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D-MARV
Thoughts? Discuss.
Spyder
It was completely about money...don't believe his ass. He'll make more money as a winner than he would've with the difference in salary.
JD
No state tax either.

I think it's lame...Jordan would never have followed anyone to another team, he would look at it as a challenge to whoop their asses. LeBron would rather be Clyde than Michael.

WEAK.
PR316
I agree with JD. Lebron is taking the easy way out.

But its all about money and glory these days.

Personally, I think the Heat will flop.
JD
2 stars, 1 really good player and a bunch of minimum salary guys...yeah, they will not win a title.

What if one of them gets hurt? What if two of them are in foul trouble in a big playoff game? Sorry...but I do not see it either.
JonnyBlaze
I'm really pissed..I'm from Chicago,so what do ya expect??I do think Wade is a snake and planned to try to make this happen the whole time..He only came to Chicago to pretend he was interested only to try to persuade James to come with them..James is a bitch for makin this move like you guys said..Chicago would of been the best team for him to go with since it would of been a risk but a good one considering the new Chicago team with Boozer..

I hate the Lakers more than any other team but I hope James,Wade,and Bosh get disappointed with their fantasy dream team and get whooped by even the Lakers..If the Heat keep Beasley,I don't see many teams holding up too well against those guys..Yet,I think they need to get rid of him to get more money to spend on scrubs..They barely have any as it is right now..
King Eugene
Kobe is sitting on his Throne with one leg cocked up on the arm rest giving the heat the Mutombo finger.


Lebron's legacy just took a step back. He can cancel all of the Jordan comparisons now. D. Wade went from Beyonce to Kelly Rowland that fast.

LAKERS BABY!!!
King Eugene
They was showing here on the news Grown Men crying cause Lebron left. laugh.gif

Hell they was even burning his Jersey in Cleveland. These fans are ridiculous. Exactly what did he owe them again?

Beasley gets traded to the Timberwolves for a draft pick. Damn that gotta suck. WTF is there to do in Minnesota?
JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (King Eugene @ Jul 8 2010, 11:36 PM) *
They was showing here on the news Grown Men crying cause Lebron left. laugh.gif

Hell they was even burning his Jersey in Cleveland. These fans are ridiculous. Exactly what did he owe them again?

Beasley gets traded to the Timberwolves for a draft pick. Damn that gotta suck. WTF is there to do in Minnesota?

Yeah,I figured Beasley had to go..

LJ's legacy is going to be taking a step back since he needs other superstars(one of which is the 3rd best in the league) to give him a championship..
King Eugene
Open Letter to Fans from Cavaliers Majority Owner Dan Gilbert

QUOTE
Dear Cleveland, All Of Northeast Ohio and Cleveland Cavaliers Supporters Wherever You May Be Tonight;

As you now know, our former hero, who grew up in the very region that he deserted this evening, is no longer a Cleveland Cavalier.

This was announced with a several day, narcissistic, self-promotional build-up culminating with a national TV special of his "decision" unlike anything ever "witnessed" in the history of sports and probably the history of entertainment.

Clearly, this is bitterly disappointing to all of us.

The good news is that the ownership team and the rest of the hard-working, loyal, and driven staff over here at your hometown Cavaliers have not betrayed you nor NEVER will betray you.

There is so much more to tell you about the events of the recent past and our more than exciting future. Over the next several days and weeks, we will be communicating much of that to you.

You simply don't deserve this kind of cowardly betrayal.

You have given so much and deserve so much more.

In the meantime, I want to make one statement to you tonight:

"I PERSONALLY GUARANTEE THAT THE CLEVELAND CAVALIERS WILL WIN AN NBA CHAMPIONSHIP BEFORE THE SELF-TITLED FORMER ‘KING’ WINS ONE"

You can take it to the bank.

If you thought we were motivated before tonight to bring the hardware to Cleveland, I can tell you that this shameful display of selfishness and betrayal by one of our very own has shifted our "motivation" to previously unknown and previously never experienced levels.

Some people think they should go to heaven but NOT have to die to get there.

Sorry, but that's simply not how it works.

This shocking act of disloyalty from our home grown "chosen one" sends the exact opposite lesson of what we would want our children to learn. And "who" we would want them to grow-up to become.

But the good news is that this heartless and callous action can only serve as the antidote to the so-called "curse" on Cleveland, Ohio.

The self-declared former "King" will be taking the "curse" with him down south. And until he does "right" by Cleveland and Ohio, James (and the town where he plays) will unfortunately own this dreaded spell and bad karma.

Just watch.

Sleep well, Cleveland.

Tomorrow is a new and much brighter day....

I PROMISE you that our energy, focus, capital, knowledge and experience will be directed at one thing and one thing only:

DELIVERING YOU the championship you have long deserved and is long overdue....



Dan Gilbert
Majority Owner
Cleveland Cavaliers
JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (King Eugene @ Jul 9 2010, 01:04 AM) *

That guy is fucked up in the head
Mino
Im a diehard Celtics fan, and all you have to do is look at what they did in 08..I hate to admit it, but Miami is gonna run roughtshot over the East and also win the title easy, just as Bos did
Method
Jordan didn't have to leave...he had Pippen, Grant, Paxton, Rodman, etc.

W the arena 5 minutes away from me, I'll be going to Heat games now.

Cavs owner made a big mistake guaranteeing a title. Big mistake.

JD
Pippen and Grant were drafted a few years after Jordan, then Rodman went there in the mid 90's...but it was Jordan's team and he won with guys that had never won. On the other hand, Lebron went to Dewayne Wade's team. Lebron didn't have to leave, he could have told Cleveland he was staying from jump and given them a chance to do something with a sign and trade...maybe Stoudemire, but the way he played it, he strung them along and they missed out on everyone, especially a replacement for him. I mean, I think it was pretty obvious in the day or two leading up to it that Miami is where he was going...but at that point it was too late, and they found out when all of us did.

As for the Cav's owner...well...that team won't be worth shit now, and he is just a hypocrite.

It's funny, sports fans are so fickle...Lebron was about as well liked as you can imagine, and in a matter of a couple days, that changed.

LOL...watching them torch his jersey in Cleveland...those dudes back home are irate. Fans in NY are irate, though I am not sure why, regardless how much he had them believe they were in it, he was never coming here. Chicago too...he was not going there.

Whatever....is it preseason football yet?
D-MARV
I think Lebron fucked his leagcy up a bit with this move and how he handled it. In saying that, Lebron wants to win a championship and he made the move he felt would best get him there. The comparisons to Jordan or even Kobe need to stop though. Jordan NOR Kobe EVER had to go to someone else's team to win a championship. Miami his "WADE" county and now Dwayne has his sidekick.


I wish Lebron and the Miami Heat the best... I still don't think they will beat the Lakers though.
BigG
Bosh, Lebron, Wade in the same team..DAMN. But how's there bench gonna be.

I'm hoping T-Mac can get back to the way he was in his early days in Houston and Orlando....

If Kobe and the Lakers 3peat...he might be Jordan status.
JD
QUOTE (D-MARV @ Jul 9 2010, 04:43 PM) *
I think Lebron fucked his leagcy up a bit with this move and how he handled it. In saying that, Lebron wants to win a championship and he made the move he felt would best get him there. The comparisons to Jordan or even Kobe need to stop though. Jordan NOR Kobe EVER had to go to someone else's team to win a championship. Miami his "WADE" county and now Dwayne has his sidekick.


I wish Lebron and the Miami Heat the best... I still don't think they will beat the Lakers though.


Kinda of the way I see it.

I don't think they beat Boston right now either...quietly, the Celtics added Jermain O'Neil...they are going to be rough down low to deal with, and match up real well with Miami.
D-MARV
QUOTE (JD @ Jul 9 2010, 08:04 PM) *
Kinda of the way I see it.

I don't think they beat Boston right now either...quietly, the Celtics added Jermain O'Neil...they are going to be rough down low to deal with, and match up real well with Miami.

You bring up a good point... Miami has no one down low to do the dirty work. Someone like Perkins can exploit that. shit, now that I think about it... Orlando matches up with them fairly well. Who is going to handle Dwight Howard? I also think that Chris Bosh has become slightly overrated. He was in Toronto for Christ sakes... He had no choice but to shine up there... LOL. The East did just get interesting though... Boston, Orlando, Miami, Chicago...It's pretty silly to just crown Miami the Eastern champions. Sadly, I have been hearing that remark all day long.
KYLE THEEE SPINKS FAN
I've been out of town for the past three days, and just heard about this. Straight up, FUCK LeBron James. This dude just lost every bit of respect I had for him. This dude will never be in the league of Dr. J, MJ, or Kobe. Be a man and finish what you started. Cleveland could have gave him more money than Miami. He may win a title, but seriously it's on an all star team basically. Wade and Bosh are two of the best players in this league. I hope they don't even make to the finals, and they choke. Seriously, Cleveland was the best team this year in the East and James choked his ass off. He had like 10 turnovers in that last game, and the team did quit. The Cavs did everything LeBron wanted, and still couldn't win the title. Then, to have the nerve to go on national TV just to make a decision is pathetic. You are not above the league, and ESPN should have just told him to fuck off. I hope this guy chokes his ass off the rest of his career, and that the Heat have no team chemistry. Ok rant over.

Oh, there's plenty to do in Minneapolis as well. Beasley won't have trouble finding things to do in this state.
JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (D-MARV @ Jul 9 2010, 07:44 PM) *
You bring up a good point... Miami has no one down low to do the dirty work. Someone like Perkins can exploit that. shit, now that I think about it... Orlando matches up with them fairly well. Who is going to handle Dwight Howard? I also think that Chris Bosh has become slightly overrated. He was in Toronto for Christ sakes... He had no choice but to shine up there... LOL. The East did just get interesting though... Boston, Orlando, Miami, Chicago...It's pretty silly to just crown Miami the Eastern champions. Sadly, I have been hearing that remark all day long.

Boston will give the new heat all they can handle..Pierce has shown he can D up LJ nicely and the big guys in the paint will shut em down..Bosh will get taken out by KG as long as KG's legs stay healthy..I also agree that the new Bulls will be a force as long as they get someone like JJ Red to give them the defense they lost in Kirk and also add a good 3 point shooter to the team..
JD
QUOTE (D-MARV @ Jul 9 2010, 08:44 PM) *
You bring up a good point... Miami has no one down low to do the dirty work. Someone like Perkins can exploit that. shit, now that I think about it... Orlando matches up with them fairly well. Who is going to handle Dwight Howard? I also think that Chris Bosh has become slightly overrated. He was in Toronto for Christ sakes... He had no choice but to shine up there... LOL. The East did just get interesting though... Boston, Orlando, Miami, Chicago...It's pretty silly to just crown Miami the Eastern champions. Sadly, I have been hearing that remark all day long.


Add Davis to Perkins and O'Neil, and not only is that a lot of bodies, but that is also a lot of fouls to give.

I still like Boston in the East.
Method
Might have been Wade's team, but that wont last. Wade took low money to get this guy here. I love Wade, but he knows Lebron is a better player.

Bird - Mchale, Parrish

Jordan - I already mentioned it

Isaiah - Dumars, Lambeer, Rodman Sally

Magic - Worthy, Kareem


People need to take a step back and chillax.

These guys now have to walk the walk. It will be fun to watch them try.

KYLE THEEE SPINKS FAN
It's not about that he left the Cavs, but how he did it. He could have let the Cavs know before he went on TV. Is it really that hard to let the franchise that did everything for you know your decision before you go on TV to make an ass of yourself? I seriously hope this dude never wins a title. I know fans on the Browns message boards are letting him have it, as are other writers. He could have handled this in a better way. In all fairness, Dan Gilbert could have handled it better too in the aftermath.
JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (JD @ Jul 11 2010, 07:24 AM) *
Add Davis to Perkins and O'Neil, and not only is that a lot of bodies, but that is also a lot of fouls to give.

I still like Boston in the East.

I don't really like O'Neil as the new addition down low..I've never been a fan of his..Big Baby continues to keep getting better..I've always liked him but what he showed me in the playoffs is that he's taking it to a new level now..
JD
LOL...yeah, your old team finding out when the rest of the world did was embarrassing. Not taking the calls from them the day of when they were looking for a heads up. He wants to leave, that's cool, but the way he did it was rough.

It's cool though, LeBron would rather be Pippen than Jordan...in fairness, he does do the point forward thing like Pippen. But Jordan was not surrounded by a slew of players outside of Pippen. Grant was solid...that was it really, the big men there were nothing, Paxson could only hit an open 3...he was later replaced by Steve Kerr who was a clone, could not create a shot or anything. The point was who...BJ Armstrong? Man, I hated him, but sometimes we forget what Jordan did with that crew that he had. The threesome that was greatest of all time was Magic, Worthy and Jabbar...that is just silly. Bird, McHale and Parrish with DJ were nasty as well.

Some guys are wired for it, some aren't...those that aren't go to other guys teams who have already won. In the end, he took a new job...that's really it in a nutshell, but the way he did it was not really the best approach.
JonnyBlaze
QUOTE (Fitz @ Jul 12 2010, 10:40 PM) *
I have heard this quite a bit. What's the deal? Rather than him going to a club, and making it his team and getting others to join him. He went to a team that already had Wade and some stars. So he took the easy way out with a team that has stars rather than create his own?

Which is why he should have gone to Chicago..He would of been the superstar of the team with co-stars like Rose,Noah,and Boozer following his lead..
Method
He's better than Wade. He aint gonna be Pippen. Would Jordan have taken less money to get (ok, keep) Pippen the way Wade took less to get Lebron?

As far as how he left Cleveland, I see the issue, but the bottom line is when the shoe is on the other foot, employers, at least in sports and in my industry, NEVER EVER give a head's up on a firing or a trade.
rusty_trombone
QUOTE (KYLE THEEE SPINKS FAN @ Jul 12 2010, 09:36 PM) *
It's not about that he left the Cavs, but how he did it. He could have let the Cavs know before he went on TV. Is it really that hard to let the franchise that did everything for you know your decision before you go on TV to make an ass of yourself? I seriously hope this dude never wins a title. I know fans on the Browns message boards are letting him have it, as are other writers. He could have handled this in a better way. In all fairness, Dan Gilbert could have handled it better too in the aftermath.

Cleveland didn't do shit for Lebron, they were lucky to have him for the time they did. They should thank him for the time he spent in that shithole wasting away and move on.
JD
He ain't a better shooter than Wade, and his game will have to be more Pippen than Jordan to coexist with Wade...because Wade's game is nothing like Pippen's. Would Jordan have taken less money to keep Pippen...considering what these guys make now versus what they did, my guess would be yes in this day and age, but that is merely conjecture...Wade is a team dude, no doubt; as for LeBron, he makes out with the Florida state tax setup. But I think the bigger part is the mentality side of it that makes him more Pippen. Game on the line in a big spot, I am betting Wade takes the shot...not LeBron.

My guess is that Wade will average more ppg than LeBron, and Bosh will see his numbers suffer the most.

In the end, they will win 60 during the regular season, I think that is a foregone conclusion...but the playoffs will be a different story and that is where it will be interesting to see how it all plays out.
rusty_trombone
QUOTE (Fitz @ Jul 12 2010, 11:40 PM) *
I have heard this quite a bit. What's the deal? Rather than him going to a club, and making it his team and getting others to join him. He went to a team that already had Wade and some stars. So he took the easy way out with a team that has stars rather than create his own?

it's because the championships are more valuable to him monetarily, then being the man on a shitty team. His biggest dollars come from endorsements and contracts, not just here, but worldwide. No one gives a shit about a great player that doesn't win, just ask Karl Malone & Dan Marino. If Dan Marino had a championship, he wouldn't be doing slimfast commercials.
JD
QUOTE (rusty_trombone @ Jul 13 2010, 11:28 AM) *
it's because the championships are more valuable to him monetarily, then being the man on a shitty team. His biggest dollars come from endorsements and contracts, not just here, but worldwide. No one gives a shit about a great player that doesn't win, just ask Karl Malone & Dan Marino. If Dan Marino had a championship, he wouldn't be doing slimfast commercials.


Pretty much. I read an interesting article a couple of months ago about how LeBron's biggest market was not NY or Chicago or Cleveland...it was China. The way to crack that market was not to go anywhere specific, but to win titles, like Kobe did. Once Kobe won trophies, he became an icon in China.
Method
Tue enough, Rusty.
rusty_trombone
QUOTE (JD @ Jul 13 2010, 11:32 AM) *
Pretty much. I read an interesting article a couple of months ago about how LeBron's biggest market was not NY or Chicago or Cleveland...it was China. The way to crack that market was not to go anywhere specific, but to win titles, like Kobe did. Once Kobe won trophies, he became an icon in China.

That's exactly right, the Chinese market is massive, and they care about rings. Lebron is doing what is best for Lebron, because the love of all the assholes in Cleveland is worth a goddamn thing. When will people get through their heads that athletes shouldn't be looking out for anyone but themselves, the people will watch whatever you shove in front of them and are fickle. I love how people think Lebron betrayed them, like he fucking matters, there are probably a ton of politicians and dirty businessmen ripping the people of Cleveland off in a way that really affects them, but Lebron leaving is what they care about.(and it's not just cleveland)

oh, and by the way,Dan Gilbert is only really pissed off because his cash cow just left town.
Run and Gun Game Calls
OK just to keep this in perspective, Lebron didnt owe the club any warning at all. how many times do the owners tell the players that they are part of a teams future plans only to start making calls trying to trade or dump the player as soon as he leaves the exec's office? It happens all the time. For once the player had enough power to put the shoe on the other foot.

Secondly, I remember the calls that Jordan couldnt win a title in chicago. finally he did break through and win though.. the big differance is the salary cap now. Cleveland is strapped for cash, and they were not gonna get much better because of moves they made. Lebron could have went to the playoffs there every year, like alan iverson did in philly, and like Iverson at the end of the day have nothing to show for it. he gave cleveland 7 years. He owes the city nor the team anything, he played by the free agency rules.

As for the owner, calling james a quitter.... The mans team took a hit in value when lebron left of $100 million, thats why he was pissed, not because a player decided to go to a new team.

And as for Kobe and Mj compaired to Lebron.

Kobe almost left LA, but the lakers made moves to keep him. Look at his history in fact, he has been the man on only 2 championship teams. Before that he was on shaq's team. And make no mistake those were shaq's teams. And kobe has an all star cast around him in LA now.. He didnt have to leave because the stars were brought to him.

As for MJ, best player I have ever seen, most complete player i have ever seen by far, And dont give me the kobe compaiaisons either because it isnt even close. but MJ too had very very good role players around him.

Lebron moved on, so what? So did Kevin Garnett.

In the end nobody slams you if you change your job, so why slam him? This like many other things will be forgotten in time. And his image will not even be tarnished for to long if they win. Winning solves alot of things
Method
Thank you, R&G
JD
Kobe is no MJ...he has better players around him on a whole, but he is the best in the league right now.

MJ was just unreal, and in time, it is funny how the players around him are perceived the be better than they really were. Outside of Pippen, there was a lot of mediocrity around him.

Run and Gun Game Calls
Dennis Rodman is one of the best rebounders I ever saw
JD
QUOTE (Run and Gun Game Calls @ Jul 13 2010, 08:57 PM) *
Dennis Rodman is one of the best rebounders I ever saw


Definitely, but Jordan had already won three without him on teams that were far from loaded.
Fitz
QUOTE (rusty_trombone @ Jul 14 2010, 01:28 AM) *
it's because the championships are more valuable to him monetarily, then being the man on a shitty team. His biggest dollars come from endorsements and contracts, not just here, but worldwide. No one gives a shit about a great player that doesn't win, just ask Karl Malone & Dan Marino. If Dan Marino had a championship, he wouldn't be doing slimfast commercials.


That's pretty much what I thought. You can correct me if I am wrong, though as far as I know. Lebron James was at least on par or seems liked just as good of a player as Kobe, according to stats and other opinions. The difference between them was championships and is why he is rated higher than Lebron.
That's the gist of it I got anyways.
Run and Gun Game Calls
QUOTE (JD @ Jul 14 2010, 12:12 AM) *
Definitely, but Jordan had already won three without him on teams that were far from loaded.



I agree, but that being said, Jordan had a far superior supporting cast to what Lebron was stuck with
JD
Better...yeah, only because of Pippen though I will disagree that it was a far superior team around him, but LeBron's 07-08 and 08-09 squads were plenty good with a lot of supporting characters, a better point guard, and better big men to do dirty work. In the end though, I think the notion that Jordan had a great squad around him is a far cry from what truly was...and it seems that as time as passed, many forget what was around him and what they truly were - not saying you, it is just a general sentiment that exists.

As for now...if I am building a team for the next decade, give me Kevin Durant.
Spyder
I went to a baseball game this past weekend where the Indians were in town playing the Rays...a couple of Cleveland fans started getting out of line, so I started talking about how much I LOVE the Miami Heat. "I can't wait for the NBA to start plaing again...Miami is STACKED this year, and should win a few Championships."

Stupid Cleveland fans. They didn't like me apologizing for LeBron peacing out of their shitty town...or mentioning the fact that their fucking river caught on fire either. I mean how much of a fucking shithole do you have to be for your river to catch on fire? If you can't picture that...then try to light water on fire.

laugh.gif
Method
QUOTE
"I mean how much of a fucking shithole do you have to be for your river to catch on fire? If you can't picture that...then try to light water on fire."-Spyder


Ahhhahahahaha
PR316
QUOTE (JD @ Jul 13 2010, 09:12 PM) *
Definitely, but Jordan had already won three without him on teams that were far from loaded.


That was exactly the thing with Jordan.

Aside from Pippen, most of those guys were just good, solid role players. But Mike made them better.

The way you can tell if a player is great is how he gets players to raise their games and look better than they actually are.

MJ is the classic example of this.
Run and Gun Game Calls
Dude Lebron didnt win a championship in Cleveland, But you tell me how many guys could have gotten his 2007 team to the finals? ya he made them better, And i dont believe even Kobe Bryant gets that team to the finals
JD
I don't think anyone said he didn't make them a far better team. The 06 - 07 team benefited from a ridiculously weak east...a decent Pistons team was the 1 and the Raptors won the Atlantic with the Nets finishing second...Boston was the 15. Put Kobe on that team and they make it to the finals in my opinion.
D-MARV
Put Kobe on that team and they go to finals and NOT get swept.
Run and Gun Game Calls
thats where you are wrong, bryant has always had a very strong supporting cast. if he was faced with playing on a average team, the player Phil Jackson called "uncoachable" would turn into Terrell Owens and implode the team. he is to much of a diva IMO
Method
Again, Im w R&G. If Zen master Phil Jackson calls you uncoachable...well, there's something to be said there.
Big Slim Sweet
QUOTE (Fitz @ Jul 12 2010, 10:40 PM) *
I have heard this quite a bit. What's the deal? Rather than him going to a club, and making it his team and getting others to join him. He went to a team that already had Wade and some stars. So he took the easy way out with a team that has stars rather than create his own?

Pippen was perceived as the ultimate supporting player, a guy who could do everything really well, but lacked something internally that kept him from being "The Man." When Jordan was gone Pip sat out the final 1.8 seconds of a playoff game because he didn't like the play Phil Jackson drew up.

Jordan, by contrast, was simply the ultimate superstar. There has never been an athlete who so consistently excelled in crunch time. When the Bulls needed a big shot, everyone in the arena knew MJ was going to take it, and for the most part, every time he took it, he made it.

LeBron going to Wade's team puts him more in the Scottie Pippen role, though I think in reality it will be more like they split the two. When the game is on the line, it won't always be on LeBron to take the big shot. Sometimes he'll take it, sometimes he'll make it. Sometimes DWade will take it, sometimes he'll make it.

One thing I'll say being a Chicago boy and having watched probably 90% of the games during the Jordan/Pippen era, Scottie Pippen was one of the most UNDERrated players in the history of the game. The guy was a phenomenal talent. He could literally do everything. Great athlete, passer, handles, 3-point shot from the top of the key, rebounder, shut-down defender, ridiculous basketball IQ. He was a superstar in his own right. But other than Horace during the first three peat and Rodman and Kukoc during the second, no one else on those teams was ever better than average.
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