Im impressed with this segment, and the way they dissected the prior bouts. It was great to hear the perspectives of both fighters and their trainers. Im glad this wasn't one of those weird staredowns with moments of wack dialogue. This is a way to get the fans/casual fans into the upcoming rubber match and help them pick up where the first two fights left off. The 24/7 material has been layed out, and makes for a great series. Have at it...

In all honesty, I thought it was the worst Face Off yet. These guys aren't "Face Off" material (though OBVIOUSLY deserving of the segment) - and I think it is evidenced by virtue of the fact that, 1.) They didnt even have these guys FACE-TO-FACE, and 2.) They had other guys there to hold their hands.

It just kinda sucked for a Face-Off format. That is not a knock on the guys. Both great fighters and decent guys. The format just doesn't fit the fighters. What's more, it seemed like HBO was fishing for drama/conflict.

Just my opinion.

It was a very good technical Face off. However, I was a bit uncomfortable with them standing Pacquiao and Marquez next to each other and talking about positioning and punching. It was great from a TV and technical perspective. In sports you just dont do that when the guys have a fight coming up. You dont stand the Falcons offense next to the Seahawks Defense and discuss positioning and strategy the week before the game.

I can repsect your opinion, I just saw it fit to conduct it in this manner, rather than sitting in front of each other. I say this based off of the past Pacquiao Face-Offs and how he isn't the best speaker in the world...though I believe he doesn't feel like talking most of the time and would much rather smile, wave, and shake hands. Marquez is almost sure to have an interpreter with him, though he freaks me out when he decides to suddenly buss out and speak English. With this being said, it was a great set-up because neither had to speak as much, and viewers were filled in on the first two bouts.


Yeah I highly disagreed with the simulation/gameplan giveaway that took place. Some things just shouldn't be put on television so soon..maybe it would've been appropriate during the replay of the fight, after its all said and done.

What had me cracking up was right off the bat Max introduces "The Great" Freddie Roach, and then says Nacho Bernstein.

Now without doing any research, I would say Nacho has had a lot and more great fighters he trained for a longer period of time. I just found that to be disrespectful to Nacho, and giving too much credit to Freddie mainly due to the success of Pac. Just my take.

Yep, Freddie made his name out of two guys that were already champs, Pacman and Toney.

Is it me, or is this Freddie Roach's favorite shirt?

I'd have to say that it was a great show. Almost like a southpaw vs conventional fighter's seminar. What thy've done isn't the same old thing. I like the face off with just the 2 fighters, but this one was pretty cool. Freddie Roach is a smart trainer, just too much of a cherry picker for Manny. Marquez looked like an O.G. Mexican gangster. He still has the fight burning inside of him. I'm glad Max Kellerman identified him as the lightweight champion of the world to remind the public that this is a man that fights 2 weight classes south. Whatever though. I think the face off had an impact on my lady because she expressed interest in buying the fight. Even though I hate Manny Pacquiao (she does as well), we have found interest in watching the great Juan Manuel Marquez do his thing. I think JMM is one of the toughest and best fighters around. I'd buy that fight for Marquez. I doubt we'll buy it. Maybe we'll just go to the sport's bar or to a fight party. Marquez wants to clear it up and Pacquiao wants to seal the deal. At least this time around, we can say he's facing someone who's coming to win. Too bad that cab driver Likar Ramos tainted Marquez' status coming into this fight by taking a dive. Marquez is the only fighter coming off of a KO victory that Manny has had the balls to face. Manny's advisor has tainted the fight by saying that he suggested putting the fight off for so long, and saying he hopes the weight will slow Marquez down. That's a way to lose respect. The moment I saw Koncz on that video, I saw the fight as tainted. In boxing, we don't wish to see people seek to exploit a fighter's weight. We want to see fighters get beat when they are at the top of their game. That's when fighters earn respect. Choosing to fight a guy, and hoping added weight will take some steam off of his competitive spirit, is a farce to me. Especially if everyone thinks you're the best fighter in the world. Be a man and stop looking for an advantage. Fight him where he's at his best, and you're at your best, and may the best man win.

Ay, for a moderator, you are surely hella active on these threads. I think that if someone says something that you don't like, you'd abuse your power and close the topic. If you're going to moderate, maybe you should limit your activity in these threads. Just my opinion. I see your name in these posts a lot, where as I hardly see Jack, Hype, or any of the other guys. Mod or post kid. I don't think you should do both. Who's side are you on anyway. You guys at fighthype think a guy who called a fighter 'Razor-head' should be able to close topics? It just seems odd to me. Can that guy as a moderator because he is not impartial.

What past Paq face-offs? From what I remember, this is the first "Face Off" that Paq has been a part of. No?

I thought it was kinda awkward, but get why they changed the format for these two guys. First off, Juan needs somebody with him to help translate anyway, and Manny is not the type of guy to sit across the table from a dude and act hard with him. They needed more parties involved to help spice it up, and Roach in this case is perfect, since HBO is all about giving him as much camera time as possible.

Agreed.

I only said it was the "worst" Face-Off by definition of what these segments are supposed to be - two guys, squared up in two small chairs at a small round table FACING OFF.

Given all of the valid points, they should have called this - SIT DOWN or something.

There was a Pacquiao-Margarito face off.

This one was boring. I didn't learn any new information. Marquez says he believes he won the fights, Pacquiao does too. Marquez says he wasn't hurt during the knockdowns, says the 3rd fight is going to be a war, blah blah. I can get that info from their press releases.

I don't even remember that (vaguely), but OK.

Co-sign. Dumbest one I've seen thus far. Max Kellerman asking them to stand up and demonstrate..."Guys, do you mind?" WTF? Was this a boxing instructional video? It did absolutely nothing to hype the fight, IMO.

...and then how Max was trying to create some controversy by centering on Paq hitting Marq as he was down. In all of these years, thats the first time I have ever seen/heard anyone point that out, let alone try and paint Manny as a dirty fighter.

Anyway...

Great points!

This was the best they could do, them not being face-off material and all.

Well thanks for noticing my activity, and I dont feel that I should limit my posts just because Im a moderator. First I hear complaints that other moderators aren't active enough, and now I hear you saying that Im too active. Cant please everybody though Moderator or not, you will always see my name on this board, so you may want to find a way to get used to it. How low of you to try and discredit my achievements, when you limited your own by proudly promoting the name "HazConvictedFelonMane".

I will continue to close duplicate or useless threads (if need be), and I dont see you doing too much about that. "You guys at FightHype think a guy named HazConvictedFelonMane should ever be granted the opportunity to close threads, let alone be considered for a moderator"? I always thought most of your posts were decent, no matter how futile other members deemed them. I find it odd that you hardly (if ever) acknowledged me on this board, but now you see "moderator" under my name, and your panties suddenly bunch up...typical though.

You are that guy that issued a bare knuckle brawl to the whole board, but never turned up. Remember? Typical YouTube internet warrior Keep hatin' Haz...I relish in knowing that you are not happy with yourself or your achievements (or lack there of). Oh yeah, if some of these words are hard for you to understand, then you can always look them before you respond out of context...I wont hold that against you. Thanks again


He had Face-Offs with Clottey, Cotto, and Margarito. See how forgettable they can be?

Are you serious? Are you sure they weren't "Countdowns"? Cuz I thought the whole "Face Off" format was relatively new. If Im wrong, then all the more to the point.

I understand why they tried to do a different setup for this Face Off. Yeah, they aren’t actually “facing off” but since English is both fighters second language it’s going to be difficult for them to really translate what they want to say very well. In a typical Face Off both fighters can feed off of what the other says, it’s more complicated (and boring) when there is a language barrier. So the producers of the show probably thought they should instead show video of their previous fight just to keep the ball rolling. Not saying it was the best idea but I see why they tried to switch it up. They know Pacquaio isn't one for hyping up a fight (after seeing his Face Off with clottey, cotto & maragrito that became pretty clear). So they gave Pac a Face Off b/c he has a big fanbase and they knew his fans would watch regardless.

Nah they were Face-Offs, but like I said, its really easy to forget about Pac's Face-Offs, but we all remember the beatdowns. Not much gets past you on this board, but those Face-Offs are easy to forget about. By far, my favorite one had to be Hopkins/Pascal...those dudes were hilarious!

I vaguely remember Paq/Marg, I def remember Hops/Pascal, Haye/Wlad, and Floyd/Ortiz. Other than that, I don't remember any.

Thats why I appreciated the set-up this time around, aside from the bullshit demonstration towards the end. Its hard to get into the Face-Off when one or both of the fighters needs an interpreter. If thats the case, then best believe there wont be much said during the 12-15 minute segment. Good post.


You're not alone on this one, I always have to look back myself.

Of course I agree there needs to be an interpreter, but if its two Spanish speaking guys, I'd be just as good with closed captioning as to not disturb any of the shit talking flow!

You are evil cshel86; just a glance at your avatar tells one so... bwahahaha, jk.

P34c3

I don't care to be a moderator my dude. No one tried to discredit anything you're doing, or done. More power to you homeboy, I'm happy for you. I'm just a blood thirsty fight fan from the roughest hood in NYC with an opinion. I just wanted to make a note of the way you can be impartial and possibly abusing your power. That's all. Nothing that I said was out of context. You responded with some kind of over zealous way that further proves my point. Yeah, I remember that. On that day I had some pressing business issues that were more important than going to Times Square that day. No big deal. I'm certainly not hating on you my dude. You're not important enough to hate on. Keep doing your thing though fella. It's all to the good. -Haz Mane The Convicted Felon.

This dude Cshel86 is one kind of piece of work. I wonder how you come up with this mythical statement of relishing in the fact that I am not happy with myself? Where do you get my wanting to be considered for a moderator position? I have acknowledged you before when I laughed at your razor head comment. Sounds to me that you are a little too happy with your position and suddenly, you are God's gift to an OBC forum. You're just a little mad because I implied that you should get canned as a moderator. You take that as I'm hating on you when I clearly stated that it was just my opinion (which probably doesn't count for much but I am entitled to it). Ay look, I relish in the fact that I provided your jolly feel good moment of the day based strictly on false pretenses. If it makes you feel better, I'm really unhappy with my accomplishments (or lack there of) and I wish I were you. You have the best job in the world and I so envy you with every fiber of my very mediocre existence. Now enjoy the rest of your day, and don't work too hard. Peace. -The Convicted One

Im just wondering why you even take the time to make a galant effort at sharing your opinion (which doesn't mean much) about me on a thread that doesn't warrant it. Whats up with the "abusing your power" mess that came out of nowhere? I find it funny that it took you almost 4 hours to respond to some mess that you created, then you actually tried to sound intelligent, which is not one of your characteristics.

First, you come at me on a thread with your opinion, which could've been settled via PM...and that gives me every reason to believe that you were trying to put on a show. Then you brought up something I said about Ortiz (calling him a "Razor-Head") and questioned how could I even be a moderator because Im impartial, then you had the nerve to laugh at the comment that I made about him. Really? So this is what we have...a guy who wants to play tough and make off-the-wall comments about me to put on a show, then he comes back and tries to clean it up...sounds like a Victor Ortiz move to me.

I dont care about any "pressing business issues" that you had to take care of, being from the roughest hood, and any of that other hogwash that you are promoting. Trust me, it doesn't matter to me the least bit. All that concerns me contributing to this board and everyone else that does, because those are my "pressing business issues". I do whats asked of me on this board, so dont try to say that I take my job too seriously. Do you even have one? Do yourself a solid from now on, and relieve yourself of all duties of being concerned about what I do.

There is a time and thread for all of this, and this aint one of 'em. The next time you decide to "share" your personal/professional opinion of me, be sure to go about it in the right manner. Thanks again Haz.

You should complain to Jack. He usually listens to guys like you over mods.

I didn't like that either. I'd forgotten all about it in fact. Never heard anyone say anything about it since.

I agree..

I think its HBO's way of matching Pac with Floyed given all the current controversy...

Just my thoughts on that..

My thoughts exactly. When that happened, I was like... "Are these dudes really goin' over their gameplan... with each other?"

Well what Max Kellerman went over isn't really a 'game-plan'. I've only followed boxing closely for about 4 years now and I picked up long ago that when you have an orthodox fighter vs southpaw, the rule of thumb is to place your front foot on the outside of your opponents front foot. The best punch vs a southpaw is the straight right hand and vice verse southpaws strongest punch is the straight left.

I think the majority of casual boxing fans which is the majority of ppv buyers do not know this and HBO did an amazing job by using two of the top p4p fighters and their future hall of fame trainers to demonstrate a well known aspect in the orthodox vs southpaw match up

Yeah HBO was definitely trying to start some controversy with that. Pacquiao did hit Marquez while Marquez was down but I wouldn't say it was dirty. When you see an opponent trying to stay up by hanging on the ropes you don't just say oh okay he's knocked down. You hit him till you know hes down. Sure the video shows us that Marquez glove was clearly on the canvas but when you are actually IN the fight that is down to the split second which I don't hold against Pacquiao in any way

Hopkins/Pascal face off is a classic....and I wished they did this face off segments back when Roy Jones and James toney were coming up. Imagine the the vernacular of James Toney and the uber assholeness from Roy it just oozes of pure classicness.

Whats Up cshel?

God that was shit. They needed their trainers for this segment and it still was boring. I might not buy the fight. I know how Marquez got knocked down and all that foot positions needed to place a good shit is already known to me.

I really do hope James Toney beats that Russian boy so he can get back on HBO and hopefully his own 24/7 segment with a face off, it will be hilarious.

Even the Floyd/Ortiz face off was better than this.

I have no recollection of them doing these face-offs before this year. Honestly I think the first one I was aware of was Bradley and Alexander.

Pac I'm pretty sure already had a face-off this year with Mosley though.

How's a Toney-Hopkins face-off sound?

That would be the best fight out of the ring, no question. It would be an instant classic. I can see Hopkins getting on Toney's lack of grammar and pronunciation.(Obviously do to being hit too many times in the head)

I can see Toney getting on Hopkins age and past opponents and having an opinion that Hopkins is a good opportunist. It would smell, taste, hear and i see it as an instant classic.

It easily outdoes Haye/Wlad and Hopkins/Pascal face off's.

Wished they also had a 24/7 segment for SRR and the Leonard's, Duran's and Hearns.

Pac had face off's with Marg's, Cotto, Clottey, Mosley and now Marquez. Notice Manny has the same jacket as Floyd now that's weird or maybe coincidence don't you think? Or am I just reaching too far with that.

Yeah, and since Bradley will be Pac's opponent next year, expect a Bradley/Pacquiao face off which will be 10x more boring than this one. SMH

They could sell tickets for such an event. Guaranteed punches would be thrown or at least some rolling around the ground action. Haha.

Tell me about it! Anything dealing with RJJ, Toney, and Hopkins, having some camera time is always worth a watch. Hopkins/Jones II Face-Off would've been worth the watch, though the fight was nothing to talk about.


I wont hold that against you in the meantime...hell, I thought I was the only one that noticed Freddie's favorite green shirt. Good ol' Freddie! Lol

LMFAO!!! Roach always has that green shirt on. It's like Martinez's main trainer always has on glasses even during a fight.

Maybe, Roach's favourite color is green. Who knows??

Good ol' Freddie I tell ya! He does what he does well though...cant argue with that.

I think so too. As much as these two surely respect each other there is no way they could do a face off where it wouldn't get seriously heated.

A James Toney face off with anybody would feature the threat of violence. He would shit-talk and shit-talk until he pissed the other dude off, and if he couldn't piss the other dude off, HE would get pissed off. (which is actually what I think would happen with Hopkins)

How about if they had done a Tyson-Ruddock face-off 20 years ago? That would have been intense as hell.

Here's probably the closest thing we'll get to a Toney face off.

Notice the format of this show...Face off looks a lot less original now doesn't it...

Good shit. The studio audience laughing it up took away from it though I thought.

That famous Roy Jones-James Toney split screen interview was kinda face-off ish too.

How do you guys post youtube here? And on the subject, how do you post photos? I can't seem to do any of it.

Spyder you helped me out once with my avatar (lol) and told me how to search the archives without getting that board message. Can you tell me how to post youtube and photos??? Help your boy out!

I have the slightest clue how this turned into a Classic Face-Off thread, but Im damn sure enjoying it! How could anyone forget about this one...



These two always put on a great show when they go at eachother!

Damn i didnt even know Bradley and Alex did one... im have to Tube that one.. (when im ready to bed tonight)..




Given Roy's late night infomercial, and music video's... Id say he has had plenty of camera time..Shit nowadays he's sleepin through his...lls

Tony and Bernard both cant pronounce words worth shit... that would would look and sound like some typa charitiy event..