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> Canelo Beats Lara..., The gate opens...let the hate begin...
Dolimite
post Mar 10 2014, 02:49 PM
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QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Mar 10 2014, 10:56 AM) *
Just call my name bro...it's only one person that started this thread. This has nothing to do with Mayweather as you always seem to bring up, just to make your point. Anybody can make a point about boxing, when Mayweather's name is brought up...stick to the topic here, we're talking about 2 common opponents. Again, LEAVE Mayweather out of this.

It's not that he beat Angulo, but it's the fashion in which he beat him. Angulo is waaaay too hittable, so why wasn't Lara able to do the same (or even better than Canelo)? Real quick (since you like bringing up Floyd so much), when did people REALLY start giving him his credit as a fighter (casual fans)? After the...wait for it...the Gatti fight. Who hasn't beaten Gatti? The thing is, the fashion in which he beat Gatti...he was supposed to "run" around the ring and avoid exchanges, instead, he brought the fight to him. I can't name anybody that beat Gatti in that embarrassing of a fashion, no one.

Guys make it seem like Lara's a world beater, because of his "style" and amateur background, stop it. The only Cuban that I put my money on nowadays, is Rigondeaux. Again, since you bring up old stuff, YOU were one of the ones that said Canelo didn't belong in the ring with Trout, whom most of you crowned as this "slick" boxer with "Mayweather" arm reach, and movement that would embarrass Canelo...we see how that turned out. As a matter of fact, that's when Canelo really won my respect.

People can talk all day about how much of a bum they think Chavez is (or was), but he proved himself in the Lee fight, and almost finished Sergio, whom most of you hyped us as this world beater...seems to be a lot of backtracking going on when it comes to Sergio around here.

You try to make this case about Lara "digging deep" and beating Angulo, but why in the world was such a "superior" fighter on the deck any damn way? Canelo wasn't doing half the movement that Lara was doing, and not once did he hit the deck.

It's about time to give credit, where credit is due, and Canelo deserves some credit. How many people are you trying to throw at the dude...hoping that he's gonna lose, huh? You HATE it when the media does it to Floyd, but you're so comfortable doing it with Canelo. I'm not saying that Canelo is gonna be the next Mayweather, but the star power is there, and I'm almost certain that he beats Lara.

There you go throwing names out there...and of all names, the Charlo twins?! I like them, but they're nowhere near that level at this time (attraction wise)...they're still contenders. Canelo beats Cotto at this point, and out of all people, what does a Kirkland victory even do for him?

And I know why they put Angulo in front of Canelo...maybe because he was the one to put the world beater, Lara, on the deck twice in his career, regardless of him being stopped late in the fight. Had Angulo just gotten starched by Lara, then there would've been no need for the Canelo fight, but let's be honest here...Angulo took a piece of Lara that he (Lara) can't get back, and now he's begging for a payday. The little faith that most had in Lara's style and ability to look unbeatable, was taken away by Angulo.

It's a hard game out there in the boxing world, but Lara may have ruined his chances by getting dropped by Angulo, whom he wasn't even slugging with (how embarrassing). NOW, if Lara's lucky, Canelo's team may take advantage of Lara's weaknesses in the Angulo fight, and actually give him a fight after all.

Dude's are on their rag today, maybe it is the change in time and people are grouchy, me not saying your name wasn't meant to be a diss, trust me if I wanted to talk smack as I have done in the past with you, I would. My thread or response has nothing to do with Mayweather. My mentioning him was because Canelo did not fight like he did against Mayweather because the skill set was a little different. i also mentioned Trout. He fought a different fight with Trout. He actually cruised or tried to cruise in that fight which is why I felt Trout won.

But let's get back on topic. You keep saying that I am ignoring Canelo's popularity. I in fact point to his popularity on why he is able to get the fights that he wants. Is it deserved? Hell no! But right now it is about popularity and that is cool. What Canelo did against Angulo he was suppose to do. Just like we all expect Danny to beat Herrera and how we expected Pacquiao to look great against Rios. This was the outcome that was suppose to happen. It's like fathers who want a damn pat on a back for being good dads, you are suppose to be! Lara looked bad against Agnulo for two reasons, one, he took Angulo as a stepping stone and a non threat and second he fought the wrong fight. He came out to the ring dry, he started sweating by mid fight and that is when he started taking off. He fought going backwards and he allowed Angulo to set up those power shots and he paid the price for it. When Lara realized this guy was serious he went into another gear, I have yet to see Canelo do that. Canelo walked Angulo down (a slow fighter with 0 head movement) and he was allowed to tee off on Angulo like it was target practice. Again, I am not taking anything away from Canelo's victory, it was impressive, it was his first stop since fighting... wait for it... Josesito Lopez. Kirkland could give Saul problems, but Kirkland needs to remain active. I believe the Charlo's could compete with Canelo and especially Martinez or Cotto. You are looking at what Canelo did to a B maybe C level fighter skill wise. Now if Canelo can do this against top Jr. Middle weights or one day top Middle weights, then I will give all credit that is do to him.

I think Lara posses these threats to Canelo, and if I am wrong I am sure Cshel (you) will kindly point them out:
1. Footwork. Lara has great footwork, this is what got him out of trouble against Angulo and the later rounds. He Instead of fighting backwards he saw he could cut the ring off against Angulo and started picking him apart.

2. Defense: for some reason it takes this guy to get cracked to display his defense. When he is on he is on. Angulo had a hard time hitting him and finding him as the fight progressed.

3. Hand speed and accuracy. Lara is scary accurate, he can hit you at will. He has good hand speed, faster than Canelo in my opinion.

4. Ring IQ: Lara makes adjust mid fights which is why he has been successful.

Those are some of the reasons why I think Lara beats Canelo. It will be an interesting fight, I don't think it will be a slug fest but a chess match.

Again, I though Saul looked great, but this is what I would like to see against stiffer competition. he was suppose to win, in this fashion. Guy connected 64% of his power shots, that is nothing to scoff at.

Floyd became popular after his De La Hoya match by the way. Gatti fight was nothing more than a showcase and a mild introduction to the casual fan.
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Cshel86
post Mar 10 2014, 03:41 PM
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QUOTE (Dolimite @ Mar 10 2014, 03:49 PM) *
Dude's are on their rag today, maybe it is the change in time and people are grouchy, me not saying your name wasn't meant to be a diss, trust me if I wanted to talk smack as I have done in the past with you, I would. My thread or response has nothing to do with Mayweather. My mentioning him was because Canelo did not fight like he did against Mayweather because the skill set was a little different. i also mentioned Trout. He fought a different fight with Trout. He actually cruised or tried to cruise in that fight which is why I felt Trout won.

But let's get back on topic. You keep saying that I am ignoring Canelo's popularity. I in fact point to his popularity on why he is able to get the fights that he wants. Is it deserved? Hell no! But right now it is about popularity and that is cool. What Canelo did against Angulo he was suppose to do. Just like we all expect Danny to beat Herrera and how we expected Pacquiao to look great against Rios. This was the outcome that was suppose to happen. It's like fathers who want a damn pat on a back for being good dads, you are suppose to be! Lara looked bad against Agnulo for two reasons, one, he took Angulo as a stepping stone and a non threat and second he fought the wrong fight. He came out to the ring dry, he started sweating by mid fight and that is when he started taking off. He fought going backwards and he allowed Angulo to set up those power shots and he paid the price for it. When Lara realized this guy was serious he went into another gear, I have yet to see Canelo do that. Canelo walked Angulo down (a slow fighter with 0 head movement) and he was allowed to tee off on Angulo like it was target practice. Again, I am not taking anything away from Canelo's victory, it was impressive, it was his first stop since fighting... wait for it... Josesito Lopez. Kirkland could give Saul problems, but Kirkland needs to remain active. I believe the Charlo's could compete with Canelo and especially Martinez or Cotto. You are looking at what Canelo did to a B maybe C level fighter skill wise. Now if Canelo can do this against top Jr. Middle weights or one day top Middle weights, then I will give all credit that is do to him.

I think Lara posses these threats to Canelo, and if I am wrong I am sure Cshel (you) will kindly point them out:
1. Footwork. Lara has great footwork, this is what got him out of trouble against Angulo and the later rounds. He Instead of fighting backwards he saw he could cut the ring off against Angulo and started picking him apart.

2. Defense: for some reason it takes this guy to get cracked to display his defense. When he is on he is on. Angulo had a hard time hitting him and finding him as the fight progressed.

3. Hand speed and accuracy. Lara is scary accurate, he can hit you at will. He has good hand speed, faster than Canelo in my opinion.

4. Ring IQ: Lara makes adjust mid fights which is why he has been successful.

Those are some of the reasons why I think Lara beats Canelo. It will be an interesting fight, I don't think it will be a slug fest but a chess match.

Again, I though Saul looked great, but this is what I would like to see against stiffer competition. he was suppose to win, in this fashion. Guy connected 64% of his power shots, that is nothing to scoff at.

Floyd became popular after his De La Hoya match by the way. Gatti fight was nothing more than a showcase and a mild introduction to the casual fan.

You're right, this time change is a kick in the pants, but no, that isn't the reason I'm grouchy. As a matter of fact, I'm not grouchy...just annoyed at your new found skill to regurgitate stuff, then back yourself into a corner of contradiction, when it matters the most. Lol

You're giving Lara all of these accolades, when he had no business being floored twice by the likes of Angulo...the very fighter that you're using to subliminally take credit away Canelo's demolition of him. Angulo's limited, but how nobody's been able to answer why he was able to put Lara on the canvas twice.

Guys blab on about a fighter's skills and ring generalship, but ring generalship is only good when it's maintained. It's funny how guys like Sergio can go 11 rounds with a plodder, but happened to get dropped (and almost stopped) in the final round...same goes for Lara being dropped twice.

You gave this flimsy excuse about Lara coming to the ring dry, but weren't they fighting outside in June??? How can guy really come to the ring dry, unless he had problems making weight? Now, he may have underestimated Angulo, but of that was the case, then why not take him head on and get him outta there?

Fact of the matter is, Saul had some weapons in his arsenal, and we saw it firsthand. I'm not saying that he can do that on any and every opponent in the future, but the fact that he was able to execute some of those punches and follow a game plan, says a lot. He not only threw these shots because a slow guy with no head movement was in front of him, but he set most of those punches up.

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Cheesey1
post Mar 10 2014, 06:33 PM
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Richard Schaefer, please, please make this match happen. CShel needs another 'L' in the prediction league.
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Hotsauce
post Mar 10 2014, 07:59 PM
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canelo is boxing next superstar

deal with it.
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Dolimite
post Mar 10 2014, 10:00 PM
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QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Mar 10 2014, 01:41 PM) *
You're right, this time change is a kick in the pants, but no, that isn't the reason I'm grouchy. As a matter of fact, I'm not grouchy...just annoyed at your new found skill to regurgitate stuff, then back yourself into a corner of contradiction, when it matters the most. Lol

You're giving Lara all of these accolades, when he had no business being floored twice by the likes of Angulo...the very fighter that you're using to subliminally take credit away Canelo's demolition of him. Angulo's limited, but how nobody's been able to answer why he was able to put Lara on the canvas twice.

Guys blab on about a fighter's skills and ring generalship, but ring generalship is only good when it's maintained. It's funny how guys like Sergio can go 11 rounds with a plodder, but happened to get dropped (and almost stopped) in the final round...same goes for Lara being dropped twice.

You gave this flimsy excuse about Lara coming to the ring dry, but weren't they fighting outside in June??? How can guy really come to the ring dry, unless he had problems making weight? Now, he may have underestimated Angulo, but of that was the case, then why not take him head on and get him outta there?

Fact of the matter is, Saul had some weapons in his arsenal, and we saw it firsthand. I'm not saying that he can do that on any and every opponent in the future, but the fact that he was able to execute some of those punches and follow a game plan, says a lot. He not only threw these shots because a slow guy with no head movement was in front of him, but he set most of those punches up.

I accept your apology lol...

I was at the fight and I was sitting a few rows back from the ring. I saw the replay on TV and I noticed that Lara was dry coming into the ring seemed unfazed by the atmosphere he was in. Lara took Angulo light. If you looked at his punches and defense he was leaving himself wide open for the shots Angulo landed. All I am saying is that Lara dug deep and pulled out the W. I have yet to see Canelo go into deep waters and pull himself out. I have seen Lara do just that. Again, Canelo looked really impressive against Angulo. Against Trout he tired and he even looked confused at times during the fight, be he got the W. Canelo is immensely popular, a damn super star just about. His popularity is what got him at the stage of his career that he is at. I became a fan of Lara when he fought Paul Williams and won. This guy was giving P W the business and he "lost" that fight. I am not taking anything away from Canelo, he showed signs of greatness against Angulo, but I am not sold on him yet, not until he can show what he did against Angulo on a top Jr. Middle Weight. I am not giving him the keys to the castle just yet. Again, he gets an A+ for his fight on Saturday, but the test was quite easy.

This post has been edited by Dolimite: Mar 10 2014, 10:03 PM
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checkleft
post Mar 11 2014, 01:46 AM
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QUOTE (mrchitown @ Mar 10 2014, 01:19 AM) *
Canelo has the skills but I'm not sold that he beats Lara. Lara hasn't shown up in all his fights..ex. The Molina fight and the Vanes fight but he still gives his opponents hell. He moves well and most opponents of Canelo are there to be hit. His most impressive fights are against guys who don't move and stay directly in front of him

Ex...Lopez, Angulo, Matthew Hatton, Rhodes, Baldomir etc...he didn't beat Trout imo and I think Trout controlled him most of the night with a jab. I think Lara can make Alvarez gas worse then Trout did. But Canelo can drop him, this we know. I'd like to see this fight happen but I'd most likely lean towards Lara

yo, give this man a contract.

as chi mentioned the verdict is out on both of these dudes. I'd lean towards Lara, but both of these guys are still unproven. Consistency is part of being considered elite, and both of these guys lack consistency. Canelo can beat the shit out of human punching bags and Lara can be on dancing with the stars, we get it. They need to get in the ring and show out, both can talk as much as they want but actions will always speak louder.

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mrchitown
post Mar 11 2014, 08:20 PM
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QUOTE (checkleft @ Mar 11 2014, 12:46 AM) *
yo, give this man a contract.

as chi mentioned the verdict is out on both of these dudes. I'd lean towards Lara, but both of these guys are still unproven. Consistency is part of being considered elite, and both of these guys lack consistency. Canelo can beat the shit out of human punching bags and Lara can be on dancing with the stars, we get it. They need to get in the ring and show out, both can talk as much as they want but actions will always speak louder.


Agreed that they both lack consistency....for all Canelo's praise for his performance last Saturday, he still gassed and was getting tee'd off on by Angulo late in the fight. Alvarez doesn't have one punch power, if you allow him to throw combos and connect on you then he can stop you. I don't see him stopping Lara because I don't believe Lara will allow him to land the combos he's so accustomed to. Lara is the better counter puncher but Alvarez has the most pop on his punches. It's an interesting fight that needs to happen
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AZWildCat
post Mar 14 2014, 07:25 PM
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-DVWm-k5fs...be_gdata_player

I know for a fact 4 of you (yeah you) wanted to but didn't so they did it for you.

10players strikes again!!!
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