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> Rank These Fighters, Give some justifications
TheCritics
post May 30 2014, 05:22 PM
Post #21


Super Bantamweight


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Pac-JMM III

Will Cooling, FOX Sports/InsideFights: 118-110 Marquez
Mike Coppinger, RingTV.com: 115-113 Marquez
Kevin Cunningham: Draw
Tim Dahlberg, Associated Press: 114-114 Draw
Gareth Davies, London Telegraph: 114-114 Draw
Beau Denison, SportsPageMagazine.com: 114-114 Draw
Jake Donovan, BoxingScene.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
Fox Doucette, The Boxing Tribune: 115-113 Marquez
Blake Dreisbach, BleacherReport.com: 116-112 Marquez
Bill Dwyer, Los Angeles Times: 115-113 Marquez
Robert Ecksel, Boxing.com: 114-114 Draw
Stephen Edwards, boxinqtalk.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
Andrew Eisele, Boxing.about.com: 115-115 Draw
George Elsasser, BraggingRightsCorner.com: 114-114 Draw
Jake Emen, ProBoxing-Fans.com: 114-114 Draw
Sean Faye, Eurosport Yahoo!: 116-115 Pacquiao
Pedro Fernandez, RingTalk.com: 116-113 Marquez
Doug Fischer, The Ring Magazine: 114-114 Draw
Lyle Fitzsimmons, The Sports Network: 116-112 Marquez
James Foley, BleacherReport.com: 115-114 Pacquiao
Nick Fors, Pasionsports.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
Nick Fox, Bad Left Hook: 115-113 Pacquiao
Norm Frauenheim, 15Rounds.com: 115-113 Marquez
Ace Freeman, FightFan.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
Andrew Fruman, The Boxing Bulletin: 116-112 Marquez
Ronald Geronimo, NowBoxing.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
Chuck Giampa: 116-112 Marquez
Leighton Ginn, Desert Sun (Palm Springs): 114-114 Draw
King J Gladney, BleacherReport.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
Oly Goldstein, BadLeftHook.com: 116-112 Marquez
Brian Arman Graham, Sports Illustrated: 114-114 Draw
Gerardo Granados, BoxingNews24.com: 116-112 Marquez
Ed Graney, Las Vegas Review-Journal: 115-113 Marquez
Robert Guerrero: 116-112 Marquez
Igor Guryashkin, ESPN: Marquez by one round
Matt Hamilton, EsNews.com: 116-115 Marquez
Thomas Hauser, SecondsOut.com: 116-113 Marquez
Daniel Herbert, Boxing News: 114-114 Draw
Joseph Herron, FightSaga: 116-112 Pacquiao
Adam Hirshfield, Bleacher Report.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
Ken Hissner, DogHouseBoxing.com: 118-110 Pacquiao
Charles Horgan, Boxing Tribune: 114-114 Draw
Graham Houston, FightWriter.com/FightNews.com/ESPN: 115-113 Pacquiao
Joel Huerto, SportsFanLive: 115-113 Pacquiao
Jerry Izenberg, Newark Star-Ledger: 115-114 Marquez
Kevin Iole, Yahoo! Sports: 114-114 Draw
Roy Jones Jr.: Draw
Teddy June, RingJunkies.com: 114-114 Draw
Steve Kim, MaxBoxing.com: 115-113 Marquez
David Kassel, FightHype.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
John Katsilometes, Las Vegas Sun: 115-114 Marquez
Max Kellerman, HBO: 114-114 Draw
Chris Koegler, TheRealHook.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
Darrell La Montre, boxinqtalk.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
Glyn Leach, Boxing Monthly: 115-113 Marquez
Harold Lederman, HBO: 116-112 Pacquiao
Greg Leon, boxinqtalk.com: 115-114 Pacquiao
Mark Lichtenfeld, Ring Announcer/Member, The Ring Magazine Ratings Panel: 114-114 Draw
Doveed Linder, boxinqtalk.com: 114-114 Draw
Mark Lyons, pacquiaosleftnut.com: 116-112 Marquez
Matt Lynch, BoxingToday: 116-112 Marquez
Paul Magno, The Boxing Tribune: 115-113 Marquez
Chris Manix, Sports Illustrated: 116-112 Marquez
Ryan Maquinana, BoxingScene.com: 116-113 Marquez
Gordon Marino, The Wall Street Journal: 114-114 Draw (Note: At the end of his live blog for the fight, he indicated his belief that Marquez had won. However, he actually scored the fight six rounds apiece: Rounds 1, 2, 5, 6, 7 and 12 for Marquez and Rounds 3, 4, 8, 9, 10, and 11 for Pacquiao.)
Michael Marley, The Examiner: 115-113 Marquez
Rich Marotta, KFI Los Angeles: 115-113Marquez
Steve Marzolf, InsideHBOBoxing.com: 115-114 Pacquiao
Brian Mazique, BleacherReport.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
John McCormick, boxinqtalk.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
Wayne McCullough: 115-113 Marquez
Larry Merchant, HBO: 114-114 Draw
Pace Miller, BleacherReport.com: 114-114 Draw
Kevin Mitchell, The Guardian: 117-114 Marquez
Gabriel Montoya, MaxBoxing.com: 116-112 Marquez
Robert Morales, Los Angeles Daily News: 116-112 Marquez
Kieran Mulvaney, ESPN/Reuters: 114-114 Draw
Bob Papa, HBO: 114-114 Draw
Max Parker, Boxing Watchers: 115-114 Pacquiao
Raj Parmar, 3MoreRounds.com: 115-113 Marquez
Jason Peck, EastSideBoxing.com: 116-112 Pacquiao
Massimo Lopes Pegna, La Gazzetta dello Sport (Italy): 115-114 Pacquiao
Ken Pollitt, the13thround.com: 116-113 Pacquiao
Gary Andrew Pool, The Atlantic: 114-114 Draw
Jeff Powell, The Daily Mail (UK): 114-114 Draw
Lance Pugmire, Los Angeles Times: 115-113 Marquez
Dan Rafael, ESPN: 114-114 Draw
Henry Ramirez, Boxing Trainer: 116-113 Marquez
Eric Raskin, TheSweetScience.com: 116-112 Marquez
Nate Ravitz, ESPN: 117-111 Pacquiao
Rick Reeno, BoxingScene.com: 114-114 Draw
Martin Rogers, Yahoo! Sports: 115-113 Marquez
Cliff Rold, BoxingScene.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
Michael Rosenthal, Editor, The Ring Magazine: 115-113 Pacquiao
Rob Rutz, MyBoxingFans.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
Ted Sares, Boxing.com: 116-112 Pacquiao
Lem Satterfield, The Ring Magazine: 117-111 Marquez
"Old Yank" Schneider, Boxing.com: 115-114 Pacquiao
Elie Seckbach, EsNews.com/AOL News: 114-114 Draw
Briggs Seekins, BleacherReport.com: 115-113 Marquez
Danny Serratelli, EastSideBoxing.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
Colin Seymour, FrontPageBoxing.com/Examiner.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
Scott Shaffer, boxinqtalk.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
Graham Shaw, SportingLife.com: 116-113 Marquez
Bob Sheridan: 115-114 Marquez
Bill Shimizu, Examiner.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
James Slater, EastSideBoxing.com: 116-112 Marquez
Michael David Smith, AOL NEWS/MMA Fighting.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
Tim Smith, New York Daily News: 116-112 Marquez
Patrick L. Stumberg, SBNation: 115-113 Pacquiao
Sean Sullivan, BoxingDigest: 115-114 Pacquiao
Justin Tate, BleacherReport.com: 114-114 Draw
Terra (Brazil): 116-112 Pacquiao
Rich Thomas, ProBoxing-Fans.com: 116-112 Marquez
Ben Thompson, FightHype.com: 115-113 Marquez
Nick Tylwalk, BoxingWatchers.com: 115-113 Marquez
Madra Uladh, EastSideBoxing.com: 115-113 Pacquiao
Bob Velin, USAToday: 115-113 Marquez
Ben Weisman, BoxingAsylum.com: 116-113 Pacquiao
Anthony Whitby, BoxingIQ.com: 114-114 Draw
Chris Williams, BoxingNews24.com: 117-111 Marquez
George Willis, New York Post: 115-113 Marquez
Michael Woods, ESPN/TheSweetScience.com: 115-114 Pacquiao
Michael Wright, ESPNChicago.com: Draw

None of the above scores for Marquez or the draws are from Mexican media/boxers.
None of the above scores for Pacquiao or the draws are from Philippine media/boxers.
Among the unofficial scorers above, 57 scored the bout for Marquez, 51 scored the bout for Pacquiao, and the remaining 36 scored the bout a draw.
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TheCritics
post May 30 2014, 05:25 PM
Post #22


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now you are much more confident that Pac won these 2 fights, even more so than half of the scribes that watched the same 2 fights... the emphatic ending in the 4th fight closes the chapter in my book, no need for the 5th
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mgrover
post May 30 2014, 07:27 PM
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pretty.confident about.the first fight yeah, still need to rescore II and III. I can see the first fight being being a draw or 114-113 Marquez , but the judge that only gave Pac the 11th round was blind, funnily enough i gave that round to Marquez. i still think pac did enough to win

all those stats.prove is that they were very.close fights that many.people could see either way, they prove as much as people thought Marquez won the fight, the same was thought for Pac, i mean if it was Marquez being awarded the decision we'd be saying Pac lost a controversial decision, or atleast thats all i hear out of hbo, controversial decision this and controversial decision that
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The Original MrF...
post May 31 2014, 07:39 AM
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QUOTE (mgrover @ May 29 2014, 06:38 AM) *
We constantly hear about Pac and Mayweather resumes, but then boxing lives outside of these guys,

1. Mosley (Or should his entire career be invalidated due to the positive tests?)
2. Cotto
3. Judah
4. Malignaggi
5. De La Hoya
6. Margarito (Or should his entire career be invalidated due to the hand wraps?)

Some justifiation would be good, no point in just listing them off, I'll probably post mine soon



As in who beats who ranking. If they fought 9 times, I'd say that


1. Mosley. Fought everyone except Trinidad. Mosley has prime wins over DLH. The W was never changed to a NC, strangely in their second fight where he stated he took, "something." Did DLH test positive too? Something to think about. Mosley also has a past prime win over a Margarito coming off the Cotto victory.

2. Margarito. DLH, Mayweather and Judah feared him for a reason. His victory over Cotto who had beaten Mosley was about as dramatic and climactic as possible. Also a tough win over a Joshua Clottey, who also had a tough time getting fights due to the "fear." This guy put you through the meat grinder and made a tough fight for everyone. This will always come up when you mention Mayweather's campaign at WW. The hand wraps scandal prior to his loss to Mosley is a blemish.

3. DLH. Fought just about everyone in and around his weight class. Win or lose, each fight was event and competitive. His popularity should not increase his ranking as a fighter. Too often fans boost a popular fighter as the greatest. DLH was a good technical fighter who had all the bells and whistles. Sometimes his popularity got him victories that he didn't deserve. Pernell Whitaker, Ike Quartey and Felix Sturm lost the popularity contest and not their fights with DLH.

4. Cotto. Fought just about everyone too. His win over Mosley was no doubt his biggest win. It was a hard fought, gut win. This guy would be #1 in terms of heart because he fights everyone they put in front of him. The fact that he came up short in so many of those fight's is why he's ranked #4.

5 Paulie. A knuckle ball thrower for 12 rounds. Will never blow by anyone with power, but can box his ass off. Always entertaining. His weakness has always been his lack of power. If this guy could throw credible power shots that made people respect him... He, like Cotto and Judah, was always in the big one, but never won the big one.

6. Judah. All the potential in the world when he was at 140. Tszyu crushed that with a jack hammer to the jaw. Didn't really fight a great list at 147. When he did dabble in the who's who list, he lost. Loss to Paulie, ranks hime below Paulie...

This post has been edited by The Original MrFactor: May 31 2014, 10:47 AM
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Cshel86
post May 31 2014, 01:00 PM
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1. ODLH- Gotta put Oscar on the top of this list, hands down. Now, he lost most of the big fights, no secret there, but he has numerous names on resume. He would fight just about anybody, and pretty much did. Mosley, Trinidad, Floyd, Manny, Mayorga, Vargas, Sturm, Hopkins, Gatti. You'd have to ask what those guys did before and after they fought Oscar...along with the special ones who are still excelling afterwards (Manny, Floyd, Hopkins)

2. Cotto - I had to put him above Shane, because its hard to rate a guy who got caught up with PEDs...period. Manny, Floyd, Mosley, Margarito, Judah, and now Martinez...seems legit to me. He may have lost some of the big ones, but he was good enough to drum up interest in the boxing world and make these fights worth mentioning.

3. Mosley - He could've easily made #2 here, but again, that PED situation wont go away any time soon, especially when you're talking about rating him. It's hard to say though, it really is. He fought Forrest twice, Wright twice, Oscar twice, Floyd, Manny, etc...but that PED thing put a damper on a lot.

4. Judah - I wanted to put him down as #3, because of his status as undisputed WW champ status and the fact that his resume is a bit lengthy as well. However, I couldn't put him there, because Shane fought Oscar, and I'm sure he wasn't on anything for their first fight, so having Oscar on your resume, works wonder. Having him on your resume may not make you this HUGE star that you're supposed to be (ask Shane), but Judah, even with accomplishments, didn't become as big as he should've been, so they're somewhat even in a sense.

5. Malignaggi - His resume is a bit lengthy as well. He's been in there with Cotto, Hatton, Khan, etc...the only reason that I'm rating him above Margarito, is because he's been in a champ in 2 divisions.

6. Margarito - He's been in there with Cotto, Mosley, Martinez (whom still competes at the upper echelon of the sport), Manny, Williams, etc. His plaster suspicions are making it a bit difficult to rate him. Lol
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Plah
post May 31 2014, 08:11 PM
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1. DLH
2. Mosley
3. Cotto
4. Paulie
5. Judah
6. Tony (fuck him lol)
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daprofessor
post Jun 1 2014, 05:27 AM
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QUOTE (mgrover @ May 29 2014, 05:38 AM) *
We constantly hear about Pac and Mayweather resumes, but then boxing lives outside of these guys,

1. Mosley (Or should his entire career be invalidated due to the positive tests?)
2. Cotto
3. Judah
4. Malignaggi
5. De La Hoya
6. Margarito (Or should his entire career be invalidated due to the hand wraps?)

Some justifiation would be good, no point in just listing them off, I'll probably post mine soon


1. cotto...3 division champ on his way to being a 4 division champ if he beats martinez. his losses were against the best but had good wins against shane, margarito, clottey and few others.
2. dlh...great wins over quartey and vargas...but had a lot of controversial wins...or wins over guys that were undersized or passed their prime.
3. shane...best win has to be against dlh twice and margarito. also had some other notable wins but dominated at 135. first guy since duran to jump 2 weight classes to win the welter title.
4. judah...dude had nine lives and his list of opponents looks like a who's who over the last 15yrs.
5. malignaggi...2 division champ....able to resurrect career. lost to decent fighters.
6. margarito....piece of shit cheating muhfucka who deserved the ass whooping he got. fuck him.
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