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[Allmenjoi8]

If Vicious Victor Ortiz wins the fight on September 17th it will be sports biggest upsets ever. He will no doubt be the top guy for a VERY long time. Victor will make his own rules and be a money fight for anyone who wants to fight him. He could pick to fight Khan or Pac, hell even another rematch with Marcos M. His future will be in his own hands. But if he loses then what? Will his stock go down or will Khan want to fight him or Pac? Will he get the big names fights? Everyone knows that if May loses that Pac fight is down the toilet and he can just retire because no one will care to see him fight. That 0 is keeping people interested. But Ortiz is young, how will he keep people interested in seeing him fight if he loses to May?
Depending on how he loses (if he does) will determine his future. If he gives May all he can handle then people will respect him, being beaten by May is nothing to cry about. I like Victor, he has a nice story and I like his cockiness. Its appealing and sales tickets. I am pulling for MJ but I have respect for Victor, I just hope the boxing world does too after Sep 17th. Any thoughts?

[BoxingStill#1]

...... Mayweather isn't accustomed to punishment, and he'll quit if things get too rough.

What planet are you on dude?.... What makes you remotely think an undefeated fighter who, when he gets in deep water, turns the fight around and breaks down his opponent like no other,.... would quit?

However, Floyed is not unbeatable for sure.

I think Ortiz' future would depend on HOW this fight plays out rather than the actuall outcome.

Here are a couple examples:
1.) Floyed beats him from round 1 to finish weather by decision or knockout = Ortiz losses belt, but not much stock. In fact, even with a loss to Floyed (as expected) he is going to raise notoriety.
2.) Floyed beats him by close decsion = this would be tremendous for Ortiz. If he could lose but look good doing it, it would still put him in postion for a championship fight or the Pac/ Floyed winner.... pending his performance till that point.
3.) Ortiz win by big KO punch at any point in the fight = Sure this would be bad for Floyed's pulling power at the negotiating table, BUT IT STILL WOULDNT DERAIL A PAC FIGHT! Remember Floyed has the draw and even though half of the people tune in just to see this type of ending for him, he would pull the ultimate comeback story and could still sell the Pac fight fairly easy. Ortiz may be known as the guy who knocked out Floyed Mayweather and caused his first loss but it would equal only too Buster and Tyson type of ending.
4.) Ortiz wins by clear decision = shock to the entire boxing community and would be the best way to create stock for himself. Though this would be far stretched to the imagination, it would ultimately be what he needs to accell his star status. Floyed, the boxer out-outboxed by the slugger Ortiz... huge for him and could easily make any fight he would want I think.

In any event of a win for Ortiz, we are looking at the fighter of the year hands down and an even brighter future for the young champion.

[Eighty88Eight]

What planet are you on dude?.... What makes you remotely think an undefeated fighter who, when he gets in deep water, turns the fight around and breaks down his opponent like no other,.... would quit?

However, Floyed is not unbeatable for sure.

I think Ortiz' future would depend on HOW this fight plays out rather than the actuall outcome.

Here are a couple examples:
1.) Floyed beats him from round 1 to finish weather by decision or knockout = Ortiz losses belt, but not much stock. In fact, even with a loss to Floyed (as expected) he is going to raise notoriety.
2.) Floyed beats him by close decsion = this would be tremendous for Ortiz. If he could lose but look good doing it, it would still put him in postion for a championship fight or the Pac/ Floyed winner.... pending his performance till that point.
3.) Ortiz win by big KO punch at any point in the fight = Sure this would be bad for Floyed's pulling power at the negotiating table, BUT IT STILL WOULDNT DERAIL A PAC FIGHT! Remember Floyed has the draw and even though half of the people tune in just to see this type of ending for him, he would pull the ultimate comeback story and could still sell the Pac fight fairly easy. Ortiz may be known as the guy who knocked out Floyed Mayweather and caused his first loss but it would equal only too Buster and Tyson type of ending.
4.) Ortiz wins by clear decision = shock to the entire boxing community and would be the best way to create stock for himself. Though this would be far stretched to the imagination, it would ultimately be what he needs to accell his star status. Floyed, the boxer out-outboxed by the slugger Ortiz... huge for him and could easily make any fight he would want I think.

In any event of a win for Ortiz, we are looking at the fighter of the year hands down and an even brighter future for the young champion.

Floyd has been in deep water once in his career, against Castillo. And in the moment of truth, after his uncle beseeched him to "get the round big", he ran. Mayweather doesn't like punishment. He'll quit if he can no longer make his opponent miss.

[EAlbian]

Floyd has been in deep water once in his career, against Castillo. And in the moment of truth, after his uncle beseeched him to "get the round big", he ran. Mayweather doesn't like punishment. He'll quit if he can no longer make his opponent miss.

Floyd was hurt much worse by Corley as well as Mosley, he stayed right in the pocket and fought. Emanuel Agustus gave him a rough fight, he stayed right in there and slugged it out and stopped him. Floyd is no coward, not to say that if he had to move to survive a rough moment he wouldn't. The guy is one of the smartest fighters I've ever seen, he does what he needs to win. He's never quit, the guy broke his hand took a knee and won the fight with one hand. Obviously you need to spend a little youtube time revisiting the guys career, at least boxrec time to realize he's 42-0 with no losses, obviously he's never quit. Supposedly he tore his rotator cuff and still moved up and fought Castillo, had a bad performance and immediately rematched him.

No need to ride dick but at least give the guy his just due

[Eighty88Eight]

Floyd was hurt much worse by Corley as well as Mosley, he stayed right in the pocket and fought. Emanuel Agustus gave him a rough fight, he stayed right in there and slugged it out and stopped him. Floyd is no coward, not to say that if he had to move to survive a rough moment he wouldn't. The guy is one of the smartest fighters I've ever seen, he does what he needs to win. He's never quit, the guy broke his hand took a knee and won the fight with one hand. Obviously you need to spend a little youtube time revisiting the guys career, at least boxrec time to realize he's 42-0 with no losses, obviously he's never quit. Supposedly he tore his rotator cuff and still moved up and fought Castillo, had a bad performance and immediately rematched him.

No need to ride dick but at least give the guy his just due

He fought like a man against an aging Mosley, because Mosley backed off and got tired. He got physically beat up against non-punchers like Corley and Augustus, and largely invited the exchanges to show how tough he is against C grade fighters. That's not deep water. Deep water is when you're in a tough fight and can't easily swim to safety. The only evenly contested fight he was in was against Castillo, whom he ran from in the last round, then subsequently ran from in the rematch. I'm not saying Mayweather doesn't deserve enormous credit, I'm just saying people are too cocksure about his ability to win. He can lose and it won't require superhuman, steroid-filled ability.

And reread my entire post, I said I didn't think it would happen. Just one possible scenario. I expect him to win and look good doing it.

And two more points: There was never any suggestion of him breaking his hand against famoso hernandez. he got hurt, so he potshot and ran for the rest of the fight. nothing wrong with that but that's what he did.

[EAlbian]

He fought like a man against an aging Mosley, because Mosley backed off and got tired. He got physically beat up against non-punchers like Corley and Augustus, and largely invited the exchanges to show how tough he is against C grade fighters. That's not deep water. Deep water is when you're in a tough fight and can't easily swim to safety. The only evenly contested fight he was in was against Castillo, whom he ran from in the last round, then subsequently ran from in the rematch. I'm not saying Mayweather doesn't deserve enormous credit, I'm just saying people are too cocksure about his ability to win. He can lose and it won't require superhuman, steroid-filled ability.

And reread my entire post, I said I didn't think it would happen. Just one possible scenario. I expect him to win and look good doing it.

And two more points: There was never any suggestion of him breaking his hand against famoso hernandez. he got hurt, so he potshot and ran for the rest of the fight. nothing wrong with that but that's what he did.

Watch the clip: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2fswFNvqgyk clearly points to his hand, it may not have been "broken" but he clearly hurt it enough to take a knee. He didn't quit. he won the 12th rd imo against Castillo. He moved, idk if i'd call the second fight running, employing a tactic that your opponent can't adjust to would be seen as smart in some observers eyes. Maybe Ortiz is C level? maybe he can get to Mayweather? I don't think its out of the realm of possibility. I was arguing the quitting part, where has he ever shown the inclination to quit?

[Eighty88Eight]

Watch the clip: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2fswFNvqgyk clearly points to his hand, it may not have been "broken" but he clearly hurt it enough to take a knee. He didn't quit. he won the 12th rd imo against Castillo. He moved, idk if i'd call the second fight running, employing a tactic that your opponent can't adjust to would be seen as smart in some observers eyes. Maybe Ortiz is C level? maybe he can get to Mayweather? I don't think its out of the realm of possibility. I was arguing the quitting part, where has he ever shown the inclination to quit?

Did I say his running wasn't smart? He used the one advantage he had... speed. I was illustrating that Floyd is beatable and it doesn't require superhuman ability to defeat him. Castillo showed all it took was good timing, mental strength, good body work, and a solid chin to at least fight evenly with him.

I don't often use the word "clearly", but you're grasping for straws with that one, because Castillo clearly won the 12th round. He nearly doubled Mayweather's landed punches in the round. Rotator cuff injury or not, the same thing would have happened in the rematch if he didn't run/dance/skip/scamper. It just goes to show that when facing a sincere challenge, Floyd thinks with his legs.

[duwdu]

Did I say his running wasn't smart? He used the one advantage he had... speed. I was illustrating that Floyd is beatable and it doesn't require superhuman ability to defeat him. Castillo showed all it took was good timing, mental strength, good body work, and a solid chin to at least fight evenly with him.

I don't often use the word "clearly", but you're grasping for straws with that one, because Castillo clearly won the 12th round. He nearly doubled Mayweather's landed punches in the round. Rotator cuff injury or not, the same thing would have happened in the rematch if he didn't run/dance/skip/scamper. It just goes to show that when facing a sincere challenge, Floyd thinks with his legs.

It's all good that you're now off your "quitting" high horse. However, you're very good with condescending words to describe the actions you yourself admit as being smart, so one has to always look past your use of language.

P34c3