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Byrd Man
QUOTE
Heavyweight David Haye may find himself without an opponent on November 7th, according to the latest boxing news around the world. It seems that former two-time World Boxing Association heavyweight champion John Ruiz, the mandatory challenger to the WBA heavyweight crown, isnít going to stand by idly and allow the WBA heavyweight champion Nikolay Valuev bypass him and fight the number #4 ranked Haye instead.

As such, the WBA is going to have to make a decision in the coming days or else risk having Ruiz press forward for possible legal action to force his case. Itís kind of odd that Valuev choose to fight Haye in the first place when Ruiz was already sitting there as the mandatory challenger waiting his turn. Valuev should have taken care of business and fought Ruiz instead.

Once Ruiz was out of the way, then Valuev could go after Haye. It isnít as if Valuev hasnít already beaten Ruiz, since heís already defeated him twice in the past four years. Ruiz worked hard to get the shot at Valuev by beating Jameel McCline in the WBA title eliminator. Even though Valuev beat Ruiz later on in the year by a 12 round split decision in August 2008, Ruiz still remained ranked high in the WBA.

The WBA needs to do the right thing and not sanction the fight between Haye and Valuev. Unless, Valuev wants to give Ruiz a big step aside fee for him to wait for his title shot. Ruiz might be up for that but they need to accommodate the warrior because heís worked his way to the top spot and deserves his title shot. It doesnít matter that Ruiz has lost twice before to Valuev, whatís important is that Ruiz deserves his title shot because heís the mandatory challenger for Valuev. Fair is fair. Let the man fight for the title. If Valuev is still good enough to beat him, then so be it. If not, Ruiz will be the new champion. But you canít just skip over Ruiz and take a fight with Haye.

If the WBA forces Valuev to fight Ruiz, it leaves Haye in a bad position. Heís already backed out of fights against both Wladimir Klitschko and Vitali Klitschko for title shots. Haye would find himself missing out on a third world title in the past year. I canít believe it. Oh well. Haye would still be plenty young enough for the Valuev-Ruiz business to get ironed out and then Haye could always fight the winner.

I kind of doubt that Haye would be welcomed back as an opponent for either of the Klitschko brothers at this point because he appears to have temporarily burned his bridges with them. Haye could stay busy in the meantime against someone like Tyson Fury or Brian Minto until Valuev and Ruiz work out their differences in the ring. Itís like bad karma though for Haye, isnít it? But it might be a good thing in the end. Haye could fight someone else and get some more visibility before he fights Ruiz or Valuev. That canít be bad for Haye.
Col Reb
I really hope the WBA doesn't make Valuev fight Ruiz a third time. Why can't Ruiz go get in line for a fight against a Klit? Better yet, make him rematch Tua for the shot at a title! I'm just so sick of hearing Ruiz's threats of lawsuits. I don't hate the guy, but I don't like the way his management always whines in the press and threatens legal action all the time.
BGv2.0
BUT....Ruiz has a valid argument though and that is why I don't mind him dragging people into court.

If you like him or not is not really the issue.....he is ranked higher than Haye and if anything Ruiz Vs. Haye should have been made...as you KNOW Ruiz would have taken the fight....then the winner of that fight could have fought Valuev.

Ruiz is simply holding these bullshit sanctioning bodies to their own rankings and rules.

I don't blame him.....


NOW...saying all of that does NOT mean I want to see a Ruiz/Valuev III match...BUT...I would not mind a Ruiz/Haye matchup as I think Haye needs it and it would be interesting to see what problems Ruiz might pose for Haye.
D-MARV
How come Mayweather was never forced to fight a mandatory?

This mandatory shit is fucked up.
Lil-lightsout
Ruiz...you have had fucking countless opportunities at title shots. Step aside and let a young EXCITING fighter get a turn. No one is interested in seeing you fight Valuev a 3rd time.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (Col Reb @ Aug 25 2009, 08:27 PM) *
I really hope the WBA doesn't make Valuev fight Ruiz a third time. Why can't Ruiz go get in line for a fight against a Klit? Better yet, make him rematch Tua for the shot at a title! I'm just so sick of hearing Ruiz's threats of lawsuits. I don't hate the guy, but I don't like the way his management always whines in the press and threatens legal action all the time.


Why Ruiz has earnt his shot but he should sit back & let Haye undeservingly take it?
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (Lil-lightsout @ Aug 25 2009, 11:03 PM) *
Ruiz...you have had fucking countless opportunities at title shots. Step aside and let a young EXCITING fighter get a turn. No one is interested in seeing you fight Valuev a 3rd time.


Do you understand what it means to earn a shot. Haye is young, black, muscular & exciting but what has he done to earn a shot at any champion?
Lil-lightsout
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Aug 25 2009, 07:11 PM) *
Do you understand what it means to earn a shot. Haye is young, black, muscular & exciting but what has he done to earn a shot at any champion?


WTF has Ruiz done recently? He keeps losing title shots,right? Atleast Haye is the former cruiserweight champion and just beat a former fringe contender recently. I just think a fresh face should get his shot.
D-MARV
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Aug 25 2009, 07:11 PM) *
Do you understand what it means to earn a shot. Haye is young, black, muscular & exciting but what has he done to earn a shot at any champion?

This logic has always tripped me out. Haye was lineal champion at Cruiser, so he moved up to fight the champion at Heavy.

What has Pac done to deserve a title shot at 147? What did Hopkins do to deserve a title shot at 175? If you're the man in you're division then I have no problem with you moving up to fight for another title. That's what GREAT fighters do. I'm not saying that Haye is great but why take his opportunity away?
Boxingjunkie
QUOTE (StyleZ @ Aug 25 2009, 06:22 PM) *
I'm not saying that Haye is great but why take his opportunity away?



Because he hasnt earned it. He has done nothing at heavyweight to deserve it. Personally I would rather see anybody else get a title shot but these two. There are other heavyweights out there that deserve a shot before Haye.
D-MARV
Again, Haye was the undisputed champ at Cruiser. What did Mayweather do to deserve a title shot at 154?
D-MARV
QUOTE (Fitz @ Aug 25 2009, 07:52 PM) *
Hopkins didn't fight Tarver for a WBC, WBA, IBF or WBO belt. I think it was for the ring title. That said, Hopkins was still fighting the man and it was for the recognised champion, though it wasn't for one of the sanctioned titles.

Ok, So Haye can fight Wladimir but he can't fight anyone else?

LOL... Look, Great champions clean out divisions and they move up. I don't see the big deal here. They been doing this for OVER 100 years.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (StyleZ @ Aug 26 2009, 12:58 AM) *
Ok, So Haye can fight Wladimir but he can't fight anyone else?

LOL... Look, Great champions clean out divisions and they move up. I don't see the big deal here. They been doing this for OVER 100 years.



I see your point. Haye is doing what should be done. I just seem to have a soft spot for Jawny.
D-MARV
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Aug 25 2009, 08:01 PM) *
I see your point. Haye is doing what should be done. I just seem to have a soft spot for Jawny.

Soft Spot for Jawny? Come on Steve... LOL, He should be one of the hated!
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (StyleZ @ Aug 26 2009, 12:07 AM) *
Soft Spot for Jawny? Come on Steve... LOL, He should be one of the hated!


I dunno I just can't help like him. He tries his best with what he has got. I have to respect that. The fact that he has Stoney in his corner never made for a boring minute between rounds.
D-MARV
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Aug 25 2009, 08:48 PM) *
I dunno I just can't help like him. He tries his best with what he has got. I have to respect that. The fact that he has Stoney in his corner never made for a boring minute between rounds.

I guess I give credit for that!


I just get so sick of these old school fighter sticking around. Guys like Ruiz, Holyfield, Rahman, and even Tua. I wanna see these new cats step up. Guys like Arreola, Haye, Chambers, Povetkin... There's a cat named Malik Scott that has the size of the Klitschko brothers, and I'm told (when serious) could be a legit challenge but he has a problem with staying focused. I have always been a heavyweight fan but for the past few years I have had nothing to look foward too.
mrwigi
QUOTE (StyleZ @ Aug 25 2009, 06:56 PM) *
How come Mayweather was never forced to fight a mandatory?

This mandatory shit is fucked up.




i love how mayweather name is mentioned in a discussion about the heavyweights.
Nay_Sayer
QUOTE (Fitz @ Aug 25 2009, 06:52 PM) *
That said, Hopkins was still fighting the man and it was for the recognised champion, though it wasn't for one of the sanctioned titles.

Nope....
Col Reb
I'm still pissed because Ruiz gets an undeserved rematch with Valuev AGAIN but the WBA won't mandate a Valuev rematch with Holyfield after that robbery of a decision.
singletrack
I wish Ruiz would have stayed retired after a juiced-up Toney BEAT HIS ASS. Seriously, he must be one of the most boring fighters of all time. Although Valuev is just a freak show.
BGv2.0
QUOTE (StyleZ @ Aug 25 2009, 07:56 PM) *
I just get so sick of these old school fighter sticking around. Guys like Ruiz, Holyfield, Rahman, and even Tua. I wanna see these new cats step up. Guys like Arreola, Haye, Chambers, Povetkin... There's a cat named Malik Scott that has the size of the Klitschko brothers, and I'm told (when serious) could be a legit challenge but he has a problem with staying focused. I have always been a heavyweight fan but for the past few years I have had nothing to look foward too.


Man...as sad as it is for me to admit it...I too have always been a HW fan....BUT I have to totally disagree with you on allowing the likes of those you mentioned to continue on. At the VERY LEAST those guys are reminders of a time when the HW's were interesting.

Why on earth anybody is excited about the "new cats" is beyond me! These total F'N asshole bastards of the HW division today are about as interesting as a saucer of goat cum!

I'll give you Haye due to all his shit talking....maybe even toss in Arreola because of the same but also his power punching ability....although I give him little chance of doing much with his lack of dedication to even the smallest level of fitness.

BUT...they could tell me guys like Povetkin, Chambers, Sultan, Austin and the like were going to fight to the death in a "Beyond Thunder Dome" type situation....and I would STILL question if they could make it interesting and worth my time.

And Scott is part of the problem...guys like him and David Rodriguez.....that have been around the division for YEARS AND YEARS and not had one significant fight.....it's absolutely ridiculous!

Hell even F'N Bergeron has had a title shot because he at least accepted a decent fight!

These cats you speak of.....are PUSSIES!

So if old farts like Evander and the rest can still stay in the game and get decent fights based on their name value....let 'em...they ave earned that with what they have given to the sport in the past.

With every generation of HW's.....it is up to that new generation to FORCE out the old....and you do that busting them up.

Holyfield, Tyson and Bowe forced out the likes of Pinklon Thomas, Dokes and Carl Williams, just as those guys forced out Holmes who forced out Ali....

So....the next time you get pissed at an oldster taking a shot...put the blame where it belongs....not with the grizzled old warrior that is only taking what is being given to him....but be pissed at the young guys that did not force them to move on due to the lack of dedication or desire to force them out through their actions in the ring!

Holyfield/Valuev would have never have been made had Wlad taken Valuev out no matter the cost. Rock Wlad would have most likely never have taken place had Big Brother Vitali taken Rock out brutally years before, when that matchup actually meant something. And it's not just the Klits....guys like Scott should have already of tested themselves with other up and comers. Out of all the possible matchups....the only instance I can think of young guys fighting here of late was Povetkin/Chambers and Arreola/Walker. That is a huge part of the problem.


QUOTE (Col Reb @ Aug 25 2009, 09:59 PM) *
I'm still pissed because Ruiz gets an undeserved rematch with Valuev AGAIN but the WBA won't mandate a Valuev rematch with Holyfield after that robbery of a decision.


I second that!

lloyd mayflower
Ruiz has dropped his appeal. Haye v Valuev Nov 7
JLUVBABY
QUOTE (Col Reb @ Aug 25 2009, 09:59 PM) *
I'm still pissed because Ruiz gets an undeserved rematch with Valuev AGAIN but the WBA won't mandate a Valuev rematch with Holyfield after that robbery of a decision.


thank you...
JLUVBABY
QUOTE (BGv2.0 @ Aug 26 2009, 02:00 AM) *
Man...as sad as it is for me to admit it...I too have always been a HW fan....BUT I have to totally disagree with you on allowing the likes of those you mentioned to continue on. At the VERY LEAST those guys are reminders of a time when the HW's were interesting.

Why on earth anybody is excited about the "new cats" is beyond me! These total F'N asshole bastards of the HW division today are about as interesting as a saucer of goat cum!

I'll give you Haye due to all his shit talking....maybe even toss in Arreola because of the same but also his power punching ability....although I give him little chance of doing much with his lack of dedication to even the smallest level of fitness.

BUT...they could tell me guys like Povetkin, Chambers, Sultan, Austin and the like were going to fight to the death in a "Beyond Thunder Dome" type situation....and I would STILL question if they could make it interesting and worth my time.

And Scott is part of the problem...guys like him and David Rodriguez.....that have been around the division for YEARS AND YEARS and not had one significant fight.....it's absolutely ridiculous!

Hell even F'N Bergeron has had a title shot because he at least accepted a decent fight!

These cats you speak of.....are PUSSIES!

So if old farts like Evander and the rest can still stay in the game and get decent fights based on their name value....let 'em...they ave earned that with what they have given to the sport in the past.

With every generation of HW's.....it is up to that new generation to FORCE out the old....and you do that busting them up.

Holyfield, Tyson and Bowe forced out the likes of Pinklon Thomas, Dokes and Carl Williams, just as those guys forced out Holmes who forced out Ali....

So....the next time you get pissed at an oldster taking a shot...put the blame where it belongs....not with the grizzled old warrior that is only taking what is being given to him....but be pissed at the young guys that did not force them to move on due to the lack of dedication or desire to force them out through their actions in the ring!

Holyfield/Valuev would have never have been made had Wlad taken Valuev out no matter the cost. Rock Wlad would have most likely never have taken place had Big Brother Vitali taken Rock out brutally years before, when that matchup actually meant something. And it's not just the Klits....guys like Scott should have already of tested themselves with other up and comers. Out of all the possible matchups....the only instance I can think of young guys fighting here of late was Povetkin/Chambers and Arreola/Walker. That is a huge part of the problem.




I second that!


i agree with you 110% bout the young guns taking out the old school fighters, thats the way its supposed to be.. but fact remains that holyfield/valuev fight did happen and we all saw what happened in that fight and holyfield got a highway robbery... yet ruiz keeps getting shot after shot.. id rather see holyfield than ruiz... thats sad to say but it is what it is... ruiz dont even have stone anymore i dont think.. at least stone made in between rounds entertaining...
MarzB
I think this works out better anyways. Should Haye win (god heaven forbid he doesn't) he could set up a makeable fight against Ruiz at the O2 arena. While Ruiz is on the downside, his experience will definitely be what Haye needs and Haye gets a name on his resume.

Now he holds better cards with the Klichko's.

Props to Johnny for somehow getting paid outta this,lol. Man thats a hustler there for you.
Nay_Sayer
QUOTE (Fitz @ Aug 25 2009, 08:57 PM) *
Piss off. We have been over this that many times and so has everyone else with you. No point in going there again.

Facts are FACTS.

Jones' "reign" at LHW was a SHAM...
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