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streetlion1
Paul Williams. When I think about who could beat this guy I would give 3 people the shot maybe 4 (depending if DLH moves down like he says) thats Mosley, Cotto, and PBF. I have to see him against tougher competition than Margarito before I judge on how far he'll go. He hasnt had anyone test his chin yet....and he hasnt been in there with a guy who can move and counter who has good boxing skills. Now Margarito is no bum but he has definite draw-backs as in swinging wide and having little speed. PW I think would have big trouble against either one of those guys. I think PBF would make him look bad and that would test just what kind of boxing skills he has cause I dont think he would be able to throw throw throw like he would against everyone else. Mosley would be the one I would give him the best chance against yet still I havent seen PW have to box- box anyone. Cotto would definitly test his chin and chop his body up as he came in tryin to swing those pit-pat little shots. I think PW has a huge future, if he gets with the right trainer and starts boxing a bit more instead of throwing constantly. The question I have is about his chin. Is he gonna be able to stand up to the power of a Cotto. Looking at him I would have to say yes since he looks like a middleweight who skipped one too many meals. Only time will tell....lets see what happens when or if he fights the divisions elite! thumbsup_anim.gif
Blayde
If Floyd decides to be too inactive to win a round, sure, Williams workrate will go down drastically but he will still have to offer more than Floyd. No doubt Floyd does have more skills, but doesnt change the fact that he would have to close the distance to land. And that would leave two options for him. Get out again very quickly what I dont think he could do against Williams LONG and also quick arms. Or try to tie Williams up every single time.

In addition to that, Williams who likes to let his hands go would always be there to throw everything hes got when Floyd wants to come in. So I just dont see how Floyd as great as he is defensively can avoid Williams punches if he also wants to land some of his own. So although Floyd is my P4P number 1, I just cant see him beating Williams.

Speaking of Cotto I would definitely pick Williams over him because I think it will be too difficult for Cotto to get his inside work going often enough to score points and/or break him down. Hes more skilled than Margarito but I that doesnt mean hes a bigger threat to Williams. I cant believe how you can say you have to see someone against tougher competition than Margarito. Margarito is one of the best at 147 IMO and it is always interesting too see how his opponents handle his size and workrate.

Its a different story with Mosley though. I would be very interested in a fight between him and Williams.
Douchebag
QUOTE(Blayde @ Jan 9 2008, 01:33 PM) [snapback]374091[/snapback]
If Floyd decides to be too inactive to win a round, sure, Williams workrate will go down drastically but he will still have to offer more than Floyd. No doubt Floyd does have more skills, but doesnt change the fact that he would have to close the distance to land. And that would leave two options for him. Get out again very quickly what I dont think he could do against Williams LONG and also quick arms. Or try to tie Williams up every single time.

In addition to that, Williams who likes to let his hands go would always be there to throw everything hes got when Floyd wants to come in. So I just dont see how Floyd as great as he is defensively can avoid Williams punches if he also wants to land some of his own. So although Floyd is my P4P number 1, I just cant see him beating Williams.

Speaking of Cotto I would definitely pick Williams over him because I think it will be too difficult for Cotto to get his inside work going often enough to score points and/or break him down. Hes more skilled than Margarito but I that doesnt mean hes a bigger threat to Williams. I cant believe how you can say you have to see someone against tougher competition than Margarito. Margarito is one of the best at 147 IMO and it is always interesting too see how his opponents handle his size and workrate.

Its a different story with Mosley though. I would be very interested in a fight between him and Williams.


Agree with everything except Margarito being the best Welter. LOL
BrutalBodyShots
Isn't Williams fighting Quintana next? Cotto leftovers anyone?

BigG
I think P-Will will give everyone trouble. As much as I like Cotto, Williams beats him by decision. The height advntage would be ridiculous. But Williams would have problems with someone as quick and tricky as Floyd.
D-MARV
A quick, slick fighter will always give Paul some trouble! I think Floyd would outpoint Williams! Williams does not always use his reach! He smothers his own shots sometimes. Floyd is a great counter puncher and paul leaves himself open alot. Tony was able to counter Paul so imagine what Floyd can do! Mosley can be a real threat! But i just keep thinking about the Forrest fights! Even though Vernon and Paul have 2 different styles, The fact that Vernon was naturally bigger and longer gave Shane some problems, so I see Paul winning the Decision! I think Paul will decision Cotto as well. As long as Paul lets his hands fly then cotto will be eating punches all night long. Cotto will have his moments though! That leaves me with one guy that may possibly give Paul some trouble! Call Me crazy! BUT! I think Zab Judah would give Paul Hell! Just think about it. Early, Paul will have his same ole' game plan, letting his hands go, then for 1 second he's open then BANG beautiful counter Left Uppercut that may not KO Williams but stuns him enough to be more cautious and the fight can become competative! but then again! I'm a Judah fan!
BoxingStill#1
I just don't like this guy Paul Williams,....its like his high school basketball coach kicked him off the team and he stopped by the local gym while walking home from practice.

He is a threat to EVERYONE in the division. Not because he is tremendously skilled boxer, not because he has a chin of steel,...but because he's has advantages that are hard to overcome. Height, Reach, and decent speed.

The best match for him both physically and economically would be Mosely, or Judah,....both fighters have the recources needed to beat the tall man. And more importantly both really nothing to lose at this junction. It would be a good exit fight for them.....Any takers?...
Fitz
QUOTE(BoxingStill#1 @ Jan 10 2008, 12:23 PM) [snapback]374184[/snapback]
He is a threat to EVERYONE in the division. Not because he is tremendously skilled boxer, not because he has a chin of steel,...but because he's has advantages that are hard to overcome. Height, Reach, and decent speed.


Agreed 100%. That's what I was saying a while ago, he is most difficult because of his physical advantaged and you forgot to mention him being a lefty as well. I haven't seen him a great deal, but what I have seen, he is a little sloppy and doesn't look technically sound, but he is difficult. That said, I still like Williams, I just think he is dangerous more due to physical advantages rather than "awesome" boxing skills he has.
xxxxxx
QUOTE(BrutalBodyShots @ Jan 9 2008, 07:53 PM) [snapback]374163[/snapback]
Isn't Williams fighting Quintana next? Cotto leftovers anyone?



It ain't Pauls fault.He wanted the unification fight with Cintron, but Cintron backed out.Williams needs to stay busy and this is a good stay busy fight for him.
kidbazooka1
Williams could give any top 147lb trouble because of his height but I think Cotto has the formula to break down a fighter like Williams.

The Original MrFactor
QUOTE(BrutalBodyShots @ Jan 9 2008, 06:53 PM) [snapback]374163[/snapback]
Isn't Williams fighting Quintana next? Cotto leftovers anyone?



From all I've read, this is the only guy who'd fight Williams. Cotto wanted no part of him after Williams/Margarito. Floyd wants no part of ANY prime WW. Cintron fakes a hand injury in order to no t fight him.

I think the ONLY guy that gives Williams trouble is Margarito. Size matters. Tony is the closest guy to hgis size. Williams beat him, but Tony came on strong late. Too little to late. If he was to start banging away at Williams body earlier, he may be able to sneak away at a decision. Otherwise, same fight as last time. Williams is an awesome specimen and a pretty good fighter on top of that.
Fitz
Why would Cotto want to fight Williams at this point? He has bigger fish to fry at the moment. It only makes sense to go for DLH, Mosley or a Mayweather type of fight before Williams.
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE(Fitz @ Jan 10 2008, 02:56 AM) [snapback]374224[/snapback]
Why would Cotto want to fight Williams at this point? He has bigger fish to fry at the moment. It only makes sense to go for DLH, Mosley or a Mayweather type of fight before Williams.



Not sure if that was on the table right after Williams/Margarito. Margarito/Cotto would have been next IF Tony was to win against Williams. Funny that since Williams won, no Cotto/Williams came to fruition... BTW, how much did Cotto bring home for the Mosley fight? Anybody know off the top of your head?
Fitz
QUOTE(The Original MrFactor @ Jan 10 2008, 07:26 PM) [snapback]374225[/snapback]
Not sure if that was on the table right after Williams/Margarito. Margarito/Cotto would have been next IF Tony was to win against Williams. Funny that since Williams won, no Cotto/Williams came to fruition... BTW, how much did Cotto bring home for the Mosley fight? Anybody know off the top of your head?


Yeah, I remember hearing about a potential Cotto/Margarito fight. I think that would have been a tough fight for Cotto (even though I don't think much of Margarito), but a lot more marketable that a Williams fight, at least you have a Mexican vs PR angle with that fight.
But yeah, I would love to see some fights between the top welters, but I have no problem with Cotto not looking in Williams direction just yet. They are both young and still have many years, while Cotto has fighters like DLH, Mosley and Mayweather who probably won't be there as long as Williams and must try and strike a fight with them now. More money, better name on a resume and an easier fight for the reward given. Can't say I blame Cotto. Though I think we will see more important fights (eg-Cotto-Williams) once the big boys decide to call it a day and move on.
Method
Margarito could beat him if he got another crack. Im not saying he would, but he definitely could. Their first contest was close and competitive.
Southeastpaw
I'm pretty confident that Williams would beat everyone in the division. Like said in a post before, it's not because he is tremendously talented, cause he is not, but what talent he does have together with his physical advantages and chin, I can't see anyone beating him at this weight.

And one thing I really don't understand is how people are saying that Mosley, of all people @ WW, would be one of the most likel;y candidates of beating Paul. Mosley has shown trouble against long, lanky guys. Paul is ALL wrong for Mosley.
Sugar Q
QUOTE(Fitz @ Jan 10 2008, 02:56 AM) [snapback]374224[/snapback]
Why would Cotto want to fight Williams at this point? He has bigger fish to fry at the moment. It only makes sense to go for DLH, Mosley or a Mayweather type of fight before Williams.



Let's deal with facts here:
1) The Cotto camp is not trying to give Shane a rematch, which Shane should be campaigning for.
2) You don't hear them calling out Mayweather (their campaigning for a DLH fight cause their sleeping on DLH)
3) If your not fighting PBF, Shane or DLH why not fight Williams. Not too long ago almost everybody in here was calling Margarito the man to beat then after Clottey put it on him people got quiet then Williams officially beat him which should've made him the man to beat according to you guys but all of a sudden Cotto beats Zab (fouls and all) who hasn't won a good one in a while and then Shane (in a squeaker) but neither one are higher ranked than Williams so how is it that Cotto shouldn't have to go through Williams to be the #1 contender? You know you guys don't allow tune-ups in here. Cotto needs to be a machine like yall expect PBF to be and he can't hold PBF's jockstrap in the accomplishment category so you know he doesn't get a bye.
Nobudius
QUOTE(Method @ Jan 10 2008, 06:35 AM) [snapback]374231[/snapback]
Margarito could beat him if he got another crack. Im not saying he would, but he definitely could. Their first contest was close and competitive.


....... I agree. If they meet again, I wouldn't necessarily bet the farm on PW winning.

Unfortunately, PW & AM are two guys where the risk outweighs the $$ at this point.

BoxingStill#1
QUOTE(Sugar Q @ Jan 10 2008, 11:36 AM) [snapback]374252[/snapback]
Let's deal with facts here:
1) The Cotto camp is not trying to give Shane a rematch, which Shane should be campaigning for.
2) You don't hear them calling out Mayweather (their campaigning for a DLH fight cause their sleeping on DLH)
3) If your not fighting PBF, Shane or DLH why not fight Williams. Not too long ago almost everybody in here was calling Margarito the man to beat then after Clottey put it on him people got quiet then Williams officially beat him which should've made him the man to beat according to you guys but all of a sudden Cotto beats Zab (fouls and all) who hasn't won a good one in a while and then Shane (in a squeaker) but neither one are higher ranked than Williams so how is it that Cotto shouldn't have to go through Williams to be the #1 contender? You know you guys don't allow tune-ups in here. Cotto needs to be a machine like yall expect PBF to be and he can't hold PBF's jockstrap in the accomplishment category so you know he doesn't get a bye.





So now we are talking about what is the economically sound fight for Cotto?,....No he does not have the resume for PBF,...Yes, he may need a tune up fight for him.....Lets look at this from a different angle: Do you think DLH would take a fight with Williams over Cotto at this point?...Ecspecially with some one who would have a decent chance of beating him? Where is the money at?....What do the people want?....Golden boy will not turn this down... To me, PW is an average fighter with above average physical attributes (for a boxer)......
Nobudius
Above average physical attributes? Look at him! He is built like a freak! There are very few people built like him on the entire planet.

Method
Margarito could beat him if he got another crack. Im not saying he would, but he definitely could. Their first contest was close and competitive.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE(Fitz @ Jan 10 2008, 02:08 AM) [snapback]374196[/snapback]
Agreed 100%. That's what I was saying a while ago, he is most difficult because of his physical advantaged and you forgot to mention him being a lefty as well. I haven't seen him a great deal, but what I have seen, he is a little sloppy and doesn't look technically sound, but he is difficult. That said, I still like Williams, I just think he is dangerous more due to physical advantages rather than "awesome" boxing skills he has.


Agreed 100%. I am not high on Williams because he is as sloppy as a HO's snatch during a brothel crawl at 4.00am.
D-MARV
As long as Paul williams is in top shape, he will always beat Tony!!!!!!
Mean Mister Mustard
The welterweight division is jam packed. We have the best 2 guys in the division in Mayweather and Cotto, there's Mosley, the old veteran who still has his skills, the hyped young fighter with his big win over Margarito, the durable hard hitting vet I just mentioned and good contenders like Cintron, Collazo, Quintana and Clottey. This is a great time for the welters.
streetlion1
QUOTE(Blayde @ Jan 9 2008, 12:33 PM) [snapback]374091[/snapback]
If Floyd decides to be too inactive to win a round, sure, Williams workrate will go down drastically but he will still have to offer more than Floyd. No doubt Floyd does have more skills, but doesnt change the fact that he would have to close the distance to land. And that would leave two options for him. Get out again very quickly what I dont think he could do against Williams LONG and also quick arms. Or try to tie Williams up every single time.

In addition to that, Williams who likes to let his hands go would always be there to throw everything hes got when Floyd wants to come in. So I just dont see how Floyd as great as he is defensively can avoid Williams punches if he also wants to land some of his own. So although Floyd is my P4P number 1, I just cant see him beating Williams.

Speaking of Cotto I would definitely pick Williams over him because I think it will be too difficult for Cotto to get his inside work going often enough to score points and/or break him down. Hes more skilled than Margarito but I that doesnt mean hes a bigger threat to Williams. I cant believe how you can say you have to see someone against tougher competition than Margarito. Margarito is one of the best at 147 IMO and it is always interesting too see how his opponents handle his size and workrate.

Its a different story with Mosley though. I would be very interested in a fight between him and Williams.

Williams workrate is his best weapon....however he lacks in boxing skills and defense. He uses his offense as a defense...what is gonna happen when what he trys to swing at isnt there and he is the one getting countered as he comes in? As would be the case with PBF. All in all I dont think PBF has the heart enough to step up and fight him anyway. Cotto I feel would have a much better shot than you give him credit for. His speed is under-rated as are his skills as a complete boxer. PW coming in swinging leaving himself open would definitely have a price to pay against the best body-puncher in the sport. Im not knocking PW in any way...he just has to answer questions jn the ring yet, since he is so young. Can he adapt when his throw-throw offense doesnt work? Or can he take the precision power shots he is gonna have to take against the divisions elite?....Also his power isnt anything to be afraid of either. Yes Margarito is good but not in the top 5 of the division IMO. thumbsup_anim.gif
Fitz
QUOTE(STEVENSKI @ Jan 11 2008, 02:51 PM) [snapback]374309[/snapback]
Agreed 100%. I am not high on Williams because he is as sloppy as a HO's snatch during a brothel crawl at 4.00am.


Yep. Well I still have to watch Williams-Margarito. I have it on DVD, just haven't got around to watching it yet. I will see what I think of his on that fight.
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE(Fitz @ Jan 10 2008, 11:22 PM) [snapback]374314[/snapback]
Yep. Well I still have to watch Williams-Margarito. I have it on DVD, just haven't got around to watching it yet. I will see what I think of his on that fight.



Great fight... Both guys got and gave. Those 1st few rounds looked like blowouts at first glance because Williams kept pumping that jab nonstop. He probably got credit for hits that shouldnt have been hits. Margarito picked off many jabs with his gloves. Thats why I think Tony may have thought he won the fight in the end. He seemed to forget that while Williams pumped a nonstop jab, Margarito was doing very little, which probably also influenced the decision. Tony opened things up in the 6th round if I remember. I think i had it 7 to 5 for Williams... let me know what you think.

The thing that really impressed me about Williams was the speed that he was spitting that jab out with. That coupled with his sheer size makes him unbeatable at 147.
Fitz
QUOTE(The Original MrFactor @ Jan 11 2008, 04:47 PM) [snapback]374321[/snapback]
Great fight... Both guys got and gave. Those 1st few rounds looked like blowouts at first glance because Williams kept pumping that jab nonstop. He probably got credit for hits that shouldnt have been hits. Margarito picked off many jabs with his gloves. Thats why I think Tony may have thought he won the fight in the end. He seemed to forget that while Williams pumped a nonstop jab, Margarito was doing very little, which probably also influenced the decision. Tony opened things up in the 6th round if I remember. I think i had it 7 to 5 for Williams... let me know what you think.

The thing that really impressed me about Williams was the speed that he was spitting that jab out with. That coupled with his sheer size makes him unbeatable at 147.


Yep, I will try watch it over the weekend or something. I will probably end up in this thread or bumping an old thread on my thoughts on the fight, lol.
Sugar Q
QUOTE(BoxingStill#1 @ Jan 10 2008, 05:15 PM) [snapback]374280[/snapback]
So now we are talking about what is the economically sound fight for Cotto?,....No he does not have the resume for PBF,...Yes, he may need a tune up fight for him.....Lets look at this from a different angle: Do you think DLH would take a fight with Williams over Cotto at this point?...Ecspecially with some one who would have a decent chance of beating him? Where is the money at?....What do the people want?....Golden boy will not turn this down... To me, PW is an average fighter with above average physical attributes (for a boxer)......


I think that Oscar would fight any fighter @147 and I think he can beat anyone except PBF. I think Oscar would KO the Williams that fought Margarito! If Margarito could connect I know Oscar can and Oscar's a harder puncher (Margarito's punching is very over rated). One thing you never wanna over look is a fighters pride and Oscar has lots of it. OSCAR WILL BE IN GREAT SHAPE FOR HIS NEXT FIGHT! If he fights Cotto (with all the past Bob Arum bs) he's gonna be ready for him and Im picking Oscar to beat Cotto as much as I like Cotto.
buford54
I think that PW can own the division. He is sloppy, but the man made AM's workrate drop in 1/2. Tony is the one who normally throws 1000 punches in a fight. But he couldn't do it while PW was in his face all day long.
I don't care who the fighter is, not many people can effectively throw hard and accurate shots when there is a glove in/on their face ALL night long.
I do think that Cotto has the best shot to beat PW, because he keeps his head when under fire, is a wicked body puncher and has a lot of pop in general. I would probably pick Williams to win it, but Cotto, because of his power would have a great shot.

I don't think Floyd would beat PW. PW has too much reach and is too tall, and I don't think that Floyd would be able to work in close enough to land anything.
BoxingStill#1
QUOTE(buford54 @ Jan 11 2008, 03:52 PM) [snapback]374379[/snapback]
I think that PW can own the division. He is sloppy, but the man made AM's workrate drop in 1/2. Tony is the one who normally throws 1000 punches in a fight. But he couldn't do it while PW was in his face all day long.
I don't care who the fighter is, not many people can effectively throw hard and accurate shots when there is a glove in/on their face ALL night long.
I do think that Cotto has the best shot to beat PW, because he keeps his head when under fire, is a wicked body puncher and has a lot of pop in general. I would probably pick Williams to win it, but Cotto, because of his power would have a great shot.

I don't think Floyd would beat PW. PW has too much reach and is too tall, and I don't think that Floyd would be able to work in close enough to land anything.



They all said the same thing about the late Corallas.......now were just talking on a bigger scale....
BigG
I'd like to see Williams fight Vernon Forrest. Forrest is around 6'1 or 6'2 I believe. Williams wouldn't have a big height advantage.
Southeastpaw
Forrest is 6'0 with a 73" reach, Paul is 6'1 with an 82" reach. I thought that Paul was taller, but this is what boxrec has.

Quartey was bothering Forrest with his activity and jab. I think that Paul could stop Forrest if they ever met up.
Blayde
QUOTE(BoxingStill#1 @ Jan 12 2008, 03:46 AM) [snapback]374414[/snapback]
They all said the same thing about the late Corallas.......now were just talking on a bigger scale....


Thats a MUCH bigger scale. Come on... And Corrales was a inside slugger with a weak chin, Williams does have a jab, he can fight inside and outside and he has a solid or good chin. Not only is he way bigger than Corrales, he also p4p better than Chico ever was IMO.
Douchebag
QUOTE(Blayde @ Jan 12 2008, 05:15 AM) [snapback]374467[/snapback]
Thats a MUCH bigger scale. Come on... And Corrales was a inside slugger with a weak chin, Williams does have a jab, he can fight inside and outside and he has a solid or good chin. Not only is he way bigger than Corrales, he also p4p better than Chico ever was IMO.


You can't make that statement without him facing the level of Op that Chico faced. Paul Williams has fought nobody except Margarito, hardly enough to make case for him as P4P over Chico.
BoxingStill#1
QUOTE(Blayde @ Jan 12 2008, 05:15 AM) [snapback]374467[/snapback]
Thats a MUCH bigger scale. Come on... And Corrales was a inside slugger with a weak chin, Williams does have a jab, he can fight inside and outside and he has a solid or good chin. Not only is he way bigger than Corrales, he also p4p better than Chico ever was IMO.





Who has Williams had a fight with that really checked his chin?.......My only point was you are saying the same things that everyone said about Chico in comparison to PBF...... And really,...Williams pulls no respect from me just yet because I consider Tony a C+, B- fighter......
buford54
QUOTE(BoxingStill#1 @ Jan 12 2008, 03:30 PM) [snapback]374514[/snapback]
Who has Williams had a fight with that really checked his chin?.......My only point was you are saying the same things that everyone said about Chico in comparison to PBF...... And really,...Williams pulls no respect from me just yet because I consider Tony a C+, B- fighter......


At this time it's all really speculation. I don't know if there is somewhere to look this up, but I don't remember hearing about Diego ever throwing 1000 punches in a fight. Also, Diego mostly fought on the inside, so he rarely used his height to his advantage.
As far as Williams' chin, he did stand up to AM's best shots, some of which landed...and Tony has power no matter what class fighter he is.
At this point, it seems that Williams has the goods, but you are right, it is time for him to step it up to really test himself. If he can hang with the other champs, then he has what it takes.

I think his big strength is his output of straight punches. When you can keep someone on the end of that many punches, and your reach is 10 inches longer than anyone else, how do they get inside? And if you can take their punch on the inside, tangle them up with your freakishly long arms and then get them back outside...I think you've got some legit tools.
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE(Fitz @ Jan 16 2008, 02:05 AM) [snapback]374906[/snapback]
I'm a little surprised there wasn't more talk as Williams-Margarito being a candidate for fight of the year. I thought it was on par with Cotto-Mosley (another one of my favourites).



Great analysis!

I thought the fight of the year talk was brought up after the fight some, but has since died down. I thought it was right up there. It was also a VERY significant fight in the division. It also brings up the question of WHY Cotto isnt fighting this guy instead of Alphonso Gomez as its rumored.
STEVENSKI
I would be interested in a Cotto vs Williams fight. Can Williams keep Cotto at distance or can Cotto slip inside & go to work on those ribs & kidneys?

Quality fight that should be made.
BoxingStill#1

Cotto has alote more to offer than Tony does...But they do have simularities in attributes :...power,...
Cotto would make Tony fight a nasty forcefull fight, and would destroy him down the stretch...Tony is entirely too slow.....


But I agree ,..I would pay for it to...
Douchebag
Cotto should avoid Paul Williams like the plague untill after he fights PBF. After that fight win, lose, or draw PW should be next.
BoxingStill#1
agreed, Im hoping things pan out to where Cotto fights Oscar....
BoxingStill#1
Im sorry I don't know why i was thinking about Antonio Margarito!!...No bad move for Cotto,...across the boards..
BoxingStill#1
QUOTE(Fitz @ Jan 16 2008, 09:17 PM) [snapback]374986[/snapback]
I watched the fight against last night with my brother and it was even wider for Williams the second fight. I think the second time I gave Margarito only one round which was round 11. The night before I gave Margarito round 7, second viewing it was a Williams round.
The only close rounds were 7,8 and I think 10 and 11. Round 11 was the only clear Margarito round and I feel that a lot of the close rounds were given to Margarito because he was losing big. He basically lost 6-0 in the first 6 and though people might not admit it, I think a lot of times when you have a fight 6-0, it really doesn't take much to give the losing guy a couple of rounds. In some cases, people sub-consciously give a fighter a round if it's just been there best round for a fight. I was aware of this the 2nd time around, and only saw round 11 clear for Margarito. I'm pretty sure any other round I gave to Margarito was probably like. He did better that round, I will give him that one.
That said, I don't think Margarito took a beat down, as he was in the fight, but in terms of scoring I don't think it was close and Williams pretty much had an answer for everything.

Also Cotto does have more skill than Margarito, but what he doesn't have is his power and sheer strength, durability and workrate. I don't think Cotto is going to have an answer for Williams workrate and after his last fight (Cotto-Mosley), I'm not sure how Cotto would go down the stretch with Williams. He won't get away what he did against Mosley, against Williams. Not sure Cotto will take as many good shots as Margarito did either. After seeing Williams take some good shots from Margarito, I'm no longer wondering if he can take shots from Cotto. Not going to say for sure that Cotto can't hurt Williams, but after seeing Williams-Margarito, your first thought on a Cotto fight DEFINITELY won't be "can Williams handle Cotto's shots".
I agree with whoever said that Cotto should avoid Williams until he gets a bigger fight like DLH or Mayweather or something. That's what I was implying when I said he shouldn't touch Williams with a 10ft pole. That said, I think Williams is wrong for Cotto.

I also came up with another opinion on watching the fight a second time last night. I'm taking Williams over Mayweather. There I said, and it kind of feels good as well. For a while I thought I had to look above 160 to see someone beat Mayweather, but I really think Williams is the guy that can do it. Not implying he is actually better than Mayweather (that would be stupid), but I think he has the tools and physical advantages to beat him. Unfortunately, this fight isn't going to happen anytime soon, probably not ever either. But overall, it feels good to think Mayweather can be beaten without seeing him move above 160 or something.




Like I've stated before, Williams is just entirely to okward for any fighter. I aswell have watched that fight a few times, and have taken the time to look up some previous fights of his. He is a challenge for any fighter in, or closely out of his division. I don't want PBF, Cotto, or even DLH to step in the ring with this guy. My first reason would be because Im a fan and don't want to see any of them get a loss because of somebody who is just too physically advantaged. Not because of the skill level. I dont agree with what you said about how had an answer for everything Tony had. I think he was one dimensional the whole fight and stuck with his game plan. Eventually, and inevidably he had his way....
I think Williams is going to be one of those fighters who will not build a big fan bases due to the shear fact people know that he has alote of title holders number. (Which would include their favorite boxer) Im one of those people that dont like him because I know it would be to much of a miss match between him and our current champions. Which in turn he would proberbly pull the win. I dont think Cotto would win unfortunetly. I think it would take someone more seasoned like a....Mosely perhaps?.....He has nothing to lose at this point......How about DLH?...
All I know is this, Paul Williams is currently the recongnized # 2 PFP best fighter in that division. (Contender, not including the Champ PBF). I have a feeling one of our favorite fighters WILL HAVE NO CHOICE but to step in the ring with him because of this. Othwer than money it makes the most sense. Thank God for us as fans, Boxing is a business more than a sport.............
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE(Fitz @ Jan 16 2008, 09:17 PM) [snapback]374986[/snapback]
I watched the fight against last night with my brother and it was even wider for Williams the second fight. I think the second time I gave Margarito only one round which was round 11. The night before I gave Margarito round 7, second viewing it was a Williams round.
The only close rounds were 7,8 and I think 10 and 11. Round 11 was the only clear Margarito round and I feel that a lot of the close rounds were given to Margarito because he was losing big. He basically lost 6-0 in the first 6 and though people might not admit it, I think a lot of times when you have a fight 6-0, it really doesn't take much to give the losing guy a couple of rounds. In some cases, people sub-consciously give a fighter a round if it's just been there best round for a fight. I was aware of this the 2nd time around, and only saw round 11 clear for Margarito. I'm pretty sure any other round I gave to Margarito was probably like. He did better that round, I will give him that one.
That said, I don't think Margarito took a beat down, as he was in the fight, but in terms of scoring I don't think it was close and Williams pretty much had an answer for everything.

Also Cotto does have more skill than Margarito, but what he doesn't have is his power and sheer strength, durability and workrate. I don't think Cotto is going to have an answer for Williams workrate and after his last fight (Cotto-Mosley), I'm not sure how Cotto would go down the stretch with Williams. He won't get away what he did against Mosley, against Williams. Not sure Cotto will take as many good shots as Margarito did either. After seeing Williams take some good shots from Margarito, I'm no longer wondering if he can take shots from Cotto. Not going to say for sure that Cotto can't hurt Williams, but after seeing Williams-Margarito, your first thought on a Cotto fight DEFINITELY won't be "can Williams handle Cotto's shots".
I agree with whoever said that Cotto should avoid Williams until he gets a bigger fight like DLH or Mayweather or something. That's what I was implying when I said he shouldn't touch Williams with a 10ft pole. That said, I think Williams is wrong for Cotto.

I also came up with another opinion on watching the fight a second time last night. I'm taking Williams over Mayweather. There I said, and it kind of feels good as well. For a while I thought I had to look above 160 to see someone beat Mayweather, but I really think Williams is the guy that can do it. Not implying he is actually better than Mayweather (that would be stupid), but I think he has the tools and physical advantages to beat him. Unfortunately, this fight isn't going to happen anytime soon, probably not ever either. But overall, it feels good to think Mayweather can be beaten without seeing him move above 160 or something.



Finally!!! Somebody else with the courage to stand up and say that someone at WW can beat Mayweather... I cant really argue with your scoring for Williams/Margarito. It easily could have been 11-1 if one gave the close rounds to Williams. I gave the close rounds to Tony. I would need to watch it again as well. Unfortuinately I was too busy entertaining to record the fight. I'm pretty sure I had it 7-5 though. I think Williams would stop Cotto in 8 or 9 rounds. I think he also stops Money May in around the same timeframe. None of these guys are gonna want to fight Williamsbecause they know they'd lose and instantly lose PPV profits for their next swindle...
streetlion1
I ask.....who has PW beaten to deserve so much credit? The man is talented..yes...but he has to work far more on his defense if he wants a chance against Cotto.....he has to learn to box more instead of throwing constantly to beat PBF. I wouldnt even have him beating Mosley at this point. Beating Margarito isnt a HUGE accomplishment. Yeah he proved he can beat a guy who is much slower and has just as bad defense as he does.. laugh.gif I do like PW...I have him #4 in my welter top 10.....But at this point I would have him only giving the top guys a lil trouble...not winning.
streetlion1
QUOTE(Fitz @ Jan 17 2008, 02:32 AM) [snapback]375019[/snapback]
Well IMO, he had a better answer with just about everything. Margarito would do something pretty good, but I just feel that Williams came back with something better. I also disagree with Margarito having his way.

Lets look at this. Williams and Margarito are both fighters that can throw 1000+ punches. Look at the punch stats for the fight, Williams threw 1200 or so and Margarito output was basically cut in half, he threw like 500 and something. To me that says that Williams fought his usual and same fight that he does and got punches off like he usually does. Margarito struggled and had to pick his shots more and was basically cut in half. That certainly doesn't sound like a guy who had his way, not even close.

Margarito did some good things, and I really want to make a point of that, I don't want people to get the wrong idea because of my cards, I don't think it was a Calazghe-Lacey beatdown or anything, I just think Williams did what he wanted to do and seemed to have an answer for everything. Scorecard wise, I really don't think it was as close as others think, I actually think Calazghe and Kessler was closer (scorecard wise) if that makes any sense. As I believe you can have a blowout on cards but competitive in the ring and have a fight close on cards, but one sided in the ring. Not sure if anyone understands what I'm trying to say though.
Prior to the fight, I didn't really have an opinion on Williams-Mayweather fight as I hadn't seen enough of Williams, but knew he had physical tools to give headaches. He impressed me in the Margarito fight, he showed he could take a punch and he looked awfully relaxed and calm for a guy in his first and biggest fight on the big stage and he just had that relaxed vibe in him which was cool, but didn't come across as arrogant and someone taking the fight lightly.
I still believe Williams makes some mistakes, he is sloppy at times but he uses his physical advantages pretty well and I didn't think he was as quick as I originally thought. I don't think he is better than Mayweather, but I think he has the tools and physical advantages to beat him.
Also onto the scoring, yep the only clear Margarito round to me was round 11. At first I gave him round 7, second time I gave it to Williams. But I think rounds 7,8, 10 were close and 11 was easy Margarito. But I kind of feel that 7,8 and 10 would have been just given to Margarito because when someone is down 6-0 in a fight, it's pretty easy to give the losing guy a round when he has his best rounds, but I tried to be honest and still thought Margarito didn't do enough. I also won't really argue if someone gave him 4 rounds, but for me, I thought he only won 1 round clearly, the others were up in the air IMO.
You wouldn't take Williams over Mosley? Hmmmm. Also I'm not basing my pick on who Williams has beaten, I know he still needs some more names and maybe some experience, I just think he has the physical tools to give Mayweather some big problems (which obviously isn't a knock on Mayweather). To give credit where it's due, it shows just how good Mayweather is, for me to go find a 6'1 freak that fights at 147 to beat Mayweather, so it's no knock on Mayweather.
I look at some of the early rounds of Judah-Mayweather and see that Williams may have some success. I do draw the comparison of him being a lefty as well, he is pretty quick, can punch and pretty much won't stop. I haven't even got started on the ridiculous height and reach advantage. Also seeing Williams take the shots he did against Margarito also gives me some confidence in him with a fight against Mayweather. Unlike Judah, Williams will keep up the pace and intensity over 12 rounds and Mayweather is seriously going to find it hard to get shots off IMO and to even get inside.

I would see the fight against Mayweather going like this....PBF backing up and countering the shit out of PW...now there will be times when PBF finds himself on the ropes and that might pose a problem. However I dont see PBF as the one trying to get inside...I see PW coming forward swinging those little pit-pat shots of his and leaving himself open. I think PBF will never take this fight but I wonder why not....Because I dont think it would be close at all IMO. PBF U.D.....117-111
BrutalBodyShots
LOL @ Mosley over Williams.

Because Mosley has NEVER struggled at all with taller guys that can jab, right?

Big Slim Sweet
QUOTE(Fitz @ Jan 16 2008, 10:17 PM) [snapback]374986[/snapback]
I think Williams is wrong for Cotto.

I actually think Cotto is all wrong for Williams. I've been impressed as hell with Paul the past couple of years but I don't think he hits hard enough to discourage Cotto from coming inside for an entire 12 rounds, and once he gets in there Paul's going to be in serious trouble. Cotto is the modern day bodysnatcher and Williams has A LOT of body to be hit.
Big Slim Sweet
QUOTE(BrutalBodyShots @ Jan 17 2008, 11:16 AM) [snapback]375045[/snapback]
LOL @ Mosley over Williams.

Because Mosley has NEVER struggled at all with taller guys that can jab, right?

Yes agreed. Williams would be a terrible matchup for Mosley.
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