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Jack 1000
For all on-going and post-fight reactions to tonight's title fight.

Jack

Administrator
KOpower
I got it at 58-56 for Pascal. Dawson needs to just throw more...he is the better fighter, but he isn't throwing. He needs to just stand his ground, get off first, and shoot the jab.
The CEO
I got it 5-4 Pascal after 9...

Not lookin' good for Dawson...Pascal is there for the taking...he needs to go for the stoppage...all he needs to do is pick up the aggression and pace...
caneman
I t is getting close where Dawson needs a KO IMO! I mean this is no blow out but he is losing all but 3 rounds! After 9 rounds!
The CEO
and right when Dawson starts rockin' Pascal at will, a vicious headbutt cuts Dawson's eye wide open, and the fight was stopped...lol

I had it a 10-8 round before the Doctor's stoppage...

and Pascal wins by deserved TD...

Chad Dawson LET Jean Pascal beat him tonight...he can only blame himself...
Imperius3
Damn, I thought Dawson was going to stop Pascal for a moment. He might have done it if he had the 12th round. We have to see a rematch, no question about it.
Method
THANK GOD that farce that has been "Bad" Chad Dawson has been EXPOSED. YES, I said it....E-X-P-O-S-E-D!
caneman
Dawson did have him hurt for sure but by then I think he needed to stop him to win it! I think the judges that had it 106-103 were dead on! Dawson blew it & let the fight be close! Good win for Pascal IMO! A rematch is in order IMO!
E.C.LEGEND
Most pure boxers have a good 1-2 where was Chad's? He didn't counter punch for shit either. I think he needed to lose so he can come back pissed and show some aggression the whole fight.
Aware
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 14 2010, 11:57 PM) *
THANK GOD that farce that has been "Bad" Chad Dawson has been EXPOSED. YES, I said it....E-X-P-O-S-E-D!

You gotta be fucking kidding me man. That's what you call exposed? Chad is a p4p talent, he just beat himself tonight. Everybody has off nights, we just saw his.
JD
Dawson is missing "it".
caneman
QUOTE (Aware @ Aug 15 2010, 12:04 AM) *
You gotta be fucking kidding me man. That's what you call exposed? Chad is a p4p talent, he just beat himself tonight. Everybody has off nights, we just saw his.



I think if there is a rematch, you will see a different Dawson but in someways he was exposed as a fighter that is unwilling to work when he has to! He is too worried about looking pretty & got out worked fairly easily tonight! So while he might not have been totally exposed, he was exposed for what he was tonight which was the lesser fighter who stayed back & threw bullshit punches til the 11th round & it cost him his zero!
caneman
QUOTE (JD @ Aug 15 2010, 12:09 AM) *
Dawson is missing "it".


Agreed, he got worked!
The CEO
QUOTE (JD @ Aug 15 2010, 12:09 AM) *
Dawson is missing "it".


He was missing It tonight for sure...lol...the progression I had seen in him made me think he had this one in the bag...he obviously lacks Elite-Level consistency...
Method
QUOTE (Aware @ Aug 15 2010, 12:04 AM) *
You gotta be fucking kidding me man. That's what you call exposed? Chad is a p4p talent, he just beat himself tonight. Everybody has off nights, we just saw his.

P4P Talent my fucking ass. P4P Talent doesn't beat itself. Jean Pascal's style is shit too. Chad should have NEVER lost to that...but he should have because I was never all that high on him anyway. Glen Johnson beat that ass in the first go round. People were WAY too fast to anointing "Bad" Chad as the man at Lt Hvy.

As an aside, Caneman, that Upper that stopped Pascal in his tracks in the 11th was spitting image of the one Hopkins landed on Lipsey. Chad shoulda pounced and it would have been a mirror image KO.

Chad aint all that.
Aware
QUOTE (caneman @ Aug 15 2010, 12:15 AM) *
I think if there is a rematch, you will see a different Dawson but in someways he was exposed as a fighter that is unwilling to work when he has to! He is too worried about looking pretty & got out worked fairly easily tonight! So while he might not have been totally exposed, he was exposed for what he was tonight which was the lesser fighter who stayed back & threw bullshit punches til the 11th round & it cost him his zero!


In boxing exposed is reserved for undefeated prospects who get badly beaten by a perceived lesser opponent . Chad Dawson already has quality victories over top fighters. I think we can safely assume he is a good fighter that lost. I mean he completely outclassed Adamek and showed heart to get up off the deck when he got hit with a flush right hand. "Exposed" is not the right word here, or you might as well use it whenever a fighter loses.
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (JD @ Aug 15 2010, 12:09 AM) *
Dawson is missing "it".


As short and sweet as it is, this is probably the best assessment of Dawson as you can get.
caneman
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 15 2010, 12:34 AM) *
P4P Talent my fucking ass. P4P Talent doesn't beat itself. Jean Pascal's style is shit too. Chad should have NEVER lost to that...but he should have because I was never all that high on him anyway. Glen Johnson beat that ass in the first go round. People were WAY too fast to anointing "Bad" Chad as the man at Lt Hvy.

As an aside, Caneman, that Upper that stopped Pascal in his tracks in the 11th was spitting image of the one Hopkins landed on Lipsey. Chad shoulda pounced and it would have been a mirror image KO.

Chad aint all that.


It was close but imagine that, so called Bad Chad was unwilling to follow threw & close the damn show! He deserved to lose, end of story!
Method
QUOTE (Aware @ Aug 15 2010, 12:38 AM) *
In boxing exposed is reserved for undefeated prospects who get badly beaten by a perceived lesser opponent . Chad Dawson already has quality victories over top fighters. I think we can safely assume he is a good fighter that lost. I mean he completely outclassed Adamek and showed heart to get up off the deck when he got hit with a flush right hand. "Exposed" is not the right word here, or you might as well use it whenever a fighter loses.

When you lose to someone with that garbage bull dozing style that Pascal employs, "exposed" fits.
JD
Lipsey was removed from his senses completely...Pascal was stunned for a second from the uppercut, but I thought he recovered well.

Either way, Bad Chad just does not have the instinct.
Aware
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 15 2010, 12:34 AM) *
P4P Talent my fucking ass. P4P Talent doesn't beat itself. Jean Pascal's style is shit too. Chad should have NEVER lost to that...but he should have because I was never all that high on him anyway. Glen Johnson beat that ass in the first go round. People were WAY too fast to anointing "Bad" Chad as the man at Lt Hvy.

As an aside, Caneman, that Upper that stopped Pascal in his tracks in the 11th was spitting image of the one Hopkins landed on Lipsey. Chad shoulda pounced and it would have been a mirror image KO.

Chad aint all that.


If you don't think Dawson is a p4p talent, you must be blind as far as boxing goes. If they rematch lets bet!
Method
Right, but both were stopped in their tracks. Hads Chad jumped on him like Hopkins did Lipsey, it would have been game over. I agree Lipsey was hurt more, but both were stopped in their tracks and almost paralyzed for a second. That seemed like the moment for Chad.

I would have been pissed too, because he didnt deserve to win that fight.
Method
QUOTE (Aware @ Aug 15 2010, 12:42 AM) *
If you don't think Dawson is a p4p talent, you must be blind as far as boxing goes. If they rematch lets bet!

I must be. P4P Talent doesnt lose to a garbage style like Pascal's bull charging bullshit.
JD
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 15 2010, 12:43 AM) *
Right, but both were stopped in their tracks. Hads Chad jumped on him like Hopkins did Lipsey, it would have been game over. I agree Lipsey was hurt more, but both were stopped in their tracks and almost paralyzed for a second. That seemed like the moment for Chad.

I would have been pissed too, because he didnt deserve to win that fight.


That was the moment...actually, the moment may have been earlier that round, but I think he was more tired than it may have looked.

The real core of it is that Hopkins had that desire to inflict damage and get the guy out of there. Dawson is happy to reassess and see what is going on before doing anything.
Method
I wonder what Floyd Sr has to say. Hopefully Percy can get one w him. Floyd called him out a while ago.

Aware
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 15 2010, 12:44 AM) *
I must be. P4P Talent doesnt lose to a garbage style like Pascal's bull charging bullshit.

Lots of p4p fighters have lost to lesser talent. For example, Lewis-Rahman I and Hopkins-Taylor both times. It happens any boxing fan knows this.
caneman
He was exposed as a fighter that is unwilling to work when he needs to! I get it though bro, you like him....it doesn't change the fact he got out worked & didn't want to work hard like elite fighters do! By round 8 or 9, he needed a KO to win! All cause he didn't work HARD when needed, so is that not exposed on some level meng???
Method
Then he came in and tried to convince Larry (and everyone else) that Pascal was "headbutting all night". I only saw ONE butt - the one resulting in the cut, and it was a mutual accident.

Which is is, "Bad"? Was the guy fighting a great technical fight? Or was he headbutting all night? You cant do both.

...and Aware, I dont consider Lennox Lewis P4P talent. He got KTFO by Rahman and Ollie McCall, sure, but I never considered Lennox P4P. As far as Hopkins/Taylor, they were disputed decisions, whatever. Nobody was disputing the scoring here, except for that 108-101 card.
Aware
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 15 2010, 12:55 AM) *
Then he came in and tried to convince Larry (and everyone else) that Pascal was "headbutting all night". I only saw ONE butt - the one resulting in the cut, and it was a mutual accident.

Which is is, "Bad"? Was the guy fighting a great technical fight? Or was he headbutting all night? You cant do both.

...and Aware, I dont consider Lennox Lewis P4P talent. He got KTFO by Rahman and Ollie McCall, sure, but I never considered Lennox P4P. As far as Hopkins/Taylor, they were disputed decisions, whatever. Nobody was disputing the scoring here, except for that 108-101 card.

Do you consider Paul Williams p4p talent (The Ring does)? He had an off night against Quintana, this situation is analogous to that. It happens there is no denying this, you cannot win this argument.
tymoney
Some fighters needs they ass handed to them so they can realize their full potential. So I wont call Chad exposed yet until i see him in his next fight. This was either a wake up call to knock some damn sense in his head.. or this was truly him getting exposed by a fighter that wasnt all that great. We'll see.. but aside from that i personally was never all that high on Chad so i wasnt surprised by shit i seen tonite. He have the talent for sure.. but he aint got the heart.. and you cant train for that!
Method
QUOTE (tymoney @ Aug 15 2010, 01:01 AM) *
Some fighters needs they ass handed to them so they can realize their full potential. So I wont call Chad exposed yet until i see him in his next fight. This was either a wake up call to knock some damn sense in his head.. or this was truly him getting exposed by a fighter that wasnt all that great. We'll see.. but aside from that i personally was never all that high on Chad so I wasnt surprised by shit i seen tonight. He have the talent for sure.. but he aint got the heart.. and you cant train for that!

I'm with you. I was never that high on him either. I thought he got EXPOSED in the first Johnson fight, but they let him off because he was the next great thing. I was glad to see that happen to him tonight. It reaffirmed what I saw in the first Johnson fight. whats funny is HBO was trying to Jock him in the first half of the first round, but they quickly jumped off that bandwagon after the first round.
Method
QUOTE (Aware @ Aug 15 2010, 01:00 AM) *
Do you consider Paul Williams p4p talent (The Ring does)? He had an off night against Quintana, this situation is analogous to that. It happens there is no denying this, you cannot win this argument.

Again, P4P talent does NOT lose to Carlos fucking Quintana. There is no argument to win, as it's not for dispute.

Further, Williams lost to Martinez and was losing to Cintron. But that's neither here nor there. Losing to Quintana is inexcusable.
Aware
QUOTE (Method @ Aug 15 2010, 01:08 AM) *
Again, P4P talent does NOT lose to Carlos fucking Quintana. There is no argument to win, as it's not for dispute.

Further, Williams lost to Martinez and was losing to Cintron. But that's neither here nor there. Losing to Quintana is inexcusable.



Well, you obviously don't grasp the nature of human beings. Everybody has off nights even the best of the best can lose to lesser opponents. Happened to Joe Louis in his prime, it happened to Tyson, Sugar Ray Robinson (P4P greatest), etc. Checkmate!
tymoney
QUOTE (Aware @ Aug 15 2010, 01:17 AM) *
Well, you obviously don't grasp the nature of human beings. Everybody has off nights even the best of the best can lose to lesser opponents. Happened to Joe Louis in his prime, it happened to Tyson, Sugar Ray Robinson (P4P greatest), etc. Checkmate!


Both of you guys are right. P4P talent dont lose to Carlos Quintana, and P4P talent dont lose to Buster Douglas either. But NO one with a brain can say that Tyson was not P4P one of the greatest ever. So I can buy into the argument that you can have an off night.. but I cant buy into the argument that this was one of Chad "off nights". I believe this is and always has been Chad Dawson, a talented guy that has mediocre wins over mediocre/old fighters.. and eventually got too damn comfortable and lost to another mediocre fighter. And the main reason why i cant put no money on him.. cuz after he got his ass whooped he had the audacity to say he thought he won the fight. Seriously dude? Lol.. not one word about going back to the drawing board.. i shouldve put more pressure on em etc.. nothing but excuses. I call that the "Zab Judah syndrome".. a talented guy that will never reach his full potential.
Lil-lightsout
Did not see the fight, but after watching a few of Pascal's previous fights, I thought he looks like a pretty good fighter. I figured he would give Dawson a tough fight. Before the fight I would have had Dawson as a P4P top ten fighter, like many others would have also. But after losing tonight, he no longer deserves it. He must now earn it and prove this fight to be a fluke if he really is a P4P fighter.

Same with Paul Williams, he does not deserve to be a P4P fighter IMHO. He did lose to Martinez and was getting outboxed by Cintron, though only a few rounds before the crazy ending. Sorry, but not really qualifications of a P4P fighter.
JD
I don't think Dawson had an off night. He lost a fight to a guy who was willing to do the work he wasn't...but that's not new with Dawson, at leasr based upon what I have seen from him. I always felt something was missing or lacking with the guy.

This is the same guy I have seen over the past year or so, no different...he just didn't have a faded, slow, downside opponent in front of him.
ViperSniper
Great fight! Pascal was the busier man all night who was taking the risks and was really letting his hands go with a lot behind them. Dawson looked good the first 3 rounds but after that just didn't do enough to change the action to his advantage.

Chad Dawson is a very good boxer but he doesn't seem to pounce on openings and doesn't throw when he should. Instead of always waiting on picture perfect chance to throw combinations, he lets too many opportunities slip that result in low work rate, as his lack of urgency to not throw enough doesn't let him focused on a steady work rate. To his credit, he knew what was needed going into the championship rounds and started the 11th with the right idea but was unlucky he got the accidental headbutt to end the fight as he was having his best round of the night. It's a shame we didn't get to see the fight go 12 rounds.

I think Chad Dawson has already proven he is a pretty good fighter with the fights he has taken so far. Chad Dawson left the states to fight in Pascal's backyard as the undefeated Light Heavyweight Champ which deserves some big props as many Champions would not do this, but at times should, specially the status Dawson already has you know he is not acting like a diva in terms of getting fights made.

I had it 7-4 Pascal, in a very good fight that needs to be thrown on the list of rematches than need to be made. This could end up being FOTY which was a very good, legit fight the moment it was signed yet went completely under the radar leading into it. Jean Pascal fought with so much energy which made for a very interesting wave-like pace, as Dawson would fire back when tagged, as both were hurt, they showed alot of toughness and some pretty solid chins.

REMATCH clapping.gif
Aware
QUOTE (tymoney @ Aug 15 2010, 12:47 AM) *
Both of you guys are right. P4P talent dont lose to Carlos Quintana, and P4P talent dont lose to Buster Douglas either. But NO one with a brain can say that Tyson was not P4P one of the greatest ever. So I can buy into the argument that you can have an off night.. but I cant buy into the argument that this was one of Chad "off nights". I believe this is and always has been Chad Dawson, a talented guy that has mediocre wins over mediocre/old fighters.. and eventually got too damn comfortable and lost to another mediocre fighter. And the main reason why i cant put no money on him.. cuz after he got his ass whooped he had the audacity to say he thought he won the fight. Seriously dude? Lol.. not one word about going back to the drawing board.. i shouldve put more pressure on em etc.. nothing but excuses. I call that the "Zab Judah syndrome".. a talented guy that will never reach his full potential.

So Adamek was a mediocre fighter @ 175? It's so obvious, fuck. I guess I live in my own world. And for the record he never said he was winning.
salvador
QUOTE (JD @ Aug 15 2010, 01:01 AM) *
I don't think Dawson had an off night. He lost a fight to a guy who was willing to do the work he wasn't...but that's not new with Dawson, at leasr based upon what I have seen from him. I always felt something was missing or lacking with the guy.

This is the same guy I have seen over the past year or so, no different...he just didn't have a faded, slow, downside opponent in front of him.


Congrats on the excellent fight breakdown on the front page JD.

I didn't get a chance to see the fight, but I'd like to know if they said anything about a rematch clause. I'm not sure who else there really is to fight at 175 for either of them and I'm not sure Bute would want to move up seeing as how he can sell out the same arenas that Pascal can while paying the opponent far less. It sure does make the 168 pound tourney that much more interesting as I'm sure those guys (especially the losers) would be comfortable moving up to 175 for a paycheck after its over.


BigG
Pascal clearly took it but I had it pretty close 6-4-1, 6-5, or 7-4 Pascal. at the end. I pick Dawson when they rematch, UD.
The Original MrFactor
People dont seem to realize it, but thats the way Dawson fights. Everytime I've seen him, he fights the exact same way. He does his rendition of boxing for most of the rounds. Most of us call it slowly stalking while throwing an occasional measuring jab and not throwing meaningful combos. He gets hurt late in every fight. He comes back. This time the cut shut his ass down. I'm almost afrais to say that if he puts in work early he'll be too gassed by the end.

He could easily be Jermaine Taylor. Where's Kelly Pavlik, Carl Froch and Arthur Abraham?? When Chad faces a real puncher, he will not get the opportunity to recover after being hurt. Chad has all the physical tools and athleticism to be good. I question his drive, motivation and desire. He fights in such an unaggressive style that it makes me puke. He's an unaggressive fighter. What an oxymoron. Dude may need a new trainer. Eddie didnt seem to echo the same sense of urgency that I thought was necessary from round 4 on. Chad was giving rounds away and they were in the other guys home stadium. All bad signs when it comes to a decision.
tymoney
QUOTE (The Original MrFactor @ Aug 15 2010, 03:15 AM) *
People dont seem to realize it, but thats the way Dawson fights. Everytime I've seen him, he fights the exact same way. He does his rendition of boxing for most of the rounds. Most of us call it slowly stalking while throwing an occasional measuring jab and not throwing meaningful combos. He gets hurt late in every fight. He comes back. This time the cut shut his ass down. I'm almost afrais to say that if he puts in work early he'll be too gassed by the end.

He could easily be Jermaine Taylor. Where's Kelly Pavlik, Carl Froch and Arthur Abraham?? When Chad faces a real puncher, he will not get the opportunity to recover after being hurt. Chad has all the physical tools and athleticism to be good. I question his drive, motivation and desire. He fights in such an unaggressive style that it makes me puke. He's an unaggressive fighter. What an oxymoron. Dude may need a new trainer. Eddie didnt seem to echo the same sense of urgency that I thought was necessary from round 4 on. Chad was giving rounds away and they were in the other guys home stadium. All bad signs when it comes to a decision.


That pretty much explains it
tymoney
QUOTE (Aware @ Aug 15 2010, 02:04 AM) *
So Adamek was a mediocre fighter @ 175? It's so obvious, fuck. I guess I live in my own world. And for the record he never said he was winning.


Dude did you lose money on this fight or what? Lol.. Adamek is decent.. nothing more nothing less. And he didnt have to say he thought he won. If he cant take the L like a man when its clear to everyone that he got his ass whooped.. then thats a bitch move, period.
Method
QUOTE (tymoney @ Aug 15 2010, 05:50 AM) *
Dude did you lose money on this fight or what? Lol.. Adamek is decent.. nothing more nothing less.


Yup, pretty much.

QUOTE
Well, you obviously don't grasp the nature of human beings. Everybody has off nights even the best of the best can lose to lesser opponents. Happened to Joe Louis in his prime, it happened to Tyson, Sugar Ray Robinson (P4P greatest), etc. Checkmate!


I have no problem with it happening to Ray Robinson. Losing isnt necessarily the point. Additionally, and much more important, look how many fights Ray Robinson has, and look how many times a year he fought. Get the fuck out of my face with the comparison. Chad fought 2 times in 2009. Pascal fought 4.

Dont come in here with your half-assed arguments and ending them w the self proclaimed "checkmate" as if declaring yourself the winner after such a half-assed effort/baseless argument. That's such a " Williams/Quintana 1" effort.

Chad Dawson is WAY over-hyped...and has been. He's got decent enough skills, and he's athletic, but he is NOT the total package.
caneman
QUOTE (Aware @ Aug 15 2010, 02:04 AM) *
So Adamek was a mediocre fighter @ 175? It's so obvious, fuck. I guess I live in my own world. And for the record he never said he was winning.



It would seem you are in your own world if you can't see what most of us are saying over & over! We get it though, you are a stylist guy that likes them pretty! Most of admit the guy has talent and is good but he won't work, he don't have killer instinct & don't have the desire, even if he kills Pascal in the rematch, this will happen again to him if he doesn't change what is in his heart!!!!! I had it 7-4 @ the time of the stoppage!
KookedKrack
I was big on Dawson and still am but last night he looked VERY bitchmade.
caneman
QUOTE (KookedKrack @ Aug 15 2010, 09:45 AM) *
I was big on Dawson and still am but last night he looked VERY bitchmade.


He has the talent & is a likable guy even if I didn't like what he said in the post fight interview! I didn't see any other head butts but maybe I need to watch it again! I can see Dawson kicking ass in the rematch but again, if he doesn't keep that hunger, what happened last night will happen again IMO! He is far from a PWill type guy, PWill goes for it & will eat punches to do it! Dawson is just too lax & it cost him & will again!
JD
Checkmate? laugh.gif

LOL...is the thought of someone having a differing view on the same fighter that disconcerting that you must proclaim victory for yourself in an imaginary competition?

Dawson lost, and some of the flaws that a handful of people saw were highlighted...he has a chance to get better from this, if he doesn't, then he is just not anything to get all that excited about. But this "checkmate" shit is hilarious.
caneman
QUOTE (JD @ Aug 15 2010, 10:04 AM) *
Checkmate? laugh.gif

LOL...is the thought of someone having a differing view on the same fighter that disconcerting that you must proclaim victory for yourself in an imaginary competition?

Dawson lost, and some of the flaws that a handful of people saw were highlighted...he has a chance to get better from this, if he doesn't, then he is just not anything to get all that excited about. But this "checkmate" shit is hilarious.



What JD, you ain't ready to knock over your queen & give up after a checkmate like that?!?!?1 GEEZ! LMFAO
JD
QUOTE (caneman @ Aug 15 2010, 10:08 AM) *
What JD, you ain't ready to knock over your queen & give up after a checkmate like that?!?!?1 GEEZ! LMFAO


I mean...it wasn't directed at me, but shit like that is always so damn funny to me.
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