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PR316
In a recent issue of Ring Magazine, they did this one in matching up Mayweather with the all time greats.


I do believe this is a tough fight for Robinson because of the styles. Ray had never met anyone quite as athletic, quick, nor as smart as Floyd. But the same could be said about Mayweather. He's fighting a guy who has a big edge in power, along with the blazing hand speed, perfect footwork, and rock solid chin.


I think its a chess match much of the fight, but Robinson will eventually find Floyd with his straight right hand over the shoulder roll and when he hurts Floyd, PBF won't recover quite as easily as he did Shane.

I think Robinson takes a competitive but clear decision over 15 rounds with Floyd in clear survival mode to just make it to the end.
JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (PR316 @ May 27 2010, 08:36 PM) *
In a recent issue of Ring Magazine, they did this one in matching up Mayweather with the all time greats.


I do believe this is a tough fight for Robinson because of the styles. Ray had never met anyone quite as athletic, quick, nor as smart as Floyd. But the same could be said about Mayweather. He's fighting a guy who has a big edge in power, along with the blazing hand speed, perfect footwork, and rock solid chin.


I think its a chess match much of the fight, but Robinson will eventually find Floyd with his straight right hand over the shoulder roll and when he hurts Floyd, PBF won't recover quite as easily as he did Shane.

I think Robinson takes a competitive but clear decision over 15 rounds with Floyd in clear survival mode to just make it to the end.

Shit,after watching Mayweather hurt bad by Mosley,I give this an easy win for Robinson by KO..Mosley has no idea how to hit like Robinson did..Mosley doesn't use his whole body in punches like Robinson does..In my opinion this is a lost art..Guys are throwing pussy punches these days(in comparison),not lethal punches like Dempsey,Louis,Robinson,Archie Moore,Duran,Benny Leonard knew how to throw..If Dempsey hit you,he could kill you with a punch..Who is a devestating puncher like any of the guys I listed today??I'm having a seriously hard time thinking about it..At any time,any of the guys I listed could KO you with one shot..

Robinson by KO..Early or late..Whenever he landed a full leveraged shot..Remember,he was convinced into carrying quite a few guys so he wouldn't tee off on many..
PR316
^^^^Thats true.

For Mayweather to last the distance, he's gonna need every inch of skill and ring smarts because if Robinson gets him in position, he'll rip with both hands like nothing Floyd has seen before.

My gut tells me Floyd wouldn't fight him the way he fought Mosley though. Not that it would help him win, but I think he'd fight a similar fight to the way he fought De La Hoya, constantly moving away from the left hook and staying out of the wheelhouse.

These days, very few guys could hit anything like a Robinson did. At welterweight, the last true puncher we have had IMO was Tito Trinidad. Every punch short, compact, with body weight behind it.
and the NEW
QUOTE (JonnyBlaze @ May 28 2010, 03:22 AM) *
Benny Leonard


Benny was far from a puncher. He was more similar to Pep.
Maxy
QUOTE (and the NEW @ May 28 2010, 06:51 AM) *
Benny was far from a puncher. He was more similar to Pep.


Good to see you ATN, how you doing?
JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (and the NEW @ May 28 2010, 05:51 AM) *
Benny was far from a puncher. He was more similar to Pep.

Are you serious??Benny was a great puncher..You may think he wasn't because he carried guys A LOT..When he started boxing,he couldn't break an egg..Then he became a puncher through finding his balance and using his weight..He does remind me of Pep in some ways though..Benny had a below average chin so he realized he had to become elusive..

Good to see ya back..
and the NEW
QUOTE (Maxy @ May 28 2010, 12:47 PM) *
Good to see you ATN, how you doing?


Hey mate, just dropped in quickly, I'm doing well, hope the same for you!

Good luck to England in the WC, I know it's said every WC lately, but this 'could be their year' I think! Up there with Spain and Brazil......

Good to see you also Jonny.

Laters.
neophyte7
Ray lost to Lamatta who I respect but is not mayweather in any shape form or fashion... I give Mayweather a good shot.. Ray would miss more punches than he ever did in his whole career that night. I mean of course ray is the favorite, but PBF would present problems as live Dog... his stamina and defense give him a shot...
D-MARV
This is a really tough one to call... I wish there was more film of Robinson at welterweight.

Based on what I've seen, I would go with Robinson via UD or late stoppage.

PR316
Admittedly there is limited footage of a welterweight Robinson.

They have highlights of his fights against Angott(The 3rd one), Riccio, Docusen, Abrams, Beckett, Flores, and Fusari. And the St Valentines Day Massacre fight against Lamotta can also be considered prime Robinson since he was the welterweight champion still.


But based on what I've seen, its enough for me to conclude that Ray beats Floyd, either by decision or KO sometime from the mid to late rounds.


Mayweather has better defense, but Robinson's offensive game is just too superior. Bigger man, stronger, faster hands, more powerful, and had a sadistic killer instinct when he had his man in trouble.

Floyd would give a good account of himself because of who he is, but he'd eventually find himself outgunned.
Run and Gun Game Calls
This is like compairing kobe Bryant to MJ. Kobe is an all time great, no hate intended, but he is no MJ. He's just not

Same for Mayweather, guy has mad skills, but he is no Ray Robinson. Ray had mad hurt you power, but he was long, and knew how to use his reach and speed. Something else not being mentioned is his body work. Ray was an absolute beast to the body.

Ray is better than Floyd, better than Roy and better than leonard. Thats not hate, thats just the truth
PR316
^^^^^No question...

Ray is definitely better than Floyd. Nobody can argue accomplishments and quality of competition here.

This is more just to see how they match up in styles.

I see Robinson winning everytime though, no matter what.
JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (PR316 @ Jul 15 2010, 07:57 PM) *
^^^^^No question...

Ray is definitely better than Floyd. Nobody can argue accomplishments and quality of competition here.

This is more just to see how they match up in styles.

I see Robinson winning everytime though, no matter what.

Yup..Floyd wouldn't be able to handle his power..Ray could KO Floyd with either hand,with any punch..His right hand to the body would break Floyd down when Floyd would pick his elbows up and hold his hands near his upper forehead..Ray would also use uppercut to split Floyds arms to land when Floyd's hands are in that position..Ray would twist his wrist at the last second on his opp. wrist and break right through..I've seen it and have had it done to me and that shit hurts your wrist bad..When Floyd would hold his right up and his left down around his waist,Ray would be too quick and would get shots in up top by feinting Floyd and seeing how he'd reach then throw the shot that would be open..I also see Ray landing a lot of belly jabs which also set up a lot of Ray's punches up top and to the body..I also see Ray shoeshining Floyd a couple times..Ray didn't have any pitty pat shoeshine either,all those punch hurt..Watch the LaMotta fight and you'll see some of the most vicious body shots..Ray moved Lamotta with body shots from the punch itself,not LaMotta moving.

I don't see Floyd's pitty pats hurting Ray or stopping Ray's rhyme..Floyd's movement would get exposed as would his leaning when he throws his right or even while he's standing still..Let's remember this guys,Ray was a master and through learning his technique he saw right from wrong(leaning,hand placement,would he lean when he bows/slips,and so on)..He exposed everyone's weaknesses..He always had a solution for everyone who was placed in there with him(he was a master of making adjustments)..Ray's mental energy was amazing..When Ray had his rhyme going in the ring,no welter or middle beats him..
PR316
If its a 12 round fight I do give Floyd a chance to last the distance but he would have to use every inch of his skill, know how, and experience here because he'd be in there with a different animal than what he's faced his entire career. Ray I think would have a hard time getting to Floyd's body.

For Floyd to even give himself a real shot, he would have to fight a PERFECT fight. He would have to get in and out, land his quick pot shot right hand, and avoid any serious exchanges of powershots at all costs. Because just staying outside in the reach and distance of Robinson is asking for trouble. Plus he'd have no way of getting his shots in from out there.

Very hard to do against a guy that is probably faster than Floyd himself, plus bigger and stronger, and with KO power in either hand. Not to mention that Robinson didn't mind taking a punch to deliver one of his own.
Run and Gun Game Calls
very good post pr316
dominicbuilder9k1
You compare Sugar Ray Robinson with Floyd..?...

No way!...Was there any instance were Robinson ducked or chicken out with good fighters?...

Better analyzed the difference between a good boxer like Floyd from a very good and great boxer fighters such as Robinson and Ali and Sugar Ray Leonard and Hearns etc,..etc.,..

There is a good boxer and there is a very good, great boxer-fighter...comparison is miles apart.
kidbazooka1
The only welters who i could see giving a peak Robinson trouble was a prime Leonard and Duran from the first Leonard fight not saying they would beat him just saying they would give him a good fight.

Robinson beats Floyd everytime.
neophyte7
If he could lose to someone the skill level of jake lamatta then I see floyd being able to hang tough. Jake lamatta outweighed him by about 15 pounds in the back to back bouts in Detroit's Olympia stadium. Suprisingly Ray weighing at below 147 lost to a much slower lamatta in 1943 even though 3 weeks later ray beat him in a rematch. If a slow Lamatta could beat Ray Rob I give Floyd a shot
PR316
Lamotta was a super strong fella who could walk through Robinson's fire to deliver his own.

I wouldn't put too much on Mayweather being able to do that. Plus he's a smaller guy.

What Lamotta did bears no resemblance to how Mayweather would do.
JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (PR316 @ Jul 21 2010, 06:59 PM) *
Lamotta was a super strong fella who could walk through Robinson's fire to deliver his own.

I wouldn't put too much on Mayweather being able to do that. Plus he's a smaller guy.

What Lamotta did bears no resemblance to how Mayweather would do.

LaMotta could take pain..Robinson broke his ribs in the last fight early on and LaMotta didn't show too many signs of that..If Mayweather had broken ribs,he probably would be showing intense pain and would be favoring his ribs..

LaMotta didn't have the best skills but so what,he had other attributes that made up for them..Skills may be the most important thing to me but there are ways to make due with what you have and beat guys with higher skills..Mayorga did it before too..Does it mean Vernon Forrest wasn't that good??Hell naw,he whooped on Mosley when they fought and Mosley beat Mayorga..LaMotta beat Robinson once..Does anyone know of anyone who beat Robinson twice??LaMotta also weighed around 16 lbs more than Robinson too in the first fight..Yet,I don't think that meant anything because that's how much he outweighed Robinson in the second fight too..
PR316
Another thing about Lamotta is that he would get more aggressive if he got hurt. Not only could he fight through it but sorta like Erik Morales, if you hurt him he would get right on you to try and hurt you back.

If Floyd got hurt against Robinson, you would really see him do alot of running and moving, plus tying up and all that. But Robinson would be able to manhandle him in clinches.

Because of the styles Floyd can last the distance. But if he gets into any kind of war, he would not survive.
neophyte7
If he lost to Lamatta he could lose to Floyd... All this conjecture about Floyd running etc... Please Floyd vs Lamatta... LMAO... Lamatta would be lucky to land 20 clean punches the entire night... I respect RAY ROB as one of the greatest ever.... Floyd is in that category skill wise and no way a Lamatta beats Floyd. Interesting that Ray Rob weighed as a welter in the bouts with Lamatta a 160 pound Lamatta against Floyd at the weights Ray Rob entered into would be too slow for FLOYD who is faster and had better defense than Robinson. Mayweather would give Robinson all types of trouble..
JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (neophyte7 @ Jul 22 2010, 02:01 PM) *
If he lost to Lamatta he could lose to Floyd... All this conjecture about Floyd running etc... Please Floyd vs Lamatta... LMAO... Lamatta would be lucky to land 20 clean punches the entire night... I respect RAY ROB as one of the greatest ever.... Floyd is in that category skill wise and no way a Lamatta beats Floyd. Interesting that Ray Rob weighed as a welter in the bouts with Lamatta a 160 pound Lamatta against Floyd at the weights Ray Rob entered into would be too slow for FLOYD who is faster and had better defense than Robinson. Mayweather would give Robinson all types of trouble..

Castillo in my opinion beat Floyd and you could make a comparison between Castillo and LaMotta..
PR316
QUOTE (neophyte7 @ Jul 22 2010, 03:01 PM) *
If he lost to Lamatta he could lose to Floyd... All this conjecture about Floyd running etc... Please Floyd vs Lamatta... LMAO... Lamatta would be lucky to land 20 clean punches the entire night... I respect RAY ROB as one of the greatest ever.... Floyd is in that category skill wise and no way a Lamatta beats Floyd. Interesting that Ray Rob weighed as a welter in the bouts with Lamatta a 160 pound Lamatta against Floyd at the weights Ray Rob entered into would be too slow for FLOYD who is faster and had better defense than Robinson. Mayweather would give Robinson all types of trouble..


Its not that simple. Boxing is not that type of sport where you can look at two guys be like "Ok, this guy is better than that one so he would do what the other one did".


Styles make fights and while Floyd would be slippery and hard to hit for Robinson, I don't see him imposing his style on a faster and stronger fighter than him.
JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (PR316 @ Jul 22 2010, 05:23 PM) *
Its not that simple. Boxing is not that type of sport where you can look at two guys be like "Ok, this guy is better than that one so he would do what the other one did".


Styles make fights and while Floyd would be slippery and hard to hit for Robinson, I don't see him imposing his style on a faster and stronger fighter than him.

Exactly.
kidbazooka1
When talking about these dream matches i assume were talking about the fighters at there absolute best or in there greatest performances.

Robinson lost to lamotta once and then came back and whooped him some four or five times.
Run and Gun Game Calls
QUOTE (JonnyBlaze @ Jul 22 2010, 07:20 PM) *
Castillo in my opinion beat Floyd and you could make a comparison between Castillo and LaMotta..




not just your opinion jonny, in most fans opinions that I have talked to
D-MARV
I certainly favor Robinson but what's this B.S about Floyd running if he got hurt?


I'm not sure if you guys saw his last fight but Floyd became more aggressive after he got clipped. Floyd is one TOUGH prima donna.
PR316
Yeah but Mosley and Robinson are two very different fighters.
D-MARV
QUOTE (PR316 @ Jul 23 2010, 08:07 PM) *
Yeah but Mosley and Robinson are two very different fighters.

Yes, I'm aware... But every time Floyd has been hurt or buzzed he fights back.
PR316
Well if he gets into a war with Sugar Ray, I don't think that would bode well for him. Robinson had chilling power with either hand.

If Floyd boxes and moves, he can make it competitive.
JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (PR316 @ Jul 23 2010, 09:42 PM) *
Well if he gets into a war with Sugar Ray, I don't think that would bode well for him. Robinson had chilling power with either hand.

If Floyd boxes and moves, he can make it competitive.

Floyd can't move nearly as good as Robinson..Floyd doesn't move good period..There are plenty of guys who move better today than Floyd..Floyd is more similar to James Toney in this aspect,they box good but don't have good footwork outside of their small movements with their feet(pivot out or whatever)..I see Floyd getting stuck in spots he wouldn't want to be in against Ray..Floyd would definitely need to work on his balance for this fight as well..Leaning in when throwing a right hand won't get ya far with Ray..
D-MARV
I agree and disagree with ya JB... Floyd has very good footwork when he uses it (See younger Floyd). Every since Floyd moved up in weight he started to fight more in the pocket (a la James Toney). I never understood why people consider Floyd a runner.
JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (D-MARV @ Jul 23 2010, 10:49 PM) *
I agree and disagree with ya JB... Floyd has very good footwork when he uses it (See younger Floyd). Every since Floyd moved up in weight he started to fight more in the pocket (a la James Toney). I never understood why people consider Floyd a runner.

Floyd is definitely not a runner..He did use footwork more in his younger days but were talkin about Floyd vs. Ray Robinson at welter not lightweight or below..Floyd also had really long arms for a guy at his weight in his younger days especially and he knows how to keep a guy at arms length through his jab..

How do you come to the conclusion of very good footwork though??I think it was decent..He would move to his right in a strategic way but it wasn't smooth like Ray Robinson who was about to punch,bow,and slip while moving to his right because of his balance..Mayweather doesn't have good balance but gets away with it through speed and abilities..When Mayweather moves backwards,he moves heel to toe which would allow a fast Ray Robinson to catch him moving backwards and drop his because of balance(or KO if the punch is flush)..

I do agree that Ray wouldn't be hitting Floyd at will like he did to LaMotta in the Massacre but Ray would find ways to expose Floyd,especially in the way he is balanced and moves..Ray would look for that kinda stuff in his opponents..Small details was the name of his game and he would expose little things that we may not even know notice until watching the fight a couple times in detail..He would fight each opponent differently..So,Floyd may be hard to hit but speed has been shown to mess with him and he's never faced a guy with Ray's speed especially at welter..
PR316
QUOTE (JonnyBlaze @ Jul 23 2010, 11:06 PM) *
Floyd can't move nearly as good as Robinson..Floyd doesn't move good period..There are plenty of guys who move better today than Floyd..Floyd is more similar to James Toney in this aspect,they box good but don't have good footwork outside of their small movements with their feet(pivot out or whatever)..I see Floyd getting stuck in spots he wouldn't want to be in against Ray..Floyd would definitely need to work on his balance for this fight as well..Leaning in when throwing a right hand won't get ya far with Ray..


Lightweight Floyd did have good footwork. He was always light on his feet, and good with side steps and pivots. However, I have also noticed that he does get off balance ever so often especially when opponents put pressure on him(Castillo, Hatton).

But your right in saying that he's not exceptional with his footwork. When I think of great footwork, I think of fighters like Robinson, Pep, Ali, Jersey Joe Walcott, Benny Leonard, Billy Conn(Watch that first with Joe Louis), and Ezzard Charles.

Today, the lightest guy on his feet that I see is Manny Pacquiao.

neophyte7
Mayweather vs Corralles... Mayweather's foot work that night was awesome... Footwork is still damned good but he has mastered defense to the extent that he does not have to move as much. He displayed footwork against Hatton as well before knocking him out. Floyd actually expends less energy by opting to sit in the pocket and use more head and upper body movement. Arturo Gatti gave Mayweather his props for his speed in upper body movement which is another means of him being hard to hit
JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (neophyte7 @ Jul 25 2010, 09:05 AM) *
Mayweather vs Corralles... Mayweather's foot work that night was awesome... Footwork is still damned good but he has mastered defense to the extent that he does not have to move as much. He displayed footwork against Hatton as well before knocking him out. Floyd actually expends less energy by opting to sit in the pocket and use more head and upper body movement. Arturo Gatti gave Mayweather his props for his speed in upper body movement which is another means of him being hard to hit

Mayweathers footwork in my opinion was not awesome at all in that fight..He kept Corrales away with jabs(Floyd had longer arms than Diego) and he would step back and around..He would step hell to toe which could cause him to get knocked down if someone timed his movement..Once he picked up the front part of his foot,he is at risk..Also,Corrales didn't engage like he normally would since he was worried about Floyd's speed..Also,Corrales had to drain himself out to make that weight since Floyd said he would only fight at that weight after Corrales said he was done at that weight cause he couldn't make it anymore..

Watch Robinson,Louis,Tommy Loughran,Benny Leonard(best footwork EVER),and the rest of the guys PR316 mentioned..For the most part,the guys that PR316 mentioned were either trained by Ray Arcel or Jack Blackburn or trainers that were linked to them..Ray Robinson spent time with Blackburn and Joe Louis,which is where I think he picked up his movement from since it's the same exact movement..Their movement is meant to expend very little energy(they never pick their foot up to move unless out of distance then it doesn't matter),be completely balanced while moving and punching,and to not let their opponent know when they are moving or where they are moving..
PR316
I've heard some say that Floyd could have success with his counter right over Robinson's low left.

I don't know because even if he lands it, Robinson being taller and an expert at rolling with punches would be able to take it and counter quickly with 2 or 3 left hooks the way he would do in quick fashion, at the same time stepping and sliding around to get into position to do more damage. Of course we know Floyd is no easy target.

But what we also know is that PBF is vulnerable to a jab. Oscar De La Hoya, Philip N'Dou, and even Ricky Hatton were able to land jabs on Floyd. And with Ray's hand speed and punching accuracy, plus the snap he had in those punches, could find Floyd on receiving end of a bloody nose or bleeding from the mouth, something he's not used to enduring.

Its a difficult fight for both guys for different reasons I think.
JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (PR316 @ Jul 26 2010, 06:29 PM) *
I've heard some say that Floyd could have success with his counter right over Robinson's low left.

I don't know because even if he lands it, Robinson being taller and an expert at rolling with punches would be able to take it and counter quickly with 2 or 3 left hooks the way he would do in quick fashion, at the same time stepping and sliding around to get into position to do more damage. Of course we know Floyd is no easy target.

But what we also know is that PBF is vulnerable to a jab. Oscar De La Hoya, Philip N'Dou, and even Ricky Hatton were able to land jabs on Floyd. And with Ray's hand speed and punching accuracy, plus the snap he had in those punches, could find Floyd on receiving end of a bloody nose or bleeding from the mouth, something he's not used to enduring.

Its a difficult fight for both guys for different reasons I think.

The reason Robinson would hold his left so low would be to keep his jab level to his opponent and not have to bring it up or down..If you watch him fight LaMotta and Basilio that's why he has it that low..If he punches down at an opponent his last 3 knuckles would land but he wanted to land his index and middle finger..To test this,just try it on a wall and you'll see what I'm talkin about..Floyd is 3 inches shorter than Floyd so he would keep it lower but not as low as he did for LaMotta and Basilio who were short to begin with and would make themselves shorter while fighting out of a full crouch instead of Ray's semi-crouch..

Floyd is vulnerable to the jab and Ray would be throwing around 40 a round..In the last LaMotta fight he threw about 60 a round with 30 other power punches EACH round..Hell of a pace..Watch the fight and count if ya don't believe me..If he had that kind of output with his jab against Floyd,I see Floyd in big trouble..DLH has a really good jab but no one today has a jab like Ray's..Ray wouldn't give you any warning it was coming so it was harder to time and see and then you add his speed to the equation and it's over..

Would Floyd be able to do good things in the fight??Yeah..They both are very very good at making adjustments after the first few rounds if things aren't going the right way for them..I see Ray being able to make more adjustments in the fight though which is in my opinion the deciding factor of who wins it..The reason why Floyd wins all his fights today is because he is able to make those adjustments which is something a lot of fighters don't have the mental energy to do..Mosley stopped thinking after he nailed Floyd for example..Mental energy keeps you focused on the task at hand and keeps you thinking and allows you to see mistakes and allows you to capitalize off the mistakes..
PR316
I wouldn't doubt at all that Robinson threw over 40 jabs a round. When I watch him, it seems like he threw even more. And it was a consistent round by round output. Ray hardly took any rounds off. I don't think I've seen a fighter with the stamina he had. I could only imagine the type of training he did compared to what most guys do. He could 15 rounds with absolutely no problem. Even in his last days at welter when he was absolutely killing himself to make the weight.


Oscar's jab is excellent but I always felt De La Hoya didn't have the confidence in his jab that he should have had. Even in his prime. He abandoned his jab against Quartey, Whitaker, and Mosley(The first fight). And we all saw against Mayweather how he put it away after getting caught with a few counter right hands. Ray wouldn't put it away. He would counter Mayweather's right with left hooks and he would fade going down the stretch.

I think Floyd would do some good things as well. At welterweight, Docusen and Gavilan, slick fighters with good skills were able to make Robinson miss. Floyd would be able to as well. And he would land his rights. The challenge would be to stay sharp and in his zone for 12 or 15 rounds against a guy that is so fast and relentless, not to mention that he punches with knockout power in either hand.

JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (PR316 @ Jul 26 2010, 10:40 PM) *
I wouldn't doubt at all that Robinson threw over 40 jabs a round. When I watch him, it seems like he threw even more. And it was a consistent round by round output. Ray hardly took any rounds off. I don't think I've seen a fighter with the stamina he had. I could only imagine the type of training he did compared to what most guys do. He could 15 rounds with absolutely no problem. Even in his last days at welter when he was absolutely killing himself to make the weight.


Oscar's jab is excellent but I always felt De La Hoya didn't have the confidence in his jab that he should have had. Even in his prime. He abandoned his jab against Quartey, Whitaker, and Mosley(The first fight). And we all saw against Mayweather how he put it away after getting caught with a few counter right hands. Ray wouldn't put it away. He would counter Mayweather's right with left hooks and he would fade going down the stretch.

I think Floyd would do some good things as well. At welterweight, Docusen and Gavilan, slick fighters with good skills were able to make Robinson miss. Floyd would be able to as well. And he would land his rights. The challenge would be to stay sharp and in his zone for 12 or 15 rounds against a guy that is so fast and relentless, not to mention that he punches with knockout power in either hand.

Ray would train hard but not like guys today..Guys today would spar 15 rounds for a 15 round fight and sometimes even a 12..Ray would spar 4-6 rounds for 15 round fights..He'd spar 4 one day,then 6 another,and maybe 8 another day..He'd do 2 rounds on the speed bag,2 jump roping,2-4 on the heavybag,2-3 shadowboxing while working his legs,maybe 2 on the double end,calestenics,and leave the gym after 2 hours of training..He'd also run 3-5 miles in combat boots when he'd be getting ready for a 15 rounder..Running forward,backward,and side to side while shadowboxing..So,guys today may seem to train harder but they are over training and that's why they get so tired..Ray was really good at knowing when he'd peak in training and when he'd peak,he'd be fighting within a few days..
gravytrain
I think this wouldn't be quite as difficult for Robinson as some would imagine, I see him winning this convincingly while in his prime. Ray would outwork him, outbox him, and take the 0 out of his record.

I see the fight like this: Sugar troubles Mayweather for five rounds as Mayweather tries to figure him out. Sugar maintains the pace and outworks Mayweather, having won the early rounds he's well ahead. Eventually I think Sugar would floor Mayweather, however I've SRR by UD.
PR316
^^^I think its a UD as well. I don't completely rule out a stoppage because of how hard and how fast Robinson could punch, but I give Floyd the benefit of the doubt that he'll last the distance because he'd be mentally prepared to do so against a guy that can do the damage the Ray could.
gravytrain
QUOTE (PR316 @ Jul 29 2010, 08:24 PM) *
^^^I think its a UD as well. I don't completely rule out a stoppage because of how hard and how fast Robinson could punch, but I give Floyd the benefit of the doubt that he'll last the distance because he'd be mentally prepared to do so against a guy that can do the damage the Ray could.


I think a big factor is whether or not Sugar really wanted to end the fight. I think a prime Sugar would be more than capable of getting a stoppage against Mayweather, that guy would unload on you for a minute straight if he'd to.
PR316
^^^^Yeah it is well known that Ray carried a few guys. And the guys who took his punch either were bigger men, or skilled slick fighters with good chins(Gavilan, Docusen). And guys like Zivic and Angott gave him some problems because of their roughhouse tactics.


I don't doubt Ray's ability to KO Floyd. But Floyd is very smart so if anyone of today era at welterweight could last 15 with him, it would be Floyd.
JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (PR316 @ Jul 29 2010, 09:19 PM) *
^^^^Yeah it is well known that Ray carried a few guys. And the guys who took his punch either were bigger men, or skilled slick fighters with good chins(Gavilan, Docusen). And guys like Zivic and Angott gave him some problems because of their roughhouse tactics.


I don't doubt Ray's ability to KO Floyd. But Floyd is very smart so if anyone of today era at welterweight could last 15 with him, it would be Floyd.

So true..Ray carried a lot of guys..
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