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Full Version: So... Pacman-Cotto for the WBC Welterweight Diamond Belt?
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Kijis Konar
http://philboxing.com/news/story-26285.html

I also read in a Filipino website that Manny Pacquiao is not pleased with having to pay $150,000 to Valcarcel for the WBO belt, and that he is interested in this new belt. Here's the link...
http://www.manilastandardtoday.com/section...d=2009/august/6

So, what does this mean for boxing? It seems like the WBC has created this useless belt to get some money, without caring about the confussion this outside-of-weight class belt will cause in terms of rankings and what not.

What do you guys think?
singletrack
QUOTE (Kijis Konar @ Aug 6 2009, 11:43 PM) *
http://philboxing.com/news/story-26285.html

I also read in a Filipino website that Manny Pacquiao is not pleased with having to pay $150,000 to Valcarcel for the WBO belt, and that he is interested in this new belt. Here's the link...
http://www.manilastandardtoday.com/section...d=2009/august/6

So, what does this mean for boxing? It seems like the WBC has created this useless belt to get some money, without caring about the confussion this outside-of-weight class belt will cause in terms of rankings and what not.

What do you guys think?


I think it's pretty stupid personally. What if there are multiple guys, fighting at multiple catch weights, that will not be able to fight each other? Will there be multiple "diamond" champions? The press release doesn't even make sense. So Cotto v. Pacquiao for the WBC diamond championship is more of a draw than Cotto v. Pacquiao (p4p #1) with HBO 24/7 coverage? After all, they claim that the reason some of the catch weight fights haven't been a "complete" success (nice wording) is because people want to see a belt involved. Will they be charging sanctioning fees? The whole thing sounds redundant with the ever increasing popularity of the p4p rankings.

...desperate attempt to remain relevant in the face of an increasingly educated boxing public.

...and how pathetic would it be for Pacman to set the record for titles by wining one that was created just prior to the fight?
STEVENSKI
Looks like complete BS to me. If it is true than that is even more BS.
The CEO
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Aug 7 2009, 12:10 AM) *
Looks like complete BS to me. If it is true than that is even more BS.


+1

This is plain wrong.
Mean Mister Mustard
LOL just when you think the alphabet cartels can't get any dumber they come out and surprise us with this diamond (pun intended).

Let me get this straight, a new belt for a non existent division? WTF?

Singletrack, nice catch there on the "complete sucess" spin they added.
JLUVBABY
i thought arum agreed to pay the sanction fee for the wbo...?... i could be wrong..
STEVENSKI
Man this sounds like a complete red herring to me.
Col Reb
If Pac goes through with this I will pull against him from here on out. He is becoming quite the diva, which is disappointing because he seemed like such a nice guy. Having diamond belts will hurt boxing even more; if anything they should be reducing the number of belts. At this point I wish Dana White could takeover boxing and call the shots. Life would be much better for all of us fans.
kidbazooka1
WTF no one in there right f*cking mind will take that belt seriouse.
King Eugene
When Cotto wins he should take the belt and trash it immediately!

On a more serious note are these guys serious? Would this really give Manny his 7th world title? This is ridiculous!
Thegreatequalizer
this is one of the stupidest things ever.
Thegreatequalizer
QUOTE (King Eugene @ Aug 7 2009, 02:11 AM) *
On a more serious note are these guys serious? Would this really give Manny his 7th world title? This is ridiculous!


that's funny. "well, i had championship belts in 15 divisions. 140, 142, 143, 145, 147, 148..."
Byrd Man
I always have this fantasy where I somehow come into billions of dollars, and I set out with some friends to buy out all the Alphabet organizations.

Have about 10 friends pose as totally separate entities to take over their organization. Once I get all of them under my sole ownership, I'd seek out someone who has NO connection to any boxer, or manager or resort or gambling or anything like that. But this person would have to OBVIOUSLY have a deep love of the sport of Boxing, and be dedicated to restoring the honor and dignity where these lame fucks have destroyed it.

And I would then sit down with them and try to hammer out a new way of sanctioning. Have 1 Belt for each division. No catchweights. If a belt for the 140-147 division is on the line, than both boxers can come in at whatever weight they want, as long as it's within 140-147. If they want a catchweight, it's not for the belt. END OF DISCUSSION.

Have minimum sanctioning fees (if at all) and try to regain some type of respectability in the sport.

No more of this bullshit "Champion in recess" or "Champion Emeritus" or whatever.

A guy can dream I guess.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (King Eugene @ Aug 7 2009, 06:11 AM) *
When Cotto wins he should take the belt and trash it immediately!


No if he wins he should get some pliers out & start tearing out the 598 diamonds 196 emeralds & 6 rubies scraming "I'm rich biatchez!".

Seriously though. Using 596 diamonds, 196 emeralds, 6 rubies, obsidian to fill out the WBC logo, 18K gold & Italian "ferrari" leather would mean teh belt would be worth more than teh fight & is a obvious sign of the red herring. When has Suleman ever given away a thing?







QUOTE (Byrd Man @ Aug 7 2009, 06:19 AM) *
Have minimum sanctioning fees (if at all) and try to regain some type of respectability in the sport.


I know you can dream but your organisation would never turn a profit & be continually in the red. You could charge larger sanctioning fees as because every title fight would be genuine it would generate more revenue.
D-MARV
Im going to stop hating on Pac. This latest shit is retarded but this fight should be fireworks. And as long as the winner fights the winner of Mayweather-Marquez then I have no reason to complain. It will be like a mini tournament to crown the P4P king!

But these fucking Pac nuthuggers can shove the 7 division title shit up there fucking asses.
torvix2000
QUOTE (damarvelous1 @ Aug 7 2009, 07:03 AM) *
Im going to stop hating on Pac. This latest shit is retarded but this fight should be fireworks. And as long as the winner fights the winner of Mayweather-Marquez then I have no reason to complain. It will be like a mini tournament to crown the P4P king!


Good! You've finally seen the lights. I sure hope lots follow.
Fadetwist
This sport needs to have some kinda international committee, this is just weird.
caneman
QUOTE (Thegreatequalizer @ Aug 7 2009, 02:15 AM) *
that's funny. "well, i had championship belts in 15 divisions. 140, 142, 143, 145, 147, 148..."



I'll start by saying that I don't think it should be for a belt @ a catch weight but someone brought something to my attention that I never thought about or looked @ in this way!!!! WW is from 141-147 so the catch weight is @ WW!
Keith
Maybe Pac should petition the WWE so this fight could be for the Intercontinental belt. I bet McMahon wouldnt even ask for a sactioning fee.

This belt will lead to more catchweight fights. A sorry state of affairs this is.
torvix2000
LOL!

A lot of people can't seem to just watch the exciting fight between Pac and Cotto and forget about the f***ing belts!!!
torvix2000
And the fight's on. As agreed upon when both Cotto and Pacquiao agreed VERBALLY a long time ago.
STEVENSKI
Thsi seriously has to be a joke!! Look at what the belt is alledgedly made from for fucks sake!!
Box in Hand
This is becoming a pageant. I don't want no stinking pageant. I want violence, pure unadulterated violence. I want two fighters going toe to toe for all the marbles. I don't need a KO, I like battles better. Take those diamonds and rubies and feed the poor.
Mean Mister Mustard
QUOTE (torvix2000 @ Aug 7 2009, 07:17 AM) *
LOL!

A lot of people can't seem to just watch the exciting fight between Pac and Cotto and forget about the f***ing belts!!!


We are still looking foward to the fight and no one is saying "Oh man now because of the diva belt the fight will suck". However, if you are a true boxing fan you can't stop from marvelling at the ever evolving stupidity of the Alphabet Organizations.
JLUVBABY
its fight teams like pac and roach that is a part of the problem with boxing... old school fighters never worried about weight... guys like henry armstrong and robinson and ike williams just to name a few that moved up in weight.. they thought they where the best and moved up to prove greatness... they didnt make catch weights and there where half the weight divisions back then (8)... i watched an interview by freddie roach on another site and his excuse when asked by mosley why he would fight oscar at 147 but not him at the same weight his responce was mosley was better than oscar... that is some faggot talk b.s.... if pac is so great he should be able to move up no questions asked and take control of the division.. he could weigh 142 and cotto mosley or whoever at 147 and if he is truly better he will come out on top... and this diamond belt is pathetic.. no validity in it what so ever...
Col Reb
Please, Dana White, buy out the boxing organizations and save us!

Seriously, I would so prefer the UFC business model with an owner picking the fights and there being one belt. The best fight the best, and (with the exception of Fedor) there is no disputing who the true champ is. The fights get major publicity and just maybe we could see more big fights and coverage on basic cable and eventually the networks. Boxing needs to look at the market and figure out it needs to change. What Pac is doing is terrible for the sport; we don't need more fracturing right now.
Thegreatequalizer
QUOTE (Byrd Man @ Aug 7 2009, 02:19 AM) *
I always have this fantasy where I somehow come into billions of dollars, and I set out with some friends to buy out all the Alphabet organizations.

Have about 10 friends pose as totally separate entities to take over their organization. Once I get all of them under my sole ownership, I'd seek out someone who has NO connection to any boxer, or manager or resort or gambling or anything like that. But this person would have to OBVIOUSLY have a deep love of the sport of Boxing, and be dedicated to restoring the honor and dignity where these lame fucks have destroyed it.

And I would then sit down with them and try to hammer out a new way of sanctioning. Have 1 Belt for each division. No catchweights. If a belt for the 140-147 division is on the line, than both boxers can come in at whatever weight they want, as long as it's within 140-147. If they want a catchweight, it's not for the belt. END OF DISCUSSION.

Have minimum sanctioning fees (if at all) and try to regain some type of respectability in the sport.

No more of this bullshit "Champion in recess" or "Champion Emeritus" or whatever.

A guy can dream I guess.


i actually came up with a comprehensive plan for an international boxing league a few years ago. the plan includes things like the use of instant replay, a restructuring of the scoring, retirement plans, regional and country-specific champs (and one world champ) for the divisions, training facilities, regular/consistent boxing events, training videos/archives, etc.
if you ever get that money let me know.
singletrack
QUOTE (Col Reb @ Aug 7 2009, 12:34 PM) *
Please, Dana White, buy out the boxing organizations and save us!

Seriously, I would so prefer the UFC business model with an owner picking the fights and there being one belt. The best fight the best, and (with the exception of Fedor) there is no disputing who the true champ is. The fights get major publicity and just maybe we could see more big fights and coverage on basic cable and eventually the networks. Boxing needs to look at the market and figure out it needs to change. What Pac is doing is terrible for the sport; we don't need more fracturing right now.


ehhhh - you serious? You think that putting one man, with a HUGE ego, in charge of boxing will make things more fair? No way my friend. There are many belt holders in the UFC that are NOT the best fighters in their weight class worldwide. That model is just as broken.
Jack 1000
You know,

Sometimes I see justification in the belts but NOT HERE! Catchweights should have no belts! Just fight! Make it 12 rounds non-title. Or in a fight where 3 of the 4 alphabet belts are on the line, make the fight 15 rounds. I know that would not go today for safety reasons. However, I still think that 15-round title bouts could be like the Superbowl of Boxing.

Jack
Box in Hand
QUOTE (Jack 1000 @ Aug 7 2009, 01:26 PM) *
You know,

Sometimes I see justification in the belts but NOT HERE! Catchweights should have no belts! Just fight! Make it 12 rounds non-title. Or in a fight where 3 of the 4 alphabet belts are on the line, make the fight 15 rounds. I know that would not go today for safety reasons. However, I still think that 15-round title bouts could be like the Superbowl of Boxing.

Jack



Too bad fighters these days are not in shape to go 15 rounds.
Spyder
Come on guys, this is nothing more than the WBC trying to get money from blockbuster fights.

The fighters would be stupid to pay sactioning fees for a made up belt, but if they do...so what? It would be just as meaningless as the Sugar Ray Robinson Trophy.
Nay_Sayer
Couldn't the WBC just sanction this fight for their "interim" title @ 147lbs?

This new belt for a non-existant weight class crap makes no sense...
JLUVBABY
QUOTE (Jack 1000 @ Aug 7 2009, 01:26 PM) *
You know,

Sometimes I see justification in the belts but NOT HERE! Catchweights should have no belts! Just fight! Make it 12 rounds non-title. Or in a fight where 3 of the 4 alphabet belts are on the line, make the fight 15 rounds. I know that would not go today for safety reasons. However, I still think that 15-round title bouts could be like the Superbowl of Boxing.

Jack


i agree with your statement 100% jack... catch weights are just what they are catch weights... it would be great to see the mega fights or the unifacation of all the belts fights going to 15 rounds...
Byrd Man
okay after I've had time to think about this I think this is complete bullshit. Not true in the slightest.

Let's think about a few things here.

1. With all those diamonds/rubies/whatever that it's got, how much is that thing worth? Would they REALLY do that for a belt that's not even a regular championship belt?

2. How would this work? Say Pac and Cotto fight for this belt and one of them wins it. Then next year (Without that winner losing) two DIFFERENT fighters fight at a catchweight in the same division at the same weight. Who gets that belt? The winner of pac/cotto didn't fight in this separate "belt" fight, so who gets the belt? Someone gonna make up a new belt?

Too many unanswered question with this and from what I've seen no reputable site has mentioned it so.....

probably much ado about nothing.
Byrd Man
then again........lol

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=21473
Box in Hand
Bring on the violence and keep the trinkets for the ladies.
Spyder
It's a fucking trophy.

It has zero significance outside of that one particular fight.
rusty_trombone
I didn't read the thread, and am not going to but here are my reactions:

If the WBC is charging for this belt, and these 2 idiots are dumb enough to pay them for it, then more power to the WBC. Those guys deserved to get charged the retard tax.

If they are not charging, and just presenting this belt to the winner, then I agree with Spyder, it's just a dumb ass trophy. Who the fuck cares? I don't think this is a major case here fellas.

I beginning to think hardcore boxing fans whine more about dumb ass shit than a fucking nagging wife. Stop being such bitches, it's boxing, not the UN. It's just a sport guys...
caneman
I don't really care about the belts anymore & since everyone agreed to the terms over a month ago, I don't think anyone should be bitching about it now but whatever! AGAIN, everyone(well not everyone but...)wants to blame Pac for this when Cotto signed the contract....he wasn't worried about it when he was gonna make over $10 million but now it's a problem!!! LMFAO! I wanna see a good fight & I hope the right bitch gets KTFO & then bitch slaps PBF & sticks a broom stick up his ass to make the PPV that much more worth it! laugh.gif
rusty_trombone
QUOTE (caneman @ Aug 7 2009, 08:19 PM) *
I don't really care about the belts anymore & since everyone agreed to the terms over a month ago, I don't think anyone should be bitching about it now but whatever! AGAIN, everyone(well not everyone but...)wants to blame Pac for this when Cotto signed the contract....he wasn't worried about it when he was gonna make over $10 million but now it's a problem!!! LMFAO! I wanna see a good fight & I hope the right bitch gets KTFO & then bitch slaps PBF & sticks a broom stick up his ass to make the PPV that much more worth it! laugh.gif

Thank you for your sanity
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (Col Reb @ Aug 7 2009, 01:43 AM) *
If Pac goes through with this I will pull against him from here on out. He is becoming quite the diva, which is disappointing because he seemed like such a nice guy. Having diamond belts will hurt boxing even more; if anything they should be reducing the number of belts. At this point I wish Dana White could takeover boxing and call the shots. Life would be much better for all of us fans.


Hey if you're a guy who got raised on the streets, and whose own dad ate your dog then I'm sure a diamond belt looks dayum good idea. LOL

Dude, Manny is from the slums of Manilla he's gonna love anything with the word Diamond in it. He'll probably be able to wear it out to the local disco and impress all his friends. In fact come to think of it, just about anybody would love a diamond belt. It sounds cool!!!!
Jack 1000
I could be wrong about this,

But I don't think this Diamond Belt is an official sanctioned weight related belt. (No sanctioning fees for it.) I think it's just a trophy that the WBC is giving out to mainstream fighters who box at catchweights. Let's hope that's all it is. Like someone said above, its just a trophy that you're a star fighter and you fought another star fighter at a catchweight. The winner gets a commemorative belt.

Jack
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