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traced4040
i was just readin the ufc 98 pay figures

http://sports.yahoo.com/mma/news?slug=ys-m...o&type=lgns

and started thinking that money is killing boxing

ufc guys get around $50,000 - $400,000

i would argue that boxing is more brutal because the main aim is to go for the head and that there are more chances for injury later on but..........

i just cant justify the silly amounts of money some boxers get

i guess it could be argued that boxers deserve the moeny that they make but the result is a slowly dying sport

sure there is the 140 - 154 divisions with strong compeition but everything else is supported by true fight fans because of the relatively weak competition and numerous governing bodies

part of the problem is that with fighters getting paid so much money they can choose to cherry pick opponents instead of having to fight for a livin

also look what money did to people like tyson, he would have een better off with half the money as he might have managed it better (probably not)

what vernon forrest did was ridiculous, how can fans be expected to maitain interest when the belt holder chooses not to fight.

in the ufc, an interim champ would have been chosen

conversely fighters starting out are paid peanuts

i think the disparity needs to be closed, i also think that promoters should be forced to use a percentage of the revenue to go into an investment fund for all boxers that fought under them

this way boxers get financial aid should they suffer injury whilst and more importantly once they finish fightin
STEVENSKI
Sorry i thought you were talking about Mayweather. He is like a cancer to the sport.
traced4040
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Jun 4 2009, 02:10 AM) *
Sorry i thought you were talking about Mayweather. He is like a cancer to the sport.


haha

that is also true!
Keith
money is killing boxing, but its not the boxers fault. its the promoters, hbo + showtime, etc. they have this scheme where they can charge 50+ for a fight with a crap undercard and make ludicris amounts of money. if i were a fighter, I would want as much of that as possible too. after all, they are the attraction.
rusty_trombone
The only reason boxing exists is because of money. UFC fighters are stupid for putting themselves through that crap for the peanuts they make. But really, what else are ex-high school wrestlers and karate masters and fat out of shape truckers and guys off the street in miami supposed to do for money? I guess it's better than becoming the local insurance salesman.
King Eugene
QUOTE (rusty_trombone @ Jun 4 2009, 08:34 PM) *
The only reason boxing exists is because of money. UFC fighters are stupid for putting themselves through that crap for the peanuts they make. But really, what else are ex-high school wrestlers and karate masters and fat out of shape truckers and guys off the street in miami supposed to do for money? I guess it's better than becoming the local insurance salesman.

I dont know who has the more brutal comments...you or method lol.
JLUVBABY
QUOTE (rusty_trombone @ Jun 4 2009, 07:34 PM) *
The only reason boxing exists is because of money. UFC fighters are stupid for putting themselves through that crap for the peanuts they make. But really, what else are ex-high school wrestlers and karate masters and fat out of shape truckers and guys off the street in miami supposed to do for money? I guess it's better than becoming the local insurance salesman.


you are freakin hilarious trombone...lol
rusty_trombone
QUOTE (JLUVBABY @ Jun 4 2009, 09:44 PM) *
you are freakin hilarious trombone...lol

it's funny because it's true. I bet you see that jerk off kimbo slice doing ads for the local used car dealership.

"Kimbo says if you don't buy from Jim Fuckbirds lot, then he'll squat in your backyard for 3 weeks and make you watch him beat up another bum(actual bum) while some 18 year old kid films it for youtube on his camcorder."
Jack 1000
Good call,

It has gotten to the point where boxers are way overpricing their worth at about 50 to 100 times normal inflation rates. I can't even imagine some of the figures that boxers are making or even seeing that type of money. Boxers being paid 20, 30, 40, 50 million purses, and often times the quality of opponent is not even that good.

You have MMA fighters competing for one-fourth the money, and often times what I have noticed is that the undercards are good, the stadiums are PACKED for the undercard fights, (when is the last time you did NOT see empty seats at a boxing undercard?) and in MMA, the undercards are often better than boxing undercards.

I blame the boxing promoters for putting so much more emphasis into advertising for a main event, than being willing to produce a quality undercard. Remember the quote I think it was in the movie, "Field of Dreams", "If you build it, they will come." I don't remember seeing that movie, but I never forgot that phrase. It means that you have to have a quality underline structure to draw people to the events they want to see. Ten years ago, Don King was smart in having four world title fight undercards leading up to a PPV event, and "people came" because the undercards represented a positive reflection to the sport, a reason for being there. Good fights that lead in to a good main event.

Today, you have two or three undercard 10-round bouts where the names mean nothing to the general public. There is no foundation in the undercards in most cases. The matches are nothing more than used to kill time leading into a sub-par main event, or even if its a quality main event, your asking people to care about one fight. Or at the very least, asking them to only come for one fight, and that type of promotion attitude is NOT how you draw fans to boxing.

In MMA, you could have 5 or 6 WORLD TITLE FIGHTS or quality elimination matches on one card. That is an example that boxing promoters need to follow in "building it, so they will come. Obviously, MMA matches can end much quicker than boxing matches, and personally, I always believe a classic boxing match will always take precedence over any match in the MMA. But at least build up the boxing undercards with an incentive to care. Right now, the public seems to be getting more quality on an MMA card than a boxing card. It does not have to be this way! However, it is the responsibility of the boxing promoters to provide better quality undercards to change this perspective in a positive way.

Jack
traced4040
great input jack

ive only started getting back into boxing with some really good fights in the last year

before that i went into (and still watch) MMA

the undercard is a real big problem also guys like liddell that do community work shows that you can be a fighter and still be a good role model. i think the UFC does a great job of promoting their fighters and that outside of pac, there isnt a lot of big name boxers that dont do it just for the money

my main prob with boxing today is people using that old line "hit and dont be hit" to justify everything from being overly defensive in the ring to avoiding fighters

people keep saying it without realising the effect that it has. mayweather stays undefeated yet hasnt fouhgt prime welterweights

i think in boxing that statement is a key fundamental

but the truth is that HBO or PPV boxing isnt boxing. i think the big fights are entertainment and if your getting paid $20M or if people are forking out $49.95 that you should at least try to entertain

i cant recall the last time a boxer won a round by blocking and i really wouldnt wanna pay money to see that
STEVENSKI
The "elite" boxers are paid far too much IMO they really are. The UFC pays it's fighters fuck all of notihing. Look at how much their promotions make vs the total live gate let alone the massive PPV profits.

Look at UFC92

Total PPV purchases were 1M + ($45M revenue)
Total live gate was $3.5M
Total declared purses $1.381M was as follows
Total declared revenue not including merch was $49.881M

Now if this prick Mr White's company is making at least $50M from this single event he is outlaying somewhere under $25M on it's cost & the company is making $25M +. That is worse than any boxing promoter I have ever heard of.

UFC generates a average of 500,000+ buys for its PPV cards yet the most profitable fighters like Chuck barely crack $1.5M per fight. Someone is making a lot of money & it is not the fighters that is for sure. Who in their right mind would headline on a PPV that does over a MILLION buys for $100,000?

Rashad Evans: $130,000 (includes $65,000 win bonus) def. Forrest Griffin: $100,000

Frank Mir: $90,000 (includes $45,000 win bonus) def. Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira: $250,000

Quinton Jackson: $325,000 (includes $100,000 win bonus) def. Wanderlei Silva: $200,000

C.B. Dollaway: $20,000 (includes $10,000 win bonus) def. Mike Massenzio: $5,000

Cheick Kongo: $90,000 (includes $45,000 win bonus) def: Mostapha Al Turk: $7,000

Yushin Okami: $32,000 (includes $16,000 win bonus) def. Dean Lister: $19,000

Antoni Hardonk: $28,000 (includes $14,000 win bonus) def. Mike Wessel: $4,000

Matt Hamill: $20,000 (includes $10,000 win bonus) def. Reese Andy: $15,000

Brad Blackburn: $14,000 (includes $7,000 win bonus) vs. Ryo Chonan: $18,000

Patrick Barry: $10,000 (includes $5,000 win bonus) Dan Evensen: $4,000
MarzB
QUOTE (rusty_trombone @ Jun 4 2009, 07:34 PM) *
The only reason boxing exists is because of money. UFC fighters are stupid for putting themselves through that crap for the peanuts they make. But really, what else are ex-high school wrestlers and karate masters and fat out of shape truckers and guys off the street in miami supposed to do for money? I guess it's better than becoming the local insurance salesman.


Thank you and I'd argue against the safety factor of boxing being more dangerous than UFC/MMA or whatever it's called. Elbow strikes, downward elbow strikes, hitting while on the ground, that crap is barbaric and I've never backed down from that. I wrestled briefly in high school and it's enough strain going down on the matt, imagine and elbow strike coming down with that. I won't say I respect those guys who do that for the pittance that they get but if they're willing to accept it, thats on them.

Back to boxing and money, is the proposed solution to more streamline the pay?? If you grabbed an inflation calculator and look at what some of the big guys then (Holmes, Leonard, Tyson, Spinks, Hagler, Duran) etc got in comparison to now. You'll see that that $11+ million Hagler and Leonard got (Halger the more) is actually no where near in line with what guys are getting today. In fact, theres less than a hand full of fights guys getting figures like that.

Money never killed any sport but if you want to make a case, the NFL's BS rookie contracts along with what the Yankees tend to give guys that play every 5 days I would say are MUCH more obscene than any of boxings worse purses.

Atleast boxers purses are generally based on what they can draw (gates and ppv) along with the money infused from the Networks.
Spyder
Money is what's keeping the sport alive!

If the money and purses weren't there, we'd see less and less athletes want to become boxers. Shit, the NBA and NFL already took all of our American Heavyweights...how many more future fighters do you guys want to lose?
Mean Mister Mustard
It helps and hurts. Like Spyder said, without the big purses how many guys would get into the ring to get punched for a living? Oh sure there are guys who would be pro boxers for a keg of beer but there is no denying that money is what drives the sport.

On the other hand, the outrageous purses some of these guys get for 1 fight takes away from potentially solid undercards. It has been proven however, that if you put together a solid undercard people will watch. Like Jack mentioned the old DK undercards. A good example of a solid undercard and all around good event was the Lightweight card featuring Diaz, Reyes, Hernandez, Escobedo, Katsidis, Chavez, Valero and Pitalua. All the matches were competitive and the crowd was into it from the first fight on, even if Diaz-Reyes got off to a tedious start.

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