IPB  

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

 
4 Pages V   1 2 3 > »   
Reply to this topicStart new topic
> What Are Your Ideas For Cleaning Up Boxing?
Jack 1000
post Jan 11 2013, 02:47 PM
Post #1


The Consultant


Group: Root Admin
Posts: 9,454
Joined: 2-December 02
Member No.: 14



I will say,

I would like to see some sort of centralized boxing authority that has the ability to over-power the sanctioning bodies when they do something that is terribly unjust or wrong. Sort of like how the Association of Boxing Commission Rules in the United States and Canada superseded, or at least are supposed to supersede alphabet federation rules. But they don't go far enough. Texas for instance has violated ABC rules by experimenting with the WBC 4th and 8th round Open Scoring system in WBC fights. This is a violation of Unified Rules.

Arkansans tried the WBC Open Scoring Rule in the Taylor-Ouma fight, but it was considered to be experimental at the time. The ABC knew this and overwhelmingly Open Scoring was rejected by almost all US Commissions and the British Boxing Board of Control. It is the ABC that kept Open Scoring thankfully out of the United States and Canada.

However, the model of a centralized boxing commission does not go far enough. And its not just the stopping of any form of Open Scoring, which has, for the most part, been a dismal failure. Why Japan likes it so much, I'll never know. If a centralized and legal authority can overturn alphabet federation protocols that are deplorable, this system should be put in place.

On the other hand, if reasonable and just decisions are made by the sanctioning bodies for the interest of the fighters, this needs to be addressed as well. Not everything an alphabet group does is corrupt. The alphabet federations are much more respected outside of the United States than within. The WBC's insurance and pension program for fighters is a good thing. The "WBC Caress" work with children's hospitals and efforts toward helping kids and fighters with terminal illness is a great thing. I can also say that the WBC out of all of the sanctioning bodies, is the most receptive to communication and feedback. They are always very helpful and willing to answer any questions or feedback that I submit to them.

The WBA is OK for feedback, but they don't respond as in-depth as the WBC does. The WBO is also pretty good for feedback. Years ago, I had a major beef with Bob Lee and the IBF when I bashed Eugenia Williams scoring in the Holyfield-Lewis I fight and recieved quite an angry response where Mr. Lee defended her right down the line. However, we know of the controversy and scandel of Bob Lee's past. Their past president Hiwatha Knight is good, and Joe Dwyer out of New York who is an IBF rep is good as well. Daryl People's the current president I heard is good and reasonable.

If all of these organizations were total shit, than I don't think respected boxing people would go to the conventions as much as they do. Also to be taken into account, has to be that no one has been able to impliment a system for boxing for the past 50 years, that completely eliminates the alphabet federations from the system. If you go with the Teddy Atlas concept of a single national commission some questions need to be addressed:

1.) Under Teddy's Atlas' national commission proposal-who would run such a system? Who would oversee a system of checks and balances to oversee fairness and justice in the system, to prevent another boxing monopoly from taking place? Teddy never talks in detail about such a proposal as to who would run the commission.

2.) I agree that there are far too many belts. WBA Super Champion, an idea proposed by Lennox Lewis to prevent multiple title holders from having to do too many defenses too close together. There should be no Super Champion period. Just call the match a 12-round World Title Elimination Match.

3.) The WBC Diamond Belt-Has no sanctioning fees associated with it and is commemorative only. But it doesn't need to be. This belt goes to the winner of two special fighters who achieved strong boxing status through the years and fight outside their weight class in a bog match. But much like the WBA Superchampion there should not be any belt for title eliminationss.

Eliminate Champion in Recess or as the WBC calls it, champion in recess belts. IF THERE IS NO WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP ON THE LINE, THERE IS NO BELT GIVEN TO THE WINNER OF THE FIGHT. PERIOD.

4.) What all powers that be in boxing SHOULD be promoting is the elimination of TV and promotional monopolies with ANY FIGHTER! This is the type of bullshit that is just as bad as the sanctioning bodies when they do something bad.

BOXING NEEDS TO GO BACK TO THE DAYS OF WHEN THE NETWORK JUST SHOWED THE FIGHTS LIKE IN THE 50'S-70'S. THERE ARE NO TIE-INS TO ANY PROMOTER OR MATCHMAKER. YOU FIGHT FOR THE BEST DEAL THAT SHOWTIME OR HBO CAN GIVE YOU ON A FIGHT TO FIGHT BASIS, OR EVEN FREE OR STANDARD CABLE TV.

5.) Boxing should have a free open market where neither HBO or Showtime are contractually obligated to any fighter or promoter. You would see better fights that way and less politics in getting the best matches made. You go with the best deals for the best fights, no long-term promoter contract monopolist tie-ins. Showtime sort of understands this. HBO doesn't get it. Lamply wouldn't know who to pom-pom if this system went into effect.

6.) Round Robin Elimination tournaments with proposal #5 in effect. Lets see how the best champions of the world federations match up to each other to produce a single unified champion. Get the Association of Boxing Commissions support of this tournament. When the undisputed champion retires or is beaten, the Round Robin elimination tournament begins again. Currently, there are too many fighters who can win a world alphabet belt, without any incentive to unify.

Jack
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
daprofessor
post Jan 11 2013, 03:11 PM
Post #2


Cruiserweight


Group: Members
Posts: 5,773
Joined: 20-May 11
From: killa kali
Member No.: 12,336



there needs to be some over sight on the judges. too many times boxing has controversial decisions that rarely get attention and the same shit judges get re-shuffled into the deck only to resurface later to deliver on their same bullshit. they need to be held accountable...or at least graded...and make it a point to only use the highly rated judges for the big fights. the same needs to be done with the shit referees out there too.

i'm all for a single champion in each division. no more of this bullshit interim this or that or champion emeritus...keep the sanctioning bodies...but do NOT call someone a unified champion or undisputed if he doesn't hold the four major belts. every belt holder should be held to a minimum of 3 defenses per year. 1 freebee, 1 mandatory and 1 to unify. if a guy has to piece of the puzzle then he can be held to a minimum of 2 defenses. 1 to unify and 1 freebee. if he has 3 belts...he can have a minimum of 1 defense and that would be for unification with whomever holds the 4th belt. they can all do as many optional defenses as they want.

no more bullshit where promoters are holding up a division trying to protect their guy sitting on a title or a number one spot. either piss or get off the pot.

commentators/journalists. these guys do more damage to the sport trying to chase a story than anything. i won't act like corruption doesn't exist or it isn't a problem...but too many times these guys blow shit out of proportion and cast the sport in a negative light.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
daprofessor
post Jan 11 2013, 03:12 PM
Post #3


Cruiserweight


Group: Members
Posts: 5,773
Joined: 20-May 11
From: killa kali
Member No.: 12,336



on a side note....aiba is seeking to be the world's governing body in professional boxing. they control amateur/olympic boxing.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Jovi
post Jan 11 2013, 03:43 PM
Post #4


Bantamweight


Group: Members
Posts: 354
Joined: 8-February 12
Member No.: 13,532



Boxing should be on more than once a week, sometimes more than once a day. Have the scheduling like NBA.

It could be certain weight classes on certain days or something.

But i hate sometimes waiting weeks or months to watch a fight.

Fighters should be required to fight more than a certain amount of times a year.

Just make the sport organized.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Jack 1000
post Jan 11 2013, 04:09 PM
Post #5


The Consultant


Group: Root Admin
Posts: 9,454
Joined: 2-December 02
Member No.: 14



Ways to Clean Up Boxing

(I provided a condensed version of my OP for easier reference:)

1.) A centralized non government entity similar to the Association of Boxing Commissions to
oversee boxing ratings and world champions expanded throughout the United States with options
for greater word expansion to other boxing jurisdictions around the world.

2.) The power of this agency to only acknowledge world championship belts between the active
champion and the designated challenger. Under this system all “Silver”, “Diamond”, “Super”
champion belts are eliminated, or would not be recognized by this centralized non-government
agency.

3.) Most World Title belts and bouts would be fought at 12 rounds.(exception proposal #4)

4.) Unified World Championship Fights with a minimum of three of the four alphabet belts on
the line would be fought at 15 rounds. At least three of the four belts recognized as world title
fights by the WBA, WBC, IBF, and or WBO would have to be represented for the 15 round
superfight to take place. To insure safety and quality of officiating at this level, only the most
experience refs and judges would work the 15 round superfight.

5.) A Centralized non-government authority to eliminate promotional monopolies AND TV
Network Monopolies in boxing. Fighters should work with matchmakers on a fight by fight
basis. NO LONG TERM CONTRACTUAL OBLIGATIONS!

6.) Round Robin elimination tournaments between the top contenders and champions of the four
major sanctioning bodies to see who is the best of the championship federations. Commissions
under a centralized boxing authority would make the fights happen in a free-market relationship
between the fighters, networks, matchmakers, and promoters. This system should prevail,
whether the alphabet federations would choose to participate would be optional.

7.) Go back to the days of the 1950's-1970's when the networks just showed the fights, without
the political or promotional monopolies of having a fighter tied to a specific network.

8.) The elimination of any type of Open Scoring System. As shown, its success rate has been
mediocre to dismal at best. Most importantly, Open Scoring does not solve the issues associated
with bad judging. It simply produces loss of suspense, security concerns, judges potentially
being forced into “group think” if their colleges scores do not reflect what they see. Too many
track meets with Open Scoring when a fighter knows he’s ahead. Too many opt outs for a losing
fighter to quit if he knows’ he is behind.

9.) All judges should be subjected to a review hearing if the Centralized Committee deems it
necessary for them to explain any decisions that are in extreme opposing views to what the public
saw. Assents and income of all judges should be subject to review before and after fights.
Officials may be called to explain and review their scores in an extremely controversial decision.

Officials have the right to a fair hearing and to submit evidence to support their positions. The
executive committee will fine, suspend, or revoke ANY official for a time period set by them if
evidence of corruption or blatant favoritism is found.

10. The centralized boxing authority should propose to work with more commercial TV networks
to make boxing appealing and exciting again for current and future generations of viewers.
Current generations of boxing writers, fans, and organizers, need to work together to make the
fight game fun and enjoyable again.


Jack
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
daprofessor
post Jan 11 2013, 05:07 PM
Post #6


Cruiserweight


Group: Members
Posts: 5,773
Joined: 20-May 11
From: killa kali
Member No.: 12,336



QUOTE (Jack 1000 @ Jan 11 2013, 04:09 PM) *
Ways to Clean Up Boxing

(I provided a condensed version of my OP for easier reference:)

1.) A centralized non government entity similar to the Association of Boxing Commissions to
oversee boxing ratings and world champions expanded throughout the United States with options
for greater word expansion to other boxing jurisdictions around the world.

2.) The power of this agency to only acknowledge world championship belts between the active
champion and the designated challenger. Under this system all “Silver”, “Diamond”, “Super”
champion belts are eliminated, or would not be recognized by this centralized non-government
agency.

3.) Most World Title belts and bouts would be fought at 12 rounds.(exception proposal #4)

4.) Unified World Championship Fights with a minimum of three of the four alphabet belts on
the line would be fought at 15 rounds. At least three of the four belts recognized as world title
fights by the WBA, WBC, IBF, and or WBO would have to be represented for the 15 round
superfight to take place. To insure safety and quality of officiating at this level, only the most
experience refs and judges would work the 15 round superfight.

5.) A Centralized non-government authority to eliminate promotional monopolies AND TV
Network Monopolies in boxing. Fighters should work with matchmakers on a fight by fight
basis. NO LONG TERM CONTRACTUAL OBLIGATIONS!

6.) Round Robin elimination tournaments between the top contenders and champions of the four
major sanctioning bodies to see who is the best of the championship federations. Commissions
under a centralized boxing authority would make the fights happen in a free-market relationship
between the fighters, networks, matchmakers, and promoters. This system should prevail,
whether the alphabet federations would choose to participate would be optional.

7.) Go back to the days of the 1950's-1970's when the networks just showed the fights, without
the political or promotional monopolies of having a fighter tied to a specific network.

8.) The elimination of any type of Open Scoring System. As shown, its success rate has been
mediocre to dismal at best. Most importantly, Open Scoring does not solve the issues associated
with bad judging. It simply produces loss of suspense, security concerns, judges potentially
being forced into “group think” if their colleges scores do not reflect what they see. Too many
track meets with Open Scoring when a fighter knows he’s ahead. Too many opt outs for a losing
fighter to quit if he knows’ he is behind.

9.) All judges should be subjected to a review hearing if the Centralized Committee deems it
necessary for them to explain any decisions that are in extreme opposing views to what the public
saw. Assents and income of all judges should be subject to review before and after fights.
Officials may be called to explain and review their scores in an extremely controversial decision.

Officials have the right to a fair hearing and to submit evidence to support their positions. The
executive committee will fine, suspend, or revoke ANY official for a time period set by them if
evidence of corruption or blatant favoritism is found.

10. The centralized boxing authority should propose to work with more commercial TV networks
to make boxing appealing and exciting again for current and future generations of viewers.
Current generations of boxing writers, fans, and organizers, need to work together to make the
fight game fun and enjoyable again.


Jack


great list!!!
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
mgrover
post Jan 11 2013, 06:47 PM
Post #7


Super Middleweight


Group: Moderators
Posts: 3,049
Joined: 23-May 11
Member No.: 12,366



shooting bob arum is a start
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
daprofessor
post Jan 11 2013, 07:45 PM
Post #8


Cruiserweight


Group: Members
Posts: 5,773
Joined: 20-May 11
From: killa kali
Member No.: 12,336



this oughta do the trick. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

(IMG:http://www.imperialsoap.com/images/products/1-Ajax.jpg)

This post has been edited by daprofessor: Jan 11 2013, 07:46 PM
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Dolimite
post Jan 11 2013, 10:03 PM
Post #9


Middleweight


Group: Members
Posts: 2,633
Joined: 16-December 12
From: Fresh Coast
Member No.: 13,803



UNION. Boxing needs a serious union. The union should be made up of former fighters and refs. Every professional sport has a union and boxing is in badly need of one.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Southeastpaw
post Jan 13 2013, 10:30 PM
Post #10


The Analyst


Group: Members
Posts: 5,949
Joined: 12-November 02
From: Fayettenam, NC
Member No.: 166



As I have stated before, I really like your list Jack. Though, I feel one of the main problems, if not, the main problem are the multiple governing bodies.

Hear me out... The Fertittas are huge boxing fans, and Lorenzo was actually part of the Nevada State Athletic Commission. He wanted to get more involved with boxing. But the more he delved into the workings of the sport, the more he realized (in his words) that the issues that plagued the sport were irreversible. So they ended up buying the UFC on a request from Dana White.

Even though most will not recognize this, it is because of boxing that the UFC is as successful as it is. Dana and the Fertittas recognized what had put boxing in it's current state and knew what to do and what to avoid. Strikeforce was coming up. They bought them out, let the contract run out with Showtime, and now it is gone. The only other legitimate competition the UFC has (if you even want to call it that) is Belator.

The UFC has a great business model and contrary to popular belief, they pay their fighters well...including incentives. The top guys get paid more than what is recorded for all to see. And the up and comers on the undercards get paid much more than the newbies on ESPN for example. With the lack of competitive organizations, they pretty much monopolize the industry and get every and all the fighters they want, for the most part. And the fights that need to happen happen.

I am not saying this to bash boxing. And I don't believe...well, I would like to believe that the issues in boxing that damage the sport are reversible. Boxing is my first love and I really appreciate when people put out ideas to help improve the sport, like you have Jack. But as long as we have multiple organizations, the issues will continue.

Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

4 Pages V   1 2 3 > » 
Reply to this topicStart new topic
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

 



Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 20th April 2014 - 09:50 AM