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> Khan vs Garcia, (Poll Added) Thanks Checkleft!
Khan vs Garcia
Who takes it?
Garcia by decision (close) [ 1 ] ** [20.00%]
Garcia by decision (wide) [ 0 ] ** [0.00%]
Garcia by KO/TKO [ 0 ] ** [0.00%]
Khan by decision (close) [ 1 ] ** [20.00%]
Khan by decision (wide) [ 1 ] ** [20.00%]
Khan by KO/TKO [ 2 ] ** [40.00%]
Draw [ 0 ] ** [0.00%]
DQ (Indicate loser in response) [ 0 ] ** [0.00%]
Total Votes: 5
  
Cshel86
post Jul 13 2012, 05:53 PM
Post #41


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Messed up a merger??? Are you losing your edge Mr. Plato? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)

Seriously though, Im not sure if the scorecards will favor Garcia in this one, if it comes to that. Khan is the one whose supposed to be a star here, Garcia just got his hand raised in his recent fight against Morales, and was supposed to be somewhat protected and built up by GBP. Wait a minute, Garcia DID just get his hand raised against Morales in TEXAS....okay I get your point about the scorecards favoring Danny.
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Jack 1000
post Jul 13 2012, 05:58 PM
Post #42


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Here is the Khan-Garcia video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_yozKPALNE...player_embedded

I am bringing the comments over here to correct the merger issue. CShell made the following comments about the video:

Khan's portion wasn't bad either. Im so used to seeing documentaries on him, that's why it sparked no interest the first time around. However, after watching it, I was actually entertained by a few things:

1. Khan's secret feeling of disdain towards Roach giving Manny more time than him. He acknowledged the obvious reason why Roach gives Manny more time, but he still seemed a bit bothered by it. (Check that part out)
2. Khan just seemed like he had a lot of shit bottled up, and is ready to explode at any moment. (Very interesting)
3. He seemed to be getting tired of being away from home, and not being recognized as the fighter that he pushes to be.

Overall, good stuff!
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Jack 1000
post Jul 13 2012, 06:02 PM
Post #43


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QUOTE (Jack 1000 @ Jul 13 2012, 05:58 PM) *
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_yozKPALNE...player_embedded

Here is the Khan-Garcia video

I am bringing the comments over here to correct the merger issue. CShell made the following comments about the video:

Khan's portion wasn't bad either. Im so used to seeing documentaries on him, that's why it sparked no interest the first time around. However, after watching it, I was actually entertained by a few things:

1. Khan's secret feeling of disdain towards Roach giving Manny more time than him. He acknowledged the obvious reason why Roach gives Manny more time, but he still seemed a bit bothered by it. (Check that part out)
2. Khan just seemed like he had a lot of shit bottled up, and is ready to explode at any moment. (Very interesting)
3. He seemed to be getting tired of being away from home, and not being recognized as the fighter that he pushes to be.

Overall, good stuff!


DaProfessor says about the video:

i saw the khan piece. i took a few things from it...

1. who are the clowns working with him? zero knowledge...he obviously doesn't respect what they ask of him.

2. he seemed to be very intent on sitting in the pocket and trading with his sparring partner who looks much smaller than garcia and actually fights nothing like him.

3. he was getting hit with plenty of shots and seemed to be loading up on everything he threw.

4. when u go for the knock out...u get knocked out.

i get the feeling he's tired. 2 camps....1 fight. the disappointment of his last fight falling out. traveling the world...uk...philippines....back to the u.s. it can all be very draining. ask linares. freddie has stated that he wants amir to go forward more and that khan needs to knock garcia out because he feels they're going to cheat them out of a decision. i believe he's setting khan up for failure. if khan boxes...he may score a very easy victory. if he chooses to stay in the pocket and bang....he's going to get put to sleep. he has let garcia's dad get under his skin. that was one of the main things i noticed in the video. it's not looking good for khan.
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Jack 1000
post Jul 13 2012, 06:03 PM
Post #44


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QUOTE (Jack 1000 @ Jul 13 2012, 06:02 PM) *
DaProfessor says about the video:

i saw the khan piece. i took a few things from it...

1. who are the clowns working with him? zero knowledge...he obviously doesn't respect what they ask of him.

2. he seemed to be very intent on sitting in the pocket and trading with his sparring partner who looks much smaller than garcia and actually fights nothing like him.

3. he was getting hit with plenty of shots and seemed to be loading up on everything he threw.

4. when u go for the knock out...u get knocked out.

i get the feeling he's tired. 2 camps....1 fight. the disappointment of his last fight falling out. traveling the world...uk...philippines....back to the u.s. it can all be very draining. ask linares. freddie has stated that he wants amir to go forward more and that khan needs to knock garcia out because he feels they're going to cheat them out of a decision. i believe he's setting khan up for failure. if khan boxes...he may score a very easy victory. if he chooses to stay in the pocket and bang....he's going to get put to sleep. he has let garcia's dad get under his skin. that was one of the main things i noticed in the video. it's not looking good for khan.


CShel Says:

I have no reason to disagree with you Professor. Didn't Ortiz just have two camps and got in there looking crazy against Lopez? I also noticed how he didn't even listen to his corner people (S & C coach, and Roach's assistant), and yes, he was getting wacked by the smaller sparring partner. It was almost like he was trying to convince himself of something that he didn't have to prove.

Something just doesn't seem right about Amir nowadays, as well as his camp situation. I remember somebody here (could've been you) that said Khan needs a trainer that will give him all of his time, and bring out the skills in him to help him fight like the bigger fighter (something along those lines). Just listening to him talk and the circumstances in which this fight was announced, may play a BIG role in the outcome.

If anything, Khan's segment raised more questions than answers. I may not be the biggest Khan fan, but I would hate to see this dude's career fall short because of some bullshit. He's destined to be a big star in the sport (to some degree), and that's desperately needed in this sport full of personality-deficient fighters.
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Jack 1000
post Jul 13 2012, 06:06 PM
Post #45


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QUOTE (Jack 1000 @ Jul 13 2012, 06:03 PM) *
CShel Says:

I have no reason to disagree with you Professor. Didn't Ortiz just have two camps and got in there looking crazy against Lopez? I also noticed how he didn't even listen to his corner people (S & C coach, and Roach's assistant), and yes, he was getting wacked by the smaller sparring partner. It was almost like he was trying to convince himself of something that he didn't have to prove.

Something just doesn't seem right about Amir nowadays, as well as his camp situation. I remember somebody here (could've been you) that said Khan needs a trainer that will give him all of his time, and bring out the skills in him to help him fight like the bigger fighter (something along those lines). Just listening to him talk and the circumstances in which this fight was announced, may play a BIG role in the outcome.

If anything, Khan's segment raised more questions than answers. I may not be the biggest Khan fan, but I would hate to see this dude's career fall short because of some bullshit. He's destined to be a big star in the sport (to some degree), and that's desperately needed in this sport full of personality-deficient fighters.


Franchize Says: (about the video)

Thanks alot Cshel. Both docs were brilliantly done. Unlike your typical HBO ones, they didnt try to mold your opinion about either guy. At first, I thought Khan was going to outclass Garcia but now Im not so sure. I think Khan having two trsining camps may hurt him in this fight. He looks like he is becoming bored and he is practicing bad habits. He was taking some thunder from that sparring partner. I know one shouldnt take too much from a sparring session because you dont know what the fighter n trainer are working on. One problem tgat has always worried me about Khan however is, while I love his lightning quick attack, when hes done firing, he pulls str8 back to seperate. So many fighters dont know what to do when theyre done dishing it out to where they almost accept receiving punishment as the norm. He is the biggest culprit. I also saw Garcia being patient n setting his man up to get the punch he wanted to get off. He paid dividends by being focus in his attack. When he targeted the body for instance, he made sure to wait for said opening and when it presented itself, he delivered. I think this fight will come down to which fighter is more intelligent when theyre at rest. In other words, which fighter handles themselves responsibly when they ARENT throwing. I also see body punching, especially from Garcia, playing a huge role in this fight. I think the body shots wilk open up both fighters respective hooks. Am I alone in this observation or did you guys see some of the same things?
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Jack 1000
post Jul 13 2012, 06:09 PM
Post #46


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Daprofessor says:

just watched danny's video. good shit. i know a lot of ppl were offended by a lot of the shit danny's pops talked...but they have to understand...this is what puerto ricans do...talk shit. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

danny is a solid dude. he's nothing special or flashy...but he's getting the job done. i'm not counting him out in this fight. i think he has a very good chance of winning. hearing him and his pops story makes u wanna root for them. they're not bad ppl but to read some of the posts on some of these websites..where ppl are wishing death on this man. c'mon!? really? it's a fight man! danny is NOT very vocal. his pops can't be quiet. he's proud of his son and he helped to mold the kid. i'd be pretty loud and obnoxious too! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)
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Jack 1000
post Jul 13 2012, 06:11 PM
Post #47


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Da Proessor Says:

QUOTE
i've said similar things about linares and other fighters in that stable. the same holds true for khan. it's a blessing and a curse. u want to have a world class trainer like freddie or even manny steward...but these guys are in high demand and have very limited time. unfortunately, high caliber fighters suffer as a result. i can go down a very long list of guys who thought they'd be getting first class training...and end up working with "assistants" who have absolutely no clue.

i think everyone has great intentions....and yes, amir has star qualities....but not everyone is meant to be a star. these things cannot be forced. they have to happen in their time. we'll see if amir is meant to be a star or not.


CShel Responds:

Good stuff!

Its just something about Khan. In his biggest fights, he always seems to come up short, or almost lose grip.

Kotelnik - Cant really remember this fight, but obviously he won. Credit to him
Malignaggi - Credit to him, he won that won with ease
Maidana - Dude controlled the fight until the 10th round, and almost blew it.
McCloskey - just didn't look all that great
Judah - he beat a short, shot, fighter who couldn't get off. Credit to him making the most of the situation.
Peterson - Biggest fight of his career, and he came up short.

It's just something about his fights that doesn't seem "complete". Again, he starts well, then it seems like he runs out of shit to do from middle rounds on. He has what it takes, but Freddie needs to find a way to bring it out of him, or somebody else does.

After the Prescott fight, he went straight to Roach, but didn't appear to do anything different...he just reaped the benefits of the stardom from Roach and Pac. It seems like they never took enough time with this guy, and he has waaaay too much potential to be put on the backburner. The Maidana fight saved his rep in regards to his chin, but everything else in his arsenal seemed to remain stationary.
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Jack 1000
post Jul 13 2012, 06:13 PM
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Da Professor Says:

very good assessment.

kotelnik was tailor made for amir.

paulie didn't bring any real pop...amir was faster and stronger.

maidana was another tailor made guy for amir but he was very determined and didn't stop coming.

mcloskey...he didn't have alex ariza...he looked pretty flat.

judah...i actually thought judah could have beat him but he was too defensive in that fight. plus he chose to act instead of fight. that lowblow wasn't that bad.

peterson beat him and exposed a lot of what i already knew.

khan is very limited and ripe for the taking.

if my memory serves me correctly....he went to freddie before the prescott fight and ended up choosing to work with the cuban instead. i thought it was a mistake back then because most of the cuban coaches that defected had little or no experience in the pros. he came back after the loss. in the beginning...i was seeing the little things they were adding to his arsenal to get him back on track...and he was very inclined to listen because he was coming off that embarrassing loss. i believe his success with freddie has been more about careful opponent selection than any increase in skill set. he stopped adding to his arsenal and seems to rely on the little skill he has and mainly on his physical gifts. the thing about the wildcard....it's a lion's den....a snake pit. eyes are always watching....so u have to stay on top of ur game. everyone wants to be noticed or make their name off of one of freddies guys...or they are hoping to be chosen by freddie. as a result, there isn't a lot of going back to the drawing board to square one to teach a guy important lessons he may have missed along the way. doing that would make a high caliber guy like amir vulnerable to the vultures standing by. freddie has to protect what i believe to be a very fragile ego so that isn't an option for amir. the things that he needs to learn cannot be mastered in an 8 week camp. it takes year round focus and dedication. at some point....they run out of perfect opponents and the fighter faces defeat. he needs to go back to school to get the lessons he missed.
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Jack 1000
post Jul 13 2012, 06:32 PM
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QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Jul 13 2012, 05:53 PM) *
Messed up a merger??? Are you losing your edge Mr. Plato? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)

Seriously though, Im not sure if the scorecards will favor Garcia in this one, if it comes to that. Khan is the one whose supposed to be a star here, Garcia just got his hand raised in his recent fight against Morales, and was supposed to be somewhat protected and built up by GBP. Wait a minute, Garcia DID just get his hand raised against Morales in TEXAS....okay I get your point about the scorecards favoring Danny.


Yes, WBC might want to make a push for the next developing star, just because Danny is undefeated. Khan's got those loses, although the Peterson one was controversial, there is still the Prescott bliz from the first fight. Danny has no blemishes and the powers that be often like undefeated fighters to stay that way.

Jack
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mgrover
post Jul 13 2012, 07:18 PM
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Khan looks very ripped, I wonder how that will effect him fight time
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