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> JMM vs Mayweather 2, How well would Marquez fair now against him?
BrutUalBK
post Dec 22 2012, 12:09 PM
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I know everyone saw the first fight and has already made up in their minds that JMM wouldn't stand much of a chance but you have to consider all of these factors before rushing to judgment based on their previous bout:

1. Floyd moved around using his legs throughout most of the fight and is now older and tends to stay in the pocket and take more punches as a result of it.

2. Floyd is older, yeah, I know so is Marquez but inactivity by Mayweather could affect his timing and it appears to me that he is missing a lot of punches that he used to land with ease before he started taking longer breaks in between fights since getting older, plus with JMM's effective counterpunching, increased speed and power it probably wouldn't take as much to at least knock Floyd down.

3. JMM has trained correctly and it showed in his last fight and he will not be grossly outweighed like he was in their first bout.

4. I think JMM has proven now that he has the power to KO anyone at WW so he may have a slight punching power advantage over FMJr even at his advanced age.

5. Confidence (not Overconfidence), well we know who's confidence is riding higher now. JMM can go into the rematch thinking to himself "I faced the man some people said that you've been ducking for years", so with this it runs in his favor but wait, Floyd does have the win over him and is undefeated, younger, taller and the P4P Champion.

Now, I'm not saying that JMM wins in a rematch but I think he fairs far better than the first bout so don't shoot me too full of holes for suggesting this idea that he does fair better. lol

Your thoughts???

This post has been edited by BrutUalBK: Dec 22 2012, 12:16 PM
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mitukczuk
post Dec 22 2012, 12:35 PM
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The thing is...there is no reason for a rematch. Floyd DOMINATED him...and when I say DOMINATED I mean....DOOOMINAAAATEEEED.

1. To me hes more dangerous in the pocket. And..I don't know where people are getting the legs issue, hes still fresher on them than 80% of young up and coming fighters.
2. The only fight I saw him miss "a lot" of punches is the Cotto fight...and Cotto was looking spectacular that night (for a Cotto of late)...not to mention he still came up short.
3. Weight was not an issue in their first fight imo. The skills were. Floyd trains incorrectly or.....can't see your point.
4. Well placed, timed and "invisible" shot doesn't mean that there is "Ill knock all them mfkers out" power behind it. A good strong jab can daze you and put you on your ass.
5. I think that knocking the f out the God himself wouldn't be enough to get Floyd off of the confidence throne.

Though I dissagree with almost all your points, I have to admit this fight can happen since money talk and Marquez's stock has been raised a bit...but still...Floyd doesn't really need to gie him a rematch...

This post has been edited by mitukczuk: Dec 22 2012, 12:38 PM
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BrutUalBK
post Dec 22 2012, 10:42 PM
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QUOTE (mitukczuk @ Dec 22 2012, 11:35 AM) *
The thing is...there is no reason for a rematch. Floyd DOMINATED him...and when I say DOMINATED I mean....DOOOMINAAAATEEEED.

1. To me hes more dangerous in the pocket. And..I don't know where people are getting the legs issue, hes still fresher on them than 80% of young up and coming fighters.
2. The only fight I saw him miss "a lot" of punches is the Cotto fight...and Cotto was looking spectacular that night (for a Cotto of late)...not to mention he still came up short.
3. Weight was not an issue in their first fight imo. The skills were. Floyd trains incorrectly or.....can't see your point.
4. Well placed, timed and "invisible" shot doesn't mean that there is "Ill knock all them mfkers out" power behind it. A good strong jab can daze you and put you on your ass.
5. I think that knocking the f out the God himself wouldn't be enough to get Floyd off of the confidence throne.

Though I dissagree with almost all your points, I have to admit this fight can happen since money talk and Marquez's stock has been raised a bit...but still...Floyd doesn't really need to gie him a rematch...



1. While I agree with point one about he's more dangerous in the pocket he does tend to get hit more often. I guess people are getting the leg issues because they're basing it on his previous performances, especially the likes of those fought against Corrales and Castillo were he moved more using his legs and since moving up he hasn't used them all that much after the Baldomir fight.

2. It seems we are on the same page here regarding Floyd's timing being off, he did miss a lot of punches<<that's timing.

3. I never said that weight was an issue nor was I trying to imply that it was. I agree that it was Floyd's skills that made all the difference and as far as you not being able to see my point, I was talking about Marquez not training properly to prepare himself to get stronger with his strength and conditioning coach and adding the weight properly that he would've needed to contend with the bigger fighters. Look at this version of JMM vs the last one that fought Pac, they're virtually two different body types Pac faced.

4. I've boxed and sparred for many years so I'm well aware about what a jab or the so called "invisible" shot (the one you don't see) can do to you so I'm not sure where you're going with your comments regarding this post.

5. Again, it appears we agree here so I'm not sure why you made the statement that you disagree with almost all my points. At no time did I suggest that JMM beats Floyd and at no time did I devalue the skills of Mayweather. I believe it is going to take a special fighter and a special moment for that one fighter to come along and beat Floyd but I just don't see that fighter on the horizon as of yet.

Here are my points about Floyd's advantages over JMM:

1. Already has a dominating win over him
2. He's more highly skillled both defensively and offensively
3. He's faster
4. He's younger
5. He's taller
6. He has the reach advantage
7. He is undefeated
8. P4P #1 (never doubted by me)
9. Been in less ring wars, taken less wear and tear over the years
10. Pac rejected 40 million dollars to fight him but took much less to face Marquez a 4th time.
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Dolimite
post Dec 23 2012, 09:23 AM
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Marquez beat Pacquiao with one devastating counter right hand. No doubt, but look at his opponent. Manny was reckless, he jumped into that punch blindly. Manny was tagging Juan all night with his speed, not accuracy just speed. Juan looked slower and he even looked like he was tiring out. Yes Juan was bigger and willing to take a beating to land that shot and the risk paid off. Mayweather wouldn't even come close to making all the silly mistakes Manny did. He would pace himself and eventually make Juan say "no mas." With Juan being slower and Mayweather willing to stand toe to toe this fight would look similar to the Gatti fight if not worse. I would say this fight would end in a stoppage. Mayweather would want to prove that Juan is far below his level which would further prove to Skip Bayless, Michael Wilbon and the rest of the idiots who actually think Manny would have a chance to pick off Mayweather. What makes Mayweather great is his boxing IQ and his willingness to adjust. Most fighters stick to one game plan Mayweather has several he is like Randy Johnson, the guy had a million different pitches, Mayweather has a million different looks and strategies. The guy is a genius. This fight would be twenty times worse. I would rather see this fight than Robert Guerrero.
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Cshel86
post Dec 23 2012, 09:02 PM
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QUOTE (Dolimite @ Dec 23 2012, 09:23 AM) *
Marquez beat Pacquiao with one devastating counter right hand. No doubt, but look at his opponent. Manny was reckless, he jumped into that punch blindly. Manny was tagging Juan all night with his speed, not accuracy just speed. Juan looked slower and he even looked like he was tiring out. Yes Juan was bigger and willing to take a beating to land that shot and the risk paid off. Mayweather wouldn't even come close to making all the silly mistakes Manny did. He would pace himself and eventually make Juan say "no mas." With Juan being slower and Mayweather willing to stand toe to toe this fight would look similar to the Gatti fight if not worse. I would say this fight would end in a stoppage. Mayweather would want to prove that Juan is far below his level which would further prove to Skip Bayless, Michael Wilbon and the rest of the idiots who actually think Manny would have a chance to pick off Mayweather. What makes Mayweather great is his boxing IQ and his willingness to adjust. Most fighters stick to one game plan Mayweather has several he is like Randy Johnson, the guy had a million different pitches, Mayweather has a million different looks and strategies. The guy is a genius. This fight would be twenty times worse. I would rather see this fight than Robert Guerrero.

You gotta look at the money factor here...who would do more numbers...the guy who just knocked Manny the hell out, or the guy that nobody knows? Let's not forget that Juan kept complaining that "weight was a factor" in the first fight. Now that Juan appears to be a decent WW (or somewhat close), people will think the fight will go differently.
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Dolimite
post Dec 23 2012, 09:38 PM
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QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Dec 23 2012, 06:02 PM) *
You gotta look at the money factor here...who would do more numbers...the guy who just knocked Manny the hell out, or the guy that nobody knows? Let's not forget that Juan kept complaining that "weight was a factor" in the first fight. Now that Juan appears to be a decent WW (or somewhat close), people will think the fight will go differently.


I would pay to see the Juan Marquez fight over Guerrero. Guerrero has no interest at all. He fights worse than Juan Castillo. A dirty fighter who tries to rough up his opponents. if Berto had any skills or sense he would of kept a distance and pot shot Guerrero for 12 rounds but this guy is a schizo and I realize Berto thinks he is Mayweather and Ali (his weak ass rope a dope). The fact is I am asking for the Juan fight. It will rake in money plus it would kill the 5th Pac fight for September so either way it works for me.
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Posts in this topic
- BrutUalBK   JMM vs Mayweather 2   Dec 22 2012, 12:09 PM
- - mitukczuk   The thing is...there is no reason for a rematch. F...   Dec 22 2012, 12:35 PM
|- - BrutUalBK   QUOTE (mitukczuk @ Dec 22 2012, 11:35 AM)...   Dec 22 2012, 10:42 PM
||- - Dolimite   Marquez beat Pacquiao with one devastating counter...   Dec 23 2012, 09:23 AM
||- - Cshel86   QUOTE (Dolimite @ Dec 23 2012, 09:23 AM) ...   Dec 23 2012, 09:02 PM
|||- - Dolimite   QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Dec 23 2012, 06:02 PM) Y...   Dec 23 2012, 09:38 PM
|||- - Franchize   QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Dec 23 2012, 09:02 PM) Y...   Dec 24 2012, 10:27 AM
||- - BoxingFan86   QUOTE (Dolimite @ Dec 23 2012, 09:23 AM) ...   Dec 26 2012, 01:57 AM
|- - Franchize   QUOTE (mitukczuk @ Dec 22 2012, 12:35 PM)...   Dec 24 2012, 02:39 AM
- - mgrover   I would be lying if i said i wouldn't like to ...   Dec 22 2012, 01:49 PM
- - leonthegee   Marquez still cant slip a left hook to save his li...   Dec 22 2012, 02:00 PM
- - Cshel86   Fight 'em Floyd! To hell with Guerrero...   Dec 22 2012, 02:36 PM
- - p4pcrown   Different fight, same ending   Dec 22 2012, 03:54 PM
- - Cshel86   Marquez DID just come off of the BIGGEST win of hi...   Dec 22 2012, 08:34 PM
- - BoxingStill#1   Pacs style makes Marquez look real good.. Floyds ...   Dec 22 2012, 09:11 PM
- - Kratza   I think we all saw how slow Marquez was in the rin...   Dec 24 2012, 07:56 AM
- - Cshel86   QUOTE (Dolimite @ Dec 23 2012, 09:38 PM) ...   Dec 24 2012, 09:06 PM
- - daprofessor   the rematch may be worse for marquez. he's slo...   Dec 24 2012, 09:29 PM
|- - Cshel86   QUOTE (daprofessor @ Dec 24 2012, 09:29 P...   Dec 24 2012, 09:37 PM
|- - Dolimite   QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Dec 24 2012, 06:37 PM) H...   Dec 24 2012, 10:57 PM
||- - BrutUalBK   QUOTE (Dolimite @ Dec 24 2012, 09:57 PM) ...   Dec 24 2012, 11:32 PM
|- - daprofessor   QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Dec 24 2012, 09:37 PM) H...   Dec 25 2012, 12:50 AM
|- - Cshel86   QUOTE (daprofessor @ Dec 25 2012, 12:50 A...   Dec 25 2012, 07:05 PM
|- - Dolimite   QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Dec 25 2012, 04:05 PM) I...   Dec 25 2012, 09:45 PM
- - checkleft   QUOTE (daprofessor @ Dec 25 2012, 01:50 A...   Dec 25 2012, 02:03 AM
|- - daprofessor   QUOTE (checkleft @ Dec 25 2012, 03:03 AM)...   Dec 25 2012, 05:04 AM
- - mgrover   I'd Marquez to get the fight for a nice payday...   Dec 25 2012, 07:54 AM
- - checkleft   QUOTE (daprofessor @ Dec 25 2012, 06:04 A...   Dec 26 2012, 02:44 AM
- - MaxPayne   I would love to see this fight. I'm a huge fan...   Dec 26 2012, 07:28 AM
|- - BrutUalBK   QUOTE (MaxPayne @ Dec 26 2012, 06:28 AM) ...   Dec 26 2012, 08:44 AM
|- - Franchize   QUOTE (BrutUalBK @ Dec 26 2012, 08:44 AM)...   Dec 26 2012, 12:06 PM
|- - KOpower   QUOTE (BrutUalBK @ Dec 26 2012, 08:44 AM)...   Dec 28 2012, 02:31 PM
|- - daprofessor   QUOTE (KOpower @ Dec 28 2012, 03:31 PM) M...   Dec 28 2012, 03:40 PM
||- - KOpower   QUOTE (daprofessor @ Dec 28 2012, 03:40 P...   Dec 28 2012, 04:39 PM
||- - daprofessor   QUOTE (KOpower @ Dec 28 2012, 05:39 PM) F...   Dec 28 2012, 08:21 PM
||- - Dolimite   QUOTE (daprofessor @ Dec 28 2012, 05:21 P...   Dec 29 2012, 01:35 AM
||- - daprofessor   QUOTE (Dolimite @ Dec 29 2012, 02:35 AM) ...   Dec 29 2012, 03:16 AM
|- - sduck   Same fight, same results. Marquez himself said wei...   Dec 28 2012, 04:35 PM
- - MaxPayne   Guys, salient points, but riddle me this: When is...   Dec 26 2012, 12:10 PM
- - bnoles4life   You know, I'm not throughly convinced JMM/Mann...   Dec 26 2012, 08:00 PM
|- - daprofessor   QUOTE (bnoles4life @ Dec 26 2012, 09:00 P...   Dec 27 2012, 03:34 AM
- - checkleft   QUOTE (bnoles4life @ Dec 26 2012, 09:00 P...   Dec 27 2012, 03:23 AM
- - Cshel86   QUOTE (Dolimite @ Dec 25 2012, 09:45 PM) ...   Dec 27 2012, 01:28 PM
|- - MaxPayne   QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Dec 27 2012, 01:28 PM) I...   Dec 27 2012, 10:27 PM
|- - BrutUalBK   QUOTE (MaxPayne @ Dec 27 2012, 09:27 PM) ...   Dec 28 2012, 09:40 AM
- - wolterb   I say he better not fight that fight and as an hon...   Dec 27 2012, 08:28 PM
|- - Dolimite   QUOTE (wolterb @ Dec 27 2012, 05:28 PM) I...   Dec 27 2012, 10:15 PM
|- - wolterb   QUOTE (Dolimite @ Dec 27 2012, 10:15 PM) ...   Dec 28 2012, 08:53 AM
- - Franchize   Normally, I'd say n way in hell because JMM is...   Dec 28 2012, 07:22 AM
- - mgrover   why would is Marquez still with top rank? I though...   Dec 28 2012, 07:30 AM
- - Cshel86   QUOTE (MaxPayne @ Dec 27 2012, 10:27 PM) ...   Dec 28 2012, 12:31 PM
- - daprofessor   pac losing reduces payout for arum. reduced pay ou...   Dec 28 2012, 01:12 PM
- - Hotsauce   this fight would easily sell especially on cinco d...   Dec 28 2012, 05:09 PM
- - Gambit808   Look I don't wanna be a buzz kill here, but th...   Dec 28 2012, 06:49 PM
|- - KOpower   QUOTE (Gambit808 @ Dec 28 2012, 06:49 PM)...   Dec 29 2012, 03:28 PM
||- - Dolimite   QUOTE (KOpower @ Dec 29 2012, 01:28 PM) W...   Dec 29 2012, 05:09 PM
|||- - KOpower   QUOTE (Dolimite @ Dec 29 2012, 05:09 PM) ...   Dec 31 2012, 09:26 AM
|||- - aTYpicalTYrant   QUOTE (KOpower @ Dec 31 2012, 09:26 AM) I...   Dec 31 2012, 03:21 PM
||- - daprofessor   QUOTE (KOpower @ Dec 29 2012, 04:28 PM) W...   Dec 29 2012, 06:28 PM
||- - mgrover   QUOTE (KOpower @ Dec 29 2012, 08:28 PM) W...   Dec 29 2012, 08:05 PM
|||- - sduck   QUOTE (mgrover @ Dec 29 2012, 08:05 PM) P...   Dec 30 2012, 01:29 PM
|||- - mgrover   QUOTE (sduck @ Dec 30 2012, 06:29 PM) I h...   Dec 30 2012, 08:58 PM
|||- - Dolimite   QUOTE (mgrover @ Dec 30 2012, 06:58 PM) f...   Dec 30 2012, 11:42 PM
||- - Gambit808   QUOTE (KOpower @ Dec 29 2012, 03:28 PM) W...   Dec 30 2012, 12:59 AM
||- - BoxingFan86   QUOTE (KOpower @ Dec 29 2012, 03:28 PM) W...   Dec 31 2012, 04:58 AM
|- - BrutUalBK   QUOTE (Gambit808 @ Dec 28 2012, 05:49 PM)...   Dec 30 2012, 08:04 PM
|- - Gambit808   [quote name='BrutUalBK' date='Dec 30 2...   Dec 31 2012, 01:28 AM
- - Cshel86   QUOTE (daprofessor @ Dec 28 2012, 01:12 P...   Dec 29 2012, 02:54 PM
- - sduck   No offense to KOpower, but I just want to say you ...   Dec 30 2012, 01:04 PM
- - checkleft   QUOTE (daprofessor @ Dec 29 2012, 07:28 P...   Dec 31 2012, 01:31 AM
|- - Franchize   QUOTE (checkleft @ Dec 31 2012, 02:31 AM)...   Dec 31 2012, 09:06 AM
- - checkleft   QUOTE (KOpower @ Dec 31 2012, 10:26 AM) I...   Dec 31 2012, 09:42 AM
|- - KOpower   QUOTE (checkleft @ Dec 31 2012, 09:42 AM)...   Dec 31 2012, 09:55 AM
- - KOpower   By the way, I still think this fight could and sho...   Dec 31 2012, 09:59 AM
|- - BrutUalBK   QUOTE (KOpower @ Dec 31 2012, 08:59 AM) B...   Jan 1 2013, 05:02 PM
- - neophyte7   It is hard to sell Pac being able to beat Mayweath...   Dec 31 2012, 01:06 PM
- - BoxingFan86   QUOTE (KOpower @ Dec 31 2012, 09:26 AM) I...   Dec 31 2012, 02:14 PM
- - checkleft   QUOTE (KOpower @ Dec 31 2012, 10:55 AM) 1...   Dec 31 2012, 04:23 PM
- - Cshel86   Mayweather vs Pacquiao talk?!   Jan 1 2013, 07:57 PM
- - BoxingFan86   QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Jan 1 2013, 07:57 PM) Ma...   Jan 1 2013, 08:11 PM


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