Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: Just heard from a solid that PBF & King...
FightHype Community > OTHER HYPE > Archives
Pages: 1, 2, 3, 4
thehype
QUOTE (caneman @ Aug 10 2010, 12:49 PM) *
Ben, I might not always agree with you but you are one smart mofo bruh! You can back much of what you say with your knowledge! Mad props bruh!


Why thank you sir.

It's all good...I don't expect people to agree with everything that I say, but I do like it when people back up their info with documented facts. It just makes it easier to debate and really see all the information that's out there.

laugh.gif
caneman
I stand corrected friends.gif
JD
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 10 2010, 12:46 PM) *
I was being facetious about casino money, which is why I said, "Well...I shouldn't say that, but the only REAL relevance it has is when it comes to them making an offer for the venue," and then put a big "LOL" at the end. HOWEVER, I will say that the PPV revenue, combined with the revenue generated from sponsors, FAR exceeds any site fee that a casino may offer, so when it comes to purse splits, I would think the ability to generate that kind of revenue is just a little more important than what the casinos are bringing in for a particular weekend...otherwise, like you said, maybe they SHOULD be asking for a far greater site fee (I'm thinking maybe double) than what they're getting. LOL. But whatever....that's a discussion for a totally different thread.

As for Hatton and Spyder...please see my above post. Like I said, Hatton WAS NOT a Golden Boy fighter until the year 2008...which was AFTER his fight with Mayweather. I never said Golden Boy DID NOT promote the event. WTF? Do you guys think I'm dumb or something? LOL.

Back to in-house fighters....there's a big difference between what Arum is doing and what Floyd is doing. Floyd isn't going out of his way to only fight Golden Boy fighters. I mean, Shane Mosley was the best fight to be made other than Mayweather vs. Pacquiao...there's no denying that. And Marquez...that was a tune-up after a lengthy retirement...I give him a pass on that one, just like I would give Pacquiao a pass on David Diaz (seeing as how that was his first and only fight at lightweight). But prior to that, like I already established, Ricky Hatton wasn't a Golden Boy fighter when that fight was being finalized and took place. Baldomir and Judah weren't Golden Boy fighters either...but that's besides the point. The point is, Bob Arum is PURPOSELY only matching Manny Pacquiao with Top Rank fighters now....Cotto, Clottey, Margarito...even him mentioning potential fights with Foreman, Cotto again, or Julio Cesar Chavez Jr....the guy is BLATANTLY keeping the fights in-house...and he's not the only fighter he's doing it with. But I think we both agree on that, so there's really no debating it. But I totally disagree with the notion that Floyd Mayweather is only looking to fight Golden Boy fighters....especially when he's only fought 3 in his entire career.

All I was simply saying was that Ricky Hatton was the last time that Floyd Mayweather fought a non-GBP fighter.


Well yeah, then it goes back to the sites anteing up. Because the whole point of having these fights in Vegas is so people get out there and gamble...sure, the gate is nice, but the casino's are hoping high rollers come in and drop money like it is going out of style. So yes, maybe the site fee needs to be upped significantly and it needs to be thrown into the pot.

And while you may be looking at intent, or lack thereof, they are still doing the same thing. When Floyd fought Hatton, he was basically a GBP fighter - he had no other affiliation, outside of his own unlicensed promotional outfit, and shortly thereafter, he signed with GBP...as we already established, it was a GBP fight. Historically no...this was not an issue with Floyd at all, but I am talking about recent past and the new trend of keeping it in house.

Arum and Floyd have disdain for each other because of how similar they are.
Method
I really have no problem w Arum making these fights between his fighters. It would be one thing if they were bullshit match ups, but they're not. What's more, they're easy to make. No matter what the outcome, I am looking forward to Paq/Margarito.
TRU
This comes down to technicalities... Hatton was BASICALLY a GBP fighter for the Floyd fight. Prior to that he was with Mr. Mafia Pellulo as his agent.

Mierda.
Method
QUOTE (TRU @ Aug 10 2010, 01:14 PM) *
This comes down to technicalities... Hatton was BASICALLY a GBP fighter for the Floyd fight. Prior to that he was with Mr. Mafia Pellulo as his agent.

Mierda.

Exactly as I see it, my chromasomally challenged cronie!

TRU
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 10 2010, 01:18 PM) *
Exactly as I see it, my chromasomally challenged cronie!



My most recent pic...



Hatton and Floyd made good money from the ticket sales for their fight.

It aint nothing that's for sure...

http://www.secondsout.com/columns/thomas-h...tton-and-boxing
salvador
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 10 2010, 12:12 PM) *
I really have no problem w Arum making these fights between his fighters. It would be one thing if they were bullshit match ups, but they're not. What's more, they're easy to make. No matter what the outcome, I am looking forward to Paq/Margarito.


For the life of me I can't understand why or how anyone could have a problem with this fight unless they just didn't believe that Marg should ever get another paycheck on principle. I didn't see the Garcia fight so I don't know how bad Marg really looked, but if anyone had suggested Pac-Marg two years ago this whole board would have laughed out loud at the mismatch.
Spyder
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 10 2010, 12:23 PM) *
I really don't understand why people can't READ EVERYTHING that I post before addressing me.

I NEVER SAID Golden Boy Promotions didn't have anything to do with the fight.

Like I already stated:

Golden Boy had something to do with the promotion because ever since Floyd split with Arum, Golden Boy has sold their promotional services to him.

What I DID SAY was that Ricky Hatton WAS NOT a Golden Boy Promotions fighters at the time he fought Floyd Mayweather.

The question that JD asked was when was the last time Floyd Mayweather faced a non-GBP fighter? The answer is Ricky Hatton!

If you recall (do your research...Google it, Bing it...or whatever your choice of search engines may be), Ricky Hatton was with Dennis Hobson just prior to the Mayweather fight. Then they had a falling out and, from what I recall, Hatton dumped him and was basically a free agent. He did not sign with Golden Boy Promotions until AFTER he had already fought Floyd Mayweather. Golden Boy Promotions sent out a lengthy press release to make the announcement in March of 2008, which again, was AFTER the Mayweather fight.

http://www.fighthype.com/pages/content2162.html

I REPEAT, RICKY HATTON DID NOT SIGN WITH GOLDEN BOY UNTIL AFTER HIS FIGHT WITH FLOYD MAYWEATHER

Please re-read the above referenced press release and pay special attention to the part that reads:

Hatton's first fight under this new promotional contract will be announced at a later date.

This was never about WHO promoted the event...but instead about who the last non-GBP fighter was that Floyd faced. And like I said, the answer is Ricky Hatton.

But whatever.

I seriously don't see the reason to argue about semantics Hype...it makes no sense, and weakens your other points.

Ricky Hatton fought Floyd Mayweather on a GBP card. Semantically speaking, Hatton signed a one fight deal with GBP to fight Floyd Mayweather. Whether that makes you want to call him a Golden Boy fighter or not means absolutely nothing. Same with signing a multi-fight deal, which is what he did immediately after the fight.

So I don't really see the point in claiming that Ricky Hatton was not a GBP fighter at the time that he fought Floyd Mayweather. Is it the 1 fight contract? Is that your sticking point? I mean, was Brett Favre not really a Jet because he only played in New York for 1 season?

It's pretty easy for everyone to see that GBP used the Mayweather fight as a chance to extend their relationship with Hatton. Extend being the operative word. If they failed to deliver on that fight, then Ricky could do the same as Favre did and play for someone else the next season. But the fact still remains that the two were in business with each other for that fight.

I don't care how you want to slice it...whether signing a one fight contract makes you a fighter for a promotional banner, or if it takes a multiple fight contract for you to consider someone a certain "promoter's" fighter...their role and purpose is exactly the same...to sell the damn fight!

gravytrain
GBP promoted the event with Mayweather Promotions. However when asking "when's the last time Floyd fought a non-GBP fighter?" and Hatton is between promoters Mayweather didn't fight a GBP fighter, he fought a fighter who was coming off a 3 fight contract with Dennis Hobson after leaving Frank Warren.
JD
It was a rhetorical question...I, like many others, truly consider the answer to be Baldomir.
Method
Agreed.
thehype
QUOTE (Spyder @ Aug 10 2010, 01:46 PM) *
I seriously don't see the reason to argue about semantics Hype...it makes no sense, and weakens your other points.

Ricky Hatton fought Floyd Mayweather on a GBP card. Semantically speaking, Hatton signed a one fight deal with GBP to fight Floyd Mayweather. Whether that makes you want to call him a Golden Boy fighter or not means absolutely nothing. Same with signing a multi-fight deal, which is what he did immediately after the fight.

So I don't really see the point in claiming that Ricky Hatton was not a GBP fighter at the time that he fought Floyd Mayweather. Is it the 1 fight contract? Is that your sticking point? I mean, was Brett Favre not really a Jet because he only played in New York for 1 season?

It's pretty easy for everyone to see that GBP used the Mayweather fight as a chance to extend their relationship with Hatton. Extend being the operative word. If they failed to deliver on that fight, then Ricky could do the same as Favre did and play for someone else the next season. But the fact still remains that the two were in business with each other for that fight.

I don't care how you want to slice it...whether signing a one fight contract makes you a fighter for a promotional banner, or if it takes a multiple fight contract for you to consider someone a certain "promoter's" fighter...their role and purpose is exactly the same...to sell the damn fight!


But that's the thing...I'm NOT arguing semantics...on the contrary, YOU (and a few other people) are.

Was Ricky Hatton signed with Golden Boy Promotions on December 8, 2007? NO!

Was Ricky Hatton a Golden Boy Promotions fighter on December 8, 2007? NO!

Now, was Golden Boy Promotions wanting to sign him? Absolutely!

Did they end up signing him? Absolutely!

But if the question is when was the last time Floyd Mayweather fought a non-GBP fighter, then the answer is simple....December 8, 2007!

That's not arguing semantics! That's just fact!

rolleyes_anim.gif

Now, if you REALLY want to argue semantics, technically, we can talk about how Ricky Hatton, Bernard Hopkins, Shane Mosley, Winky Wright, David Haye and Juan Manuel Marquez ARE NOT really Golden Boy fighters...unlike Victor Ortiz, Saul Alvarez, Daniel Jacobs and Sergio Mora, who actually are contractually bound to Golden Boy Promotions.

If you really, really, REALLY want to arguments semantics, then I can also say Manny Pacquiao is a Golden Boy fighter as well.

Care to continue the discussion?

On a side note, have you actually seen a fight contract before? I have. I've also seen a Golden Boy Promotions contract before and I can guarantee you that Shane Mosley, who IS NOT really a Golden Boy Promotions fighter, is free to walk away and fight anyone he chooses WITHOUT Golden Boy Promotions being involved in any way, shape or form. I'm quite sure Bernard Hopkins, a "partner" with Golden Boy Promotions...the "President" of Golden Boy Promotions East (whatever the fuck that is) would co-sign that statement.

Like I said, we can REALLY talk semantics and break things down if you want, but in my opinion, this is not the thread to do it in.

But I stand by my answer!
thehype
QUOTE (JD @ Aug 10 2010, 02:47 PM) *
It was a rhetorical question...I, like many others, truly consider the answer to be Baldomir.


You, and many other, would answer the question wrong then.

laugh.gif

If this were Jeopardy and you threw out the name Carlos Baldomir, I might reply:

Who was the last fighter that Mayweather faced in a non-GBP event?

laugh.gif
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (gravytrain @ Aug 11 2010, 04:36 AM) *
GBP promoted the event with Mayweather Promotions.


Mayweather promotions. They sure are a fine company LOL. So what did Mayweather promotions do to promote the event? Maybe Hype knows what MP actually does because to my untrained eye GBP does everything & just adds MP to the banner above the ring.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 11 2010, 07:56 AM) *
I can guarantee you that Shane Mosley, who IS NOT really a Golden Boy Promotions fighter, is free to walk away and fight anyone he chooses WITHOUT Golden Boy Promotions being involved in any way, shape or form.


Yes & if he wanted to fight another GBP fighter in the future he would be frozen out. GBP has the proverbial gun to the head of fighters that leave them since they have the HBO access & HBO = $$.
JD
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 10 2010, 05:59 PM) *
You, and many other, would answer the question wrong then.

laugh.gif

If this were Jeopardy and you threw out the name Carlos Baldomir, I might reply:

Who was the last fighter that Mayweather faced in a non-GBP event?

laugh.gif


OK...Well to me and others Hatton was working under the GBP promotional banner as a GBP fighter with the intention of sticking with them. We can just disagree that he was basically a Golden Boy fighter at that point in time.

Fitz
I think everyone understood the point with Hatton/GBP. It's just splitting hairs now. In the end, Mayweather/Hatton was a Golden Boy event, and Hatton was Golden Boy's fighter (officially/unofficially)
The CEO
Like I texted you the other day, JD...regardless of whether Hatton was or wasn't a full fledged Golden Boy fighter on 12/8/2007, Mayweather vs. any GB fighter isn't the "same house" scenario like say Pacquiao-Clottey and Pacquiao-Margarito...

Mayweather-Mosley was a real fight that Mosley wanted to win....GBP would have been over the moon if Mosley had beat him....can't say the same about Pac-Clot, Clottey's effort, and Top Rank....


That's all I gotta say...keep on keepin' on, Hype...I'm in and out on topics of this nature...lol
caneman
Exactly right bro! IMO anyhow!
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (The CEO @ Aug 11 2010, 09:29 AM) *
Mayweather-Mosley was a real fight that Mosley wanted to win....


Could have fooled me. It was almost like Shane just gave up after 2 rounds & decided he did not want to win.
Fitz
QUOTE (The CEO @ Aug 11 2010, 09:29 AM) *
Mayweather-Mosley was a real fight that Mosley wanted to win....GBP would have been over the moon if Mosley had beat him....can't say the same about Pac-Clot, Clottey's effort, and Top Rank....


Big shit, so Mayweather took one credible fight since when? Cotto probably really wanted to beat Pacquiao as well. They are both fucked and I don't know how one can side with Mayweather and be against Pacquiao or one with Pacquiao and against Mayweather when it comes to recent match making. They are both cut from the same fucking cloth, they look for vulnerable fights and easy paths.
So Mayweather-Mosley was a real fight, what about all those fights that Mayweather has fought since moving above 140? He has had one clear real fight and maybe 2 if you are kind. Mayweather hasn't been consistently taking 'real' fights and either has Pacquiao recently. They are both fucked.
Method
So agruing Hatton is not a Goldenboy fighter is NOT arguing semantics, but arguing Hopkins, Mosley, and all the rest of them arent GBP fighters IS semantics? I'm perplexed...
gravytrain
No matter what banner Hatton was fighting under I think comparing what Arum is doing to Mayweather fighting Hatton, Marquez, and Mosley is apples and oranges.

The Hatton fight was being proposed back before Mayweather left Top Rank, Mayweather took it and ran with it. The two would have fought regardless of promotional company. Marquez arguably has a win over Pacquiao and Pacquiao claimed Mayweather's #1 spot in the sport, you can decide whether it was a tuneup or chance to have a common opponent. Mosley was really the only fight to make after the negotiations went south and would have fought regardless of promotional company. Would a Cotto rematch, Chavez fight, Foreman fight, Clottey fight, or Margarito fight even be considered if it weren't for them sharing a promoter with Pacquiao? Valero was even being built up as an opponent, if he wasn't promoted by TR he wouldn't get a fight with Pacquiao.


QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Aug 10 2010, 07:00 PM) *
Mayweather promotions. They sure are a fine company LOL. So what did Mayweather promotions do to promote the event? Maybe Hype knows what MP actually does because to my untrained eye GBP does everything & just adds MP to the banner above the ring.


Mayweather Promotions gives Mayweather a chance to put his name on the ring.. That's about it. I heard Mayweather doesn't want to pay the fees associated with promoting, I can't say if that's true though. I listed it because they were the only promotional companies to be on the banners for the Mayweather/Hatton fight.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (gravytrain @ Aug 11 2010, 09:55 AM) *
Mayweather Promotions gives Mayweather a chance to put his name on the ring.. That's about it. I heard Mayweather doesn't want to pay the fees associated with promoting, I can't say if that's true though. I listed it because they were the only promotional companies to be on the banners for the Mayweather/Hatton fight.


Thats cool. It is just Mayweather Promotions seems to do nothing but magically get their name on the marquee.
gravytrain
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Aug 10 2010, 08:29 PM) *
Thats cool. It is just Mayweather Promotions seems to do nothing but magically get their name on the marquee.


It's not by coincidence that it's only on the marquee during Mayweather fights lol. I know he's some fighters though: http://www.floydmayweather.com/mayweather-...tions/fighters/

Some of the guys in his stable fought on his undercard for the Mosley fight, it seems like MP might do more than a whole lot of nothing.
Fitz
QUOTE (gravytrain @ Aug 11 2010, 10:38 AM) *
It's not by coincidence that it's only on the marquee during Mayweather fights lol. I know he's some fighters though: http://www.floydmayweather.com/mayweather-...tions/fighters/

Some of the guys in his stable fought on his undercard for the Mosley fight, it seems like MP might do more than a whole lot of nothing.


I remember some of those guys on the card, lol. Wouldn't Mayweather be just like a middleman anyways? Using Mayweather's name/contact to get noticed? Also, judging by the fighters, it doesn't seem Mayweather or Golden Boy would have cared too much. By the looks of it, they would have cheaped out even more on an undercard than usual and more money for the others, haha.
Fitz
Double post.
caneman
QUOTE (Fitz @ Aug 10 2010, 09:27 PM) *
Double post.


I am cool with that being said twice bro! lmao
thehype
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Aug 10 2010, 06:05 PM) *
Yes & if he wanted to fight another GBP fighter in the future he would be frozen out. GBP has the proverbial gun to the head of fighters that leave them since they have the HBO access & HBO = $$.


That's a risk that EVERY fighter takes any time they leave a promoter...I mean, if you piss someone off, then yeah, there's a chance you may not be able to do business with them, but I wouldn't say that GBP is the only way to make money with HBO. I mean, Jermain Taylor did okay without the services of GBP....so is Andre Berto. And those hurt feelings would only last for so long. I mean, if you're in a position to force a fight, then you're going to get it regardless of who your promoter may be.
thehype
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Aug 10 2010, 06:00 PM) *
Mayweather promotions. They sure are a fine company LOL. So what did Mayweather promotions do to promote the event? Maybe Hype knows what MP actually does because to my untrained eye GBP does everything & just adds MP to the banner above the ring.


MP does the exact same thing that Ex Promotions (Bernard), Winky Promotions (Wright), Marquez Promotions (Juan Manuel)...the list goes on...they HIRE Golden Boy Promotions and use their services....whether that be to set up press conferences, book conference calls, promote entire events or get them a fight date. To the untrained AND trained eye GBP does everything because that's what they're being paid to do. It's a model set up by HBO. Because the network is not allowed to act as a promoter, they literally tell fighters to get with Golden Boy Promotions. That's EXACTLY what they did to Winky Wright.

But again, that's a topic of discussion for a DIFFERENT thread.
thehype
QUOTE (JD @ Aug 10 2010, 06:09 PM) *
OK...Well to me and others Hatton was working under the GBP promotional banner as a GBP fighter with the intention of sticking with them. We can just disagree that he was basically a Golden Boy fighter at that point in time.


But he WAS NOT a GBP fighter...and neither was Floyd Mayweather...but both were fighting in an event promoted by GBP. So basically, you're saying that BECAUSE Hatton eventually DID sign with GBP, that ESSENTIALLY means he was a GBP fighter when he fought Floyd, and that's simply not true. I mean, if that IS true, then BASICALLY, Manny Pacquiao is a Golden Boy fighter too....hence the reason why GBP still lists him on their website and still collects a percentage from him when he fights. Heck, technically, Manny Pacquiao is more of a GBP fighter than Ricky Hatton ever was. LOL. But whatever...we can move along.
thehype
QUOTE (Fitz @ Aug 10 2010, 06:27 PM) *
I think everyone understood the point with Hatton/GBP. It's just splitting hairs now. In the end, Mayweather/Hatton was a Golden Boy event, and Hatton was Golden Boy's fighter (officially/unofficially)


See above....but again, on December 8, 2007, both Ricky Hatton AND Floyd Mayweather were NOT GBP fighters...and that's OFFICIAL. The ONLY reason why anyone is splitting hairs (which I'm actually not doing, because facts are facts and Hatton was not under contract with GBP) is because Hatton EVENTUALLY did sign an "agreement" with Golden Boy months later, whereas Floyd didn't. So yeah, in the end, Mayweather/Hatton was a Golden Boy event, but Hatton WAS NOT Golden Boy's fighter. Hatton was no more a Golden Boy fighter when he fought Floyd than Mayweather was. That's the reason why Golden Boy Promotions issued a nice press release 3 or 4 months after that fight explaining that they had just signed Hatton, were delighted to be working with him and his FIRST fight under the Golden Boy banner would be coming soon. I don't get why that's so hard to understand when I already provided a link to the press release with the date on it.

dntknw.gif
thehype
QUOTE (Fitz @ Aug 10 2010, 06:48 PM) *
Big shit, so Mayweather took one credible fight since when?


Since Hatton. Isn't that the fight everyone wanted to see...to undefeated fighters?

dntknw.gif

LOL
Fitz
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 11 2010, 12:32 PM) *
Since Hatton. Isn't that the fight everyone wanted to see...to undefeated fighters?

dntknw.gif

LOL


I don't care what anybody says. That was a fight people could deal with, but not a fight people were screaming to see at the time. If it were at 140 that was different, at 140 you had Hatton that was undefeated and undisputed and Mayweather was a titlist. But the thing is, the fight happened later at 147. At the time, Mayweather was the undisputed 147 fighter in the world. Hatton moved up to 147 for one fight and looked crap against Collazo and showed he didn't belong at 147, the fight lost some of it's desire at that point IMO. Especially considering at 147, we had Mosley, Williams, Cotto, Clottey, Margarito, Cintron, Quintana and the list goes on with world class to solid contenders we had at 147. When he fought Hatton, like I said, it was a fight people were able to deal with, but it wasn't a fight people were screaming to see at the time. A few years before? Yeah, at the time? I don't think it was highly demanded by everyone.
Fitz
...
JD
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 10 2010, 10:19 PM) *
But he WAS NOT a GBP fighter...and neither was Floyd Mayweather...but both were fighting in an event promoted by GBP. So basically, you're saying that BECAUSE Hatton eventually DID sign with GBP, that ESSENTIALLY means he was a GBP fighter when he fought Floyd, and that's simply not true. I mean, if that IS true, then BASICALLY, Manny Pacquiao is a Golden Boy fighter too....hence the reason why GBP still lists him on their website and still collects a percentage from him when he fights. Heck, technically, Manny Pacquiao is more of a GBP fighter than Ricky Hatton ever was. LOL. But whatever...we can move along.


We already said that as a technicality you could say he was not...but he basically was as it was the first time he worked with and under, and shortly after signed with, GBP never working with another promoter. It was a GBP card, and Hatton who was promoterless (sans his own unlicensed promotional outfit) signed with GBP directly after that for a multi fight deal, after working under them for a first fight...that is why we are saying that Hatton was a GBP fighter at the time.

As for Pac, I don't recall GBP having anything to do with the promotion for Clottey...or Cotto...and I would think they won't be involved in the Margarito fight.

This is why he is characterized as a GBP fighter in the Hatton fight. I understand why you don't see it that way...and that's fine, have at it, but just as you are not going to agree with anyone who is saying Hatton really was a GBP fighter for the Floyd fight - those of us who see / saw Hatton as a GBP fighter at the time of the Floyd fight are not going to suspend that notion and agree that Hatton was not a GBP fighter.
thehype
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 10 2010, 06:50 PM) *
So agruing Hatton is not a Goldenboy fighter is NOT arguing semantics, but arguing Hopkins, Mosley, and all the rest of them arent GBP fighters IS semantics? I'm perplexed...


Perhaps you're perplexed because nobody is arguing that Hatton is not a Golden Boy fighter...at least I'm certainly not.

The question was who was the last non-GBP fighter that Mayweather fought...and my answer was Ricky Hatton because on December 8, 2007, when Mayweather vs. Hatton took place, Ricky Hatton WAS NOT a Golden Boy Promotions fighter. That's fact. There are no semantics to argue regarding that. Ricky Hatton did not become the same thing that Hopkins, Mosley, and all the rest of them are until months after he fought Floyd Mayweather....and during that time, he could have just as easily signed with Top Rank, Dan Goossen, Lou DiBella or whoever.

Now AFTER I explained all of that, I said I'll gladly argue the semantics about whether or not Hopkins, Mosley, Haye, Marquez, AND Hatton are really GBP fighters, but that should be in a different thread under a different topic. But if anyone wants to get a head start and start doing some research now, Miguel Cotto is a Top Rank fighter who has his own promotional company, but you won't see him signing with any other promoters any time soon because he's under contract with Top Rank. On the contrary, Bernard Hopkins, Winky Wright, David Haye, etc. are all "GBP fighters" who also have their own promotional companies, but they're free to walk away from GBP any time they want to and sign with another promoter because they're not contractually bound to GBP (which is something both BHop AND Winky have hinted at doing in the past). So there's a big difference there. Victor Ortiz, another GBP fighter, does not have the same luxury as Mosley, Hopkins, Haye, etc. because, unlike them, he IS contractually bound. But again, I had no intention into getting into all of that. Like I said, that's a discussion for a different thread. But I'm not arguing any semantics regarding whether or not Hatton was GBP fighter when he fought Floyd because...well...because he wasn't....that's fact.
thehype
QUOTE (Fitz @ Aug 10 2010, 09:42 PM) *
I don't care what anybody says. That was a fight people could deal with, but not a fight people were screaming to see at the time. If it were at 140 that was different, at 140 you had Hatton that was undefeated and undisputed and Mayweather was a titlist. But the thing is, the fight happened later at 147. At the time, Mayweather was the undisputed 147 fighter in the world. Hatton moved up to 147 for one fight and looked crap against Collazo and showed he didn't belong at 147, the fight lost some of it's desire at that point IMO. Especially considering at 147, we had Mosley, Williams, Cotto, Clottey, Margarito, Cintron, Quintana and the list goes on with world class to solid contenders we had at 147. When he fought Hatton, like I said, it was a fight people were able to deal with, but it wasn't a fight people were screaming to see at the time. A few years before? Yeah, at the time? I don't think it was highly demanded by everyone.


rolleyes_anim.gif

Yeah...okay. For some reason, I don't remember too many people complaining about having to "deal with" it. In fact, I could have sworn people couldn't wait to see it.

dntknw.gif

Pacquiao vs. Clottey or Pacquiao vs. Margarito sound more like fights that people have to "deal with".

laugh.gif
thehype
QUOTE (JD @ Aug 10 2010, 09:42 PM) *
We already said that as a technicality you could say he was not...but he basically was as it was the first time he worked with and under, and shortly after signed with, GBP never working with another promoter. It was a GBP card, and Hatton who was promoterless signed with GBP directly after that for a multi fight deal, after working under them for a first fight...that is why we are saying that Hatton was a GBP fighter at the time.

As for Pac, I don't recall GBP having anything to do with the promotion for Clottey...or Cotto...and I would think they won't be involved in the Margarito fight.

This is why he is characterized as a GBP fighter in the Hatton fight. I understand why you don't see it that way...and that's fine, have at it, but just as you are not going to agree with anyone who is saying Hatton really was a GBP fighter for the Floyd fight - those of us who see / saw Hatton as a GBP fighter at the time of the Floyd fight are not going to suspend that notion and agree that Hatton was not a GBP fighter.


But it's not a technicality...it's fact. As a technicality, because he ended up signing with them months after the fight, you could say he was....but he officially wasn't. I'm not asking you or anyone else to agree to it....it's a fact. Read the press release...Google it....Bing it...whatever it...it's fact.

Does that mean Joe Calzaghe is basically a Square Ring fighter since it was the first time he worked with and under, and shortly retired, never working with another promoter?

dntknw.gif

No, no, no....I kid, I kid...but the fact remains, Ricky Hatton was not fighting for Golden Boy Promotions on December 8, 2007....and neither was Floyd. So technically and officially, neither one were GBP fighters.

laugh.gif

As for Pac, if he's NOT a GBP fighter, then why is he paying them?

dntknw.gif

I know I certainly wouldn't be giving someone any of my money if I didn't have to.

laugh.gif

Perhaps someone should start a petition to get them to remove Pacquiao from their website.

laugh.gif
D-MARV
Click Here

Scroll on down to the lightweight division.
Mean Mister Mustard
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 10 2010, 09:51 PM) *
rolleyes_anim.gif

Yeah...okay. For some reason, I don't remember too many people complaining about having to "deal with" it. In fact, I could have sworn people couldn't wait to see it.


dntknw.gif

Pacquiao vs. Clottey or Pacquiao vs. Margarito sound more like fights that people have to "deal with".

laugh.gif


You have now made him go back into the FH archives to dig out the information.
rusty_trombone
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 10 2010, 10:51 PM) *
Pacquiao vs. Clottey or Pacquiao vs. Margarito sound more like fights that people have to "deal with".

laugh.gif

I think any fight that involves Margarito is a fight we have to "deal with"
gravytrain
QUOTE (Fitz @ Aug 10 2010, 10:42 PM) *
I don't care what anybody says. That was a fight people could deal with, but not a fight people were screaming to see at the time. If it were at 140 that was different, at 140 you had Hatton that was undefeated and undisputed and Mayweather was a titlist. But the thing is, the fight happened later at 147. At the time, Mayweather was the undisputed 147 fighter in the world. Hatton moved up to 147 for one fight and looked crap against Collazo and showed he didn't belong at 147, the fight lost some of it's desire at that point IMO. Especially considering at 147, we had Mosley, Williams, Cotto, Clottey, Margarito, Cintron, Quintana and the list goes on with world class to solid contenders we had at 147. When he fought Hatton, like I said, it was a fight people were able to deal with, but it wasn't a fight people were screaming to see at the time. A few years before? Yeah, at the time? I don't think it was highly demanded by everyone.


Realistically he wasn't going to fight Margarito or Cotto, Arum and Mayweather couldn't even work together to make the biggest fight of recent times. I'd say Mosley, Williams, and Cintron is a far more realistic solid list. I think Mayweather vs Hatton was one of the biggest fights to make; Mayweather was the American star of boxing and Hatton was the British star of boxing. That Margarito fight really revived Mosley's career, Cintron and Williams still haven't transcended the sport. All things considered I think it'd appeal to boxing fans and casual fans.
Fitz
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 11 2010, 12:51 PM) *
rolleyes_anim.gif

Yeah...okay. For some reason, I don't remember too many people complaining about having to "deal with" it. In fact, I could have sworn people couldn't wait to see it.

dntknw.gif

Pacquiao vs. Clottey or Pacquiao vs. Margarito sound more like fights that people have to "deal with".

laugh.gif


I didn't say people complained. I said it was a fight people could 'deal with it'. When the expression is used, it normally means that they can deal with it without much complaint. That is what I said, people were able to deal with, they didn't kick up a stink because it wasn't the worst fight. But then, don't go to other lengths and try suggest it was a fight people were screaming for, because it wasn't at that time. Maybe when Mayweather and Hatton were at 140, but at the time the fight happened. It wasn't a highly demanded fight, it was a fight people were able to deal with it.

By the way, you should hate evenly. How thoughtful of you to harp on about Pacquiao-Clottey/Margarito but remain silent about him fighting Marquez. How does it feel that even Margarito/Clottey still probably ended up as a more credible fight than Marquez.
laugh.gif

Hate on both, they are both bad as each other, don't play favourites.


Fitz
QUOTE (Mean Mister Mustard @ Aug 11 2010, 01:26 PM) *
You have now made him go back into the FH archives to dig out the information.


laugh.gif

I could, but I think he misunderstood me, so not this time.
gravytrain
QUOTE (Fitz @ Aug 10 2010, 11:56 PM) *
I didn't say people complained. I said it was a fight people could 'deal with it'. When the expression is used, it normally means that they can deal with it without much complaint. That is what I said, people were able to deal with, they didn't kick up a stink because it wasn't the worst fight. But then, don't go to other lengths and try suggest it was a fight people were screaming for, because it wasn't at that time. Maybe when Mayweather and Hatton were at 140, but at the time the fight happened. It wasn't a highly demanded fight, it was a fight people were able to deal with it.

By the way, you should hate evenly. How thoughtful of you to harp on about Pacquiao-Clottey/Margarito but remain silent about him fighting Marquez. How does it feel that even Margarito/Clottey still probably ended up as a more credible fight than Marquez.
laugh.gif

Hate on both, they are both bad as each other, don't play favourites.


Marquez had a draw against Pacquiao and a questionable SD, he also was arguably P4P #1. Mayweather came back from retirement with Pacquiao in the #1 spot and fought a guy that arguably beat him. Clottey lost to a person Pacquiao dominated[Cotto] and Margarito is coming back after a TKO loss, suspension, and looking like shit against a bum[who he fought for a title Martinez had to vacate lol]. I think the tuneup fight against a guy that's done well against the then P4P #1 and #2 WW is far more credible than both Pacquiao/Margarito and Pacquiao/Clottey combined.

thehype
QUOTE (Fitz @ Aug 10 2010, 10:56 PM) *
I didn't say people complained. I said it was a fight people could 'deal with it'. When the expression is used, it normally means that they can deal with it without much complaint. That is what I said, people were able to deal with, they didn't kick up a stink because it wasn't the worst fight. But then, don't go to other lengths and try suggest it was a fight people were screaming for, because it wasn't at that time. Maybe when Mayweather and Hatton were at 140, but at the time the fight happened. It wasn't a highly demanded fight, it was a fight people were able to deal with it.

By the way, you should hate evenly. How thoughtful of you to harp on about Pacquiao-Clottey/Margarito but remain silent about him fighting Marquez. How does it feel that even Margarito/Clottey still probably ended up as a more credible fight than Marquez.
laugh.gif

Hate on both, they are both bad as each other, don't play favourites.


Saying that people could "deal with it" implies, at least to me, that they were hoping for a much better fight, but because they couldn't get that fight, they simply settled for this one because it wasn't so bad and it wasn't so great....they just chose to "deal with it" because it was so-so and, like you said, they didn't have much to complain about. Now, I'm not saying or suggesting that people were "screaming for it" (not sure where you got that assumption from, as all I said was that people couldn't wait for it...which was true...PPV numbers don't lie, so obviously, there were a lot of people who couldn't wait to see it), but I do think it was at least one of the biggest fights that could have been made at the time.

I mean, how many other fights at the time around the division were bigger? Margarito had JUUUUUST lost to Paul Williams two months after Floyd fought Oscar, so surely you're not going to tell me that Mayweather should have fought Margarito instead of Hatton. I mean, I guess he could have fought Cotto...maybe Mosley....sure, those would have been big fights too, but were they really that much bigger or that much more anticipated than a fight with Ricky Hatton...a fight that people had been wanting to see ever since Hatton beat Tszyu in 2005? I mean, we ARE talking about two undefeated fighters...two fighters that most people had ranked in their top 10 P4P lists, right? Were Cotto and Mosley ranked in your Top 10 at the time. Were they top 5? Hell, I think some people (certainly NOT me) may have even had Hatton as high as 4...so I don't know if I would act like it was just some "ho-hum" fight that people simply chose to "deal with" because they had to. If Mayweather vs. Mosley was MORE anticipated at the time, I'm quite sure Floyd would have LOVED to fight him then for the much bigger payday (would Mosley have even demanded the same type of purse split as Hatton), no?

I'm just saying, I don't know if I would say Mayweather vs. Hatton was just some "ho-hum, we'll deal with it" type of fight at the time. I mean, Hatton vs. Collazo was a "deal with it" type of fight...just like Pacquiao vs. Margarito and Pacquiao vs. Clottey are "deal with it" type of fights, which is the reason why I even mentioned them bro. I don't bring those fights up because I "hate" them or have "hate" for Pacquiao. On the contrary, I'm looking forward to Pacquiao vs. Margarito because either way it goes, it's going to be entertaining and I'm going to LOVE the outcome. If Pacquiao beats the shit out of Margarito, that's great, because quite frankly, he deserves a beatdown for 1) even trying that shit against Mosley and 2) for possibly doing it to other fighters, like Cotto. On the flip, if Margarito wins, hey, that's great too because all this talk about Mayweather vs. Pacquiao will be gone...POOF....just like that, and quite frankly, I think that would be the funniest shit in the world to happen to some motherfuckers that are already rich as shit, but still greedy as fuck (and that goes across the aboard to everyone involved). But it ain't about playing favorites nor did I "harp" on Pacquiao-Clottey/Margarito. Those were simply the first two fights that popped up in my head...the first two fights, involving a big name, that I remembered which I would consider being "deal with it" type of fights. So okay...I could have easily said De La Hoya vs. Forbes, De La Hoya vs. Sturm, Cotto vs. Jennings, Hatton vs. Lazcano, Pacquiao vs. Diaz, Hopkins vs. Ornelas...and yes...sure...why not....Mayweather vs. Marquez, Mayweather vs. Baldomir, Mayweather vs. Mitchell, or fuck it...even Mayweather vs. Gatti. ALL OF THOSE...sure...no problem...I'll agree and gladly call them ALL "deal with it" fights (although Mayweather vs. Marquez still kind of sticks out from the bunch...at least one of the better anticipated of the group)....BUT Mayweather vs. Hatton....NAAAAAH....I don't think it falls into that same category.

nea.gif

I mean, if it does, then shit, go ahead and throw Pacquiao vs. Hatton into that category too.

laugh.gif

If it wasn't a highly anticipated fight, I don't know how the hell the PPV numbers did so well. Obviously somebody was anticipating it...must've just been those dumb Brits who actually thought Hatton had a chance.

laugh.gif

AGAIN, not saying it was the MOST anticipated...like a Mayweather vs. Paquiao or Mayweather vs. De La Hoya...but it was CERTAINLY ONE OF THE BEST fights that could've been made at the time.

Now Pacquiao vs. De La Hoya on the other hand...that was DEFINITELY a "deal with it" type of fight....that one DEFINITELY fits your definition of a fight that "they can deal with without much complaint."

laugh.gif

Oh, but wait...some people did complain about it. Shit! So what does that make THAT fight?

dntknw.gif

Maybe a "deal with it, but the result shocked me" type of fight?

laugh.gif
Fitz
QUOTE (gravytrain @ Aug 11 2010, 02:09 PM) *
Marquez had a draw against Pacquiao and a questionable SD, he also was arguably P4P #1. Mayweather came back from retirement with Pacquiao in the #1 spot and fought a guy that arguably beat him. Clottey lost to a person Pacquiao dominated[Cotto] and Margarito is coming back after a TKO loss, suspension, and looking like shit against a bum[who he fought for a title Martinez had to vacate lol]. I think the tuneup fight against a guy that's done well against the then P4P #1 and #2 WW is far more credible than both Pacquiao/Margarito and Pacquiao/Clottey combined.


Absolutely not. Just remember your bolded part "tuneup". Yet with this tuneup, Marquez was like a 6/7-1 underdog and his last fight was at 135 and was 36 years old. He was inferior to Mayweather in every single way possible. Age and speed was one, and then came size and skills. Like yourself said, it was a tuneup. Yet this so called tuneup, they made a 24/7 about and promoted the fuck out of it.
Also people look too much at Marquez ratings. Yeah, so he had a close fight with Pacquiao and was rank #2 in the world, though he was never big enough or young enough to be given a chance.
The fight also lost so much credibility when they tried to sell the fight more by making it a catch weight at 144. Mayweather comes in at 147 and turned out they paid Marquez money or something along those lines for him to come in over, lol.
It always makes me laugh when people assume Marquez-Mayweather was credible because Marquez arguably beat Pacquiao. I suppose with the same logic, we should have pushed for Spinks-Hopkins at 170 because Spinks arguably beat Taylor.
Based on the odds, the size, how Marquez looked vulnerable against Diaz, Mayweather paying to come in overweight etc. The fight was no better than Margarito/Clottey. Like you yourself called it. A tuneup. Just remember, that it wasn't promoted like one. The fight definitely wasn't better than Clottey or Margarito.
The fight was flat out garbage, and looking how Mayweather looked against Mosley and then see what he did against Marquez. Floyd carried Marquez, the fight was just as predictable or if not more so than Clottey or a Margarito fight.
Fitz
QUOTE (thehype @ Aug 11 2010, 02:52 PM) *
Saying that people could "deal with it" implies, at least to me, that they were hoping for a much better fight


They were. Don't you remember the Margarito fight being the one that people were literally SCREAMING for (me personally, I never gave Margarito a chance). But there you go.
As for the rest, I'm at work I will try read the rest when I get a chance. But that's an awful lot for "deal with it". Though you never disappoint.

laugh.gif
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Invision Power Board © 2001-2014 Invision Power Services, Inc.