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> Is Manny Pacquiao A B Level Fighter?
mrchitown
post Jun 8 2013, 01:23 PM
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QUOTE (Dolimite @ Jun 7 2013, 05:45 PM) *
Tyson is a good fighter but what was his strength? His knock out punching power. Let's not pretend we remember Tyson for setting traps and cutting off the ring. He was a home run hitter. Tyson is a smart fighter but do we remember Tyson for his ring IQ, fuck no. Why are we trying to pretend like Tyson wasn't a brawler? Shit is ridiculous.

Cotto bitched about the two pounds and again giving credit to a smaller fighter is BS. I am sorry. The reason why Pac's face look the way it did after Margarito is because mighty mouse HAS NO DEFENSE He did not slip those slow ass punches Margarito was throwing. A good fighter with sound defense would not Margarito get to him. He did not avoid those punches instead he just took them on his chin. The power puncher won that fight. That fight was hardly technical, they stood toe to toe and slugged it out. Again Gatti did that his whole damn career. Rios is doing that now. Rios isn't a big guy and he has fought bigger guys than he so can we make him out to be an A level fighter? Hell no!


That's not his fault that he steamrolled thru his opponents. Yeah shit is ridiculous where the fuck you get it in your head that because Tyson or any other fighter had power that they're ring acumen is diminished. He trained with Cus who is one of the greatest boxing minds had Atlas with him and trained with Rooney who I believe should've trained hin for the rest of his career.

These are all men with considerable knowledge who helped him. I don't see him as a brawler. Rios is a brawler. He just goes in and looks to bang it out. Tyson had defense and could make you miss, he's not the stereotypical brawler you trying to make him out to be. To each his own but damn bruh. You seem to love stereotypes. Cuz by listening to you only so called technicians like an Andre Ward type have ring smarts

Tyson had many strengths. Like speed defense power and so on and so on. I think your assessment of him is for lack of a better word bullshit to prove your point about Manny. Tyson is way better then you give him credit for. I got hooked on boxing as a kid thru Iron Mike and one of the things my trainer had me do was study different fighters and they styles and I studied Mike inside out and he way more then a brawler. You dumb him down by giving him that label. I respect your opinion but that ring intelligence remark was the dumbest shit I ever heard you say on here. He's remembered for his vicious KO's but he was no dummy in the ring...I think he's smarter then Manny who doesn't seem to make adjustments or know how to.

This post has been edited by mrchitown: Jun 8 2013, 01:24 PM
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mgrover
post Jun 8 2013, 03:26 PM
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QUOTE (Dolimite @ Jun 8 2013, 02:03 PM) *
How did he beat these fighters? Was through his boxing skills or going toe to toe? He re-matched Morales ten months later and Barrera 4 years later! Many say that Barrera won the rematch. Come on mgrover. Because he is short you want to give him credit. Okay, then Spud Webb is the greatest point guard in all of the NBA. He was short and he had to compete with guys way smaller than he was. He even defended Jordan. Muggsy Bogues was also short, does that make him an all time great? This perception of Manny being great because he beat bigger guys is a load of crap, many boxers have beaten guys bigger who were bigger than them. Again, Rios is a small man, he fights like Pac, how come he doesn't get the same credit? Pac had to fight the same guy 4 times and got his ass put to bed the last time which proves to me he may had won all 3 matches. He won two of them for sure. the 3rd and 4th fight. Again, he was nicely and perfectly matched against guys who fit his style. I am sorry he is a B level fighter and a A level brawler.


who cares how he beat them?? If your good enough to beat the best through brawling why should that take away from it? If I outbrawl Mayweather and beat his ass is that less of an achievement than outboxing him? No because I had my hand raised up the at the end of the fight. To an extent winning is winning and thats it. I don't really follow NBA so thats lost on me. I'll say this again, Rios doesn't get credit because he's beaten nobody yet, if he moves through the weights and makes it to welterweight and super welterweight beating some of the top guys in brutal fashion then sure have him up there.
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anthonyaccurate
post Jun 8 2013, 04:43 PM
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In what fights did Tyson's opponents not have a height/reach advantage, seriously? He was a much smarter, technical fighter when he was younger. He was extremely hard to hit, used a nasty jab (see the Mitch Green fight where he knocks the bridge out his mouth with a jab), was in great shape, and set up his punches beautifully with footwork and timing. Later on, he basically solely relied on his power, entered fights bloated, just threw bombs (stopped jabbing, hook to the body, uppercut combo was non-existant) and was a shell of himself when he fought Lewis, who btw, gave alot of people problems.
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Junior80
post Jun 8 2013, 06:35 PM
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Tyson , when he was in shape resembled the HULK he could destroy anything in his path with insane speed, timing accuracy and power , he was vicious and had true bad intentions , somewhere along the lines ( before buster KO'd him) he lost that edge , had he remained dedicated and in shape I think his boxing career would have turned out a lot differently


And asking if manny pacquaio is a B level fighter is seriously laughable , he is the ONLY person in the history of boxing to hold eight world titles in 8 different weight divisions , you name me a B level fighter that could accomplish that. He will for sure go down in history as an elite fighter.........

This post has been edited by Junior80: Jun 8 2013, 06:46 PM
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Dolimite
post Jun 8 2013, 07:17 PM
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QUOTE (mrchitown @ Jun 8 2013, 10:23 AM) *
That's not his fault that he steamrolled thru his opponents. Yeah shit is ridiculous where the fuck you get it in your head that because Tyson or any other fighter had power that they're ring acumen is diminished. He trained with Cus who is one of the greatest boxing minds had Atlas with him and trained with Rooney who I believe should've trained hin for the rest of his career.

These are all men with considerable knowledge who helped him. I don't see him as a brawler. Rios is a brawler. He just goes in and looks to bang it out. Tyson had defense and could make you miss, he's not the stereotypical brawler you trying to make him out to be. To each his own but damn bruh. You seem to love stereotypes. Cuz by listening to you only so called technicians like an Andre Ward type have ring smarts

Tyson had many strengths. Like speed defense power and so on and so on. I think your assessment of him is for lack of a better word bullshit to prove your point about Manny. Tyson is way better then you give him credit for. I got hooked on boxing as a kid thru Iron Mike and one of the things my trainer had me do was study different fighters and they styles and I studied Mike inside out and he way more then a brawler. You dumb him down by giving him that label. I respect your opinion but that ring intelligence remark was the dumbest shit I ever heard you say on here. He's remembered for his vicious KO's but he was no dummy in the ring...I think he's smarter then Manny who doesn't seem to make adjustments or know how to.


Chi, I respect your opinions and you. I like Iron Mike, I honestly do, even after he married that gold digging chic. He did work with the best minds in boxing, however after Cus died his game slipped. I think his demons caught up with him inside the ring and out. Buster Douglas he got totally careless. He was quick he has one of the best head movements I have seen a heavy weight or anyone else have. However, there were holes in the arsenal. He was a brutal KO puncher and that is how I remember him as. What I will do all next week is look at Tyson's old fights and maybe I will have a different opinion but as of today, he is a brawler. By the way, my Kings are winning tonight!

QUOTE (Junior80 @ Jun 8 2013, 03:35 PM) *
Tyson , when he was in shape resembled the HULK he could destroy anything in his path with insane speed, timing accuracy and power , he was vicious and had true bad intentions , somewhere along the lines ( before buster KO'd him) he lost that edge , had he remained dedicated and in shape I think his boxing career would have turned out a lot differently


And asking if manny pacquaio is a B level fighter is seriously laughable , he is the ONLY person in the history of boxing to hold eight world titles in 8 different weight divisions , you name me a B level fighter that could accomplish that. He will for sure go down in history as an elite fighter.........

And you probably believe that George Michael isn't gay? That 8 divisional title is bullshit. You can't be a 154 champion if you never actually fought at that weight plus it was a vacant title, please.


mgrover Muggsy Bogues and Spud Web were the shortest basketballs players in history of the game. They were like 5'10 or some shit. Meaning they went up against guys bigger than they all the time, does that make them better than LeBron or Magic Johnson? Hell no!

This post has been edited by Dolimite: Jun 8 2013, 07:18 PM
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mrchitown
post Jun 8 2013, 09:30 PM
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QUOTE (Dolimite @ Jun 8 2013, 07:17 PM) *
Chi, I respect your opinions and you. I like Iron Mike, I honestly do, even after he married that gold digging chic. He did work with the best minds in boxing, however after Cus died his game slipped. I think his demons caught up with him inside the ring and out. Buster Douglas he got totally careless. He was quick he has one of the best head movements I have seen a heavy weight or anyone else have. However, there were holes in the arsenal. He was a brutal KO puncher and that is how I remember him as. What I will do all next week is look at Tyson's old fights and maybe I will have a different opinion but as of today, he is a brawler. By the way, my Kings are winning tonight!


Yeah you need to go back and study. I've been studying that man and other fighters for 17yrs and I never considered him a brawler but then again I guess you have to be labeled as something. There was absolutely NO slippage when he was with Rooney. NONE. He didn't slip until he lost to Buster and had that farce of a corner in that fight. Holyfield is more of a brawler then Mike to me
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Junior80
post Jun 8 2013, 10:42 PM
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QUOTE (Dolimite @ Jun 8 2013, 08:17 PM) *
Chi, I respect your opinions and you. I like Iron Mike, I honestly do, even after he married that gold digging chic. He did work with the best minds in boxing, however after Cus died his game slipped. I think his demons caught up with him inside the ring and out. Buster Douglas he got totally careless. He was quick he has one of the best head movements I have seen a heavy weight or anyone else have. However, there were holes in the arsenal. He was a brutal KO puncher and that is how I remember him as. What I will do all next week is look at Tyson's old fights and maybe I will have a different opinion but as of today, he is a brawler. By the way, my Kings are winning tonight!


And you probably believe that George Michael isn't gay? That 8 divisional title is bullshit. You can't be a 154 champion if you never actually fought at that weight plus it was a vacant title, please.


mgrover Muggsy Bogues and Spud Web were the shortest basketballs players in history of the game. They were like 5'10 or some shit. Meaning they went up against guys bigger than they all the time, does that make them better than LeBron or Magic Johnson? Hell no!
the 8 division titles is very real, and I'm not sure how u compare guys putting a ball through a hole to guys physically beating each other into submission
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mrchitown
post Jun 8 2013, 11:48 PM
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QUOTE (Dolimite @ Jun 8 2013, 07:17 PM) *
By the way, my Kings are winning tonight


(IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) see yall next season. We got a ship to win
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mgrover
post Jun 9 2013, 03:14 AM
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QUOTE (Dolimite @ Jun 9 2013, 01:17 AM) *
Chi, I respect your opinions and you. I like Iron Mike, I honestly do, even after he married that gold digging chic. He did work with the best minds in boxing, however after Cus died his game slipped. I think his demons caught up with him inside the ring and out. Buster Douglas he got totally careless. He was quick he has one of the best head movements I have seen a heavy weight or anyone else have. However, there were holes in the arsenal. He was a brutal KO puncher and that is how I remember him as. What I will do all next week is look at Tyson's old fights and maybe I will have a different opinion but as of today, he is a brawler. By the way, my Kings are winning tonight!


And you probably believe that George Michael isn't gay? That 8 divisional title is bullshit. You can't be a 154 champion if you never actually fought at that weight plus it was a vacant title, please.


mgrover Muggsy Bogues and Spud Web were the shortest basketballs players in history of the game. They were like 5'10 or some shit. Meaning they went up against guys bigger than they all the time, does that make them better than LeBron or Magic Johnson? Hell no!


If they performed at the level of Lebron or Johnson why not, since they clearly were at a disadvantage and still performed as well
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BrutUalBK
post Jun 9 2013, 05:03 AM
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QUOTE (mgrover @ Jun 7 2013, 09:54 AM) *
no he skill clearly isn't, but that doesn't mean he didn't beat some of the elite in brutal fashion.



But you're contradicting yourself because I quote you here as saying the following:
QUOTE
He's clearly A level and elite and had one heck of a chin. Say what you want about the catch weights but he was the smaller man still aside from DLH.



You can't go both ways on this, either his is or isn't an A level fighter, which is it? I think that Arum did a skillfull job of keeping MP away from guys who would've boxed his ears off and that with all the careful matchmaking he did a great job marketing him catching his opponents at their worst moments (coming off of KO/TKO/UD losses) and that enabled him to capitalize against limited competition (either due to the following losses, weight draining or way past their primes).

I believe any decent fighter with power can make himself look like an A level fighter if he is skillfully matched especially against those who lack real boxing skills or have a crappy defense and is easy to hit.
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