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PR316
I don't think its looking too good for KP. He can't make 160 anymore apparentley, and at 168 its an even harder division, with Bute and the Super Six. I'm not sure he could make any sort of name for himself at 168 let alone 175. Jack Loew was talking about him fighting Chad Dawson but if Martinez, a natural 154 pounder was able to do what he did, what would Bad Chad do???....


And with the possible exceptions of Abraham and Green, I don't think his chances are all that great against the Super Six guys. Either Ward or Dirrell would just school him. Kessler would overpower him. Froch would out tough him and probably stop him late.

With Abraham and Green, he stands a chance to do something with either of those guys I think being that both are slow and predictable, but its no guarantee.

But aside that, I don't see much left for the Ghost. I think Jermain Taylor is the only top fighter he'll have beaten when its all said and done.
King Eugene
Pavlik is a fish swimming in bloody shark infested water at 168. Him showing he isn't as effective above 160 and the lack of confidence he probably has from his last few fights will all play against him. We wont be seeing too much of the Ghost in the next couple of years. I give him the best chance against Abraham just off style alone.
Spyder
Pavlik should take some time off and come back as a cruiserweight.
KYLE THEEE SPINKS FAN
He could try and make a fight with Librado Andrade if he beats Eric Lucas later this month. Style wise, that would work gerat for him. He could land that one-two, and may be able to get out of the way of Andrade's shots. However, if Andrade got it going, he could make it a long night for the Ghost. I think they'll try and get some tune up bouts, or even a fight with Jesse Brinkley. Then, they may try to push for a fight with Lucian Bute. Style wise, it would be the same thing as Martinez. However, Pavlik was having his way with Martinez rounds 5-8 before the cut. Martinez looked to be on his way out, and I think people are underestimating how much that cut took out of Pavlik and energized Martinez. I don't think he beats Bute, but it would be a more competitive fight than people would think.
pcraw
HBO will stick him in there with Bute if they're trying to cut their ties with him. Similar to the way they fed Jermain Taylor o him twice and then bounced Taylor.
D-MARV
Pavlik fighting Dawson is Suicide.



JLUVBABY
pavlik is toast... i like him as a fighter to a certain degree but at 168 we will start seeing him getting dropped and stopped..
Box in Hand
He needs to leave his current trainer Jack and get with someone who can fix his errors. Manny Steward or Freddie Roach may be an option but Jack Lowe has taken him as far as he can go. He may stay loyal to Jack and that will only keep him in Frankenstein mode and that will get him killed at 168.
Fitz
QUOTE (King Eugene @ May 14 2010, 03:09 AM) *
Him showing he isn't as effective above 160 and the lack of confidence he probably has from his last few fights will all play against him.


He has fought Taylor and Hopkins above 160. That isn't true, doesn't mean he is ineffective, he just never faced someone like Hopkins at 160 and it was just a coincidence it was above 160. It had everything to do with Hopkins and nothing about weight.
Fitz
That said, the next step for him is going to be down. We are going to see his career unravel. Haha.
JLUVBABY
QUOTE (Fitz @ May 13 2010, 06:03 PM) *
That said, the next step for him is going to be down. We are going to see his career unravel. Haha.


yep. the boy is done but hey.... he can grow old saying even in todays time with all the belts he was champion at one point... a lot of better fighters than him cant say that bout their careers... not only was he champ he was linear champion not just a paper champ so... but that said its only down hill from here... it'll be fun tho cuzz certain styles he will still be able to beat... i think he'll be a contender (5-10 ranked) for a while even with his "frankenstien" style (he's not leaving jack lowe) till he starts to lose a step...
King Eugene
QUOTE (Fitz @ May 13 2010, 06:55 PM) *
He has fought Taylor and Hopkins above 160. That isn't true, doesn't mean he is ineffective, he just never faced someone like Hopkins at 160 and it was just a coincidence it was above 160. It had everything to do with Hopkins and nothing about weight.

But he wasn't as effective the second time against Taylor. Credit to Taylor for fighting a better fight but it wasn't his best showing. I believe had Taylor not gotten tired and kept his punch output up he could have won.
Fitz
QUOTE (King Eugene @ May 14 2010, 10:41 AM) *
But he wasn't as effective the second time against Taylor. Credit to Taylor for fighting a better fight but it wasn't his best showing. I believe had Taylor not gotten tired and kept his punch output up he could have won.


I thought Taylor fought better, Pavlik to me was the same. Just my opinion though.
PR316
Yeah it looks rough for Pavlik.


After the Taylor fights it looked promising for him. Maybe Hopkins really took his heart and soul, because I just don't think KP is all that commited to the cause anymore. The whole P-Will saga was just not right. One moment he couldn't fight, then he could, then he couldn't again, but as soon as Williams signs for Martinez, KP has a fight two weeks after the day he was supposed to fight Williams. There's just something not right with Pavlik and his team. Its almost like they got out of the Williams fight on purpose and hoped he would lose so that he would be out of the picture. He took on the Martinez fight but he needed to at that point because he was losing credibility in a hurry and if he wanted to stay relevant, he had to take the fight. Of course he got taken to school afterwards.

He's just stuck now. He couldn't beat a 154 pounder and he's looking to compete with the supper middles. He's gonna need alot of luck.
D-MARV
QUOTE (Fitz @ May 13 2010, 09:57 PM) *
I thought Taylor fought better, Pavlik to me was the same. Just my opinion though.

Agreed... That was the same Pavlik from the first fight. Taylor made some adjustments and decided to box a little more which is why he had a little bit of success.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (King Eugene @ May 14 2010, 12:41 AM) *
I believe had Taylor not gotten tired and kept his punch output up he could have won.


Yes & if my aunty had a dick she would be my uncle. Your point?
D-MARV
LOL...



What hurt Taylor in that second fight was the bodyshot that Pavlik landed in the 11th round. After 10, I had it dead even and I was giving Taylor the 11th until Pavlik landed the bodyshot and Taylor froze up from there.
King Eugene
LOL...

Yea welp after going back and watching it. Taylor fought better but Pavlik still pretty much whipped him. Guess I can throw the "not looking good above 160" out the window but you can tell the man's confidence level has gone down since the Hopkins fight. The riducule added by the media and fans for pulling out of the Williams fights and then pretty much getting beating up by a Jr. Middleweight had to mentally damage the man. Guess we'll see in his next fight.
buford54
That's too bad. Pavlik had everything going for him except the raw, natural talent.
He had the whole "humble upbringings" storyline, seemed like a likeable guy, simple style that makes for exciting fights (he went for the knockout).
I hope he retires rather than getting himself really hurt.
PR316
Thats what always got me about Pavlik. First 170 was too big for him after the Hopkins loss, and after the Martinez loss 160 is too small for him.


Which one is it??...



He's still young. But I don't think a new trainer will help much because Pavlik doesnt' strike me as a guy who can really add any new weapons to the arsenal. Thats why I laughed when Hopkins went up to him after their fight talking about "Learn that slickness" or something to that extent. KP is not that type of fighter. And Jack Loew is definitely not going to be able to teach him to fight a different way.


I think they were trying to build up a showdown with Bute, hence the reason they put them on the same card. Now though, that fight doesn't really have luster.

I think the best bet is to start Pavlik off slowly at 168. Have him beat up a few nobodies to get his confidence back then maybe try to put him in there with Bute to cash him out.
JLUVBABY
QUOTE (PR316 @ May 14 2010, 10:19 AM) *
Thats what always got me about Pavlik. First 170 was too big for him after the Hopkins loss, and after the Martinez loss 160 is too small for him.


Which one is it??...



He's still young. But I don't think a new trainer will help much because Pavlik doesnt' strike me as a guy who can really add any new weapons to the arsenal. Thats why I laughed when Hopkins went up to him after their fight talking about "Learn that slickness" or something to that extent. KP is not that type of fighter. And Jack Loew is definitely not going to be able to teach him to fight a different way.


I think they were trying to build up a showdown with Bute, hence the reason they put them on the same card. Now though, that fight doesn't really have luster.

I think the best bet is to start Pavlik off slowly at 168. Have him beat up a few nobodies to get his confidence back then maybe try to put him in there with Bute to cash him out.


damn pr thats a painful cash out.. lol...
PR316
^^^^ I think Dawson at 175 would be worse. LOL..
Maxy
I think Pavlik is done. He was never all that in the first place but now he's just a fucking journeyman.

Disagree?

OK, so whose he beating at the elite level tomorrow? No fucking body.
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