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> Poll bitches: Do you think Guerrero deserves a shot at Floyd?
Does Guerrero deserve a shot at Floyd?
Vote suckas
Guerrero needs to beat a top 5 WW. [ 15 ] ** [88.24%]
Guerrero has done enough and deserves a shot [ 2 ] ** [11.76%]
Total Votes: 17
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gcarroll
post Nov 28 2012, 07:30 PM
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QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 28 2012, 10:24 AM) *
he packed the house in san jose and out in ontario. if the fight is in vegas...he has plenty of fans that will make the trip from the bay and socal. i actually think robert has more fans than ortiz who is a transplant while guerrero is a local boy.

The fight in Ontario was far from a sellout. Sure they called it that but it wasn't. I went a 2 weeks before to get tickets as the arena is 10 mins from my house. Upper deck prices were from $25 - $100. I was told that no tickets were available. So watching the fight on TV and at one point when showing the ring from a long view, I find that there is no one at all in the upper deck, not even stragglers. Needless to say I was pissed. The stadium only holds about 10,000 so they would be hard pressed to claim that there were more than 6000 people there. With GB's reputation, I'm sure 50% of the tickets were comps.

In So Cal, the ghost is just that, a ghost! They didn't even sell the fight as Guerro vs Berto. It was sold at the stadium as HBO Boxing! They didn't even have the pics of the fighters on the advertisements at the stadium when I was there 2 weeks before. Just a black poster with silver letter saying HBO Boxing and the date. No one will pay to see him fight Mayweather in Vegas. I would even bet on 1.0 mil PPV buys. I would go as far to say that they could still sell Floyd vs Berto and do better money wise than The Ghost!
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daprofessor
post Nov 28 2012, 08:02 PM
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QUOTE (gcarroll @ Nov 28 2012, 08:30 PM) *
The fight in Ontario was far from a sellout. Sure they called it that but it wasn't. I went a 2 weeks before to get tickets as the arena is 10 mins from my house. Upper deck prices were from $25 - $100. I was told that no tickets were available. So watching the fight on TV and at one point when showing the ring from a long view, I find that there is no one at all in the upper deck, not even stragglers. Needless to say I was pissed. The stadium only holds about 10,000 so they would be hard pressed to claim that there were more than 6000 people there. With GB's reputation, I'm sure 50% of the tickets were comps.

In So Cal, the ghost is just that, a ghost! They didn't even sell the fight as Guerro vs Berto. It was sold at the stadium as HBO Boxing! They didn't even have the pics of the fighters on the advertisements at the stadium when I was there 2 weeks before. Just a black poster with silver letter saying HBO Boxing and the date. No one will pay to see him fight Mayweather in Vegas. I would even bet on 1.0 mil PPV buys. I would go as far to say that they could still sell Floyd vs Berto and do better money wise than The Ghost!


well...i don't know for sure because i'm not part of gbp, the money team...or guerrero's camp...but i'm willing to bet guerrero is the front runner to be his next opponent.
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Jack 1000
post Nov 29 2012, 01:41 AM
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QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 28 2012, 05:38 PM) *
You made some decent points, but seriously, people dont even know who Robert Guerrero is...even AFTER the Berto fight. People once again realized who Ortiz was after beating Berto, which is past tense for people knowing him before hand.

It doesn't matter if his image was tarnished after the Maidana loss...point is, he actually had an image to be tarnished to begin with. Guerrero and "image" don't even belong in the same sentence...dude truly IS a ghost. That's not hating, that's just the truth.

The weird thing is, people across the net are probably looking at pictures of Berto's eyes swollen shut, and it's sad because Berto may actually be THAT much more known for looking like a Star Wars creature, than Guerrero would be for beating him. When I seriously say that the fight lacked entertainment value...it did.

Berto walked away with more than an ass kicking after the Ortiz fight...he left with more respect and an enhanced fan base. It's not like Ortiz went in there and fleeced him over the course of 12 rounds. Hell, Ortiz was about 2-3 punches away from being stopped in that fight. So that proved that Berto wasn't just a trash hype job.

Robert, even without being knocked down, did a poor man's job of what Ortiz did. I'm still not understanding how a guy who was obviously bigger and faster, not able to put away a guy who couldn't see anything. I'm still stuck there. Berto was still able to duck & slip shots, and land some of his own. So that raised more questions about Guerrero, than it actually answered.

Oh yeah, I don't see how Floyd was considered the PPV after the Oscar fight, when he went on to sale on about 900k buys against Hatton. Dont get me wrong, those are good numbers, but a PPV King status should exceed 1M buys, ESPECIALLY after you just sold 2.4M with Oscar. So him cracking 1M buys against JMM, was wit Marquez's help...who is more popular than Ortiz and Guerrero.

Trust me, most of those buys in the Ortiz fight had a lot to do with people hoping that the Pacquiao fight was next. Floyd DID say, "And yes Pacquiao, you're next" during the press conference. NOW, to us who know what's going on, that's a big crock of shit on Floyd's part, but to the casual fans (who actually buy more of these PPVs than us hardcore fans), that was a sure as shit reason to buy it and see how he performed after a 14-month layoff against a strong Mexican American who had JUST beat an undefeated Berto and became champ.

I'll go back to my point of casual fans being the bulk of these PPV cards. Really, us as hardcore fans, what in the hell do we need to be bothered with all of the pressers, commercials, open workouts, etc. while a fight is being built up? We already know what's going on, that shit is done for PUBLICITY, to increase the buy rate.

As soon as a PPV is announced, I already know who most (or all) of the fighters are on the card, and I have general idea of how the fight will go. Casual fans don't know this, hence why we have to see one highlight reel after another, along with other promotional material. With that in mind, if people don't know who Robert Guerrero is, or they happen to be uninterested in the fight, then the remainder of the casual buyers will buy it because they either want to see Floyd just because, see him lose, or they wanna see if he's still able to pull it off.

Sadly, Guerrero has done the worst possible thing, he hasn't made an identity for himself, and he's trying too hard to find a fight that will get him noticed. All fighters should do the latter, but he was supposed to go out there and put Berto on a stretcher last Saturday. He needs to do what Martinez did...take on all comers, fleece 'em, and call out the big names while doing so. Robert can't just piss way up and down in weight classes, and hope for something big to happen. Floyd already called out a smaller MARKETABLE fighter to jump up 2 weight classes and fight him...and his name wasn't Robert Guerrero.


Good points!

I disagree though that the fight was not entertaining. It was entertaining as hell I thought! Many rounds were give and take, and if you take away the two knockdowns it was a close, grueling, punishing contest. I totally agree with the weight-jumping issue and Robert trying to find his identity. Also agree about too much build-up and pom-pom shaking! When I DVR a fight, I go right to the ring intros most of the time.

Jack
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Cshel86
post Nov 29 2012, 01:07 PM
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QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 28 2012, 07:01 PM) *
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) i get ur hate for guerrero...but i have to stop u on this one...ortiz/maidana only became the headliner because the original main event fell out. ortiz losing that fight lost him a bunch of fans as well because everyone heard his..."i don't deserve to get beat like this..." statement and it was disgraceful in the fans eyes.

It's not hate, it's more frustration than anything. I remember a fight fell through, can't really remember who it was though. My point is, Ortiz was remembered more for quitting in the Maidana, than Guerrero has ever been remembered. There are a few fighters who are disliked/hated/misunderstood, and get more attention than fighters who really deserve it.

It's like a classroom full of kids (or adults), EVERYONE is either distracted or entertained by the class clowns and the bad asses...rarely does anyone give a flying flip about the student who's quietly working hard.

QUOTE (Jack 1000 @ Nov 29 2012, 01:41 AM) *
Good points!

I disagree though that the fight was not entertaining. It was entertaining as hell I thought! Many rounds were give and take, and if you take away the two knockdowns it was a close, grueling, punishing contest. I totally agree with the weight-jumping issue and Robert trying to find his identity. Also agree about too much build-up and pom-pom shaking! When I DVR a fight, I go right to the ring intros most of the time.

Jack

It was entertaining for what it was worth, but I grew frustrated because this was Robert's breakout fight, and he couldn't finish a guy who couldn't see at all. At least Ortiz managed to embarrass the hell outta Berto, and going on win a UD.

Guerrero was supposed to go in there and do what hasn't been done before...and actually stop Berto. We can't say that Berto wasn't ripe for the picking, and actually gave Robert ample opportunity to stop him.

PS: I actually liked Lampley's post-fight DVR advertisement...too funny!
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checkleft
post Nov 29 2012, 01:11 PM
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QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 29 2012, 01:07 PM) *
It's not hate, it's more frustration than anything. I remember a fight fell through, can't really remember who it was though. My point is, Ortiz was remembered more for quitting in the Maidana, than Guerrero has ever been remembered. There are a few fighters who are disliked/hated/misunderstood, and get more attention than fighters who really deserve it.

It's like a classroom full of kids (or adults), EVERYONE is either distracted or entertained by the class clowns and the bad asses...rarely does anyone give a flying flip about the student who's quietly working hard.


It was entertaining for what it was worth, but I grew frustrated because this was Robert's breakout fight, and he couldn't finish a guy who couldn't see at all. At least Ortiz managed to embarrass the hell outta Berto, and going on win a UD.

Guerrero was supposed to go in there and do what hasn't been done before...and actually stop Berto. We can't say that Berto wasn't ripe for the picking, and actually gave Robert ample opportunity to stop him.

PS: I actually liked Lampley's post-fight DVR advertisement...too funny!

Very true. If berto was ever stopped this was the best time to do it, very inactive, mentally weak, coming off injury, and no vision. It could say something about guerrero but I think it says more about berto. If only he had a better trainer and corner.
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sduck
post Nov 29 2012, 05:37 PM
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lol i wonder if cshel ever gave a fighter a chance
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BrutUalBK
post Nov 29 2012, 07:41 PM
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It seems that if Ortiz was able to earn a shot at Floyd for beating Berto then so should Guerrero also, but the only difference is that Vic actually earned a title in his bout with Berto so I guess if Floyd was doing what Manny is doing (chasing belts and bogus titles) then he should fight Robert and if not, then just wait until Guerrero beats somebody with one and then fight him.
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daprofessor
post Nov 29 2012, 08:35 PM
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QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 29 2012, 02:07 PM) *
It's not hate, it's more frustration than anything. I remember a fight fell through, can't really remember who it was though. My point is, Ortiz was remembered more for quitting in the Maidana, than Guerrero has ever been remembered. There are a few fighters who are disliked/hated/misunderstood, and get more attention than fighters who really deserve it.

It's like a classroom full of kids (or adults), EVERYONE is either distracted or entertained by the class clowns and the bad asses...rarely does anyone give a flying flip about the student who's quietly working hard.


It was entertaining for what it was worth, but I grew frustrated because this was Robert's breakout fight, and he couldn't finish a guy who couldn't see at all. At least Ortiz managed to embarrass the hell outta Berto, and going on win a UD.

Guerrero was supposed to go in there and do what hasn't been done before...and actually stop Berto. We can't say that Berto wasn't ripe for the picking, and actually gave Robert ample opportunity to stop him.

PS: I actually liked Lampley's post-fight DVR advertisement...too funny!


so u are holding a guy who has fought as low as 122 to a higher standard because he failed to do what no one has ever done to berto before? (stop him) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) i guess some ppl are harder to impress?

i think guerrero was that student who was quietly working hard than he realized the squeaky wheel gets the oil. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) i think i'd be more embarrassed getting dropped twice and looking like i was in a car accident against a guy who just came up two divisions than what ortiz did to him.
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daprofessor
post Nov 29 2012, 08:37 PM
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QUOTE (checkleft @ Nov 29 2012, 02:11 PM) *
Very true. If berto was ever stopped this was the best time to do it, very inactive, mentally weak, coming off injury, and no vision. It could say something about guerrero but I think it says more about berto. If only he had a better trainer and corner.


guerrero wasn't supposed to do this to berto. berto was supposed to stop him. berto was the betting favorite.
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Cshel86
post Nov 29 2012, 09:50 PM
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QUOTE (sduck @ Nov 29 2012, 05:37 PM) *
lol i wonder if cshel ever gave a fighter a chance

Yes I have...the wrong ones of course, but yes. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 29 2012, 08:35 PM) *
so u are holding a guy who has fought as low as 122 to a higher standard because he failed to do what no one has ever done to berto before? (stop him) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) i guess some ppl are harder to impress?

i think guerrero was that student who was quietly working hard than he realized the squeaky wheel gets the oil. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) i think i'd be more embarrassed getting dropped twice and looking like i was in a car accident against a guy who just came up two divisions than what ortiz did to him.

That whole coming from 122 to 147 while bullying and taking solid WW shots, seems a bit fishy. Hell, if he was able to hurt Berto like he did BEFORE his eyes started swelling up, then why couldn't he stop him while he was working off of no more than 20% vision?

He should've stopped Berto, if he was truly seeking that respect or attention from fans who'd love to see him in a bigger fight...especially a Berto who had been inactive for that period of time.

Im not hard to impress, but Guerrero should know how the boxing business goes, and it's fans are harsh and critical, so he should've gone for the knockout. Honestly, at this point, Floyd would not have to pay Robert more than $2M (which would be his highest payday), so I cant even say that the fight would be hard to make anymore.
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