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Full Version: Anderson Silva is moving up to Light Heavy
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AussieLad
So its happened, he's moving up

What are your guys opinions on the move

He should beat the Sandman with no problems, but how does the spider match up with the elite at 205?
monzo
i would like to see him fight lyoto mashida
AussieLad
Machida is an interesting match up. I think Silva is a superior striker, but lyoto's stick and move elusiveness will be tricky
King Eugene
I think he'll fair pretty well, I mean hell you seen what he did to Dan Henderson. Put 20 more pounds on him and he is going to be even more of a beast!
AussieLad
He's got a frame that can handle the weight, so i dont think that will be a problem for him

The ultimate match up is Silva vs Rampage

Incidentally, the video on UFC.com of Rampage talking about his upcoming match vs Griffin is hilarious. Never heard anyone say "Ass Whoopin" so many times in 2 minutes
mrwigi
lookout rampage
CreDog
The big question is whether or not his chin can hold up moving up 20lbs... His striking in MMA is on a different level.


Shogun
Wandy
Chuck
Sokodjou
Machida
Griffin


He cleaned out 185, I guess he needed more competition-- good for him and the fans!

Douchebag
The first fight that I would like to see A.Silva in at 205 is against Chuck Lidell.
BigG
Wandy vs Anderson! Total war.
King Eugene
QUOTE(The Conscience @ Jun 20 2008, 11:49 AM) [snapback]393133[/snapback]
The first fight that I would like to see A.Silva in at 205 is against Chuck Lidell.



I'd pay good money to see that!
Bill The Butcher
I'm a big Rampage fan. But I have to admit, I'm a little worried for Rampage now that Anderson Silva is moving up in weight. I agree that Silva has the body frame to easily pack on the weight. He is still going to be fast. He will still hurt people in this weight class. I think he could beat anyone in this weight class.
BigG
Is Anderson Silva the most perfect fighter in MMA right now? He probably is...
Warlord
QUOTE(biggeorge89 @ Jun 23 2008, 02:30 PM) [snapback]393502[/snapback]
Is Anderson Silva the most perfect fighter in MMA right now? He probably is...

Naa, Fedor is.

Anderson Silva will struggle at 205. Too many good fighters there. He may get by hype-jobs like Chuck Liddell, but I don't see him looking as dominant against slick fighters like Machida or well-rounded fighters like Quinton Jackson.

No matter what he does, I can never get the image of Anderson getting traingled by fucking Daiju Takase out of my mind. That's some fucked up shit. Those boys in Pride used Anderson like a dirty fucking cum-rag.

And despite what I've been hearing, Anderson doesn't really have the frame to carry 205 well. He's a skinny fucking dude, lithe, quick, accurate. I don't imagine those same qualities will translate too well to a higher division once 20 pounds have been packed on to them. We'll see though. I've never been wrong yet, but there's a first time for everything I hear.
AussieLad
QUOTE(Warlord @ Jun 27 2008, 05:05 AM) [snapback]393861[/snapback]
And despite what I've been hearing, Anderson doesn't really have the frame to carry 205 well. He's a skinny fucking dude, lithe, quick, accurate. I don't imagine those same qualities will translate too well to a higher division once 20 pounds have been packed on to them. We'll see though. I've never been wrong yet, but there's a first time for everything I hear.


You just popped your cherry on that one.

As for rampage, look at how each performed vs henderson. One fought 25 minutes for a decision, one stopped him in the second. In my opinion henderson is a more natural middle than light heavy, but can beat elite light heavies because he is a serious fighter. Silva beat him in a more convincing fashion at the weight henderson is most suited too. Should silva vs jackson happen, my money is on Silva

Andersons striking is better than fedors, particularly the leg kicks. I would still rate fedor higher based on his record, winning percentages, and haven beaten opponents much larger than himself fairly easily. But given his inactivity, and lack of quality opposition of late, fedor will slip down the ladder unless he fights again against a quality opponent very soon
ROLL DEEP
QUOTE(AussieLad @ Jun 20 2008, 03:48 AM) [snapback]393094[/snapback]
Incidentally, the video on UFC.com of Rampage talking about his upcoming match vs Griffin is hilarious. Never heard anyone say "Ass Whoopin" so many times in 2 minutes


laugh.gif

Just listened to it....Ass Whoopin'!
Warlord
QUOTE(AussieLad @ Jun 27 2008, 02:51 AM) [snapback]393868[/snapback]
You just popped your cherry on that one.

As for rampage, look at how each performed vs henderson. One fought 25 minutes for a decision, one stopped him in the second. In my opinion henderson is a more natural middle than light heavy, but can beat elite light heavies because he is a serious fighter. Silva beat him in a more convincing fashion at the weight henderson is most suited too. Should silva vs jackson happen, my money is on Silva

Andersons striking is better than fedors, particularly the leg kicks. I would still rate fedor higher based on his record, winning percentages, and haven beaten opponents much larger than himself fairly easily. But given his inactivity, and lack of quality opposition of late, fedor will slip down the ladder unless he fights again against a quality opponent very soon

Quinton Jackson versus Dan Henderson being compared to Anderson Silva versus Dan Henderson? MMAth at its finest, lol.

Dude, Dan Henderson has NEVER performed very well at middleweight. His best wins have come at 205lbs. He's the same type of mythical middleweight that James Toney is. Because they have an unbelievable skill set, and because they had fights at middleweight, people automatically assume they must have been great middleweights. They weren't. Dan is a dried out middleweight with no stamina or endurance. At 205 he's a beast who can go all night. I know on the surface he's a good marker to measure Silva/Jackson, but when you go a little deeper, that comparison just plain sucks. Not to mention common opponents are rarely ever a good indication of how well two fighters will match up against each other.

Henderson is a natrual 205lber. Silva isn't.

I won't even begin to compare Fedor to Silva, as you have already agreed to that point. Fedor has no embarrassing losses on his record. Silva has many.

That is all.
AussieLad
QUOTE(Warlord @ Jun 28 2008, 01:26 AM) [snapback]393936[/snapback]
Quinton Jackson versus Dan Henderson being compared to Anderson Silva versus Dan Henderson? MMAth at its finest, lol.

Dude, Dan Henderson has NEVER performed very well at middleweight. His best wins have come at 205lbs. He's the same type of mythical middleweight that James Toney is. Because they have an unbelievable skill set, and because they had fights at middleweight, people automatically assume they must have been great middleweights. They weren't. Dan is a dried out middleweight with no stamina or endurance. At 205 he's a beast who can go all night. I know on the surface he's a good marker to measure Silva/Jackson, but when you go a little deeper, that comparison just plain sucks. Not to mention common opponents are rarely ever a good indication of how well two fighters will match up against each other.

Henderson is a natrual 205lber. Silva isn't.

I won't even begin to compare Fedor to Silva, as you have already agreed to that point. Fedor has no embarrassing losses on his record. Silva has many.

That is all.


How long does fedor have to go without a real match up before he drops down a notch in your rankings then...? at the moment it looks like he's turning out to be MMA's PBF
Warlord
QUOTE(AussieLad @ Jun 27 2008, 11:03 PM) [snapback]393944[/snapback]
How long does fedor have to go without a real match up before he drops down a notch in your rankings then...? at the moment it looks like he's turning out to be MMA's PBF

I didn't say Fedor is, or should be, ranked #1. I just made the argument he is the most "perfect" fighter in MMA today. Rankings are based on what you've accomplished lately, so I have no problem with anyone who thinks that Anderson Silva has fought, and defeated, the better competition over the last year or two. I just have a problem if that same person wants to argue that Silva is a better fighter. He isn't.
AussieLad
Wouldnt you think a perfect fighter would have a better kit of kicks in his arsenal?
Warlord
QUOTE(AussieLad @ Jun 28 2008, 02:01 AM) [snapback]393954[/snapback]
Wouldnt you think a perfect fighter would have a better kit of kicks in his arsenal?

Yes, I think a "perfect" fighter would. I only said Fedor was the "most perfect" fighter today, not THE perfect fighter. There's no such thing as THE "perfect fighter," and I think we all know that. But we can keep arguing semantics if you want.
AussieLad
Well you can break each sentence down into minutia if you want, but i think you are over analyzing it

Whilst Fedor is the best heavyweight at the moment, i think there are a few fighters in lower weight classes that have better all round skillsets. Better strikers with comparable submissions skills, or vice versa. BJ Penn and GSP for example. Of course most of them have the odd loss in their resume. An imperfect resume does not necessarily mean that a fighter cant be top of the heap, so long as they have evolved since the loss. Its the destination rather than the road one takes to get there

Where they fall down in comparison with fedor is the list of names on his unblemished resume, but as you stated we arent comparing accomplishments where comparing who is a better fighter
Warlord
QUOTE(AussieLad @ Jun 28 2008, 04:51 AM) [snapback]393964[/snapback]
Well you can break each sentence down into minutia if you want, but i think you are over analyzing it

Whilst Fedor is the best heavyweight at the moment, i think there are a few fighters in lower weight classes that have better all round skillsets. Better strikers with comparable submissions skills, or vice versa. BJ Penn and GSP for example. Of course most of them have the odd loss in their resume. An imperfect resume does not necessarily mean that a fighter cant be top of the heap, so long as they have evolved since the loss. Its the destination rather than the road one takes to get there

Where they fall down in comparison with fedor is the list of names on his unblemished resume, but as you stated we arent comparing accomplishments where comparing who is a better fighter

Are we arguing P4P now? BJ Penn might be #1, if he could be trusted to show up in shape and not gas after 2 rounds.

Anderson Silva might be #1 if he knew how to defend against subs being put on him by sub .500 Japanese fighters. 1 embarrassing loss is excusable. Multiple losses to inferior opponents isn't.

GSP definitley has a chance to be on the list... once he can prove that he isn't susceptible to getting blown out by scrubs like Matt Serra.

Quinton Jackson, could never be considered, no matter how thankful we are for him knocking Chuck Liddell out. Jackson sucks in the clinch, has no submission skills, and won't always be able to power out of the submission attempts being applied to him.

Fedor has excellent stand-up, always throwing punches in bunches, and is able to fight at angles which neutralize the striking power of his opponents (like Mirko Cro-Cop.) Fedor's chin is one of, if not the best, in the business. His shoots have a high percentage, and once he gets you on the ground... well, just ask his opponents. Fedor's shots on the ground are BRUTAL, and fucking legendary. Ask your current UFC champ about it. Fedor fucked him up like a 2nd class hooker, all the while Eiko Koike is sitting at the announcer's booth sobbing and crying at the beating big Nog is taking.

Pulling guard doesn't mean a damn thing, because Fedor's subs are phenomenal. He'll arm-bar you with Rickson Gracie-like authority.

Again, debate that shit all day long. You talk about kicks / leg kicks, and then mention BJ Penn in the same breath. How many kicks has BJ Penn ever thrown? Well, since I'm an MMA virgin, I probably don't have to tell you, but the answer is few. BJ Penn claims kicks are useless, and he thinks it leaves a fighter open to being taken down and put on his back, so he doesn't train in them.

Whatever though. You guys trying to diminish Fedor is laughable at best. He's the best until he gets beaten or shows weakness. Until then you better learn to love it.
BigG
One thing I'm not really impressed with about Fedor is his standup/boxing. Other than that, he is really good.
AussieLad
LOL... "Are we arguing P4P now". I thought that was fucking obvious. Who is the most perfect fighter in MMA right now... what does that sentence imply? Does it stipulate heavyweight, does it stipulate a division... no, the only thing it stipulates is the best active fighter... so yes, P4P if i need to spell it out to you. Although i really thought it was obvious that was what we are discussing

So what if Penn thinks kicks are useless? GSP landed numerous inside leg kicks on Penn, and threw the odd head kick, without penn being able to capitalize on this "vulnerability" the majority of the time, let alone everytime. GSP won the fight, and you yourself said GSP has a shot at the ranking if it wasnt for a freak loss against Serra, GSP's game includes a solid base of kicks. A kicking game is part of a complete fighters skillset, and a deficiency in any aspect of the game is still a deficiency

Besides, that wasnt my point, Penns submissions are superior to fedors and his striking is comparable. He has a superior skillset p4p, despite the record which is more a reflection of his dedication to training than his skill. And as i said before, the destination is more importat than the path one travels to get there, and a spotless record means shit if the last time you fought a legit opponent was april 2007, and the only fight since thenm was against a freak show in December 2007
Warlord
QUOTE(AussieLad @ Jun 29 2008, 01:46 AM) [snapback]394066[/snapback]
LOL... "Are we arguing P4P now". I thought that was fucking obvious. Who is the most perfect fighter in MMA right now... what does that sentence imply? Does it stipulate heavyweight, does it stipulate a division... no, the only thing it stipulates is the best active fighter... so yes, P4P if i need to spell it out to you. Although i really thought it was obvious that was what we are discussing.

I was comparing Fedor to Anderson Silva, dumbass, I wasn't doing a fucking P4P rundown on every fighter in the game. I posed the "P4P" question to you after you shit the names BJ Penn and Georges St. Pierre out of your mouth.

QUOTE
So what if Penn thinks kicks are useless?
So what? So you said BJ Penn was the #1 fighter in the game, or close to it, meanwhile you shit on Fedor at every turn, claiming "The number one fighter in the world should have kicks in his arsenal." So fuck off with your condescending bullshit, chump. You aren't smart enough for it.

QUOTE
GSP landed numerous inside leg kicks on Penn, and threw the odd head kick, without penn being able to capitalize on this "vulnerability" the majority of the time, let alone everytime. GSP won the fight, and you yourself said GSP has a shot at the ranking if it wasnt for a freak loss against Serra, GSP's game includes a solid base of kicks. A kicking game is part of a complete fighters skillset, and a deficiency in any aspect of the game is still a deficiency.

Circular argument, Einstein. You brought up the names of both BJ Penn and GSP, so congratulations for actually sitting here and debating yourself as to which fighter is better. It's not often you catch a motherfucker debating himself like that... and winning. That's some Chuck Norris-type shit right there.

QUOTE
Besides, that wasnt my point, Penns submissions are superior to fedors and his striking is comparable.
Is that fact or opinion? You wanna know a FACT? Fedor has more submission wins than Penn, and he has them over better competition. Penn has 5 FUCKING submissions in his career! Fedor has 14 subs, and he holds victories over almost every single big name opponent at or near his weight class. After he rapes Tim Sylvia, Randy Cotoure will be the only name left. Let's see what kind of credit you guys give Fedor for that win too. Randy was proclaimed GOD after beating Tim Sylvia, never mind the fact he was coming off two brutal KO's to a light heavyweight. Fedor gets that win and you guys say big deal, fight Randy. Fedor rapes Randy and it's big deal, Randy's old. You fuckers kill me.

QUOTE
He has a superior skillset p4p, despite the record which is more a reflection of his dedication to training than his skill.

So a fighter's shitty conditioning shouldn't be held against him? If he loses when he gasses it doesn't count as a loss? WTF? Then James Toney is still the P4P #1 bad ass in the sport of boxing today, if that's the case. Jesus H. Christ, you're a real fucking genius at this debate shit.

QUOTE
And as i said before, the destination is more importat than the path one travels to get there, and a spotless record means shit if the last time you fought a legit opponent was april 2007, and the only fight since thenm was against a freak show in December 2007.

Again, who else is left for Fedor? Sylvia? Randy? And then what? Back to the same shit about how he's fighting nobody? Who else is there? Who else does the man have to beat? Does he have to go through his entire comp list again, and maybe fight guys twice or thrice in one night? Will he get his fucking respect then? Nope, he won't. Not from fucking TUF noobs like you. Go play in the sandbox kid, you're getting on my nerves.
AussieLad
Check the thread history. I replied to your reply about Silva being the most perfect fighter in MMA, and you thought it was fedor. That is the entry point, a p4p discussion. Because you choose to believe that it is an all out attack on fedor... well thats your problem

Warlord
QUOTE(AussieLad @ Jun 30 2008, 02:51 AM) [snapback]394191[/snapback]
Check the thread history. I replied to your reply about Silva being the most perfect fighter in MMA, and you thought it was fedor. That is the entry point, a p4p discussion. Because you choose to believe that it is an all out attack on fedor... well thats your problem

Comparing Fedor's skillset to Anderson Silva's isn't a P4P discussion, moron. Discussing how they would do in a mythical match-up is.

It wasn't an all out attack on Fedor until you shit your panties, shitting out the names BJ Penn and GSP of your mouth like it was impressing me or something.
AussieLad
The point, fuck nob, is that a question was asked. "Is Silva the most perfect MMA fighter today." You were the one that mentioned fedor as being better than silva, when you could have picked any fighter from any weight division. The question was not "is silva better than fedor". Its a P4P discussion, deny it all you want, but your wrong and i think you know it and just cant admit it. So suck a bag of shit fuck.gif

And the fact is that fedors stand up striking is fairly rudimentary in comparison to guys like GSP and Silva, but he has an excelent submission game, and is great at leaping in with head strikes while an opponent is on their back

But Penns Jiu Jitsu is better than fedors, and he has more power for his weight class behind his strikes. Fedor wings punches from his waste half the time.

And i havent shit on fedor at any point, he is the best current heavyweight, but the best P4P in MMA... hardly
Warlord
QUOTE(AussieLad @ Jul 1 2008, 03:53 AM) [snapback]394333[/snapback]
The point, fuck nob, is that a question was asked. "Is Silva the most perfect MMA fighter today." You were the one that mentioned fedor as being better than silva, when you could have picked any fighter from any weight division. The question was not "is silva better than fedor". Its a P4P discussion, deny it all you want, but your wrong and i think you know it and just cant admit it. So suck a bag of shit fuck.gif


Comparing fighters's all-around skills isn't a P4P discussion, you little cum-sipper. Technique is technique, and weight has nothing to do with it. Talking about how a 250lb fighter would do against a 180lb fighter is a P4P discussion, you fucking douche.

QUOTE
And the fact is that fedors stand up striking is fairly rudimentary in comparison to guys like GSP and Silva, but he has an excelent submission game, and is great at leaping in with head strikes while an opponent is on their back.
Your point being? Again you dumb fucking cunt, no one here was claiming Fedor was an ace standing on his feet.

QUOTE
But Penns Jiu Jitsu is better than fedors

So is Royce Gracie's. Is Gracie a "more perfect" fighter than Fedor now too? Fuck off, cunt.

QUOTE
and he has more power for his weight class behind his strikes.
Fedor has better strikes on the ground, which is where he takes his fights anyway. Your stand-up don't mean shit when you're laying on your back, fuckwit.

QUOTE
Fedor wings punches from his waste half the time.

So does Chuck Liddell, but that doesn't stop you from licking up every single drop of his jizz off the floor, now does it?

Fuck off, you fucking noob. You know jack about MMA. Every single active fighter worth a damn fighting today has gone on record stating Fedor is the best fighter on the planet. Only dumb fuck noobs like you say any different, because you think it sounds cool to be contrary, when in reality it's just plain fucking dumb.

QUOTE
And i havent shit on fedor at any point, he is the best current heavyweight, but the best P4P in MMA... hardly

So who is better? Anderson fucking Silva? Silva got OWNED in Pride by fucking C fighters. Just cause he went to some watered down org in the states and punished Chris Leben and Rich Franklin don't make him legendary. Grow up, you cunt, and go watch some REAL MMA before you deign to speak to me.
AussieLad
QUOTE(Warlord @ Jul 5 2008, 01:23 AM) [snapback]394871[/snapback]
Comparing fighters's all-around skills isn't a P4P discussion, you little cum-sipper. Technique is technique, and weight has nothing to do with it. Talking about how a 250lb fighter would do against a 180lb fighter is a P4P discussion, you fucking douche.


Are you serious....

So what your saying is that everyone that has pbf as p4p no 1 think that he would beat wlad klitschko in a fight....?

And the ones that have pacman as number 2 think he would beat bernard hopkins because he is rated higher on p4p lists...?

That must mean that when you look at the ring magazines p4p hardest punchers list, that because they have sugar ray robinson ranked over mike tyson, that robinson physically punches harder than tyson, because as you say weight divisions have nothing to do with p4p discussions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pound_for_pound

"[edit] Origin of the term
It is often said to have been created to describe world Welterweight and Middleweight champion Sugar Ray Robinson.[1] Robinson is one of the most accomplished fighters of all time, but his supporters realized that, while he could beat anyone in his own class, as a Middleweight he would not be able to beat a top Heavyweight. Hence, Robinson was called the pound-for-pound best without being expected to beat much larger fighters, under the belief that he as a Middleweight was still a better quality fighter than any fighter fighting at heavier or lighter weights than him."


BWAAAAARP....SFTTTTTTTTTTftttttttttttt.... thats the sound of you sucking a fart out of my arse retard
Warlord
QUOTE(AussieLad @ Jul 5 2008, 03:19 AM) [snapback]394889[/snapback]
Are you serious....

So what your saying is that everyone that has pbf as p4p no 1 think that he would beat wlad klitschko in a fight....?

In a hypothetical match, if weight weren't a factor, then yes, that is exactly what I'm saying. That was the original point of the P4P list, dipshit. Otherwise we'd have to say that Mike Tyson is a better fighter than Floyd Mayweather because he'd win a fight against him 10 out of 10 times.

QUOTE
And the ones that have pacman as number 2 think he would beat bernard hopkins because he is rated higher on p4p lists...?
Again, they think he would if both fighters were in a mythical match-up where weight wasn't a factor.

QUOTE
That must mean that when you look at the ring magazines p4p hardest punchers list, that because they have sugar ray robinson ranked over mike tyson, that robinson physically punches harder than tyson, because as you say weight divisions have nothing to do with p4p discussions.

That just means that, P4P, he punches harder you fucking dipshit, and that if he faced Tyson in a mythical match-up where weight wasn't a factor, he wouldn't get blown out in 0.02 seconds because of physical gaps like strength and size.

Jesus Christ, you don't even know what P4P means, do you? Skill and technique transcends weight you fucking moron. Size and Punching power don't. P4P was created to discuss how fighters from different weight classes would fare against each other, assuming that weight weren't a factor, and assuming other skills would stay relatively intact, such as speed, stamina, reflexes, etc... That's why we say P4P Bernard Hopkins would own Floyd Mayweather, or P4P Floyd Mayweather would dance around most of today's heavyweights.

Is this concept REALLY so fucking difficult for you, you goddamn simpleton? Yes, I think it is. Now keep playing semantics, dipshit, trying to convince me you're even dumber than I originally thought. Semantics is the mating call of losers, btw. You sing it pretty good.
AussieLad
QUOTE(Warlord @ Jul 5 2008, 01:23 AM) [snapback]394871[/snapback]
Comparing fighters's all-around skills isn't a P4P discussion, you little cum-sipper. Talking about how a 250lb fighter would do against a 180lb fighter is a P4P discussion, you fucking douche.


Thats what you said. Backtracking now isnt going to do you any good fuck.gif
Warlord
QUOTE(AussieLad @ Jul 5 2008, 03:54 AM) [snapback]394892[/snapback]
Thats what you said. Backtracking now isnt going to do you any good fuck.gif

It's what I said from the beginning, you fucking idiot. You see, this is exactly what happens when a fucktard like you tries to play semantics. Eventually you get broken down into the tiny little shit particle you are, and you have to finish off with a short, retard retort and hope it flies. It doesn't. You've been owned, now STFU with your lame, uneducated ass and get out of my section you fucking TUF noob. You don't belong here.
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