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salvador
After years of having to answer the most repetitive (and boring) question on this board: "Who has Tony beaten that would earn him a shot at the great Floyd Mayweather?" I will ask 4 in return:

1.) Can anyone name a single fight in which Floyd Mayweather destroyed an opponent the caliber of Miguel Cotto in the fashion that Margarito destroyed Cotto?

2.) Would Floyd have even pretended to try to ko Cotto?

3.) Is there ANY chance that Floyd could hurt Tony, even with his very best shot?

4.) Is there any chance that Floyd isn't totally aware of the fact that, right now, the single best way he could solidify his legacy would be to ko Margarito?



Floyd's been ducking Margarito from the beginning, and now everyone on the planet knows why. Thank the Lord!

BigG
1) Maybe a prime Corrales at 130? I don't know...Floyd doesnt really destroy opponents...he outboxes them. I dont think hes ever beaten anyone the caliber of Cotto but you MUST give him respect because he actually moves up in weight to beat good-great fighters like Castillo, Corrales, DLH, Judah, Hatton, etc.

2) No because Floyd is a boxer and thats not his style. If the KO comes it comes..he doesnt go looking for it. Come on sal...

3) No if Cotto couldnt then Floyd cant but can he outbox Marg yes.

4) How is Floyd going to KO Margarito?

I think people should remember that Floyd STARTED at 130 and is not even really a real WW. Margarito and Cotto are naturally much bigger than him
kidbazooka1
Margarito reminds me of a bigger and stronegr version of a prime Castillo and we all know how the 1st fight played out.

Margarito's strengh and pressure would be too much for lil Floyd.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE(salvador @ Jul 28 2008, 03:27 AM) [snapback]397606[/snapback]
After years of having to answer the most repetitive (and boring) question on this board: "Who has Tony beaten that would earn him a shot at the great Floyd Mayweather?" I will ask 4 in return:

1.) Can anyone name a single fight in which Floyd Mayweather destroyed an opponent the caliber of Miguel Cotto in the fashion that Margarito destroyed Cotto?

2.) Would Floyd have even pretended to try to ko Cotto?

3.) Is there ANY chance that Floyd could hurt Tony, even with his very best shot?

4.) Is there any chance that Floyd isn't totally aware of the fact that, right now, the single best way he could solidify his legacy would be to ko Margarito?
Floyd's been ducking Margarito from the beginning, and now everyone on the planet knows why. Thank the Lord!


1) Corrales possibly but it was his speed moreso than his power that kept dropping Diego.

2) Pretended yes in the leadup to the fight & then once the bell rang he would run, jab & grab.

3) Yes anyone can get hurt by a single punch. It the timing & placement is right that is.

4) No. Floyd was always concerned about fighting a guy with the rangy build & stamina that Margs has. He could win but it would not be pretty & would have always been a dangerous fight for PBF to take.
The Original MrFactor
DLH is as close as it gets at WW. I'll say this, DLH doesnt beat the top 5 WW's. Cotto, Clottey, Williams, Mosley adn Margarito would all beat DLH . Even Judah/DLH is a close competitive fight.

If you are looking through Mayweather's career. I'd say his career best win was against Corrales. Corrales was a monster before Floyd beat him. He was the Paul Williams of 130. Floyd destroyed him. I'll also say that he was on his way to KO'ing Judah, had the crazies not come out of their corners.
JonnyBlaze
Floyd would be able to beat anyone from 154 and down..I hate to say it,but it's true..His skill says it all..If you look back in history,the boxers always were the greatest..Ali and Ray Robinson are two of the best fighters of all time,with Ray Robinson being the best..Floyd is no where near Ray Robinson,but he has skill that is extra ordinary like Roy Jones had for a long time..Being able to not get hit clean ever,to have insane hand speed,to be mentally strong,and always know what punch to throw in every situation can make anyone great..He didn't have punching power,but thats just icing on the cake if you have it..I am not defending Mayweather since I don't like him personally,but I know boxing and am a student of boxing..You gotta appreciate his skills..
JonnyBlaze
Also,Corrales was always a monster..Before and after the Floyd fight..
King Eugene
lol this is ridiculous. I'm not a cotto or marg fan but hell let them live out the glory of a great fight without always bringing up mayweather.

mayweather is not a knockout artist, he is a boxer and will out box anybody he steps in the ring with. cotto is smart but everybody knows weather they want to admit it or not that mayweather is a smarter, more skilled and more conditioned fighter.

by no means am I saying cotto and marg aren't good fighters but I don't think they are as good as everybody is making them out to be. mayweather isn't the greastest but he was better than them two when he was a boxer. hell marg is a dang jr. middleweight fighting at WW and cotto is a natural JWW cause he was struggling to make weight.

mayweather came up from 130 to 154 taking belts by out boxing and not going in face first slugging it out like a dummy shortening his career cause of the head trauma.

just give the man credit that's all I ask. as for marg I wish him the best at getting a big money fight first before taking too big of a risk trying to satisfy fans who won't give a heck about him after he lose. get your money while its out there. he's fought everybody on the tough road to get where he is now. he deserves a big payday. admit it or not arum will take care of him and put some money in his pocket. I just hope to God it aint with Judah (unless he wins impressively sat.) cause I dnt think he can take what cotto took. then again it may have just been margs night and he may never perform like that again. every dog has his day. I still want to see a rematch! if I seen my son and wife cry like that I'd be begging for a rematch!
Jack 1000
All I can think of would be a prime Castillo or a prime Corrales.

Jack
salvador
QUOTE(biggeorge89 @ Jul 27 2008, 11:36 PM) [snapback]397608[/snapback]
I think people should remember that Floyd STARTED at 130 and is not even really a real WW. Margarito and Cotto are naturally much bigger than him


My point is that the question of who had Tony faced was rediculous in the first place because nobody would fight him, but explaining that simple truth around here has been an uphill battle to say the least. Now that Margarito has destroyed a man who Floyd would have been lucky (satisfied) to get a narrow decision over, I think it's safe to say that Margarito was worthy all the time and that FLOYD KNEW IT! And now everyone here who's been asking that tired question over the years can think of new reasons for Floyd to duck Margarito. (Because we know for damn sure that Money May's not done yet.) The question of Tony's worthiness to fight Floyd is now put to rest.

Floyd ducked Margarito because Margarito was way too big for him, threw too many punches, and could take his best shot all day and all night. Margarito is clearly a natural mw and that might be reason enough for Floyd to duck him. But regardless of where Floyd started, he's always claimed that he was the best at 154 down. And I can't think of anyone on Floyd's resume (p4p) who would have been competitive with Cotto for 12 rounds, much less destroyed him, with the possible exception of DLH.

The truth is that a Floyd-Margarito fight would probably be boring, with Floyd insisting on a football field sized ring and with Tony chasing him around all night and catching the occasional potshot.

salvador
QUOTE(Fitz @ Jul 28 2008, 01:05 AM) [snapback]397619[/snapback]
WTF. You want Mayweather to KO Margarito? Unbelievable dude.

Another situation where people are putting power over everything. lol. If he doesn't KO, he is not worth it. Haha.


No, what I want you and everyone here to admit is that Floyd was, in fact, ducking Margarito because Floyd knew Margarito was too big and too strong for him.

And even if everyone on this board thought Marg was a joke and an amateur, FLOYD DIDN'T. Floyd knew Margarito was formidable, and yet Floyd belittled Marg's accomplishments as an excuse to duck him.

Floyd is too small for Tony. And even though Floyd is clearly the fastest and most skilled fighter in the sport, Marg's size, strenth, power, and chin put the fear of God into Floyd and that's why Floyd never fought him.

As long as you recognize that simple truth, that Floyd was ducking Marg, I couldn't care less whether or not Floyd would even try to ko Marg. Because we know the truth on that, which is that if Floyd wasn't even going to try to ko a slow 35 year old with no head movement and only 13kos in 58 fights (with most of those kos coming against Argentinian club fighters), then obviously Floyd wouldn't even pretend to try and hurt Tony.

Floyd was scared of Tony and that's why the fight never happened!!!!!!!!!! Just admit it! thumbsup_anim.gif
neophyte7
Just because Cotto got his slow ass kicked people want to trash Mayweather. Bottom line- Cotto is not elusive.. LOL from some of the clips I saw it looked like he was trying to emulate mayweather against the ropes..... NEWS FLASH: THE PUNCHES THAT MARGARITO LANDED ON COTTO WOULD NOT LAND ON PBF

MAGARITO HAS NOT BEEN DUCKED-- clottey fought him and handled him before he broke his hand Paul williams beat him and now Cotto fought him. He lost to Santos--- styles make fights and Cotto was tailor made for Maragarito who would beat Cotto 8/10 times if they fought. Mayweather would study Tony's slow ass and outpoint him. If Clottey was handling hime rather easily- PBF will do the same. Don't over or underestimate size---

How many times prior to Margarito beating his ass had we seen Cotto in trouble in a fight? Corley should have KO'd him... Nuff said... The Cotto elusion is now over... Clottey and Margarito should rematch- if they do Margarito will no longer be champion-- Cotto was tailor made for Margarito- slow afoot, easy to hit- poor defense--- his only hope is to employ MAYWEATHER SR TO TEACH HIS ASS SOME DEFENSE-- LOL
BigG
For the record Sal, I do believe Floyd chose the path of high reward/low risk with Baldomir. Hey, he got 8 million dollars for the Baldo fight as well and picked up the WBC/lineal Welterweight title and he did by fighting a much easier fighter to beat. Everyone knew Margarito was a tougher fight than Baldo and Floyd certainly did.

There was a time when Floyd seeked out the best challenges IMO and that was before he was the megastar he was today. When he was champ at 130-135....Corrales, Castillo 2x, Chavez, Hernandez, etc.

Since beating Gatti it has been about the biggest money fights for Floyd...I think the only reason he moved up in the first place was to fight DLH wasn't it? But lets be real alot of people on this board thought DLH would beat Floyd...alot of knowledgeable posters predicted DLH would win a close decision..some even stoppage. So lets give credit where credit is due..he moved up to 154 and beat a bigger, quick, high skilled very good fighter to win the WBC title. Thats a great win..even if you thought the fight sucked.

Hatton was undefeated, had just looked good beating Castillo a few months before the Mayweather fight and Hatton is somewhat of a draw...plus Hatton is a smallish Welterweight like Floyd so Floyd could do whatever he wanted to him. And he got a big payday. Is Hatton in the league of Cotto or Margarito at WW..no...

So you think Mayweather would beat the natural middleweight as you say Margarito in a boring fight Salvador
neophyte7
Just because Cotto got his slow ass kicked people want to trash Mayweather. Bottom line- Cotto is not elusive.. LOL from some of the clips I saw it looked like he was trying to emulate mayweather against the ropes..... NEWS FLASH: THE PUNCHES THAT MARGARITO LANDED ON COTTO WOULD NOT LAND ON PBF

MAGARITO HAS NOT BEEN DUCKED-- clottey fought him and handled him before he broke his hand Paul williams beat him and now Cotto fought him. He lost to Santos--- styles make fights and Cotto was tailor made for Maragarito who would beat Cotto 8/10 times if they fought. Mayweather would study Tony's slow ass and outpoint him. If Clottey was handling hime rather easily- PBF will do the same. Don't over or underestimate size---

How many times prior to Margarito beating his ass had we seen Cotto in trouble in a fight? Corley should have KO'd him... Nuff said... The Cotto elusion is now over... Clottey and Margarito should rematch- if they do Margarito will no longer be champion-- Cotto was tailor made for Margarito- slow afoot, easy to hit- poor defense--- his only hope is to employ MAYWEATHER SR TO TEACH HIS ASS SOME DEFENSE-- LOL
torvix2000
QUOTE(salvador @ Jul 28 2008, 12:31 PM) [snapback]397644[/snapback]
My point is that the question of who had Tony faced was ridiculous in the first place because nobody would fight him, but explaining that simple truth around here has been an uphill battle to say the least.


Yeah. I still remember how some posters here were saying that Margarito was being avoided. Well, we now know why.
torvix2000
And when excellent fighters get avoided, they tend to get lazy and even lose interest. They lose. Against some other top fighters, their fighting abilities get showcased big time.
salvador
George,

I'd pick Floyd over Tony by decision all day, but I'd also bet all the tea in China that Floyd would get more roughed up in 12 rounds with Tony than he has been in his entire career combined.

Mostly, I think Floyd knew that he'd never be able to hurt Tony, that if they fought Floyd would be booed from the opening bell to the final bell for running, and that Floyd's body would take a pounding. Floyd wanted no part of that and so he told everyone that Margarito was a nobody - AND EVERYONE ON THIS BOARD BOUGHT IT! Everyone on this board was so full of excuses for Floyd that it was sickening.

And my ultimate point is that if (when) Floyd comes back, Tony HAS to be on the top of his dance card (after one more snoozefest with DLH). If Floyd fights ANYONE other than Williams or Margarito, then we'll know what a liar and a Fraud Floyd was being when he kept pointing out how worthless a fighter Tony was. Floyd knew the truth (just like Mosley and Judah knew the truth), and the truth was that he wanted no part of Tony. It was always obvious to me and I never understood why it wasn't obvious to everyone here. Now it should be obvious to all!
neophyte7
Styles make fights... Cotto is easy to hit and not elusive-- easy fight for Maragarito--- boxing is superior to the style that Maragarito brings into the ring. Margarito showed nothing new or different- you had two face fighters with no defense in there going at it--- looks good for those who thirst slugging action- and despite being booed- Floyd would outpoint Tony-- as far as Floy'd body taking a beating to the body LOL-- ease up--- hitting slow ass no defense Cotto in the body is quite different from hitting Mayweather to the body-- let us see what Margarito's next move is-- The Cotto victory does not make him any different a fighter- he is still too slow for Mayweather--
salvador
QUOTE(neophyte7 @ Jul 28 2008, 09:57 AM) [snapback]397659[/snapback]
Styles make fights... Cotto is easy to hit and not elusive-- easy fight for Maragarito--- boxing is superior to the style that Maragarito brings into the ring. Margarito showed nothing new or different- you had two face fighters with no defense in there going at it--- looks good for those who thirst slugging action- and despite being booed- Floyd would outpoint Tony-- as far as Floy'd body taking a beating to the body LOL-- ease up--- hitting slow ass no defense Cotto in the body is quite different from hitting Mayweather to the body-- let us see what Margarito's next move is-- The Cotto victory does not make him any different a fighter- he is still too slow for Mayweather--


Marg's too slow for Floyd, and Floyd's too small for Tony.

At the end of the day, Floyd ducked Tony for a reason. You can argue who would win all day, but to say that Floyd did anything other than SHAMELESSLY DUCK MARGARITO is rediculous.

The reason Tony beat Cotto is because Cotto was way too small for him, and Floyd is smaller than Cotto. You do the math.
neophyte7
Your mathematical calculations factor size in too much--- Floyd has been the smaller many times--- as a matter of Fact Cotto is two inches shorter than Floyd who was at 147 before Cotto moved up-- Margarito is a face fighter dude who has lost to less skilled fighters than Mayweather.
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE(neophyte7 @ Jul 28 2008, 09:57 AM) [snapback]397659[/snapback]
Styles make fights... Cotto is easy to hit and not elusive-- easy fight for Maragarito--- boxing is superior to the style that Maragarito brings into the ring. Margarito showed nothing new or different- you had two face fighters with no defense in there going at it--- looks good for those who thirst slugging action- and despite being booed- Floyd would outpoint Tony-- as far as Floy'd body taking a beating to the body LOL-- ease up--- hitting slow ass no defense Cotto in the body is quite different from hitting Mayweather to the body-- let us see what Margarito's next move is-- The Cotto victory does not make him any different a fighter- he is still too slow for Mayweather--


You must have just started watching boxing yesterday. Cotto had excellent movement on Saturday nite. Cotto is pretty good defensively. He boxed superbly. The reason many say his defense is flawed at times is because he sacrifices defense in order to hammer opponents with blistering bodyshots. On Saturday, he was faced with a guy who he couldnt afford to stand and trade with, so he was on his bike for most of the fight. He was boxing Margarito's ears off.

I'd expect a Mayweather fight to look similar. Cotto had to put himself in harms way in order to just hit Margarito. At times he paid because Tony would time and nail him with bodyshots. Lampley and crew seemed to always miss the fact that Cotto would throw a 3 or 4 punch combo and dash out. Many times on his way out he'd get caught with a bodyshot. In the 2nd round he really got nailed and couldnt get out. He was stuck on the ropes and nailed repeatedly.

Mayweather would have the same problems. He's smallish and would have to put himself in harms way to hit Tony. If he gets trapped against the ropes, which is inevitable he too will get nailed. Body shots slow a guy down. He cant run when he's taking 20 bodyshot per round. I'd easily pick Tony to stop Mayweather and a decision over Mayweather is also not completely out of the question...
Mean Mister Mustard
QUOTE(The Original MrFactor @ Jul 28 2008, 11:24 AM) [snapback]397675[/snapback]
You must have just started watching boxing yesterday. Cotto had excellent movement on Saturday nite. Cotto is pretty good defensively. He boxed superbly. The reason many say his defense is flawed at times is because he sacrifices defense in order to hammer opponents with blistering bodyshots. On Saturday, he was faced with a guy who he couldnt afford to stand and trade with, so he was on his bike for most of the fight. He was boxing Margarito's ears off.

I'd expect a Mayweather fight to look similar. Cotto had to put himself in harms way in order to just hit Margarito. At times he paid because Tony would time and nail him with bodyshots. Lampley and crew seemed to always miss the fact that Cotto would throw a 3 or 4 punch combo and dash out. Many times on his way out he'd get caught with a bodyshot. In the 2nd round he really got nailed and couldnt get out. He was stuck on the ropes and nailed repeatedly.

Mayweather would have the same problems. He's smallish and would have to put himself in harms way to hit Tony. If he gets trapped against the ropes, which is inevitable he too will get nailed. Body shots slow a guy down. He cant run when he's taking 20 bodyshot per round. I'd easily pick Tony to stop Mayweather and a decision over Mayweather is also not completely out of the question...


Looks like he didn't even watch the fight.

QUOTE
Just because Cotto got his slow ass kicked people want to trash Mayweather. Bottom line- Cotto is not elusive.. LOL from some of the clips I saw it looked like he was trying to emulate mayweather against the ropes...
Chi-Town
Floyd's issue isn't that he never fought top fighters, its that he hasn't fought the top fighters since becoming aq mainstream celebrity. At 130 and 135 he beat the best fighters in the world.
Sugar Q
QUOTE(The Original MrFactor @ Jul 28 2008, 11:24 AM) [snapback]397675[/snapback]
You must have just started watching boxing yesterday. Cotto had excellent movement on Saturday nite. Cotto is pretty good defensively. He boxed superbly. The reason many say his defense is flawed at times is because he sacrifices defense in order to hammer opponents with blistering bodyshots. On Saturday, he was faced with a guy who he couldnt afford to stand and trade with, so he was on his bike for most of the fight. He was boxing Margarito's ears off.

I'd expect a Mayweather fight to look similar. Cotto had to put himself in harms way in order to just hit Margarito. At times he paid because Tony would time and nail him with bodyshots. Lampley and crew seemed to always miss the fact that Cotto would throw a 3 or 4 punch combo and dash out. Many times on his way out he'd get caught with a bodyshot. In the 2nd round he really got nailed and couldnt get out. He was stuck on the ropes and nailed repeatedly.

Mayweather would have the same problems. He's smallish and would have to put himself in harms way to hit Tony. If he gets trapped against the ropes, which is inevitable he too will get nailed. Body shots slow a guy down. He cant run when he's taking 20 bodyshot per round. I'd easily pick Tony to stop Mayweather and a decision over Mayweather is also not completely out of the question...



The HUGE difference between Cotto and PBF is:
1) PBF is the smartest fighter in the game in terms of punch selection and picking battles
2) PBF is the best defensive fighter in the game hands down
3) PBF is the most accurate puncher in the game
4) PBF has FAR greater foot work than Cotto
5) PBF's rope game is nuts. Dude is a master on the ropes and against a slow, wide swinging opponent he would look like a wizard.

Notice how none of those body shots or uppercuts worked against Santos, Williams or Clottey? Why would we think they would work against the P4P best?
salvador
QUOTE(neophyte7 @ Jul 28 2008, 10:17 AM) [snapback]397666[/snapback]
Your mathematical calculations factor size in too much--- Floyd has been the smaller many times--- as a matter of Fact Cotto is two inches shorter than Floyd who was at 147 before Cotto moved up-- Margarito is a face fighter dude who has lost to less skilled fighters than Mayweather.


Margarito's never lost to anyone smaller than he is. Williams is 6'3" and Santos was 173 pounds when they fought. Even Clottey gets in the ring at around 170. Those are very different sized guys than the small wws like Cotto, Judah, Floyd, Mosley.

I believe Floyd outpoints Marg, but it'll be bloody. But be real, Floyd has NEVER been in the ring with a force like Margarito.

As far as any of the other smaller guys in the division, they don't have the defense, the chins, or the power to keep Marg off them for 12 rounds. They all ducked Marg for a damn good reason. It's the same reason none of them will ever get in the ring with Williams.
Imperius3
QUOTE(salvador @ Jul 28 2008, 08:27 AM) [snapback]397649[/snapback]
No, what I want you and everyone here to admit is that Floyd was, in fact, ducking Margarito because Floyd knew Margarito was too big and too strong for him.

And even if everyone on this board thought Marg was a joke and an amateur, FLOYD DIDN'T. Floyd knew Margarito was formidable, and yet Floyd belittled Marg's accomplishments as an excuse to duck him.

Floyd is too small for Tony. And even though Floyd is clearly the fastest and most skilled fighter in the sport, Marg's size, strenth, power, and chin put the fear of God into Floyd and that's why Floyd never fought him.

As long as you recognize that simple truth, that Floyd was ducking Marg, I couldn't care less whether or not Floyd would even try to ko Marg. Because we know the truth on that, which is that if Floyd wasn't even going to try to ko a slow 35 year old with no head movement and only 13kos in 58 fights (with most of those kos coming against Argentinian club fighters), then obviously Floyd wouldn't even pretend to try and hurt Tony.

Floyd was scared of Tony and that's why the fight never happened!!!!!!!!!! Just admit it! thumbsup_anim.gif


This is disgusting. Time to find a new hobby, sal. This isn't healthy.
salvador
QUOTE(Imperius3 @ Jul 28 2008, 04:32 PM) [snapback]397729[/snapback]
This is disgusting. Time to find a new hobby, sal. This isn't healthy.


The thing is, you have a tendency to get nasty - which is fine when you're right. But you were very wrong about Margarito. You were wrong and you were nasty about it. Again, that's fine. If that's who you are, then be it. But I would have thought that, given the amount of energy you have expended over the years telling me how stupid I've been about this one fighter, you would have had the grace to admit you were wrong - or at least the good sense to stay away from the topic until the excitement over "The greatest ww fight since Leonard-Hearns" blew over. fuck.gif








King Eugene
QUOTE(salvador @ Jul 28 2008, 09:27 AM) [snapback]397649[/snapback]
No, what I want you and everyone here to admit is that Floyd was, in fact, ducking Margarito because Floyd knew Margarito was too big and too strong for him.

And even if everyone on this board thought Marg was a joke and an amateur, FLOYD DIDN'T. Floyd knew Margarito was formidable, and yet Floyd belittled Marg's accomplishments as an excuse to duck him.

Floyd is too small for Tony. And even though Floyd is clearly the fastest and most skilled fighter in the sport, Marg's size, strenth, power, and chin put the fear of God into Floyd and that's why Floyd never fought him.

As long as you recognize that simple truth, that Floyd was ducking Marg, I couldn't care less whether or not Floyd would even try to ko Marg. Because we know the truth on that, which is that if Floyd wasn't even going to try to ko a slow 35 year old with no head movement and only 13kos in 58 fights (with most of those kos coming against Argentinian club fighters), then obviously Floyd wouldn't even pretend to try and hurt Tony.

Floyd was scared of Tony and that's why the fight never happened!!!!!!!!!! Just admit it! thumbsup_anim.gif



Why would Floyd duck or be scared of any fighter with the skills and knowledge he has. I find that way toooooooooo hard to believe. Everybody know Floyd doesnt want to fight you if you dont have a big name and a big draw that will bring big money! Its called prize fighting dude!
hitman harding
Mayweather has proved to everyone that hes a class boxer at many different weight classes (i don't like the guy but he is great boxer). Cotto flew through 140 # straight up to 147 while never really being rated the best in that division by must pundits and ring magerzine. Mayweather could have pressured Tzsyu a bit more for the 140# belts but apart from that his resume is supreme compared to Cotto's and is as good as it can get.
Cotto really looked awful against a tough boxer named N'dou and after his showing on Saturday the verdict is simple. Cotto is a world class boxer but Mayweather is an all time great
Cotto ranks as at top 5 147# and if he could make 140# top 3.
Where next for Cotto time will tell.
BoxingStill#1
QUOTE(neophyte7 @ Jul 28 2008, 09:37 AM) [snapback]397654[/snapback]
Just because Cotto got his slow ass kicked people want to trash Mayweather. Bottom line- Cotto is not elusive.. LOL from some of the clips I saw it looked like he was trying to emulate mayweather against the ropes..... NEWS FLASH: THE PUNCHES THAT MARGARITO LANDED ON COTTO WOULD NOT LAND ON PBF

MAGARITO HAS NOT BEEN DUCKED-- clottey fought him and handled him before he broke his hand Paul williams beat him and now Cotto fought him. He lost to Santos--- styles make fights and Cotto was tailor made for Maragarito who would beat Cotto 8/10 times if they fought. Mayweather would study Tony's slow ass and outpoint him. If Clottey was handling hime rather easily- PBF will do the same. Don't over or underestimate size---

How many times prior to Margarito beating his ass had we seen Cotto in trouble in a fight? Corley should have KO'd him... Nuff said... The Cotto elusion is now over... Clottey and Margarito should rematch- if they do Margarito will no longer be champion-- Cotto was tailor made for Margarito- slow afoot, easy to hit- poor defense--- his only hope is to employ MAYWEATHER SR TO TEACH HIS ASS SOME DEFENSE-- LOL




this thread is getting a bit out of hand......

Cotto took Margarito to school before he got gased.......

PBF would destroy Marg simply because he can out box, land ANY punch when he wants,...

No he cant Knock Marg out.....but if Cotto could land punches and move in 6 rounds.....we all know PBF can do it in 12.....
MarzB
I'm glad there are some sensible post in here. As someone said why does Mayweathers name have to come up? We already have that jilted lover BOB ARUM to do that frequently. Thanks to both fighters for NOT mentioning Floyd.

You can add Hernandez to the fold also. Floyd has been in the ring with guys 168 pounds and has sparred heavyweights. That I know for a fact. So him being in with the indestructible force that Marg has become after Saturdays fight (nevermind that we've seen Marg outclassed before) would be nothing new.

Everything Cotto did well on Saturday Floyd did better. Better defense, better timing, better accuracy, better lateral movement, better combinations when he committed to throwing them, etc, etc. Not to mention Floyd's stamina was better than Cotto's because we've never ONCE seen Floyd tired as we've seen Cotto.

Can't Margarito just have his victory without Floyd being mentioned?? OH about this ducking crap.. For the umpteenth time.

After the JUDAH fight Floyd was trying to set up a bout with Oscar Dela Hoya. Oscar wanted no parts of Arum in that proposed fight. Floyd paid $750K to become a promotional free agent. Arum offers 8 mill to fight Marg for a chensy WBO belt (big deal). Meantime Goosen gives Floyd 8,000,001 dollars PLUS a percentage of the the PPV buys. It equated to $10 million dollars total most importantly WITH NO OPTIONS..

I don't know where you all that keep reciting that crap (He ducked Margarito) went to school but the last time I checked $10 million was more than $8 million.

Floyd could beat King Kong and the "hating" express would say, "it means nothing because he's got to fight Godzilla now".

He's retired (hence my bold on the past tense) let him be. Marg, great victory and a show of will..
BrutalBodyShots
I think both Judah and Hatton would have been pick em fights against Cotto at 140. Cotto at 140 was easier to hurt, and unlike Torres or Corley that don't know the definition of finishing Judah and Hatton would put it on Cotto if they buzzed him at 140. 147 is perfect for Cotto but out of Judah and Hatton's comfort zone which is why either (and one did) would get housed at 147 by him.

STEVENSKI
QUOTE(hitman harding @ Jul 29 2008, 12:56 AM) [snapback]397759[/snapback]
Mayweather could have pressured Tzsyu a bit more for the 140# belts


He could not come close to the $6M offer that Hatton had on the table. On reflection it probably would have been a better fight for Tszyu as he would have smoked PBf of that I have no doubt. Slick fighters never worried Tszyu & Uncle Roger could show PBF how to run for 12 rounds whilst taking a beating just like he did.
MarzB
QUOTE(STEVENSKI @ Jul 28 2008, 09:51 PM) [snapback]397777[/snapback]
He could not come close to the $6M offer that Hatton had on the table. On reflection it probably would have been a better fight for Tszyu as he would have smoked PBf of that I have no doubt. Slick fighters never worried Tszyu & Uncle Roger could show PBF how to run for 12 rounds whilst taking a beating just like he did.


Yeah an older Roger Mayweather and Roger and Floyd Jr fought nothing a like so moving on.

HaydelHammer
QUOTE(biggeorge89 @ Jul 27 2008, 11:36 PM) [snapback]397608[/snapback]
1) Maybe a prime Corrales at 130? I don't know...Floyd doesnt really destroy opponents...he outboxes them. I dont think hes ever beaten anyone the caliber of Cotto but you MUST give him respect because he actually moves up in weight to beat good-great fighters like Castillo, Corrales, DLH, Judah, Hatton, etc.

2) No because Floyd is a boxer and thats not his style. If the KO comes it comes..he doesnt go looking for it. Come on sal...

3) No if Cotto couldnt then Floyd cant but can he outbox Marg yes.

4) How is Floyd going to KO Margarito?

I think people should remember that Floyd STARTED at 130 and is not even really a real WW. Margarito and Cotto are naturally much bigger than him


excellent post!!

They should have locked this entire thread after BIG G laid it down like this!

the floyd cotto debate is non sense...two completely different styles.
King Eugene
QUOTE(BoxingStill#1 @ Jul 28 2008, 10:05 PM) [snapback]397770[/snapback]
this thread is getting a bit out of hand......

Cotto took Margarito to school before he got gased.......

PBF would destroy Marg simply because he can out box, land ANY punch when he wants,...

No he cant Knock Marg out.....but if Cotto could land punches and move in 6 rounds.....we all know PBF can do it in 12.....



I agree 100%
King Eugene
QUOTE(MarzB @ Jul 28 2008, 10:50 PM) [snapback]397775[/snapback]
I'm glad there are some sensible post in here. As someone said why does Mayweathers name have to come up? We already have that jilted lover BOB ARUM to do that frequently. Thanks to both fighters for NOT mentioning Floyd.

You can add Hernandez to the fold also. Floyd has been in the ring with guys 168 pounds and has sparred heavyweights. That I know for a fact. So him being in with the indestructible force that Marg has become after Saturdays fight (nevermind that we've seen Marg outclassed before) would be nothing new.

Everything Cotto did well on Saturday Floyd did better. Better defense, better timing, better accuracy, better lateral movement, better combinations when he committed to throwing them, etc, etc. Not to mention Floyd's stamina was better than Cotto's because we've never ONCE seen Floyd tired as we've seen Cotto.

Can't Margarito just have his victory without Floyd being mentioned?? OH about this ducking crap.. For the umpteenth time.

After the JUDAH fight Floyd was trying to set up a bout with Oscar Dela Hoya. Oscar wanted no parts of Arum in that proposed fight. Floyd paid $750K to become a promotional free agent. Arum offers 8 mill to fight Marg for a chensy WBO belt (big deal). Meantime Goosen gives Floyd 8,000,001 dollars PLUS a percentage of the the PPV buys. It equated to $10 million dollars total most importantly WITH NO OPTIONS..

I don't know where you all that keep reciting that crap (He ducked Margarito) went to school but the last time I checked $10 million was more than $8 million.

Floyd could beat King Kong and the "hating" express would say, "it means nothing because he's got to fight Godzilla now".

He's retired (hence my bold on the past tense) let him be. Marg, great victory and a show of will..



I couldn't have stated that better myself. I swear some people dont understand the meaning of Prize Fighting!
Big Slim Sweet
It wasn't that Floyd simply turned down Margarito for a fight with Baldomir instead. Floyd turned down Margarito with an open PPV date on the table and then for weeks searched high and low looking for someone to replace him with. Baldomir just fell into his lap after he dusted Gatti in a fight most people thought Gatti was going to win. Floyd was talking about Mosley, Spinks, Winky (more bullshit), Cotto... anyone with a resume between 140 and 154 heard their name come out of Floyd's mouth.

The only possible other reason for Floyd being so doggedly determined not to step in the ring with Tony was that he didn't want to work with Arum again. I don't buy it myself.
D-MARV
QUOTE(Big Slim @ Jul 29 2008, 12:09 AM) [snapback]397800[/snapback]
It wasn't that Floyd simply turned down Margarito for a fight with Baldomir instead. Floyd turned down Margarito with an open PPV date on the table and then for weeks searched high and low looking for someone to replace him with. Baldomir just fell into his lap after he dusted Gatti in a fight most people thought Gatti was going to win. Floyd was talking about Mosley, Spinks, Winky (more bullshit), Cotto... anyone with a resume between 140 and 154 heard their name come out of Floyd's mouth.

The only possible other reason for Floyd being so doggedly determined not to step in the ring with Tony was that he didn't want to work with Arum again. I don't buy it myself.

There was more too Mayweather turning down Margarito! The date Arum was throwing around was sometime in July. Mayweather didn't want too fight until November because he hurt his hand in the Judah fight! 8 million was good money for Mayweather but he really didn't want to work with Arum! Besides he got Baldomir for the same price! What's wrong with Smart Money?
And for the record... I stand firm and say Mayweather defeats Margarito in a Boring Lopsided UD!
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE(3King3 @ Jul 28 2008, 08:34 PM) [snapback]397756[/snapback]
Why would Floyd duck or be scared of any fighter with the skills and knowledge he has. I find that way toooooooooo hard to believe. Everybody know Floyd doesnt want to fight you if you dont have a big name and a big draw that will bring big money! Its called prize fighting dude!



Well, if his skills and such are so great that he cant be beaten, then he would have 1 upped Roy jones and fought Wladimir Klitschko... I know thats absurd, but this is what the Mayweather arguement has become.

As proven by this past weekends fight, size matters... Mayweather may have reached his peak in terms of a division where he can reasonably be competitive at his size. I think its obvious that he did not fight the larger WW's because of the risk. Mitchel, Judah, Baldomir were all smallish WW's. DLH was the exception and Floyd just scraped by him. Oscar is well past his prime and just not a hungry fighter anymore. If he got in with one of these hungry, younger, larger WW's, he'd more than have his hands full. Margarito would flat out beat him. If they fight, I'll be here waiting for you naysayers... AGAIN!!!

Its silly to just say mayweather just UD's everybody. I admit he's a gifted boxer, but I will not concede him victories just because he's Floyd Mayweather.
D-MARV
QUOTE(The Original MrFactor @ Jul 29 2008, 12:32 AM) [snapback]397804[/snapback]
DLH was the exception and Floyd just scraped by him.

Did he really?
I had Mayweather 9 to 3 easy! but thats another thread!

It's not a given that Mayweather would simply beat everyone because he's Mayweather! I have never stated that! I always stated that Mayweather would beat Tony and I still believe that till this day. After watching the first 6 rounds of Staurdays fight I just feel that Mayweather is too smart, too fast, too skilled, and too slick for the new Mexican ICON! I simpy dont see Margarito being at all effective the way he was against Cotto. I see alot of comparison made to Jose Luis Castillo! let's not forget that Castillo was quicker and more techniqually sound than Margarito is. Also, Im usually not one for excuses but Mayweather did fight that first Castillo fight with a torn rotator. Anyone who has sustained that injury knows how painful that can be.

After Saturday, I Give all respect to Maragrito. He's a warrior and at this time I would favor him over all the welterweights (Including Williams).

As far as Mayweather is concerned I think that he would have a much tougher time against the likes of Williams or Clottey.
King Eugene
QUOTE(The Original MrFactor @ Jul 29 2008, 12:32 AM) [snapback]397804[/snapback]
As proven by this past weekends fight, size matters... Mayweather may have reached his peak in terms of a division where he can reasonably be competitive at his size. I think its obvious that he did not fight the larger WW's because of the risk. Mitchel, Judah, Baldomir were all smallish WW's. DLH was the exception and Floyd just scraped by him. Oscar is well past his prime and just not a hungry fighter anymore. If he got in with one of these hungry, younger, larger WW's, he'd more than have his hands full. Margarito would flat out beat him. If they fight, I'll be here waiting for you naysayers... AGAIN!!!


LMAO...Flat out beat Mayweather? Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight your really off your rocker now. I take nothing away from Margarito but he or no other WW will flat out beat Floyd and everybody knows that. Mayweather would not have his hands full, he would do him just like he did Ricky Hatton minus the knockout. But he'd still beat him clearly. And you, I, and everybody else that has watched Floyd fight knows good and well Margarito would not get off on Floyd like he did Cotto just cause of Floyds style alone. He would sit in that pocket with that rolling defense and counter punch the heck out of Margarito. Hell I bet Big Floyd would tell you that!
dbdbdb
QUOTE(MarzB @ Jul 28 2008, 10:50 PM) [snapback]397775[/snapback]
I'm glad there are some sensible post in here. As someone said why does Mayweathers name have to come up? We already have that jilted lover BOB ARUM to do that frequently. Thanks to both fighters for NOT mentioning Floyd.

You can add Hernandez to the fold also. Floyd has been in the ring with guys 168 pounds and has sparred heavyweights. That I know for a fact. So him being in with the indestructible force that Marg has become after Saturdays fight (nevermind that we've seen Marg outclassed before) would be nothing new.

Everything Cotto did well on Saturday Floyd did better. Better defense, better timing, better accuracy, better lateral movement, better combinations when he committed to throwing them, etc, etc. Not to mention Floyd's stamina was better than Cotto's because we've never ONCE seen Floyd tired as we've seen Cotto.

Can't Margarito just have his victory without Floyd being mentioned?? OH about this ducking crap.. For the umpteenth time.

After the JUDAH fight Floyd was trying to set up a bout with Oscar Dela Hoya. Oscar wanted no parts of Arum in that proposed fight. Floyd paid $750K to become a promotional free agent. Arum offers 8 mill to fight Marg for a chensy WBO belt (big deal). Meantime Goosen gives Floyd 8,000,001 dollars PLUS a percentage of the the PPV buys. It equated to $10 million dollars total most importantly WITH NO OPTIONS..

I don't know where you all that keep reciting that crap (He ducked Margarito) went to school but the last time I checked $10 million was more than $8 million.

Floyd could beat King Kong and the "hating" express would say, "it means nothing because he's got to fight Godzilla now".

He's retired (hence my bold on the past tense) let him be. Marg, great victory and a show of will..


Good Post thumbsup_anim.gif

I mean no offense to anyone ........................ But it does seem that quite a few people have a wild hair up their ass about floyd. After every major fight, it takes about 5-7 hours before the Floyd Mayweather threads start. Sometimes not even that long. PBF had nothing whatsoever to do with the great fight we all witnessed this past Saturday ......... Yet here is another thread about him.

Get over it guys!!!! dntknw.gif

One of the most overlooked reasons alot of decent matchups didn't and won't happen between Floyd and others, can be summarized with one word ... Arum. PBF is not going to fight any fighter that's under Bob Arum.

Boxing is about MONEY, POLITICS and CORRUPTION.

Many here think its just a matter of saying yes to this matchup or that matchup .... Emphatically NO!!!! ..... MONEY, POLITICS and CORRUPTION dictates what happens in boxing and many times the boxer's on the short end of the stick. I give floyd much credit for NOT wanting to be on the short end of the stick when he's involved. So, to speculate about why this fight didn't happen or that fight didn't happen is absolutely nuts!!!!

Where is all the threads about MOSLEY ducking Margarito. ........... He said NO to a fight with Margarito also, turning down MILLIONS. But no one person here got blue balls over that and nothing is ever mentioned about it.

Like I stated earlier ..... It does seem that quite a few people have a wild hair up their ass about floyd.

!
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE(dbdbdb @ Jul 29 2008, 01:56 AM) [snapback]397816[/snapback]
Where is all the threads about MOSLEY ducking Margarito. ........... He said NO to a fight with Margarito also, turning down MILLIONS. But no one person here got blue balls over that and nothing is ever mentioned about it.

Like I stated earlier ..... It does seem that quite a few people have a wild hair up their ass about floyd.

!


Mosley never said, Margarito was "easy money." Mosley never said, who has Margarito fought. Mosley never said if it makes dollars it makes sense. Mosley never claimed to be the best ever. Mosley never said he was better than Sugar Ray Robinson. Floyd did say all of those things. Sounds like people are just calling Floyd on what he's stated.

Also on the subject of Mayweather. I have no problem with people bringing his name up. He left boxing and he left a bad taste in alot fans mouths. Not to mention this IS a boxing forum. Sugar Ray Robinson hasnt fought in 50 or so years and people still bring him up. Money May will always be fair game. He'll be lucky if we talk about him 50 years from now. In fact, many see him for who and what he is/was. He's a good fighter who many times took the path of least resistance. In doing that, he gets a heap of what i see as undeserved credit. Hence so many conceding him victories that he hasnt earned.

Now that I mention it, has Money May ever had a career defining fight. Will he ever make it to Legendary nights? Will we ever hear the words, "Legendary nights, the tale of Mayweather/ ???"
torvix2000
Point is:

You fight and win/lose/draw ONLY in the ring. Not on words. Why do we have to care whether Floyd would beat Cotto or Margarito. He has to beat them in the ring. But he's retired.
BigG
Mayweather/DLH and Mayweather/Hatton could BOTH be legendary nights episodes...both fights were both big draws and Mayweather/DLH was the biggest PPV ever which was hyped up like crazy.

It wasnt' an action packed fight but hey neither was DLH-Tito and that has its own episode..
Big Slim Sweet
QUOTE(damarvelous1 @ Jul 28 2008, 11:26 PM) [snapback]397803[/snapback]
The date Arum was throwing around was sometime in July. Mayweather didn't want too fight until November because he hurt his hand in the Judah fight!

The offer to fight Margarito was there for November as well.

QUOTE(dbdbdb @ Jul 29 2008, 12:56 AM) [snapback]397816[/snapback]
Where is all the threads about MOSLEY ducking Margarito. ........... He said NO to a fight with Margarito also, turning down MILLIONS. But no one person here got blue balls over that and nothing is ever mentioned about it.

MrFactor already addressed this pretty thoroughly, but I'd just like to add that on top of all that, Mosley was in a very different place in his career at that time. Fresh off two losses to Winky Wright, he was trying to rebuild his confidence and regain some career momentum, so it was perfectly understandable, IMO, why he wouldn't want a fight with Margarito at that time. Floyd on the other hand was the man, the champ, so in his case turning down a worthy challenger then was far more offensive.
Nay_Sayer
QUOTE(damarvelous1 @ Jul 29 2008, 12:00 AM) [snapback]397809[/snapback]
Did he really?
I had Mayweather 9 to 3 easy! but thats another thread!

Agreed. Maywaether 9 to 3 or @ worst 8 to 4. de la Hoya was swinging @ air all night long...
D-MARV
QUOTE(Big Slim @ Jul 29 2008, 02:09 PM) [snapback]397915[/snapback]
The offer to fight Margarito was there for November as well.

Maybe So, But Baldomir was the Weleterweight champion at that time so Mayweather took the Lower Risk, Higher Reward fight!!!!! Safe MOney!
MarzB
Again never have I seen such a boxer that infuriates so called fans like Mayweather. "He could have still taken the date in November" WHY?? What did Margarito bring to the table?? Do you all not understand simple math that says this??

Also on the subject of Mayweather. I have no problem with people bringing his name up. He left boxing and he left a bad taste in alot fans mouths

Who the HELL are you or even ME for that matter?? You'll reply, "I'm a fan of boxing I bought PPViews, blah, blah". Whatever, he doesn't owe you(nor me or anyone else) a DAMN THING!! You totally fit that "Godzillia" point I mentioned, nothing is never enough.

The truth is you all(the hating, nitpicking faction) wanna see Floyd get KTFO and you'll haven't gotten that opportunity. Too bad, life sucks huh?? You don't get what you always want.

The point about Mosley is hilarious too. I distinctly recall him having of all things "a toothache" after Vargas II but thats rarely ever echoed.

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