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PUERTOROCKS
http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=15136
BigG
Classy Cotto..hope he fights Berto..
kidbazooka1
QUOTE(biggeorge89 @ Jul 27 2008, 02:56 PM) [snapback]397516[/snapback]
Classy Cotto..hope he fights Berto..


That would be a good win for Cotto to come back on.
salvador
QUOTE(biggeorge89 @ Jul 27 2008, 02:56 PM) [snapback]397516[/snapback]
Classy Cotto..hope he fights Berto..


I think Berto would be a terrible choice. I'd think that the very last guy Cotto would want to face next would be an undefeated contender who'd just gotten a ton of confidence after watching Cotto get destroyed like that. Cotto needs to take at least 6 months off and then, if he returns, it should be against very limited competition - RICKY HATTON.

George, I know you love Cotto, but I think you're seriously underestimating the damage he sustained last night. The slow motion replay of the last 5 seconds of the 10th round show that Cotto was essentially out on his feet when the bell rang - like a real concussion. And then, after only a minute's rest, he was back in the ring having his concussed head cracked some more. His corner should have stopped the fight after the 10th round. I've watched those last rounds several times today and the more I see, the less likely I think it is that Cotto can come back from that beating. It's just impossible for me to see him in a competitive fight with any of the big wws again.

The real fear, of course, is that DLH will pick the easy prey and make an offer Cotto can't refuse. That would be tragic.
hitman harding
QUOTE(salvador @ Jul 27 2008, 05:43 PM) [snapback]397555[/snapback]
I think Berto would be a terrible choice. I'd think that the very last guy Cotto would want to face next would be an undefeated contender who'd just gotten a ton of confidence after watching Cotto get destroyed like that. Cotto needs to take at least 6 months off and then, if he returns, it should be against very limited competition - RICKY HATTON.

George, I know you love Cotto, but I think you're seriously underestimating the damage he sustained last night. The slow motion replay of the last 5 seconds of the 10th round show that Cotto was essentially out on his feet when the bell rang - like a real concussion. And then, after only a minute's rest, he was back in the ring having his concussed head cracked some more. His corner should have stopped the fight after the 10th round. I've watched those last rounds several times today and the more I see, the less likely I think it is that Cotto can come back from that beating. It's just impossible for me to see him in a competitive fight with any of the big wws again.

The real fear, of course, is that DLH will pick the easy prey and make an offer Cotto can't refuse. That would be tragic.


I remember watching Cotto v N'dou and i thought he wasn't able to handle the mauling type boxers very well then. To throw him in with Hatton at 140# would be wise.
Cotto losing made my day.
Adleast Hatton lost to p4p 1 fighter not a guy that got beat by Daniel Santos lol
Mean Mister Mustard
I will Return
kidbazooka1
QUOTE(salvador @ Jul 27 2008, 05:43 PM) [snapback]397555[/snapback]
I think Berto would be a terrible choice. I'd think that the very last guy Cotto would want to face next would be an undefeated contender who'd just gotten a ton of confidence after watching Cotto get destroyed like that. Cotto needs to take at least 6 months off and then, if he returns, it should be against very limited competition - RICKY HATTON.

George, I know you love Cotto, but I think you're seriously underestimating the damage he sustained last night. The slow motion replay of the last 5 seconds of the 10th round show that Cotto was essentially out on his feet when the bell rang - like a real concussion. And then, after only a minute's rest, he was back in the ring having his concussed head cracked some more. His corner should have stopped the fight after the 10th round. I've watched those last rounds several times today and the more I see, the less likely I think it is that Cotto can come back from that beating. It's just impossible for me to see him in a competitive fight with any of the big wws again.

The real fear, of course, is that DLH will pick the easy prey and make an offer Cotto can't refuse. That would be tragic.


Berto reminds me of a poor mans Mosley his chin seems pretty suspect aswell. I see Berto taking a brutal beating at the hands of Cotto.
BoxingStill#1
QUOTE(salvador @ Jul 27 2008, 05:43 PM) [snapback]397555[/snapback]
I think Berto would be a terrible choice. I'd think that the very last guy Cotto would want to face next would be an undefeated contender who'd just gotten a ton of confidence after watching Cotto get destroyed like that. Cotto needs to take at least 6 months off and then, if he returns, it should be against very limited competition - RICKY HATTON.

George, I know you love Cotto, but I think you're seriously underestimating the damage he sustained last night. The slow motion replay of the last 5 seconds of the 10th round show that Cotto was essentially out on his feet when the bell rang - like a real concussion. And then, after only a minute's rest, he was back in the ring having his concussed head cracked some more. His corner should have stopped the fight after the 10th round. I've watched those last rounds several times today and the more I see, the less likely I think it is that Cotto can come back from that beating. It's just impossible for me to see him in a competitive fight with any of the big wws again.

The real fear, of course, is that DLH will pick the easy prey and make an offer Cotto can't refuse. That would be tragic.



funny how the 2/3 of this fight was forgotten,.....you know when Cotto was completely outclassing Tony,.......whoa...no props?
salvador
QUOTE(BoxingStill#1 @ Jul 27 2008, 06:31 PM) [snapback]397567[/snapback]
funny how the 2/3 of this fight was forgotten,.....you know when Cotto was completely outclassing Tony,.......whoa...no props?


Cotto was outboxing Tony for most of the fight, but "completely outclassing Tony"?????? How drunk were you? The difference in the fight was that Tony could take everything Cotto could dish out and and Cotto couldn't take what Tony dished out. I would argue that Tony's chin outclassed Cotto's power. Being able to take a punch might be the most important quality of a true championship level fighter - and p4p, Tony's the BEST at that.

And if you seriously don't think that Cotto will be a very different fighter going forward, take a look at Vargas after Tito. That's what happens when fighters have concussions and are allowed to continue taking punishment. Cotto was concussed for that entire 11th round - his chin was defenseless to the huge shots from the bigger man. No one's taking anything away from Cotto, just like I'd never take anything away from Vargas, but Cotto's corner should have stopped this fight after the 10th.

salvador
QUOTE(hitman harding @ Jul 27 2008, 05:49 PM) [snapback]397556[/snapback]
Adleast Hatton lost to p4p 1 fighter not a guy that got beat by Daniel Santos lol


that's funny!
JD
Cotto will be back, but I have a hunch he won't quite be the same fighter.
PR316
Fighters are rarely the same after a big loss. Its like a mental block of some sort that just takes over them it seems that doesn't allow them to be as loose as they once were in the ring.


Be that as it may, I still dont see Margarito as an opponent that Cotto CAN'T beat. I don't think Margarito can do anything different but Cotto can do a few little things different so that he could possibly pull off a decision victory.


But I doubt Arum lets Cotto near Margarito anytime soon anyways. I see both guys taking on different paths for the moment and if Cotto is able to resurrect himself in the way Kostya Tszyu did after losing to Vince Phillips, then maybe down the line we can see this one again.
JD
I don't know if I would say "rarely".

The nature of this loss is where my concern comes from...Cotto had it beaten out of him to the point where he was forced to kneel in from of Margarito in order to get him to stop. Cotto fought as well as he could have and would have beaten any other welter last night - he just ran into someone who was not going to be denied, and he took a beating in the process.
Boxingjunkie
QUOTE(PR316 @ Jul 27 2008, 08:35 PM) [snapback]397591[/snapback]
But I doubt Arum lets Cotto near Margarito anytime soon anyways.



Thats a great point about Arum. Wonder what he plans to do now that his main star has lost (Next to Pacquiao). Arum never really gave Margarito his props over all these years. You know Arum didnt think that Margarito would win that fight. I bet he sucks up big time to Margarito now.
salvador
QUOTE(JD @ Jul 27 2008, 10:04 PM) [snapback]397594[/snapback]
The nature of this loss is where my concern comes from...Cotto had it beaten out of him to the point where he was forced to kneel in from of Margarito in order to get him to stop. Cotto fought as well as he could have and would have beaten any other welter last night - he just ran into someone who was not going to be denied, and he took a beating in the process.


I've watched the last 2 rounds of this fight enough times today to say without a shadow of a doubt that Cotto WILL BE A LESSER FIGHTER GOING FORWARD. There's no way he's ever going to have the confidence he had before Margarito. And without that confidence, Cotto will never be Cotto again. It's very very sad, but undeniable.
PR316
QUOTE(JD @ Jul 28 2008, 02:04 AM) [snapback]397594[/snapback]
I don't know if I would say "rarely".

The nature of this loss is where my concern comes from...Cotto had it beaten out of him to the point where he was forced to kneel in from of Margarito in order to get him to stop. Cotto fought as well as he could have and would have beaten any other welter last night - he just ran into someone who was not going to be denied, and he took a beating in the process.


That can't be denied. On that night, will definitely did triumph over skill. Cotto boxed as well as I've ever seen him arguably but I think he could have clinched a bit more, especially when Margarito got him trapped on the ropes. Cotto would only clinch after getting hurt. I think if he does that and uses his jab a bit more from the outside, I could see a different outcome if there is a next time.

As far as Cotto recovering from this one I honestly can't say. He's still young and has a few more prime years left in him I want to say. But one thing for sure is that I expect him to be thrown in there with lots of soft touches for a long time until he challenges for another title. Expect him to be kept away from "punchers" for a good while.

QUOTE(Boxingjunkie @ Jul 28 2008, 02:17 AM) [snapback]397596[/snapback]
Thats a great point about Arum. Wonder what he plans to do now that his main star has lost (Next to Pacquiao). Arum never really gave Margarito his props over all these years. You know Arum didnt think that Margarito would win that fight. I bet he sucks up big time to Margarito now.


I expect Cotto to be fed alot of soft opposition for a long time. We'll learn alot about Cotto now thats for sure. Margarito IMO doesn't have it too good because...

A- Oscar won't fight him.

B- Not alot of welterweights would wanna fight him.

C- Paul Williams is still there willing and able to give him another loss.


Margarito will hopefully get the chance to see some real money now. If I were Tony, I would do my damn best to try and entice Floyd Mayweather out of retirement because I don't see Oscar taking either him or Miguel Cotto.
kidbazooka1
QUOTE(JD @ Jul 27 2008, 08:26 PM) [snapback]397588[/snapback]
Cotto will be back, but I have a hunch he won't quite be the same fighter.


I actualy think Cotto will come bacl stronger from this loss I just don't see him taking on Marga any time soon but I say he beats most other 147lb's out there rignth now.
BigG
Cotto looked sensational IMO....what combos he was landing...Marg isnt the hardest fighter to find but Cotto showed mad skills. He is one of the best fighters to watch today...him, Pac, Marquez brothers, Floyd, JuanMa Lopez, P-Will, Taylor, Pavlik Margarito, Vazquez, Judah, Montiel
The Original MrFactor
I like Luis Collazo as an opponent for Cotto. I think Cotto should take the rest of this year off. Heal up, spend some money and come back. Right now there is no pressure on him to return. When he does, take on the bottom guy of the top 10 and see where you are.
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE(salvador @ Jul 27 2008, 10:45 PM) [snapback]397602[/snapback]
I've watched the last 2 rounds of this fight enough times today to say without a shadow of a doubt that Cotto WILL BE A LESSER FIGHTER GOING FORWARD. There's no way he's ever going to have the confidence he had before Margarito. And without that confidence, Cotto will never be Cotto again. It's very very sad, but undeniable.



I liken this to when Tyson got beat for the 1st time. Maybe not quite on teh same scale because people thought Tyson was unbeatable. Cotto was vulnerable. He definately left something in that ring the other nite. I think he can come back and beat most of the top 10. He will always have trouble with the bigger WW's.

Come to think of it, this guy has been in some incredible wars as of late. Judah was a war. Mosley was a war. Margarito was a war. He'd be good to take a long break. He's taken alot of punishment in the last year or so. How much of himself has he left in the ring in the last year?
King Eugene
trust and believe he will be back. nobody can live with a lost like that. I think he'll be back stronger. and he shouldn't fight no bum next either.

I don't care what nobody says he'll want a rematch sooner or later. too much pride to live with that beating for him and his country!

oh and even tho retired...MAYWEATHER is still the BEST!
neophyte7
Cotto is finished... PR has to look for another ICON to worship... Margarito is a natural middle who lost to Daniel Santos at 154 and came back to 147 to beat on smaller welters--- Cotto tailor made for him
Tha Docta
QUOTE(neophyte7 @ Jul 28 2008, 10:09 AM) [snapback]397663[/snapback]
Cotto is finished... PR has to look for another ICON to worship... Margarito is a natural middle who lost to Daniel Santos at 154 and came back to 147 to beat on smaller welters--- Cotto tailor made for him



people are quick to say a guy is finished, but i will wait and see. i think cotto will look at the tape and realize that if he tied up a little more and went to the body more often he would have had a better chance.

and people knock margarito for the santos fight but i give margarito alot of credit for that fight. santos was a lightheavyweight when they stepped in the ring that night and margarito was beginning to take control of that fight before the cut stoppage.

i would say that kermit cintron is tailor made for margarito, but not cotto. look at margaritos face and tell me that cotto is tailor made for him.
Imperius3
Cotto might have left a piece of himself in the ring the other night, but I will reserve judgment until I see him fight again. He is young, he can recover. Sometimes a loss can do good things to a fighter.
King Eugene
QUOTE(neophyte7 @ Jul 28 2008, 10:09 AM) [snapback]397663[/snapback]
Cotto is finished... PR has to look for another ICON to worship... Margarito is a natural middle who lost to Daniel Santos at 154 and came back to 147 to beat on smaller welters--- Cotto tailor made for him



He is far from finished...its just one lost.
BrutalBodyShots
I think a good reference for what may happen to Cotto is to look at Fernando Vargas following the Trinidad beating. In my estimation both Cotto and Vargas took similar punishment from their opponents on those nights, although Vargas was concussed more to the head and Cotto beaten more to the body as a whole they took about the same damage over about the same time span of 30-35 minutes. I wouldn't be surprised to see Cotto's resiliency and ability to take shots greatly diminish following the Margarito loss the same way Vargas wasn't able to.

For a more recent reference, I'd look at Calzaghe/Lacy. Again, a long sustained beating; only that Lacy actually finished the fight on his feet. However, Lacy too lost a piece of that hunger/desire that he possessed pre-Calzaghe and he hasn't been the same since.

FenderDG3
QUOTE(BrutalBodyShots @ Jul 28 2008, 07:32 PM) [snapback]397755[/snapback]
I think a good reference for what may happen to Cotto is to look at Fernando Vargas following the Trinidad beating. In my estimation both Cotto and Vargas took similar punishment from their opponents on those nights, although Vargas was concussed more to the head and Cotto beaten more to the body as a whole they took about the same damage over about the same time span of 30-35 minutes. I wouldn't be surprised to see Cotto's resiliency and ability to take shots greatly diminish following the Margarito loss the same way Vargas wasn't able to.

For a more recent reference, I'd look at Calzaghe/Lacy. Again, a long sustained beating; only that Lacy actually finished the fight on his feet. However, Lacy too lost a piece of that hunger/desire that he possessed pre-Calzaghe and he hasn't been the same since.


Brutal, you make some great points. I would like to expand upon them a little bit if I may. I hope we don't have a Castillo/Corrales situation here. I really feel that both of those fighters left a lot of themselves in the ring their first fight, and weren't the same fighters after that fight.
woooooo
After Clottey takes care of Judah once and FOR ALL, I'd pick Clottey over Margarito even after this fight.

Williams and Margarito is still a toss up.
BrutalBodyShots
QUOTE(FenderDG3 @ Jul 28 2008, 08:47 PM) [snapback]397758[/snapback]
Brutal, you make some great points. I would like to expand upon them a little bit if I may. I hope we don't have a Castillo/Corrales situation here. I really feel that both of those fighters left a lot of themselves in the ring their first fight, and weren't the same fighters after that fight.


I agree. What amazes me about Margarito though is that he never appears to be hurt in the ring. It seems almost impossible to even stun the guy, be it to the head or body. Castillo and Corrales both showed signs of being badly hurt in their first fight. Trinidad and Vargas were both hurt in their fight, etc. It amazes me that in such a brutal fight like Margarito/Cotto that one man never even seemed phased by the punching of the other. Eventually of course it WILL catch up to Margarito, but until I actually see him show signs of being hurt in the ring I have no reason to assume that he will indeed be more susceptible to being hurt in the ring based on this fight. He may just be one of those guys genetically that just has extreme resiliency.



FenderDG3
QUOTE(BrutalBodyShots @ Jul 28 2008, 08:53 PM) [snapback]397768[/snapback]
I agree. What amazes me about Margarito though is that he never appears to be hurt in the ring. It seems almost impossible to even stun the guy, be it to the head or body. Castillo and Corrales both showed signs of being badly hurt in their first fight. Trinidad and Vargas were both hurt in their fight, etc. It amazes me that in such a brutal fight like Margarito/Cotto that one man never even seemed phased by the punching of the other. Eventually of course it WILL catch up to Margarito, but until I actually see him show signs of being hurt in the ring I have no reason to assume that he will indeed be more susceptible to being hurt in the ring based on this fight. He may just be one of those guys genetically that just has extreme resiliency.


It really was unreal wasn't it?? That's one thing that is undeniable about Margarito and that is his granite chin.
woooooo
Margarito has been hurt badly before against Santos and rocked a couple times against Clottey.

He does have a very good chin, but I think granite is a bit much.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=xlnU-4qnHx4
Big Slim Sweet
Physically I think with some rest Cotto should be alright. Six-nine months off and I think he can come back strong once again. He took a beating, but I wouldn't compare it to the ones Corrales and Castillo administered to each other. More than anything he simply just got worn down and had the fight beat out of him, which leads me to agree though that mentally he'll be a question mark. Taking a knee will be tough for him to live with. He's going to have to remake himself in his own mind. Maybe he'll be able to do that, maybe he won't. I hope he can.
D-MARV
QUOTE(woooooo @ Jul 28 2008, 11:51 PM) [snapback]397794[/snapback]
Margarito has been hurt badly before against Santos and rocked a couple times against Clottey.

He does have a very good chin, but I think granite is a bit much.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=xlnU-4qnHx4

F*Ck that! Tony was shaken not badly hurt!!!!!

That punch would have knocked alot of people out! Santos was like 175 pounds for that fight as well.
Tony's chin is Granite!!!!!! Ask Cotto, Cintron, Williams and Clottey!


LOL, You gotta love the irony here... Last week Im trashing this guy, this week Im backing him up. Wow, what a difference a fight can make!
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE(damarvelous1 @ Jul 28 2008, 11:57 PM) [snapback]397798[/snapback]
F*Ck that! Tony was shaken not badly hurt!!!!!

That punch would have knocked alot of people out! Santos was like 175 pounds for that fight as well.
Tony's chin is Granite!!!!!! Ask Cotto, Cintron, Williams and Clottey!
LOL, You gotta love the irony here... Last week Im trashing this guy, this week Im backing him up. Wow, what a difference a fight can make!



snicker... snicker...
MarzB
Cotto has nothing to be ashamed of. It's not like Jeff Lacy vs. Joe Cal where Lacy was dominated in every single aspect of the fight where he cold question his own talent.

Cotto ran outta gas and feel to Marg's pressure. He did PLENTY of things well. A few tweaks here and there along with renewed confidence that he's went through that and he'll be fine..

kidbazooka1
QUOTE(woooooo @ Jul 28 2008, 11:51 PM) [snapback]397794[/snapback]
Margarito has been hurt badly before against Santos and rocked a couple times against Clottey.

He does have a very good chin, but I think granite is a bit much.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=xlnU-4qnHx4


Santos can crack and with the weight advantage like mentioned he owuld have KO'ed many fighters with that shot if anything Margarito actually showed how tough his chin is by not going down.

fighters improve and I think Marga learn alot from the PW fight I think beats both of em' now.
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE(kidbazooka1 @ Jul 29 2008, 01:19 AM) [snapback]397813[/snapback]
Santos can crack and with the weight advantage like mentioned he owuld have KO'ed many fighters with that shot if anything Margarito actually showed how tough his chin is by not going down.

fighters improve and I think Marga learn alot from the PW fight I think beats both of em' now.



Cant watch Youtube, rt now. If memory serves, wasnt that shot from Santos right behind the ear?? If so, then most men probably would have fallen from that shot. He recovered and returned the favor. It was a very competitive match. I'll say that Margarito was walking Santos down toward the end. Plus, SANTOS IS NO SLOUCH... I keep reading things like Cotto lost to a guy that lost to Daniel Santos. Santos aint bad. He's at least a 2 or 3 time title holder. He's got pretty decent credentials as a fighter.
BigG
QUOTE(salvador @ Jul 28 2008, 02:45 AM) [snapback]397602[/snapback]
I've watched the last 2 rounds of this fight enough times today to say without a shadow of a doubt that Cotto WILL BE A LESSER FIGHTER GOING FORWARD. There's no way he's ever going to have the confidence he had before Margarito. And without that confidence, Cotto will never be Cotto again. It's very very sad, but undeniable.


Salvador, I disagree. Hearns lost similarly to Cotto and took a bad beating vs Sugar Ray in the final few rounds of the fight and was stopped. He came back stronger and won several titles.

Now on the other hand this was also similar to the type of beating Meldrick Taylor took vs. Julio Cesar Chavez too and Meldrick might have been damaged goods after that fight (fighting Terrible Terry didn't help either).

We'll just have to wait and see. I say put Cotto in with a top 10 Welterweight. Kermit Cintron maybe?
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE(biggeorge89 @ Jul 29 2008, 05:38 AM) [snapback]397847[/snapback]
Salvador, I disagree. Hearns lost similarly to Cotto and took a bad beating vs Sugar Ray in the final few rounds of the fight and was stopped. He came back stronger and won several titles.

Now on the other hand this was also similar to the type of beating Meldrick Taylor took vs. Julio Cesar Chavez too and Meldrick might have been damaged goods after that fight (fighting Terrible Terry didn't help either).

We'll just have to wait and see. I say put Cotto in with a top 10 Welterweight. Kermit Cintron maybe?



Cintron would be a bad matchup for him in a comeback fight. Not saying that its not a winnable fight, but Cintron can hit. Cotto has been in some wars over the last year and a half. He could use a light touch, confidence builder. Maybe Luis Collazo or David Estrada or someone that he can probably get outta there, that doesnt pose too much risk.
Douchebag
I was letting the fight replay in my head and I am convinced that there is no way that Cotto can beat Tony. Eventhough I believe he can win a decision against him there is no way for Cotto to actually beat him. I'll clarify.................If Cotto would have tied up more he could have outpointed Marg fairly easily IMO but that has never been Cotto's style so he didn't do so. But for him to actually beat Tony he would have to go the body and the reason that I think that he didn't is because he was worried about Tony's uppercuts. That is why think Cotto was such a head hunter last saturday. He did effectively neutralize Tony's uppercuts with movement and his own uppercuts but negated his biggest strength which is the body attack. Personally I think Cotto should never try to fight Tony again he should just chalk up that loss and keep it moving he can still come back but he should stay away from AM all together.
salvador
QUOTE(The Original MrFactor @ Jul 29 2008, 05:45 AM) [snapback]397848[/snapback]
Cintron would be a bad matchup for him in a comeback fight. Not saying that its not a winnable fight, but Cintron can hit. Cotto has been in some wars over the last year and a half. He could use a light touch, confidence builder. Maybe Luis Collazo or David Estrada or someone that he can probably get outta there, that doesnt pose too much risk.


I totally agree. Cintron would be a terrible choice because of his power.

After watching Margarito take all those shots from Cotto, it makes you wonder why Cintron wanted the rematch with Margarito. Margarito might be the only guy in the division who can take his punch. It would almost be sad if Kermit didn't get a shot at one of the smaller wws like Judah or Mosley.

BigG
Cintron is amateurish compared to Cotto. Cotto would beat him down. Cintron is big and punches hard but did you see him against Felciano?

He doesn't have the chin or heart of Margarito. I think this would be easy work for Cotto.
Douchebag
QUOTE(biggeorge89 @ Jul 29 2008, 09:56 AM) [snapback]397862[/snapback]
Cintron is amateurish compared to Cotto. Cotto would beat him down.



I agree. I think Cotto would end up breaking Kermit down. Cotto has always been good at defending the overhand right which is Kermits best punch.
salvador
QUOTE(biggeorge89 @ Jul 29 2008, 09:56 AM) [snapback]397862[/snapback]
Cintron is amateurish compared to Cotto. Cotto would beat him down.


He may be amateurish, but he's 5'11" with a 74 inch reach compared with Cotto's 5'7" frame and 67" reach. On top of that, Cintron might be the hardest puncher in the division. Cotto's chin, and more importantly, his confidence, were shattered on Saturday. If he starts doubting himself against a big guy with a long reach advantage and ko power, Cotto might fold.

Cotto needs to fight skilled guys at the smaller end of the ww spectrum - someone like a Malignaggi.

The more I think about it, the more I think Cotto needs a very very long vacation - at least a year.
BigG
Man Salvador, I have to be honest, I think your putting way to much on Cotto's "broken" confidence when in fact we haven't seen him since him fight yet.

Cintron was beat much worse than Cotto was against Margarito BOTH times. Cotto is VERY professional and I believe he will come back stronger.

The only that would fold in a Cotto-Cintron fight is Cintron when he finds out the guy in front of him is more superior than him.
salvador
QUOTE(biggeorge89 @ Jul 29 2008, 10:12 AM) [snapback]397865[/snapback]
Man Salvador, I have to be honest, I think your putting way to much on Cotto's "broken" confidence when in fact we haven't seen him since him fight yet.

Cintron was beat much worse than Cotto was against Margarito BOTH times. Cotto is VERY professional and I believe he will come back stronger.


I don't think it has anything to do with professionalism. I think it has to do with the fact that Cotto was semi-concussed for that entire 11th round after taking an uppercut at the end of the 10th. When your chin takes those kinds of punches, it's never the same again. Combine that fact - that will be in Cotto's mind forever - with the fact that Cotto landed his Sunday punch against Margarito 20 or 30 times each round and never hurt the bigger man. That's got to be a life changing experience for a guy like Cotto, a guy who relies entirely on his will and fortitude. The ww division is filled with bigger men, and I just can't see Cotto walking into a ring with a guy like Margarito, Williams, Clottey, or even Cintron KNOWING that he was going to blow them out. Those days are over for Miguel. Between the fact that he'll be protecting his chin more and the fact that his confidence has been damaged, he'll be a lesser fighter going forward. I just can't see it any other way.

I've been wrestling with the Vargas comparison, which I admit is too extreme because he fought for 10 entire rounds semi-concussed after the first round with Tito, but I think it is ballpark comparable. Vargas should NEVER have been allowed to continue after the 2nd knockdown in the first round. (I'm, of course, glad he did because it was an all time heroic performance, but it was career ending.) And I don't feel Cotto should have been allowed to come out for the 11th. Cotto spent 2 minutes completely defenseless against a much bigger, stronger man who was literally pounding him into submission. And I would even argue that the fact that Margarito never landed the absolute "lights out" punch was actually worse for Cotto. Cotto was too brave and too strong and those punches kept coming. And the fact that Cotto was able to get up and walk away from the punishment - the fact that he was literally beaten into submission but not ko'd, can't be underestimated in it's psychological damage to a fighter who relies almost entirely on the strength of his will.

And Cintron was never beat worse than Cotto. Cintron quit both times before the real physical damage set in. Psychologically, Cintron was destroyed and that was obvious with his body language in the second round of his second fight with Margarito. But Cintron never sustained the chin altering damage that Cotto did.

salvador
somehow this post got here when I was leaving it on another thread. Oddly I haven't been able to edit it. ........Well, now I have.
Douchebag
QUOTE(salvador @ Jul 29 2008, 10:35 AM) [snapback]397866[/snapback]
I don't think it has anything to do with professionalism. I think it has to do with the fact that Cotto was semi-concussed for that entire 11th round after taking an uppercut at the end of the 10th. When your chin takes those kinds of punches, it's never the same again. Combine that fact - that will be in Cotto's mind forever - with the fact that Cotto landed his Sunday punch against Margarito 20 or 30 times each round and never hurt the bigger man. That's got to be a life changing experience for a guy like Cotto, a guy who relies entirely on his will and fortitude. The ww division is filled with bigger men, and I just can't see Cotto walking into a ring with a guy like Margarito, Williams, Clottey, or even Cintron KNOWING that he was going to blow them out. Those days are over for Miguel. Between the fact that he'll be protecting his chin more and the fact that his confidence has been damaged, he'll be a lesser fighter going forward. I just can't see it any other way.

I've been wrestling with the Vargas comparison, which I admit is too extreme because he fought for 10 entire rounds semi-concussed after the first round with Tito, but I think it is ballpark comparable. Vargas should NEVER have been allowed to continue after the 2nd knockdown in the first round. (I'm, of course, glad he did because it was an all time heroic performance, but it was career ending.) And I don't feel Cotto should have been allowed to come out for the 11th. Cotto spent 2 minutes completely defenseless against a much bigger, stronger man who was literally pounding him into submission. And I would even argue that the fact that Margarito never landed the absolute "lights out" punch was actually worse for Cotto. Cotto was too brave and too strong and those punches kept coming. And the fact that Cotto was able to get up and walk away from the punishment - the fact that he was literally beaten into submission but not ko'd, can't be underestimated in it's psychological damage to a fighter who relies almost entirely on the strength of his will.

And Cintron was never beat worse than Cotto. Cintron quit both times before the real physical damage set in. Psychologically, Cintron was destroyed and that was obvious with his body language in the second round of his second fight with Margarito. But Cintron never sustained the chin altering damage that Cotto did.


The Jury is still out on whether Cotto will be same or not. The fact of the matter is this Cotto had the presence of mind to take a knee even with Marg all over him like a wet tee-shirt and he walked out of the ring by his own power and was giving people hi-fives and shit on the way to the dressing room. He definitely took of beating on Sat but it could have been much worst (which is very scary). You make it seem like Cotto got caried out on a stretcher and is on life support as we speak. I know Tony is your boy but the fanboyism is getting disgusting Sal.
salvador
QUOTE(The Conscience @ Jul 29 2008, 11:25 AM) [snapback]397874[/snapback]
I know Tony is your boy but the fanboyism is getting disgusting Sal.


I love Cotto (definitely one of my top 5 fighters) and I hope he comes back stronger. I'd love to see him KO Williams or even Margarito. That would be great great drama. I just can't see it happening because I don't believe he'll ever walk into the ring again against a bigger man like Marg or Williams and KNOW he's gonna win. If Cotto doesn't have the confidence to KNOW he can beat those bigger guys, he won't have a chance. I hope I'm wrong.

D-MARV
Cotto should wait until Margarito and Cotto move up before he tries to take the throne back!
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