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> Floyd vs Cotto Article, Don't beat me up if you read it already
iKeNjiro
post Apr 11 2012, 11:35 PM
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QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Apr 12 2012, 10:41 AM) *
So Floyd will retire undefeated??? Please dont tell me this is the case...



Hahahahahahhha at that 1st quote
move up an face Alvarez?

Any who yea I believe Floyd retires un-defeated
I also don't see Floyd fighting past 36
Thus the reason he is fighting more times a year.

This fall he will look for the pacquiao fight
if he gets it, and wins super easily or by KO, he'll retire

If that fight with Pacquiao isn't there, he'll fight Alvarez if he wins big
Or Martinez. If Alvarez loses I see Floyd going to the winner of Berto/Ortiz, or
fighting Khan if Khan wins very big.

Thats what two fights next year

Fall 2012
Early or Mid 2013
Fall 2013



This post has been edited by iKeNjiro: Apr 11 2012, 11:42 PM
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Thickback
post Apr 12 2012, 06:33 AM
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I couldn't finish the article because it's clear from the first sentence that this "writer" is anti-Mayweather. We get enough of that from sites like Boxingscene. I guess the writer forgets about Cotto being present when Mayweather embarrassed Gatti and the potential for a fight with Mayweather shrunk with every punch landed. These writers always neglect to mention the direct impact that Bob Arum has had in a lot of the most anticipated fights not materializing. 3 examples are Floyd/Manny..Gamboa/Lopez and Chavez/Martinez. With Mayweather, the list is long. We all wanted to see him face Cotto when he was undefeated, Marg when he was clobbering people and even Clottey. But it is well documented that Floyd called out all of the top boxers at the time and none answered his challenge. Those boxers are De La Hoya..Mosely and Tszyu. The best excuse came from mosley who "was going on vacation and getting his tooth fixed". Lastly, anytime a "writer" inserts (LOL) into a published piece of work, I am instantly disinterested because maturity is clearly not the "writer's" strong point.

I may have missed some good points that the "writer" made after his initial blast of hatred for mayweather but I couldn't read any more. So excuse my rant on a half read article.
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iKeNjiro
post Apr 12 2012, 06:44 AM
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QUOTE (Thickback @ Apr 12 2012, 08:33 PM) *
I couldn't finish the article because it's clear from the first sentence that this "writer" is anti-Mayweather. We get enough of that from sites like Boxingscene. I guess the writer forgets about Cotto being present when Mayweather embarrassed Gatti and the potential for a fight with Mayweather shrunk with every punch landed. These writers always neglect to mention the direct impact that Bob Arum has had in a lot of the most anticipated fights not materializing. 3 examples are Floyd/Manny..Gamboa/Lopez and Chavez/Martinez. With Mayweather, the list is long. We all wanted to see him face Cotto when he was undefeated, Marg when he was clobbering people and even Clottey. But it is well documented that Floyd called out all of the top boxers at the time and none answered his challenge. Those boxers are De La Hoya..Mosely and Tszyu. The best excuse came from mosley who "was going on vacation and getting his tooth fixed". Lastly, anytime a "writer" inserts (LOL) into a published piece of work, I am instantly disinterested because maturity is clearly not the "writer's" strong point.

I may have missed some good points that the "writer" made after his initial blast of hatred for mayweather but I couldn't read any more. So excuse my rant on a half read article.


+1
great post
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BigFightFan
post Apr 12 2012, 07:57 AM
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I just want to know why would Floyd borrow money from Don King? I guess the writer didn't realize Floyd addressed Ortiz as a young strong lion as well. This went beyond bias to straight hate. I like Al Hamon for putting more money in the fighters pocket, they really deserve it.
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xxxxxx
post Apr 12 2012, 10:05 AM
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I think this article was ridiculous. It was entertaining enough to finish reading, but I agree with very little of it. Mayweather has wanted Cotto for awhile now. Well before he "Retired" after the Hatton fight. Once he split from Top Rank it was gonna become almost impossible to make the fight with Cotto still under the Top Rank banner. Bob Arum don't like Mayweather and vice versa. They Can't work together period.
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daprofessor
post Apr 12 2012, 12:23 PM
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QUOTE (xxxxxx @ Apr 12 2012, 11:05 AM) *
I think this article was ridiculous. It was entertaining enough to finish reading, but I agree with very little of it. Mayweather has wanted Cotto for awhile now. Well before he "Retired" after the Hatton fight. Once he split from Top Rank it was gonna become almost impossible to make the fight with Cotto still under the Top Rank banner. Bob Arum don't like Mayweather and vice versa. They Can't work together period.


i think the best time for that fight to be made was after cotto/shane and floyd/hatton. floyd retired. there's no denying that.

a close look at floyds resume reveals some things that i find very telling...he's only defeated 2 undefeated fighters.

now that cotto has 2 losses...the fight is being made. critics will have easy ammo in this and floyd will not get much credit for beating a man who has been beaten badly, twice. had he beat cotto after the hatton fight...it would have been difficult to criticize then and would have raised his standing greatly imo.
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wolterb
post Apr 12 2012, 02:01 PM
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QUOTE (Thickback @ Apr 12 2012, 07:33 AM) *
I couldn't finish the article because it's clear from the first sentence that this "writer" is anti-Mayweather. We get enough of that from sites like Boxingscene. I guess the writer forgets about Cotto being present when Mayweather embarrassed Gatti and the potential for a fight with Mayweather shrunk with every punch landed. These writers always neglect to mention the direct impact that Bob Arum has had in a lot of the most anticipated fights not materializing. 3 examples are Floyd/Manny..Gamboa/Lopez and Chavez/Martinez. With Mayweather, the list is long. We all wanted to see him face Cotto when he was undefeated, Marg when he was clobbering people and even Clottey. But it is well documented that Floyd called out all of the top boxers at the time and none answered his challenge. Those boxers are De La Hoya..Mosely and Tszyu. The best excuse came from mosley who "was going on vacation and getting his tooth fixed". Lastly, anytime a "writer" inserts (LOL) into a published piece of work, I am instantly disinterested because maturity is clearly not the "writer's" strong point.

I may have missed some good points that the "writer" made after his initial blast of hatred for mayweather but I couldn't read any more. So excuse my rant on a half read article.


Those were my thoughts when I read it. It is nice to get another perspective but it seems wherever you go the writing on mayweather or pacquiao is incredibly biased. So now i'm wondering: Is the notion that Mayweather could not make the "dream" fights because of politics a biased notion? Does anyone have any clear cut, evidence based answers to that?

I frequent fighthype because the reporting appears more objective than other sites, but i have heard the site being criticized for doing the same thing we see in this article.

Either way, I don't mind reading differing perspective so I appreciated the read iKeNjiro

And i completely agree about the "LOL"...that shit is completely distracting in what is supposed to be a legitimate article and makes anything stated suspect.

This post has been edited by wolterb: Apr 12 2012, 02:03 PM
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daprofessor
post Apr 12 2012, 02:17 PM
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QUOTE (wolterb @ Apr 12 2012, 03:01 PM) *
Those were my thoughts when I read it. It is nice to get another perspective but it seems wherever you go the writing on mayweather or pacquiao is incredibly biased. So now i'm wondering: Is the notion that Mayweather could not make the "dream" fights because of politics a biased notion? Does anyone have any clear cut, evidence based answers to that?

I frequent fighthype because the reporting appears more objective than other sites, but i have heard the site being criticized for doing the same thing we see in this article.

Either way, I don't mind reading differing perspective so I appreciated the read iKeNjiro

And i completely agree about the "LOL"...that shit is completely distracting in what is supposed to be a legitimate article and makes anything stated suspect.


i too come here because the reporting seems to be a bit more objective than the others...but that's not really saying much. bias is something everyone is guilty of. i get the arguments for and against mayweather making/not making the fights with arums fighters. i have personally felt that arum bears most of the blame in those situations...but i still partially believe that floyd is to blame also.

as for floyd calling out all the top boxers....i must have missed that one. i've heard him make plenty of excuses not to face them....and not all of them were toprank fighters. after williams beat margarito...he called out floyd, cotto, shane....and none answered his call. it's all politricks. hide behind your promoter when u can....use excuses like "this guy isn't a draw...or who is that guy?....or i beat this guy who beat that guy...blah,blah,blah..." it's all just bullshit excuses.
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duwdu
post Apr 13 2012, 10:02 AM
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QUOTE (daprofessor @ Apr 12 2012, 12:23 PM) *
i think the best time for that fight to be made was after cotto/shane and floyd/hatton. floyd retired. there's no denying that.

a close look at floyds resume reveals some things that i find very telling...he's only defeated 2 undefeated fighters.

now that cotto has 2 losses...the fight is being made. critics will have easy ammo in this and floyd will not get much credit for beating a man who has been beaten badly, twice. had he beat cotto after the hatton fight...it would have been difficult to criticize then and would have raised his standing greatly imo.


I agree with you that was about the best time Mayweather-Cotto should have first happened, and on account of that, some may blame Floyd going into that retirement for the fight not happening then all they want. However, a reasonable observer and follower of the politics of boxing would know that, Mayweather going into that retirement or not, Arum was not going to allow Cotto to fight Mayweather then (or now,) as the bile from Mayweather leaving Arum had not subsided, and is still not subsided till this day. Even while both fighters were under him earlier, Arum, when asked, categorically stated that Cotto was not ready for Mayweather, talk less of when/after him (Arum) and Floyd had developed this deep grudge.

To cap this tought, when reports emerged that Mayweather could choose to fight Cotto once Cotto had the balls to say that he would not bow to Pacman's demand/Arum's reference for him (Cotto) to drain down to 147 in other to get Pacquiao-Cotto II, Arum immediately boasted: "They won't get him," meaning Team Mayweather would not get to fight Cotto. That, to me, shows the extent of the bile in Arum towards Mayweather, if he would say that for a fighter (Cotto) even when that fighter was no longer under his control.

I don't know about "...he's only defeated 2 undefeated fighters," as if that would benchmark anything. What we do know, is that Mayweather has faced more champions in his weight range during his career this far, than any other fighter in this era. Nice try though.

And, for what it's worth, Mayweather-Cotto was made possible now, not because Cotto now has two losses as you alluded to, but because Cotto is no longer under Arum's control, simple; and also because Mayweather has the "good fortune" that Pacman "schemed" himself out of a return with Cotto, even though the Cotto fight was what Jinkee said Pacquiao preferred.

P34c3
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daprofessor
post Apr 13 2012, 12:36 PM
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QUOTE (duwdu @ Apr 13 2012, 11:02 AM) *
I agree with you that was about the best time Mayweather-Cotto should have first happened, and on account of that, some may blame Floyd going into that retirement for the fight not happening then all they want. However, a reasonable observer and follower of the politics of boxing would know that, Mayweather going into that retirement or not, Arum was not going to allow Cotto to fight Mayweather then (or now,) as the bile from Mayweather leaving Arum had not subsided, and is still not subsided till this day. Even while both fighters were under him earlier, Arum, when asked, categorically stated that Cotto was not ready for Mayweather, talk less of when/after him (Arum) and Floyd had developed this deep grudge.

To cap this tought, when reports emerged that Mayweather could choose to fight Cotto once Cotto had the balls to say that he would not bow to Pacman's demand/Arum's reference for him (Cotto) to drain down to 147 in other to get Pacquiao-Cotto II, Arum immediately boasted: "They won't get him," meaning Team Mayweather would not get to fight Cotto. That, to me, shows the extent of the bile in Arum towards Mayweather, if he would say that for a fighter (Cotto) even when that fighter was no longer under his control.

I don't know about "...he's only defeated 2 undefeated fighters," as if that would benchmark anything. What we do know, is that Mayweather has faced more champions in his weight range during his career this far, than any other fighter in this era. Nice try though.

And, for what it's worth, Mayweather-Cotto was made possible now, not because Cotto now has two losses as you alluded to, but because Cotto is no longer under Arum's control, simple; and also because Mayweather has the "good fortune" that Pacman "schemed" himself out of a return with Cotto, even though the Cotto fight was what Jinkee said Pacquiao preferred.

P34c3



that's one way to look at it i suppose...

but here is food for thought. at the point that cotto/mayweather could have been made...after floyd/hatton....there wasn't even an attempt by floyd. he immediately dismissed cotto calling him a regional star...and "who is miguel cotto?" he knew who miguel was...and the fight was much more possible imo because cotto was no where near the cash cow that pac would soon become. arum/haymon didn't have two failed negotiations. things were highly more possible then. plus, hbo wanted that fight and it was the obvious next step if u listen to the commentary. floyd killed it all with his "retirement." also...hearing statements by floyd, roger and floyd sr about "why should floyd fight all these tough guys? let them fight each other and when the smoke clears...." take that how u want. i agree....floyd shouldn't have to fight tough guy after tough guy...but let's be blatantly honest about this. since floyd left 135 all of his opponents have been carefully selected. there is something to be said about defeating undefeated fighters. there is a huge difference in confidence in facing an undefeated fighter who does not know how to lose. facing a fighter who has lost is not as difficult.
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