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The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (thehype @ Jul 8 2011, 10:01 PM) *
Ring size. VERY relevant when you're fighting a boxer who likes to stick and move (again Ollie, you're smarter than that, aren't you?).

$10 million penalty, VERY relevant to Pacquiao's side, otherwise they would have never asked for it. As for the "disgusting debacle", I believe if you do your research, you'll see that everyone was wishy-washy regarding the weight limit. Beristain kept bitching about the fact that they couldn't agree on the weight limit...and in fact, at one point, a couple of weeks before the fight, De La Hoya was asked about the weight limit and he said tune in to the weigh-in and everyone from Mayweather's camp kept saying it's a "welterweight" fight. Long story short, BOTH sides knew that Floyd wasn't going to fight him at no catchweight, otherwise that would give Pacquiao leverage at the negotiating table to say, "Hey, you fought Marquez at 144 so fight me at 144". The problem was that Marquez was coming up from lightweight, so in order to get people to quit focusing on the weight difference, Golden Boy Promotions thought it would be a good idea to play games regarding the weight limit. The agreement went something like, "Look, we ain't agreeing to fight at no catchweight because we don't plan on giving Poochiao a chance to ask for a catchweight, however, we'll get as close to 144 as we can and for your trouble, we'll fatten up your purse a bit." THAT was the agreement. THAT is what Beristain kept complaining about. THAT is what Golden Boy Promotions kept quiet about. I can assure you that there was no penalty ever taken out of Mayweather's purse.

Gloves. Like you said, Paccy won...so advantage Pacquiao.

And no, Marvelous Marvin Hagler would not have asked for extra testing, mainly because he wasn't in a position to. Perhaps if he would have stuck to his guns a bit on some of the other details, however, like a smaller ring size (which you seem to think is irrelevant) or 15 rounds instead of 12, perhaps he would have got the victory that night and had a couple more fights after that. In this example, it would have been Sugar Ray Leonard asking Hagler to take the extra special tests, and as you just pointed out, he would have happily agreed and just taken the tests in order to get the other guy in the ring to beat the shit out of him. Obviously, Manny Pacquiao doesn't share that same opinion as Hagler. LOL.

Just my two cents. None of that was directed to me though, so we'll have to wait and see what Sicko has to say about it.

laugh.gif

I must be bored. I have to go find some work to do. LOL.



Honestly Hype we'll just agree to disagree on this one.

Mayweather is a veteran champion and defensive specialist, one of the greatest of all time, I don't think a smaller ring will bother him one bit. As long as he has room to turn Manny I truly don't believe it will be a factor.

The $10 million penalty looks great on paper but let's face it, it doesn't mean shit to a guy who can make 147 eating a pack of Durrito's and guzzling a can of Coke on the scales. Sure looks good from Floyd's standpoint (what a concession!!) but all they are essentially agreeing to is that they will be fighting at no higher than 147, a weight Floyd makes comfortably anyways.

If someone who may be struggling to make the weight, say Cotto, had signed something similiar to this clause then yeah I can see how that would be a factor, but lets face it Floyd making 147 will NOT be a factor in this fight.

I think we can both agree neither guy is Hagler in this story.
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (Sicko @ Jul 8 2011, 10:28 PM) *
no disrespect but you sound like the TYPICAL PACQUIAO FAN, the answers and the replies are ALL THE SAME lol

"What Mayweather Agreed Upon Is Nothing" but a DRUG TEST is "MAJOR" thumbsdown_anim.gif


as for Hagler, guess what, Ray Leonard had his demands as well but eventually they fault...or I do you one better, how about when Hearns basically accused Ray Leonard of using Steroids...Ray Leonard didn't run and file a case in court...he say "I WILL TAKE WHAT EVER TEST THEY WANT ME TO TAKE!"

so you trying to drag Hagler into this and "WHAT WOULD HAGLER DO"....FAILED! taunt.gif Because Hagler did what ever he had to do to get Ray Leonard in the ring even if he had to agree to Ray Leonard's DEMANDS

Mayweather agreed to all of Pacquiao's demands but when he requested blood test...Pacquiao team started SCRABBLING! If Your Are Clean And Having Nothing To Hide...TAKE THE TEST!


laugh.gif
thehype
QUOTE (zucrates @ Jul 8 2011, 11:08 PM) *
I'm got a quick question too can you just call Floyd and do an article on what Floyd is really doing with his hands so all the SHOTS in the HAND questions and post will come to a head?


No, I'm not even going to bother to ask him a question like that because 1) even if he is using it during training, that's LEGAL to do, 2) many other fighters use it, 3) even Freddie Roach said he uses it and it's not a PED, and 4) I thought it was obvious that Floyd gets massage therapy and manicure to take care of his delicate hands (go watch the episodes of 24/7 Mayweather vs. Marquez for more info).

laugh.gif
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (thehype @ Jul 8 2011, 10:38 PM) *
No, I'm not even going to bother to ask him a question like that because 1) even if he is using it during training, that's LEGAL to do, 2) many other fighters use it, 3) even Freddie Roach said he uses it and it's not a PED, and 4) I thought it was obvious that Floyd gets massage therapy and manicure to take care of his delicate hands (go watch the episodes of 24/7 Mayweather vs. Marquez for more info).

laugh.gif



And Leonard to fluff his balls laugh.gif
thehype
QUOTE (The Ollie Reed Fan Club @ Jul 8 2011, 11:37 PM) *
Honestly Hype we'll just agree to disagree on this one.

Mayweather is a veteran champion and defensive specialist, one of the greatest of all time, I don't think a smaller ring will bother him one bit. As long as he has room to turn Manny I truly don't believe it will be a factor.

The $10 million penalty looks great on paper but let's face it, it doesn't mean shit to a guy who can make 147 eating a pack of Durrito's and guzzling a can of Coke on the scales. Sure looks good from Floyd's standpoint (what a concession!!) but all they are essentially agreeing to is that they will be fighting at no higher than 147, a weight Floyd makes comfortably anyways.

If someone who may be struggling to make the weight, say Cotto, had signed something similiar to this clause then yeah I can see how that would be a factor, but lets face it Floyd making 147 will NOT be a factor in this fight.

I think we can both agree neither guy is Hagler in this story.


Neither guy is Hagler, Leonard, Duran, OR Hearns.

And if none of those issues are a big deal because it's the consummate professional boxer Floyd Mayweather we're talking about and he won't have a problem with any of them, then taking a few blood tests that require a very minimal amount of blood shouldn't be a big issues for the warrior Manny Pacquiao who is a clean fighter that's willing to battle toe-to-toe and bleed for his country.

Kind of seems like a double standard.

I'm just sayin.
thehype
QUOTE (The Ollie Reed Fan Club @ Jul 8 2011, 11:41 PM) *
And Leonard to fluff his balls laugh.gif


Funny, but I thought that was Pacquiao who preferred for his adviser to sleep at the foot of his bed.

dntknw.gif

I'm just sayin.
FightHypeRules
Hype,

Fair enough on all counts. Not sure who Ross Thompson is, although I'm sure I should know. lol.

Perhaps that was the point? ha ha.

And finally yes, I would say you are LESS biased than others.
zucrates
QUOTE (FightHypeRules @ Jul 8 2011, 09:59 PM) *
Well you were repsonding to a post talking about him feeling that taking blood the day of the fight weakened him, and then you responded by saying "well he gave blood before the Hatton fight and flattened him".

Those were two completely different blood taking times. One (that he claimed to be weakened) was the same day.

The one where he "Flattened" Hatton, he took 3 weeks prior.

Not exactly an equal argument there. But I get your overall point. There's too many excuses coming from Manny's side.

I don't think he should have to give the tests, and I don't think him refusing means he's guilty or hiding anything. Think it has more to do with just not wanting to give in to Floyd's demands than him being guilty.

I just don't think his people has confidence in him being clean.

I feel what you are saying but I was looking at maybe it was the lack of food and liquids that made him weak not the blood. They took the blood the day of the fight because they lost the previous test. How many times had they tested fighters prior to that point in boxing? Also these fights are for big money how did they lose a test and why does Arum still trust them so much over the Olym style test. I know the second part is off the orig topic but they're branches. Its just alot of things going on thats hard to stomach.
zucrates
QUOTE (thehype @ Jul 8 2011, 10:38 PM) *
No, I'm not even going to bother to ask him a question like that because 1) even if he is using it during training, that's LEGAL to do, 2) many other fighters use it, 3) even Freddie Roach said he uses it and it's not a PED, and 4) I thought it was obvious that Floyd gets massage therapy and manicure to take care of his delicate hands (go watch the episodes of 24/7 Mayweather vs. Marquez for more info).

laugh.gif

I seen that same 24/7 and saw all that and I felt all your reasons but I've been reading a lot of shot questions and replies today (To Many) and if you or people posting say this or that people take it as op or bias. With answers coming from him saying whats exactly going on out goes op or bias ideas about it. Thats all just was tired of seeing people compare the shots or whatever he does to his hands to PEDS
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (thehype @ Jul 8 2011, 10:46 PM) *
Funny, but I thought that was Pacquiao who preferred for his adviser to sleep at the foot of his bed.

dntknw.gif

I'm just sayin.


And that's where all good advisors should be, at the foot of the bed. Ellerbee I think it is fair to say wants to be in the bed. laugh.gif
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (Fitz @ Jul 9 2011, 10:56 AM) *
Using proper PED during camp is absolutely not comparable to having and injection in your hand during training camp. PED gives you that edge to train 110% rather than 100%.


PED's allow you to train at 100% for longer just like painkilling injections allow you to punch at 100% for longer. At least any PED that is worthwhile for a boxer that has to make weight that is.......
Spyder
QUOTE (Fitz @ Jul 8 2011, 09:38 PM) *
You have actually been very funny recently, lol. Very subtle and doing it very well, I have been appreciating it, haha. Keep it up.

I resemble that statement! nono.gif
STEVENSKI
All this is bullshit. Fight Hype will do interviews with anyone that is relevant & willing to give their time to Ben & co. The fact is that due to the unprecedented access Ben has been getting means a lot more articles & interviews with Mayweather are going to appear on the front page.

Therefore it appears that this site is biased in Floyds favour. If it were the other way around & it was Pac giving a lot of exclusive interviews then people would still claim FH as biased.

I think Ben is pro Floyd & anti Pac based on what I have seen over the years but just because the site owner has his own opinion does not mean the site itself has a agenda to run Pac's name down.

Either way fuck both Pac & Mayweather. Instead of focusing on a fight that may never happen how about people focus on fights that are happening & are signed & dated. All the talk about Pac vs PBF is just speculation at this stage until a signed contract by both parties is delivered.
Fitz
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Jul 9 2011, 03:49 PM) *
PED's allow you to train at 100% for longer just like painkilling injections allow you to punch at 100% for longer. At least any PED that is worthwhile for a boxer that has to make weight that is.......


Nice. I didn't know licodaine helped increase your stamina/cardio.
Hops
I wont allow my opponent to fight at 100% by taking any form of immediate-effect drugs when hes not 100% due to effects of wear and tear.

Walstan86
For me, the important things are that Floyd is calling out Manny, even saying that he wants him next after Ortiz. That right there is HUGE. (Remember all that time of silence and ducking, etc...)

The other thing is that now Camp Pacquiao is saying (in no uncertain terms) that they are agreeable to "unlimited random testing".

Those are the two things the boxing world has been waiting to hear. Taken together, it looks like the fight is finally shaping up for next year.

Seems the only people not welcoming these developments are those who see it as another "trap" for Floyd to fall into, where he will get blamed again for the fight falling through if he doesn't agree to a testing agency other than the USADA. These people's nerves have been scraped so raw for so long as they've watched Floyd mocked and ridiculed, dragged down by the press and public, that they reflexively view every turn as another "attack". That's ok. They have reason to be sore. It's a heavy burden to carry the flag for Floyd.

But seen objectively (without suspicion and doubt), we've got the two camps talking at each other in public and the conversation is only going to get louder and clearer as the months go by. This is great news. HUGE.

One last thing: For Floyd fans, the USADA thing shouldn't be a problem. As you can see, Camp Floyd has shown in the past that they are ok with another agency doing the tests. http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/boxing/ne...tory?id=4772853
Spyder
QUOTE (Fitz @ Jul 9 2011, 03:26 AM) *
Nice. I didn't know licodaine helped increase your stamina/cardio.

No, but it does let you keep punching shit because your hands aren't fucking throbbing.
D-MARV
It's prettly clear to me that bob Arum will do anything in his power to try to mess this fight up! My hope is that Floyd says "Fuck It!, let's do it anyways!"

QUOTE
by Phil D. Jay

WBO welterweight champion Manny Pacquiao has given the clearest indication yet that he is willing to abide by the conditions laid down by Floyd Mayweather in order to get a 2012 fight between the two pound for pound greats. Mayweather, 35, has insisted that Pacquiao agrees to USADA (US Anti-Doping Agency) random drug testing before any potential fight between them and the Filipino is willing to agree if certain terms can be met.

The 32 year-old, according to promoter Bob Arum, has given the green light to the random testing, but has provisions set so that ‘Money’ doesn’t have negotiations all his own way. The eight-time world champion has offered to take the tests, but only if a neutral organization is involved, ruling out being tested by the USADA, which Mayweather wanted.

"We have agreed in the Pacquiao camp to unlimited random testing done by a responsible, neutral organization," Arum told an ESPN report.

"We don't believe USADA (United States Anti-Doping Agency) is a neutral organization.”

Top Rank supremo Arum has suggested that an organisation that deals with Athletes at Olympic level could be drafted in to administer the tests and replace the USADA for this special circumstance.

"I don't think anybody's test is as vigorous as the test administered by the Olympic Organization.

“If Mayweather says he's agreeable to us, then we can have the Mayweather vs Pacquiao fight next year," added Arum.



Source






gravytrain
QUOTE (D-MARV @ Jul 9 2011, 04:15 PM) *
It's prettly clear to me that bob Arum will do anything in his power to try to mess this fight up! My hope is that Floyd says "Fuck It!, let's do it anyways!"




Source


first he'll only agree to a cutoff and now he wants the most vigorous and unbiased testing available lol
D-MARV
QUOTE (gravytrain @ Jul 9 2011, 04:42 PM) *
first he'll only agree to a cutoff and now he wants the most vigorous and unbiased testing available lol

LOL...

Arum knows EXACTLY what he's doing and Pacquiao fans are going to eat this up if Floyd rejects this.



ChadSaysTakeTheTest
QUOTE (gravytrain @ Jul 9 2011, 01:42 PM) *
first he'll only agree to a cutoff and now he wants the most vigorous and unbiased testing available lol

It is unbiased. The standard commission testing has been proven to be beat. NOTHING WILL GET BY THE USADA
Walstan86
Sad all the "butthurted-ness" when there should be rejoicing by all.
gravytrain
QUOTE (D-MARV @ Jul 9 2011, 04:45 PM) *
LOL...

Arum knows EXACTLY what he's doing and Pacquiao fans are going to eat this up if Floyd rejects this.


i don't know how big of an issue it'll be but i don't see the fight happening for at least another year. i've got to give it up to Arum though, dude takes full advantage of having a PPV fighter.

QUOTE (ChadSaysTakeTheTest @ Jul 9 2011, 04:46 PM) *
It is unbiased. The standard commission testing has been proven to be beat. NOTHING WILL GET BY THE USADA


i think it kind of went over your head. originally Arum was saying there wouldn't be a fight with a cutoff, now he's saying this other organization has the most stringent testing and he'll only agree to use it.

QUOTE (Walstan86 @ Jul 9 2011, 05:37 PM) *
Sad all the "butthurted-ness" when there should be rejoicing by all.


what's there to rejoice about? there would really be something to rejoice about if Arum said "we agree to full random testing and have no problem with the USADA". now he's saying they're biased without even explaining how the hell the USADA could possibly be biased. this is just another chapter in what has amounted to two teenage girls talking shit to each other on Facebook.
Walstan86
QUOTE (gravytrain @ Jul 9 2011, 05:04 PM) *
there would really be something to rejoice about if Arum said "we agree to full random testing and have no problem with the USADA".

Floyd's camp has already said in the past they don't care if USADA is the one who does the tests. As long as it's unlimited random Olympic-style testing with no cut-off. I don't see how it could be a roadblock now.

http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/boxing/ne...tory?id=4772853
caneman
QUOTE (Walstan86 @ Jul 9 2011, 05:13 PM) *
Floyd's camp has already said in the past they don't care if USADA is the one who does the tests. As long as it's unlimited random Olympic-style testing with no cut-off. I don't see how it could be a roadblock now.

http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/boxing/ne...tory?id=4772853



yea but that was 2009...I'll believe it when sign a contract and are in the ring together and the bell rings!
Hops
You mean floydie changes his mind again and stick to USADA simply because he got kiddie-snubbed the first time?
Walstan86
QUOTE (caneman @ Jul 9 2011, 05:18 PM) *
yea but that was 2009...I'll believe it when sign a contract and are in the ring together and the bell rings!

Fair enough. lol
gravytrain
QUOTE (Walstan86 @ Jul 9 2011, 06:13 PM) *
Floyd's camp has already said in the past they don't care if USADA is the one who does the tests. As long as it's unlimited random Olympic-style testing with no cut-off. I don't see how it could be a roadblock now.

http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/boxing/ne...tory?id=4772853


why even make the USADA an issue? it's just petty bullshit. even if it's an issue he could just discuss it with Mayweather in mediation. instead of doing that he just publicly came out and said the USADA is biased and is 2nd rate.

these guys want to do and say everything except just talking man to man and making a fight without all the soap opera shit.
Hops
One thing left to do.

Here's what Floyd should say loud and clear:

"Hey BOB, put it in writing, sign it, send it to me and copies to journalists and I'll sign it".

Simple as that.

Walstan86
QUOTE (gravytrain @ Jul 9 2011, 07:45 PM) *
why even make the USADA an issue?

It wasn't an issue Floyd objected to last time. Why would it be an issue now? Can anyone think of a reason?
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (Fitz @ Jul 9 2011, 05:26 PM) *
Nice. I didn't know licodaine helped increase your stamina/cardio.


QUOTE (Spyder @ Jul 10 2011, 05:09 AM) *
No, but it does let you keep punching shit because your hands aren't fucking throbbing.


Spyder said it all really.
gravytrain
QUOTE (Walstan86 @ Jul 9 2011, 09:53 PM) *
It wasn't an issue Floyd objected to last time. Why would it be an issue now? Can anyone think of a reason?


why would he even come out and go to the media saying they can't use the USADA because they're not neutral? it's not like he couldn't talk to Leonard Ellerbe or someone about it through mediation once a fight between Pac and Mayweather could happen. he can't even prove they're biased.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (ChadSaysTakeTheTest @ Jul 10 2011, 06:46 AM) *
It is unbiased. The standard commission testing has been proven to be beat. NOTHING WILL GET BY THE USADA


Why should it be a American org? Why not a neutral one?

QUOTE (gravytrain @ Jul 10 2011, 08:04 AM) *
what's there to rejoice about? there would really be something to rejoice about if Arum said "we agree to full random testing and have no problem with the USADA". now he's saying they're biased without even explaining how the hell the USADA could possibly be biased.


It is a Ameican organization. Pac is not American & Mayweather is. There is clear potential for bias not to mention the fact that the USDA has failed to catch their own countries cheats in the past.

gravytrain
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Jul 9 2011, 11:37 PM) *
Why should it be a American org? Why not a neutral one?



It is a Ameican organization. Pac is not American & Mayweather is. There is clear potential for bias not to mention the fact that the USDA has failed to catch their own countries cheats in the past.


LOL like they've control over that. it's not like the athletes don't do everything they can to cheat the tests. are other organizations biased because they don't catch everyone? that's like saying that if Hopkins took the drug tests Pascal wanted it would be biased if they used WADA since it's based in Canada. if the USADA and WADA are biased who else is there?

personally i think Arum is just ready to make the fight and he's just spinning shit. he'll be the good guy and make concessions but they can't use the inferior and biased organization.
Hops
lol! Gravy, you may just well be right. Bob is ready to make the fight. He just doesnt want people to blame it on him that thefight got stalled.

STEVENSKI
QUOTE (gravytrain @ Jul 10 2011, 01:50 PM) *
LOL like they've control over that. it's not like the athletes don't do everything they can to cheat the tests. are other organizations biased because they don't catch everyone? that's like saying that if Hopkins took the drug tests Pascal wanted it would be biased if they used WADA since it's based in Canada. if the USADA and WADA are biased who else is there?


Well they have failed to catch many cheats in the past. Maybe they could use a neutral testing organzation possibly a European one? Bob has a point here I am afraid.



QUOTE (gravytrain @ Jul 10 2011, 01:50 PM) *
personally i think Arum is just ready to make the fight and he's just spinning shit. he'll be the good guy and make concessions but they can't use the inferior and biased organization.


Both sides have played this perfectly. They will double the money that will be made for stop-starting it for as long as they have. They have played the superfans like fiddles & I guarentee you that these fans would pay a PPV price of $109.95 now.

I will watch it on a stream to make sure my money does not go to Mayweather or go to a pub.
Fitz
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Jul 10 2011, 01:31 PM) *
Spyder said it all really.


It allows him to have a 'normal' training camp, it doesn't give him an edge like PED's do. He isn't building stamina and cardio, he isn't increasing strength, he isn't adding muscle.

I don't even know why I am having this debate, it's legal. I don't recall you having a problem with Danny Green drinking powerade or a different drink in his fight, even though it's illegal in most other states. Why didn't you? Because it's legal where Green done it. You don't have an issue with that, you shouldn't have an issue with this. I will stand corrected if you did imply Green was cheating and gaining an unfair advantage though, but I don't remember that.
But like I said, it's legal, so any argument against it holds no water.
thehype
LMFAO

SMH at some of you guys.

I thought terms were already agreed to this time last year. Why was USADA not an issue last year during the "second round of negotiations"?

dntknw.gif
thehype
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Jul 9 2011, 02:00 AM) *
I think Ben is pro Floyd & anti Pac based on what I have seen over the years but just because the site owner has his own opinion does not mean the site itself has a agenda to run Pac's name down.


Do you remember when I was telling everyone that I pick Pacquiao to beat Floyd by Unanimous Decision?

dntknw.gif

laugh.gif
FightHypeRules
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Jul 10 2011, 12:32 AM) *
Well they have failed to catch many cheats in the past.


Great point. How many olympians only were found out after they testified to congress once their career was over, or disclosed it in a book or interview? Athletes who were routinely tested under ODST type testing, and yet they never got caught.

This is why it's a meaningless thing to me. If Manny takes the test and fails, everyone will assume everything he's done is achieved via PED's.

If he takes it and passes, then people will just say it's undetectable whatever he's taking, and "You know how those Philipinos are, with their A-Side Meth" or some other excuse. He'll have cycled off in time, or the testing was flawed, or he had taken so much in the past, that it was still paying dividends while not being in his system anymore.

I guarantee you once he takes and passes these tests, there will not be a sudden rush of people who have smeared and slandered his name over the last few years coming forth to say "oh we were wrong, I guess he was clean the whole time".

Which is why, once again, I have no problem with the defamation lawsuit. His name and image has been irreparably damaged, and no amount of his accepting tests will change that nor would it have changed it if he had taken the tests the 1st time around, after Floyd and the rest of his dispicable family made baseless accusations, for the exact reasons I mentioned above.

On one hand i feel bad for anyone being maligned like that. On the other hand Manny,. Arum and Roach can suck a dick for all I care, as I can't really stand any of them bastards.

But right is right, and what Floyd and his family have done is definitely NOT right.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (Fitz @ Jul 10 2011, 06:13 PM) *
It allows him to have a 'normal' training camp, it doesn't give him an edge like PED's do. He isn't building stamina and cardio, he isn't increasing strength, he isn't adding muscle.


I would consider being able to punch as hard as you can longer in training because of painkilling injections to be performance enhancing. We must have different definitions of "normal". If you exercice body parts they do get stronger & more used to the workload. So having numbed up hands which will allow you to punch harder longer & therefore train harder will give you added benifits.



QUOTE (Fitz @ Jul 10 2011, 06:13 PM) *
I don't even know why I am having this debate, it's legal. I don't recall you having a problem with Danny Green drinking powerade or a different drink in his fight, even though it's illegal in most other states. Why didn't you? Because it's legal where Green done it. You don't have an issue with that, you shouldn't have an issue with this. I will stand corrected if you did imply Green was cheating and gaining an unfair advantage though, but I don't remember that.
But like I said, it's legal, so any argument against it holds no water.


As for Green lets be serious it was danny fucking Green against a no hoper from the USA. I could give a fuck if he drank Powerade or horse piss. Both guys are non entities in the scheme of world class boxing.

The other guy is regarded as one of teh best two fighters on the world. I also happen to despise him so yeah I will allow double standards when it comes to Mayweather just like the referees do when he rabbit punches & elbows.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (thehype @ Jul 10 2011, 06:38 PM) *
Do you remember when I was telling everyone that I pick Pacquiao to beat Floyd by Unanimous Decision?

dntknw.gif

laugh.gif


I do & it seems your opinion may have changed since you started getting Mayweather exclusives. Do you still pick Pac to beat him by UD or if you do still believe that would Floyd give you these inside access stories if you published that you think Floyd would lose to Pac?

Out of interest what is your opinion on who would win today?

Either way I don't really care as we are all entitled to our own opinions on the subject.

STEVENSKI
QUOTE (FightHypeRules @ Jul 10 2011, 06:41 PM) *
Great point. How many olympians only were found out after they testified to congress once their career was over, or disclosed it in a book or interview? Athletes who were routinely tested under ODST type testing, and yet they never got caught.

This is why it's a meaningless thing to me. If Manny takes the test and fails, everyone will assume everything he's done is achieved via PED's.

If he takes it and passes, then people will just say it's undetectable whatever he's taking, and "You know how those Philipinos are, with their A-Side Meth" or some other excuse. He'll have cycled off in time, or the testing was flawed, or he had taken so much in the past, that it was still paying dividends while not being in his system anymore.

I guarantee you once he takes and passes these tests, there will not be a sudden rush of people who have smeared and slandered his name over the last few years coming forth to say "oh we were wrong, I guess he was clean the whole time".

Which is why, once again, I have no problem with the defamation lawsuit. His name and image has been irreparably damaged, and no amount of his accepting tests will change that nor would it have changed it if he had taken the tests the 1st time around, after Floyd and the rest of his dispicable family made baseless accusations, for the exact reasons I mentioned above.

On one hand i feel bad for anyone being maligned like that. On the other hand Manny,. Arum and Roach can suck a dick for all I care, as I can't really stand any of them bastards.

But right is right, and what Floyd and his family have done is definitely NOT right.



+1
Fitz
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Jul 10 2011, 07:10 PM) *
I would consider being able to punch as hard as you can longer in training because of painkilling injections to be performance enhancing. We must have different definitions of "normal". If you exercice body parts they do get stronger & more used to the workload. So having numbed up hands which will allow you to punch harder longer & therefore train harder will give you added benifits.


That's the thing though, boxers don't train like that. They don't stand in front of a heavybag the whole time, focus pads etc and punch as hard as you can, that just isn't how you train in boxing. You may do a bit concentrating on punching hard, but they don't train like that. So he isn't there punching as hard as he can the whole time, it's more for discomfort.
It gets rid of discomfort, it isn't a supplement.

It's also banned because it's dangerous for the user, as they risk more injury with it. It's not banned because it's a PED. My dad is a doctor, and mum is a nurse, it's been used before here at home. It just isn't a PED no matter what people try and say, it just isn't.

They also have a schedule that they would follow, so I doubt they train for 'longer' anyways. They do what's on the schedule, and probably no more and no less, I'm pretty sure they would follow a strict training schedule.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (Fitz @ Jul 10 2011, 08:08 PM) *
That's the thing though, boxers don't train like that. They don't stand in front of a heavybag the whole time, focus pads etc and punch as hard as you can, that just isn't how you train in boxing. You may do a bit concentrating on punching hard, but they don't train like that. So he isn't there punching as hard as he can the whole time, it's more for discomfort.
It gets rid of discomfort, it isn't a supplement.

It's also banned because it's dangerous for the user, as they risk more injury with it. It's not banned because it's a PED. My dad is a doctor, and mum is a nurse, it's been used before here at home. It just isn't a PED no matter what people try and say, it just isn't.

They also have a schedule that they would follow, so I doubt they train for 'longer' anyways. They do what's on the schedule, and probably no more and no less, I'm pretty sure they would follow a strict training schedule.


Fair enough if your parents are Dr's then they would know best. I also understand that boxers do not put everything into all the shots they throw at training (see Uncle Rog's pad slapping). I should probably word it better. What it does mean to me at least is they can do the same level of training at a higher intensisty without suffering the inconvenience of pain or discomfort.

Whatever way it is cut I don't care. This fight has totally lost it's lustre for me not that I won't watch it. It will be like Lewis vs Tyson or Calzaghe vs RJJ where it should have happened years earlier & most fans will probably be left dissappointed by the end result.

Fitz
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Jul 10 2011, 08:26 PM) *
Fair enough if your parents are Dr's then they would know best. I also understand that boxers do not put everything into all the shots they throw at training (see Uncle Rog's pad slapping). I should probably word it better. What it does mean to me at least is they can do the same level of training at a higher intensisty without suffering the inconvenience of pain or discomfort.

Whatever way it is cut I don't care. This fight has totally lost it's lustre for me not that I won't watch it. It will be like Lewis vs Tyson or Calzaghe vs RJJ where it should have happened years earlier & most fans will probably be left dissappointed by the end result.


Well just my dad, my mum was just a standard 1st division nurse, but hasn't worked for quite a while. I only mentioned it because I am not an expert, but I do know a little bit from them. I remember when I was younger, my mum pierced my ear and used it on me before, haha. I just don't think you get an edge from using it in training. If used on fight night, yes, but not really during training. I think they are just able to train better, and without discomfort. Just like a headache, panadol would help that, and you train without discomfort.
I just don't imagine it being used, so he is able to train that little bit longer to get an edge. I think it's mainly to be able to train comfortably.

Though I definitely agree about it losing it's lustre
gravytrain
QUOTE (Hops @ Jul 10 2011, 12:34 AM) *
lol! Gravy, you may just well be right. Bob is ready to make the fight. He just doesnt want people to blame it on him that thefight got stalled.


more than likely.

QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Jul 10 2011, 03:32 AM) *
Well they have failed to catch many cheats in the past. Maybe they could use a neutral testing organzation possibly a European one? Bob has a point here I am afraid.





Both sides have played this perfectly. They will double the money that will be made for stop-starting it for as long as they have. They have played the superfans like fiddles & I guarentee you that these fans would pay a PPV price of $109.95 now.

I will watch it on a stream to make sure my money does not go to Mayweather or go to a pub.


the Euro ones aren't catching everyone either. no organization can. the big difference between the USADA and WADA is who they test and when they're testing them. beyond that you're looking at basically the same group, the USADA is just meant to test American athletes. if i legitimately thought they were biased i would admit it, it just doesn't make any sense. that's what makes me think that the USADA isn't the real problem and it's just posturing.

forget doubling the money on the fight, Arum has made out like a King on this. he might have even made out like Don King lol. this dude has made so much money drawing out the fight that it's almost too good to be true. and he made fighters work with him to fight Pac so he kept all the money. Arum has gotten paid just to get paid.

Walstan86
If it's unlimited random Olympic-style testing with no cut-off that Floyd wants, he shouldn't have any problem with the WADA doing it. The "agency" question wasn't a problem for Floyd in the past. It shouldn't be now.
thehype
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Jul 10 2011, 05:15 AM) *
I do & it seems your opinion may have changed since you started getting Mayweather exclusives. Do you still pick Pac to beat him by UD or if you do still believe that would Floyd give you these inside access stories if you published that you think Floyd would lose to Pac?

Out of interest what is your opinion on who would win today?

Either way I don't really care as we are all entitled to our own opinions on the subject.


That was my opinion during Mayweather's retirement...and I actually remember people laughing at me for even suggesting the idea of Manny Pacquiao fighting at welterweight.

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Go figure.

And don't be like some of these other idiots...you've been here long enough to know that my opinion changed LOOOOONG before we had any Mayweather interviews on the site.

You know, for some of you guys that have been around here even before FightHype was around, I'm really starting to get a little insulted with some of your comments and insinuations. WTF? I don't change my fvcking opinion about fights so I can get an interview with this guy or that guy. That's ridiculous. I wasn't running around telling everyone that Shane Mosley was going to whip Pacquiao....Shane Mosley was on the site all the time talking about how he was going to go toe-to-toe and knockout Pacquiao, but that didn't change my pick of Pacquiao by UD.

If you remember picking Pacquiao by UD over Floyd, then you should remember it was during Floyd's retirement when I said Pacquiao's punch output could be a problem for Floyd, who has been inactive for a long time and can be too defense at times, giving the impression to judges that the man throwing more punches, whether they are landing or not, is winning the round. I said Pacquiao by controversial UD....HOWEVER...that was BEFORE Floyd came back and whooped Marquez's ass with ease. After I saw that, forget about it....Mayweather by UD....EASY WORK! WOOOOOOOO! Okay, maybe not easy work, but not a difficult night at the office either.

So, now that I say that I pick Mayweather to win, that will prompt many to label me as biased, right? LOL. That being said, I have my opinion on quite a few other fights, and more than likely, you're probably going to see interviews with those fighters on the site, but that does not mean our fvcking predictions are leaning way or the other in order to keep getting interviews. WTF?
thehype
QUOTE (Walstan86 @ Jul 10 2011, 12:11 PM) *
If it's unlimited random Olympic-style testing with no cut-off that Floyd wants, he shouldn't have any problem with the WADA doing it. The "agency" question wasn't a problem for Floyd in the past. It shouldn't be now.


Again, I thought they already agreed to all of Floyd's terms during the "second round of negotiations." The "agency" question wasn't a problem for Pacquiao in the past. Why is USADA a problem now if they weren't a problem when they agreed before?

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And not for nothing, but why did Bob Arum say that in an interview on TUESDAY, but when I spoke to Michael Koncz on WEDNESDAY, he didn't mention anything about agreeing to "unlimited Olympic-style testing" or USADA being a problem, but he was still talking about a cut-off date and fear of giving blood? Did he just miss the memo?

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WHY CAN'T I GET AN ANSWER TO SOME OF THOSE QUESTIONS?

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WHY?

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Why Halle have to let a white man pop her to get a Oscar?

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Why Denzel have to be crooked before he took it?

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