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HazConvictedFelonMane
Manny Pacquiao is the single-most biggest con job that sports media has ever embarked on. Starting from Oscar De La Hoya, Manny Pacquiao has recieved so much unwarranted accolades that it is truly amazing. The media can spin a fighter into whatever they work hard enough to spin him into.
Oscar De La Hoya fought 2 generations of Mayweathers. He fought Uncle Jeff and Nephew Floyd. Oscar De La Hoya was so far over the hill when he lost to Manny Pacquiao that it is a complete shame. I find it outlandish that a fighter can be dubbed the P4P KING because he beat up on a fighter that was singled out by Freddie Roach, as being a perfect opponent. Roach's own words were Oscar's last 2 fights weren't 'that great'. This is a trainer that seeks the easiest fights for his fighter to be involved in.
Ricky Hatton had a gift wrapped home cooked decision against Juan Luzcano in Manchester. That fight showed us all that Ricky Hatton was severely flawed and could be exploited because of his come forward style. That combined wit the fact that he couldn't take a good punch, made for an easy decision to take that fight.
Miguel Cotto was badly damaged after his fateful night in Vegas against loaded gloves. Cotto's tough night in MSG against Clottey showed us all that he was having issues with his mental toughness, as well as his ability to take a punch. That was an easy choice for Manny's advisory board. Take the fight with Cotto instead of taking the fight with Shane Mosley. We all saw that video where Freddie Roach admitted to trying to use a catch weight as a weapon against a solid fighter with some power behind his punch.
Quite simply put, Manny Pacquiao had reached the height of his P4P run and there was no other acceptable direction to go besides to step up to either of the 2 welterweight fighters in FMJ and SSM. He failed to capitalize on his shot to cement his legacy forever. Since then, Manny has showed us his reluctance to embark on a fight that would be considered highly dramatic with world title and pound for pound implications. He has failed to undertake a unification match with any of the other welterweight title holders. He has failed to show us why he's considered the P4P KING. The only thing he has proven, is that he and his team are comfortable with taking on the easiest fights they can possibly get their hands on. Any fight that would be considered a 'good fight' is a fight that Manny has passed up on over and over again since Nov. 2009. The media has created this mythical persona of a brave warrior who fights for the fans, yet all I see is an oppurtunistic pack of wolves that prey on the weak, weary, and wounded. Manny Pacquiao is the best fighter that Top Rank has to offer, but as far as the world is concerned.....NOT HARDLY. The media can say that you're the best. The fans can say it as well, but at some point, he has to prove it. I'm waiting.
HazConvictedFelonMane
Everyone can cry all at once, or one at a time. Please don't spare me the usual responses laced with racially charged comments, homophobic slurs, and the ignorance associated with being a complete idiot. I've raised plenty of hell on the comment boards, now I'm going to take it a bit further and invade the forums. Please don't hate me because I'm telling it like it is. You guys that are blinded by the allure of a cherry picker and a potential drug cheat, can cry me a fucking lake. Have a wonderful day and I look forward to breaking all of your hearts in the future.
Seek
QUOTE (HazConvictedFelonMane @ May 28 2011, 10:06 AM) *
Everyone can cry all at once, or one at a time. Please don't spare me the usual responses laced with racially charged comments, homophobic slurs, and the ignorance associated with being a complete idiot. I've raised plenty of hell on the comment boards, now I'm going to take it a bit further and invade the forums. Please don't hate me because I'm telling it like it is. You guys that are blinded by the allure of a cherry picker and a potential drug cheat, can cry me a fucking lake. Have a wonderful day and I look forward to breaking all of your hearts in the future.


This is gonna be good! Do it up brother
RyanA
100% truth

http://www.fox5sandiego.com/community/blog...,3242452.column

caneman
QUOTE (HazConvictedFelonMane @ May 28 2011, 09:58 AM) *
Manny Pacquiao is the single-most biggest con job that sports media has ever embarked on. Starting from Oscar De La Hoya, Manny Pacquiao has recieved so much unwarranted accolades that it is truly amazing. The media can spin a fighter into whatever they work hard enough to spin him into.
Oscar De La Hoya fought 2 generations of Mayweathers. He fought Uncle Jeff and Nephew Floyd. Oscar De La Hoya was so far over the hill when he lost to Manny Pacquiao that it is a complete shame. I find it outlandish that a fighter can be dubbed the P4P KING because he beat up on a fighter that was singled out by Freddie Roach, as being a perfect opponent. Roach's own words were Oscar's last 2 fights weren't 'that great'. This is a trainer that seeks the easiest fights for his fighter to be involved in.
Ricky Hatton had a gift wrapped home cooked decision against Juan Luzcano in Manchester. That fight showed us all that Ricky Hatton was severely flawed and could be exploited because of his come forward style. That combined wit the fact that he couldn't take a good punch, made for an easy decision to take that fight.
Miguel Cotto was badly damaged after his fateful night in Vegas against loaded gloves. Cotto's tough night in MSG against Clottey showed us all that he was having issues with his mental toughness, as well as his ability to take a punch. That was an easy choice for Manny's advisory board. Take the fight with Cotto instead of taking the fight with Shane Mosley. We all saw that video where Freddie Roach admitted to trying to use a catch weight as a weapon against a solid fighter with some power behind his punch.
Quite simply put, Manny Pacquiao had reached the height of his P4P run and there was no other acceptable direction to go besides to step up to either of the 2 welterweight fighters in FMJ and SSM. He failed to capitalize on his shot to cement his legacy forever. Since then, Manny has showed us his reluctance to embark on a fight that would be considered highly dramatic with world title and pound for pound implications. He has failed to undertake a unification match with any of the other welterweight title holders. He has failed to show us why he's considered the P4P KING. The only thing he has proven, is that he and his team are comfortable with taking on the easiest fights they can possibly get their hands on. Any fight that would be considered a 'good fight' is a fight that Manny has passed up on over and over again since Nov. 2009. The media has created this mythical persona of a brave warrior who fights for the fans, yet all I see is an oppurtunistic pack of wolves that prey on the weak, weary, and wounded. Manny Pacquiao is the best fighter that Top Rank has to offer, but as far as the world is concerned.....NOT HARDLY. The media can say that you're the best. The fans can say it as well, but at some point, he has to prove it. I'm waiting.

No hate but get your copy of Tiger Beat today! I still am trying to figure out whose whose worse Pactards or Mayweather nut mites and while It's probably Pactards, it's only cause he has more fans! Oh well we wanted more action on the boards, too bad all we are getting is a bunch of bullshit spam all over the forums! Just saying, fuck
blackbelt2003
QUOTE (HazConvictedFelonMane @ May 28 2011, 03:58 PM) *
Manny Pacquiao is the single-most biggest con job that sports media has ever embarked on. Starting from Oscar De La Hoya, Manny Pacquiao has recieved so much unwarranted accolades that it is truly amazing. The media can spin a fighter into whatever they work hard enough to spin him into.
Oscar De La Hoya fought 2 generations of Mayweathers. He fought Uncle Jeff and Nephew Floyd. Oscar De La Hoya was so far over the hill when he lost to Manny Pacquiao that it is a complete shame. I find it outlandish that a fighter can be dubbed the P4P KING because he beat up on a fighter that was singled out by Freddie Roach, as being a perfect opponent. Roach's own words were Oscar's last 2 fights weren't 'that great'. This is a trainer that seeks the easiest fights for his fighter to be involved in.
Ricky Hatton had a gift wrapped home cooked decision against Juan Luzcano in Manchester. That fight showed us all that Ricky Hatton was severely flawed and could be exploited because of his come forward style. That combined wit the fact that he couldn't take a good punch, made for an easy decision to take that fight.
Miguel Cotto was badly damaged after his fateful night in Vegas against loaded gloves. Cotto's tough night in MSG against Clottey showed us all that he was having issues with his mental toughness, as well as his ability to take a punch. That was an easy choice for Manny's advisory board. Take the fight with Cotto instead of taking the fight with Shane Mosley. We all saw that video where Freddie Roach admitted to trying to use a catch weight as a weapon against a solid fighter with some power behind his punch.
Quite simply put, Manny Pacquiao had reached the height of his P4P run and there was no other acceptable direction to go besides to step up to either of the 2 welterweight fighters in FMJ and SSM. He failed to capitalize on his shot to cement his legacy forever. Since then, Manny has showed us his reluctance to embark on a fight that would be considered highly dramatic with world title and pound for pound implications. He has failed to undertake a unification match with any of the other welterweight title holders. He has failed to show us why he's considered the P4P KING. The only thing he has proven, is that he and his team are comfortable with taking on the easiest fights they can possibly get their hands on. Any fight that would be considered a 'good fight' is a fight that Manny has passed up on over and over again since Nov. 2009. The media has created this mythical persona of a brave warrior who fights for the fans, yet all I see is an oppurtunistic pack of wolves that prey on the weak, weary, and wounded. Manny Pacquiao is the best fighter that Top Rank has to offer, but as far as the world is concerned.....NOT HARDLY. The media can say that you're the best. The fans can say it as well, but at some point, he has to prove it. I'm waiting.



OK, where to start? One...I'm a fan of neither Pac or Mayweather. I hope they both fight each other and destory each other with a double KO.

Two...not sure how DLH could have been so competitive with Floyd yet so shot with Pac just TWO fights later. Weight drained? Yes. Shot? No. Same with Hatton.

Three...saying Hatton got a gift decision against Lazcano is lunacy. Did ANYONE else score it for Lazcano? I don't think even Lazcano scored it for himself. Yes, he gave Ricky a hard fight, but c'mon...be objective here.

Four...aside from Mosley...which welterweight would you like Manny to have faced? And don't say Mayweather, for obvious reasons.

Manny Pacquiao is a great fighter. An ATG, smoke and mirrors or no smoke and mirrors. Him and Floyd fail to quite live up to past ATG's legacies because of their politicking and fight schedules...but they are both great fighters. Which one is greatest? Whatever the bullshit, even Pactards and May-niacs can't even predict that until they grow a pair and get it on in the ring.



Black
JONdaCON817
Lol...... good shyt cuhz... can't wait to see the response, if they decide to show. Lmao.
HazConvictedFelonMane
QUOTE (RyanA @ May 28 2011, 11:33 AM) *


Great Article. I haven't read it in full yet, but I can tell by the title that it's something that I'd be interested in reading. I'm glad to see that some people have the same summation that I have. I'm no journalist or anything, I'm just a boxing fan with a brain.
caneman
QUOTE (blackbelt2003 @ May 28 2011, 10:52 AM) *
OK, where to start? One...I'm a fan of neither Pac or Mayweather. I hope they both fight each other and destory each other with a double KO.

Two...not sure how DLH could have been so competitive with Floyd yet so shot with Pac just TWO fights later. Weight drained? Yes. Shot? No. Same with Hatton.

Three...saying Hatton got a gift decision against Lazcano is lunacy. Did ANYONE else score it for Lazcano? I don't think even Lazcano scored it for himself. Yes, he gave Ricky a hard fight, but c'mon...be objective here.

Four...aside from Mosley...which welterweight would you like Manny to have faced? And don't say Mayweather, for obvious reasons.

Manny Pacquiao is a great fighter. An ATG, smoke and mirrors or no smoke and mirrors. Him and Floyd fail to quite live up to past ATG's legacies because of their politicking and fight schedules...but they are both great fighters. Which one is greatest? Whatever the bullshit, even Pactards and May-niacs can't even predict that until they grow a pair and get it on in the ring.



Black



Good post and I guess a better way of doing so then I but most of these guys are just trolling now and I beat if it was really checked out, some of these guys have more than 1 account!
HazConvictedFelonMane
QUOTE (blackbelt2003 @ May 28 2011, 11:52 AM) *
OK, where to start? One...I'm a fan of neither Pac or Mayweather. I hope they both fight each other and destory each other with a double KO.

Two...not sure how DLH could have been so competitive with Floyd yet so shot with Pac just TWO fights later. Weight drained? Yes. Shot? No. Same with Hatton.

Three...saying Hatton got a gift decision against Lazcano is lunacy. Did ANYONE else score it for Lazcano? I don't think even Lazcano scored it for himself. Yes, he gave Ricky a hard fight, but c'mon...be objective here.

Four...aside from Mosley...which welterweight would you like Manny to have faced? And don't say Mayweather, for obvious reasons.

Manny Pacquiao is a great fighter. An ATG, smoke and mirrors or no smoke and mirrors. Him and Floyd fail to quite live up to past ATG's legacies because of their politicking and fight schedules...but they are both great fighters. Which one is greatest? Whatever the bullshit, even Pactards and May-niacs can't even predict that until they grow a pair and get it on in the ring.



Black


Andre Berto before the loss to Ortiz. He may not be the best or the most marketable, but he was a title holder at 147, he was undefeated, he's young, strong, fast, and he would've put up much more of a fight than Shane did. Now that Victor Ortiz has unseated Berto, try him on for size. Timothy Bradley called Manny Pacquiao out at 147. Bob Arum said that he's not willing to give a fighter a 'free ride to superstardom on Manny's back'. That means that he's unwilling to pu Manny in there with someone that has the potential to unseat the so-called king. Bob Arum had mentioned both Berto and Bradley after Manny fought Margarito. After Berto KO'd Hernandez in 1 round, Bob went on to say that Mosley makes the most business sense. He sure did make the most sense. The one that will put up the least amount of resistance with maximum financial gain. I get it and it makes sense. It's just cancerous to the sport that thrives off of my hard earned money. At least make me feel like I'm not getting conned out of my money. They're not even making an attempt to make it appear that way. This is who we're going to fight like it or not. We saw all of Mosley's fights. Vargas, Mayorga, Cotto, Collazo, Margarito, Mayweather, and Mora. We knew what Shane brought to the table. It wasn't what they were hyping it up to be. We knew that fight was going to be a disappointment from the day it was signed. If there's no one out there to fight, do what Floyd's doing until it's time to make a move. Fighting 2 bums a year doesn't make you the best in the sport.
kodakbyd
QUOTE (SmartyBeardo @ May 28 2011, 01:33 PM) *
You remind me of Dusty the Organ Grinder . . . your shit is so old the mold done died.


Its hard to ignore race because it plays such a huge factor. Alot of black fight fans are highly critical of Pacquiao and its a case of reverse racism as commented by Coltrane from GYGB. If Manny was black alot of you would be praising him instead of criticizing him. I'm a fan of Pacquiao but I ain't no Pactard. The fact is Manny has pretty much fought all there is at welterweight. I will admit he has fought past their prime fighter but that all there is right now. Unlike Mayweather when he was active there was an abundance of fighters in their prime Cotto, Margarito, Mosley etc instead he chose to fight Baldimir and Judah after a loss. But I don't hear you guys complaining about that. Now you want Manny to fight Martinez, come on Pacquiao's body frame is a lightweight at most. People seem to forget this guy has already moved up, its not like he was a lifelong welterweight. I bet you if these fights we competitive you guys wouldn't be saying anything. Its really not his fault he blowing them away. The worst part about all this is fools are coming up with conspiracy theories about how these fights are fixed. Come on people get real this is the modern era where theres too much money involved to even risk getting caught
Snoop
QUOTE (kodakbyd @ May 28 2011, 08:25 PM) *
Its hard to ignore race because it plays such a huge factor. Alot of black fight fans are highly critical of Pacquiao and its a case of reverse racism as commented by Coltrane from GYGB. If Manny was black alot of you would be praising him instead of criticizing him. I'm a fan of Pacquiao but I ain't no Pactard. The fact is Manny has pretty much fought all there is at welterweight. I will admit he has fought past their prime fighter but that all there is right now. Unlike Mayweather when he was active there was an abundance of fighters in their prime Cotto, Margarito, Mosley etc instead he chose to fight Baldimir and Judah after a loss. But I don't hear you guys complaining about that. Now you want Manny to fight Martinez, come on Pacquiao's body frame is a lightweight at most. People seem to forget this guy has already moved up, its not like he was a lifelong welterweight. I bet you if these fights we competitive you guys wouldn't be saying anything. Its really not his fault he blowing them away. The worst part about all this is fools are coming up with conspiracy theories about how these fights are fixed. Come on people get real this is the modern era where theres too much money involved to even risk getting caught

As strange as it sounds, Baldomir was the legitimate linear WW champion when he fought Floyd.
kodakbyd
QUOTE (Snoop @ May 28 2011, 02:43 PM) *
As strange as it sounds, Baldomir was the legitimate linear WW champion when he fought Floyd.


I know but he wasn't the best one out there. Its like Hatton was the linear light welterweight when he fought Pacquiao but everyone knows he wasn't the best in the class. Mayweather was offered 8mm to fight Margarito but instead took less money to fight Baldomir. Thats all I'm saying
HazConvictedFelonMane
QUOTE (kodakbyd @ May 28 2011, 03:52 PM) *
I know but he wasn't the best one out there. Its like Hatton was the linear light welterweight when he fought Pacquiao but everyone knows he wasn't the best in the class. Mayweather was offered 8mm to fight Margarito but instead took less money to fight Baldomir. Thats all I'm saying


It doesn't even matter. Floyd Mayweather had learned something very important over the years. He obviously cares about what people have been saying about him in the past, so he made an adjustment. The fans didn't want to see him moving. They wanted to see him stand and fight. They wanted to see what would happen if he got belted by a full on welterweight. We got what we wanted to see from him. His last fight, he didn't move. He didn't box Shane Mosley, he beat his ass. He at least made an attempt to correct some of the negatives that have plagued his reputation for years. Manny Pacquiao on the other hand is not trying to make any attempts to change the people's perception of him. He chose the weakest fighter in March of 2010, and in 2011, he's still doing the same thing. He can't do this forever because the boxing world will crash down on him and that humble shit won't smooth it over.
AngronWorldEater
The OP betrays his Lack of Knowledge right off the bat.

Pacquiao was already P4P King, before De La Hoya. They also didn't seek out the fight with Oscar, Oscar sought the fight. Freddie accepted, because he thought Oscar was washed up, that's from training him and watching him give the fight to Mayweather.

Why the hell wouldn't you accept the fight anyways? Oscar was the cash cow, you fight him your stock goes up. That's pretty much Boxing in a nutshell. When you're the cash cow, everyone wants to fight you. Were you Pachaters expecting Pacquiao to turn down an opportunity like that? If so, then you're quite stupid, and should take up a less mentally rigorous sport to follow, figure skating perhaps...
The CEO
QUOTE (HazConvictedFelonMane @ May 28 2011, 10:58 AM) *
Manny Pacquiao is the single-most biggest con job that sports media has ever embarked on. Starting from Oscar De La Hoya, Manny Pacquiao has recieved so much unwarranted accolades that it is truly amazing. The media can spin a fighter into whatever they work hard enough to spin him into.
Oscar De La Hoya fought 2 generations of Mayweathers. He fought Uncle Jeff and Nephew Floyd. Oscar De La Hoya was so far over the hill when he lost to Manny Pacquiao that it is a complete shame. I find it outlandish that a fighter can be dubbed the P4P KING because he beat up on a fighter that was singled out by Freddie Roach, as being a perfect opponent. Roach's own words were Oscar's last 2 fights weren't 'that great'. This is a trainer that seeks the easiest fights for his fighter to be involved in.
Ricky Hatton had a gift wrapped home cooked decision against Juan Luzcano in Manchester. That fight showed us all that Ricky Hatton was severely flawed and could be exploited because of his come forward style. That combined wit the fact that he couldn't take a good punch, made for an easy decision to take that fight.
Miguel Cotto was badly damaged after his fateful night in Vegas against loaded gloves. Cotto's tough night in MSG against Clottey showed us all that he was having issues with his mental toughness, as well as his ability to take a punch. That was an easy choice for Manny's advisory board. Take the fight with Cotto instead of taking the fight with Shane Mosley. We all saw that video where Freddie Roach admitted to trying to use a catch weight as a weapon against a solid fighter with some power behind his punch.
Quite simply put, Manny Pacquiao had reached the height of his P4P run and there was no other acceptable direction to go besides to step up to either of the 2 welterweight fighters in FMJ and SSM. He failed to capitalize on his shot to cement his legacy forever. Since then, Manny has showed us his reluctance to embark on a fight that would be considered highly dramatic with world title and pound for pound implications. He has failed to undertake a unification match with any of the other welterweight title holders. He has failed to show us why he's considered the P4P KING. The only thing he has proven, is that he and his team are comfortable with taking on the easiest fights they can possibly get their hands on. Any fight that would be considered a 'good fight' is a fight that Manny has passed up on over and over again since Nov. 2009. The media has created this mythical persona of a brave warrior who fights for the fans, yet all I see is an oppurtunistic pack of wolves that prey on the weak, weary, and wounded. Manny Pacquiao is the best fighter that Top Rank has to offer, but as far as the world is concerned.....NOT HARDLY. The media can say that you're the best. The fans can say it as well, but at some point, he has to prove it. I'm waiting.



QUOTE (HazConvictedFelonMane @ May 28 2011, 11:06 AM) *
Everyone can cry all at once, or one at a time. Please don't spare me the usual responses laced with racially charged comments, homophobic slurs, and the ignorance associated with being a complete idiot. I've raised plenty of hell on the comment boards, now I'm going to take it a bit further and invade the forums. Please don't hate me because I'm telling it like it is. You guys that are blinded by the allure of a cherry picker and a potential drug cheat, can cry me a fucking lake. Have a wonderful day and I look forward to breaking all of your hearts in the future.


I can appreciate some of the things you're saying and what you're doing...Hell, a few of us here were among the very first to go after Pacquiao in the entire OBC (Online Boxing Community)....but there's no need to go on a Pactard slaying spree here...this isn't the comment sections on the articles...

Speak your mind, but tone down the aggression please...thanks.
Prov0
first off i think Pac is Garbage.i think his skills are wack ,seriously i i dont see how he wins he looks like a damn amatuer i mean seriously go to boxing gym hop around close your eyes and punch like him any trainer will be like wtf are u doing.
Pac is just a Boxing Poster boy thats all he is .

can anyone on figthype see if their is any truth to Pacs rehydrating clause in his contracts.Ron Frazier once gave a interview on fighthype and he mentioned it ..and if u think about it they Never show the weight in for the night of the fight.except the margarito.
Snoop
QUOTE (kodakbyd @ May 28 2011, 07:52 PM) *
I know but he wasn't the best one out there. Its like Hatton was the linear light welterweight when he fought Pacquiao but everyone knows he wasn't the best in the class. Mayweather was offered 8mm to fight Margarito but instead took less money to fight Baldomir. Thats all I'm saying

Actually from what I remember, Mayweather made the same amount of $ to fight Baldomir, and isn't the whole point to fight the linear champion?

dntknw.gif

I'm not trying to defend Mayweather, but I think people throw out the "ducking" accusation without looking at his career choices closely enough. For me the entire argument hinges on whether you thought Judah or Margarito was the bigger challenge in 2006.

And as weird as this sounds, especially coming from me, I thought Hatton was a legitimate challenge for Pacquiao.

laugh.gif
gravytrain
QUOTE (Snoop @ May 28 2011, 07:37 PM) *
Actually from what I remember, Mayweather made the same amount of $ to fight Baldomir, and isn't the whole point to fight the linear champion?

dntknw.gif

I'm not trying to defend Mayweather, but I think people throw out the "ducking" accusation without looking at his career choices closely enough. For me the entire argument hinges on whether you thought Judah or Margarito was the bigger challenge in 2006.

And as weird as this sounds, especially coming from me, I thought Hatton was a legitimate challenge for Pacquiao.

laugh.gif


if there's one thing i agree with on the videos Hype did with Mayweather it's that after he left TR and probably couldn't even get a fight with Cotto or Margarito he was scared of them all of a sudden. then he was just a cherry picker. he just makes himself the villain and Pac is presented as a nice guy. it's like how Mayweather beat up an old man when he fought Mosley, a guy people were saying was his first real opponent in awhile and he wouldn't even fight. Pac beat a very shitty Shane Mosley and Mosley even got blamed for the fight while Pac just got patted on the back.

kodakbyd
QUOTE (Prov0 @ May 28 2011, 05:50 PM) *
first off i think Pac is Garbage.i think his skills are wack ,seriously i i dont see how he wins he looks like a damn amatuer i mean seriously go to boxing gym hop around close your eyes and punch like him any trainer will be like wtf are u doing.
Pac is just a Boxing Poster boy thats all he is .

can anyone on figthype see if their is any truth to Pacs rehydrating clause in his contracts.Ron Frazier once gave a interview on fighthype and he mentioned it ..and if u think about it they Never show the weight in for the night of the fight.except the margarito.


Yah an amateur that destroys everyone. Such an amateur that you think hes on steroids. Yes, he's not the conventional fighter but there must be something to him that everyone steps in the ring confident and thinking they have a great chance and leave demoralized and battered. If he such an "amateur" Floyd should just step in the ring and collect his 50 mm. I hate to bring race into this but 95% of the ppl that are most critical of Pac is black. Like I said I'm actually a fan of both fighters but you guys just like to discredit the guy and making excuses one fight after another. Pactards may not be the most knowledgable fans but at least they give Mayweather respect in regards to his skills, its his character that they attack
Snoop
QUOTE (gravytrain @ May 29 2011, 03:46 AM) *
if there's one thing i agree with on the videos Hype did with Mayweather it's that after he left TR and probably couldn't even get a fight with Cotto or Margarito he was scared of them all of a sudden. then he was just a cherry picker. he just makes himself the villain and Pac is presented as a nice guy. it's like how Mayweather beat up an old man when he fought Mosley, a guy people were saying was his first real opponent in awhile and he wouldn't even fight. Pac beat a very shitty Shane Mosley and Mosley even got blamed for the fight while Pac just got patted on the back.

The power of the Pacquiao hype machine summed up in two sentences.
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (gravytrain @ May 28 2011, 10:46 PM) *
if there's one thing i agree with on the videos Hype did with Mayweather it's that after he left TR and probably couldn't even get a fight with Cotto or Margarito he was scared of them all of a sudden. then he was just a cherry picker. he just makes himself the villain and Pac is presented as a nice guy. it's like how Mayweather beat up an old man when he fought Mosley, a guy people were saying was his first real opponent in awhile and he wouldn't even fight. Pac beat a very shitty Shane Mosley and Mosley even got blamed for the fight while Pac just got patted on the back.


I'm not sure Mosley got blamed for a shitty performance more the way he just caved and gave up. There are some (myself included) who thought that no matter how outgunned he was he would take the Arce way out and win or die trying. The fact he couldn't compete with Manny I didn't find disappointing, the way he shut up shop I did.
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (HazConvictedFelonMane @ May 28 2011, 10:58 AM) *
Manny Pacquiao is the single-most biggest con job that sports media has ever embarked on. Starting from Oscar De La Hoya, Manny Pacquiao has recieved so much unwarranted accolades that it is truly amazing. The media can spin a fighter into whatever they work hard enough to spin him into.
Oscar De La Hoya fought 2 generations of Mayweathers. He fought Uncle Jeff and Nephew Floyd. Oscar De La Hoya was so far over the hill when he lost to Manny Pacquiao that it is a complete shame. I find it outlandish that a fighter can be dubbed the P4P KING because he beat up on a fighter that was singled out by Freddie Roach, as being a perfect opponent. Roach's own words were Oscar's last 2 fights weren't 'that great'. This is a trainer that seeks the easiest fights for his fighter to be involved in.
Ricky Hatton had a gift wrapped home cooked decision against Juan Luzcano in Manchester. That fight showed us all that Ricky Hatton was severely flawed and could be exploited because of his come forward style. That combined wit the fact that he couldn't take a good punch, made for an easy decision to take that fight.
Miguel Cotto was badly damaged after his fateful night in Vegas against loaded gloves. Cotto's tough night in MSG against Clottey showed us all that he was having issues with his mental toughness, as well as his ability to take a punch. That was an easy choice for Manny's advisory board. Take the fight with Cotto instead of taking the fight with Shane Mosley. We all saw that video where Freddie Roach admitted to trying to use a catch weight as a weapon against a solid fighter with some power behind his punch.
Quite simply put, Manny Pacquiao had reached the height of his P4P run and there was no other acceptable direction to go besides to step up to either of the 2 welterweight fighters in FMJ and SSM. He failed to capitalize on his shot to cement his legacy forever. Since then, Manny has showed us his reluctance to embark on a fight that would be considered highly dramatic with world title and pound for pound implications. He has failed to undertake a unification match with any of the other welterweight title holders. He has failed to show us why he's considered the P4P KING. The only thing he has proven, is that he and his team are comfortable with taking on the easiest fights they can possibly get their hands on. Any fight that would be considered a 'good fight' is a fight that Manny has passed up on over and over again since Nov. 2009. The media has created this mythical persona of a brave warrior who fights for the fans, yet all I see is an oppurtunistic pack of wolves that prey on the weak, weary, and wounded. Manny Pacquiao is the best fighter that Top Rank has to offer, but as far as the world is concerned.....NOT HARDLY. The media can say that you're the best. The fans can say it as well, but at some point, he has to prove it. I'm waiting.



Seriously you couldn't find an appropriate thread to put this in?

I also like the way you've just glazed over Manny's career pre-140 pounds almost as if it didn't exist. Funny there are parts of this rant where I could replace the name Pacquiao with Mayweather and you'd have the same result.
Snoop
QUOTE (The Ollie Reed Fan Club @ May 29 2011, 05:57 AM) *
I'm not sure Mosley got blamed for a shitty performance more the way he just caved and gave up. There are some (myself included) who thought that no matter how outgunned he was he would take the Arce way out and win or die trying. The fact he couldn't compete with Manny I didn't find disappointing, the way he shut up shop I did.

Mosley definitely deserves part of the blame, but it somehow overshadowed the fact that it was a bullshit matchup to begin with.
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (Snoop @ May 29 2011, 01:12 AM) *
Mosley definitely deserves part of the blame, but it somehow overshadowed the fact that it was a bullshit matchup to begin with.



Mosley talked the talk coming in to that fight (but then I guess they all do) and while it was a shitty match-up I expected it to be a shitty match-up 'for as long as it lasted.' And yes for that I blamed Mosley. It's not like Manny is hard to find in there.
BoxingWizard23
Wow. Great article. The truth will set you free as it says. Blob Arum and Top Wank will oneday come to light. Pac is trained by a trainer who coached several fighters who were caught with steroids including James Toney. Ariza is making his speciality and you can tell he upgraded his shakes in the Mosley fight. Mosley basically said Pacmans one punch was stronger than Vernon Forrests barrage that KD a prime Mosley. Pacman stronger than a prime Dela Hoya? Prime Winky?, Prime Vernon?, plus a non weight drained and Primed Cotto?? yep Ariza stepped his shakes game up now Pacman can probably toppled and hurt even a Kilts brother. Pacman has basic skills and will be exposed if he gets in the ring wit Mayweather. If and when the fight happens it will go down as the biggest mismatch in history since Gatti vs Mayweather all you fools who believe in Pac are blinded and aren't real boxing fans. Roach admitted several times that Pac isn't ready for Mayweather and that Mayweather's style is a nightmare and it worries him. Throwing punches in bunches against a boxing master who don't wastes his punches, has pin point sniper accuracy, one of the greatest defensive techniques ever, a veteran,one of the highest boxing IQ's ever, ring generalship,mind game master, and counter punch specialist will end in a horrible night for Power Pellet Pacman
Hops
Pacquiao is many times over more a fighter than Castillo and Judah combined. He will knock the hell outta Floyd. That's why Floyd is still pretending that he never saw/heard/imagined/dreamt Pacquiao being interviewed by BoxingScene confidently stating that he had agreed to Floyd's demands for blood testing including and up to the night of the fight even after round 6.

Again, don't delve on the past. Move the story forward. Floyd demanded. Pacquiao refused. Floyd was stern on his demands. Pacquiao capitulated. Then, Floyd's silent about the issue.
JONdaCON817
QUOTE (gravytrain @ May 28 2011, 09:46 PM) *
if there's one thing i agree with on the videos Hype did with Mayweather it's that after he left TR and probably couldn't even get a fight with Cotto or Margarito he was scared of them all of a sudden. then he was just a cherry picker. he just makes himself the villain and Pac is presented as a nice guy. it's like how Mayweather beat up an old man when he fought Mosley, a guy people were saying was his first real opponent in awhile and he wouldn't even fight. Pac beat a very shitty Shane Mosley and Mosley even got blamed for the fight while Pac just got patted on the back.


Yeaa what May said made a lot of sense to me.... why wouldn't Arum say some shyt like that when he gets dropped as the promoter... if you look bacc at their fights May had a better level of competition IMO...

juss like with Mosely, the Marquez fight will be no different. Everyone will think it'll be close but it'll be a complete mismatch... ppls eyes will open up when Pac dominates Marquez in 3 rds...
JONdaCON817
QUOTE (Hops @ May 29 2011, 07:13 AM) *
Pacquiao is many times over more a fighter than Castillo and Judah combined. He will knock the hell outta Floyd. That's why Floyd is still pretending that he never saw/heard/imagined/dreamt Pacquiao being interviewed by BoxingScene confidently stating that he had agreed to Floyd's demands for blood testing including and up to the night of the fight even after round 6.

Again, don't delve on the past. Move the story forward. Floyd demanded. Pacquiao refused. Floyd was stern on his demands. Pacquiao capitulated. Then, Floyd's silent about the issue.


In the words of Mike Tyson "sign the contract big boy.. sign the contract"..

I doubt Pac takes the test up to the night of the fight and after the 6... he can say it all he wants but I guarantee he won't do it.. and if he does he loses and that'll be his reason... then the media will make Floyd look even worse by sayin he made Manny do that...

Anytime you have your blood drained your almost useless for the day... especially when Roach has already said Manny feels weakend after giving blood.

The best thing to do is give blood the day before and after the fight... none of that 6 round shyt... if they fight I want it to be at both guys best... no advantages... no excuses...
Walstan86
QUOTE (JONdaCON817 @ May 29 2011, 07:46 AM) *
In the words of Mike Tyson "sign the contract big boy.. sign the contract"..

Contracts? Sounds reasonable enough, and yet Floyd's future in boxing is a complete mystery. As others have said, his unwillingness to discuss his future makes him appear "retired" and any talk of contracts, premature. We need first to hear what Floyd wants to do now that he's won the Testing Wars. A simple tweet ("Let's do it then") would work.

And still....crickets.
gravytrain
QUOTE (The Ollie Reed Fan Club @ May 29 2011, 01:57 AM) *
I'm not sure Mosley got blamed for a shitty performance more the way he just caved and gave up. There are some (myself included) who thought that no matter how outgunned he was he would take the Arce way out and win or die trying. The fact he couldn't compete with Manny I didn't find disappointing, the way he shut up shop I did.


but with Mayweather he beat a Mosley that should retire, with Pac he got a Mosley that's just scared of him. Mosley looked just as bad against Mayweather as he did with Pac, the only difference is Mosley doesn't have to survive against someone throwing 30 punches a round. and even after a lot of writers said the match up was shitty when the fight actually turned out to be horrible they didn't even try to say anything to Arum or Pac about passing on 2 other opponents to fight Mosley. it's just Mosley not being able to compete.

i just think it'll always be something with Mayweather since his image is different. even if he were to fight and beat Pac there would probably be an asterisk on it when if Pac beat him nobody would say shit since he's portrayed as the nice guy.

JONdaCON817
QUOTE (Walstan86 @ May 29 2011, 11:06 AM) *
Contracts? Sounds reasonable enough, and yet Floyd's future in boxing is a complete mystery. As others have said, his unwillingness to discuss his future makes him appear "retired" and any talk of contracts, premature. We need first to hear what Floyd wants to do now that he's won the Testing Wars. A simple tweet ("Let's do it then") would work.

And still....crickets.


Yuhp.. and he'll come out when hes ready.. but will he have a tune up fight with someone like Ortiz or Spadafora??... i doubt he'll jump in the ring fresh off this long layoff... we'll see what happens but i aint holding my breathe.. niether should any of us..
JONdaCON817
QUOTE (gravytrain @ May 29 2011, 11:20 AM) *
but with Mayweather he beat a Mosley that should retire, with Pac he got a Mosley that's just scared of him. Mosley looked just as bad against Mayweather as he did with Pac, the only difference is Mosley doesn't have to survive against someone throwing 30 punches a round. and even after a lot of writers said the match up was shitty when the fight actually turned out to be horrible they didn't even try to say anything to Arum or Pac about passing on 2 other opponents to fight Mosley. it's just Mosley not being able to compete.

i just think it'll always be something with Mayweather since his image is different. even if he were to fight and beat Pac there would probably be an asterisk on it when if Pac beat him nobody would say shit since he's portrayed as the nice guy.


yea thats a pretty fair assestment... and i deff agree. Floyd is always gonna be portrayed as the bad guy.. partially becuz of his out of the ring antics but mostly becuz Arum is a Dusty Dicchead.
kidbazooka1
Naw Manny ain't no media creation he's the real deal, a beast the type that comes along every 50 yrs but some ppl being that he's not Latino or African American can't admit to it.

Manny is a monster and he's proven himself more so than any fighter in the last decade.
Snoop
QUOTE (kidbazooka1 @ May 31 2011, 05:45 AM) *
Naw Manny ain't no media creation he's the real deal, a beast the type that comes along every 50 yrs but some ppl being that he's not Latino or African American can't admit to it.

Manny is a monster and he's proven himself more so than any fighter in the last decade.

That's horseshit. There's very little to do with the fact that he's Filipino and more to do with his overblown accomplishments. Where are these race based explanations coming from anyway?

Good fighter? Yes. Legitimately tested? Not recently.
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (kidbazooka1 @ May 30 2011, 11:45 PM) *
Naw Manny ain't no media creation he's the real deal, a beast the type that comes along every 50 yrs but some ppl being that he's not Latino or African American can't admit to it.

Manny is a monster and he's proven himself more so than any fighter in the last decade.



I concur. He stood up and took the Mexicans legends challenge no less than 7 times, and regardless of how you felt those fights went and whether they were over the hill or not it makes him a fucken superstar in my book. This part of Manny's history gets so easily washed away by Floyd cum guzzler revisionists.

Look I for one felt Morales was a washed up fighter but as he proved against a supposed beast like Maidana the guy can still take a shot and keep on truckin yet no-one and I repeat no-one has done what Manny did to him in fights 2 and 3. And that goes for Barerra and Marquez as well. No-one has brutalized them the way Manny did and I'd even throw in the clinical disection Floyd performwed on JMM.

I'd also throw in his fights against Fishnets and Cotto as being good wins. Yes the last 3 have been ka ka, but geesh he's still got nothing on Fraud when it comes to 'set-up' fights.
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (Snoop @ May 31 2011, 02:28 AM) *
Good fighter? Yes. Legitimately tested? Not recently.


This part is true.
BoxingWizard23
Manny is a media creation if he had his own Promo company and another trainer he wouldn't be where he is today. Not the other way around. Like I said Ariza's special blend had made this man able to probably KO a heavyweight. For Mosley to say Pac is the hardest hitting opponent he's ever face was made me go what?? impossible how is he stronger than super middle weights?? Mosley took nasty shots from a Primed Winky and Prime Dela Hoya and still didn't drop.
kidbazooka1
QUOTE (Snoop @ May 31 2011, 02:28 AM) *
That's horseshit. There's very little to do with the fact that he's Filipino and more to do with his overblown accomplishments. Where are these race based explanations coming from anyway?

Good fighter? Yes. Legitimately tested? Not recently.


Overblown accomplsishments now thats horsesh*t.

Hops
The Pachaters are as guilty as the writer who posted this:

http://www.nowboxing.com/2011/05/teddy-atl...pressive/18358/
Walstan86
Interesting press-release following Pac's dismissal of GBP from the defamation claim still pending against the Mayweathers:

“Richard Schaefer and Oscar de la Hoya, on behalf of themselves and Golden Boy Promotions, wish to make it crystal clear that we never intended to claim that Manny Pacquiao has used or is using any performance enhancing drugs, and further state that we do not have any evidence whatsoever of such use.

“Manny Pacquiao is one of the greatest fighters of all time, and we apologize if anyone construed our prior remarks as in any way claiming or even suggesting that Manny uses or has used performance enhancing drugs.”

EDIT: Didn't see the thread already up before posting this....apologies
Snoop
QUOTE (kidbazooka1 @ Jun 1 2011, 01:23 AM) *
Overblown accomplsishments now thats horsesh*t.

LMAO. A 2011 Mosley, a 150lb Margarito for a 154lb title, a gunshy Clottey, and a damaged 145lb Cotto for a 147lb title. Yeah, those are awesome.

rolleyes_anim.gif

But no please, tell me how people are hating on Pacquiao because he's not black or Latino.

laugh.gif
gravytrain
QUOTE (Snoop @ Jun 1 2011, 12:34 AM) *
LMAO. A 2011 Mosley, a 150lb Margarito for a 154lb title, a gunshy Clottey, and a damaged 145lb Cotto for a 147lb title. Yeah, those are awesome.

rolleyes_anim.gif

But no please, tell me how people are hating on Pacquiao because he's not black or Latino.

laugh.gif


Clottey wasn't his fault, i do think he's the best welter he's faced though. that and Clottey is a punk so him being a bitch didn't surprise me. his sorry ass was too scared to go for the kill with Cotto when Cotto was huffing and puffing about to pass out in their fight.

Pac has had exaggerated success though. all his fights recently have just been "he's bigger than Pac" or "he'll put on a good fight". sounds like some serious hype to me.
Hops
These Pachaters are as guilty as Don Donatello of using an old proven technique of degrading a fighter.

So here's what the Pachaters are doing.

TEDDY ATLAS WRONG ABOUT HENRY ARMSTRONG, MANNY PACQUIAO IS MORE IMPRESSIVE
Sunday, May 29, 2011

By Don Donatello

Whenever I hear Henry Armstrong’s name mentioned in the American Sports Media, I hear the following in one form or another. He held the Featherweight, Lightweight, Welterweight, and fought for the Middleweight Title all at the same time. And then you get the impression that he was going up and down from weight to weight defending all three titles at the same time. And you also hear that he was robbed when he got a draw when he fought Filipino fighter Ceferino Garcia for the Middleweight Title.

Below I provide evidence that Armstrong’s accomplishments were overly inflated by the American media.

Teddy Atlas just loves bringing up Henry Armstrong’s name and his record whenever Manny Pacquiao’s greatness is being discussed. And of course like a broken record he loves to interject in the conversation the huge number and how often the old fighters fought. In the video below he blatantly inflates Armstrong’s record to slight Pacquiao’s stature. He said the following about Armstrong’s record when comparing him to Pacquiao:

“He defended all three titles.” “He had 300 fights.” “He had 135 knockouts.” In reality he only defended the Lightweight title once with a loss while holding both the Lightweight and Welterweight Title. Atlas added 120 fights to Armstrong’s record, added 10 more knockouts, and made it look like Armstrong was holding and defending all three titles at the same time.

Here is Henry Armstrong’s record:

Pass this onto Atlas because he does not know what he is talking about:

Henry Armstrong 149-21-10 = 180

101 wins by KO

Lost twice by KO

56.11 KO%

As you can see below, Armstrong relinquished the Featherweight title to concentrate on Lightweight and Welterweight. But he only defended the Lightweight title once. In his last 75 fights, 73 were at Welterweight, Armstrong only fought at Lightweight twice, both were against Lou Ambers. Once when he won the Lightweight title from Lou Ambers and the second when he loss the Lightweight title to the same man, Lou Ambers, almost exactly one year later.

Teddy Atlas also likes to mock and slight Pacquiao’s 8-Weight Division Titles by saying that there are all kinds of governing bodies today that were not around when Armstrong was fighting. Armstrong fought for titles from 126 pounds to 160 pounds, he won the Featherweight, Lightweight, and Welterweight. But he only defended the Lightweight Title once while holding the Lightweight and Welterweight Title at the same time. He failed to win the 160 pound title against Filipino fighter Ceferino Garcia in a draw. Pacquiao won titles from 112 pounds to 154 pounds, a span of 42 pounds, double that of Henry’s. Armstrong’s titles are from 126 pounds to 147 pounds, a stretch of 21 pounds. Even if Pacquiao discounted the the Light Middleweight title and stopped at the Welterweight division of 147 pounds, that is a stretch of 35 pounds.

The most misleading is Atlas’ attempt to insinuate that Armstrong defended the Featherweight, Lightweight, and Welterweight title at the same time. Some American sportscasters even give the impression that Armstrong held all three titles at the same time when he fought for the Middleweight title. Atlas and other sportscasters gave the impression that Armstrong was going up in down defending all three titles at the same time.

There were many non-title fights that Armstrong fought between title fights. I excluded the non-title fights and only charted the title fights.

01/01 – 1935 Armstrong’s attempts to win the California-Mexico World Featherweight Title against Baby Arizmendi. He loses on points in 12 rounds.

09/13 – 1935 Armstrong wins the Western Featherweight Title by an 8th round TKO over Alton Black.

12/06 – 1935 His first defense of the Western Featherweight Title. Once again he beat Alton Black in another 8th round TKO.

05/19 – 1936 Armstrong wins the California State Featherweight Title by a 4rth round TKO over Bobby Leyvas.

10/27 – 1936 Armstrong defends the California-Mexico World Featherweight Title and beat Mike Belloise by points in 10 rounds.

01/01 – 1937 Armstrong defends California-Mexico World Featherweight Title and beat Rodolfo Casanova in a 3rd round KO.

10/29 – 1937 Armstrong wins the National Boxing Association World Featherweight Title and NYSAC World Featherweight Title over Petey Sarron by a 6th round KO. This was his last fight as a Featherweight. He never defended or fought as a Featherweight while holding the Lightweight and Welterweight Title. From this point on until he retired, he fought 75 times. Of the 75 fights only two were at Lightweight, once when he won the Lightweight Title and again when he defended it. Both fights were against the same opponent, Lou Ambers. Both fights were 1 year apart.

05/31 – 1938 He wins the World Welterweight Title by beating Barney Ross by 15 rounds UD. Armstrong weighs 133 ½ and Ross weighs 142. This was the very last fight for Barney Ross, he never fought again. This fact is never mentioned when today’s sports broadcasters talks about Armstrong winning the Welterweight Title.

08/17 – 1938 Three months later Armstrong fights at Lightweight and beats Lou Ambers for the World Lightweight Title by a 15 round split decision. Armstrong weighs 134 pounds, Lou Ambers at 134 ½ pounds. Armstrong’s next 7 fights were defending the Welterweight Title from 11/25/1938 to 5/25/1939.

After over a year of defending the Welterweight title, his first and only defense of the Lightweight Title came against the same man he won it from, Lou Ambers.

10/09 – 1939 Armstrong defended his Lightweight Title against Lou Ambers. He loss to the man he won the title from, Lou Ambers, by UD. Armstrong was penalized 5 rounds (2nd, 5th, 7th, 9th, 11th,) for low blows.

Teddy Atlas talks mockingly about Manny’s catchweight fights for the Welterweight and Light Middleweight titles. What he fails to mention is Armstrong’s attempt to win the Middleweight title against Ceferino Garcia was set up as a 10 round championship fight. Only California recognized it as a World Middleweight Title fight.

It was a common practice for Champions to use tomato cans to stay in shape between big fights in the olden days. These so called fights were nothing more than a sparring session that absurdly padded their win record. That is why the old fighters were fighting even twice a week. These sparring sessions were being sold to the public.

Sugar Ray Robinson fought long stretches against tomato cans like I outlined in my previous article. Henry Armstrong did the same.

From September 9nth of 1939 to January 4rth of 1940, a span of about 4 months, Armstrong defended the World Welterweight Title 7 times.

10/09 – 1939 Al Manfredo 66-20-8 TKO 4

10/13 – 1939 Howard Scott 55-38-8 KO 2

10/20 – 1939 Ritchie Fontaine 35-21-9 TKO 3

10/24 – 1939 Jimmy Garrison 28-10-4 Win 10

10/30 – 1939 Bobby Pacho 81-54-15 TKO 4

12/11 – 1939 Jimmy Garrison 28-11-4 KO 7

01/04 – 1940 Joe Ghnouly 60-22-7 KO 5

Does Teddy Atlas mention this part of Armstrong’s career of 7 consecutive tomato cans defending the Welterweight Title?

As you can see Armstrong fought Jimmy Garrison twice in less than two months. No need for a training camp there, Atlas. In the first fight with Garrison, there was only one scoring official, referee George Blake. Garrison was knocked down in the 8th round. How were these 7 tomato cans able to get a title fight?

These were the great old days of boxing and Henry Armstrong that Teddy Atlas likes to talk about.

Here is a longer stretch of Armstrong’s fights that starts in a fight in July 17th of 1940 to March 2 of 1943:

7/17 – 1940 Lew Jenkins 45-15-4 W TKO 6

9/23 – 1940 Phil Furr 41-33-7 W K0 4 World Welterweight Title

10/04 – 1940 Fritzie Zivic 100-24-4 L UD 15 World Welterweight Title

01/17 – 1941 Fritzie Zivic 100-24-5 L TKO 12 World Welterweight Title

06/01 – 1942 Johnny Taylor 20-15-7 W TKO 4

06/24 – 1942 Sheik Rangel 42-6-14 W PTS 10

07/03 – 1942 Reuben Shank 18-3-3 L 10 UD

07/20 – 1942 Joe Ybarra 23-28-16 W TKO 3

08/03 – 1942 Aldo Spoldi 95-22-7 W TKO 7

08/13 – 1942 Jackie Burke 112-33-22 W PTS 10

08/26 – 1942 Rodolfo Ramirez 26-7-3 W KO 8

09/07 – 1942 Johnny Taylor 20-17-7 W TKO 3

09/14 – 1942 Leo Rodak 73-20-9 W TKO 8

09/30 – 1942 Earl Turner 16-5-4 W KO 4

10/13 – 1942 Juan Zurita 111-20-1 W KO 2

10/26 – 1942 Fritzie Zivic 125-31-6 W UD 10

12/04 – 1942 Lew Jenkins 51-26-5 W TKO 8

12/14 – 1942 Saverio Turiello 87-55-32 W TKO 4

01/05 – 1943 Jim McDaniels 27-14-8 W UD 10

03/02 – 1943 Willie Joyce 46-6-7 L MD 10

Sure Henry Armstrong easily defeated and KO’d the tomato cans, but loss or only decisioned against the opponents who had somewhat of a decent record.

In this span, against Fritzie Zivic who had a record of 100 wins and 24 losses, in three of their fights, Zivic won 2 and one by a 12th round TKO.

Against Reuben Shank who had an 18-3-3 record, Armstrong loss by a 10 round UD.

And against Willie Joyce who had a record of 46-6-7, Armstrong loss by a majority decision in 10 rounds.

Now we know how olden days fighters like Sugar Ray Robinson and Henry Armstrong had over 100 fights. They recorded sparring sessions against tomato cans as wins. We also know that Henry Armstrong did not hold the Featherweight, Lightweight, and Welterweight titles while fighting for the Middleweight title. His attempt to win the Middleweight title against Ceferino Garcia was only sanctioned by California and it was only a 10 round fight.

Teddy Atlas needs to brush up on his knowledge of the olden days. He acts like he was actually there when Armstrong was fighting. His fellow American broadcasters also need to brush up on their boxing history and knowledge so they can correct the BS and ignorance that Atlas regularly regurgitates on ESPN.
kidbazooka1
QUOTE (Fitz @ May 31 2011, 11:53 PM) *
Yeah, I too am curious to see how people are hard on Pacquiao because he isn't black or latino. Let's here it, tonto.


Man im sick and tired of all these fake ass ppl saying that oh race has nothing to do with it. Thats f*cking BS and ya know it.

You Fitz for example are always on Vics nuts cause he's an Aussie right? And I willing to bet that if Manny was an Aussie aswell you wouldn't be talking about him the way you are. So please lets all keep it real and not act like race has nothing to do with it cause it does.

If Manny was African American im pretty damn sure that most ppls would be saying the he is the GOAT and ditto for the latino's.

Manny is a fucking beast he wants to fight Floyd but Floyd lil pussy ass is too afraid to sign thats the bottom line.

And yes my wife is Pinoy and i use to root against him each and every time he fought but the i've come to appreciate him for what he has done in the sport.

Like i said lets keep it real race has alot to do with it and ya muthaf*ckers know it.
Snoop
QUOTE (kidbazooka1 @ Jun 1 2011, 06:23 AM) *
Man im sick and tired of all these fake ass ppl saying that oh race has nothing to do with it. Thats f*cking BS and ya know it.

You Fitz for example are always on Vics nuts cause he's an Aussie right? And I willing to bet that if Manny was an Aussie aswell you wouldn't be talking about him the way you are. So please lets all keep it real and not act like race has nothing to do with it cause it does.

If Manny was African American im pretty damn sure that most ppls would be saying the he is the GOAT and ditto for the latino's.

Manny is a fucking beast he wants to fight Floyd but Floyd lil pussy ass is too afraid to sign thats the bottom line.

And yes my wife is Pinoy and i use to root against him each and every time he fought but the i've come to appreciate him for what he has done in the sport.

Like i said lets keep it real race has alot to do with it and ya muthaf*ckers know it.

First of all, you need to differentiate between NATIONALITY and RACE because the two are different.

Secondly, exactly WHO is saying Pacquiao isn't one of the GOATs outside of people on message boards, the Mayweathers, and maybe Teddy Atlas? He's boxing's media darling. Promoters love him, networks love him, fans love him. The only ones that don't are the ones who analyze the facts, and it has NOTHING to do with his race.

You still haven't said anything to prove WHY or HOW its "f*cking BS" to say race has nothing to do with it apart from your own opinion and guesses of what people would be saying if he was this or that.
kidbazooka1
QUOTE (Snoop @ Jun 1 2011, 12:32 AM) *
First of all, you need to differentiate between NATIONALITY and RACE because the two are different.

Secondly, exactly WHO is saying Pacquiao isn't one of the GOATs outside of people on message boards, the Mayweathers, and maybe Teddy Atlas? He's boxing's media darling. Promoters love him, networks love him, fans love him. The only ones that don't are the ones who analyze the facts, and it has NOTHING to do with his race.

You still haven't said anything to prove WHY or HOW its "f*cking BS" to say race has nothing to do with it apart from your own opinion and guesses of what people would be saying if he was this or that.


Fitz is Australian and like i said i bet if Manny was Australian Fitz would be calling him the GOAT why because he Australian. If Manny was your nationality im sure you would do the same aswell but im certian your gonna say otherwise for the sake of your argument.

Race/nationality has a lot to do with how most ppl view a fighter/athlete thats a fact. I don't know what fairytale world your living in but theres not much that needs to be explained.
Snoop
QUOTE (kidbazooka1 @ Jun 1 2011, 06:45 AM) *
Fitz is Australian and like i said i bet if Manny was Australian Fitz would be calling him the GOAT why because he Australian. If Manny was your nationality im sure you would do the same aswell but im certian your gonna say otherwise for the sake of your argument.

Race/nationality has a lot to do with how most ppl view a fighter/athlete thats a fact. I don't know what fairytale world your living in but theres not much that needs to be explained.

Way to say absolutely nothing relevant to the argument, again.
Snoop
QUOTE (Fitz @ Jun 1 2011, 06:11 AM) *
So you have come to a conclusion on this topic and based it on what you think 'Fitz' from Australia would do?

Haha, thanks. But not very smart.

Fitz, just please say you wouldn't love Pacquiao even if he was Aussie. Otherwise, I'm fucked.
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (Snoop @ Jun 1 2011, 02:27 AM) *
Fitz, just please say you wouldn't love Pacquiao even if he was Aussie. Otherwise, I'm fucked.


If Pac was an Aussie Fitz would love him. Fitz is a true Aussie laugh.gif

P.S And no hating Mundine doesn't count as he is from another planet laugh.gif
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