QUOTE (JLUVBABY @ Nov 28 2009, 08:23 AM)
good luck on getting a responce to this thread... i started a very similar thread to this a a couple of weeks ago and not a single responce.... i think its an interesting topic tho so this is what my thoughts where.... at heavyweight def. harry wills... early 20's, white america has finally some say bought the belt back from jack johnson and golden boy jack dempsey is champ now... Lord forbid they allow another black man to win the most coveted crown in all of sports again.... dempsey used the color barrior to never fight the man, and from what ive read in the past is on record saying he would never fight a black man (this may not have been so true tho)... 2 things my grandfather talked about when i was a kid growing up... number 1 was the mythical unsanctioned fights that dempsey and johnson supposedly took place in back in the 20's... some think they happened others think it is what it is... talk... theres no documents of them but my grandfather stood firm on the fact that they did take place and johnson got the better of dempsey everytime... the second was talks of harry wills.... again gramps stood on it like a rock that had they fought wills would surely have gotten the better of him... i must admit ive got lots of footage of dempsey and johnson but have only seen a little footage of harry wills and that was only of him training etc.... but from what ive read it appears he would be a great canidate for that spot at heavyweight...
another that comes to mind is charlie burley at middleweight... another great great fighter that was denied his shot at the crown...
Thanks for the post. Interesting info from your grandfather. Since it doesn't look like anyone else is interested in this thread, I will throw in a few names;
I agree with you about Harry Wills, but I was wondering if your grandfather ever talked about Sam Langford. He, Wills and Joe Jeanette fought each other multiple times over many years because they were so seldom allowed to fight white boxers. Another black heavy that I read about awhile back was Peter Jackson. He fought in the 1880s and 90s. Sullivan refused to fight him (or any black fighter). He fought Corbett before he became champ, for something like 50 rounds/4 plus hours. some consider him better than Johnson. I find that hard to believe.
Jose Basora (77-20-7) fought once a month for years. He fought LaMotta 4 times ( draw, decision W, decision L, KO L). He lost to Kid Tunero and achieved a draw with Sugar Ray Robinson in his prime. Late in his career he got his only title shot in his 2nd fight with Robinson. Robinson KOed him in 50 seconds. He did a ton for boxing in Puerto Rico.
Kid Tunero (97-32-16) is a legendary Cuban boxer mainly because there is so little info out there about him. He was purported to be so highly trained and skilled that he would frustrate seasoned pros to distraction.
Jose Medel (69-31-8) is probably the best Mexican fighter never to have won the championship. Definitely the best bantam weight IMO.
Henry Cooper (40-15-1) is probably the most beloved boxer in UK history. He fought Ali before he had changed his name. I remember my Dad cheering when Cooper put Ali down in the 4th (I think). It was one of the first fights I remember seeing on TV but even then I could not figure out why he was cheering against the American. Ali was saved by the bell, no doubt. Cooper lost several bouts by TKO for bleeding. He had one of the greatest left hooks in boxing history. He is the one that Ali coined the phrase "he hit me so hard my ancestors in Africa felt it" about.
Last but not least (but probably destined to be the most ridiculed) there is the tragic Duk Koo Kim (17-2-1). IMO if he would have been lucky enough to have a great trainer like Pacman has been blessed with he would have been a champion. Mancini was at the height of his career and the Korean kid stood in there with him. I honestly thought he was going to win that fight at the end of 10 rounds. It would have been a very close decision if it had ended in 12. He was just too tough for his own good and too green to finish Mancini. It is well known that Mancini nearly quit that fight. Duk Koo Kim should not have been in that ring that night. He was not ready for it career wise. But his heart symbolizes the toughness of the Korean people. The ROK Marines who terrified the Viet Cong and North Vietnamese during the Viet Nam war. The young men who loved to duke it out on Friday and Saturday night street corners in Seoul and other cities in the 70's when I served there. The Koreans who have suffered centuries of discrimination at the hands of the the Japanese and Chinese. The Koreans who have built an economic powerhouse thanks to the help of the USA. The Rok Marines who more than once knocked me on my ass in Pohang. Duk Koo Kim was the greatest fighter never to become champion.