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The Original MrFactor
I've read on various other websites that 2 people are now coming forward saying that Shane knowingly took some type of illegal steroid supplelment before the 1st DLH fight. I'm wondering, if these allegations are true, how does that change his relationship with Oscar? DLH is cool with him knowing that Shane may have cheated in the fight against him. Also, does this now make DLH look better because it was a very close competitive fight that Shane won by allegedly cheating?
Boxingjunkie
If I am not mistaken the two you are refering to are the founders or something for BALCO. Its hard to believe the word of someone who is in big time trouble trying to save his own ass. They guys would turn their own mothers in if they thought it would get them out of trouble. Mosley did admit to unknowingly taking something. I guess it just depends on who you want to believe in this case. Its funny how the media thinks that baseball has such a steroid problem. Its in every sport.
KingEugene
Its crazy period how the media will blow anything up to get press and how people will say anything to get press. The man already admitted to taking illegal substances unknowningly. What more else do they want from this guy....money or jail? I like Mosley, and I think taking illegal substances is illegal and I dispise it. But when a man is Man Enough to say that he was wrong then let it go goodness gracious. I honestly dont think DLH could have beat him either way it went. Mosley is a beast!
hardhead
QUOTE(Boxingjunkie @ Jun 3 2008, 05:11 AM) [snapback]391261[/snapback]
If I am not mistaken the two you are refering to are the founders or something for BALCO. Its hard to believe the word of someone who is in big time trouble trying to save his own ass. They guys would turn their own mothers in if they thought it would get them out of trouble. Mosley did admit to unknowingly taking something. I guess it just depends on who you want to believe in this case. Its funny how the media thinks that baseball has such a steroid problem. Its in every sport.



I agree about it being in practically every sport, what's ever crazier for me though is, and this is just speculation on my part, I think there's FAR MORE steroid use going on in College/Professional/High School Football than in Baseball at any level. I mean seriously when you were in High School and you thought of "athletes using steroids?" what's the first sport that came to your mind?? Not Baseball I can tell you that. It would've been Football for me. Sure Baseball players probably used it(we know the majors were doing it) but for some reason, and especially in Pro Baseball, it's a WAY bigger deal than it is in Football when a player gets busted(that is when it's made public because the NFL does a good job of covering it up IMO). Look at Shawn Merriman, this guys was the DFPOTY and you almost never hear shit about his steroid use or if other players are juicing, it's like they fined and suspended him and the media just swept it under the rug. I think in Baseball it has something to do with a large part of the"greatness" in Baseball is built on records(the fact that Bonds could be considered the GOAT and never have won a championship), and not so much championships/winning like in most other sports. Also the serious tradition and reverence for the past greats is something I think Baseball writers and fans hold extremely high(similar to Boxing really) and when they see some of these newer guys using every advantage(illegal and legal) they can breaking some of the old timer's records they cry foul(not saying they're right or wrong) and rock the hell out of the boat.
Fitz
Whether it's true or not, I don't think Oscar would hold it to personally. I think people under estimate how much steroids are probably used in boxing.
Boxing is not the cleanest sport, they fight a couple of times a year and have months to get rid of anything before a fight. There aren't facts that support it, but I don't know, to me I think it's pretty naive to assume that a very, very small minority only do it. That's just me anyways.
Maxy
QUOTE(Fitz @ Jun 3 2008, 05:27 AM) [snapback]391274[/snapback]
Whether it's true or not, I don't think Oscar would hold it to personally. I think people under estimate how much steroids are probably used in boxing.
Boxing is not the cleanest sport, they fight a couple of times a year and have months to get rid of anything before a fight. There aren't facts that support it, but I don't know, to me I think it's pretty naive to assume that a very, very small minority only do it. That's just me anyways.


My head tells me that you're bang on with that but I don't want to believe it. Spoils things big time to think that some of my favourite fighters might have been juiced up.

I'll just be naive until proven otherwise.
Chillmatic
Steroid use in boxing should come to no one's surprise. After all, there is no random drug testing policy like there is in MLB or the NFL. A fighter can put whatever he wants in his body during a layoff, then by the time it's ready to fight his blood levels would have returned to normal. Same goes with HGH, which is becoming very popular with heavyweight fighters.

In the fight in question in the de la Hoya rematch, where Victor Conte alleges that Mosley injected himself with EPO, Mosley weighed in at 172 pounds over night.

This highlights that it's not just heavyweights using performance enhancers. Anyone looking to get a competitive edge can take advantage of what's right in front of him.
D-MARV
Your right on point!

I think alot of boxers are using illegal steroids. Think about it! You're in a sport where you have to cut weight with as less muscle loss as possible.
Tha Docta
does anyone really believe that someone who knows exactly whats going on with his body like Shane Mosley didnt realize he was taking performance enhancers?? Shane always keeps himself in shape and I imagine he would have to be pretty stupid to not realize what he was taking.

victor conte has already paid his dues and cannot be charged again for his past crimes of distributing performance enhancers. he already cut his deal. and everything that conte has come out and said has been true so far. (marion jones comes to mind) she also slapped conte with a defamation suit and that bitch is sitting in jail right now for lying to the feds.

ive always liked shane as a fighter, but his career really didnt take off until he started using performance enhancers. yeah he was a nasty lightweight, but he wasnt considered HOF material until he started juicing. i think boxers that have been caught should have a ridiculously hard time getting into the HOF just like baseball is doing now with their cheats.

holyfield is another obvious juicer that gets a pass for some reason as well. because he had so much heart and was fighting bigger guys he doesnt face the criticism. i dont understand why more people arent calling these guys out for having tainted careers.
Douchebag
They should ALL juice IMHO. What would be the problem if they all did it?
Big Slim Sweet
QUOTE(The Conscience @ Jun 3 2008, 11:36 AM) [snapback]391292[/snapback]
They should ALL juice IMHO. What would be the problem if they all did it?

Agreed. The fact of the matter is it's the only way to maintain a level playing field.
Boxingjunkie
There is no doubt that steroids are in every sport. Maxy Im like you I dont want to believe it, but just look at the ones who have been caught. Just the ones I can remember are Toney, Vargas, and we know that Mosley and Holyfield have both been accused but never proven. You look at Holyfield. Some steroid maker gets busted. One of their clients is Evan Fields and has the same phone number as Evander. We can all figure that one out. I never believed that Evander was juiced until I heard this. It kinda makes sense. The guy was like the walking dead in the ring against Bowe III, and Czyz. Then he comes out against Tyson and looks ten years younger.
Tha Docta
QUOTE(Boxingjunkie @ Jun 3 2008, 02:13 PM) [snapback]391303[/snapback]
There is no doubt that steroids are in every sport. Maxy Im like you I dont want to believe it, but just look at the ones who have been caught. Just the ones I can remember are Toney, Vargas, and we know that Mosley and Holyfield have both been accused but never proven. You look at Holyfield. Some steroid maker gets busted. One of their clients is Evan Fields and has the same phone number as Evander. We can all figure that one out. I never believed that Evander was juiced until I heard this. It kinda makes sense. The guy was like the walking dead in the ring against Bowe III, and Czyz. Then he comes out against Tyson and looks ten years younger.



holyfield was juicing way before the tyson fight. if i remember correctly holyfield use to train with some weightlifter that was big into steroids. and the amount of muscle that he put on to fight at heavyweight was ridiculous.

on a side note, i wish someone would slip judah some of that EPO shit and maybe the guy could fight for more than 4-5 rounds.
Boxingjunkie
QUOTE(Tha Docta @ Jun 3 2008, 01:18 PM) [snapback]391304[/snapback]
holyfield was juicing way before the tyson fight. if i remember correctly holyfield use to train with some weightlifter that was big into steroids. and the amount of muscle that he put on to fight at heavyweight was ridiculous.

on a side note, i wish someone would slip judah some of that EPO shit and maybe the guy could fight for more than 4-5 rounds.



Tyson could have used some to. He could still be fighting right if he had.
hardhead
The ironic thing for me is that while Mosley is accused of taking "performance enhancing" steroids for the second DLH fight, for me I thought he didn't look all that great and DLH won the fight comfortably(I think I had it 8-4). He definitely looked way better performance wise IMO in the first DLH fight. Even though I had the first one(7-5 Mosley) a little closer than the second one, I thought it was a pretty clear cut 7-5 Mosley.
Mean Mister Mustard
His physique did look way better than ever in the second DLH fight. I believe that many of the today's top guys do steroids, I bet in the gym they hear rumors of who uses and then all the rest want to do them as well as to not be at a disadvantage.
dj necrogenic
QUOTE(hardhead @ Jun 3 2008, 01:29 PM) [snapback]391316[/snapback]
The ironic thing for me is that while Mosley is accused of taking "performance enhancing" steroids for the second DLH fight, for me I thought he didn't look all that great and DLH won the fight comfortably(I think I had it 8-4). He definitely looked way better performance wise IMO in the first DLH fight. Even though I had the first one(7-5 Mosley) a little closer than the second one, I thought it was a pretty clear cut 7-5 Mosley.

I had DLH winning the fight as well, but Mosely is credited with the win for coming on late, EXTRA STAMINA perhaps? Then the accusations come out, and in Mosleys next (unroided) fight, he turns into the guy who seems about to cry in frustration half way through the fight because he had no energy, and his punches were pitty patter punches to Winky Wright... It all makes perfect sense to me to tell you the truth... And I dont for one second buy the "I Had No Idea" card... thats BS, a fighter in todays game isnt just going to let some dude give him some new form of miracle vitamin without questioning it
Boxingjunkie
QUOTE(dj necrogenic @ Jun 3 2008, 05:12 PM) [snapback]391327[/snapback]
And I dont for one second buy the "I Had No Idea" card... thats BS, a fighter in todays game isnt just going to let some dude give him some new form of miracle vitamin without questioning it


It could happen laugh.gif
dj necrogenic
QUOTE(Boxingjunkie @ Jun 3 2008, 03:18 PM) [snapback]391330[/snapback]
It could happen laugh.gif

Mosley isnt that dumb... He knew what he was doing
flazi
First off, Mosley ALLEGEDLY, was spotted injecting epo. EPO is not a steroid. EPO is given to dialysis patients to help the kidneys do their job. Did he knowingly take this? This remains to be seen. If you have kids, wife, training going on and your edurance/nutrionalist suggest a 'injectable b12 for faster and better absorbtion' would you say no? After all you are paying this guy for his knowledge and you trust in him for him to get you fit and ready to go 12 hard rounds.
sweetchuck
It is in every sport. I am a pro boxer and I have never used steroids, but I'll admit that when I was an amateur I would take things like Stacker 2 and other ephidrine based products to help me cut weight and train harder. One of my best friends is a power lifter and toughman competitor and he admits to taking steroids and testostrone. I have football player friends that juice as well. They all tell me how much steroid use there is. Like in weight lifters who juice know which leagues and federations they can juice and they go into those ones and there are drug free ones that check constantly. There is skill involved in sports as well so a better boxer will beat a juiced boxer (i.e. De La Hoya over Vargas).

As far as knowing what you are taking before, there are times when you hire a nutritionist and strength and conditioning coaches and they give you stuff and say take these supplements or drink this shake or whatever and you do and you don't know it's an illegal substance. You trust them because you are paying them for their expert advice. There are also times when you talk to someone in the gym and they tell you to take something and it could be an illegal substance and you not know it. Think about the times when you're with a friend and you go somewhere and they're like "Hey try this stuff it's great" so you do because you're friend isn't going to lie. I mean if someone knows you drink energy drinks and says "Hey the new Rockstar is better tasting and will keep you awake longer," you're going to go try it if their someone you trust.

We all have our limits, like I admit to using diet pills (and I would take 10 a day) to lose weight. Another can justify and live with themselves to take steroids and testostrone, some will be on several painkillers, some will use Human Growth Hormone. There's a lot of drugs that will help you get to places you want to get. It's whether or not you choose to use them. We're all looking for an edge, whether it's a nutritionist, strength coach, drugs, whatever.

It would be nice to know that all athletes are clean, but just like parents have to lose their notion that their kid is an angel that would never do something wrong, we need to realize that a lot of athletes put themselves through a hell a normal person won't to get where they want to know. At the end of the day, it is the athlete that makes the accomplishment, not the drugs. Barry Bonds was a great baseball player before he got big and started hitting all those home runs. Everyone loved him until the steroid investigation. And you know what, people still do and he has all the accomplishments he wanted in baseball.

I guess what I'm trying to say is cut Mosley a break like someone else said, at least he'll man up and admit that he did it and it was wrong. That's more than a lot of other people do.
Method
I am not looking to start a bunch of shit or get into back and forths here - the truth will (or maybe it won't) come out eventually, or the fed grand judy is gonna throw someone in jail for either perjury or obstruction (see Martha Stewart, Scooter Libby, Lil Kim for Christ's sake).

I will say this, I have injected myself before, and god damn right when you're on them you fucking A right know it.

I hear what you're saying about a nutritionist and blah blah blah, but any top ranked nutritionist that you are paying a premium to will go out of their was yo explain what it is you're taking and what its for. STANDARD. Especially in a sport where its tested for and/or an elite athelete, who stands to lose multi million dollar paydays is invovled.

This story is going to get interesting before it goes away completely.

Now, Shane did the right thing and admited he took something, coupling it with saying that he wasn't aware that it was illegal.

That is a helluva lot better than denying injecting anything.

Problem is, now these guys are suing for libel, which, as Lou Dibella can tell you, is as hard a case to win as anything. Sweet Lou was trying to win something like 30,000,000 and came out with 600k.
HaydelHammer
nothing can make deLaTreadmill look better......not even those stockings and high heels he wears around the house.

flazi
Method, that is not the case with some of this stuff. I have used test and knew i was on it. I have also used var and felt nothing. I have used winny and only felt elbow pain. So me guys respond differently to certain drugs than other guys. Every drug is different also, test doesn't feel like equippose or deca.
I am a powerlifter and so are my friends. I am the only clean one of the bunch. They beat me, not because they juice (which of course helps) but because they are way more intense than i am in the gym they also work their butts off and are way more dedicated than i am. Steroids is no magic potion, you have to work your ass off in order for it to work.
Method
True. And I am by far a prolonged user. I may have done 2, 5-week cycles of Winnie in about a 55 year span. Hardly full cycles, but bro, you just feel stronger, more energized. On winnie I used to wake up in the middle of the night in a puddle of sweat. I was shredded. But I also got my most shredded off of either of that crap. Just a heavy, very clean dieat, and two-a-days.

sweetchuck
I agree it depends on what you're on and how your body reacts to it. Not all nutritionists and strength trainers explain everything. But you should always know what you're putting in your body. I never used steroids because I never wanted my balls to shrink and my head to get bigger. My balls are already small enough and my head is like spudnik
GMontoya
QUOTE(dj necrogenic @ Jun 3 2008, 03:12 PM) [snapback]391327[/snapback]
I had DLH winning the fight as well, but Mosely is credited with the win for coming on late, EXTRA STAMINA perhaps? Then the accusations come out, and in Mosleys next (unroided) fight, he turns into the guy who seems about to cry in frustration half way through the fight because he had no energy, and his punches were pitty patter punches to Winky Wright... It all makes perfect sense to me to tell you the truth... And I dont for one second buy the "I Had No Idea" card... thats BS, a fighter in todays game isnt just going to let some dude give him some new form of miracle vitamin without questioning it

Especially if you are paying 15K for it.
flazi
QUOTE(GMontoya @ Jun 9 2008, 05:23 AM) [snapback]391931[/snapback]
Especially if you are paying 15K for it.

most boxers don't handle their own finances bro. Jin handles Mosley's. For all we know he probably never knew how much it cost.

Method, two a days are brutal, i too was my most shredded on two a days. I would get back to it now but i am not ready for that kind of intesity lol. When i was on winny, i actually had less intensity than being clean. that winny really hurt my joints but deca was just the opposite, it was great for my joints.

Fitz, not all steroids make you more intense. I have seen more guys with more intensity on redline than i have on juice. Some make you feel very lethargic.
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