Full Version: Castillo/ Lujan
Man, that was just sad...thanks for the memories JLC, future HOF. I hope Lujan can get a rematch with Tony and gets both his ears and nose ripped open
I asked during the chat was JLC shot and I see I got my answer. That was NOT a good look at all..
JLC's shot..no suprise. Any WW contender would beat him
Yeah...he's done.
QUOTE(biggeorge89 @ Jul 30 2008, 11:08 PM) [snapback]398179[/snapback]
JLC's shot..no suprise. Any WW contender would beat him
Yes that's a given, but it's always sad to see a fighter shot and at the end of an illustrious career...Corrales (R.I.P) I, he sealed himself into immortality, and how many fighters can say they beat Floyd? So it's kinda sad, but a great career
QUOTE(iron_mike @ Jul 31 2008, 03:11 AM) [snapback]398182[/snapback]
Yes that's a given, but it's always sad to see a fighter shot and at the end of an illustrious career...Corrales (R.I.P) I, he sealed himself into immortality, and how many fighters can say they beat Floyd? So it's kinda sad, but a great career
I agree I still scored that one for Castillo.
But yea he was game to the end but now it's time for him to hang it up, the guy has had a hell of a career at 135-140.
QUOTE(iron_mike @ Jul 31 2008, 03:11 AM) [snapback]398182[/snapback]
Yes that's a given, but it's always sad to see a fighter shot and at the end of an illustrious career...Corrales (R.I.P) I, he sealed himself into immortality, and how many fighters can say they beat Floyd? So it's kinda sad, but a great career
I believe the first Corrales fight took something out of him...having a long tough career, being an aging fighter in a weight class where you're small...Castillo is just done. He should take a last easy fight in Mexico and call it a career.
QUOTE(biggeorge89 @ Jul 30 2008, 11:32 PM) [snapback]398186[/snapback]
I believe the first Corrales fight took something out of him...having a long tough career, being an aging fighter in a weight class where you're small...Castillo is just done. He should take a last easy fight in Mexico and call it a career.
Well he said if he won, he'd 'try' (impossible?) for a belt back @ 140. If he lost which he did, he'll call it a career. But boxers aren't known to retire or announce retirement and comeback do they?
It's my belief that both Castillo and Corrales were on their way downhill when they first met...I'm talking like right over the hump....
You know the expression..."one great fight left in them"...well...I think that was theirs....they both had their last hurrahs facing each other that night.
You know the expression..."one great fight left in them"...well...I think that was theirs....they both had their last hurrahs facing each other that night.
And this cat Lujan is no world beater by any means. Before this fight, he was something like 4-3 or 5-3 in his last 7 or 8 fights...getting shutout by some british fighter, getting knocked out in 2 by some journeyman, and losing a wide decision to the current WBO champ at 154..
Geez,that was a bad beating..The only sign of the old Castillo I thought was at the end when he threw the flurry..Hopefully he'll retire now and not take anymore punches then he already took tonight..I was impressed with how many punches Lujan threw..
QUOTE(Fitz @ Jul 31 2008, 12:13 AM) [snapback]398196[/snapback]
Not quite. I got to see one last hurrah when I saw Castillo beat the shit out of Corrales around the ring second time a round. A fight that I enjoyed a lot also. lol.
It's crazy...but I can see what you're saying pissing some people off....lol...it shouldn't though...'cause he was alive, and he got his ass whooped. It's just facts...
Corrales was definitely the more worn of the two after their war....
Tonights perfromance clearly showed that Casitllo was a done fighter when he met Hatton.
Castillo has had a great career and will do doubt make it into the HOF. I hope he decides to retire no need to take further punishment.
Castillo has had a great career and will do doubt make it into the HOF. I hope he decides to retire no need to take further punishment.
QUOTE(kidbazooka1 @ Jul 31 2008, 05:25 AM) [snapback]398211[/snapback]
Tonights perfromance clearly showed that Casitllo was a done fighter when he met Hatton.
Castillo has had a great career and will do doubt make it into the HOF. I hope he decides to retire no need to take further punishment.
Castillo has had a great career and will do doubt make it into the HOF. I hope he decides to retire no need to take further punishment.
Looking at Castillo's career I probably under appreciated him a little, he fought everyone at lightweight with wins over Johnson(even though it was close I thought Stevie edged it), Cassamayor, Corrales and Julio Diaz(in addition to tough contenders Bazan and Lazcano) and arguably IMO a win over Mayweather in their first fight(at the very least gave him the toughest fight, at least in my mind, of his career) and in the greatest fight I've ever seen in the first Corrales fight.
Hopefully he hangs it up because he's just not strong enough and doesn't have the punch to compete at welter.
QUOTE(The C.E.O. @ Jul 30 2008, 07:47 PM) [snapback]398190[/snapback]
It's my belief that both Castillo and Corrales were on their way downhill when they first met...I'm talking like right over the hump....
You know the expression..."one great fight left in them"...well...I think that was theirs....they both had their last hurrahs facing each other that night.
You know the expression..."one great fight left in them"...well...I think that was theirs....they both had their last hurrahs facing each other that night.
EXACTLY WAT I TOLD MY OLDER BROTHER. HE WAS NOT THE SAME AFTER CORRALES VS CASTILLO 1.
WHAT A GREAT MEXICAN WARRIOR. FUTURE HALL OF FAMER. VIVA MEXICO!!!.
AM
QUOTE(The C.E.O. @ Jul 30 2008, 07:47 PM)
It's my belief that both Castillo and Corrales were on their way downhill when they first met...I'm talking like right over the hump....
You know the expression..."one great fight left in them"...well...I think that was theirs....they both had their last hurrahs facing each other that night.
This could not have been said any better
QUOTE(The C.E.O. @ Jul 30 2008, 07:47 PM)
It's my belief that both Castillo and Corrales were on their way downhill when they first met...I'm talking like right over the hump....
You know the expression..."one great fight left in them"...well...I think that was theirs....they both had their last hurrahs facing each other that night.
This could not have been said any better
QUOTE(iron_mike @ Jul 30 2008, 11:11 PM) [snapback]398182[/snapback]
Yes that's a given, but it's always sad to see a fighter shot and at the end of an illustrious career...Corrales (R.I.P) I, he sealed himself into immortality, and how many fighters can say they beat Floyd? So it's kinda sad, but a great career
When did he beat Floyd? LOL
Why does Floyd still have the 0 on his record? I didn't know he LOST!
LOL, You guys crack me up!
QUOTE(The C.E.O. @ Jul 30 2008, 10:47 PM) [snapback]398190[/snapback]
It's my belief that both Castillo and Corrales were on their way downhill when they first met...I'm talking like right over the hump....
You know the expression..."one great fight left in them"...well...I think that was theirs....they both had their last hurrahs facing each other that night.
You know the expression..."one great fight left in them"...well...I think that was theirs....they both had their last hurrahs facing each other that night.
I don't think they were quite going downhill just yet, more like they were both right at the edge of their respective peaks, but it was a slippery slope. I agree completely though with the second part of your statement. That fight was the perfect storm.
Their second fight was meaningless horseshit though. Thankfully it's barely even a footnote to their first.
QUOTE(iron_mike @ Jul 30 2008, 11:11 PM) [snapback]398182[/snapback]
and how many fighters can say they beat Floyd?
maybe some guys in the amateurs. but no pros.
Serafim Todorov
Nouredine Medjihoud
I think Augie Sanchez beat him in Olympic qualifying
So Augie Sanchez can say he beat Mayweather, but JLC cannot
QUOTE(The C.E.O. @ Jul 30 2008, 11:47 PM) [snapback]398190[/snapback]
It's my belief that both Castillo and Corrales were on their way downhill when they first met...I'm talking like right over the hump....
You know the expression..."one great fight left in them"...well...I think that was theirs....they both had their last hurrahs facing each other that night.
You know the expression..."one great fight left in them"...well...I think that was theirs....they both had their last hurrahs facing each other that night.
I told the forum Castillo was shop worn before the Hatton fight.
Hype and everybody thought i was a fuck wit i even think you did as well C.E.O. Abusing your body to make weight and being in one too many slugfests isn't a recipe for a long career.
Same goes for Hatton he's best days are gone.
QUOTE(biggeorge89 @ Jul 30 2008, 10:32 PM) [snapback]398186[/snapback]
I believe the first Corrales fight took something out of him...having a long tough career, being an aging fighter in a weight class where you're small...Castillo is just done. He should take a last easy fight in Mexico and call it a career.
I don't want to beat a dead horse, but both fighters left a lot of themselves in the ring that night. I personally think JLC should retire. I remember them saying something about him being in some financial trouble prior to the Hatton fight, but I could be mistaken about that.
QUOTE(Fitz @ Jul 30 2008, 11:13 PM) [snapback]398196[/snapback]
Not quite. I got to see one last hurrah when I saw Castillo beat the shit out of Corrales around the ring second time a round. A fight that I enjoyed a lot also. lol.
I'm not trying to be a dick, but wasn't Castillo like 8 pounds over the 135 limit for that fight, but Corrales fought him anyways? I liked Chico a lot, but after bitchin' and moanin' about JLC being overweight he turned around and weighed-in heavy for his second fight with Casamayor?
QUOTE(hitman harding @ Jul 31 2008, 04:08 PM) [snapback]398298[/snapback]
I told the forum Castillo was shop worn before the Hatton fight.
Hype and everybody thought i was a fuck wit i even think you did as well C.E.O. Abusing your body to make weight and being in one too many slugfests isn't a recipe for a long career.
Same goes for Hatton he's best days are gone.
Hype and everybody thought i was a fuck wit i even think you did as well C.E.O. Abusing your body to make weight and being in one too many slugfests isn't a recipe for a long career.
Same goes for Hatton he's best days are gone.
???
Anyone who knows anything knew Castillo was well past his prime before Hatton....and I'M saying he was a little over the hump going all the way back to the Corrales I.....he then fought two more times after that...OFCOURSE he was worn by the time he met Hatton.....I'm not saying he was fully "shot"....but he was broke and unmotivated along with being battle worn...
In other words....I personally didn't have a problem with you saying he was worn then....you have me confused with someone else.
I think one of the reasons HYPE was killin' you was because you kept typing it "shop warn"....with an "a".
That fight last night sucked to watch. Castillo lookes slow, well he always looks slow, but he made up for it with pressure and timing. Those things were nowhere to be seen last night. Time to call it a career.
I think he should be in the HOF and I mean really deserves to be there. I know some people believe the HOF should be reserved for elite fighters only but Castillo's list of wins has some good wins.
Johnston, Bazan, Mayweather (you know he beat him), Lazcano, Cassamayor, Diaz, Corrales. And even being shot he squeaked past Ngoudjo.
I think he should be in the HOF and I mean really deserves to be there. I know some people believe the HOF should be reserved for elite fighters only but Castillo's list of wins has some good wins.
Johnston, Bazan, Mayweather (you know he beat him), Lazcano, Cassamayor, Diaz, Corrales. And even being shot he squeaked past Ngoudjo.
Ok, you guys know your boxing. When I say JLC beat PBF, HE BEAT PBF. Floyd got the decision, but anyone with 20/20 or better vision can see Castillo won the fight. Yes Floyd has the '0' on his record, but he should have a 1, or at least an * next to that fight because that was blatant robbery. If you guys are baiting, good job, but some seemed serious.
Just because some fans say "you won" doesn't mean you won!!!! 3 experts say you lost... so guess what? "you lost"
I had Floyd winning that fight anyways!
I had Floyd winning that fight anyways!
QUOTE(damarvelous1 @ Jul 31 2008, 08:58 PM) [snapback]398343[/snapback]
Just because some fans say "you won" doesn't mean you won!!!! 3 experts say you lost... so guess what? "you lost"
I had Floyd winning that fight anyways!
I had Floyd winning that fight anyways!
Do we really need to get into judges and their incompetence?
but this discussion about who won is not going to get us anywhere, best let it go.
QUOTE(The C.E.O. @ Jul 31 2008, 08:10 PM) [snapback]398330[/snapback]
???
Anyone who knows anything knew Castillo was well past his prime before Hatton....and I'M saying he was a little over the hump going all the way back to the Corrales I.....he then fought two more times after that...OFCOURSE he was worn by the time he met Hatton.....I'm not saying he was fully "shot"....but he was broke and unmotivated along with being battle worn...
In other words....I personally didn't have a problem with you saying he was worn then....you have me confused with someone else.
I think one of the reasons HYPE was killin' you was because you kept typing it "shop warn"....with an "a".
Anyone who knows anything knew Castillo was well past his prime before Hatton....and I'M saying he was a little over the hump going all the way back to the Corrales I.....he then fought two more times after that...OFCOURSE he was worn by the time he met Hatton.....I'm not saying he was fully "shot"....but he was broke and unmotivated along with being battle worn...
In other words....I personally didn't have a problem with you saying he was worn then....you have me confused with someone else.
I think one of the reasons HYPE was killin' you was because you kept typing it "shop warn"....with an "a".
I'd like to see the proof of the warn? Probally another failed attempt to smear
QUOTE(Mean Mister Mustard @ Jul 31 2008, 09:21 PM) [snapback]398345[/snapback]
Do we really need to get into judges and their incompetence?
but this discussion about who won is not going to get us anywhere, best let it go.
but this discussion about who won is not going to get us anywhere, best let it go.
MMM,
You're right! Im letting it go!
From the Hatton-Urango thread in the Archives.....
and that's that.
Hype and others thought that even a worn version of Castillo could beat Hatton.....it wasn't an off base call....for example....a battle worn and past prime Morales beat a strong Pacquiao....
We NOW know that Hatton eventually faced and stopped Castillo...but let's set something straight....there's a notable difference between being "battle worn and past prime" and "washed up and SHOP worn"...
So after revisiting all this....I have to retract what I said earlier...
You didn't say he was simply worn....you said he was "washed up and SHOP worn"....which I disagree with...
Castillo was battle worn, well past his prime, financially broke, and unmotivated by the time he faced Hatton....which means Hatton's win over him still means next to nothing....
QUOTE(hitman harding @ Jan 21 2007, 04:13 PM) [snapback]310261[/snapback]
Big call Hype backing a washed up shop warn Fighter to tko Hatton 
QUOTE(thehype @ Jan 21 2007, 07:52 PM) [snapback]310317[/snapback]
I never said Castillo was "elite", but I certainly don't think he's a "washed up shop warn Fighter".
Personally, I think statements like that should be reserved for fighters like Arturo Gatti.
I don't think that failing to make weight is any indication of a fighter becoming "washed up" or "shop warn". He just can't make the weight anymore...period. He's been struggling with the weight since the Mayweather fights (in 2002). Castillo just made the mistake of sticking around that weight for one too many fights. Miguel Cotto, on the other hand, was smart enough to realize when it was time to move on. He was fortunate enough not to embarass himself by failing to make weight. Now surely you wouldn't imply that Cotto is "washed up" and "shop warn" simply because he can't make 140 anymore...would you???? I see no reason why you would point to Castillo's failure to make 135 as a sign that he's "washed up".
Castillo may not be quite as good at 140 as he was at 135...but then again, maybe he still is.
Certainly you have to give Ngoudju some credit. Before the fight, you considered him to be a "no name". As such, I can only assume that you had never seen him fight before. If that's the case, then certainly you must have been impressed with the skills he displayed in the ring. Nice jab. Tight defense. Good combos. Decent movement. Can box and mix it up. He had an opportunity to showcase himself on HBO and fought a great fight against a high-profile name. Excellent job Ngoudju.
As far as Castillo's concerned, I thought he looked about the same given the circumstances. Coming off a long layoff. Questions about his weight. An opponent he wasn't too excited about facing. A guy that showed him a jab and some movement. If you ask me, it looked a lot like Castillo's fights with Rolando Reyes, Julio Diaz, Juan Lazcano and even Joel Casamayor...fights where Castillo looked frustrated early because his opponents were on the move. Then he'd turn up the pressure and take over in the second half of the fight.
From what I saw, Castillo didn't even think he was in serious jeopardy of losing the fight...even joking around with photographers as Lampley pointed out. Looked like just another day at the office...just another ho-hum tune-up until he can get back onto the big stage.
I think you're making waaaaaay too much out of his fight with Ngoudju. Personally, I think Ngoudju was probably the tougher assignment. I mean, Urango didn't even win his last fight against Ben Rabah (which is fitting considering that Hatton didn't win his last fight against Collazo). Urango's a one punch fighter....right hook, right hook, right hook...that's all he can do. Ngoudju is a much more talented fighter than that, with more tools in his bag, making him a more difficult opponent. In fact, if I may be so bold, I'd even pick Ngoudju to beat Hatton.
Look, I don't want to knock Hatton, but I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility for someone to think that Castillo can stop him. I just think you're not giving Ngoudju enough credit for actually being a pretty good fighter and you're giving Hatton too much credit for beating a pretty basic fighter in Urango. Plus, Hatton has clearly shown that he's vulnerable to the body and Castillo, who despite looking a bit rusty against Ngoudju, has clearly shown that he still like's putting in relentless work to the body. Hatton has also shown me that he doesn't like mixing it up quite as much as some people like to say. His punch-clinch-break-repeat style may work against lazy fighters like Urango, but I don't think it's going to work against someone who's as tenacious and dirty as Castillo. In fact, I think that's only going to piss Castillo off even more, which, in turn, is going to make it even uglier for Jawny Hatton. I think eventually, it would be Castillo wearing him down and stopping him with a body shot late in the fight. Not too shabby for a "washed up shop warn Fighter".
For the record, you can also add Junior Witter, Diego Corrales, Kendall Holt and Ben Rabah to that list of 140lbs fighters that I think will beat Hatton.
Just out of curiosity, if Castillo really is a "washed up shop warn Fighter", then what the hell is Hatton wasting his time fighting him for?
I guess it would be so he can add him to his list of other "washed up shop warn Fighters" that he's already beaten...you know...guys like Joe Hutchinson, Vince Phillips, Ben Tackie, Dennis Pederson, Carlos Vilches, Michael Stewart, Ray Oliveira and, dare I say it, Kostya Tszyu.
Personally, I think statements like that should be reserved for fighters like Arturo Gatti.
I don't think that failing to make weight is any indication of a fighter becoming "washed up" or "shop warn". He just can't make the weight anymore...period. He's been struggling with the weight since the Mayweather fights (in 2002). Castillo just made the mistake of sticking around that weight for one too many fights. Miguel Cotto, on the other hand, was smart enough to realize when it was time to move on. He was fortunate enough not to embarass himself by failing to make weight. Now surely you wouldn't imply that Cotto is "washed up" and "shop warn" simply because he can't make 140 anymore...would you???? I see no reason why you would point to Castillo's failure to make 135 as a sign that he's "washed up".
Castillo may not be quite as good at 140 as he was at 135...but then again, maybe he still is.
Certainly you have to give Ngoudju some credit. Before the fight, you considered him to be a "no name". As such, I can only assume that you had never seen him fight before. If that's the case, then certainly you must have been impressed with the skills he displayed in the ring. Nice jab. Tight defense. Good combos. Decent movement. Can box and mix it up. He had an opportunity to showcase himself on HBO and fought a great fight against a high-profile name. Excellent job Ngoudju.
As far as Castillo's concerned, I thought he looked about the same given the circumstances. Coming off a long layoff. Questions about his weight. An opponent he wasn't too excited about facing. A guy that showed him a jab and some movement. If you ask me, it looked a lot like Castillo's fights with Rolando Reyes, Julio Diaz, Juan Lazcano and even Joel Casamayor...fights where Castillo looked frustrated early because his opponents were on the move. Then he'd turn up the pressure and take over in the second half of the fight.
From what I saw, Castillo didn't even think he was in serious jeopardy of losing the fight...even joking around with photographers as Lampley pointed out. Looked like just another day at the office...just another ho-hum tune-up until he can get back onto the big stage.
I think you're making waaaaaay too much out of his fight with Ngoudju. Personally, I think Ngoudju was probably the tougher assignment. I mean, Urango didn't even win his last fight against Ben Rabah (which is fitting considering that Hatton didn't win his last fight against Collazo). Urango's a one punch fighter....right hook, right hook, right hook...that's all he can do. Ngoudju is a much more talented fighter than that, with more tools in his bag, making him a more difficult opponent. In fact, if I may be so bold, I'd even pick Ngoudju to beat Hatton.
Look, I don't want to knock Hatton, but I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility for someone to think that Castillo can stop him. I just think you're not giving Ngoudju enough credit for actually being a pretty good fighter and you're giving Hatton too much credit for beating a pretty basic fighter in Urango. Plus, Hatton has clearly shown that he's vulnerable to the body and Castillo, who despite looking a bit rusty against Ngoudju, has clearly shown that he still like's putting in relentless work to the body. Hatton has also shown me that he doesn't like mixing it up quite as much as some people like to say. His punch-clinch-break-repeat style may work against lazy fighters like Urango, but I don't think it's going to work against someone who's as tenacious and dirty as Castillo. In fact, I think that's only going to piss Castillo off even more, which, in turn, is going to make it even uglier for Jawny Hatton. I think eventually, it would be Castillo wearing him down and stopping him with a body shot late in the fight. Not too shabby for a "washed up shop warn Fighter".
For the record, you can also add Junior Witter, Diego Corrales, Kendall Holt and Ben Rabah to that list of 140lbs fighters that I think will beat Hatton.
Just out of curiosity, if Castillo really is a "washed up shop warn Fighter", then what the hell is Hatton wasting his time fighting him for?
I guess it would be so he can add him to his list of other "washed up shop warn Fighters" that he's already beaten...you know...guys like Joe Hutchinson, Vince Phillips, Ben Tackie, Dennis Pederson, Carlos Vilches, Michael Stewart, Ray Oliveira and, dare I say it, Kostya Tszyu.
and that's that.
Hype and others thought that even a worn version of Castillo could beat Hatton.....it wasn't an off base call....for example....a battle worn and past prime Morales beat a strong Pacquiao....
We NOW know that Hatton eventually faced and stopped Castillo...but let's set something straight....there's a notable difference between being "battle worn and past prime" and "washed up and SHOP worn"...
So after revisiting all this....I have to retract what I said earlier...
QUOTE
I personally didn't have a problem with you saying he was worn then
You didn't say he was simply worn....you said he was "washed up and SHOP worn"....which I disagree with...
Castillo was battle worn, well past his prime, financially broke, and unmotivated by the time he faced Hatton....which means Hatton's win over him still means next to nothing....
QUOTE(The C.E.O. @ Aug 1 2008, 10:42 AM) [snapback]398407[/snapback]
From the Hatton-Urango thread in the Archives.....
and that's that.
Hype and others thought that even a worn version of Castillo could beat Hatton.....it wasn't an off base call....for example....a battle worn and past prime Morales beat a strong Pacquiao....
We NOW know that Hatton eventually faced and stopped Castillo...but let's set something straight....there's a notable difference between being "battle worn and past prime" and "washed up and SHOP worn"...
So after revisiting all this....I have to retract what I said earlier...
You didn't say he was simply worn....you said he was "washed up and SHOP worn"....which I disagree with...
Castillo was battle worn, well past his prime, financially broke, and unmotivated by the time he faced Hatton....which means Hatton's win over him still means next to nothing....
and that's that.
Hype and others thought that even a worn version of Castillo could beat Hatton.....it wasn't an off base call....for example....a battle worn and past prime Morales beat a strong Pacquiao....
We NOW know that Hatton eventually faced and stopped Castillo...but let's set something straight....there's a notable difference between being "battle worn and past prime" and "washed up and SHOP worn"...
So after revisiting all this....I have to retract what I said earlier...
You didn't say he was simply worn....you said he was "washed up and SHOP worn"....which I disagree with...
Castillo was battle worn, well past his prime, financially broke, and unmotivated by the time he faced Hatton....which means Hatton's win over him still means next to nothing....
Castillo v Hatton was a farce agreed
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