Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: Drug Testing In Nevada
FightHype Community > BOXING HYPE > Boxing
Allmenjoi8
It seems that there have been a lot to say about the drug testing system in Nevada for boxers. I have no idea what it entails (if you would like to educate me on it please feel free). My questions is: How effective are these test and should the states that have boxing in them carry Olympic Style Testing to help insure that everyone who fights is clean? Would it cost boxing commissions more money or are there too many politics to change the current systems? I would love to hear your thoughts.
bosco
From my understanding they give you 1 test before the fight and 1 after the fight and they let you know when you have to take it. It's not random nor do they test for everything olympic style testing does. Basically with decent advisers it can easily be beat. I doubt if Nevada changes its rules. Shane Mosley testified that he was juiced for De La Hoya 2 fight and they didn't even change Mosleys win to a no contest. They just don't care. It's a corrupt system and they play by their own rules.
gravytrain
i think most commissions just give you a post-fight piss test.
STEVENSKI
Drug testing will only catch the poor never the super rich. Why do you think it is alwasy a 2nd or 3rd world athlete that gets busted at the Olympics? Because they cannot afford the lastest designer PED's.
caneman
QUOTE (Allmenjoi8 @ Jun 15 2011, 03:01 PM) *
It seems that there have been a lot to say about the drug testing system in Nevada for boxers. I have no idea what it entails (if you would like to educate me on it please feel free). My questions is: How effective are these test and should the states that have boxing in them carry Olympic Style Testing to help insure that everyone who fights is clean? Would it cost boxing commissions more money or are there too many politics to change the current systems? I would love to hear your thoughts.



I'mma gonna respond to this only for now and then read the other post...I think this would be ok for the 2 prima donna's I guess but it's bull shit unless year around it is TOTALLY USELESS...AND MAKES NO DIFFERENCE OTHER THEN THE MAYWEATHER'S CAUSE ONLY FLOYD CAN GO UP IN WEIGHT AND BE SO GREAT! lmfao With that said, there are still stuff that won't be caught!
boxtop123
QUOTE (Allmenjoi8 @ Jun 15 2011, 04:01 PM) *
It seems that there have been a lot to say about the drug testing system in Nevada for boxers. I have no idea what it entails (if you would like to educate me on it please feel free). My questions is: How effective are these test and should the states that have boxing in them carry Olympic Style Testing to help insure that everyone who fights is clean? Would it cost boxing commissions more money or are there too many politics to change the current systems? I would love to hear your thoughts.

well sir i dont know why they wont cheange the testing methods other than for financial gain. consider this sugar shane mosely passed every test that nevada state athletic commission had and all the while he was dirty he was a product of balco so we need better testing
gravytrain
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Jun 15 2011, 06:58 PM) *
Drug testing will only catch the poor never the super rich. Why do you think it is alwasy a 2nd or 3rd world athlete that gets busted at the Olympics? Because they cannot afford the lastest designer PED's.


lol. how do you explain Russian and Bulgarian lifters getting caught? what about American athletes?

athletes get caught because sooner or later there's a chance you can get caught, not because there's some million dollar per serving PED they can't afford.
BoxingWizard23
QUOTE (caneman @ Jun 15 2011, 06:59 PM) *
I'mma gonna respond to this only for now and then read the other post...I think this would be ok for the 2 prima donna's I guess but it's bull shit unless year around it is TOTALLY USELESS...AND MAKES NO DIFFERENCE OTHER THEN THE MAYWEATHER'S CAUSE ONLY FLOYD CAN GO UP IN WEIGHT AND BE SO GREAT! lmfao With that said, there are still stuff that won't be caught!

Like I said. No one questions Ariza's background like how can a former medical nutritionist all of a sudden mysteriously was arrested for something to do with medicine and then jump into boxing as a Strength/conditions trainer?? All fighters he trained under were improved in all categories they never had before. No one questions that. Mayweather did go up in weight and suffered lost of power and a bit of speed. He was much faster at 140 and had wayyyy more power at the lower weights. While everyone suffers something when they go up and down in weight only Manny can do that without suffering anything but gaining everything and some new attributes all of a sudden under Ariza. Well Roach? you know his history with James Toney and another boxer that was caught with steroids right?? Let you think about it Cane.
gravytrain
QUOTE (BoxingWizard23 @ Jun 15 2011, 11:37 PM) *
Like I said. No one questions Ariza's background like how can a former medical nutritionist all of a sudden mysteriously was arrested for something to do with medicine and then jump into boxing as a Strength/conditions trainer?? All fighters he trained under were improved in all categories they never had before. No one questions that. Mayweather did go up in weight and suffered lost of power and a bit of speed. He was much faster at 140 and had wayyyy more power at the lower weights. While everyone suffers something when they go up and down in weight only Manny can do that without suffering anything but gaining everything and some new attributes all of a sudden under Ariza. Well Roach? you know his history with James Toney and another boxer that was caught with steroids right?? Let you think about it Cane.


how do you explain the improvement in pro athletes that go to someplace like Athletes Performance? what about all the other athletes that have a personal trainer to improve their performance?

you guys have some serious conspiracy theory shit when it comes to Pac. at least point out the legit argument and say you're suspicious because of how him and his team handled the PED allegations.
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
Nevada could improve but the really smart money says you need to test all year round and randomly. And even then still the likes of Lance Armstrong and Marion Jones keep beating the tests, but year round will give you about the only good chance of consistently catching juicers.
BoxingFan86
QUOTE (The Ollie Reed Fan Club @ Jun 16 2011, 01:02 AM) *
Nevada could improve but the really smart money says you need to test all year round and randomly. And even then still the likes of Lance Armstrong and Marion Jones keep beating the tests, but year round will give you about the only good chance of consistently catching juicers.

I co-sign this post.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (gravytrain @ Jun 16 2011, 01:05 PM) *
lol. how do you explain Russian and Bulgarian lifters getting caught? what about American athletes?

athletes get caught because sooner or later there's a chance you can get caught, not because there's some million dollar per serving PED they can't afford.


Comprehension slugger. Unless you think Russia & Bulgaria are 1st world countries that is??????

The only American athletes caught in the act are either too stupid for their own good or cannot afford the latest designer gear that is undetectable with todays testing. It would be detectable if it was looked for but the really good chemists work for the highest bidder not a poorly paid government body.

I am not talking about million $$ PED's I am talking about cunts like Marion Jones who used Balco & never failed a test. She was only caught because Conte grassed on every man & their dog not because of "olympic style testing".

All said & done guys with the type of capital like Pac & Mayweather could afford to have designer drugs manufactured & tailored to their genetic disposition & will never get caught in the act if they are juicing. If a fighter at that level is using PED's that are undetectable through todays technology they should still be worried about what happens if those samples are tested 10 or 15 years from now when the testing apparatus has evolved to detect the current elite level PED's.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (gravytrain @ Jun 16 2011, 01:58 PM) *
how do you explain the improvement in pro athletes that go to someplace like Athletes Performance? what about all the other athletes that have a personal trainer to improve their performance?

you guys have some serious conspiracy theory shit when it comes to Pac. at least point out the legit argument and say you're suspicious because of how him and his team handled the PED allegations.


+1

Personally I think Pac has lost some speed that he had at 130. He just happens to be fighting bigger much slower guys so his speed still looks fast in relation to a Margarito etc.



QUOTE (The Ollie Reed Fan Club @ Jun 16 2011, 03:02 PM) *
Nevada could improve but the really smart money says you need to test all year round and randomly. And even then still the likes of Lance Armstrong and Marion Jones keep beating the tests, but year round will give you about the only good chance of consistently catching juicers.



IMO year round won't do shit to catch the educated. It will catch the small players & contenders but not the high level athletes.
Kusini
The real question for me is whether or not PEDs improve a fighters performance in the first place. So far Mosley has admitted using something in the De la Hoya fight..but he looked sh*t in thatfight. Vargas was caught against Oscar but he faded badly and KTFO. Nothing that makes me think the outcome of Toney-Ruiz and Jones-Hall would have been different though they were caught.

Is there any EVIDENCE that PEDs enhance a fighters performance? If so then most fighters could be cheating...
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (Kusini @ Jun 16 2011, 06:42 PM) *
If so then most fighters could be cheating...


I think every fighter on the planet will do whatever they can get away with.

Mayweather fighting nowhere but Nevada because they don't punish novocaine use is a prime example. Is it cheating? In my eyes it sure is because novocaine is a anastheic agent. Now some will say that if your hands are numb then you could do further damage by not feeling the same pain signals. The opposite is also true as you can punch as hard as you can for longer periods without feeling pain to the same degree. When you are fighting every 12-18 months that is plenty of time to heal any hand injury.

Hopkins is another example. He is a fighter fighting elite level competition at 46 & not only looking good but winning in impressive fashion. How is that so? Is he a freak? Is he gentically blessed? Is he a PED user? Probably a combination in reality.

Pac is going up in weight & not only holding his own but destroying his opposition. Is he on PED's? Or is he just using his natural talents?

All 3 guys I am sure will do whatever they can to gain a edge over their competition & they are not alone out there. That said all 3 have a tremendous work ethic & put in the hard yards inside the gym to hone their craft.

Who the fuck knows? I view all athletes as being on some form of PED or another & no sport is "clean".
Kusini
The issue of whether xylocane can be descpribed as performance enhancing has been discussed at length on this site and I agree that it enhances performance ( I may seem to be answering my own question here but I need to know whether other PEDs such as HGH or steroids actually enhance boxers performance..given Mosley, Toney, Vargas and Jones)

I am not convinced that Hopkins is using PEDs..in the same way I do with Manny. It's the double standard that gets to me, in the sense that Manny is being the suspect while Hopkins is not.
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (Fitz @ Jun 16 2011, 05:59 AM) *
That said, innocent until proven guilty in my eyes. All I'm saying is that it didn't just come down to people singling Pacquiao out randomly over Hopkins, it was just events leading up to it didn't help and was what got the ball rolling with the suspicions. The situation wasn't handled well at all by Manny and his team. I just think it's different to Hopkins.


Just out of interest Fitz, what do you think Hopkins' response would've been if Pascal's team had tried to introduce a random testing clause before their rematch? I bet Nard would've told him to fuck off.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (The Ollie Reed Fan Club @ Jun 16 2011, 08:41 PM) *
Just out of interest Fitz, what do you think Hopkins' response would've been if Pascal's team had tried to introduce a random testing clause before their rematch? I bet Nard would've told him to fuck off.


For sure. We all know Asians are weak people so having one putting beatings on all comers is unusual. Since it is unusual he must be on something.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (Fitz @ Jun 16 2011, 09:06 PM) *
Oh geeze. Haha.


Fitz does not understand.

Kusini
QUOTE (Fitz @ Jun 16 2011, 04:59 AM) *
It isn't a performance enhancer. Where it is legal in Nevada, I understand that it is only legal UP UNTIL 7 days before a fight. He is not allowed to use it in the last 7 days. The effect of it only lasts a short while, it wouldn't even be an enhancer the night before of the fight, forget it about doing anything 7 days from the fight, haha.


Hear ya, but to me if it makes you punch harder and more frequently than if you weren't on it, then it enhances your performance


QUOTE (Fitz @ Jun 16 2011, 04:59 AM) *
It has a lot to do with how Pacquiao and the team reacted to the proposition. Stories kept changing on why they didn't want it. Basically, it was handled poorly. Then looking at the performances, I suppose people get suspicious because Pacquiao has seemed to have an easier time with good bigger fighters, and has taken shots better as well. Basically everything looks easier.
Hopkins is also different to Pacquiao. Manny seems to be more of a fighter that relies on his physical attributes. Hopkins has relied more on his IQ and strucure/plan/discipline. The performances between the two are different, one looks like it compliments a more of an explosive one.

That said, innocent until proven guilty in my eyes. All I'm saying is that it didn't just come down to people singling Pacquiao out randomly over Hopkins, it was just events leading up to it didn't help and was what got the ball rolling with the suspicions. The situation wasn't handled well at all by Manny and his team. I just think it's different to Hopkins.


I have never heard Manny address the rationale regarding testing issue by himself. I think he's either been quoted by Arum or Roach most of the times and I believe that is what hurt him in the public eye. Then again I believe he's using Arum and Roach because he does not have a good command of English. I think if he just said "I am superstitioous about drawing blood 14 days before the fight" and stuck with it, then it would have been better. It's the different excuses that have hurt him.
caneman
QUOTE (BoxingWizard23 @ Jun 15 2011, 10:37 PM) *
Like I said. No one questions Ariza's background like how can a former medical nutritionist all of a sudden mysteriously was arrested for something to do with medicine and then jump into boxing as a Strength/conditions trainer?? All fighters he trained under were improved in all categories they never had before. No one questions that. Mayweather did go up in weight and suffered lost of power and a bit of speed. He was much faster at 140 and had wayyyy more power at the lower weights. While everyone suffers something when they go up and down in weight only Manny can do that without suffering anything but gaining everything and some new attributes all of a sudden under Ariza. Well Roach? you know his history with James Toney and another boxer that was caught with steroids right?? Let you think about it Cane.



It's all good man, I still say Pac didn't bring power up with him and is about as fast but again when he was @ 126, he would be 135-139 and now that he is @ 147 is only 144ish within a few lbs! Toney took something cause he was hurt but prolly needed it to show up @ the gym and do his work and as much as he is a boxing master, he needed something to do his roadwork! lol! Just kidding but hey it's Toney!

Look it's ok that not everyone agrees with me but pac doesn't have one punch power especially @ 147, he had more @ 140, he is more of throw 80 punches a round at you...or if you will death by a 1000 paper cuts!

Bottom line though as a few said, team pac handled it all wrong and should of said fuck off criminals...I was weighing 138ish when I was 126! Just cause Floyd couldn't do it like him don't mean he cheated!!!!!!!!! Pacman could live or die by his style and has been doing well! Floyd ran around the ring trying to not get hit and win by UD...that's Floyd which is fine, my point is it ain't as far off as Floyd and many of his fans say...but I admit it's nice to see a few of his fans that can see both side compared some of the reverse Pactard as of late! They all need Pacman to take the test? PETITIONS THE DAMN COMMISSION!
gravytrain
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Jun 16 2011, 02:50 AM) *
Comprehension slugger. Unless you think Russia & Bulgaria are 1st world countries that is??????

The only American athletes caught in the act are either too stupid for their own good or cannot afford the latest designer gear that is undetectable with todays testing. It would be detectable if it was looked for but the really good chemists work for the highest bidder not a poorly paid government body.

I am not talking about million $$ PED's I am talking about cunts like Marion Jones who used Balco & never failed a test. She was only caught because Conte grassed on every man & their dog not because of "olympic style testing".

All said & done guys with the type of capital like Pac & Mayweather could afford to have designer drugs manufactured & tailored to their genetic disposition & will never get caught in the act if they are juicing. If a fighter at that level is using PED's that are undetectable through todays technology they should still be worried about what happens if those samples are tested 10 or 15 years from now when the testing apparatus has evolved to detect the current elite level PED's.


Russia has one of the most well respected and best Olympic weightlifting teams. some PEDs were even created just to help them perform better. they might be Russian but they're not behind on anything and have been one of the top teams since the 1950s. still their athletes can sometimes test positive though and that's really just down to the laws of probability. if you're trying to time cycles throughout the year and especially during Olympic years there could be some unexplained fuck up.

there's not always the next undetectable substance, there are organizations that exist just to find out and test for them. it comes down to timing. Pac and Mayweather only get tested when they fight and they've scheduled testing, it's a lot easier to pass 1 urine that's scheduled for after your fight than numerous blood and urine tests. pro boxing is a sport where you've to be dumb or lazy to get caught, that's not really the case with the Olympic sports.
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (caneman @ Jun 16 2011, 07:59 PM) *
It's all good man, I still say Pac didn't bring power up with him and is about as fast but again when he was @ 126, he would be 135-139 and now that he is @ 147 is only 144ish within a few lbs! Toney took something cause he was hurt but prolly needed it to show up @ the gym and do his work and as much as he is a boxing master, he needed something to do his roadwork! lol! Just kidding but hey it's Toney!

Look it's ok that not everyone agrees with me but pac doesn't have one punch power especially @ 147, he had more @ 140, he is more of throw 80 punches a round at you...or if you will death by a 1000 paper cuts!

Bottom line though as a few said, team pac handled it all wrong and should of said fuck off criminals...I was weighing 138ish when I was 126! Just cause Floyd couldn't do it like him don't mean he cheated!!!!!!!!! Pacman could live or die by his style and has been doing well! Floyd ran around the ring trying to not get hit and win by UD...that's Floyd which is fine, my point is it ain't as far off as Floyd and many of his fans say...but I admit it's nice to see a few of his fans that can see both side compared some of the reverse Pactard as of late! They all need Pacman to take the test? PETITIONS THE DAMN COMMISSION!


So true Randy, when guys talk about Manny's punching power I don't get it, the dude has to hit them with virtually the kitchen sink before they'll go. Mosley was an exception but I truly believe Shane Mosley is a shot fighter with no legs.
Kusini
QUOTE (Fitz @ Jun 16 2011, 06:33 PM) *
You don't hear me though.

You CANNOT use it 7 days out from a fight. Considering this, numbing 7 days out from a fight will have zero effect. So how will it make him punch harder and more frequently, when it won't be used 7 days out from a fight?

Have you been to the dentist, or doctors where they have used an anesthetic? The numbing does not even last 24 hours, let along 7 days. It probably wouldn't even last several hours.
If you did go to the dentist, and got injected so you had no feeling around your mouth. I can promise you that if I was to punch you in the mouth 7 days later. You would be feeling it.
So not sure how you still think it will make you punch harder and more 7 days out from a fight. It's banned 7 days out.


I suspect that you did not read my post well. I said IF...

But it's interesting that it cannot be used 7 days before the fight. Do you know why?
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Invision Power Board © 2001-2014 Invision Power Services, Inc.