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Full Version: List your Top 10 Greatest Mexican fighters of all time
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FinitoElDinamita
1. Chavez

2. Sanchez

3. Finito Lopez

4. Eric Morales

5. Juan Manuel Marquez ( Ranking can change after retirement )

6. Barrera

7. Ruben Olivares

8. Carlos Zarate

9. Oscar Delahoya

10. Vicente saldivar

What could have been: Jose Luis Lopez
salvador
I'll go with Sanchez and Morales with too many more as honorable mention.

On a side note, you really consider DLH a Mexican? Even after the Tito fight? I mean, he was definitely Mexican in the Quartey fight and he tried to be a Mexican in the Hopkins fight, but Floyd Sr. confused the shit out of him and turned a perfectly acceptable Mexican brawler into a very confused American boxer.

FinitoElDinamita
QUOTE (salvador @ May 19 2011, 04:11 PM) *
I'll go with Sanchez and Morales with too many more as honorable mention.

On a side note, you really consider DLH a Mexican? Even after the Tito fight? I mean, he was definitely Mexican in the Quartey fight and he tried to be a Mexican in the Hopkins fight, but Floyd Sr. confused the shit out of him and turned a perfectly acceptable Mexican brawler into a very confused American boxer.


I understand your disappointed regarding the Tito fight but that one event doesn't define who Oscar is as a fighter. He may not be the stereotypical Mexican fighter but that doesn't mean we can count him out when mentioning the Mexican greats.He was a smart, versaile fighter who has fought everybody and showed plenty of warrior spririt in many of his fights. Even against Vargas who accused him of not being " mexican enough" ... Oscar finished him like a true Mexican would..

Oscar is an underrated warrior.
salvador
QUOTE (FinitoElDinamita @ May 19 2011, 06:25 PM) *
I understand your disappointed regarding the Tito fight but that one event doesn't define who Oscar is as a fighter. He may not be the stereotypical Mexican fighter but that doesn't mean we can count him out when mentioning the Mexican greats.He was a smart, versaile fighter who has fought everybody and showed plenty of warrior spririt in many of his fights. Even against Vargas who accused him of not being " mexican enough" ... Oscar finished him like a true Mexican would..

Oscar is an underrated warrior.


Nobody's underrating DLH. And obviously after the Quartey fight (and really, the Rueles fight) DLH has never had to explain himself to anyone, ever. Maybe if he looked more like Chris Arreola and less like Mischa Barton I could give him the benefit of the doubt, but I just can't consider him a Mexican at this point in time.

I'm kidding, of course. Welcome to the board.
FinitoElDinamita
QUOTE (salvador @ May 19 2011, 04:35 PM) *
Nobody's underrating DLH. And obviously after the Quartey fight (and really, the Rueles fight) DLH has never had to explain himself to anyone, ever. Maybe if he looked more like Chris Arreola and less like Mischa Barton I could give him the benefit of the doubt, but I just can't consider him a Mexican at this point in time.

I'm kidding, of course. Welcome to the board.


Thanks for having me aboard.. But what does it take to be a Mexican fighter?
kidbazooka1
1. Chavez-no question about that.

2. Sanchez

3.Morales

4.Olivarez

5.Marquez

6.lopez

7.Barrera

8.Zarate

9.saldivar

Any Latino could tell you Roberto Duran is the greatest latino fighter of all time but Many forget Roberto Duran is also half Mexican from his fathers side.
salvador
QUOTE (kidbazooka1 @ May 19 2011, 08:52 PM) *
Any Latino could tell you Roberto Duran is the greatest latino fighter of all time but Many forget Roberto Duran is also half Mexican from his fathers side.


Bitchin' factoid.
salvador
QUOTE (FinitoElDinamita @ May 19 2011, 07:10 PM) *
Thanks for having me aboard.. But what does it take to be a Mexican fighter?


Fight exactly like Erik Morales and Marco Antonio Barrera in their first fight or die trying.
FinitoElDinamita
QUOTE (salvador @ May 19 2011, 08:37 PM) *
Fight exactly like Erik Morales and Marco Antonio Barrera in their first fight or die trying.


I know you're just jokin.. Miguel Canto who's a defensive genius is also regarded as one of the best Mexicans to ever lace em up even though he wasn't a banger.
BigG
Salvador Sanchez
Julio Cesar Chavez
Erik Morales
Ricardo Lopez
Rubin Olivares
Juan Manuel Marquez
Marco Antonio Barrera
Miguel Canto
Carlos Zarate
Vincente Salvidar
kidbazooka1
Miguel Canto was a helluva boxer like mentioned he didn't carry much pop but his skill was superb.
SmartyBeardo
Ricardo Lopez
JCC
Salvador Sanchez
Jose Luis Ramirez
JMM
Ruben Olivares
Vincente Salvidar
Marco Antonio Barrera
Erik Morales
Jorge Arce
salvador
QUOTE (FinitoElDinamita @ May 20 2011, 01:29 AM) *
I know you're just jokin.. Miguel Canto who's a defensive genius is also regarded as one of the best Mexicans to ever lace em up even though he wasn't a banger.


Defensive Mexican boxers are about as interesting as Justin Timberlake's backup dancers, but if that's what you like......
Nay_Sayer
QUOTE (FinitoElDinamita @ May 19 2011, 06:25 PM) *
I understand your disappointed regarding the Tito fight but that one event doesn't define who Oscar is as a fighter.


How is that?

The biggest fight of his career and he puts on track shoes and does his best Jesse Owens impersonation for the last three rounds.

And what happened to the rematch?

Oscar still hasn't found the cojones to get back in the ring with Trinidad...
FinitoElDinamita
QUOTE (Nay_Sayer @ May 20 2011, 08:59 AM) *
How is that?

The biggest fight of his career and he puts on track shoes and does his best Jesse Owens impersonation for the last three rounds.

And what happened to the rematch?

Oscar still hasn't found the cojones to get back in the ring with Trinidad...


nea.gif huh? lolz I dont know how long you've been watching Boxing but Oscar was on a mad hunt for a Tito rematch from 00--05. He even flew out to Puerto Rico on numerous occasions to persuade Tito for a rematch but it never happened..

How can you blame Tito though? He got schooled and was made to look like a fool for 9 rounds..

Rematch would have been no different. Oscar would have learned his lesson and beat him decisively over 12 rounds.. He wouldnt have ran..
FinitoElDinamita
QUOTE (salvador @ May 20 2011, 08:04 AM) *
Defensive Mexican boxers are about as interesting as Justin Timberlake's backup dancers, but if that's what you like......


If backyard brawls float your boat, you can try watching an old show called Thunderbox, a toughman competition... Youll see a bunch of Gattis and the Mickey Wards, guys that swing without thinking....

Boxing is an art and there's a reason why we call it the Sweet science.. So what if Canto was a defensive fighter? if his defensive nature makes him less of a mexican, that's pretty silly..

This is a new day in age and even Mexican fighters are elevating their game.. That face-first mentality is a thing of the past... They're getting alot smarter now..

Hit without getting hit is the name of the game... BUt it's cool if you're into the Mayorgas, Ponce Deleons, Urangos and the Maidanas of the world... Personally, for me, those type of fighters bore me to death...
salvador
QUOTE (FinitoElDinamita @ May 20 2011, 12:26 PM) *
If backyard brawls float your boat, you can try watching an old show called Thunderbox, a toughman competition... Youll see a bunch of Gattis and the Mickey Wards, guys that swing without thinking....

Boxing is an art and there's a reason why we call it the Sweet science.. So what if Canto was a defensive fighter? if his defensive nature makes him less of a mexican, that's pretty silly..

This is a new day in age and even Mexican fighters are elevating their game.. That face-first mentality is a thing of the past... They're getting alot smarter now..

Hit without getting hit is the name of the game... BUt it's cool if you're into the Mayorgas, Ponce Deleons, Urangos and the Maidanas of the world... Personally, for me, those type of fighters bore me to death...


Risk floats my boat because risk leads to drama, and drama is exciting. I love every one of the fighters you named above and I've never watched a toughman contest or thunderbox. Hitting and not getting hit is ok if you're knocking your guy out doing it or at least abusing him. But if hitting and not getting hit is how you would describe Floyd-Baldomir and you would rate that performance as "great" because Floyd won every round, then we like boxing for different reasons.

It's machismo - the same spirit that causes some bullfighters to take absurd life threatening risks in the ring is what separates Mexican fighters from all other ethnicities. (I once saw a bullfighter in Monterrey put his hands behind his back and kiss a tired, but still very alive, bull's forehead.) It's what makes Mexican fighters special. And Salvador Sanchez was a great and intelligent fighter with very solid defense and less power than most of the very top guys and yet he was as Mexican as Pancho Villa in the ring.
The CEO
QUOTE (salvador @ May 20 2011, 06:03 PM) *
Risk floats my boat because risk leads to drama, and drama is exciting. I love every one of the fighters you named above and I've never watched a toughman contest or thunderbox. Hitting and not getting hit is ok if you're knocking your guy out doing it or at least abusing him. But if hitting and not getting hit is how you would describe Floyd-Baldomir and you would rate that performance as "great" because Floyd won every round, then we like boxing for different reasons.

It's machismo - the same spirit that causes some bullfighters to take absurd life threatening risks in the ring is what makes Mexican fighters have above all other ethnicities. (I once saw a bullfighter in Monterrey put his hands behind his back and kiss a tired, but still very alive, bull's forehead.) It's what makes Mexican fighters special. And Salvador Sanchez was a great and intelligent fighter with very solid defense and less power than most of the very top guys and yet he was as Mexican as Pancho Villa in the ring.


laugh.gif

Good stuff...

I'm not the most well versed on the pantheon of Mexican Legends...but I can tell you this...I've appreciated the Hell outta most of 'em...

Same goes for the Puerto Rican Greats (oh no!...lol)...I used to study Wilfred Benitez when I was a kid...I thought he was Boxing perfection.


Chavez may arguably be the greatest due to his record and resume...but I personally prefer Lopez, Marquez, Barrera, Morales, and Sanchez over him...I was never that high on Chavez, Bazooka...sorry...lol


P.S.~ De La Hoya was an American boxer of Mexican descent, just like Donaire is an American of Filipino descent...that's their appropriate classification.
kidbazooka1
QUOTE (The CEO @ May 20 2011, 05:40 PM) *
Chavez may arguably be the greatest due to his record and resume...but I personally prefer Lopez, Marquez, Barrera, Morales, and Sanchez over him...I was never that high on Chavez, Bazooka...sorry...lol


Chavez was moslty remembered as a tough always coming forward fighter with heavy hands and an iron chin but at his absolute best he could box when he wanted and play defense beautifully. As he begna to age and go up in weight he relied more on his punch and chin but when he fought at 130 and 135lb he was a complete fighting machine.

It's shame that most casual fans and youngsters only remember him from his DLH lose and his Whitaker fight.

Chavez wasn't the best mexcian fighter ever just because he fought hard. At his best the guy had it all.
BigG
Salvador Sanchez IMO would have been on his way to being mentioned with Sugar Ray Robinson and Henry Armstrong and possibly would bave surpassed Leonard, Hearns, Hagler, as the BEST fighter of the 80's had he not died. He's in my top 10 or top 15 greats of all time.
kidbazooka1
QUOTE (BigG @ May 20 2011, 10:19 PM) *
Salvador Sanchez IMO would have been on his way to being mentioned with Sugar Ray Robinson and Henry Armstrong and possibly would bave surpassed Leonard, Hearns, Hagler, as the BEST fighter of the 80's had he not died. He's in my top 10 or top 15 greats of all time.


Many writers have felt the same about Sanchez.

I remember one writer going as far as saying that had Sanchez not died he could have been in his opinion arguably the second greatest fighter of all time behind Robinson. who knows how far he really could have gone but for such a short career and passing at the tender age of 23 he sure did acomplish alot so i could see why many would believe that he could have been in the top 3 GOAT had he not died,

SmartyBeardo
I thought Ramirez did enough to get the decision v Arguello in this fight -

damn vid won't connect. Oh well, you will have to go fetch it yourselves -

www.youtube.com/watch?v=WX74WdsJsqk&feature=related


One of my favorite fights of all time -




Jose Luis Ramirez is best known for who he lost to - Olivares, Arguello, Rosario, Mancini, Camacho, JCC, Sweet Pea, Coggi. Koed just once v Olivares. Revenged v Rosario. Got the controversial decision v Sweet Pea in their first fight (in France). Suspected of being made an offer he could not refuse to throw his fight v Mancini.

To me, Ramirez was the consummate Mexican warrior.
Nay_Sayer
QUOTE (FinitoElDinamita @ May 20 2011, 12:20 PM) *
nea.gif huh? lolz I dont know how long you've been watching Boxing but Oscar was on a mad hunt for a Tito rematch from 00--05. He even flew out to Puerto Rico on numerous occasions to persuade Tito for a rematch but it never happened..

How can you blame Tito though? He got schooled and was made to look like a fool for 9 rounds..

Rematch would have been no different. Oscar would have learned his lesson and beat him decisively over 12 rounds.. He wouldnt have ran..


Immediately after the Oscar Tito fight, Trinidad would rip through the 154lb division and claim a 160lb belt. Until running into Hopkins, he looked unstoppable. Oscar wanted NO parts of a Trinidad rematch. Especially at a higher weight.
FinitoElDinamita
Let me ask you guys something. The other day I was chatting with some guys at the gym and they kept arguing that Olivares is the greatest Mexican fighter of all times. IT's a matter of opinion so nobody is right or wrong but of all my years in boxing, ive rarely seen people putting Olivares that high...

What exactly did he do that makes him any higher than Chavez and Sanchez?????? This is unbelievable to me..
kidbazooka1
QUOTE (FinitoElDinamita @ May 23 2011, 10:57 PM) *
Let me ask you guys something. The other day I was chatting with some guys at the gym and they kept arguing that Olivares is the greatest Mexican fighter of all times. IT's a matter of opinion so nobody is right or wrong but of all my years in boxing, ive rarely seen people putting Olivares that high...

What exactly did he do that makes him any higher than Chavez and Sanchez?????? This is unbelievable to me..


Im a big fan of Olivarez but he was not greater than Chavez or Sanchez. I do believe Oliavrez wasted alot of his prime years partying had he been more discipline he probably could have accomplished more but he suffered alot of losses because of that.

Olivarez was great no doubt about it but Chavez and Sanchez were special fighters the cream of the crop in mexican boxing.
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