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Byrd Man
Great article pointing out what should be obvious. The author is obviously biased, but it doesn't make what he's saying any less right.

http://pound4pound.com/BillysBoxingBlog/20...ox-office-goat/

Billy’s Boxing Blog
Test WeekendTicket Sales Show “Cash Cow” Floyd Is Really Just A Box Office Goat
by William Trillo

If you have the patience to sit through one of Floyd Mayweather Jr.’s self serving diatribes you will undoubtedly hear him tell you that when it comes to ticket sales and PPV buys he is the “Cash Cow” in boxing.

So far ticket sales for his upcoming fight with Juan Manuel Marquez tell us otherwise.

Tickets for “Number One/Numero Uno” went on sale this past Friday morning and as I sit to write this article late Monday night, a quick check of Ticketmaster reveals that there are plenty of tickets left for the Las Vegas battle….PLENTY!

Oh sure all the 150 dollar tickets are gone, and one could easily argue that Marquez fans are the ones who gobbled up those low priced seats. But in every other price range there a tickets-o-plenty. In fact if someone wanted to snag 10 ringside seats up (most allowed in one transaction) right now…they could. The only way all the ringside and other expensive seats sell is if Floyd buys them himself, goes to his favorite night club and throws them up in the air the way he does fake hundred dollar bills. But unlike the counterfeit hundreds (allegedly), most of these tickets will lie on the floor for the janitor to sweep up.

When Super Fights and/or Mega Fights tickets go on sale we were getting used to the promoter announcing in the first 2 hours that tickets have been “SOLD OUT” but arrangements have been made for closed circuit venues to open up on the night of the fight so everyone will be able to witness the battle.

No such announcement was made last Friday and it’s highly doubtful we will be receiving one anytime soon or at all for that matter.

In fact, the only times in recent history that announcement was made either the names De La Hoya, Hatton or Pacquiao were attached. Not coincidentally, the only time Floyd has been involved in a box office bonanza is when he had a dance partner like Oscar and Ricky. Floyd may be a whizz on Dancing With the Stars, but he’s got two left feet when it comes to waltzing with the Benjamins.

The fact is Floyd Mayweather Jr. was not a pay-per-view star before his 2007 fights with Oscar De La Hoya and Ricky Hatton, the numbers speak for themselves:

Mayweather, already a two-division Champ when he took on Arturo Gatti for a super lightweight title in his first pay-per-view fight in June 2005 did 365,000 buys, and you could plausibly argue that it was the vastly more popular Gatti who pulled in the majority of the buyers.

Floyd’s fight with Zab Judah for a 147 pound strap in April 2006 sold 375,000 PPV buys even though Floyd’s promoter at that time, Bob Arum, predicted it would do more than the 1.4 million buys De La Hoya-Felix Trinidad Jr. did in 1999.

Mayweather’s “fight” against flavor of the moment Carlos Baldomir in November 2006 did a paltry 300,000 buys.

The numbers don’t lie and the truth will be revealed when anemic PPV numbers come in after the fight.

In this “mega-fight” with Juan Manuel Marquez – which HBO somehow decided was worthy of the 24/7 treatment – Floyd won’t get any help from his dance partner, because Marquez, for all his accomplishments, has never been a box office PPV star. Even when he fought Manny Pacquiao in a very highly anticipated rematch, HBO reported 400,000 buys, which was good numbers for the little guys back then, but this a new day and age. The majority of the seats at the house for the Pacquiao-Marquez fight were filled by Filipinos, not Mexicans. And it’s fair to assume Pacquiao fans generated the lion’s share of the PPV purchases as well.

In their efforts to generate sales for this fight, the press tour was taken to England in a desperate venture to try and bolster PPV buys. But the Brit tabloid “The Sun” laid to rest any hopes this promotion was going to be a hit in England. The Sun said bluntly, “Floyd Mayweather was in London with Juan Manuel Marquez to promote his fight on July 18. It’s a fight Mayweather is expected to win. He will be too big for Marquez. The reason they are in Britain? The promoters believe it will generate big pay-per-view numbers here! At 4.30am in the morning! Dream on.”

Given the state of the economy and the slow start to ticket sales it is very realistic to believe this fight may do only 400,000 in PPV buys and if it breaks the 500,000 mark everyone involved should consider themselves lucky at best.

Everyone but HBO, the promoters and the fighters that is.

If the PPV numbers come in far lower than expected, HBO will certainly be second-guessing its decision to pour time and considerable money into another one of their 24/7 series. Time-Warner, which owns HBO, might also get on the horn to the network president Ross Greenburg and ask him how he so misjudged the potential of this fight.

Fact is, any boxing industry analyst could have told HBO that given Marquez’s anonymity beyond the Mexican community, and the over-inflated value Mayweather has given himself as a PPV draw, going for a 24/7 on what would seem to be a tune-up – albeit a difficult one – for “Money May” was a very questionable proposition. If HBO had said no to Floyd on the 24/7, what would he have done, gone to Showtime? This was probably seen as an investment by HBO in a huge Pacquiao-Mayweather showdown, but given Floyd’s aversion to be being hit, that fight may never take place.

The biggest losers on this fight will be the promoters.

It’s very conceivable that Golden Boy and the respective Mayweather and Marquez promotional companies, who like all promoters had to pay the purses on a PPV fight – are going to lose their proverbial butts on this one. The fighters also lose, too, because their contracts include a percentage of the PPV revenue.

Sorry, but there is no way in hell anybody who speaks only Spanish gives a darn about Mayweather, and in my humble opinion we’ve seen way too much 24/7 of all the Mayweather’s, especially Floyd Jr.

But Mayweather Jr. probably demanded it, and HBO invested the money just to make him happy, not to mention it’s a good way to suck up to “Pretty Boy” just in case he does grow a set of cajones and fights Pacquiao somewhere down the line. (I’ve already predicted he won’t).

Bottom line here, Mayweather is throwing around HBO money like the dollar bills he tosses around at strip clubs and he is getting away with it.

Nevermind what you are reading elsewhere that Mayweather is boxing’s true reality star and that we can hardly wait for HBO’s 24/7 to begin. That’s just more sucking up to HBO and Mayweather by the Fat Man.

The numbers speak for themselves and right now the dismal ticket sales are pointing to Mayweather vs. Marquez being one of the biggest PPV busts of all time.
MarzB
Didn't you post this article in another thread? Talk about SCREAMING for attention. At least type out YOUR own words since you obviously feel SOOOO strongly about a man who you don't know personally.

Can we at least wait to see how his fight does with Marquez before we call anything a "myth"? I know you're seething and oozing ready to burst with your anti Floyd venom but just wait. I have a question for you though and please, DON'T comment with an article. I'd like your own words.

  • If Floyd right now at this point isn't the "Cash Cow" or his claim has zero validity who is and most importantly WHY??
  • Name me ANY current boxer with a nationally televised commercial for a recognized Fortune 50 company?? (PS, if "dissenters" such as your self amongst ANY of your other cohorts merely dismiss this as nothing, look no further in history when after Marvin Hagler's victory over Thomas Hearns how his "Right Guard" "Anything else is uncivilized" ad vaulted his popularity to where as he still earned more in his fight with Leonard who was definitely the cash cow despite comig out of retirement. )
  • Name me a fighter who retired for the duration of whatever Floyd's "pseudo" retirement was that still was discussed COUNTLESS on most boxing message boards if not on a daily basis DEFINITELY on a weekly basis?? (Max's, Dogshit boxing, EastSide, BoxingScene's, etc)?
  • Lastly, tell the truth. I'm willing to bet your still "not wired for cable" self (LOL, you're really gonna be stuck after June 10th) will still find SOME way or another to WATCH this fight despite what you (and the other "dissenters") say otherwise right??
Byrd Man
It's simply me posting an article. I've been on record as saying what I think of Floyd many many times. So your insinuating that I can't speak for myself and have to rely on other's words is stupid and ignorant.

I don't like Floyd because he's arrogant and disrespectful. Whether that's an "act" or what, I don't know and don't care. All I know is the man is a rude disrespectful arrogant asshole. Period point blank.

The man is immensely talented and skilled in the ring.

Now to address your questions:

1. When I post an article pointing out that he is in fact not the "cash cow" of Boxing that he pretends to be, that's not a lie, at least based on his ppv history without DLH and Hatton as his fight opponents. He routinely dismisses fighters like Shane Mosley and others saying "they bring nothing to the table". Floyd never brought anyone to the table either, and his fights NEVER were big on PPV until DLH and then Hatton. Mayweather believes he brought the majority of those there. *shrugs*.

2. Hey, congrats go to Floyd for getting the deal. Endorsements are great, and I have nothing negative to say about this.

3. He was discussed on message boards after his "retirement" because of the belief (that many many people have) that he ducked worthy fighters while fighting people of lower weight classes who had to come up or heavier fighters that had to come down. There were always people saying that he should have fought the best in his division instead of going outside the division. Also there were many people saying that he wasn't really retired. I'm sure Mayweather things as long as people are talking about him, that it's all good. And maybe it is. But the majority of people still talking about him were people who don't respect him. And some of them are just blatant people who don't like his success in the past. I have no problem with his success, I have a problem with his attitude and his arrogance.

4. As for my "not wired for cable self" lol....I don't have TV. I don't watch TV, besides any shows I follow I can catch online via Hulu or their network sites. No, I won't watch the fight, but I'll be interested to see who wins.

Oh and as for who is the cash cow, I don't really think there IS a Cash Cow in Boxing. I don't think there is anyone who has the ability to just bring massive numbers like De La Hoya did and Tyson did.

Marquez isn't that guy, Pac-Man isn't really that guy, and neither is Floyd. We're still waiting for that guy.

QUOTE (MarzB @ May 30 2009, 01:24 PM) *
Didn't you post this article in another thread? Talk about SCREAMING for attention. At least type out YOUR own words since you obviously feel SOOOO strongly about a man who you don't know personally.

Can we at least wait to see how his fight does with Marquez before we call anything a "myth"? I know you're seething and oozing ready to burst with your anti Floyd venom but just wait. I have a question for you though and please, DON'T comment with an article. I'd like your own words.

  • If Floyd right now at this point isn't the "Cash Cow" or his claim has zero validity who is and most importantly WHY??
  • Name me ANY current boxer with a nationally televised commercial for a recognized Fortune 50 company?? (PS, if "dissenters" such as your self amongst ANY of your other cohorts merely dismiss this as nothing, look no further in history when after Marvin Hagler's victory over Thomas Hearns how his "Right Guard" "Anything else is uncivilized" ad vaulted his popularity to where as he still earned more in his fight with Leonard who was definitely the cash cow despite comig out of retirement. )
  • Name me a fighter who retired for the duration of whatever Floyd's "pseudo" retirement was that still was discussed COUNTLESS on most boxing message boards if not on a daily basis DEFINITELY on a weekly basis?? (Max's, Dogshit boxing, EastSide, BoxingScene's, etc)?
  • Lastly, tell the truth. I'm willing to bet your still "not wired for cable" self (LOL, you're really gonna be stuck after June 10th) will still find SOME way or another to WATCH this fight despite what you (and the other "dissenters") say otherwise right??

D-MARV
ByrdMan...

It's people like you that makes Floyd the biggest draw in the sport. You will shell out 50 dollars to see Floyd get Knocked the F*ck Out...


But keep the threads coming... I enjoy reading articles on how much Floyd "ISNT" a draw.
Byrd Man
QUOTE (damarvelous1 @ May 30 2009, 01:44 PM) *
ByrdMan...

It's people like you that makes Floyd the biggest draw in the sport. You will shell out 50 dollars to see Floyd get Knocked the F*ck Out...


But keep the threads coming... I enjoy reading articles on how much Floyd "ISNT" a draw.


Nope. I made the mistake and bought the DLH/Mayweather fight because I was suckered into thinking it was going to be a fight with both sides actually fighting. Never again.

I think I've only bought two payperview fights in my life. Can't remember the other one, but I know the DLH/May fight was the last one.

There ARE people who will tune in to see him or see him get beat hopefully, but the numbers don't add up to him being the main draw in boxing. It just doesn't. Show me a fight before DLH that he did on PPV that sold anywhere NEAR what he did with DLH and Hatton? His argument that no one else brings anything to the table rings hollow because HE doesn't bring people.

It'll be interesting to see what the Marquez fight does. I could be proven wrong, as could the naysayers, and this could do 800k.

D-MARV
QUOTE (Byrd Man @ May 30 2009, 01:51 PM) *
Nope. I made the mistake and bought the DLH/Mayweather fight because I was suckered into thinking it was going to be a fight with both sides actually fighting. Never again.

I think I've only bought two payperview fights in my life. Can't remember the other one, but I know the DLH/May fight was the last one.

There ARE people who will tune in to see him or see him get beat hopefully, but the numbers don't add up to him being the main draw in boxing. It just doesn't. Show me a fight before DLH that he did on PPV that sold anywhere NEAR what he did with DLH and Hatton? His argument that no one else brings anything to the table rings hollow because HE doesn't bring people.

It'll be interesting to see what the Marquez fight does. I could be proven wrong, as could the naysayers, and this could do 800k.

It won't do 800, but I'm almost certain that it will do more than Pacquiao Marquez II. I predict around 500k.
Thegreatequalizer
i've never bought a mayweather ppv and don't really ever plan on it.
MarzB
Would you prefer he came out of retirement and immediately jumped into fighting Paul Williams,lol??

You can't name me ANY sport where a guy coming off a long layoff is thrown RIGHT back at the ZENITH of competition. (Not that I think Paul is that but just saying). In baseball guys go to the minors or are brought in on slowly. In basketball guys come off the bench and in football guys aren't playing every down. So why is Mayweather held to a different standard? Oh I know because with "Money" so comes the DOUBLE STANDARDS, roger that. (smirk)

I don't like Floyd because he's arrogant and disrespectful. Whether that's an "act" or what, I don't know and don't care. All I know is the man is a rude disrespectful arrogant asshole. Period point blank.


This is what sounds so "HOMO" to me by you and the Floyd "dissenters" here. I strongly doubt there are ANY female posters here, that said the last thing I talk about when I'm with my friends are, "yeah man that dude is an asshole. I don't like his demeanor". LOL That sounds exactly to me how a conversation a bunch of females would have. Maybe I'm cut from a different flock because I just don't CARE about ANY ONE outside of my families circle in how "arrogant", "mean", "rude" or "nice" for that matter.

That seems to be the number one complaint but you know what? It's compelling and it conjures up feelings hence why all the threads are created, why he's the discussion piece. You don't like it?? Why can't "nice guys get over", "why do good girls like nice boys", "why does GM get a bailout but you nor I would get a damn thing if our company was mismanaged the way GM was". Too bad. Life moves on. If everyone was how you (or I) think should be the planet would be really boring.

Contrary to belief by some, I don't like personally a lot of things Floyd does but it's not that big of an issue for me. I respect the dude because no matter the stupid shit he says or portrays, unlike PLENTY of other so called "HUMBLE" boxers, he KNOWS what butters his bread at the end of the day. His weight doesn't YO YO, he doesn't cut down 20+ friggin pounds unlike MOST fighters (and my personal theory is fighters should fight close to their natural weights but I digress) between fights, his training regimen is unreal, he understands theres more to boxing than mere puching (he understands about distance, timing), etc. I could go on but I keep the things boxing specific. I wish most would.

(in the next follow up post, FightHype's -"Floyd Dissenting Faction" will attempt to flame )
Thegreatequalizer
QUOTE (MarzB @ May 30 2009, 02:04 PM) *
This is what sounds so "HOMO" to me by you and the Floyd "dissenters" here. I strongly doubt there are ANY female posters here, that said the last thing I talk about when I'm with my friends are, "yeah man that dude is an asshole. I don't like his demeanor". LOL That sounds exactly to me how a conversation a bunch of females would have. Maybe I'm cut from a different flock because I just don't CARE about ANY ONE outside of my families circle in how "arrogant", "mean", "rude" or "nice" for that matter.

That seems to be the number one complaint but you know what?


it's not that he is those things. i have lots of friends who are rude, etc.

it's that he's a douchebag. people that act like floyd are people i would never want to associate with.
D-MARV
Floyd does a great job playing the Villian.
Byrd Man
I would have preferred he fought the best in his division.

Do you realize that when he "retired" he had not fought four of the top five in his division? The only one he fought was Zab Judah @ #5 (I believe was the rank).

Williams, Margarito, Mosley, Cotto....nothing. Surely all those weren't his fault, but the point is that there are people in his division that he refused to fight, often for bogus reasons "they don't bring anything to the table", and instead goes looking for fighters to gain weight or lose weight to fight him, while he stays pretty much where he is (give or take a few pounds).

as for the "homo" aspect, I just use to to explain why I don't care for him and would love to see him get his ass handed to him. You can make it out to be whatever you like though.

And I love how the basic idea of that article still hasn't really been discussed in here. Where is the proof that Floyd brings the numbers to PPV without him having a fighter against him who brings a massive following with them?

There were three fights quoted that got 300-400k PPV prior to the DLH fight.

How is that being the cash cow of Boxing? I understand the idea of people tuning in to watch him get his ass kicked or whatever, but apparantly there aren't that many according to the numbers. Add in the fact that the economy is the way it is, and I don't see this fight doing a lot.

I have no issue with him fighting a "tuneup" fight, even though he bragged and boasted that he didn't need a tuneup fight (before signing the tuneup fight). Saying he wasn't coming back for a tuneup fight, he was coming back to fight.

Anyone out there aside from the REALLY diehard Marquez fans or Mayweather haters actually think Marquez has a legit shot here? I'd like to see it happen, but I don't think it will.

Byrd Man
QUOTE (Thegreatequalizer @ May 30 2009, 02:26 PM) *
it's not that he is those things. i have lots of friends who are rude, etc.

it's that he's a douchebag. people that act like floyd are people i would never want to associate with.


Exactly. When you go out of your way to disrespect people, and say shit that he's said, you are begging people to hate you. And when they DO hate him, then suddenly they're acting "homo" and whatnot.

Don't blame the people who have a problem with ya boy, Marz, just blame the guy who's acting like that. lol
JD
QUOTE (MarzB @ May 30 2009, 02:04 PM) *
You can't name me ANY sport where a guy coming off a long layoff is thrown RIGHT back at the ZENITH of competition. )


I can...boxing.
Byrd Man
QUOTE (JD @ May 30 2009, 03:14 PM) *
I can...boxing.


Considering that Mayweather still tells everyone who will listen (and most who won't) that he's STILL the p4p best fighter on the planet, he shouldn't NEED a tune-up. He should have held off until the fight ended and then said "Pac-Man, let's go"

Everyone knows that aside from his money issues, the fact that Pac-Man is getting so much love now and being called the P4P king, is the reason "Money Problems" Mayweather is coming back.
D-MARV
LMAO... Of course Mayweather could have challenged himself a bit more. When he chose to retire, he did leave a lot of fights on the shelf. It's his career and he chose one of the easier ways out. I will never sit up here and say that Floyd is the greatest and he takes on all challengers. But the fact that people say he disrespects the sport and he's a pussy and he can't draw flies to shit is bogus. People have done worse. Mosley and Margarito, just to name a few. Floyd is Floyd. He has all time talent but not an all time heart. But the man can sell his ass off and that's not up for debate.
JD
Floyd deserves credit for turning himself into an attraction, there is no denying that.
thehype
LOL

I guess it just depends on your definition of being a draw. Now, is he as big of a draw as Oscar De La Hoya? Of course not! But then again, no one is and no one may ever be. Without a SOLID dance partner, I highly doubt anyone does PPV numbers above 600,000. I mean, just look at some of the top PPV cards over the last few years:

Trinidad/Wright - 520,000 buys
Trinidad/Jones - 500,000 buys
Vargas/Mosley - 420,000 buys
Tarver/Jones III - 415,000 buys
Taylor/Hopkins II - 410,000 buys
Pacquiao/Marquez - 400,000 buys
Mayweather/Judah - 375,000 buys
Mayweather/Gatti - 365,000 buys
Morales/Pacquiao II - 355,000 buys
Pacquiao/Barrera II - 350,000 buys
Mosley/Vargas II - 350,000 buys
Morales/Pacquiao III - 350,000 buys
Mayweather/Baldomir - 325,000 buys
Tarver/Hopkins - 330,000 buys
Pacquiao/Diaz - 250,000 buys
Calzaghe/Jones - 225,000 buys

The numbers don't lie. The truth of the matter is that both Pacquiao AND Mayweather pull in around 300,000 to 400,000 buys whenever they fight...the difference is the guy standing across from them. With Mayweather, it took guys like Gatti, Baldomir and Judah to get those numbers while with Pacquiao, it took guys like Barrera, Morales and Marquez. Knowing that, you could almost argue that Mayweather does indeed have a slight edge in being the bigger "cash cow" simply because he still pulled in those type of numbers with lesser opponents. Furthermore, when they both faced common opponents, like De La Hoya and Hatton, Mayweather still drew more.

The fact that Mayweather vs. Marquez didn't sell out in a few days doesn't mean that it's still not going to do 400,000 or more PPV buys. If memory serves me correctly, Pacquiao vs. Marquez II didn't sell out either. In fact, there were still a ton of tickets available two weeks out from that fight (here's a press release from March 5, ten days before the fight, where they're still advertising tickets: http://www.fighthype.com/pages/content2143.html ). It simply means that it's not a big event...unlike the HUGE events involving De La Hoya and Hatton. Just to take it a step further, if you really want to make a comparison between the two, Mayweather's fight with Hatton sold out in the first 30 minutes that tickets went on sale whereas Pacquiao's fight with Hatton didn't sell out until two weeks before the fight. That being said, I don't necessarily consider that to be an indicator of either man's drawing power as I really think Ricky Hatton had a lot more to do with it in both cases...but still, while I'm sure people are tuning in to see Manny Pacquiao, I still think there's even more people tuning in to see Mayweather...either to win or to see someone be the first to beat him. That fact alone is the reason why he brags about being the "cash cow".

Come July 18, I don't expect to see record PPV numbers, but I do think he'll probably pull in better numbers than Pacquiao did against Marquez simply because a lot of people will be curious to see what he looks like after the retirement. Any time a fighter comes out of retirement, curiosity causes people to push that "Buy" button on their remote. Is Mayweather vs. Marquez going to do more numbers than Pacquiao vs. Hatton? Of course not, but as long as it does more than Pacquiao vs. Marquez, they, as well as HBO, will consider it to be a success. I'm willing to guess that it does between 450-500,000 buys. If it does more than that, I think they'll be even happier as HBO is fully aware that this isn't a mega-event.

On a side note, I don't even think Mayweather vs. Pacquiao is the biggest fight that can be made in boxing. It might be the most important, but as far as money is concerned, in my opinion, I think De La Hoya vs. Hatton SHATTERS all PPV records. If Oscar is smart, he'll unretire and fight Hatton in England in front of 60,000+ screaming fans...I bet that does more buys than both of his fights with Mayweather and Pacquiao combined. WOOOOOOOOOOOO!

Seriously though, the reality as that both Floyd Mayweather Jr. AND Manny Pacquiao are CASH CALVES when compared to the TRUE CASH COW, Oscar De La Hoya:

De La Hoya/Floyd Mayweather Jr. - 2.4 million buys
De La Hoya/Manny Pacquiao - 1.25 million buys
De La Hoya/Felix Trinidad - 1.4 million buys
De La Hoya/Bernard Hopkins - 1 million buys
De La Hoya/Shane Mosley II - 950,000 buys
De La Hoya/Fernando Vargas - 935,000 buys
De La Hoya/Ricardo Mayorga - 925,000 buys
De La Hoya/Pernell Whitaker - 720,000 buys
De La Hoya/Shane Mosley - 590,000 buys
De La Hoya/Ike Quartey - 570,000 buys
De La Hoya/Hector Camacho - 560,000 buys
De La Hoya/J.C Chavez II - 525,000 buys
De La Hoya/Javier Castillejo - 400,000 buys
De La Hoya/Felix Sturm - 380,000 buys
De La Hoya/Yory Boy Campas - 350,000 buys
De La Hoya/M.A. Gonzalez - 345,000 buys
De La Hoya/Rafael Ruelas - 330,000 buys
De La Hoya/Wilfredo Rivera - 240,000 buys
De La Hoya/Genaro Hernandez - 220,000 buys

Truly astonishing that De La Hoya still pulls in ridiculous numbers like that. There's only oooooooone De La Hoya...ooooooooone De La Hoya.....
Romulus9
The numbers for DLH-Hatton would be absolutely sick. It's very possible that it could surpass the numbers for DLH-Mayweather, and it certainly would surpass DLH-Pacquiao. The odd part? I'm not sure WHY. It'd be an awful fight. Oscar, even this Oscar, could win that fight with his left hand only. The Hatton clan that couldn't make it there in person would buy that fight for whatever it cost, and the American crowd would buy in nicely as well. Crazy numbers for a fight that simply would not deliver.

The good news is that they'd absolutely sell out a 60K seat venue for the fight live in Britain, Oscar could demand whatever number for the payday that he could ever want, and there's not much risk. Hatton couldn't do a thing with him.

What I'd really enjoy is to see Floyd Sr. in Hatton's corner... leaving Oscar no choice but to hire Freddie Roach.

DLH-Hatton would be a monster event and a lackluster fight. Simple enough.

On a final side note:

QUOTE (thehype @ May 30 2009, 06:12 PM) *
Truly astonishing that De La Hoya still pulls in ridiculous numbers like that. There's only oooooooone De La Hoya...ooooooooone De La Hoya.....


You're fired. Get out.
Byrd Man
Quality post Hype!
Douchebag
Floyd vs JMM will prove once and for all that Floyd is not as big a draw as he thinks he is. His dick suckers are going to be eating humble pie also.
Douchebag
QUOTE (JD @ May 30 2009, 03:14 PM) *
I can...boxing.

I don't know how he made that mistake.
D-MARV
QUOTE (The Conscience @ May 30 2009, 07:56 PM) *
Floyd vs JMM will prove once and for all that Floyd is not as big a draw as he thinks he is. His dick suckers are going to be eating humble pie also.

I guess you just didn't read Hype's Post?


Get the fuck out of here.
Fitz
QUOTE (MarzB @ May 31 2009, 03:24 AM) *
Didn't you post this article in another thread? Talk about SCREAMING for attention. At least type out YOUR own words since you obviously feel SOOOO strongly about a man who you don't know personally.


lol, you really don't take criticism of Floyd too well do you? You cracked the shits about a negative Floyd article being posted. laugh.gif
Douchebag
QUOTE (damarvelous1 @ May 30 2009, 08:08 PM) *
I guess you just didn't read Hype's Post?


Get the fuck out of here.




Tell the truth! You took offense, didn't you?
D-MARV
QUOTE (The Conscience @ May 30 2009, 08:57 PM) *
Tell the truth! You took offense, didn't you?

LOL... I'm good bro, I'm just shocked that you don't see Floyd as a draw. You know the sport well... I expect that from someone else, not you.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (MarzB @ May 30 2009, 07:04 PM) *
Would you prefer he came out of retirement and immediately jumped into fighting Paul Williams,lol??

You can't name me ANY sport where a guy coming off a long layoff is thrown RIGHT back at the ZENITH of competition. (Not that I think Paul is that but just saying). In baseball guys go to the minors or are brought in on slowly. In basketball guys come off the bench and in football guys aren't playing every down. So why is Mayweather held to a different standard? Oh I know because with "Money" so comes the DOUBLE STANDARDS, roger that. (smirk)


How about Ray Leonard you stupid cunt? He came out of retirement & fought at a weight far higher then he ever fought at against the best & most dominant fighter of that era.
Douchebag
QUOTE (damarvelous1 @ May 30 2009, 09:55 PM) *
LOL... I'm good bro, I'm just shocked that you don't see Floyd as a draw. You know the sport well... I expect that from someone else, not you.



Not as big as he or YOU thinks he is......
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ May 30 2009, 09:24 PM) *
How about Ray Leonard you stupid cunt? He came out of retirement & fought at a weight far higher then he ever fought at against the best & most dominant fighter of that era.


I notice Marz hasn't come up with an answer for this one. LOL He's probably on the phone right now with Sugar seeing if they can summon up a rebuttal to this most devestating observation. LOL
STEVENSKI
It pains me to say Leonard as he is another fighter whose personna I do not like much. At least he made the biggest fights happen eventually.
MarzB
QUOTE (Fitz @ May 30 2009, 07:55 PM) *
lol, you really don't take criticism of Floyd too well do you? You cracked the shits about a negative Floyd article being posted. laugh.gif


There's a difference between "constructive criticism" and "criticism lace with vindictiveness or or intent meaning to belittle an most of the articles amongst a lot of the message board post here are the latter.

So now that I've answered that salvo and since "you KNOW me", allow me to share an observation about your "persona". You try or more to the point "ACT" as if you're this non biased, take no sides pseudo arbitrator type of poster. But all bets are off when it comes to Floyd. So what makes Floyd gets under your skin? I thought you Australians were generally nice to all your 'mates'?

(I bet the answer deals with some what I said in my first second post in this thread)
MarzB
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ May 31 2009, 07:34 AM) *
It pains me to say Leonard as he is another fighter whose personna I do not like much. At least he made the biggest fights happen eventually.


Leonard fought Aaron Pryor, wow? Leonard fought Hagler with no contract stipulations such as "bigger rings" or types of gloves? Leonard fought Michael Nunn when Nunn called him out??
D-MARV
QUOTE (The Conscience @ May 31 2009, 12:11 AM) *
Not as big as he or YOU thinks he is......

LOL... He's the biggest draw right now. Numbers don't lie. But I'm done debating this, any fool can see that Floyd is a draw.
Vodoo
I like Floyd in the ring. The guys is borderline a genius boxer, but the fact that he's not fighting the guys in his weight and keeps making excuses mixed with his overall scumbag attitude is really turning me against him. I won't be rooting against him in JMM fight, but I won't be rooting against Juan either.

Lately Floyd has really reminded me of a politician with the way he talks. He continually uses politician techniques like repeatedly saying the same lie or half-truth over and over so it sticks and becomes truth. He answers questions with answers that have nothing to do with the questions asked, or he out right ducks questions. He'd make a much better politician than Manny Pacquiao that's for sure.
Douchebag
QUOTE (damarvelous1 @ May 31 2009, 10:31 AM) *
LOL... He's the biggest draw right now. Numbers don't lie. But I'm done debating this, any fool can see that Floyd is a draw.



I already stated that he was a draw.......
Fitz
QUOTE (MarzB @ Jun 1 2009, 12:01 AM) *
Leonard fought Aaron Pryor, wow? Leonard fought Hagler with no contract stipulations such as "bigger rings" or types of gloves? Leonard fought Michael Nunn when Nunn called him out??


He answered your question already. Don't even know how you are questioning Leonard's resume. Hagler is a much more dangerous fight than any fight you are trying to give Leonard shit for.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (MarzB @ May 31 2009, 03:01 PM) *
Leonard fought Aaron Pryor, wow? Leonard fought Hagler with no contract stipulations such as "bigger rings" or types of gloves? Leonard fought Michael Nunn when Nunn called him out??


You must just be incredibly stupid boyo because it is not up for debate who Leonard fought it is up for debate that YOU said

QUOTE (MarzB @ May 30 2009, 06:04 PM) *
You can't name me ANY sport where a guy coming off a long layoff is thrown RIGHT back at the ZENITH of competition.


I did just that & you make silly posts about things that have nothing to do with teh topic at hand. Once again you show blatant stupidity & somehow seem proud of your stupidity.

Nunn was a middleweight who brought nothing to the table for Leonard except a undefeated record at the time. Hagler was the recognised universal middleweight champion & the public were clamouring for a fight between the two for years.

Considering Pryor never fought above 140 in his first career & the fact that he was NEVER in the same division as Leonard or fought above 154 your argument is null & void once again.

Keep it up boyo you are clutching at straws & they are slipping through your fingers
MarzB
Dumb ass. End your little cyber war with me really. You don't know what your talking about generally and most of your comments (like the bitch that you are) come out of emotion and not fact. Most importantly I'm certain if you ever came across me personally your tone would be completely different. As I've said before I generally try NOT to address you (god wheres the "IGNORE" button when we need it) but somehow in your "lack of a life state" I tend to because of my own zeal to address ignorance.

That said. Nunn was the Pound 4 Pound guy when he called out Leonard #1. Most of all the same SHIT you criticize Floyd for your somehow giving Ray a "pass" for in that "Nunn" brought nothing to the table which is not exactly true. Nunn at the time was being budded as the next "IT" or "passing the torch to" in boxing. The dude appeared on of a couple of popular tv shows at the time, ah fuck it. You one of those people that facts doesn't mean anything to so forget me going into a longwinded spiel.

Bottom line as been clearly stated here is theres a double standard and I have no problem in saying it's riddled in (those that feel that way) for lack of a term "BITCHASSNESS".

It's cool to have an opposing opinion but thing like, 'wishing death', 'plotting out imaginged schemes' etc really shows you have nothing going on in your personal life and it's TOO bad you're that way.
MarzB
QUOTE (Fitz @ May 31 2009, 06:06 PM) *
He answered your question already. Don't even know how you are questioning Leonard's resume. Hagler is a much more dangerous fight than any fight you are trying to give Leonard shit for.


So why not acknowledge the FACT that Leonard DEMANDED a bigger than standard ring size?? Bigger gloves?? Less rounds (at the time 15 rounders were still being fought and the standard while 12 rounds were JUST coming into play)??

Now if Floyd would have done ANY of the above, people like yourself would be HAMMERING away on the keyboard and YOU KNOW IT.
JaRaNDa
Buisness/Finance has become a discussion in fighters credability???

It seems that Floyds fans are running out of arguments and excuses to why Floyd is such a dick and has ducked from many important fights!! So now arguments have become about how popular a fighter is??? What do people consider a 'DRAW'??? A PPV fighter?? Cotto, Mosley, Jones, Hatton, Pac, De la Hoya, Hopkins all appear to be a draw!
Is Mayweather as big a draw as De La Hoya, Hatton or Pac??...please!! so let's say his the 4th biggest DRAW in boxing..so what! what does that mean?? he is still a talented douche bag that has no balls or manners towards any worthy fighter!!

Fuck these debates are getting soo gay and materialistic for fans to start arguing how many PPV they sell or how much cash they have or don't have! Who fucking cares man..unless it's an argument due to who should be getting a bigger purse bid between 2 fighters when still in negotiations, then fair enough it may be relivant! Anyways it's not like Mayweather is liked, for those who actually buy his PPV I bet the majoirty wanna see him get KTFO anyways!
Fitz
QUOTE (MarzB @ Jun 1 2009, 03:05 PM) *
So why not acknowledge the FACT that Leonard DEMANDED a bigger than standard ring size?? Bigger gloves?? Less rounds (at the time 15 rounders were still being fought and the standard while 12 rounds were JUST coming into play)??

Now if Floyd would have done ANY of the above, people like yourself would be HAMMERING away on the keyboard and YOU KNOW IT.


Even Leonard demanding those against possibly the greatest MIDDLEWEIGHT of all time is still a whole lot more impressive than Floyd's come back with Marquez at 147, and it's going to be better anyway you slice it.
Now if Floyd fought anybody like Duran, Hearns or Hagler we wouldn't be hammering away on the keyboard either. We are even happy to settle for Cotto or Mosley which isn't Duran, Leonard or Hagler, but we will be happy with that.
If you see a mass of people criticising Floyd's opponents, chances are there is probably something wrong with them. That's a good rule of thumb. Thanks.
MarzB
Wait a minute.

Did Leonard NOT comeback out of retirement number 2 (first retirement was after the Olympics) with NOBODY Kevin Howard true or false?? By the way, thanks for NOT acknowledging my specific questions addressed to you. (So selective of you smile.gif )

So you're dare belittling the man who Floyd is fighting that most would agree is a top 3 guy if not the pound for pound guy??

I've been hearing this "lovely" selective debate of "Floyds fighting a little guy" which is laughable no doubt. You guys really think Floyd is a welterweight? Ok, fine at this stage I'd buy that. What the big deal with one class up or one class down? Forget JUNIOR classes since some of you like the previous post LOVE to echo the "old days" of "FIGHTERS FIGHTING EVERYONE". If thats the case then Anyone above light weight to middlewight or more specifically 136-159 is open game right? I'm only saying that for the sake of the "old time argument".

Meantime, why are we splitting hairs considering 90% of boxers today are NOT fighting anywhere near a weight class that their natural weight is?? So Floyd walks at 150, agrees to fight one helluva fighter in Marquez at 144 and somehow this is a mismatch? In his first fight back??

As far as the point about PAYING TO WATCH FLOYD LOSE. YEP!! You're right. Thats the beautiful part about life in that there are so called "villians", "heels", "bad guys" and theres the opposite along with the GREYs. Thanks for helping refuting the LACK of a point of the article and this thread although that wasn't your intention.
JonnyBlaze
Guys,ease up on MarzB..Lets just talk boxing..

You can't question Leonard's opponents at all..Yet,Leonard did not fight Pryor who was a legit fight for Ray..Pryor did put it to Ray in sparring and he did beat Hearns in the amateurs(either once or twice)..Pryor would have come up to 147 for Ray Leonard or Hearns in the pros but neither would give him the chance..I may give the edge to Pryor in a fight with Leonard..Pryor/Duran would have been sweet too..Back to the point though,the guys that Leonard fought were ATG's and he beat them..You can't criticize him though for not fighting one guy though..We can wish they had fought like people were wishing Floyd fought Margarito before Margarito got exposed as a fraud..
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (MarzB @ Jun 1 2009, 05:56 AM) *
Dumb ass. End your little cyber war with me really. You don't know what your talking about generally and most of your comments (like the bitch that you are) come out of emotion and not fact. Most importantly I'm certain if you ever came across me personally your tone would be completely different. As I've said before I generally try NOT to address you (god wheres the "IGNORE" button when we need it) but somehow in your "lack of a life state" I tend to because of my own zeal to address ignorance.

That said. Nunn was the Pound 4 Pound guy when he called out Leonard #1. Most of all the same SHIT you criticize Floyd for your somehow giving Ray a "pass" for in that "Nunn" brought nothing to the table which is not exactly true. Nunn at the time was being budded as the next "IT" or "passing the torch to" in boxing. The dude appeared on of a couple of popular tv shows at the time, ah fuck it. You one of those people that facts doesn't mean anything to so forget me going into a longwinded spiel.

Bottom line as been clearly stated here is theres a double standard and I have no problem in saying it's riddled in (those that feel that way) for lack of a term "BITCHASSNESS".

It's cool to have an opposing opinion but thing like, 'wishing death', 'plotting out imaginged schemes' etc really shows you have nothing going on in your personal life and it's TOO bad you're that way.


There is a ignore button Marz. Just a pity that you are too stupid to find it. As for your hollow internet tough guy rhetoric. I could care less there are millions of people in the world that could beat me in a fight & that does not concern me one iota as I am more than comfortable with Stevenski the person.

For Nunn vs Leonard (nice change of subject BTW) Leonard had been retired for several years & was coming back to face the top dog in the middleweight division. As he was the crossover superstar he could & did make certain demands that if Hagler did not want to concede to he did not have to make the fight. He knew it would be a massive payday & conceded to Leonard’s demands.

What this all comes back to is that YOU said no one has ever come out of retirement to face the top dog in sports & once again you were proven wrong. Deal with it little man.

QUOTE (MarzB @ Jun 1 2009, 06:05 AM) *
So why not acknowledge the FACT that Leonard DEMANDED a bigger than standard ring size?? Bigger gloves?? Less rounds (at the time 15 rounders were still being fought and the standard while 12 rounds were JUST coming into play)??

Now if Floyd would have done ANY of the above, people like yourself would be HAMMERING away on the keyboard and YOU KNOW IT.


See above for explanation but as the post was pertaining to the fact that in your words "You can't name me ANY sport where a guy coming off a long layoff is thrown RIGHT back at the ZENITH of" it was not relevant.
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE (MarzB @ Jun 1 2009, 01:26 AM) *
Wait a minute.

Did Leonard NOT comeback out of retirement number 2 (first retirement was after the Olympics) with NOBODY Kevin Howard true or false?? By the way, thanks for NOT acknowledging my specific questions addressed to you. (So selective of you smile.gif )

So you're dare belittling the man who Floyd is fighting that most would agree is a top 3 guy if not the pound for pound guy??

I've been hearing this "lovely" selective debate of "Floyds fighting a little guy" which is laughable no doubt. You guys really think Floyd is a welterweight? Ok, fine at this stage I'd buy that. What the big deal with one class up or one class down? Forget JUNIOR classes since some of you like the previous post LOVE to echo the "old days" of "FIGHTERS FIGHTING EVERYONE". If thats the case then Anyone above light weight to middlewight or more specifically 136-159 is open game right? I'm only saying that for the sake of the "old time argument".

Meantime, why are we splitting hairs considering 90% of boxers today are NOT fighting anywhere near a weight class that their natural weight is?? So Floyd walks at 150, agrees to fight one helluva fighter in Marquez at 144 and somehow this is a mismatch? In his first fight back??

As far as the point about PAYING TO WATCH FLOYD LOSE. YEP!! You're right. Thats the beautiful part about life in that there are so called "villians", "heels", "bad guys" and theres the opposite along with the GREYs. Thanks for helping refuting the LACK of a point of the article and this thread although that wasn't your intention.


If he's NOT a WW, what is Mayweather?? A Jr WW?? If he's that then, why make Marquez come up to 144?? I think the comparison to ray Leonard vs hagler is crazy. Ray wanted certain concessions to fight the GREATEST MW in the history of the sport. Ray came up in weight to do the job. Mayweather demands concessions of a guy 2 weight classes smaller than him. If Mayweather can make 140, then why not fight Marquez at 140?
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (JonnyBlaze @ Jun 1 2009, 05:52 AM) *
Guys,ease up on MarzB..Lets just talk boxing..

You can't question Leonard's opponents at all..Yet,Leonard did not fight Pryor who was a legit fight for Ray..Pryor did put it to Ray in sparring and he did beat Hearns in the amateurs(either once or twice)..Pryor would have come up to 147 for Ray Leonard or Hearns in the pros but neither would give him the chance..I may give the edge to Pryor in a fight with Leonard..Pryor/Duran would have been sweet too..Back to the point though,the guys that Leonard fought were ATG's and he beat them..You can't criticize him though for not fighting one guy though..We can wish they had fought like people were wishing Floyd fought Margarito before Margarito got exposed as a fraud..


Why would I ease up on a idiot who resorts to internet tough BS. The guys has been exposed more than Bush's foreign policy but we should ease up on him?

As for Pryor he deserved a chance? How about earning a chance instead by taking even one fight at 147 or 154 & winning?
Fitz
QUOTE (MarzB @ Jun 1 2009, 03:26 PM) *
I've been hearing this "lovely" selective debate of "Floyds fighting a little guy" which is laughable no doubt. You guys really think Floyd is a welterweight? Ok, fine at this stage I'd buy that. What the big deal with one class up or one class down? Forget JUNIOR classes since some of you like the previous post LOVE to echo the "old days" of "FIGHTERS FIGHTING EVERYONE". If thats the case then Anyone above light weight to middlewight or more specifically 136-159 is open game right? I'm only saying that for the sake of the "old time argument".


Translation: I'm only using old time argument because it's the only way it can make Floyd look good. Floyd is fighting someone 2 divisions below, but I will try make it look good by pretending this is the 1970's and act like it's only one division apart when in reality, it's two in todays standards.
Other fights like Darchinyan, Pacquiao, Williams, Marquez have all been able to adjust to 'modern' day, fight tough fights, guys in there weight class. Why can't Mayweather?

QUOTE (MarzB @ Jun 1 2009, 03:26 PM) *
You guys really think Floyd is a welterweight?


Well he was about to fight Marquez at a catch weight, and now they are fighting at 147. He can't make 140? Well then he is a welter weight.

QUOTE (MarzB @ Jun 1 2009, 03:26 PM) *
Meantime, why are we splitting hairs considering 90% of boxers today are NOT fighting anywhere near a weight class that their natural weight is?? So Floyd walks at 150, agrees to fight one helluva fighter in Marquez at 144 and somehow this is a mismatch? In his first fight back??


Mayweather won't come down to 140, he was undisputed champion at 147. Cotto is at 147, Mosley is at 147. Marquez at 135. You can't see why we are complaining?
JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Jun 1 2009, 01:10 AM) *
Why would I ease up on a idiot who resorts to internet tough BS. The guys has been exposed more than Bush's foreign policy but we should ease up on him?

As for Pryor he deserved a chance? How about earning a chance instead by taking even one fight at 147 or 154 & winning?

Yeah,that is bogus shit to pull..

I just want to keep as many people on the boards as possible..Bashing on people have made quite a few leave..And The New left because of that shit and I really liked talkin with him..

I think Pryor deserved to fight the best guys like Leonard and Hearns..I just don't know why they didn't want to fight him and they both knew him very well..If Pryor was a nobody callin out these guys,then he is not worth wasting time on..Yet,I think Pryor deserved a shot at them..I also think your thing about earning at shot at 147 or 154 is true but we see this all the time..Floyd fought DLH at 154 and Pac-man fought him at 147..Pac-man and Floyd both fought Hatton..Pac-man skipped divisions and got a fight with DLH..Haye is fighting Klitchko after a win over Monte Barrett!!We've seen worse things happen than if Pryor/Leonard happened..Hearns should of been dying to fight Pryor again after losing to him in the amateurs to redeem himself to himself..
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (Fitz @ Jun 1 2009, 07:19 AM) *
Mayweather won't come down to 140, he was undisputed champion at 147. Cotto is at 147, Mosley is at 147. Marquez at 135. You can't see why we are complaining?


No I don't Fitz. He is fighting the goddam #2 P4P & so what if it is at welter. It is not like Floyd has any challengers at 147 to take on. Did you not hear him Shane has 5 I repeat 5 losses! Cotto got destroyed by Margarito so he is no challenge & Margarito lost to PBF on paper already so he did not have to fight him. Don't you see this is the only option for Floyd fighting a guy stepping up from 135.
JaRaNDa
QUOTE (The Original MrFactor @ Jun 1 2009, 07:06 AM) *
If he's NOT a WW, what is Mayweather?? A Jr WW?? If he's that then, why make Marquez come up to 144?? I think the comparison to ray Leonard vs hagler is crazy. Ray wanted certain concessions to fight the GREATEST MW in the history of the sport. Ray came up in weight to do the job. Mayweather demands concessions of a guy 2 weight classes smaller than him. If Mayweather can make 140, then why not fight Marquez at 140?



Leonard not fighting one single fighter (I don't know the circumstances that well) should not be compared to or accepted as ok for Mayweather ducking an ENTIRE DIVISION(s)!
Then why not have mayweather move up to Middle to fight Pavlik! Evan then Hagler was never embarressed in his previous bouts and Kelly will NEVER come close to what Hagler or any top 10 middleweight will ever do!
I feel this is a bad argument and comparison, also a slap in the face to compare one of Leonards career defining fights to one of Mayweathers typical cowardly picks!

People should concerntrate on fighting their respective 'DIVISION' fighters to become p4p best and not fighting other p4p fightres to become p4p best! What good is p4p#1 fighting p4p#2 if they are 2 divisions apart?? if both fighters are in the same division and cross paths or one deservingly moves up to the same division then bring it on!!
JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Jun 1 2009, 01:46 AM) *
No I don't Fitz. He is fighting the goddam #2 P4P & so what if it is at welter. It is not like Floyd has any challengers at 147 to take on. Did you not hear him Shane has 5 I repeat 5 losses! Cotto got destroyed by Margarito so he is no challenge & Margarito lost to PBF on paper already so he did not have to fight him. Don't you see this is the only option for Floyd fighting a guy stepping up from 135.

It's all making sense now!!!!

hahahaha..Just playin..
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