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> should hbo just reel in jim lampley, or get rid of him altogether?
BrutUalBK
post Mar 29 2013, 02:53 PM
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QUOTE (daprofessor @ Mar 29 2013, 02:23 PM) *
i totally disagree. it's a very bad thing. forget the ratings....it's an attempt to compromise our sport!!! i never particularly cared for the rocky series because they are a caricature of what boxing truly is!!! today's generation is fucked because of their lack of focus/short attention spans. boxing should not compromise itself to appease some idiots. let them have mma.



I agree with that, but I do not agree that all people who follow MMA are idiots and neither are the fighters. MMA is a very technical sport, especially when it comes to the ground game Jiu Jitsu and Wrestling but I do get your drift as it appears many who do not appreciate the technical aspects of boxing tend to lean towards that sport.

It is sad that today when you mention the word "boxing" to most people in this generation what they think of is two guys just slugging it out, they have no appreciation whatsoever of the real skill a true Master Boxer displays like Floyd and Hopkins.

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daprofessor
post Mar 29 2013, 07:27 PM
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QUOTE (BrutUalBK @ Mar 29 2013, 02:53 PM) *
I agree with that, but I do not agree that all people who follow MMA are idiots and neither are the fighters. MMA is a very technical sport, especially when it comes to the ground game Jiu Jitsu and Wrestling but I do get your drift as it appears many who do not appreciate the technical aspects of boxing tend to lean towards that sport.

It is sad that today when you mention the word "boxing" to most people in this generation what they think of is two guys just slugging it out, they have no appreciation whatsoever of the real skill a true Master Boxer displays like Floyd and Hopkins.


i was at a place of business last week and i was wearing a boxing t-shirt. the guy at the register and i had a brief conversation about boxing and how he really loved the sport. i shared his sentiment but a woman standing behind me chimed in and expressed her opinion almost in disgust...'how can you support such a savage sport where the goal is for two men to beat each others brains out?' i smiled and replied..."i understand why a casual observer would describe it that way....but there is definitely more to it than meets the eye! boxing takes intelligence to succeed. yeah, to some extent, there are some in the sport who aren't as skillful as others...but on the highest levels...it takes extreme intelligence to be the best. boxing is a thinking persons sport. it's like chess. every move has to be calculated just right in fractions of a second...and if you get it wrong...u get punched in the face." i went on to say...."and it's not just a sport for men, our last gold medal winner for the u.s. was a woman!!! and 2 of the heavyweight champions in men's pro boxing are doctors who speak 7 languages!!! there's a lot more to the sport than you realize." she replied....'well when you put it like that, you make me want to watch it!!!' i turned to the guy at the register and said..."my work here is done. take care." (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

part of the problem that exists today is that the people who cover our sport don't truly understand it...so how are they to educate the public? most of the fans i see in boxing regurgitate the same bullshit spewed by some of the arrogant/pompous commentators or some hack website so called journalist. we have to take it upon ourselves to educate the fans if they won't.
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Cshel86
post Mar 29 2013, 09:26 PM
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QUOTE (daprofessor @ Mar 29 2013, 08:27 PM) *
i was at a place of business last week and i was wearing a boxing t-shirt. the guy at the register and i had a brief conversation about boxing and how he really loved the sport. i shared his sentiment but a woman standing behind me chimed in and expressed her opinion almost in disgust...'how can you support such a savage sport where the goal is for two men to beat each others brains out?' i smiled and replied..."i understand why a casual observer would describe it that way....but there is definitely more to it than meets the eye! boxing takes intelligence to succeed. yeah, to some extent, there are some in the sport who aren't as skillful as others...but on the highest levels...it takes extreme intelligence to be the best. boxing is a thinking persons sport. it's like chess. every move has to be calculated just right in fractions of a second...and if you get it wrong...u get punched in the face." i went on to say...."and it's not just a sport for men, our last gold medal winner for the u.s. was a woman!!! and 2 of the heavyweight champions in men's pro boxing are doctors who speak 7 languages!!! there's a lot more to the sport than you realize." she replied....'well when you put it like that, you make me want to watch it!!!' i turned to the guy at the register and said..."my work here is done. take care." (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

part of the problem that exists today is that the people who cover our sport don't truly understand it...so how are they to educate the public? most of the fans i see in boxing regurgitate the same bullshit spewed by some of the arrogant/pompous commentators or some hack website so called journalist. we have to take it upon ourselves to educate the fans if they won't.

Wow, if I didn't have any sense, I'd think that she was ready to pounce you sir.

The reason that you weren't more of a creepy opportunist is this situation (as my creepy ass would've been), I have no idea. Think about it Professor, women love it when you make them stfu in an intelligent manner...for some reason they feel less embarrassed and more turned on. What a weird species they are.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)
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BrutUalBK
post Mar 30 2013, 05:20 PM
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QUOTE (daprofessor @ Mar 29 2013, 07:27 PM) *
i was at a place of business last week and i was wearing a boxing t-shirt. the guy at the register and i had a brief conversation about boxing and how he really loved the sport. i shared his sentiment but a woman standing behind me chimed in and expressed her opinion almost in disgust...'how can you support such a savage sport where the goal is for two men to beat each others brains out?' i smiled and replied..."i understand why a casual observer would describe it that way....but there is definitely more to it than meets the eye! boxing takes intelligence to succeed. yeah, to some extent, there are some in the sport who aren't as skillful as others...but on the highest levels...it takes extreme intelligence to be the best. boxing is a thinking persons sport. it's like chess. every move has to be calculated just right in fractions of a second...and if you get it wrong...u get punched in the face." i went on to say...."and it's not just a sport for men, our last gold medal winner for the u.s. was a woman!!! and 2 of the heavyweight champions in men's pro boxing are doctors who speak 7 languages!!! there's a lot more to the sport than you realize." she replied....'well when you put it like that, you make me want to watch it!!!' i turned to the guy at the register and said..."my work here is done. take care." (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

part of the problem that exists today is that the people who cover our sport don't truly understand it...so how are they to educate the public? most of the fans i see in boxing regurgitate the same bullshit spewed by some of the arrogant/pompous commentators or some hack website so called journalist. we have to take it upon ourselves to educate the fans if they won't.



Very well stated, I'm sure she thought about it even more when she hears the word boxing for now on.
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scdrking2
post Mar 31 2013, 10:03 AM
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QUOTE (Jack 1000 @ Mar 29 2013, 12:56 AM) *
HBO Commentary Agendas

I echo the sentiments of what has been expressed around the Internet boxing community. HBO, once the boxing leader in sports boxing broadcasts has for the last several years pushed an agenda to “Build Stars Against C-grade competition” instead of working to produce the most exciting, or often two-sided matches.

For the past decade, if not more, HBO’s Jim Lamply has formed a love-affair with certain fighters on the network. Roy Jones, Oscar Delahoya, Arturo Gatti, and recently, until losing to Juan Marquez by shocking KO in their four fights, Manny Pacquiao. In addition to this, Larry Merchant also offered the same love-affair relationship with the same fighters. Max Kellerman, is also now part of this agenda. Punch-stats statistics have been proven to be mostly inaccurate. When an HBO fighter is on the stage, Jim Lamply is always there with the pom-poms to try to force his belief system in terms of how the fight is going. In Bradley-Pacquiao, a bad decision win for Bradley, but no where near the lopsided fight that Jim Lamply paraded it to be, there was times during the fight that Bradley would box well throwing nice combinations and doing some good work in rounds. Lamply and the crew would say nothing. However, when Manny even attempted to throw a punch, Jim Lamply would be screaming with excitement, often over punches that didn’t even land.

Punch Stat and HBO’s inherent favorable bias for the fighters in their network also in recent years shows the commentary, both Lamply and Larry Merchant have a dislike for slick scientific boxers on their network. Floyd Mayweather left HBO we believe because he felt he was not getting the proper respect from the network. The series of Gatti-Ward fights, the first fight being outstanding, but the next two fights WAY over hyped by Jim Lamply, Larry Merchant and crew created an illusion that became more and more real over the last decade. HBO caters to sluggers over boxers for the fights on their network.

My take is that this is not necessarily a bad thing, but is a ratings grabber for the shorter attention spans of today’s generation. They want brawls. They want all fights to be “Rocky Movies.” If they aren’t Rocky movies, today’s “I want to be entertained now!” generation, falls back on Mixed Martial Arts. The respect for The Sweet Science is nowhere near what it was in the past.

Jack


Your comments here rang in my ear while watching the undercard of the Rios-Alvarado fight. You had a young fighter on short notice taking a step up in weight and competition who put on a boxing clinic, but was booed by the crowd who came to see a blood filled slug fest in the main fight.
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Franchize
post Mar 31 2013, 11:53 AM
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Lampley is only good for fights like Rios v Alvarado now. One can't deny. The guy has an epic voice for this sport. That being said, the actual CONTENT of what he's saying is way out of wack #1 Because he, after all these years, still can't accurate detect punches landed and punches blocked or dodged. #2 Because he's so disgustingly biased it is not only ridiculous but completely unprofessional.

Roy Jones is saving the commentary on HBO. Kellerman, much like Dan Rafael at ESPN, knows a lot but will sit back idly and let bias dwarf his better judgement. In other words, rather than saying "hey Jim, STFU this is a good boxing match" or "hey Jim, this slugger isn't all that skilled and none of these flurries he's throwing are landing"...Kellerman just shuts the fuck up. I got on Dan Rafael on his Facebook page about his irresponsibility at ESPN. He allows clowns like Skip Bayless to have the loudest opinion on sports most visible network when Bayless admits to not even knowing who Canelo Alvarez is. He cowardly deleted my post. It's time the REAL boxing savants have the loudest voice in the sport, and the guys simply there for their voice and personality sit and just provide us with some melodic oohs and ahhhs. I'm tired of the fighters and trainers, who put the extra time in to master the mental aspect of the sport, being penalized socially.

If you want an opinion on Boxing on TV, most casual fans usually turn to HBO and ESPN. You get "The Fight Game" from HBO and First Take from ESPN (their boxing show with Brian Kenny gets no advertisement push). So, essentially, the casual fan is looking to Jim Lampley and Skip Bayless to help formulate their opinion on a very complex sport.

I say this all the time but there's a big difference between Boxing and Fighting. Pretty much everyone has had some form of a fight. Not everyone can. There are some very irresponsible clowns that are blurring that difference. It's called the Sweet Science and they are trying to turn it into Mathematics. How many big punches did you throw?
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BrutUalBK
post Mar 31 2013, 01:47 PM
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QUOTE (Franchize @ Mar 31 2013, 11:53 AM) *
Lampley is only good for fights like Rios v Alvarado now. One can't deny. The guy has an epic voice for this sport. That being said, the actual CONTENT of what he's saying is way out of wack #1 Because he, after all these years, still can't accurate detect punches landed and punches blocked or dodged. #2 Because he's so disgustingly biased it is not only ridiculous but completely unprofessional.

Roy Jones is saving the commentary on HBO. Kellerman, much like Dan Rafael at ESPN, knows a lot but will sit back idly and let bias dwarf his better judgement. In other words, rather than saying "hey Jim, STFU this is a good boxing match" or "hey Jim, this slugger isn't all that skilled and none of these flurries he's throwing are landing"...Kellerman just shuts the fuck up. I got on Dan Rafael on his Facebook page about his irresponsibility at ESPN. He allows clowns like Skip Bayless to have the loudest opinion on sports most visible network when Bayless admits to not even knowing who Canelo Alvarez is. He cowardly deleted my post. It's time the REAL boxing savants have the loudest voice in the sport, and the guys simply there for their voice and personality sit and just provide us with some melodic oohs and ahhhs. I'm tired of the fighters and trainers, who put the extra time in to master the mental aspect of the sport, being penalized socially.

If you want an opinion on Boxing on TV, most casual fans usually turn to HBO and ESPN. You get "The Fight Game" from HBO and First Take from ESPN (their boxing show with Brian Kenny gets no advertisement push). So, essentially, the casual fan is looking to Jim Lampley and Skip Bayless to help formulate their opinion on a very complex sport.

I say this all the time but there's a big difference between Boxing and Fighting. Pretty much everyone has had some form of a fight. Not everyone can. There are some very irresponsible clowns that are blurring that difference. It's called the Sweet Science and they are trying to turn it into Mathematics. How many big punches did you throw?



Very well stated and I agree that many of today's so called TV Journalist or Sportscasters are too biased on their favorite fighters to simply comment objectively, it's almost as though they are telling us what we should believe or see during a fight or about a certain fighter(s). On DHB there was a certain boxing pundit who claims to be a Journalist but yet he displayed no objectivity whatsoever when it came to speaking about MP, I went to war with that clown and just like Rafael did to you this guy did the same to me (he shut me out/blocked my posts so he couldn't read them) and now he's supposedly some highly respected Journalist for boxing.

The guy hung out all day long at the Wildcard Gym and defended anything you said about MP, FR or Bob Arum and I labeled him a Top Rank Shill for which he had no defense whatsoever and yet the blinded PacTARD faithful hangs on to this guy's every word as though it is the gospel truth especially when he speaks about MP or against Floyd Mayweather.

I won't name him but I guarantee that Da Professor knows who I'm talking about. These are all the clowns we have representing the sport that the unsuspecting public now listens to on a regular basis, it's no wonder why they booed in the Prescott fight last night. Go figure!!
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Jack 1000
post Mar 31 2013, 03:59 PM
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The one plus for Lamply and it is HUGE as stated above, He's got the best voice for a "Boxing Brawl." It draws the viewer into the action. However, there's not really a lot of other positives about him. I noted LESS favoritism, in fact very little last night because HBO loved both guys for brawling the first time, so you really had a good reasonably objective call.

But if it's "One of HBO's contracted fighters against a C+ type opponent, that C+ type opponent has to damn near kill the "HBO guy" for guys like Lamply to acknowledge them. And even when their "smiling sweethearts" make their millions on the network against lessor known guys, HBO commentary will bend over backwards, to make love to their contracted fighters.

The house bias started with Roy Jones, got very nauseating with Delahoya, and than the same with Gatti than Pacquiao, and now Rios and Alverado. Note that when the house fighters brawl against other house fighters, this is where HBO shows the least bias. The thing is though Jones was not a natural brawler, and neither was Delahoya, but Jim would just blush, coddle and coo at the mention of Delahoya's name. Larry Merchant was once suspended for a boxing telecast by saying "Delahoya's entrance music sucked." I wonder who made that decision? I think there has been for a very long time, higher ups at HBO telling the pom-pom shakers for whom to shake them.

Since Mayweather and Hopkins are master boxers in their prime, I believe that they don't really have the likable personality. Over time, these factors made the higher-ups at HBO lose respect for them. Floyd's always been more hated than loved by anybody. I think his strong ratings might also be attributed to those who just want to see him lose no matter what. Hopkins is street-wise, but very bitter and opinionated. He doesn't fall into the "Can't we all get along and love our fighters flagship model at HBO." Woman worshipped Delahoya even though Oscar almost always lost his big fights, and perhaps somebody at HBO as a producer, wanted to parade Delahoya to make him more appealing to woman, even though most woman don't like boxing. They might have watched HBO just to see Delahoya.

The model for HBO boxing in order to be respected by the current commentary and production team is the following:

1.) Any brawler who can engage in two-sided wars that can create excitement from fight to fight. Get two brawlers who do that as often as they can, this yields great fights. OR

2.) A Pretty Boy boxer, but he must have a likeable, charismatic personality. If he doesn't have that, HBO thinks, "Not worth our time."

Jack
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Cshel86
post Mar 31 2013, 08:22 PM
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QUOTE (Franchize @ Mar 31 2013, 12:53 PM) *
I got on Dan Rafael on his Facebook page about his irresponsibility at ESPN.

I would've paid to read that. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)
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Franchize
post Apr 1 2013, 08:13 AM
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QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Mar 31 2013, 09:22 PM) *
I would've paid to read that. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

He deleted it too. I actually felt honored lol That a world renowned boxing journalist not only took the time to read it, but to get rid of it rather than match me wit for wit lmaooooo I've heard of "If you can't beat em join em." but never "If you can't beat em, delete em." (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)
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