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thehype
QUOTE (Fitz @ Aug 10 2010, 11:09 PM) *
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I could, but I think he misunderstood me, so not this time.


Nope...I understood exactly what you meant, so you may actually want to go back through the archives and pull up a bunch of posts from people saying "eh, yeah, we'll deal with that fight."

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I definitely remember how much you thoroughly enjoyed the fight, as well as Mayweather's performance, despite the fact that you personally didn't demand it, but were able to deal with it.

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thehype
QUOTE (Fitz @ Aug 11 2010, 12:00 AM) *
They were. Don't you remember the Margarito fight being the one that people were literally SCREAMING for (me personally, I never gave Margarito a chance). But there you go.
As for the rest, I'm at work I will try read the rest when I get a chance. But that's an awful lot for "deal with it". Though you never disappoint.

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It's an awful lot because I don't think you ever understand me. Apparently my one-liners aren't clear enough. Just think, this all started when I answered that Hatton was the last non-GBP fighter that Mayweather fought.

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May 5, 2007 - Mayweather SD12 De La Hoya
July 14, 2007 - Williams UD12 Margarito
November 10, 2007 - Margarito TKO1 Golden Johnson
December 8, 2007 - Mayweather TKO10 Hatton

???????

You really had that much stock in Margarito, huh?
Fitz
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 11 2010, 03:07 PM) *
Nope...I understood exactly what you meant, so you may actually want to go back through the archives and pull up a bunch of posts from people saying "eh, yeah, we'll deal with that fight."

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I definitely remember how much you thoroughly enjoyed the fight, as well as Mayweather's performance, despite the fact that you personally didn't demand it, but were able to deal with it.

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I am not searching for it, because I didn't say people were complaining. Sheeesh. I said people dealt with it (meaning people didn't bitch and moan about it) because it wasn't the worst fight. Though I don't think it was the best and probably 3 fights at least that people probably would have preferred at the time.

QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 11 2010, 03:14 PM) *
It's an awful lot because I don't think you ever understand me. Apparently my one-liners aren't clear enough. Just think, this all started when I answered that Hatton was the last non-GBP fighter that Mayweather fought.

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May 5, 2007 - Mayweather SD12 De La Hoya
July 14, 2007 - Williams UD12 Margarito
November 10, 2007 - Margarito TKO1 Golden Johnson
December 8, 2007 - Mayweather TKO10 Hatton

???????

You really had that much stock in Margarito, huh?


Hey, a loss never stopped him from fighting Judah did it? You really had that much stock in Judah who just lost to a journeyman from south america that nobody knew of, huh?

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gravytrain
QUOTE (Fitz @ Aug 11 2010, 12:57 AM) *
Absolutely not. Just remember your bolded part "tuneup". Yet with this tuneup, Marquez was like a 6/7-1 underdog and his last fight was at 135 and was 36 years old. He was inferior to Mayweather in every single way possible. Age and speed was one, and then came size and skills. Like yourself said, it was a tuneup. Yet this so called tuneup, they made a 24/7 about and promoted the fuck out of it.
Also people look too much at Marquez ratings. Yeah, so he had a close fight with Pacquiao and was rank #2 in the world, though he was never big enough or young enough to be given a chance.
The fight also lost so much credibility when they tried to sell the fight more by making it a catch weight at 144. Mayweather comes in at 147 and turned out they paid Marquez money or something along those lines for him to come in over, lol.
It always makes me laugh when people assume Marquez-Mayweather was credible because Marquez arguably beat Pacquiao. I suppose with the same logic, we should have pushed for Spinks-Hopkins at 170 because Spinks arguably beat Taylor.
Based on the odds, the size, how Marquez looked vulnerable against Diaz, Mayweather paying to come in overweight etc. The fight was no better than Margarito/Clottey. Like you yourself called it. A tuneup. Just remember, that it wasn't promoted like one. The fight definitely wasn't better than Clottey or Margarito.
The fight was flat out garbage, and looking how Mayweather looked against Mosley and then see what he did against Marquez. Floyd carried Marquez, the fight was just as predictable or if not more so than Clottey or a Margarito fight.


I'm being impartial by calling it a tune up for Mayweather, I'm not going to sit around and make it sound like Marquez was going to come up and dominate. It's a chance for Mayweather to have a legitimate common opponent with Pacquiao though. Ultimately Marquez is a good fighter that got dominated by a better fighter.

Pacquiao/Margarito? The only reason the fight is happening is because no one will buy a Cotto rematch. Margarito went the distance with a chump to win a title and will now be fighting for the regular title a legit champion had to vacate. Margarito doesn't even deserve to fight again, he should be banned for life. How's it in the same league as Mayweather/Marquez? Clottey lost to a guy Pacquiao pretty much shut out then got a TKO against and Mosley was begging for a fight. Arum himself admits Clottey has no following and from the minute the fight was announced Clottey was smiling and waiting to collect a check. A guy showing up to be a sparring partner is more credible?

I'll give you the Marquez fight not being the best, I don't deny that. Mayweather is too big for Marquez. To say Margarito and Clottey against Pacquiao is comparable is a stretch though, they're not even in the same universe.
Warlord
Pac and Gayweather are both pieces of shit. They remind me of two pussies facing off on the playground shouting, "Do something!"

"NO YOU DO SOMETHING!

"DO SOMETHING!!!!"

And neither of them ever does shit.

And the only fucktards still talking about it or even giving a shit are their stupid ass friends. "Man did you see Jonny? He was gonna whip dude's ass."

Fucking faggots can't find enough sack to sign a contract with like $100 million dollars on the line. They both fucking suck. James Toney'd fight 'em both for a cheeseburger. At the same time.
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (gravytrain @ Aug 11 2010, 01:49 AM) *
I'll give you the Marquez fight not being the best, I don't deny that. Mayweather is too big for Marquez. To say Margarito and Clottey against Pacquiao is comparable is a stretch though, they're not even in the same universe.


I'd say they are in the same ballpark purely because of the weight. Marquez looked like a fucking club fighter at 144. He was so far out of his weight class it was ridiculous. As Fitz pointed out it would be like Spinks going up to fight Hopkins at LHW. Marquez had NO business fighting anyone at that weight.

I'll ask you this. If Marquez had fought either Clottey or Margarito allowing them to come in at 147 how long do you think the fight would go? 3 rounds tops.

I'd go so far to say if he ever rematched Pac at 144 and Pac weighing 147 the fight would not go 3.
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (gravytrain @ Aug 10 2010, 11:52 PM) *
Realistically he wasn't going to fight Margarito or Cotto, Arum and Mayweather couldn't even work together to make the biggest fight of recent times. I'd say Mosley, Williams, and Cintron is a far more realistic solid list. I think Mayweather vs Hatton was one of the biggest fights to make; Mayweather was the American star of boxing and Hatton was the British star of boxing. That Margarito fight really revived Mosley's career, Cintron and Williams still haven't transcended the sport. All things considered I think it'd appeal to boxing fans and casual fans.


Gravy it seems like you have a good memory. Who was it that was screaming for Mayweather at 147 but he declined to fight them cause he felt 'disrespected.' Was it Mosley or Margarito? Someone like that. Anyhoo Hatton comes out with one quip after his fight with Callazo and suddenly Floyd's screaming for the fight to be made. Classic!

As for Floyd and King I suspect they both have their own agenda on this one. Floyd's a thinkin I'm gonna use this dude to put my crew on notice and Don's a thinkin I'm gonna sucker this fool into signing with me. No way do I see Don King allowing himself to used as a negotiating tool for Floyd Mayweather. He's in it to win it.

It's like a grand a night hooker dictating what positions she will and won't do. I'm afraid it doesn't quite work that way.
Fitz
QUOTE (gravytrain @ Aug 11 2010, 03:49 PM) *
I'm being impartial by calling it a tune up for Mayweather, I'm not going to sit around and make it sound like Marquez was going to come up and dominate. It's a chance for Mayweather to have a legitimate common opponent with Pacquiao though. Ultimately Marquez is a good fighter that got dominated by a better fighter.


I'm being impartial by saying Mayweather-Marquez and Pacquiao-Clottey were both trash. Though I definitely don't think Mayweather-Marquez is in a different league when it comes to match making. The odds and predicitions for those fights show us otherwise. More people would have felt Clottey was more a legitimate chance of winning than Marquez. I personally felt Marquez was a poor opponent and Floyd should have been in with someone bigger and better at that weight limit and Clottey was collecting a pay check. The difference between the two fights before it happened was that I KNEW Marquez was a shitty opponent and with Clottey, it was merely speculation that he was just getting his check. It seemed to be the case otherwise.

QUOTE (gravytrain @ Aug 11 2010, 03:49 PM) *
Pacquiao/Margarito? The only reason the fight is happening is because no one will buy a Cotto rematch. Margarito went the distance with a chump to win a title and will now be fighting for the regular title a legit champion had to vacate. Margarito doesn't even deserve to fight again, he should be banned for life. How's it in the same league as Mayweather/Marquez? Clottey lost to a guy Pacquiao pretty much shut out then got a TKO against and Mosley was begging for a fight. Arum himself admits Clottey has no following and from the minute the fight was announced Clottey was smiling and waiting to collect a check. A guy showing up to be a sparring partner is more credible?


I'm not here to argue whether Margarito should be fighting morally or not. He is fighting so I am just commenting on the fight as him as a fighter, not on whether he should or shouldn't be fighting.
Once again, I am not saying Margarito-Pacquiao is a great fight. I think it's a shit fight and a fight they are putting Manny in that they know he can win, but I still don't think it's better than Mayweather-Marquez. Even now, I would still give Margarito a bigger chance against Pacquiao (which isn't saying much) more than I gave Marquez a shot at beating Mayweather.

QUOTE (gravytrain @ Aug 11 2010, 03:49 PM) *
I'll give you the Marquez fight not being the best, I don't deny that. Mayweather is too big for Marquez. To say Margarito and Clottey against Pacquiao is comparable is a stretch though, they're not even in the same universe.


I suppose we will just agree to disagree. You think Marquez is a better fighter to fight at welter, while I think Clottey/Margarito are better opponents at 147/154 than Marquez is at that weight.
I can honestly say that both Manny and Floyd are acting like bitches with bad match making. I just don't think Pacquiao-Clottey/Margarito are in a totally different universe than Marquez-Mayweather, lol. To me there isn't much that separates the two when it comes to safe match making.
JD
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 10 2010, 11:07 PM) *
But it's not a technicality...it's fact. As a technicality, because he ended up signing with them months after the fight, you could say he was....but he officially wasn't. I'm not asking you or anyone else to agree to it....it's a fact. Read the press release...Google it....Bing it...whatever it...it's fact.

Does that mean Joe Calzaghe is basically a Square Ring fighter since it was the first time he worked with and under, and shortly retired, never working with another promoter?

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No, no, no....I kid, I kid...but the fact remains, Ricky Hatton was not fighting for Golden Boy Promotions on December 8, 2007....and neither was Floyd. So technically and officially, neither one were GBP fighters.

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As for Pac, if he's NOT a GBP fighter, then why is he paying them?

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I know I certainly wouldn't be giving someone any of my money if I didn't have to.

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Perhaps someone should start a petition to get them to remove Pacquiao from their website.

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Pac is forced to pay GBP because of the settlement made between Top Rank and GBP in what is a totally jacked up scenario, regardless of the fact that they will promote against him constantly, he is forced to dole out some money to them...strange ass sport we love.

On Hatton...we are on the "could say he was" side, and do say he was.

Hatton - Mayweather...Golden Boy Promotions Fight (one fight agreement)
Hatton - Lazcano...Golden Boy Promotions (multi-fight deal)
Hatton - Malignaggi...Golden Boy Promotions (multi-fight deal)
Hatton - Pacquiao...Golden Boy Promotions (multi-fight deal)

Now sure...someone can sit back and say "see, he wasn't a GBP fighter for the Mayweather fight...he didn't officially and / or technically become one until March of 2008 before the Lazcano fight."

Technically they would be right, but it doesn't mean he wasn't a GBP fighter for all intents and purposes when he fought Floyd. Had Hatton won, they were hoping to make a DLH fight...it was rumored for a while that he was signing longterm with GBP. Much like Spyder said, it is similar to a player getting a one year "prove it" deal, they are still part of the team - just not long term.

So, as I said...if you can see why many of us view it the way that we do, which I think you do but man do you love busting balls, wonderful...if not, c'est la vie.
Method
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 10 2010, 10:13 PM) *
MP does the exact same thing that Ex Promotions (Bernard), Winky Promotions (Wright), Marquez Promotions (Juan Manuel)...the list goes on...they HIRE Golden Boy Promotions and use their services....whether that be to set up press conferences, book conference calls, promote entire events or get them a fight date. To the untrained AND trained eye GBP does everything because that's what they're being paid to do. It's a model set up by HBO. Because the network is not allowed to act as a promoter, they literally tell fighters to get with Golden Boy Promotions. That's EXACTLY what they did to Winky Wright.

But again, that's a topic of discussion for a DIFFERENT thread.


Can we PLEASE start this thread. I think there is a lot of juicy shit waiting to be unearthed.
Fitz
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 11 2010, 02:52 PM) *
Saying that people could "deal with it" implies, at least to me, that they were hoping for a much better fight, but because they couldn't get that fight, they simply settled for this one because it wasn't so bad and it wasn't so great....they just chose to "deal with it" because it was so-so and, like you said, they didn't have much to complain about. Now, I'm not saying or suggesting that people were "screaming for it" (not sure where you got that assumption from, as all I said was that people couldn't wait for it...which was true...PPV numbers don't lie, so obviously, there were a lot of people who couldn't wait to see it), but I do think it was at least one of the biggest fights that could have been made at the time.

I mean, how many other fights at the time around the division were bigger? Margarito had JUUUUUST lost to Paul Williams two months after Floyd fought Oscar, so surely you're not going to tell me that Mayweather should have fought Margarito instead of Hatton. I mean, I guess he could have fought Cotto...maybe Mosley....sure, those would have been big fights too, but were they really that much bigger or that much more anticipated than a fight with Ricky Hatton...a fight that people had been wanting to see ever since Hatton beat Tszyu in 2005? I mean, we ARE talking about two undefeated fighters...two fighters that most people had ranked in their top 10 P4P lists, right? Were Cotto and Mosley ranked in your Top 10 at the time. Were they top 5? Hell, I think some people (certainly NOT me) may have even had Hatton as high as 4...so I don't know if I would act like it was just some "ho-hum" fight that people simply chose to "deal with" because they had to. If Mayweather vs. Mosley was MORE anticipated at the time, I'm quite sure Floyd would have LOVED to fight him then for the much bigger payday (would Mosley have even demanded the same type of purse split as Hatton), no?

I'm just saying, I don't know if I would say Mayweather vs. Hatton was just some "ho-hum, we'll deal with it" type of fight at the time. I mean, Hatton vs. Collazo was a "deal with it" type of fight...just like Pacquiao vs. Margarito and Pacquiao vs. Clottey are "deal with it" type of fights, which is the reason why I even mentioned them bro. I don't bring those fights up because I "hate" them or have "hate" for Pacquiao. On the contrary, I'm looking forward to Pacquiao vs. Margarito because either way it goes, it's going to be entertaining and I'm going to LOVE the outcome. If Pacquiao beats the shit out of Margarito, that's great, because quite frankly, he deserves a beatdown for 1) even trying that shit against Mosley and 2) for possibly doing it to other fighters, like Cotto. On the flip, if Margarito wins, hey, that's great too because all this talk about Mayweather vs. Pacquiao will be gone...POOF....just like that, and quite frankly, I think that would be the funniest shit in the world to happen to some motherfuckers that are already rich as shit, but still greedy as fuck (and that goes across the aboard to everyone involved). But it ain't about playing favorites nor did I "harp" on Pacquiao-Clottey/Margarito. Those were simply the first two fights that popped up in my head...the first two fights, involving a big name, that I remembered which I would consider being "deal with it" type of fights. So okay...I could have easily said De La Hoya vs. Forbes, De La Hoya vs. Sturm, Cotto vs. Jennings, Hatton vs. Lazcano, Pacquiao vs. Diaz, Hopkins vs. Ornelas...and yes...sure...why not....Mayweather vs. Marquez, Mayweather vs. Baldomir, Mayweather vs. Mitchell, or fuck it...even Mayweather vs. Gatti. ALL OF THOSE...sure...no problem...I'll agree and gladly call them ALL "deal with it" fights (although Mayweather vs. Marquez still kind of sticks out from the bunch...at least one of the better anticipated of the group)....BUT Mayweather vs. Hatton....NAAAAAH....I don't think it falls into that same category.

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I mean, if it does, then shit, go ahead and throw Pacquiao vs. Hatton into that category too.

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If it wasn't a highly anticipated fight, I don't know how the hell the PPV numbers did so well. Obviously somebody was anticipating it...must've just been those dumb Brits who actually thought Hatton had a chance.

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AGAIN, not saying it was the MOST anticipated...like a Mayweather vs. Paquiao or Mayweather vs. De La Hoya...but it was CERTAINLY ONE OF THE BEST fights that could've been made at the time.

Now Pacquiao vs. De La Hoya on the other hand...that was DEFINITELY a "deal with it" type of fight....that one DEFINITELY fits your definition of a fight that "they can deal with without much complaint."

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Oh, but wait...some people did complain about it. Shit! So what does that make THAT fight?

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Maybe a "deal with it, but the result shocked me" type of fight?

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That's a pretty good post, I eventually read it, lol. Look, I seriously think you took what I said the wrong way. You know me and my searching, I even searched myself, though this time I wasn't owning myself or anybody. This is what I meant and this was before the fight was signed.

http://www.fighthype.com/community/index.p...st&p=357908

QUOTE
Yeah, I too would have preferred to have seen Mayweather vs Mosley/Cotto, not that there is anything wrong with Hatton but I think Mosley or Cotto would probably match up better against Mayweather.
But it kind of looks like that the winners of both fights are going to square off, so as long as that happens this isn't too bad afterall. Also MeanMustard, your right about Hatton being decisively quick. He has a different type of quickness, he isn't quick on his feet like a Mayweather type of way moving from side to side etc, he is really quick on his feet going in and out. He kind of bounces in and out in a weird type of way and his hand speed isn't too bad either. I really hope I am wrong, but I think Hatton will win some early rounds but as the fight goes on, Mayweather should settle in better and dominate big in the 2nd half of the fight and win something like 8-4 9-3 or something. I really hope I am wrong though, I will definitely be rooting for Hatton.


When I said "deal with it", this is what I was talking about. It wasn't the worst fight and I wasn't going to bitch about it, and others didn't either. Though it wasn't the priority fight people wanted. Though they dealt with it, because it could have been much worse. That's all I ever said before and after.

I even gave him heaps of props for that fight.

http://www.fighthype.com/community/index.p...st&p=369391

QUOTE
Yep, I hate Mayweather and said a few weeks back that for Mayweather to have a chance next to Cotto, he needs to beat Hatton in very impressive fashion. A win like he had against DLH or Baldomir just wouldn't cut it. He looked good tonight and was impressive and as much as I hate him, I give credit where it's due and this win was enough to make him a serious contender for the award.
For me it's out of Cotto and Mayweather, I don't agree with anyone else in the running.


http://www.fighthype.com/community/index.p...st&p=369277

QUOTE
I can't stand Floyd's guts, but very good win for him. He doesn't really fight like a pussy when he is stronger. But he fought well in the rounds I saw (missed rounds 6,7 and 8 cause of the cable company) and he fights well on the inside.
Another thing, Hatton is dirty which is to be expected but so is Floyd he makes a habbit of putting elbows into faces. It was a rough and dirty fight by both. Very impressive performance by both.
I now think fighter of the year should be Cotto or Floyd (stuff Pavlik), Floyd put on a performance I thought was needed for his to be a serious contender for fighter of the year. As much as I hate Floyd, good win for him and props.


I think you took my quote as "deal with it" as me being too hostile. I wasn't being hostile, it was a legit fight, it just wasn't the priority and myself felt that there were far more credible 147 fighters to fight when Mayweather was undisputed. Hatton had one fight and looked bad in doing so, and you mentioned two guys already that he could have fought. Cotto or Mosley and they were the ones I was thinking of, and even Margarito (yeah he lost his last fight, but like I already told you, it didn't stop him from fighting Zab wink.gif). I just felt it was not the number 1 fight, but not terrible either. So when I say "deal with it", that's what I meant and I explained what I meant by pulling a post from 2007 before the fight happened. I still thought it was good enough, but not shit enough to talk shit about.

QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 11 2010, 02:52 PM) *
If it wasn't a highly anticipated fight, I don't know how the hell the PPV numbers did so well. Obviously somebody was anticipating it...must've just been those dumb Brits who actually thought Hatton had a chance.


I know you are joking about this, but funnily enough, there is a bit of truth to that. The Brits did quite a bit for the PPV numbers, lol.

QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 11 2010, 02:52 PM) *
I mean, if it does, then shit, go ahead and throw Pacquiao vs. Hatton into that category too.


I think the difference between that is, that when Mayweather-Hatton fought, people knew how good Floyd was already and he was UNDISPUTED 147 champion at the time, and Hatton had one fight and got worked by Collazo in a close fight, he didn't look good. Plus, Mayweather worked it at 140 as well, so it was a good transition.
Pacquiao on the other hand fought a controversial decision with Marquez at 130, he moved up to 135 and beat Diaz, then all of a sudden he is fighting DLH and nobody gave him a chance. Manny spanked him and a lot of people (myself included) believed DLH was a dead man walking that night, he didn't touch Pacquiao and people felt DLH was a human punching bag that night, a walking corpse.
He then goes on to fight Hatton, and until then people were still not sold on Pacquiao when he was fighting Hatton, because they still didn't believe how Manny handles a legit 135+ fighter, because DLH did nothing, it was hard to gauge that fight. So I think leading up to the fight, it wasn't as big, but it was a very legit fight, plus many felt Manny at 147 was a once off, and he was moving back down to 140 and going to campaign there.

I also complained about DLH-Pacquiao and bitched about it being a circus act and Manny will get laid out. If a fight like that happens again, I will continue to bitch because stuff like that rarely happens. Next time I will be right when I bitch under similar circumstances. Actually, I was right the next time. I bitched about Mayweather-Marquez, that one guy was too big, quick and young. Turned out I was right about that one.

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thehype
QUOTE (Fitz @ Aug 11 2010, 01:21 AM) *
I am not searching for it, because I didn't say people were complaining. Sheeesh. I said people dealt with it (meaning people didn't bitch and moan about it) because it wasn't the worst fight. Though I don't think it was the best and probably 3 fights at least that people probably would have preferred at the time.


At the time, Mayweather vs. Hatton was just as big of a fight as Mayweather vs. Mosley or Mayweather vs. Cotto. I'm not saying that people complained about it either....I'm saying that just as many people who were eagerly anticipating the Cotto fight were likely just as eager to see the Hatton fight.


QUOTE (Fitz @ Aug 11 2010, 01:21 AM) *
Hey, a loss never stopped him from fighting Judah did it? You really had that much stock in Judah who just lost to a journeyman from south america that nobody knew of, huh?

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And a loss never stopped Pacquiao from fighting Clottey...but that's not the really point. You're comparing apples to oranges. I never said that I preferred for Floyd to fight Zab Judah, coming off that loss, instead of someone else. On the contrary, you just told me that you preferred to see Floyd fight Margarito, coming off that loss.

There's is difference in that, no?
thehype
QUOTE (JD @ Aug 11 2010, 06:48 AM) *
Pac is forced to pay GBP because of the settlement made between Top Rank and GBP in what is a totally jacked up scenario, regardless of the fact that they will promote against him constantly, he is forced to dole out some money to them...strange ass sport we love.

On Hatton...we are on the "could say he was" side, and do say he was.

Hatton - Mayweather...Golden Boy Promotions Fight (one fight agreement)
Hatton - Lazcano...Golden Boy Promotions (multi-fight deal)
Hatton - Malignaggi...Golden Boy Promotions (multi-fight deal)
Hatton - Pacquiao...Golden Boy Promotions (multi-fight deal)

Now sure...someone can sit back and say "see, he wasn't a GBP fighter for the Mayweather fight...he didn't officially and / or technically become one until March of 2008 before the Lazcano fight."

Technically they would be right, but it doesn't mean he wasn't a GBP fighter for all intents and purposes when he fought Floyd. Had Hatton won, they were hoping to make a DLH fight...it was rumored for a while that he was signing longterm with GBP. Much like Spyder said, it is similar to a player getting a one year "prove it" deal, they are still part of the team - just not long term.

So, as I said...if you can see why many of us view it the way that we do, which I think you do but man do you love busting balls, wonderful...if not, c'est la vie.


I'm not busting balls. If Ricky Hatton was "technically" a GBP fighter, then why was Dennis Hobson doing the negotiating with Team Mayweather to make the fight? Was he "technically" one of the GBP fighter that GBP let other promoters do the negotiating for?

dntknw.gif
thehype
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 11 2010, 06:58 AM) *
Can we PLEASE start this thread. I think there is a lot of juicy shit waiting to be unearthed.


There IS a lot of juicy shit...always is....but like I said, this ain't the thread for it.

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JD
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 11 2010, 10:33 AM) *
I'm not busting balls. If Ricky Hatton was "technically" a GBP fighter, then why was Dennis Hobson doing the negotiating with Team Mayweather to make the fight? Was he "technically" one of the GBP fighter that GBP let other promoters do the negotiating for?

dntknw.gif


Yep, because it was his first fight before signing a long term deal and it was a one shot "prove it" deal where he had Hobson working with him. It was pretty well known that going in he was going to sign with GBP because Oscar wanted to fight him if he won. What was stated was that "technically" he was not a GBP fighter, but for all intents and purposes, he really was...so I think the technicality is on the opposite side in the above statement.

Not sure what more can be said on it...we each view it differently...though I understand your side of it.

Whatever, I guess boxing is so dead, this is the shit we are spending time and energy on. LOL...I can't do this anymore.
thehype
QUOTE (Fitz @ Aug 11 2010, 08:02 AM) *
That's a pretty good post, I eventually read it, lol. Look, I seriously think you took what I said the wrong way. You know me and my searching, I even searched myself, though this time I wasn't owning myself or anybody. This is what I meant and this was before the fight was signed.

http://www.fighthype.com/community/index.p...st&p=357908

When I said "deal with it", this is what I was talking about. It wasn't the worst fight and I wasn't going to bitch about it, and others didn't either. Though it wasn't the priority fight people wanted. Though they dealt with it, because it could have been much worse. That's all I ever said before and after.

I even gave him heaps of props for that fight.

http://www.fighthype.com/community/index.p...st&p=369391

http://www.fighthype.com/community/index.p...st&p=369277


I don't know if that was the best example, because I can find just as many people...probably even more...in that very same thread that were more than happy to see that fight and just as pleased to see Mayweather fight Hatton as they would have been to see him fight Mosley or Cotto. I mean, I GET that it wasn't the fight that YOU wanted...and maybe some others wanted...but I think what you're not getting is that it was INDEED a fight that A LOT of people wanted. Hell, Method even said it himself:

QUOTE (Method @ Jul 31 2007, 01:38 PM) *
This showdown, regardless of how competitive it will or won't be, was a long time coming. What is wrong with the best fighting the best? Just one more example of someone complaining about an intriguing matchup. Whether or not Hatton has a snowball's chance in hell is a whole other story.


I mean, my man Meth speaks for the people and if he says it was a long time coming, the best fighting the best and an intriguing matchup, well, that's all I need to hear to know that it was way more than just a "deal with it" type of fight.

QUOTE (Fitz @ Aug 11 2010, 08:02 AM) *
I think you took my quote as "deal with it" as me being too hostile. I wasn't being hostile, it was a legit fight, it just wasn't the priority and myself felt that there were far more credible 147 fighters to fight when Mayweather was undisputed. Hatton had one fight and looked bad in doing so, and you mentioned two guys already that he could have fought. Cotto or Mosley and they were the ones I was thinking of, and even Margarito (yeah he lost his last fight, but like I already told you, it didn't stop him from fighting Zab wink.gif). I just felt it was not the number 1 fight, but not terrible either. So when I say "deal with it", that's what I meant and I explained what I meant by pulling a post from 2007 before the fight happened. I still thought it was good enough, but not shit enough to talk shit about.


No....I didn't take it as you being hostile at all (I don't know why you keep trying to tell me what I was or was not thinking...lol). I took it as you trying to downplay that fight as though it was insignificant and not really anticipated...basically, that it was an okay fight that people would accept, but not a mega-fight that people were eager to see. THAT is what I assumed you meant by a "deal with it" type of fight and that is what I disagree with. Was it the number 1 fight? Maybe, maybe not...but I don't know if I'd say that Mayweather-Mosley or Mayweather-Cotto were the number 1 fight either (judging from the strong belief that some people have that De La Hoya nearly beat him, I'd say Mayweather-De La Hoya 2 was probably the number 1 fight...lol). I think they were all just as equally big and as equally as important. Had Mayweather have fought Mosley instead, then people would have been "dealing with" the fact that he fought Mosley, but "ducked" Hatton, right?

QUOTE (Fitz @ Aug 11 2010, 08:02 AM) *
I think the difference between that is, that when Mayweather-Hatton fought, people knew how good Floyd was already and he was UNDISPUTED 147 champion at the time, and Hatton had one fight and got worked by Collazo in a close fight, he didn't look good. Plus, Mayweather worked it at 140 as well, so it was a good transition.
Pacquiao on the other hand fought a controversial decision with Marquez at 130, he moved up to 135 and beat Diaz, then all of a sudden he is fighting DLH and nobody gave him a chance. Manny spanked him and a lot of people (myself included) believed DLH was a dead man walking that night, he didn't touch Pacquiao and people felt DLH was a human punching bag that night, a walking corpse.
He then goes on to fight Hatton, and until then people were still not sold on Pacquiao when he was fighting Hatton, because they still didn't believe how Manny handles a legit 135+ fighter, because DLH did nothing, it was hard to gauge that fight. So I think leading up to the fight, it wasn't as big, but it was a very legit fight, plus many felt Manny at 147 was a once off, and he was moving back down to 140 and going to campaign there.

I also complained about DLH-Pacquiao and bitched about it being a circus act and Manny will get laid out. If a fight like that happens again, I will continue to bitch because stuff like that rarely happens. Next time I will be right when I bitch under similar circumstances. Actually, I was right the next time. I bitched about Mayweather-Marquez, that one guy was too big, quick and young. Turned out I was right about that one.

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So in summary, Mayweather is a victim of his own talent. Those fights were just "deal with it" fights because he's good, whereas Manny's fights were "legit" because everyone thought he sucked?

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This is really a funny conversation.

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thehype
QUOTE (JD @ Aug 11 2010, 10:44 AM) *
Yep, because it was his first fight before signing a long term deal and it was a one shot "prove it" deal where he had Hobson working with him. It was pretty well known that going in he was going to sign with GBP because Oscar wanted to fight him if he won. What was stated was that "technically" he was not a GBP fighter, but for all intents and purposes, he really was...so I think the technicality is on the opposite side in the above statement.

Not sure what more can be said on it...we each view it differently...though I understand your side of it.

Whatever, I guess boxing is so dead, this is the shit we are spending time and energy on. LOL...I can't do this anymore.


Awwwww....I see....so before signing the long term deal, GBP was just sampling him to see if he could take a good enough beatdown from Mayweather before they "officially" decided to sign him?

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Or did you mean it was Dennis Hobson who had the one shot "prove it" deal? I hope that's not what you meant, because I thought Hobson had already been working with Hatton for a few fights.

For the record, I don't recall De La Hoya being interested in fighting Hatton until AFTER Mayweather retired. I don't think De La Hoya was ever planning on moving back down to 147 at the time...nor was he expecting Hatton to jump up to 154, so I'm not sure if I'd agree with the statement "It was pretty well known that going in he was going to sign with GBP because Oscar wanted to fight him if he won."

But like you said...whatever. I've got PLENTY of other things to talk in boxing...I've even suggested a few of them, and yet, nobody seems interested in started a new thread about any of them.

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But technically and officially, the last non-GBP fighter that Mayweather fought was Ricky Hatton.

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I can do this allllll day baby! WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

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Just messin around man. Think of it this way...look at how many pages and views this thread has jumped to. That's a good thing. Apparently, there's a few people interested in the discussion. Of course, there's probably a few other peolpe who are just "dealing with it".

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Method
I can deal w the Top Rank in house fights because they are decent enough.
D-MARV
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 11 2010, 11:41 AM) *
I can deal w the Top Rank in house fights because they are decent enough.

Cotto-Pacquiao was legit.

Clottey-Pacquiao was a joke and so is this next fight.
salvador
QUOTE (D-MARV @ Aug 11 2010, 10:52 AM) *
Cotto-Pacquiao was legit.

Clottey-Pacquiao was a joke and so is this next fight.


Clottey-Pac was no joke and neither is Pac-Marg. I would have loved to have seen Floyd fight either of those two guys.
JD
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 11 2010, 11:32 AM) *
Awwwww....I see....so before signing the long term deal, GBP was just sampling him to see if he could take a good enough beatdown from Mayweather before they "officially" decided to sign him?

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Or did you mean it was Dennis Hobson who had the one shot "prove it" deal? I hope that's not what you meant, because I thought Hobson had already been working with Hatton for a few fights.

For the record, I don't recall De La Hoya being interested in fighting Hatton until AFTER Mayweather retired. I don't think De La Hoya was ever planning on moving back down to 147 at the time...nor was he expecting Hatton to jump up to 154, so I'm not sure if I'd agree with the statement "It was pretty well known that going in he was going to sign with GBP because Oscar wanted to fight him if he won."

But like you said...whatever. I've got PLENTY of other things to talk in boxing...I've even suggested a few of them, and yet, nobody seems interested in started a new thread about any of them.

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But technically and officially, the last non-GBP fighter that Mayweather fought was Ricky Hatton.

laugh.gif

I can do this allllll day baby! WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

laugh.gif

Just messin around man. Think of it this way...look at how many pages and views this thread has jumped to. That's a good thing. Apparently, there's a few people interested in the discussion. Of course, there's probably a few other peolpe who are just "dealing with it".

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I would say it was more of a "what can you draw in Vegas and how can you sell, you pasty bastid?" type of one fight "prove it deal". Needless to say, Hatton added a ton to the promotion.

And I am surprised...because I remember the buzz of Oscar being interested in a Hatton fight before Floyd retired. I mean, this is the article from March, after the one fight with GBP, and when the multi-fight deal was announced.

http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/boxing/ne...tory?id=3282542

Golden Boy promoted Hatton's 10th-round knockout loss to welterweight champion Floyd Mayweather Jr. on Dec. 8. Hatton had a good experience working with Golden Boy and many in the boxing industry believed he would sign with Oscar De La Hoya's company long term.

Hatton (43-1, 31 KOs) did explore other options, including a return to former promoter Artie Pelullo, but eventually decided to stick with Golden Boy. Hatton has also founded his own promotional company, Punch Promotions, which will partner with Golden Boy.

"I'm pleased to be working with Golden Boy Promotions and I know that each one of my fights will be bigger than the last, not only for me, but for all of my loyal fans," Hatton said in a statement. "I got a taste of working with Oscar and his team with my fight with Floyd Mayweather and they're a world-class company. They're the kind of team I need to keep me in big fights against the best in the world."

Said De La Hoya, who probably would have wound up facing Hatton had Hatton defeated Mayweather, "I've always been a fan of Ricky Hatton and it's an honor to partner with Ricky and Punch Promotions to add him to the Golden Boy Promotions roster. He's a fighter universally loved by fight fans because of his heart and aggressive style. We're all expecting even bigger and better things from him in the coming months."


I mean, I legitimately recall the viewpoint that Oscar wanted to fight Hatton if he beat Floyd. I am sure there is discussion of it here on this board somewhere.

As for me...unfortunately...I cannot do this all day, so at this point while I do understand your viewpoint and am not saying it is wrong, whether or not you can understand / appreciate / accept / recognize / like / loathe / care about / care less about / enjoy / find a middle ground with the way others may view this is cool by me...no matter which one you circle...LOL.
Method
Clottey-Paq wasnt a joke until Clottey turned it into one. On paper, leadng up to the fight, it was an intriguing enough of a match up to "deal with".

Same goes for Paq/Margarito.
D-MARV
The whole Clottey situtation was fucking shady as hell.

Mayweather-Pacquiao hits a bump and Clottey-Pacquiao is signed, sealed, and delivered the next next day?

Then Clottey getting an extra Million dollars after the fight for putting on a great performance?
PR316
I don't know what to make of Pacquiao-Clottey.

Either Clottey came for a pay day, or it was a STYLISTIC mismatch.

Spyder
QUOTE (JD @ Aug 11 2010, 12:18 PM) *
As for me...unfortunately...I cannot do this all day, so at this point while I do understand your viewpoint and am not saying it is wrong, whether or not you can understand / appreciate / accept / recognize / like / loathe / care about / care less about / enjoy / find a middle ground with the way others may view this is cool by me...no matter which one you circle...LOL.

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If I were to pick one for Hype, I would circle "loathe"...though I think deep down he "accepts" what people are saying.

BTW, I expect to see Floyd come out of his second retirement and sign to fight Pac before Hype would ever admit that.

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salvador
QUOTE (D-MARV @ Aug 11 2010, 11:45 AM) *
The whole Clottey situtation was fucking shady as hell.

Mayweather-Pacquiao hits a bump and Clottey-Pacquiao is signed, sealed, and delivered the next next day?

Then Clottey getting an extra Million dollars after the fight for putting on a great performance?


I totally agree with that. The matchup was a real fight, but Clottey didn't fight like a guy who'd been given the opportunity of a lifetime. The extra $1.5MM from jones was the shadiest thing about it. I paid a lot of money to be fairly close to ringside that night and I felt that every punch Clottey landed was doing damage - actually moving Pac, but for some reason he stopped throwing. Clottey HAD TO HAVE KNOWN his punches were doing damage, but he refused to throw. I guess it's possible that Marg is in the same boat - though from Arum's perspective Marg is a lot more marketable going forward with a win over Pac.

Something dirty went down with Pac-Clottey.
Method
QUOTE (salvador @ Aug 11 2010, 12:57 PM) *
I totally agree with that. The matchup was a real fight, but Clottey didn't fight like a guy who'd been given the opportunity of a lifetime. The extra $1.5MM from jones was the shadiest thing about it. I paid a lot of money to be fairly close to ringside that night and I felt that every punch Clottey landed was doing damage - actually moving Pac, but for some reason he stopped throwing. Clottey HAD TO HAVE KNOWN his punches were doing damage, but he refused to throw. I guess it's possible that Marg is in the same boat - though from Arum's perspective Marg is a lot more marketable going forward with a win over Pac.

Something dirty went down with Pac-Clottey.

Fuck yeah, man. The little that Paq did throw, when he landed, he was literally MOVING Paq. Shit, look at Paq's face AFTER the fight. For al of the non-effort, and I agree there was, Clottey marked him up with what little he did throw.
salvador
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 11 2010, 12:03 PM) *
Fuck yeah, man. The little that Paq did throw, when he landed, he was literally MOVING Paq. Shit, look at Paq's face AFTER the fight. For al of the non-effort, and I agree there was, Clottey marked him up with what little he did throw.


Arum must have given Clottey some kind of hand signal from the crowd between the 6th and 7th rounds (a middle finger perhaps), because Clottey's lack of punches didn't make any sense. And his positive attitude about the whole event afterwards was also fishy as hell.
thehype
QUOTE (JD @ Aug 11 2010, 12:18 PM) *
Hatton (43-1, 31 KOs) did explore other options, including a return to former promoter Artie Pelullo, but eventually decided to stick with Golden Boy. Hatton has also founded his own promotional company, Punch Promotions, which will partner with Golden Boy.

"I'm pleased to be working with Golden Boy Promotions and I know that each one of my fights will be bigger than the last, not only for me, but for all of my loyal fans," Hatton said in a statement. "I got a taste of working with Oscar and his team with my fight with Floyd Mayweather and they're a world-class company. They're the kind of team I need to keep me in big fights against the best in the world."

Said De La Hoya, who probably would have wound up facing Hatton had Hatton defeated Mayweather, "I've always been a fan of Ricky Hatton and it's an honor to partner with Ricky and Punch Promotions to add him to the Golden Boy Promotions roster. He's a fighter universally loved by fight fans because of his heart and aggressive style. We're all expecting even bigger and better things from him in the coming months."


I mean, I legitimately recall the viewpoint that Oscar wanted to fight Hatton if he beat Floyd. I am sure there is discussion of it here on this board somewhere.

As for me...unfortunately...I cannot do this all day, so at this point while I do understand your viewpoint and am not saying it is wrong, whether or not you can understand / appreciate / accept / recognize / like / loathe / care about / care less about / enjoy / find a middle ground with the way others may view this is cool by me...no matter which one you circle...LOL.


I would think it would be tough for him to explore other options, like a return to former promoter Artie Pelullo, if he's already a GBP fighter, no?

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Buzz? I don't remember a bunch of people, like Richard Schaefer or Oscar himself, talking about De La Hoya targeting Hatton at all. I mean, did people, like Rafael did in his article, make an assumption that Oscar might want to fight him should he beat Mayweather? Sure. I mean...DUH! Who else would Oscar have fought for a big money fight? Winky Wright? Vernon Forrest? Hell, I've made the assumption that Oscar will STILL fight Ricky Hatton when he comes out of retirement...but I don't think it was a foregone conclusion that Hatton was going to sign with GBP because Oscar was going to fight him, like you implied. I mean, if that's the case, why would he even explore other options, as Rafael's article so astutely pointed out?

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As for me....it's not even really about being able to understand / appreciate / accept / recognize / like / loathe / care about / care less about / enjoy / find a middle ground with the way others may view this. You can view it however you want to view it and keep it moving...that's cool with me. What I did apparently have an issue with, however, was you, and a few others, actually NOT understanding my viewpoint and constantly telling me that it IS wrong, when in actuality, it's not. If someone is going to keep discussing it, trying to challenge me about whether or not I'm right or wrong, or telling me that the right answer is Carlos Baldomir, then I'm gonna dispute it because clearly my viewpoint is not understood. I mean, if you understand my viewpoint, then quit addressing it and keep it moving.

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thehype
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 11 2010, 11:41 AM) *
I can deal w the Top Rank in house fights because they are decent enough.


I can deal with it too. I got no problem with it so long as they're good fights. I could care less about "in-house" fights...I just don't like crappy or unnecessary fights.
thehype
QUOTE (Spyder @ Aug 11 2010, 12:55 PM) *
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If I were to pick one for Hype, I would circle "loathe"...though I think deep down he "accepts" what people are saying.

BTW, I expect to see Floyd come out of his second retirement and sign to fight Pac before Hype would ever admit that.

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You would be wrong on both accounts. I think the word to circle would have been "recognize".

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BTW, I've already said time and time again that Floyd 1) wants to fight Pacquiao and 2) wants to fight him in 2011. I expect to see Floyd "come out of his second retirement" shortly AFTER Bernard Hopkins comes out of his retirement and BEFORE Oscar De La Hoya comes out of his.

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Method
I mean, I know the Clottey fight turned out to be garbage, but, when the fight was announced, in lieu of other negotiations not panning out, I was intrigued and somewhat "excited" (term used loosely, interested more like it). I guess what I'm saying is if the match ups look good enough on paper, as Paq/Clottey did, Paq/Marg does, I cant hate on it in retrospect if they don't turn out that way.

As an aside, I would expect to see Floyd fight again before B-Hop.
JD
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 11 2010, 01:33 PM) *
I would think it would be tough for him to explore other options, like a return to former promoter Artie Pelullo, if he's already a GBP fighter, no?

dntknw.gif

Buzz? I don't remember a bunch of people, like Richard Schaefer or Oscar himself, talking about De La Hoya targeting Hatton at all. I mean, did people, like Rafael did in his article, make an assumption that Oscar might want to fight him should he beat Mayweather? Sure. I mean...DUH! Who else would Oscar have fought for a big money fight? Winky Wright? Vernon Forrest? Hell, I've made the assumption that Oscar will STILL fight Ricky Hatton when he comes out of retirement...but I don't think it was a foregone conclusion that Hatton was going to sign with GBP because Oscar was going to fight him, like you implied. I mean, if that's the case, why would he even explore other options, as Rafael's article so astutely pointed out?

dntknw.gif

As for me....it's not even really about being able to understand / appreciate / accept / recognize / like / loathe / care about / care less about / enjoy / find a middle ground with the way others may view this. You can view it however you want to view it and keep it moving...that's cool with me. What I did apparently have an issue with, however, was you, and a few others, actually NOT understanding my viewpoint and constantly telling me that it IS wrong, when in actuality, it's not. If someone is going to keep discussing it, trying to challenge me about whether or not I'm right or wrong, or telling me that the right answer is Carlos Baldomir, then I'm gonna dispute it because clearly my viewpoint is not understood. I mean, if you understand my viewpoint, then quit addressing it and keep it moving.

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If any fighter has a one fight "prove it" deal, of course they can still see what is out there after that fight and at the same time he can get nothing more than that one fight from the promoter if it flops...I think it was clear the way I described the viewpoint, but I also do think it was a foregone conclusion he was going to end up with GBP, or as Rafael put it "decided to stick with GBP." And this is well beyond this topic now, it is general view...which as Method said, should make for another thread.

And for the record, I think I said on multiple occasions that you weren't wrong...in fact, I think I said we just viewed it differently.

So if that is the sticking point...the thought you are being told you're wrong, well, I think I addressed that by stating quite the contrary...it was just a different approach to viewing something.

QUOTE (Spyder @ Aug 11 2010, 12:55 PM) *
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If I were to pick one for Hype, I would circle "loathe"...though I think deep down he "accepts" what people are saying.

BTW, I expect to see Floyd come out of his second retirement and sign to fight Pac before Hype would ever admit that.

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LOL...I would say dislike, thought that is not an option...so I guess "loathe"... laugh.gif

But no...seriously...who ends up promoting Floyd's next fight...will it be GBP...or will it be DKP?
thehype
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 11 2010, 01:44 PM) *
I mean, I know the Clottey fight turned out to be garbage, but, when the fight was announced, in lieu of other negotiations not panning out, I was intrigued and somewhat "excited" (term used loosely, interested more like it). I guess what I'm saying is if the match ups look good enough on paper, as Paq/Clottey did, Paq/Marg does, I cant hate on it in retrospect if they don't turn out that way.

As an aside, I would expect to see Floyd fight again before B-Hop.


I hope you're wrong about Hopkins. I'd really love to see him fight the winner of Dawson vs. Pascal. I mean, I know it may not be the easy money fight he's looking for, but in my opinion, fights like that are far more important to the sport of boxing than Mayweather vs. Pacquiao. Or shit, if Haye is going to continue being a pussy, then HBO should go ahead and force that Haye vs. Hopkins bout.

As for Pac/Clottey and Pac/Margarito...I honestly don't think very many people really do or did hate those fights. I mean, they can say they do or did, but honestly, do or did they hate them like they hated De La Hoya vs. Forbes or Pacquiao vs. Diaz? I don't think so. I think there is/was still enough intrigue in those fights to make people say, "Hmmm, I don't know. I think he might lose. I might have to check it out. I ain't paying for it, but I do want to check it out." So yeah, as far as the matchups on paper are concerned, I totally agree. Now, personally, I don't think either one of them DESERVED the fights (especially Margarito), and for that I take issue, but as far as the fights are concerned, shit, I did and will watch them. LOL.
thehype
QUOTE (JD @ Aug 11 2010, 01:55 PM) *
If any fighter has a one fight "prove it" deal, of course they can still see what is out there after that fight and at the same time he can get nothing more than that one fight from the promoter if it flops...I think it was clear the way I described the viewpoint, but I also do think it was a foregone conclusion he was going to end up with GBP, or as Rafael put it "decided to stick with GBP."

And for the record, I think I said on multiple occasions that you weren't wrong...in fact, I think I said we just viewed it differently.

So if that is the sticking point...the thought that someone might think you are wrong, well, I think I addressed that by stating quite the contrary...it was just a different approach to something.


It's not a sticking point...nor did I say it was just you saying I was wrong. But if people are going to keep nitpicking and taking shots, expect me to fire back. Case in point, here you are still going on about this "prove it deal" that, according to you, meant that Ricky Hatton was "essentially" a Golden Boy fighter. On the contrary, the fact that he had to "prove" anything would lead me to believe that he was not yet a Golden Boy fighter, no?

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But it's cool...we can continue to discuss.

QUOTE (JD @ Aug 11 2010, 01:55 PM) *
LOL...I would say dislike, thought that is not an option...so I guess "loathe".

But no...seriously...who ends up promoting Floyd's next fight...will it be GBP...or will it be DKP?


I wouldn't say "dislike" at all...if I disliked it, or even loathed it, I would have silenced it a long time ago.

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If I had to pick, I'd say it's Golden Boy that promotes his next fight. I don't think he has a problem with Golden Boy because Golden Boy wasn't doing anything.
JD
I don't think you loathe it...lol...I would say that Spyder, like me, is playing around.

And more to the point, I would say that interpretation is probably where our viewpoints diverge...to me...someone who is on a one fight / year / week / month / prove it deal and does prove it before signing a longer term deal is basically a part of XYZ promotions / team / organization / etc from the prove it deal. In your view, they are not part of XYZ promotions / team / organization / etc until they sign the long term deal.

As for the more important topic that somehow got buried under pages of...stuff...man, how the hell is DK going to get used like that twice? I mean...really? That is embarrassing.
Method
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 11 2010, 02:04 PM) *
I hope you're wrong about Hopkins. I'd really love to see him fight the winner of Dawson vs. Pascal. I mean, I know it may not be the easy money fight he's looking for, but in my opinion, fights like that are far more important to the sport of boxing than Mayweather vs. Pacquiao. Or shit, if Haye is going to continue being a pussy, then HBO should go ahead and force that Haye vs. Hopkins bout.

As for Pac/Clottey and Pac/Margarito...I honestly don't think very many people really do or did hate those fights. I mean, they can say they do or did, but honestly, do or did they hate them like they hated De La Hoya vs. Forbes or Pacquiao vs. Diaz? I don't think so. I think there is/was still enough intrigue in those fights to make people say, "Hmmm, I don't know. I think he might lose. I might have to check it out. I ain't paying for it, but I do want to check it out." So yeah, as far as the matchups on paper are concerned, I totally agree. Now, personally, I don't think either one of them DESERVED the fights (especially Margarito), and for that I take issue, but as far as the fights are concerned, shit, I did and will watch them. LOL.


I hope I'm wrong about Hopkins too, man, but he's been laying awfully low lately, the duration of which I don't remember. Id LOVE to see him fight Haye, but I don't think it will ever happen. As Roy Jones showed in beating Ruiz (not arguing the outcome would be the same) Haye (like Ruiz) has NOTHING to gain in that fight and everything to lose. I'd like to see Hopkins/Dawson, but I'd like to see them get paid for it.

I agree, I don't think either deserved these shots at big fights, but fuck man, if its one thing I learned long ago in this god forsaken sport - DESERVE'S GOT NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. Unfortunate, but true.
Spyder
I would compare it to a Player that wants to date a nice girl...the nice girl might be intrigued enough to start dating the man, but not ready to fall in love until he "proves" that he's serious.

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BTW, yes I was playing around.

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thehype
QUOTE (JD @ Aug 11 2010, 02:16 PM) *
I don't think you loathe it...lol...I would say that Spyder, like me, is playing around.

And more to the point, I would say that interpretation is probably where our viewpoints diverge...to me...someone who is on a one fight / year / week / month / prove it deal and does prove it before signing a longer term deal is basically a part of XYZ promotions / team / organization / etc from the prove it deal. In your view, they are not part of XYZ promotions / team / organization / etc until they sign the long term deal.

As for the more important topic that somehow got buried under pages of...stuff...man, how the hell is DK going to get used like that twice? I mean...really? That is embarrassing.


Fair enough...although it should be pointed out that EVEN WITH a contrat that actually said he was a GBP fighter, Manny Pacquiao ended up signing with Top Rank instead.

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That's kind of the reason why I think you should wait until the ink is completely dry before drawing conclusions.

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As for King, I mean, I don't know...was Floyd using King or was King using Floyd? Maybe it's both. I think Floyd's appearance in St. Louis was no different than Evander Holyfield's appearance there. Surely people don't think that Holyfield just happened to be in the area...or that he was a HUGE fan of Devon and just had to see that fight. LOL. Holyfield was LIKELY there because King flew him in and very well could have paid him an appearance fee. I would not be shocked if that was the exact same case with Floyd. There's a reason why DKP sent out a press release to let everyone know that Holyfield, Mayweather and Tyson were going to be in attendance (even though Tyson didn't show). That kind of shit right there helps sell tickets. I'm just saying.

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Don't get me wrong, I'm sure King would LOVE to sink his teeth into Floyd, but I really think it's being blown waaaaay out of proportion. But hey...what do I know...I let the experts like Rafael explain to the fans what's really going on. Obviously his name carries a lot more weight than little ol' me.

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thehype
QUOTE (Spyder @ Aug 11 2010, 02:21 PM) *
I would compare it to a Player that wants to date a nice girl...the nice girl might be intrigued enough to start dating the man, but not ready to fall in love until he "proves" that he's serious.

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BTW, yes I was playing around.

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Then I guess Pacquiao fell in love with Golden Boy until Top Rank happened to walk by and catch his eye.

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BTW, I didn't think you were serious to begin with. I don't know why someone would seem to think I'm serious about it. I just talk a lot...which translates into writing a lot...so I think some people seem to believe that I really care a lot more than I do. For me, this is just shooting the shit. Ironically, this is my break away from doing FightHype shit...so for me, this is fun.
Method
What do you think is being blown out of proportion, specifically?

I'm just curious. I could see if it was just them hanging out, and/or being at a card together, but obviously Floyd is doing this for a reason, when he's dangling pictures of $100,000,000 contracts up on his Twitter page to sign w King. How is that being blown out of proportion by the media?

To be honest, the first pic I saw of May and King a week or so ago w them holding money is NOT ANYWHERE NEAR CURRENT, as King's hair is still black (not GRAY, like the 79 year old actually is).
Spyder
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 11 2010, 02:32 PM) *
Then I guess Pacquiao fell in love with Golden Boy until Top Rank happened to walk by and catch his eye.

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BTW, I didn't think you were serious to begin with. I don't know why someone would seem to think I'm serious about it. I just talk a lot...which translates into writing a lot...so I think some people seem to believe that I really care a lot more than I do. For me, this is just shooting the shit. Ironically, this is my break away from doing FightHype shit...so for me, this is fun.

It wasn't the amount you wrote, just the couple of times that you mentioned ending things...lol...but I apologize if I misinterpreted that to mean something that you didn't.

For a fight this polarizing, it's pretty ridiculous that the thing ain't signed yet...I really do hope that King's involvement is more than just smoke and mirrors.
gravytrain
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 11 2010, 02:46 PM) *
What do you think is being blown out of proportion, specifically?

I'm just curious. I could see if it was just them hanging out, and/or being at a card together, but obviously Floyd is doing this for a reason, when he's dangling pictures of $100,000,000 contracts up on his Twitter page to sign w King. How is that being blown out of proportion by the media?

To be honest, the first pic I saw of May and King a week or so ago w them holding money is NOT ANYWHERE NEAR CURRENT, as King's hair is still black (not GRAY, like the 79 year old actually is).


I think it's being blown out of proportion in the sense that Don King is now the only man capable of "getting" Mayweather to fight.
thehype
QUOTE (Spyder @ Aug 11 2010, 03:00 PM) *
It wasn't the amount you wrote, just the couple of times that you mentioned ending things...lol...but I apologize if I misinterpreted that to mean something that you didn't.

For a fight this polarizing, it's pretty ridiculous that the thing ain't signed yet...I really do hope that King's involvement is more than just smoke and mirrors.


I don't remember saying anything about "ending things" other than when I just told JD "if I disliked it, or even loathed it, I would have silenced it a long time ago"...which is basically me saying that I had no problem with anyone's opinion and I'll gladly continue to discuss it if people so choose. Other than that, I don't even remember saying anything about ending the discussion...so I'm not sure where you got that from. You might have to refresh my memory.

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No apology needed...I didn't take offense to anything.

Sorry, but as far as I know, it's just smoke and mirrors.
thehype
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 11 2010, 02:46 PM) *
What do you think is being blown out of proportion, specifically?

I'm just curious. I could see if it was just them hanging out, and/or being at a card together, but obviously Floyd is doing this for a reason, when he's dangling pictures of $100,000,000 contracts up on his Twitter page to sign w King. How is that being blown out of proportion by the media?

To be honest, the first pic I saw of May and King a week or so ago w them holding money is NOT ANYWHERE NEAR CURRENT, as King's hair is still black (not GRAY, like the 79 year old actually is).


Being blown out of proportion as in Mayweather went from hanging out with Don King to signing a 4-fight, $100,000,000 contract with him in under a week. I mean, I DEFINITELY agree that he's putting that stuff out there for a reason...in fact, I'm pretty sure I know the reason and have talked about it already...but I don't think a couple of pictures with Don King and a pic of a Letter of Intent for a promtional agreement worth $100,000,000 translates into him signing a 4-fight, $100,000,000 deal with King, according to Marley and co-signed by Montoya. I mean, Holyfield was chillin in St. Louis too....is he about to sign a 4-fight contract? Heck, Tyson was supposed to be in attendance as well...does that mean that King is about to announce Tyson vs. Holyfield 3?

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So just in that sense. I just think there's a lot of writers out there grabbing at straws, trying to make it sound like they have the inside track when they really don't have any clue as to what's going on. The fact that Arum and Roach are running around saying the fight can be made if Don King is involved...I mean...REALLY? It's come to THAT now? Bob Arum supporting Don King? LOL. It's REALLY getting way out of hand. About 99.5% of the media have no clue as to what's going on, but they're all trying to guess and spin it whatever way they can. I mean...whatever...it is what it is, but I just think a lot of people are giving way more attention than it deserves...especially if it amounts to absolutely nothing.

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Regarding the pic...I'm not sure how current those pics are. I thought King and Floyd looked a little youthful in those pics, but hey, it's hard to say. But if those pics are old, then there's also a good chance that the pic of $100,000,000 contract is old too...perhaps something that King presented to him the first time Floyd visited him in Florida (when he first came out of retirement).
Method
Gotcha.

You hearing anything on Hopkins vs winner of Dawson/Pascal? Haye?

How the fuck does Tavaris Cloud label himself the "new Hopkins"? Cuz he beat Glen Johnson? Shit. He BARELY escaped w his "0" in tact.

Another thread, I guess.
gravytrain
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 11 2010, 06:51 PM) *
Gotcha.

You hearing anything on Hopkins vs winner of Dawson/Pascal? Haye?

How the fuck does Tavaris Cloud label himself the "new Hopkins"? Cuz he beat Glen Johnson? Shit. He BARELY escaped w his "0" in tact.

Another thread, I guess.


And was lucky to get a UD.
thehype
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 11 2010, 06:51 PM) *
Gotcha.

You hearing anything on Hopkins vs winner of Dawson/Pascal? Haye?

How the fuck does Tavaris Cloud label himself the "new Hopkins"? Cuz he beat Glen Johnson? Shit. He BARELY escaped w his "0" in tact.

Another thread, I guess.


You know, that's the messed up thing because I haven't heard shit about Hops. I just assumed that he was laying in the cut, surveying the scene and waiting to see how a few things panned out before selecting his target to make a lot of noise about. I know he's mentioned Haye time and time again, but I really think Schaefer probably told him, "Vell, look Bernard, ve vould really like to get you that fight, but you know Haye is going to just vait for the Klitschkos, so our hands are tied." In which case, I figured maybe Nard might reconsider a fight with the Dawson/Pascal winner if he could get the money he's looking for. I think best case scenario for Bernard is that Pascal wins, because if he does, I think Bernard could get more money fighting Pascal in Canada than fighting Dawson anywhere. So I just thought maybe he might be waiting around for the outcome of that fight before making some noise.

As for Cloud, well, the "new Hopkins" couldn't do to the "old Johnson" what the "old/young Hopkins" did to the "old/young Johnson"...so I don't know what the hell he was talking about. Maybe he meant the "new Demetrius Hopkins".

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Keith

Is Hopkins just hanging around for some small going away paydays at this point?

He's been kinda avoiding Dawson for a bit now and at his age the longer he waits the worse his chances of winning get. He can't be a fool to that point.
Method
Hahahahahaha @ "Demetrius".

Dude, Hops is gonna wind up in the Milk Carton Clan w Winky, et al...
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