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AussieLad
So i see this fight is on. Very interesting. Whilst Tarver is passed his best, Green is no spring chicken and returning from surgery that could have ended his career.

Say what you will about the hand wraps, green would have knocked roy out regardless. He has always been a very heavy handed fighter.

Who wins?

Tarvers punch output has never been that good. but he is a good counter puncher, which may cause problems for Greens aggressive style.

I say Tarver by KO
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
Tarver and relatively easily. I hate Tarver.
Box in Hand
Why is Tarver always following in Roy's shadow? Roy went to Heavyweight so does Tarver. Roy wanted Tyson then so does Tarver, Roy is an announcer and now so is Tarver. Roy fought Green and now Tarver. Roy wore Jordan's in the ring and then Tarver. I mean talk about idol worship.
BigG
Tarver by wide decision
neophyte7
Tarver made Roy Jones the shit he has become and for that he always gets my respect.... Great Job Antonio in cracking Jones' chin. You officially killed a "so called" Legend
blackbelt2003
Can't we just stick Tarver in with Vit Klit and get him over and done wite for now)h? It's not like Vit's got anything worthwhile coming up this year (we'll ignore the possibility of Haye getting past Wlad for now).

Who wouldn't want to see Klit's gloves bouncing off Tarver's shiny dome? Over and over again.


It's a damned sight better than a supremely dull UD over Green followed by, "I'm the greatest. I knocked out Roy Jones. I want a fourth fight with him. I'm the best fighter ever." Yaaaaaaaawn.



For the record I don't dislike Tarver. I'm just, like.......meh! For a big puncher he hasn't scored many big KO's since Roy, has he? I mean, how many UD wins and losses can we sit through?




Black
neophyte7
QUOTE (blackbelt2003 @ Apr 6 2011, 04:38 PM) *
Can't we just stick Tarver in with Vit Klit and get him over and done wite for now)h? It's not like Vit's got anything worthwhile coming up this year (we'll ignore the possibility of Haye getting past Wlad for now).

Who wouldn't want to see Klit's gloves bouncing off Tarver's shiny dome? Over and over again.


It's a damned sight better than a supremely dull UD over Green followed by, "I'm the greatest. I knocked out Roy Jones. I want a fourth fight with him. I'm the best fighter ever." Yaaaaaaaawn.



For the record I don't dislike Tarver. I'm just, like.......meh! For a big puncher he hasn't scored many big KO's since Roy, has he? I mean, how many UD wins and losses can we sit through?




Black


LMAO @ Who wouldn't want to see Klit's gloves bouncing off Tarver's shiny dome? Over and over again. LMAO... that would be a mercy killing

D-MARV
QUOTE (Fitz @ Apr 6 2011, 05:47 PM) *
It's actually amazing how many people HATE Danny Green. Even over on the other forum, people are all rooting for Tarver and saying how they dislike Green. Haha.

I can't stand Danny Green. Fuck him!

I hope Tarver removes Green from his senses... I highly doubt it though. I'll take Tarver by SD.
JLUVBABY
QUOTE (Fitz @ Apr 6 2011, 07:34 PM) *
But I think it's funny because just about every American hates him, but why? he is kind of irrelevant.

He embarrassed Roy Jones Jr, and then beat BJ Flores, a guy nobody gave a fuck about and people can't stand him, haha.

I love it.


young fitzgerald... im actually rooting for green... i cant stand tarver as a fighter... i hope green knocks his ass out in a dominating slow beat down....
JLUVBABY
QUOTE (Fitz @ Apr 6 2011, 07:34 PM) *
But I think it's funny because just about every American hates him, but why? he is kind of irrelevant.

He embarrassed Roy Jones Jr, and then beat BJ Flores, a guy nobody gave a fuck about and people can't stand him, haha.

I love it.


young fitzgerald... im actually rooting for green... i cant stand tarver as a fighter... i hope green knocks his ass out in a dominating slow beat down....
gravytrain
QUOTE (Fitz @ Apr 6 2011, 08:34 PM) *
But I think it's funny because just about every American hates him, but why? he is kind of irrelevant.

He embarrassed Roy Jones Jr, and then beat BJ Flores, a guy nobody gave a fuck about and people can't stand him, haha.

I love it.


it's probably because his sorry ass lost to Mundine lol.
AussieLad
I dont mind Danny, but he did start down mundines path of least resistance with some easy fights. So he has dropped a few notches in my book. Tarver isnt the biggest match out there for him either, but more credible than feasting Jones carcass... slightly more credible that is. I just think he will get caught with a big shot as he presses forward
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (ViperSniper @ Apr 7 2011, 04:28 AM) *
I think that's a pretty unfair to compare his path to Mundines path, there not even close. Had Mundine made the moves Danny Green was/has been willing to make, I guarantee you he would have been spoken about higher than he is now. He also wouldn't be training for a rematch against a guy smaller than him with much less skills than him either.


If Mundine had ever pulled a stunt like fighting Paul Briggs he would've been crucified and rightly so. If I had to pick a point where I started disliking Green a little it was this fight. It really was a black mark for he sport of boxing.

That and the fact that all of his opponents lately are fighting for his supposed CW crown yet they all come in at 'Dannyweight.' What's that all about?
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (The Ollie Reed Fan Club @ Apr 7 2011, 08:24 PM) *
If Mundine had ever pulled a stunt like fighting Paul Briggs he would've been crucified and rightly so.


Umm he did & then some by fighting a alcoholic Lester Ellis who was IBF 130 lb champion in 1985! Or maybe when he called out Jeff Fench? Or when he fought Guy Waters? Or what about when he fought a coked up Shannan Taylor?

Mundine is a joke. He was a 2nd rate 5/8 & is a 2nd rate boxer. Everything about the dumb abo is 2nd rate.

As for Green vs Tarver I am surprised at how many are picking Tarver by easy victory. What has he remotely done in the last few years to give people that opinion? lose twice to Dawson? Not saying Danny is all that & a pack of crisps but for fucks sake it is Tarver he is fighting not a prime Robinson. This is the same cunt who could not adjust to old fox Hopkins & fought like a complete bitch against RJJ in their third fight.

Personally I hope Green catches him good & sends him to the land'o twitch.
AussieLad
Siaca was a cynical attempt at beating Mundines conqueror. He had fought 4 times in 4 years prior, and was coming off a year long lay off. That is a least resistance fight based purely on sticking it to mundine

The Briggs fight was a disgrace. A 3 year lay off only to come back and fight for a title? Some dodgy strings were pulled in making that match

When i said he started down mundines yellow brick road of shit fights... you bet he did. Did he meet mundines mates the cowardly lion and the tin man, no, but he sure as hell shook hands with the scare crow. All I said was he dropped a few notches in my book. If he didnt drop a few notches in your own after those matches then there is something wrong with you

Is he anywhere near as bad as Mundine? No, not even close to the shit choc was pulling, but still... he tainted his fan base with some recent shitty fights.

Yes, in retrospect Jones was a carcass, but at the time he was supposed to beat Green. Granted. But realistically, Jones only looked good against Lacy because Lacy was a shell. Lacy gave people a false sense of security that Roy was back on track. He wasnt even close to the old roy, as demonstrated in the green fight and subsequent performances. If i am guilty of anything it is in overestimating Jones prior to the fight. But in the cold light of day, regardless of the prefight hype, Green fought a shot Jones. The prefight hype for Jones argument only carries you so far. It does not improve the actual quality of the win. That can only be determined by the quality of the opponent that steps into the ring on the night
AussieLad
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Apr 7 2011, 11:00 AM) *
Personally I hope Green catches him good & sends him to the land'o twitch.


And so do i
AussieLad
QUOTE (The Ollie Reed Fan Club @ Apr 7 2011, 10:24 AM) *
If Mundine had ever pulled a stunt like fighting Paul Briggs he would've been crucified and rightly so. If I had to pick a point where I started disliking Green a little it was this fight. It really was a black mark for he sport of boxing.

That and the fact that all of his opponents lately are fighting for his supposed CW crown yet they all come in at 'Dannyweight.' What's that all about?


Exactly
D-MARV
I personally don't mind Green... I talk shit to get all the aussies fired up!


I do think all the catchweight fights were gay but people do worse and I DOUBT HIGHLY that Hopkins "ducked" Green.

Anyways... I still would like to see Green laid out motionless. Tarver SD
Big Slim Sweet
All I know is the winner of this fight needs to come see James.
JLUVBABY
QUOTE (Big Slim Sweet @ Apr 7 2011, 10:11 AM) *
All I know is the winner of this fight needs to come see James.


only if the fights on espn2 or showbox.... lol...
ViperSniper
QUOTE (The Ollie Reed Fan Club @ Apr 7 2011, 10:24 AM) *
If Mundine had ever pulled a stunt like fighting Paul Briggs he would've been crucified and rightly so. If I had to pick a point where I started disliking Green a little it was this fight. It really was a black mark for he sport of boxing.

That and the fact that all of his opponents lately are fighting for his supposed CW crown yet they all come in at 'Dannyweight.' What's that all about?


Stevenski did a very good job of replying to this. Mundine has done much worse and got away with it way longer than he should have. Not until he continued fighting bum after bum after bum for years, while running his mouth while never making the effort to fight the best of leave Australia did the people start catching on.

As for the catchweights they are nothing I really support at all, but Briggs didn't even bother training properly to make them anyways.

QUOTE (AussieLad @ Apr 7 2011, 11:02 AM) *
Siaca was a cynical attempt at beating Mundines conqueror. He had fought 4 times in 4 years prior, and was coming off a year long lay off. That is a least resistance fight based purely on sticking it to mundine

The Briggs fight was a disgrace. A 3 year lay off only to come back and fight for a title? Some dodgy strings were pulled in making that match

When i said he started down mundines yellow brick road of shit fights... you bet he did. Did he meet mundines mates the cowardly lion and the tin man, no, but he sure as hell shook hands with the scare crow. All I said was he dropped a few notches in my book. If he didnt drop a few notches in your own after those matches then there is something wrong with you

Is he anywhere near as bad as Mundine? No, not even close to the shit choc was pulling, but still... he tainted his fan base with some recent shitty fights.

Yes, in retrospect Jones was a carcass, but at the time he was supposed to beat Green. Granted. But realistically, Jones only looked good against Lacy because Lacy was a shell. Lacy gave people a false sense of security that Roy was back on track. He wasnt even close to the old roy, as demonstrated in the green fight and subsequent performances. If i am guilty of anything it is in overestimating Jones prior to the fight. But in the cold light of day, regardless of the prefight hype, Green fought a shot Jones. The prefight hype for Jones argument only carries you so far. It does not improve the actual quality of the win. That can only be determined by the quality of the opponent that steps into the ring on the night


Nothing wrong with me here!

I think Danny Green has been heavily criticized as I think people were/are expecting too much from him. It's not like he is considered the best nor claiming to be (like Mundine), not to mention, people forget to mention he was coming out of retirement and is now coming off a serious injury. Has Green fought the best at Cruiserweights? No, but when your the 'best' of any division it's hard for everyone to get a shot. I just don't think it's fair to compare Green's competition to something Mundine has mastered and is now become known for. Danny Green has many things Anthony Mundine lacks.

For the Paul Briggs fight, as it was out of left field & agree that the fight was shit, but I can see why it was made as it was a massive fight in Australia. The only thing that was more wrong about the fight being made was the disgusting effort Paul Briggs displayed which unjustifiably reflected on Green. The only dodgy strings pulled was by Briggs and the people around him and the commissions ended up ruling it that way. I can never forgive him for taking such a weak embarrassing dive which seemed to have hurt Danny Green's reputation just as much as himself, but on top of that many played Paul Briggs out to be some victim. Fuck that! I don't think Danny Green had anything to do with that dive and because of his disgust and embarrassment he showed inside the ring after the fight, Green ended up magnified the situation even more which didn't help the already fucked display that took place. All of his words were at the heat of the moment which came through the guys passion which he had every right feeling the way he did, but unfortunately may have not helped him. His UD victory over Flores in his nesxt fight was a good start.

As for Jones-Lacy, Jones was a shell of himself too, that was no secret to the boxing world! Some saw he wasn't at his best, based on how he looked after coming down from Heavyweight, but I think majority knew he was a shell of his former self back since he was KO'd good by Glen Johnson! As for the Lacy fight, they were two fighters past their best and labeled 'shot' but I don't think many were expecting Jones to look as impressive as he did leading into the fight, which was a credit to Jones.

As for Danny Green-Roy Jones Jr. fight, I really don't think anyone was thinking Jones wasn't shot and I also don't think anyone (including Hopkins) thought Green was going to win, despite how shot Roy was anyways. I think it was more a case of people underestimating what Danny Green was capable of. People like to discredit Green for losing to Mundine, truth is as bad a wrap Mundine rightfully gets, at one stage the guy really was a decent fighter (like against Green) who is one of the biggest waste of talents I have ever seen and since that fight, Danny Green has improved alot, while Mundine has declined and the paths both their careers have taken shows since. Just take a look at what divisions they're fighting in now & both their next opponents for proof.

Does Green victory over Jones mean anything to boxing? Not at all, because everyone knew Jones was well past his best days, had lost and been KO'd many times prior to that. But it's still impressive he could stop Roy Jones Jr quicker than anyone ever has. Danny Green was not and is still not meant to be some world beater, so for a limited fighter of his caliber to KO Roy Jones Jr in a 121 seconds despite how shot Roy was, is a pretty decent accomplishment, that shouldn't take away the quality of performance.

Bernard Hopkins who is considered one of the most talented fighters in the last 25 years who was top 3 P4P fighter in the world still justified fighting a 'carcass' of Jones who manage to look horrible for 12 rounds, spending most the time complaining, rolling around on the floor and still never manage to never have Jones hurt or in trouble. Despite how old and shot Roy was, Danny Green deserves respect for getting Jones out of there the way he did, because despite everyone knowing how shot he is, no one would have expected Jones to put up a better fight against Bernard Hopkins at that age than Danny Green.
AussieLad
QUOTE (ViperSniper @ Apr 8 2011, 05:18 PM) *
Stevenski did a very good job of replying to this. Mundine has done much worse and got away with it way longer than he should have. Not until he continued fighting bum after bum after bum for years, while running his mouth while never making the effort to fight the best of leave Australia did the people start catching on.

As for the catchweights they are nothing I really support at all, but Briggs didn't even bother training properly to make them anyways.



Nothing wrong with me here!

I think Danny Green has been heavily criticized as I think people were/are expecting too much from him. It's not like he is considered the best nor claiming to be (like Mundine), not to mention, people forget to mention he was coming out of retirement and is now coming off a serious injury. Has Green fought the best at Cruiserweights? No, but when your the 'best' of any division it's hard for everyone to get a shot. I just don't think it's fair to compare Green's competition to something Mundine has mastered and is now become known for. Danny Green has many things Anthony Mundine lacks.

For the Paul Briggs fight, as it was out of left field & agree that the fight was shit, but I can see why it was made as it was a massive fight in Australia. The only thing that was more wrong about the fight being made was the disgusting effort Paul Briggs displayed which unjustifiably reflected on Green. The only dodgy strings pulled was by Briggs and the people around him and the commissions ended up ruling it that way. I can never forgive him for taking such a weak embarrassing dive which seemed to have hurt Danny Green's reputation just as much as himself, but on top of that many played Paul Briggs out to be some victim. Fuck that! I don't think Danny Green had anything to do with that dive and because of his disgust and embarrassment he showed inside the ring after the fight, Green ended up magnified the situation even more which didn't help the already fucked display that took place. All of his words were at the heat of the moment which came through the guys passion which he had every right feeling the way he did, but unfortunately may have not helped him. His UD victory over Flores in his nesxt fight was a good start.

As for Jones-Lacy, Jones was a shell of himself too, that was no secret to the boxing world! Some saw he wasn't at his best, based on how he looked after coming down from Heavyweight, but I think majority knew he was a shell of his former self back since he was KO'd good by Glen Johnson! As for the Lacy fight, they were two fighters past their best and labeled 'shot' but I don't think many were expecting Jones to look as impressive as he did leading into the fight, which was a credit to Jones.

As for Danny Green-Roy Jones Jr. fight, I really don't think anyone was thinking Jones wasn't shot and I also don't think anyone (including Hopkins) thought Green was going to win, despite how shot Roy was anyways. I think it was more a case of people underestimating what Danny Green was capable of. People like to discredit Green for losing to Mundine, truth is as bad a wrap Mundine rightfully gets, at one stage the guy really was a decent fighter (like against Green) who is one of the biggest waste of talents I have ever seen and since that fight, Danny Green has improved alot, while Mundine has declined and the paths both their careers have taken shows since. Just take a look at what divisions they're fighting in now & both their next opponents for proof.

Does Green victory over Jones mean anything to boxing? Not at all, because everyone knew Jones was well past his best days, had lost and been KO'd many times prior to that. But it's still impressive he could stop Roy Jones Jr quicker than anyone ever has. Danny Green was not and is still not meant to be some world beater, so for a limited fighter of his caliber to KO Roy Jones Jr in a 121 seconds despite how shot Roy was, is a pretty decent accomplishment, that shouldn't take away the quality of performance.

Bernard Hopkins who is considered one of the most talented fighters in the last 25 years who was top 3 P4P fighter in the world still justified fighting a 'carcass' of Jones who manage to look horrible for 12 rounds, spending most the time complaining, rolling around on the floor and still never manage to never have Jones hurt or in trouble. Despite how old and shot Roy was, Danny Green deserves respect for getting Jones out of there the way he did, because despite everyone knowing how shot he is, no one would have expected Jones to put up a better fight against Bernard Hopkins at that age than Danny Green.



The disgusting effort by Briggs reflecting badly on Green? What about Green fighting him in the first place given how long he had been inactive? That is what reflects badly on him, and is the source of the woeful display in the ring. And its because it was a massive fight in Australia that he overlooked this glaring deficit in the quality of his opponent... presumably for $$$ and name value. A shitty move that deserves criticism. Sorry, you cant fight a "has been" and then dodge the flack when the "has been" doesnt perform. Its a case of "what did you expect was going to happen?" The guy should never have been in the ring in the first place

Bernard knew Jones was a carcass. He took the fight because of his ego, because of the history the 2 shared together, not because the fight was justifiable. A p4p fighter taking on a guy that got absolutely obliterated in 1 round by a relative nobody in his last fight? rolleyes_anim.gif Thats almost like a floyd mayweather jr bitch move. Bernard took criticism in accepting this fight, and the criticism was justified.
Lil-lightsout
QUOTE (Big Slim Sweet @ Apr 7 2011, 11:11 AM) *
All I know is the winner of this fight needs to come see James.


Well I guess the first place they should look is either KFC or BK.


Also, I am hoping Tarver ices Green after what he did to Roy.
King Eugene
I really hope Green gives him a nice and slow beat down and brutally KO's him in the 12th
ViperSniper
QUOTE (AussieLad @ Apr 8 2011, 11:42 PM) *
The disgusting effort by Briggs reflecting badly on Green? What about Green fighting him in the first place given how long he had been inactive? That is what reflects badly on him, and is the source of the woeful display in the ring. And its because it was a massive fight in Australia that he overlooked this glaring deficit in the quality of his opponent... presumably for $$$ and name value. A shitty move that deserves criticism. Sorry, you cant fight a "has been" and then dodge the flack when the "has been" doesnt perform. Its a case of "what did you expect was going to happen?" The guy should never have been in the ring in the first place

Bernard knew Jones was a carcass. He took the fight because of his ego, because of the history the 2 shared together, not because the fight was justifiable. A p4p fighter taking on a guy that got absolutely obliterated in 1 round by a relative nobody in his last fight? rolleyes_anim.gif Thats almost like a floyd mayweather jr bitch move. Bernard took criticism in accepting this fight, and the criticism was justified.


Of course he took the Briggs fight for the money and name value as it was a big fight in Australia. Based on the circumstances it was horrible timing to take the fight and was a horrible decision and did get shit for it. And yes, Briggs taking a dive did reflect badly on Green when many start accusing Danny Green of being involved & many start claiming strings were pulled!

Only by Paul Briggs and perhaps his people did they know he didn't want to be in the ring as his weight and body language showed before the bell rang. Danny Green rightfully so did get criticized for taking the fight, but more so with how the fight ended, which was all on Briggs who not only embarrassed himself for taking a weak ass dive, but put a black mark on Danny Green's name and even more on the sport of boxing.

"What did you expect?" argument gets thrown out alot when discussing this fight. And really..I was expecting a lot more than what Briggs showed. Briggs didn't perform? That's a little generous..the guy took a blatant dive!!

By all means if people want to give Green shit for taking the fight that's fair enough, but it was a one off fight you can criticize him for. But I don't think he should take shit for Brigg's actions inside the ring, because despite having a 3 year lay off, and whatever neurology problems he had, you do not go down by the first fucking punch of the fight landed by a grazing jab like that! How the fuck did he get through a single round of sparring, training for the fight if he really was legit?

Just look at Greens reaction while he was down and after the fight as he was just as surprised as everyone watching and the right decision was made when Paul Briggs and his team were fined and suspended for it. The more I think about it the more I think fuck Paul Briggs the fuckin K9!! LOL!


Agreed. Hopkins would have been better off without taking the rematch from 17 years ago with Jones. I know it was because of his own personal reasons, but he justified it to himself which is bad enough. Instead of a weak, pointless fight doing nothing for his career, it actually hurt it. He would have been better off returning the multiple offers, phone messages and personal messages through his team left personally by Danny Green and taken that fight instead. Beat the guy that beat the guy, not the beatin' down, shot guy on the floor LOL.

ViperSniper
QUOTE (Fitz @ Apr 9 2011, 07:29 AM) *
I don't even know why people are being so hard on Green. He probably isn't even a top 25-30 p4p fighter, haha.

All of this is because of how he beat Jones. Something he wasn't supposed to do, and was supposed to be a tune up for Jones. I doubt we would even be having discussions about Green and having bitter people if the fight didn't even take place, haha.


I guess that's what sums up my opinion on all of the criticism he cops, for someone who is not even considered highly to begin with, he sure does have high expectations of people. Since fighting at Cruiserweight the guy was coming out of retirement himself and is now coming off a career threatening injury, so I think getting fights with Jones, Siaca, Flores and now Tarver, I think Danny has actually done very well for himself for a fighter who I'd go as far to say isn't even considered a P4P top 60 fighter? Mundine on the other hand was regarded and and proclaimed much higher and has abused his name and situation by feasting on bum after bum with fighters no one has ever heard of. Danny's determination has paid of, while Mundine's lack off has left him taking on a rematch with Garth Who?
AussieLad
Mundine and Green are two different people entirely. I didn't raise the comparison of Green and Mundine, as Greens actions stand solely on his own merits. What choc does is irrelevant to Greens career, the only point debating is the discrepancy in boxing fans attitudes to the two. One guy gets nailed for his shitty comp, the other guy had a short string of crap matches and should be held accountable

Flores was a good fight. No problems with that.

Tarver is borderline on paper, based on recent form. If it wasnt for Greens injury i would have him comfortably beating Tarver on points. Maybe the operation wasn't as bad as first thought and he still manages to put away tarver. Certainly a possibility. All i said was i think tarver will land a nice counter at some point and shake danny up. Its called an opinion dntknw.gif

I swear, its pretty funny the dudes leaping to defend green. He had 3 suspect fights in a row in my opinion, two clearly dodgy (one very much so), and a third dodgy in retrospect (though should have been clear from the outset, blinded by wishful thinking and nostalgia). Prior to that, Green has had some good fights against relatively decent opposition. Its not like i'm calling a complete sell out... sheesh... And i dont even really blame Green for the Jones fight either. Roy is a big scalp to have on a resume, and given roys prime greatness, it ensures people will remember Green long after he retires. People will always remember how great Roy was, and in turn remember his losses.

Just calling it how i see it. Then Fitz went on the Fritz...

LOL
ViperSniper
QUOTE (AussieLad @ Apr 9 2011, 07:23 AM) *
Mundine and Green are two different people entirely. I didn't raise the comparison of Green and Mundine, as Greens actions stand solely on his own merits. What choc does is irrelevant to Greens career, the only point debating is the discrepancy in boxing fans attitudes to the two. One guy gets nailed for his shitty comp, the other guy had a short string of crap matches and should be held accountable

Flores was a good fight. No problems with that.

Tarver is borderline on paper, based on recent form. If it wasnt for Greens injury i would have him comfortably beating Tarver on points. Maybe the operation wasn't as bad as first thought and he still manages to put away tarver. Certainly a possibility. All i said was i think tarver will land a nice counter at some point and shake danny up. Its called an opinion dntknw.gif

I swear, its pretty funny the dudes leaping to defend green. He had 3 suspect fights in a row in my opinion, two clearly dodgy (one very much so), and a third dodgy in retrospect (though should have been clear from the outset, blinded by wishful thinking and nostalgia). Prior to that, Green has had some good fights against relatively decent opposition. Its not like i'm calling a complete sell out... sheesh... And i dont even really blame Green for the Jones fight either. Roy is a big scalp to have on a resume, and given roys prime greatness, it ensures people will remember Green long after he retires. People will always remember how great Roy was, and in turn remember his losses.

Just calling it how i see it. Then Fitz went on the Fritz...

LOL


Well you did make the comparison of the two due to the fights they take by bringing up 3 fights Danny took since coming out of retirement & compared him to Mundine. Jones was caught while cold & old, Siaca didn't want to continue after feelin the heat and Briggs plain simply took a dive. Other than Dominguez and Flores, I agree he hasn't been tested, therefore appears to have 'easy' fights but I don't think it was all his fault. I have already written why I felt it was unfair to compare Green to Mundine in regards to the paths they have taken. Should he be held accountable for his fights? Absolutely, but I would not be prepared to say he takes easy fights just yet, nor compare him to Mundine for a very long time.

Well there must be something wrong with me because Danny didn't drop a couple of notches in my book, but did so in yours dntknw.gif .It is your opinion and can see why you would say it and I respect it! I just gave you mine back & wrote 'why' I don't agree with it or your comparison of Green to Mundine, because I feel Danny would have to take a bunch of shocking fights for the next couple of years to be compared to like that. Just my opinion, not trying to have a go at you either lol.

Anyways, I think this may be another case of people sleeping on Green as I agree he may have what it takes (heart and power) to hurt Tarver at this point of his career. I hope he does too.
Big Slim Sweet
QUOTE (Fitz @ Apr 9 2011, 01:29 AM) *
All of this is because of how he beat Jones. Something he wasn't supposed to do, and was supposed to be a tune up for Jones. I doubt we would even be having discussions about Green and having bitter people if the fight didn't even take place, haha.

Why do you think people hate Tarver the way they do? Sure he can be a douche but a lot of that visceral hatred comes from the way he gave Roy Jones a sex change.

I don't know how big a deal Green is in Australia but for sure the reason he's on people's radar here is because of what he did to Roy as well. Prior to that, I think most Americans knew him as the guy who'd had a heated sparring session with James Toney.

Speaking of which...

The winner of this fight needs to come see James.
JLUVBABY
QUOTE (Big Slim Sweet @ Apr 9 2011, 10:24 AM) *
Why do you think people hate Tarver the way they do? Sure he can be a douche but a lot of that visceral hatred comes from the way he gave Roy Jones a sex change.

I don't know how big a deal Green is in Australia but for sure the reason he's on people's radar here is because of what he did to Roy as well. Prior to that, I think most Americans knew him as the guy who'd had a heated sparring session with James Toney.

Speaking of which...

The winner of this fight needs to come see James.


cant speak for anyone else but my personal dislike for tarver stems from his arrogance and thought in his mind that he is this supreme fighter when in reality he is not... he is cocky when it isnt warrented... the guy was LUCKY in the fact that he caught Roy Jones at the true beginning of his slide in skills and still lost the first fight... got lucky in the second fight with the ko with his eyes closed and all of a sudden he thinks he is king shit... take a look at tarvers record and he has never won a big fight the first time around... he has always needed rematches and that dates back to the eric harding fights... the guy hit the circumstance lotto and it made him a brash cocky shit talker when he didnt have that right... sad thing is some actually give him full credit for that ko of jones which further boosts his shitty ego... i love nothing more than watching him get beat on in the ring and im hoping danny green lays a methodical slow beat down on him...

now his fighting aside i give him full credit as a fight announcer and analyzer on showtime.. i think he does a great job there... i dont hate the guy as a person just when he goes into fighter mode...
Big Slim Sweet
QUOTE (JLUVBABY @ Apr 9 2011, 11:40 AM) *
cant speak for anyone else but my personal dislike for tarver stems from his arrogance and thought in his mind that he is this supreme fighter when in reality he is not... he is cocky when it isnt warrented... the guy was LUCKY in the fact that he caught Roy Jones at the true beginning of his slide in skills and still lost the first fight... got lucky in the second fight with the ko with his eyes closed and all of a sudden he thinks he is king shit... take a look at tarvers record and he has never won a big fight the first time around... he has always needed rematches and that dates back to the eric harding fights... the guy hit the circumstance lotto and it made him a brash cocky shit talker when he didnt have that right... sad thing is some actually give him full credit for that ko of jones which further boosts his shitty ego... i love nothing more than watching him get beat on in the ring and im hoping danny green lays a methodical slow beat down on him...

JLUV you're kinda proving my point here though. I get that you hate Tarver for his arrogance but there is NO WAY you'd even waste the time hating on him to THIS ^^^ extent if it hadn't been for what he did to Roy Jones. He just wouldn't be on your radar the same way.

Incidentally, whatever anyone thinks of Tarver otherwise I believe he deserves full credit for his KO of Jones. Roy was still superman back then. He looked great in the first round of that fight and then just got nailed. And that was the end of that.

neophyte7
Referee: Are there any questions. TARVER: Yeah, I got a question, you got any excuses tonight Roy??? CLASSIC SHIT

and the NEW
QUOTE (Fitz @ Apr 6 2011, 10:47 PM) *
It's actually amazing how many people HATE Danny Green. Even over on the other forum, people are all rooting for Tarver and saying how they dislike Green. Haha.


What is the 'other forum' Fitz?

On first instinct, I go with Green also. Tarver throws about as many punches as BHOP, but with nowhere near the same ring smarts. Green has a serious set of whiskers, so unless it's the Harding KO counter-punch, I don't see Tarver stopping him.
JLUVBABY
QUOTE (Big Slim Sweet @ Apr 9 2011, 02:39 PM) *
JLUV you're kinda proving my point here though. I get that you hate Tarver for his arrogance but there is NO WAY you'd even waste the time hating on him to THIS ^^^ extent if it hadn't been for what he did to Roy Jones. He just wouldn't be on your radar the same way.

Incidentally, whatever anyone thinks of Tarver otherwise I believe he deserves full credit for his KO of Jones. Roy was still superman back then. He looked great in the first round of that fight and then just got nailed. And that was the end of that.


tarver could have ko'd anybody with that same status at the time and i would feel the same.... its not that it was ROY JONES.... and fact is, roy wasnt the superman we thought he was in hindsight... Roy killed what prime he had left dropping that muscle weight to go back down to lt heavy to face tarver (no way roy pre heavyweight loses to antonio tarver)... he would never be the same again after the defeat of ruiz... it was the last night we saw a prime roy or anything close to it... didnt know it then but it is what it is.. roy should have cashed out at heavyweight taking the tyson and holyfield fights 2 fights i think he would have won by the way and cashed out vs lewis... he wouldnt be fighting now...

tarver faced the same weight loss demon after blowing up to close to 220 for the rocky balboa movie... he was never the same after that as he was a fairly good fighter in his own right before blowing up in weight to make the movie, just not who he would like to think he was, but a fairly good fighter that was never the same after his weight loss issues... but like i said i hate tarver as a fighter and love seeing him get his cocky ass busted up in fights but can say he is a very good analyst...
Big Slim Sweet
QUOTE (JLUVBABY @ Apr 10 2011, 03:44 AM) *
and fact is, roy wasnt the superman we thought he was in hindsight... Roy killed what prime he had left dropping that muscle weight to go back down to lt heavy to face tarver (no way roy pre heavyweight loses to antonio tarver)...

That's not a fact though J, it's your opinion, and while I can respect it the fact is we'll never really know. Maybe dropping the weight killed Roy's prime. Maybe getting clocked by Tarver in the rematch snatched his confidence and killed his prime. Maybe he was just getting old and something like that was bound to happen sooner or later anyway. More than likely, IMO, it was a combination of the three. Roy was getting on in years, he messed with his weight which accelerated his decline, and then he got smoked and lost his aura of invincibility which cemented his status as a once great now over the hill.

No one can question that Tarver was the beneficiary of some fortunate circumstances, but he also made those circumstances what they were - goading Roy into a fight and then knocking him the fuck out. Let's not forget, Tarver was Roy's mandatory but Roy chose to go up to face Ruiz first instead - after virtually making a career out of disposing of his mandatories for years. He could have faced Tarver first and then gone up to face Ruiz, but he chose to do it that way.

Roy didn't look great in that first Tarver fight but he didn't look washed up. He didn't look up washed up in the first round of their rematch either. His next fight, when he fought Glen Johnson, Roy was completely washed up.

What Tarver did to Roy Jones can never be taken away. Roy was perceived as unbeatable. Tarver mocked him, asked him if he had any excuses, then blasted him. The special effects in "Star Wars" look like crap now when compared to the technology we see in films today. Doesn't change the fact that when it came out it changed the world.
neophyte7
Excellent Tarver and Roy analysis.. Roy seemed to fear Tarver... before their first and second bouts he seemed to have terror in his eyes when they came up for questioning... Bottom line Tarver tamed a legend.. busted his ass and sent him into doldrums of boxing mediocrity. Add that to go along with quality wins over some solid opponents--- hehad a good career...
JLUVBABY
QUOTE (Big Slim Sweet @ Apr 11 2011, 11:45 AM) *
That's not a fact though J, it's your opinion, and while I can respect it the fact is we'll never really know. Maybe dropping the weight killed Roy's prime. Maybe getting clocked by Tarver in the rematch snatched his confidence and killed his prime. Maybe he was just getting old and something like that was bound to happen sooner or later anyway. More than likely, IMO, it was a combination of the three. Roy was getting on in years, he messed with his weight which accelerated his decline, and then he got smoked and lost his aura of invincibility which cemented his status as a once great now over the hill.

No one can question that Tarver was the beneficiary of some fortunate circumstances, but he also made those circumstances what they were - goading Roy into a fight and then knocking him the fuck out. Let's not forget, Tarver was Roy's mandatory but Roy chose to go up to face Ruiz first instead - after virtually making a career out of disposing of his mandatories for years. He could have faced Tarver first and then gone up to face Ruiz, but he chose to do it that way.

Roy didn't look great in that first Tarver fight but he didn't look washed up. He didn't look up washed up in the first round of their rematch either. His next fight, when he fought Glen Johnson, Roy was completely washed up.

What Tarver did to Roy Jones can never be taken away. Roy was perceived as unbeatable. Tarver mocked him, asked him if he had any excuses, then blasted him. The special effects in "Star Wars" look like crap now when compared to the technology we see in films today. Doesn't change the fact that when it came out it changed the world.


i feel what you are saying... but in my mind... i will always feel that heavy muscle loss so fast killed what ever prime roy had left... you could look at his body definition and it was not the same.. he looked drained and in a way older... not tryingto make an excuse for him but i just think thats what it was... same thing can be said for tarver.. he experienced the same heavy weight loss issues after blowing up to 220 for the rocky movie then cutting hte weight to move back down... i dont think he was ever the same either... they both should have stayed heavyweights... specially roy and cashed out on his win over ruiz.. he wouldnt have to fight now had he...

with that said i feel roy was declining in the first tarver fight that i actually thought he won very very close... i never felt he should have taken that rematch tho you can make the argument that tho he loss he actually put it together for that 1st round and most of the second till the ko... but thats neither here nor there... he was already declining... i think what he displayed those 1 and a half rounds or how long it was rounds was his last hoorah of skill set and tarver ended it... truth is he was going in the direction of any ordinary fighter being able to beat him... as tarver was very ordinary.. actually eric harding was a superior fighter to him as he showed in the first fight and his fight with a prime lt heavy roy jones.. i look at tarver and i ask myself could tarver have beaten roy pre ruiz... my answer to that is hell no... therefore tarver gets a pass i suppose for that win but he gets it on a technocality.... in a lot of ways he is a lt heavy buster douglas as he never really did much since... i could go on and on bout tarver tho i really dont like him as a fighter... lol.
Big Slim Sweet
You can definitely compare Tarver beating Roy to Buster beating Tyson. For me, no two moments in my boxing lifetime compare as far as that all out HOLY SHIT.

Outside of those two moments however, Tarver's career definitely outshines Buster's. Douglas really didn't have any other wins of note, while Tarver beat a bunch of B-B+ guys (Griffin, Harding, Glen Johnson, Reggie Johnson, Woods). Douglas truly was a one-hit wonder. Tarver has had a solid workmanlike career highlighted by one incredible moment.
Big Slim Sweet
And I agree Roy's face looked different - and older kinda - in that first fight with Tarver. In the rematch though I thought he looked like himself again.
JLUVBABY
QUOTE (Big Slim Sweet @ Apr 11 2011, 11:21 PM) *
You can definitely compare Tarver beating Roy to Buster beating Tyson. For me, no two moments in my boxing lifetime compare as far as that all out HOLY SHIT.

Outside of those two moments however, Tarver's career definitely outshines Buster's. Douglas really didn't have any other wins of note, while Tarver beat a bunch of B-B+ guys (Griffin, Harding, Glen Johnson, Reggie Johnson, Woods). Douglas truly was a one-hit wonder. Tarver has had a solid workmanlike career highlighted by one incredible moment.


if you look back at his career... tarver was the king of rematches... he usually lost the first match to most of those guys... i just dont see tarver the way he sees himself.. lol... i ant like the guy as a fighter... hard for me to give him much credit and i actually have tried to...
JLUVBABY
QUOTE (Big Slim Sweet @ Apr 11 2011, 11:24 PM) *
And I agree Roy's face looked different - and older kinda - in that first fight with Tarver. In the rematch though I thought he looked like himself again.


ali looked in phenominal shape when he fought holmes too... looking in shape and being in shape is two different things... lol....
True-Boxing-Fan
QUOTE (JLUVBABY @ Apr 11 2011, 10:40 PM) *
ali looked in phenominal shape when he fought holmes too... looking in shape and being in shape is two different things... lol....

Ali looked in phenomial shape? Are you kidding me? Ali was begining to show signs of parkinson. Plus during his training for that fight he was getting beat up by his sparring partners and he was slow as hell. You ar right about looking in shape and being in shape are two different things. But ALi did not look like he was in phenomial shape.
JLUVBABY
QUOTE (True-Boxing-Fan @ Apr 12 2011, 11:54 AM) *
Ali looked in phenomial shape? Are you kidding me? Ali was begining to show signs of parkinson. Plus during his training for that fight he was getting beat up by his sparring partners and he was slow as hell. You ar right about looking in shape and being in shape are two different things. But ALi did not look like he was in phenomial shape.


ali got himself to the lightest weight he had been in years... im fully aware of his physical condition he was in internally... but his outward appearance looked like that of a man that turned back the clock... he bamboozled a lot of people into thinking he actually had a chance in that fight... thats why i said looking and being is two different things...
True-Boxing-Fan
QUOTE (JLUVBABY @ Apr 12 2011, 10:36 AM) *
he bamboozled a lot of people into thinking he actually had a chance in that fight... thats why i said looking and being is two different things...

He didn't bamboozle that many people. There were many people fearing for him in that fight with Holmes. I think the only peoplewho believed in him in that fight were Ali and his camp and his camp prolly had some reservation but didnt say anything because he was Ali. But yea being I shape and looking it are two different things Ali may have been his lightest in years at that time but he looked far from from being the Ali we all know
Mean Mister Mustard
I do think the weight loss affected Jones in the first Tarver fight, but in the second he looked in very good shape. Like Slim said, he dominated the 1st round and was on his way to winning the 2nd one too. The Johnson fight was just him being in with a strong determined fighter who was conditioned to fight all 12 rounds and take shots all night. In my eyes, the Jones fight was the best performance of Glen's career and it would have taken a prime Jones, who was willing to let his hands go more, to be able to beat him.
JLUVBABY
QUOTE (True-Boxing-Fan @ Apr 12 2011, 12:51 PM) *
He didn't bamboozle that many people. There were many people fearing for him in that fight with Holmes. I think the only peoplewho believed in him in that fight were Ali and his camp and his camp prolly had some reservation but didnt say anything because he was Ali. But yea being I shape and looking it are two different things Ali may have been his lightest in years at that time but he looked far from from being the Ali we all know


i was a kid at the time... i remember the fight tho.... i can vaguely recall people giving ali a shot... just watched a documentary on the fight on espn classic called 30 30 where fans where giving ali a shot in the fight.... there where other fight people that where totally against the fight but a lot of fans gave ali a fare chance in the fight.. there was some good money put on ali on the books... it was a pretty good con job making that fight...
Big Slim Sweet
Riddick Bowe in the Golota rematch is another example. He finally shed those love handles and got down to his lightest weight since the first fight with Evander. But he had nothing left in the tank.

I still say Roy was close to the real Roy when Tarver detonated him however.
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (Big Slim Sweet @ Apr 12 2011, 05:46 PM) *
Riddick Bowe in the Golota rematch is another example. He finally shed those love handles and got down to his lightest weight since the first fight with Evander. But he had nothing left in the tank.

I still say Roy was close to the real Roy when Tarver detonated him however.


I'm probably in the minority (but then I usually am, haha) who would argue that Roy's move to HW was kinda prompted by Tarver rising up the ranks at LHW. That way he killed 2 birds with one stone. Got that elusive HW strap and avoided Tarver except Tarver then punked him at the post fight press conference.

For some reason I think even before moving up Roy just never in his head liked the Tarver fight. I believe sometimes fighters, even the great ones, can get a hoodoo or bad vibe about a certain fight or opponent. Not saying he was scared of him, but I think Tarver was a fight Roy prefrred to miss. And trust me I loathe saying that because I fucken can't stand Tarver.

Just a hunch.
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