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provo
I just read the article of freddie ,fuck now he's saying cottos a dirty fighter and he don't want joe cortez to ref cause he's puerto rican ! Man freddie roach has been getting on my nerves lately lol, he was already crying about cottos belt 2 be on the line ! What's next?LOL

What's everyones thoughts about freddie ?
lloyd mayflower
I think he fancies himself as a celebrity as well as a boxing trainer and i think hes a twat for it. His head is wedged firmly up his own ass. A brutal Cotto KO would maybe drop him down a peg or two.
Spyder
He's just trying to get the thought out there that Cortez would favor Cotto. Even if Cortez is selected, he won't be able to blatantly give Cotto every break...he'll probably even try to overcompensate in Pac's favor.

Like it or not, it's a smart move.
provo
LOL ! I hope cotto takes low shot on pac ,a uppercut 2 his dick LOL.

But wait why is Freddie worried about low blows ! Don't they say asians have little dicks LMAO pac won't feel anything LOL!
The Original MrFactor
He's just working the refs. Same things Phil Jackson used to do when MJ got those hard fouls in NY and Detroit. Freddie is a good coach, just looking to gain some advantages for his guy. I dont blame him. Cotto is gonna beat the shit out of Manny.
D-MARV
I hate Freddie Roach! It's bad enough that there making him come down two pounds. I really don't hate Pacquiao, But Roach makes me want to see Pacquiao laid out stiff.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (Fitz @ Oct 13 2009, 12:39 AM) *
Parkinsons on no parkinsons, he is a straight up moron. I can see straight through his illness and glasses.


laugh.gif You have some serious hate for Freddy sunshine. I like it I really do. I feel like a proud father but you must let it intensify & build so it peaks come fight time. Don't let it all out in training camp Fitz.

I can see his point though because Cortez is a shady MF at the best of times.
Lil-lightsout
QUOTE (provo @ Oct 12 2009, 08:59 PM) *
LOL ! I hope cotto takes low shot on pac ,a uppercut 2 his dick LOL.

But wait why is Freddie worried about low blows ! Don't they say asians have little dicks LMAO pac won't feel anything LOL!


WTF? Balls are balls, no matter what size your junk is.

As for Roach, I can not stand him. The way he is manipulating all this shit is ridiculous, this is boxing for crying out loud. I just want that smirk wiped off his silly face.
pacco_diablo
Cortez can often be over-involved as a ref. I dont blame Roach. However, a ref like Cortez may be an advantage for Manny. If he'd ref anything like he did during Mayweather/hatton then there wont be much inside work. Cortez should just let them fight it out.
frankypc
lol i think Roach is getting nervous as the days go by.
JD
Hopkins did the same thing with Cortez in the 3rd Robert Allen fight.
dominicbuilder9k1
Roach is the trainer of Pacquiao,...he is doing his job, he is the most celebrated and no.1 boxing trainor right now...hehehe (i know Mayweather Sr will disagree)...anyhow, its a good thing he brought this issue up, I believe "prevention is better tha Cure", but Cotto is not a dirty fighter... Cotto and Pacquiao fans want this fight to be fair and square,...NO CHEATING from either one of the fighter... but first they should make sure both fighters make the weight,...second,both fighters must be tested (steroids or whatever),...last but not the least, the hand wraps!..no plaster of Paris allowed!...hahaha... The "low blow" issue will be handled by the referee Im sure of it...

This is a boxing match worth seeing... I like Pacquiao,...but I pick Cotto to win this fight, its up to Pacquiao to prove me (and hundred of thousands like me) WRONG... Bring it ON!...
D-MARV
QUOTE (Fitz @ Oct 12 2009, 10:27 PM) *
Considering Pacquiao is a heavy favourite, I would think that Cotto must prove the majority of people wrong.

Yeah, that's more like it.

What are the odds right now? I want to drop a little on Cotto.
provo
Lil lightsout it was a joke bro LOL!

All be going for cotto but I really don't think he will win this fight I think pac will win late by ref stoppage due to a cut ! Pac is not going 2 stay in front of cotto ..
provo
Lil lightsout it was a joke bro LOL!

All be going for cotto but I really don't think he will win this fight I think pac will win late by ref stoppage due to a cut ! Pac is not going 2 stay in front of cotto ..
But lets go Cotto! Knock pac out !
dominicbuilder9k1
QUOTE (Fitz @ Oct 12 2009, 03:27 PM) *
Considering Pacquiao is a heavy favourite, I would think that Cotto must prove the majority of people wrong.

Exactly what i mean...its Pacquiao that will prove me, and hundred of thousans like me, Wrong!... Cotto will win this fight...
Spyder
QUOTE (JD @ Oct 12 2009, 10:09 PM) *
Hopkins did the same thing with Cortez in the 3rd Robert Allen fight.

Didn't Hopkins get Cortez pulled from the De La Hoya fight too?
JaRaNDa
Roach takes too much advantage of Pac fame & is loving all the attention as he does not know how to shut his fucking flaps! This fuckwitt mouths off way too much for a trainer & comes across as really unprofessional & makes himself & pac look bad.

Enough is enough, firstly Pac&Roach call out all the top WW but WON'T fight them at WW, demands Cotto loose 2 pounds, makes an issue when Cotto rightfully so does not want to put up his WW title, comes up with this 'diamond title' now wants an automatic DQ against Cotto if he goes south. What if it is an accident or it's along the belt line, Roach wants Cotto to loose the fight just like that after all the hard work his done after all the bitching that Roach has done to disadvantages he made. Fuck Roach & fuck Pacman, I hope Cotto knocks Pacs head off then knocks the wind out of Roach & breaks his glasses.
King Eugene
QUOTE (JaRaNDa @ Oct 13 2009, 01:39 AM) *
Roach takes too much advantage of Pac fame & is loving all the attention as he does not know how to shut his fucking flaps! This fuckwitt mouths off way too much for a trainer & comes across as really unprofessional & makes himself & pac look bad.

Enough is enough, firstly Pac&Roach call out all the top WW but WON'T fight them at WW, demands Cotto loose 2 pounds, makes an issue when Cotto rightfully so does not want to put up his WW title, comes up with this 'diamond title' now wants an automatic DQ against Cotto if he goes south. What if it is an accident or it's along the belt line, Roach wants Cotto to loose the fight just like that after all the hard work his done after all the bitching that Roach has done to disadvantages he made. Fuck Roach & fuck Pacman, I hope Cotto knocks Pacs head off then knocks the wind out of Roach & breaks his glasses.

Thats some old school yard shit right there. LOL Classic though!

I wish somebody would risk getting an assault charge just to smack the shit out of Roach one good time. Like Floyd Sr. or not but he kept it coming at Roach lol.
STEVENSKI
You know Freddy refuses to use a milkshake maker to make Pac's powershakes. He just holds it & BOOM a frothy milk treat ensures. He also makes a mean martini just the way James Bond likes it shaken but not stirred.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (Fitz @ Oct 13 2009, 09:26 AM) *
If Roach read this, I'm sure would shake his head at............oh wait.


I think you mean he would shake his fist at me. I bet he dances like a spastic when he stands still too at the Philo discos.
AussieLad
Some pissweak shit getting thrown around here about the mans disability. Like to see how much fucking laughter there is if you or a one of your loved ones end up with something as nasty as parkinsons. Bet you'd be real funny stuttering on your keyboard

Like it or not, cotto did pull a trinidad in the judah fight. He was getting pressed (not nearly as bad trinidad vs vargas of course) and out came the low blows. Intentional? Who knows? Convenient... hell yes. And he didnt land just one. I think it is a smart move putting it out there in the conciousness of whatever ref gets the gig. All part of the psychological war.

At the end of the day, the advantages stack up well for cotto, and he should win. Pac will need to fight a perfect fight, and i dont think its going to happen

STEVENSKI
QUOTE (AussieLad @ Oct 13 2009, 10:32 AM) *
Some pissweak shit getting thrown around here about the mans disability. Like to see how much fucking laughter there is if you or a one of your loved ones end up with something as nasty as parkinsons. Bet you'd be real funny stuttering on your keyboard


Yes yes I know I am a bad person for saying these things about Mr Jitters. Freddy handles his disease admirably & with dignity. Pity he has none when demanding for the odds to be heavily stacked in his fighters favour.
gbh32001
After Pacman brutally finish Cotto, those boxing expert will hardened their belief that Cotto is a damaged goods. But those casual fans will hail him more like henry armstrong era. This is "Manny Pacquiao Era", all greats have their time and we have not seen the best in Manny yet.
Snoop
I know this thread is about Freddie Roach, but I fucking hate Joe Cortez. I mean, after all the dumb fuck decisions he's made in the past and the CLEAR signs of incompetence, I don't even know why they still let him officiate. Cortez is just as much a wannabe celebrity ref as people are claiming Roach being a celebrity trainer. "I'm fair but I'm firm." Dude, shut the fuck up.
Douchebag
QUOTE (The Original MrFactor @ Oct 12 2009, 09:05 PM) *
He's just working the refs. Same things Phil Jackson used to do when MJ got those hard fouls in NY and Detroit. Freddie is a good coach, just looking to gain some advantages for his guy. I dont blame him. Cotto is gonna beat the shit out of Manny.




.............................................
maelstrom
QUOTE (gbh32001 @ Oct 13 2009, 06:34 AM) *
After Pacman brutally finish Cotto, those boxing expert will hardened their belief that Cotto is a damaged goods. But those casual fans will hail him more like henry armstrong era. This is "Manny Pacquiao Era", all greats have their time and we have not seen the best in Manny yet.


There is no Manny era.

If he were that great he'd be fighting Shane instead of the slumping Cotto.
thisneverworks
QUOTE (AussieLad @ Oct 13 2009, 06:32 AM) *
Some pissweak shit getting thrown around here about the mans disability. Like to see how much fucking laughter there is if you or a one of your loved ones end up with something as nasty as parkinsons. Bet you'd be real funny stuttering on your keyboard

I wouldn't make fun of his disability either way but does Roach really have Parkinson's disease or does he have the symptoms from being punched too many times in the head (like Ali). I was always under the impression that Ali and Roach had all the symptoms of Parkinson's and the same end result but not necessarily the "disease". Probably just semantics at this point.
Mean Mister Mustard
I don't get where this accusations about Cotto being dirty are coming from. He hit Judah low in the beginning but they seemed to be accidental, he didn't do it again afterwards so no one can say he was chronically doing it throughout the fight. Also, in which other fight has Cotto done that to gain an advantage? Wouldn't he have done it against Corley or Torres when he was hurt? Roach is just trying to play the psychological warfare game.
Spyder
QUOTE (Mean Mister Mustard @ Oct 13 2009, 10:04 PM) *
I don't get where this accusations about Cotto being dirty are coming from. He hit Judah low in the beginning but they seemed to be accidental, he didn't do it again afterwards so no one can say he was chronically doing it throughout the fight. Also, in which other fight has Cotto done that to gain an advantage? Wouldn't he have done it against Corley or Torres when he was hurt? Roach is just trying to play the psychological warfare game.

They were definitely chronic.

I remember being at a bar full of Puerto Ricans, and yelling "Supah-Judah". This guy next to me was all kinds of drunk off of Miguel Cotto jizz...Judah was lighting him up, and then BAM! Low blow...the dude next to me starts cheering, "Hit him in the balls!" For the rest of the fight, anytime that Judah would rally...BAM! And I'd have to hear that dumbass cheer, "Hit him in the balls!"

Believe me. That was the only cheer that guy knew.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (Spyder @ Oct 14 2009, 02:12 AM) *
They were definitely chronic.

I remember being at a bar full of Puerto Ricans, and yelling "Supah-Judah". This guy next to me was all kinds of drunk off of Miguel Cotto jizz...Judah was lighting him up, and then BAM! Low blow...the dude next to me starts cheering, "Hit him in the balls!" For the rest of the fight, anytime that Judah would rally...BAM! And I'd have to hear that dumbass cheer, "Hit him in the balls!"

Believe me. That was the only cheer that guy knew.


Puerto Ricans are just naturally dirty. Look at Toto he would get in trouble & BAM he would crack their balls up their windpipe. Now I don't see anything wrong with that tactic myself as you gotta do what you gotta do to win. Provided the referee punishes the offense I have no problem with it.
Snoop
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Oct 14 2009, 06:12 AM) *
Puerto Ricans are just naturally dirty. Look at Toto he would get in trouble & BAM he would crack their balls up their windpipe. Now I don't see anything wrong with that tactic myself as you gotta do what you gotta do to win. Provided the referee punishes the offense I have no problem with it.

I dunno about that. I'd still consider the win tainted. I just can't give credit to a fighter that fouls himself to a win. At least not as much to a fighter who weathered through the tough parts of a fight and managed to win on their own will, rather than fouling when in trouble.
kidbazooka1
Roach is just playing his mind games and he's getting pretty damn good at it too.
1zz
It's a pretty legit concern,just watch the Judah Cotto fight for clarification.
Snoop
QUOTE (Fitz @ Oct 14 2009, 05:53 AM) *
I don't have a problem with fighters going low either, as long as they try disguise it well, not like what Hatton did to Tszyu where it was as clear as day. It's dirty, but boxing is a dirty sport. They must suffer the consequences and taken a point off, after that they risk a DQ like Stevenski mentioned.
I'm sure you guys watch basketball, and other sports like soccer. You sometimes give a deliberate foul to prevent someone with a sure scoring opportunity and make it more difficult for them to score with a stop in play. A low blow is the same type of foul. I don't mind a foul like that, as long as it's disguised and not a blatant cheap shot.

Hmm..I can kinda see where you guys are coming from. Utilize all the tools available to win the fight, but those aren't considered part of the tools, that's why they're illegal fouls. Plus I don't see the difference between fouling blatantly and fouling secretly. You're fouling either way.

I also don't agree with your comparison to basketball or football since those are team sports and fouling is more of a strategy against time, rather than how it's used in boxing. Don't get me wrong, many fighters use it buy time as well, but boxing is an individual sport based on momentum, so when you break someone's momentum by socking them in the nuts, that's going to affect the outcome a lot more than if you intentionally foul someone in a bball game, where that player has 4 other teammates, plus a bench, to rely on.

Maybe it's the frequency it appears in other mainstream sports that makes it acceptable but I'd prefer this not be a regular "strategy" for boxers. Imagine if fighters commonly low-blowed or headbutted every time they were in trouble. It would demean the quality of the sport IMO.
Snoop
QUOTE (Fitz @ Oct 14 2009, 09:44 PM) *
What about in tennis when they call out the doctor when a player is down for a so called 'cramp'? I can understand why some people may not like it, but I understand it.

No I understand why boxers foul to buy time, but that doesn't mean I think it's okay. I think a more comparable situation in boxing would be something like Corrales spitting out his mouthpiece. He was buying time for himself, perhaps disrupting the momentum, but at least he didn't do it in way that would possibly injury or affect the Castillo's performance like a low-blow would. And despite the fact Corrales/Castillo was one of the best fights ever in the history of boxing, it was a bit tainted due to the mouthpiece spitting.

My whole thing is that sayings like "I don't have a problem with fighters going low," or "You gotta do what you gotta do to win", justifies and possibly normalizes fouling in sports. I don't want to watch a boxing match and have it be normal that a fighter low-blows or headbutts when in trouble. I don't want to "not have a problem with it", I guess is what I'm saying. If I was a tennis fan, I wouldn't want "doctor calling" to become a trend either.

Play the sport the way it's supposed to be played, is how I view it.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (snoopnick @ Oct 14 2009, 11:30 PM) *
And despite the fact Corrales/Castillo was one of the best fights ever in the history of boxing, it was a bit tainted due to the mouthpiece spitting.


I don't believe it was a intentional foul as I thought Corrales was dead after that second knockdown. I think he just did not have a clue as he was so dazed as to deliberatley spit out his mouthpiece.
lloyd mayflower
QUOTE (snoopnick @ Oct 14 2009, 11:30 PM) *
No I understand why boxers foul to buy time, but that doesn't mean I think it's okay. I think a more comparable situation in boxing would be something like Corrales spitting out his mouthpiece. He was buying time for himself, perhaps disrupting the momentum, but at least he didn't do it in way that would possibly injury or affect the Castillo's performance like a low-blow would. And despite the fact Corrales/Castillo was one of the best fights ever in the history of boxing, it was a bit tainted due to the mouthpiece spitting.

My whole thing is that sayings like "I don't have a problem with fighters going low," or "You gotta do what you gotta do to win", justifies and possibly normalizes fouling in sports. I don't want to watch a boxing match and have it be normal that a fighter low-blows or headbutts when in trouble. I don't want to "not have a problem with it", I guess is what I'm saying. If I was a tennis fan, I wouldn't want "doctor calling" to become a trend either.

Play the sport the way it's supposed to be played, is how I view it.


Agreed, i follow football(soccer) more than anything else and the cheating tha goes on is getting worse, but its up to refs and governing bodies to stamp it out. Players will do whatever they can get away with. Same for fighters, if there goin to get away with it they will do it. My opinion for boxing cheats is the same as football cheats. Retrospective punishment. I know it wont make any difference to the fight, but you could still hit them in the pocket or something. There must be some way to discourage it.
Lil-lightsout
I have no problem when a little bit of bending of the rules happens in boxing, as long as it favors the boxer I am rooting for. If it is the boxer I am rooting against cheats, then I cuss and complain like a bitch. I am sure it is like that for most fans.
lloyd mayflower
QUOTE (Lil-lightsout @ Oct 15 2009, 07:10 PM) *
I have no problem when a little bit of bending of the rules happens in boxing, as long as it favors the boxer I am rooting for. If it is the boxer I am rooting against cheats, then I cuss and complain like a bitch. I am sure it is like that for most fans.


Haha at least your honest. and your right.
Snoop
QUOTE (Lil-lightsout @ Oct 15 2009, 06:10 PM) *
I have no problem when a little bit of bending of the rules happens in boxing, as long as it favors the boxer I am rooting for. If it is the boxer I am rooting against cheats, then I cuss and complain like a bitch. I am sure it is like that for most fans.

LOL. Very true.
Fadetwist
QUOTE (Lil-lightsout @ Oct 15 2009, 02:10 PM) *
I have no problem when a little bit of bending of the rules happens in boxing, as long as it favors the boxer I am rooting for. If it is the boxer I am rooting against cheats, then I cuss and complain like a bitch. I am sure it is like that for most fans.


I hate Holyfield with a passion, but I was still rooting for Tyson even when he turned cannibal. LoL
torvix2000
QUOTE (snoopnick @ Oct 14 2009, 10:30 PM) *
No I understand why boxers foul to buy time, but that doesn't mean I think it's okay.


Fitz is one of those who don't like catchweights and yet secret fouling is okay for him. LOL!
Snoop
QUOTE (Fitz @ Oct 15 2009, 10:59 PM) *
Look at Hopkins for example, what he does is an art. He knows exactly where the referee is, takes note and does what he must do. I also don't mind it because in a lot of cases, it isn't just used to get a break in the fight, it is good to test a fighter mentally and give them a physiological edge, see how they react.

I can see your point, even agree with it to a degree. But I still don't condone say, Felix Trinidad low-blowing Vargas because he was in trouble during the 4th round. That was a resort to dirty tactics to avoid losing and the fight could have very well went to Vargas had that never happened. I've never seen Hopkins use it in the same manner nor foul in the same magnitude.
Snoop
QUOTE (Fitz @ Oct 15 2009, 11:02 PM) *
There is a difference dipshit. Fouling is something both fighters have access to, they can both do it as much as they like, but you are accountable and suffer the consequences.
A catch weight puts one guy at a disadvantage, especially when one fighters wants to fight for a title, but still restrict him from the standard limit, especially when you are making the guy with the title do it.

LOL. I knew that comment would get something out of you.
dominicbuilder9k1
QUOTE (gbh32001 @ Oct 13 2009, 12:34 AM) *
After Pacman brutally finish Cotto, those boxing expert will hardened their belief that Cotto is a damaged goods. But those casual fans will hail him more like henry armstrong era. This is "Manny Pacquiao Era", all greats have their time and we have not seen the best in Manny yet.

Wow..!!.. you really are a PacMan fan,..very confident your Manny will "brutally finish" Cotto...hahaha.... I like Manny too...but my judgment pick Cotto to win... Cotto might be the one to brutally finish Pacquiao...hahaha... Anyhow, Roach is playing a Psywar tactics with Cotto.
Fadetwist
QUOTE (dominicbuilder9k1 @ Oct 16 2009, 02:03 AM) *
Wow..!!.. you really are a PacMan fan,..very confident your Manny will "brutally finish" Cotto...hahaha.... I like Manny too...but my judgment pick Cotto to win... Cotto might be the one to brutally finish Pacquiao...hahaha... Anyhow, Roach is playing a Psywar tactics with Cotto.



I got Manny for this fight and Roach is only doing his job to make sure his fighter wins.

Nating personal im jes doin my jeb - PacMan
AussieLad
Been reading comments on another forum that reportedly pacs strength coach has walked out, and that manny was KO'd in sparring. Supposedly he camp is imploding

Of course, until i see something more official i will chalk it up to scare mongering, and i certainly hope this is not true
King Eugene
QUOTE (AussieLad @ Oct 16 2009, 03:44 AM) *
Been reading comments on another forum that reportedly pacs strength coach has walked out, and that manny was KO'd in sparring. Supposedly he camp is imploding

Of course, until i see something more official i will chalk it up to scare mongering, and i certainly hope this is not true

The way Manny was whipping those sparring partners on 24/7 I dont see him getting KO'd in sparring. I dont think he is that unfocused. I'm stilling picking Cotto to win this thing though.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (snoopnick @ Oct 16 2009, 12:39 AM) *
I can see your point, even agree with it to a degree. But I still don't condone say, Felix Trinidad low-blowing Vargas because he was in trouble during the 4th round. That was a resort to dirty tactics to avoid losing and the fight could have very well went to Vargas had that never happened. I've never seen Hopkins use it in the same manner nor foul in the same magnitude.


I respect Hopkins as a fighter but the dude just fouls for shits & giggles whereas most fighters do it to get them out of trouble Hopkins does it because he can yet when it is done to him he bitches like one of his prison ho boys taking his enourmous member with no soap.
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