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Jack 1000
For all on-going comments and post-fight reactions to the Ward-Miranda fight.

Jack

Administrator
KYLE THEEE SPINKS FAN
I think this could be a good fight. Miranda has only lost to the two best middleweights out there in Abraham and Pavlik, and he has a lot of power. Ward has been hurt before, but he has some good speed and is elusive. Ward could make this bout suck, if he plays it cautious and stays away. However, with Miranda's style, he won't be able to run all night. Miranda is going to press him hard, and there will be a point where Ward will have to stand his ground. What happens next will determine the fight. I think Ward will build up a lead early with his style and long jab. However, I think in the middle rounds Miranda will catch up to him and start landing hard shots. Ward won't be able to take these bombs, and I expect him to go down around the 8th or 9th round. Hopefully it will be a good one.
Col Reb
I am so excited about this fight. Ward has plenty of potential, and this fight should tell us what we need to know. I expect the winner to fight for a title, with the loser looking at second tier opponents ( I suggest Mayorga if it's Miranda, Lacy if it's Ward). I think it'll be close, with Ward taking the decision due to Miranda slowing late in the fight.
Al Hata

I'm very excited for the fight also. Love fights like these. Lets see if Ward can past the test.
Douchebag
what channel is this fight on?

The CEO
Showtime
Lil-lightsout
Well that was pretty boring. I must admit I am not really impressed with Ward, and obviously Miranda fought horribly. Ward holds way too much and to me seems to run too much. Wards constant clinching is just frustrating to watch, I could careless to see him again.

Also, Farhood and Charles riding Ward's cock the whole fight was ridiculous. They sounded more like cheerleaders then an announcing team.

The undercard fight was a complete joke too. I think if I ever see Archequito, I just might punch him in the face myself.
Romulus9
Ward dominated. I was completely impressed with him. Miranda fought horribly because he got beat pillar to post for 36 minutes. NEVER in the fight. He's painfully one-dimensional.

Ward would destroy Carl Froch and within a year he'll be ready to take control of the division. Beautiful technical performance tonight.

Marty Sammon should be ashamed of himself for that 116-112 card.
The CEO
I agree with wvu....Boxing is more like The Theater of The Expected to us nowadays, ain't it...lol

Tonight is just another example of what usually happens when a properly groomed, American, Olympic Gold Medalist steps up for their first real test....they shine....especially against a crude brawler/puncher. Ward's pedigree was evident tonight....mentally as well as physically....his heart and chin are just fine...

The only bad thing I can say is that he held a little too much for my taste....although it must be said...like how Mosley tied up Margarito....he kept it within the rules and didn't cross the line into overboard, heavy warning/deduction territory....

Anyway...Andre proved to me tonight what I've always felt....that he's better than the other Andre...Dirrell.....and is gonna be a future, serious champion.

He reminds me of a grounded Jones who doesn't mind warring a little........that's good shit to me.
Lil-lightsout
QUOTE (wvu8893 @ May 16 2009, 10:36 PM) *
Ward dominated. I was completely impressed with him. Miranda fought horribly because he got beat pillar to post for 36 minutes. NEVER in the fight. He's painfully one-dimensional.

Ward would destroy Carl Froch and within a year he'll be ready to take control of the division. Beautiful technical performance tonight.


I do not think Ward will take control of the division. Miranda fought horribly because he is crude, not very technically skilled, and does not let his punches go enough. Ward did what he had to do, I am a little irritated at the constant holding, but maybe it is just me.

I would slightly favor Froch over him, Ward has NO power to keep Froch off him. Bute would outslick him. Kessler I would favor over him too, though I have not seen him in a little bit. Him and Andrade would be a nice test next.

Remember... he just beat a "painfully one-dimensional" Miranda as you stated. Do not go overboard after one performance. There are some other good fighters(Champions) in this division.

CEO- No offense dude... but Jones was light years ahead of Ward in every category. I have seen just about everyone of Jones fights since turning pro, and not knocking Ward, but I just do not see the comparison. Shit... Jones in his first year as a pro would destroy this Ward(even with the weight difference). I know 3King3 would agree. Maybe I took your statement wrong? dntknw.gif
Romulus9
QUOTE (Lil-lightsout @ May 16 2009, 11:35 PM) *
I do not think Ward will take control of the division. Miranda fought horribly because he is crude, not very technically skilled, and does not let his punches go enough. Ward did what he had to do, I am a little irritated at the constant holding, but maybe it is just me.

I would slightly favor Froch over him, Ward has NO power to keep Froch off him. Bute would outslick him. Kessler I would favor over him too, though I have not seen him in a little bit. Him and Andrade would be a nice test next.

Remember... he just beat a "painfully one-dimensional" Miranda as you stated. Do not go overboard after one performance. There are some other good fighters(Champions) in this division.

CEO- No offense dude... but Jones was light years ahead of Ward in every category. I have seen just about everyone of Jones fights since turning pro, and not knocking Ward, but I just do not see the comparison. Shit... Jones in his first year as a pro would destroy this Ward(even with the weight difference). I know 3King3 would agree. Maybe I took your statement wrong? dntknw.gif



LOL. Across the board.

Froch sucks.
Miranda is a one-dimensional, head hunting hack.
Bute is Canadian.
Kessler is MIA.
Andrade got owned by Bute.


I'll take Ward.
The CEO
QUOTE (Lil-lightsout @ May 16 2009, 11:35 PM) *
I do not think Ward will take control of the division. Miranda fought horribly because he is crude, not very technically skilled, and does not let his punches go enough. Ward did what he had to do, I am a little irritated at the constant holding, but maybe it is just me.

I would slightly favor Froch over him, Ward has NO power to keep Froch off him. Bute would outslick him. Kessler I would favor over him too, though I have not seen him in a little bit. Him and Andrade would be a nice test next.

Remember... he just beat a "painfully one-dimensional" Miranda as you stated. Do not go overboard after one performance. There are some other good fighters(Champions) in this division.

CEO- No offense dude... but Jones was light years ahead of Ward in every category. I have seen just about everyone of Jones fights since turning pro, and not knocking Ward, but I just do not see the comparison. Shit... Jones in his first year as a pro would destroy this Ward(even with the weight difference). I know 3King3 would agree. Maybe I took your statement wrong? dntknw.gif


No offense to you...but Jesus CHRIST the bold...lol........Ward...right NOW....is NOTICEABLY a better boxer and more versatile than all 3 of those guys...and way smarter too...

and when I was saying he reminded me of Jones....I meant stylewise...and although he's not quite up to Roy's speed skillswise....he's definitely more technically sound....
Nay_Sayer
A little more seasoning and I'll take Ward by UD against any 168lb fighter in the world....
Lil-lightsout
QUOTE (wvu8893 @ May 16 2009, 11:43 PM) *
LOL. Across the board.

Froch sucks.
Miranda is a one-dimensional, head hunting hack.
Bute is Canadian.
Kessler is MIA.
Andrade got owned by Bute.


I'll take Ward.


LOL. Across the board. Great in depth analysis.

Froch just KO'd Taylor. Though it was not a great performance, he did win and is more proven at this time.
Miranda you keep degrading... that is fine, but in Wards only real test you are basing this fight to Wards future domination. What a joke.
Bute is Canadian??? WTF is that about. Bute is very good and skilled and has beating way better fighters thus far.
Kessler is MIA- but is again atleast still he is still more proven.
Andrade did get beat by Bute and Kessler, but those are his only two losses, so it would be a good indicator to see how Ward would do against him to compare.
Lil-lightsout
QUOTE (The C.E.O. @ May 16 2009, 11:46 PM) *
No offense to you...but Jesus CHRIST the bold...lol........Ward...right NOW....is NOTICEABLY a better boxer and more versatile than all 3 of those guys...and way smarter too...

and when I was saying he reminded me of Jones....I meant stylewise...and although he's not quite up to Roy's speed skillswise....he's definitely more technically sound....


Seriously...Ward did okay tonight, I just was not that impressed with him. Maybe I am being too critical on him? In no freaking way would I favor him over ANY of the champions as of right now after his first test. It is just to early IMO to say he is better than them all right now. Maybe EVENTUALLY he will prove me wrong, but right now I would not favor him over any of them.

Oh... Ward is a better boxer than Froch(but there is more than just "boxing" in a championship fight). I will give you that, but not Kessler or Bute. I KNOW you will not agree with me, but it is impossible to prove he is a "NOTICEABLY better boxer and more versatile than all 3 of those guys...and way smarter too..." Geez... he just had his 1st test and you are making a statement like that. But hey... we are all entitled to our opinion.
The CEO
lol......I'm not even gonna argue it with you, L-L......I'm just gonna go crash...and laugh some before I pass out....Atlassitis.....lol
Jack 1000
I think Ward's people knew that Miranda was shot, which is why they took this fight. I only gave Edison the 10th round and an even 2nd. 116-112? LOL! Miranda's best was the classic losing war with Abraham. He's been on the downside since.

Jack
The Original MrFactor
Not sure what fight you guys were watching... Ward looked horrible. As bad as Miranda was, Ward should have closed the show. His clinching and running made him tough to watch. I'm very surprised that he didnt garner any deductions for all of his holding. I want that hour of my life back...
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE (Jack 1000 @ May 17 2009, 01:36 AM) *
I think Ward's people knew that Miranda was shot, which is why they took this fight. I only gave Edison the 10th round and an even 2nd. 116-112? LOL! Miranda's best was the classic losing war with Abraham. He's been on the downside since.

Jack



People know that if you take it to Miranda, he'll fold. He's a gatekeeper at best. Dont really think he's shot. He's just not that good...
Col Reb
Time for Miranda to either fight Mayorga or Tito.
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE (Col Reb @ May 17 2009, 01:48 AM) *
Time for Miranda to either fight Mayorga or Tito.


I think its a good showcase fight for Tito. he could probably look pretty good and KO Miranda. Man , would a Miranda/Mayorga fight be huuuge if you just consider thr trash that would get talked... i think Miranda would beat Mayorga because he's so much bigger. It would be entertaining to watch though...
Lil-lightsout
QUOTE (The Original MrFactor @ May 17 2009, 01:46 AM) *
Not sure what fight you guys were watching... Ward looked horrible. As bad as Miranda was, Ward should have closed the show. His clinching and running made him tough to watch. I'm very surprised that he didnt garner any deductions for all of his holding. I want that hour of my life back...


Atleast someone watched the same fight I did.
kidbazooka1
I thought Miranda was gonna get him towards the end boy was i wrong Miranda looked like sh*t yet Ward still couldn't put him away.

Not impressed by Ward one bit never was and i doubt i ever will.
thefloatingmonkey
This was a good win for Ward. I thought he looked really good. Miranda is very one dimensional, and has a mean right, but Ward was able to suppress that power all night long, rough him up around the ring, and out box him all night long.

Miranda was shot, he was never great. Being in the ring with someone has quick and slick as Ward is always going to be bad news for him.

I would like to see Ward take on Froch. I don't think he would have a problem putting a who0pin on this dude out.
The Original MrFactor
I think Ward should try his luck with Jermaine Taylor. I see an ugly fight, but I cant pick a winner. Taylor would be the aggressor. Ward would be elusive and wait on Taylor to gas out. Then Ward can clinch and run from the gassed out Taylor, who'd escape with a decision...
JLUVBABY
QUOTE (The Original MrFactor @ May 17 2009, 02:00 AM) *
I think Ward should try his luck with Jermaine Taylor. I see an ugly fight, but I cant pick a winner. Taylor would be the aggressor. Ward would be elusive and wait on Taylor to gas out. Then Ward can clinch and run from the gassed out Taylor, who'd escape with a decision...


that would be a very interesting fight.... ward doesnt seem to have the power to pull out a last minute ko like froch so that would be a good fight....
salvador
QUOTE (The Original MrFactor @ May 17 2009, 12:46 AM) *
Not sure what fight you guys were watching... Ward looked horrible. As bad as Miranda was, Ward should have closed the show. His clinching and running made him tough to watch. I'm very surprised that he didnt garner any deductions for all of his holding. I want that hour of my life back...


I'm with you on this.

I've never been as impressed with Ward as everyone else seems to be and he didn't do anything last night to change my opinion. Admittedly it has something to do with his style and his body, which just doesn't appear as solid as it should. I get it that he's flexible and that he's slick for his size, but I think a serious body puncher with a solid chin would do really well against him.

I go back and forth with the 168 pound division in terms of really liking it and really not caring much about it. There are definitely some very interesting fights in it, but no superstars and no really great fighters. I'm sure Ward-Froch will look like last night's fight, but I'd actually take Taylor over Ward. Kessler could be an interesting match with Ward as well if Kessler could focus his power shots downstairs. I love Andrade, but Ward's too slick for him.

Dawson would destroy Ward.
JD
I thought Ward looked good. This was his first step up, lets see what he does next.

As of right now, I would not put him him with the top dogs - but two fights from now that should change. The winner of the Balzsay - Steiglitz fight would be a good next step, and net him the WBO strap.
Spyder
Ward did good to get the win, but at no time did I feel it was easy for him.

There's just something about him that seems vulnerable to me.
The CEO
QUOTE (thefloatingmonkey @ May 17 2009, 02:27 AM) *
This was a good win for Ward. I thought he looked really good. Miranda is very one dimensional, and has a mean right, but Ward was able to suppress that power all night long, rough him up around the ring, and out box him all night long.

Miranda was shot, he was never great. Being in the ring with someone has quick and slick as Ward is always going to be bad news for him.

I would like to see Ward take on Froch. I don't think he would have a problem putting a who0pin on this dude out.


Yes to everything.....except I believe Miranda is worn....not "shot".......he had problems pullin' the trigger at times...but he still had some speed and sauce on some of his punches...

It was a good win that showed what this kid is made of....he got cut by a heabutt early, kept his head, and took it TO the power puncher....his versatility and accuracy was showcased...as well as the ability to get dirty too.....yeah....it was a showcase that he will and CAN do everything to get the win.......all kinds of styles offensively and defensively.....hope he doesn't continue with and takes the holding to the next level though...he don't need to do it that much....because from what I see....he has the ability and potential to straight outbox most everyone around his weight....
Lil-lightsout
Anyone notice how Ward just let his left hand so low most of the fight? Miranda landed a few rights on him, but nothing or not enough to make Ward change. I see that as a major problem if he keeps that up with a faster guy who would also throw more effective right hands.

So if you are Wards team, what is next for him?

Do you look for a title shot next or another top 10 opponent next?
The CEO
I hate the low left hand as much as the next purist...but if he stays out of range, helps him score, and doesn't cause him to lose...it's not considered a detriment....

I say go after Green or Taylor next....then Froch.....then Bootay.
Nay_Sayer
QUOTE (The Original MrFactor @ May 17 2009, 12:59 AM) *
I think its a good showcase fight for Tito. he could probably look pretty good and KO Miranda.

Miranda KO's Tito....
Nay_Sayer
QUOTE (The C.E.O. @ May 17 2009, 11:04 AM) *
I say go after Green or Taylor next....then Froch.....then Bootay.

I'd like to see Ward shut Green's mouth...
Mean Mister Mustard
I agree with what some of you said, Miranda is not shot, he's just not that smart. Give credit to Ward for dictating the pace and action. I too have never been impressed by Ward but that's not fair. Just because he doesn't dazzle like Roy Jones or KO's people like Mike Tyson doesn't mean he suck. I'm not saying he's a future ATG, too early to tell, but he is good. He showed the good efense from the amateurs, nice handspeed, a willingness to go to the body and could even fight on the inside.

He's lack of explosiveness though will not make him into an attraction but he reminds me a bit of Pernell Whitaker in that his punches have snap but no real KO power yet still enough to keep guys off of him. I think he can beat a lot of guys in the same undramatic fashion he did last night, just like Whitaker used to do.
thefloatingmonkey
QUOTE (Lil-lightsout @ May 17 2009, 08:49 AM) *
Anyone notice how Ward just let his left hand so low most of the fight? Miranda landed a few rights on him, but nothing or not enough to make Ward change. I see that as a major problem if he keeps that up with a faster guy who would also throw more effective right hands.

So if you are Wards team, what is next for him?

Do you look for a title shot next or another top 10 opponent next?


Yeah, I hate that low left hand of his. There is just no reason to keep it low like that.

Froch has that low left hand too, and he is a lot slower than Ward. Both of them need to keep their hands up.
Thegreatequalizer
QUOTE (Lil-lightsout @ May 16 2009, 10:32 PM) *
Well that was pretty boring. I must admit I am not really impressed with Ward, and obviously Miranda fought horribly. Ward holds way too much and to me seems to run too much. Wards constant clinching is just frustrating to watch, I could careless to see him again.

Also, Farhood and Charles riding Ward's cock the whole fight was ridiculous. They sounded more like cheerleaders then an announcing team.


yeah, i thought he was trying the first few rounds and then settled into a boring routing of 1 or 2 punches at a time and clinching. farhood was going on about his great performance, which was hilarious. ward is somewhat redeemed in admitting that his performance wasn't good (and even looked at farhood like he was an idiot when he said it was a great performance). so hopefully we'll see a more determined ward next time. there was mention of how he doesn't really have a style, which i think hurt him in this fight. he did show a good chin taking some flush shots from miranda. based on this performance it's hard to say how he would do against the top guys, but he's still on his way up, so maybe he'll make some adjustment. i would give him a good chance against froch and bute. i wouldn't favor him over kessler though.
Thegreatequalizer
QUOTE (Nay_Sayer @ May 17 2009, 12:28 PM) *
Miranda KO's Tito....


that would be a fun fight to watch.
The CEO
QUOTE (Thegreatequalizer @ May 17 2009, 02:22 PM) *
yeah, i thought he was trying the first few rounds and then settled into a boring routing of 1 or 2 punches at a time and clinching. farhood was going on about his great performance, which was hilarious. ward is somewhat redeemed in admitting that his performance wasn't good (and even looked at farhood like he was an idiot when he said it was a great performance). so hopefully we'll see a more determined ward next time. there was mention of how he doesn't really have a style, which i think hurt him in this fight. he did show a good chin taking some flush shots from miranda. based on this performance it's hard to say how he would do against the top guys, but he's still on his way up, so maybe he'll make some adjustment. i would give him a good chance against froch and bute. i wouldn't favor him over kessler though.


I liked that he admitted that....it was another trait of his American Olympic Gold pedigree....he knows he's still a work in progress....he wasn't satisfied with his performance because he's a perfectionist and wants to be the best he can be....great attitude on this kid.
Lil-lightsout
QUOTE (The C.E.O. @ May 17 2009, 12:04 PM) *
I hate the low left hand as much as the next purist...but if he stays out of range, helps him score, and doesn't cause him to lose...it's not considered a detriment....

I say go after Green or Taylor next....then Froch.....then Bootay.


I think he is now the number 1 contender for Froch, so maybe he should jump on that next. I think that is his best shot right now, Froch is not the fastest fighter in there. Style wise, I would take a fight with Froch over Green or JT.
Lil-lightsout
QUOTE (thefloatingmonkey @ May 17 2009, 01:04 PM) *
Yeah, I hate that low left hand of his. There is just no reason to keep it low like that.

Froch has that low left hand too, and he is a lot slower than Ward. Both of them need to keep their hands up.


Yeah... I agree. Maybe he did not pay last night, but there are better fighters that lie ahead that could possibly make him pay. Whats wrong with watching a guy like Hopkins and taking some pointers off his style(hands up)? Just something he should work on IMO. Not saying to change his style completely, but more refine it for a longer and safer career.
Romulus9
This just in from the Associated Press:

Boxer Miranda being investigated for suspicious substance

OAKLAND (AP) — The California State Athletic Commission confiscated a suspicious substance from the corner of Colombian boxer Edison Miranda during his loss to Andre Ward on Saturday, Ward's trainer and the fight's promoter told The Associated Press.

Trainer Virgil Hunter said the substance was in a brown bottle resembling a Vaseline tub apparently hidden in a bag in Miranda's corner. When Miranda's cornermen were spotted taking the substance out of the bag around the fourth or fifth rounds of the fight at Oakland's Oracle Arena, it was seized before officials actually saw it given to Miranda, according to promoter Dan Goossen.

"We're not sure if anything was going on, but it's good they caught it," Hunter said.

Goossen said the athletic commission will test the substance and could have results by Monday. The commission's offices were closed Sunday, and spokesman Luis Farias didn't have any information on the incident.

Ward (19-0) won the 168-pound fight in his hometown with a comfortable unanimous decision over Miranda (32-4), a former top middleweight prospect who has lost to champions Arthur Abraham and Kelly Pavlik in the past two years.

"I don't want to jump to any conclusions right now," Goossen said. "That's why I didn't say anything (Saturday). There's nothing worse than taking away from a good victory by putting the focus on something else."

Miranda's managers, Steve Benbasat and Greg Wantman, didn't immediately respond to e-mails.

Hunter and Goossen don't assume anything illegal occurred, and most of the substances applied to boxers' heads and bodies during fights are legal petroleum jelly mixes or coagulants to stop bleeding.

But boxing lore also is filled with stories of substances surreptitiously applied to a fighter's head or arms that could irritate an opponent's eyes or open cuts. Ward had a cut above his eye from early in the first round after a head-butt from Miranda.

Petroleum jelly is routinely applied to fighters' faces to stop cuts and to lessen the impact of punches to the face, although it's not allowed on the body and can't be used excessively, according to California's boxing code of regulation.

The California commission suspended former welterweight champion Antonio Margarito for at least one year in February after illegal wraps containing a substance resembling plaster of Paris was discovered on his hands before his fight against Shane Mosley in Los Angeles.

Ward stated his case for a title shot with his decisive victory over Miranda, although the 2004 U.S. Olympic gold medalist might not get it immediately. Ward has called out WBC champion Carl Froch of Britain, and Goossen also would like to match Ward against IBF 168-pound champ Lucian Bute, who hasn't fought outside of Montreal in four years.

"I want any champion with a belt," Ward said. "My respect is here now, and it's going to continue to grow. That's the story of my career. ... I don't know what it is about my style, but they get in there and then they see something different. By the time they figure it out, it's too late."
D-MARV
I say set up Miranda Vs Margarito @ 158.
King Eugene
QUOTE (damarvelous1 @ May 17 2009, 09:16 PM) *
I say set up Miranda Vs Margarito @ 158.

With loaded gloves!
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