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Fitz
I've seen that Cotto is replacing Steward as a trainer, first Dawson and now Cotto.

I was interested to see how Cotto worked with Steward in this fight. As Steward trained fighters to fight tall, use the jab and clinch when necessary. These were all things that caused Cotto to fall short against Margarito. Not sure what to think of this, and don't know much about this trainer that he now has (Pedro Luis Díaz), but regardless, I hope it works out for Cotto. Don't think it will happen, but would love nothing more for Cotto to end Margarito's career.
thehype
Cocaine is a helluva drug.
BoxingEinstein

Cotto is making a bad mistake. Steward can help him make the adjustments neccessary to help him win the fight. I just hope this new trainer he got isn't as bad as that replacement trainer he had at the Pacman fight. That trainer was terrible all he was saying during when Cotto was getting pummeled was, "Keep it up, Keep it up, your doing good, very good." While Cotto was a bloody mess, I feel this will only make matters worse.
STEVENSKI
Manny was probably smoking herb the whole time he was training & laughed at Cotto's ability to stumble like a drunk around the ring.

As a side note I hope Margarito smashes his head in again.
BoxingEinstein
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Oct 4 2011, 05:37 PM) *
Manny was probably smoking herb the whole time he was training & laughed at Cotto's ability to stumble like a drunk around the ring.

As a side note I hope Margarito smashes his head in again.


WTF?! Your urging on a noted cheater like he deserves it or something. As a boxing fan I have lost all respect for Margarito and any less from Bob Arum for allowing that trifling son of a bitch to still box. Heck, he should've just let the man be a sponsor for casts, clay, or some other shit. My perception of you had drastically changed and I may lose respect for you for even hoping some fucked up shit like that. I hope Cotto retires Marg's for good!!!
Cshel86
QUOTE (BoxingEinstein @ Oct 4 2011, 05:44 PM) *
WTF?! Your urging on a noted cheater like he deserves it or something. As a boxing fan I have lost all respect for Margarito and any less from Bob Arum for allowing that trifling son of a bitch to still box. Heck, he should've just let the man be a sponsor for casts, clay, or some other shit. My perception of you had drastically changed and I may lose respect for you for even hoping some fucked up shit like that. I hope Cotto retires Marg's for good!!!

I understand your argument about the wraps, but look at it this way...illegal wraps or not, Margarito was still touching Cotto the WHOLE fight. Thats why I feel that he will still beat Cotto again, unless Cotto's gameplan and defense changes. He was getting stalked throughout the fight, and he kept his head stuck out like an Ostrich and invited those Margarito uppercuts all night.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (BoxingEinstein @ Oct 5 2011, 08:44 AM) *
WTF?! Your urging on a noted cheater like he deserves it or something. As a boxing fan I have lost all respect for Margarito and any less from Bob Arum for allowing that trifling son of a bitch to still box. Heck, he should've just let the man be a sponsor for casts, clay, or some other shit. My perception of you had drastically changed and I may lose respect for you for even hoping some fucked up shit like that. I hope Cotto retires Marg's for good!!!


There is no evidence that Margarito cheated in that fight. I simply cannot support a fighter who shapes their eyebrows. I should also add it is not so much I want to see Margarito win I just enjoy seeing Cotto lose.

TheFonz
QUOTE (cshel86 @ Oct 4 2011, 05:53 PM) *
I understand your argument about the wraps, but look at it this way...illegal wraps or not, Margarito was still touching Cotto the WHOLE fight. Thats why I feel that he will still beat Cotto again, unless Cotto's gameplan and defense changes. He was getting stalked throughout the fight, and he kept his head stuck out like an Ostrich and invited those Margarito uppercuts all night.



You are right, but the question is how would have Cotto handled those "touches" if they where from fist instead of bricks?
BoxingEinstein
QUOTE (cshel86 @ Oct 4 2011, 05:53 PM) *
I understand your argument about the wraps, but look at it this way...illegal wraps or not, Margarito was still touching Cotto the WHOLE fight. Thats why I feel that he will still beat Cotto again, unless Cotto's gameplan and defense changes. He was getting stalked throughout the fight, and he kept his head stuck out like an Ostrich and invited those Margarito uppercuts all night.


I too still think Marg's will win as Cotto threw everything at him but the kitchen sink and still was getting hit by them slow ass uppercuts. Now, by Cotto switching Steward with a trainer that he hasn't been under since his amature days only provokes knowledgable boxing fans' minds to think that this only makes things worse for him.

Right now I see this fight stopped around the 10th round by TKO or a UD for Marg's until I see some other shit that makes me change thoughts.

btw, when has Marg's ever cut up or bloodied any other boxer besides Cotto in his career?? Even during his sling of stopping opponents he still hasn't make any of them showed cuts. The man before that didn't even have KO power but now all of a sudden he just knocking people out.
Cshel86
QUOTE (TheFonz @ Oct 4 2011, 05:57 PM) *
You are right, but the question is how would have Cotto handled those "touches" if they where from fist instead of bricks?

He had no choice but to handle those "touches" because he was getting towered over, walked down and corned all night. Cotto did an exceptional job of slipping most of those punches early in the fight, but down the stretch, he just couldn't keep Margarito off of him...that would've happened without the plaster (if there ever was any) because thats how Margarito fights.
EAlbian
QUOTE (TheFonz @ Oct 4 2011, 04:57 PM) *
You are right, but the question is how would have Cotto handled those "touches" if they where from fist instead of bricks?


we don't know that the wraps were actually loaded, thats why this fight is happening. I hate Margs way more than Cotto, i just think style wise Margarito is all wrong for him
EAlbian
QUOTE (cshel86 @ Oct 4 2011, 05:06 PM) *
He had no choice but to handle those "touches" because he was getting towered over, walked down and corned all night. Cotto did an exceptional job of slipping most of those punches early in the fight, but down the stretch, he just couldn't keep Margarito off of him...that would've happened without the plaster (if there ever was any) because thats how Margarito fights.


+1
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (BoxingEinstein @ Oct 5 2011, 09:04 AM) *
btw, when has Marg's ever cut up or bloodied any other boxer besides Cotto in his career?? Even during his sling of stopping opponents he still hasn't make any of them showed cuts. The man before that didn't even have KO power but now all of a sudden he just knocking people out.


Ask & ye shall receive

JONdaCON817
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Oct 4 2011, 04:57 PM) *
There is no evidence that Margarito cheated in that fight. I simply cannot support a fighter who shapes their eyebrows. I should also add it is not so much I want to see Margarito win I just enjoy seeing Cotto lose.



The evidence was the dried blood on the cast blocc he tried to put in there. And unfortunately a lot of ppl get there eyebrows done. Maybe its a PR thing or an Eastcoast thing. Shyt maybe its a pretty boy thing but its actually pretty common around me.

I guess you prefer Margs Mexican rat tail?
BoxingEinstein
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Oct 4 2011, 05:57 PM) *
There is no evidence that Margarito cheated in that fight. I simply cannot support a fighter who shapes their eyebrows. I should also add it is not so much I want to see Margarito win I just enjoy seeing Cotto lose.



No evidence?? Jesus Christ man, open your fucking eyes and use common sense. The man was denied by the Nevade State Commission to get his liscense renewed to fight in Las Vegas. The man had no KO power, then all of a sudden goes onto KO numerous opponents out of nowhere. Marg's was never known for knockout power. The man beats Cotto and then in the Mosley fights gets caught with some cast that hardens when sweat/water is applied on. Nazim even stated that Marg's had the face of a guilty person and his trainer at the time looked nervous. Of course, Marg's mind state would be different after being caught with something. The man claims he doesn't know what the fuck was in his handwraps like he didn't look at it when his trainers wrapped them. Your simply a Cotto hater end of story.
Method
QUOTE (BoxingEinstein @ Oct 4 2011, 06:13 PM) *
No evidence?? Jesus Christ man, open your fucking eyes and use common sense. The man was denied by the Nevade State Commission to get his liscense renewed to fight in Las Vegas. The man had no KO power, then all of a sudden goes onto KO numerous opponents out of nowhere. Marg's was never known for knockout power.

Hell, man, Daniel Santos came into his fight w Margarito as a light heavy and by the mid rounds, Marg started knocking him around the ring before the doctor called an advantageous stoppage for Santos,who was starting to fade.
TheFonz
I stand by my prediction that Cotto wins via making Cheato's head explode.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (JONdaCON817 @ Oct 5 2011, 09:10 AM) *
The evidence was the dried blood on the cast blocc he tried to put in there. And unfortunately a lot of ppl get there eyebrows done. Maybe its a PR thing or an Eastcoast thing. Shyt maybe its a pretty boy thing but its actually pretty common around me.

I guess you prefer Margs Mexican rat tail?


I am at work so I have to be selective about what langauage I use. It is a metro thing & I simply cannot respect a man who plucks their eyebrows. Margarito & anyone with a rats tail is a bogan. Margs happens to be a Mexican bogan. Nothing wrong with being a bogan mind you. Hell a lot of Bogans take pride in being one.



STEVENSKI
QUOTE (BoxingEinstein @ Oct 5 2011, 09:13 AM) *
No evidence?? Jesus Christ man, open your fucking eyes and use common sense. The man was denied by the Nevade State Commission to get his liscense renewed to fight in Las Vegas.


I am waiting for the evidence that he chated in the Cotto fight. We all know about the Mosley one it is on the public record.



QUOTE (BoxingEinstein @ Oct 5 2011, 09:13 AM) *
Your simply a Cotto hater end of story.


At least you got something right in your post.
EAlbian
QUOTE (BoxingEinstein @ Oct 4 2011, 05:13 PM) *
No evidence?? Jesus Christ man, open your fucking eyes and use common sense. The man was denied by the Nevade State Commission to get his liscense renewed to fight in Las Vegas. The man had no KO power, then all of a sudden goes onto KO numerous opponents out of nowhere. Marg's was never known for knockout power. The man beats Cotto and then in the Mosley fights gets caught with some cast that hardens when sweat/water is applied on. Nazim even stated that Marg's had the face of a guilty person and his trainer at the time looked nervous. Of course, Marg's mind state would be different after being caught with something. The man claims he doesn't know what the fuck was in his handwraps like he didn't look at it when his trainers wrapped them. Your simply a Cotto hater end of story.


you are talking about after the fact. No KO power? the guy has 27 ko's in 38 fights haha. I'm not saying i don't think he cheated but you can't just jump to that conclusion and convict the guy. He got caught in the Mosley fight, we saw what happened. Obviously I think his mindset was effected in that fight. Doesn't change the fact that Cotto doesn't take a good punch and doesn't like to get hit(see mosley(ran) and judah(low blows)). He hurt Manny to the body, gloves weren't loaded.
TheFonz
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Oct 4 2011, 06:25 PM) *
I am waiting for the evidence that he chated in the Cotto fight. We all know about the Mosley one it is on the public record.





At least you got something right in your post.



I am putting a block on your hate. It will not effect the outcome of this fight.
Method
QUOTE (EAlbian @ Oct 4 2011, 06:26 PM) *
you are talking about after the fact. No KO power? the guy has 27 ko's in 38 fights haha. I'm not saying i don't think he cheated but you can't just jump to that conclusion and convict the guy. He got caught in the Mosley fight, we saw what happened. Obviously I think his mindset was effected in that fight. Doesn't change the fact that Cotto doesn't take a good punch and doesn't like to get hit(see mosley(ran) and judah(low blows)). He hurt Manny to the body, gloves weren't loaded.

His mindset wasnt affected, the OVER WEIGHT LOSS last minute due to a faulty scale is what killed him.
STEVENSKI
I just want to see this happen again. Cotto can convince himself it was the "wraps" all he likes but in the back of his mind he will still remember that he was beaten down & broken by the man opposite him.



EAlbian
QUOTE (Method @ Oct 4 2011, 05:35 PM) *
His mindset wasnt affected, the OVER WEIGHT LOSS last minute due to a faulty scale is what killed him.


are you saying that the scale was off so he had to lose extra weight at the last minute? I've never heard that, that would be an interesting insight into the way the fight played out
TheFonz
I'm pretty sure Mosley killing that body and bouncing right hands off of his dome had something to do with it also. I like how everybody is making excuses for his loss against Mosley when he is the one that was caught cheating. FOH.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (TheFonz @ Oct 5 2011, 10:19 AM) *
I'm pretty sure Mosley killing that body and bouncing right hands off of his dome had something to do with it also. I like how everybody is making excuses for his loss against Mosley when he is the one that was caught cheating. FOH.


Who is this "everyone"? I have not seen anyone make a excuse in this thread for his loss to Mosley. I don't think anyone has really made excuses for that loss from my memory on here. Wraps or no wraps Mosley would have beat him that night in his last good performance.
EAlbian
QUOTE (TheFonz @ Oct 4 2011, 06:19 PM) *
I'm pretty sure Mosley killing that body and bouncing right hands off of his dome had something to do with it also. I like how everybody is making excuses for his loss against Mosley when he is the one that was caught cheating. FOH.


+1

You have no idea the joy I received from witnessing this beating. I hate Margs, I hope Cotto wins. I really would have liked to see Pac beat him so severely that he could never fight again(almost did too). However I try to look at the sport objectively and can't take away from his performance in the first fight with out real proof. I wish Capetillo would have just manned up and said "we cheated this whole time" he really has nothing to lose at this point
King Eugene
I'm starting to think Marg just might have Cotto's number like he has Cintrons. I wouldn't be surprised to see a repeat of the first fight but I'll be rooting for Cotto.
Method
Margarito gonna fuck him up again something fierce.
MaxPayne
To be honest, I'm of the opinion that Margarito had been fighting with loaded handwraps his entire career, leading up to the Mosley fight where it was finally discovered by Brother Naazim. We will never be able to prove it, but that's my belief.

Had Steward been in his corner, I would have been confident that Cotto would win this match. Now that Steward is not manning the corner, I'm less confident, but were I betting on the outcome, I would go with a Cotto victory.

At first I thought it was more of a scheduling conflict, but the fact that he's so willing to walk away from the guy who essentially helped rebuild his career at 154 lbs. is a little disturbing. I'm sure Cotto feels he can win without Steward, but I question how sound that reasoning is.

The Ollie Reed Fan Club
I don't think it as the wraps that killed Cotto (although they sure didn't hinder it) it was the pressure. We had already seen what pressure does to Cotto in the Mosley and Judah fights but here was a guy who applied pressure to Cotto for 3 minutes of every round, round after round.

Manny did the same thing but to a higher level. Anytime Cotto faces a guy who makes him fight a full 3 minutes he gasses, panics and ultimately folds. Margarito by 10th round TKO.
gravytrain
QUOTE (The Ollie Reed Fan Club @ Oct 4 2011, 09:34 PM) *
I don't think it as the wraps that killed Cotto (although they sure didn't hinder it) it was the pressure. We had already seen what pressure does to Cotto in the Mosley and Judah fights but here was a guy who applied pressure to Cotto for 3 minutes of every round, round after round.

Manny did the same thing but to a higher level. Anytime Cotto faces a guy who makes him fight a full 3 minutes he gasses, panics and ultimately folds. Margarito by 10th round TKO.


all of those bums either lost or had luck on their side. Cotto got hit with bricks round after round and it barely phased him. the only thing Pac did on a higher level was cherry pick

Arum better higher a priest for this fight, Margarita is going to need his last rites read to him before the 10th.
Cshel86
QUOTE (The Ollie Reed Fan Club @ Oct 4 2011, 09:34 PM) *
I don't think it as the wraps that killed Cotto (although they sure didn't hinder it) it was the pressure. We had already seen what pressure does to Cotto in the Mosley and Judah fights but here was a guy who applied pressure to Cotto for 3 minutes of every round, round after round.

Manny did the same thing but to a higher level. Anytime Cotto faces a guy who makes him fight a full 3 minutes he gasses, panics and ultimately folds. Margarito by 10th round TKO.

I totally freakin' agree! Though Cotto is the fan favorite, that wont keep Margarito off his ass. In the first fight, Margarito was the underdog to unqualified observers, but in this fight, he's the bad guy, so he really doesn't have anything to lose this time around. I expect to see two or even three times the pressure on Dec. 3rd. Yeah Cotto isn't in love with fighting 3 minutes a round, only when he's in control. If his defense can hold up for 3 minutes a round, EVERY round, then he will be okay...it will just be a technical fight, where I see Cotto playing it safe.
BoxingEinstein
QUOTE (EAlbian @ Oct 4 2011, 08:00 PM) *
+1

You have no idea the joy I received from witnessing this beating. I hate Margs, I hope Cotto wins. I really would have liked to see Pac beat him so severely that he could never fight again(almost did too). However I try to look at the sport objectively and can't take away from his performance in the first fight with out real proof. I wish Capetillo would have just manned up and said "we cheated this whole time" he really has nothing to lose at this point


The joy I had was utterly brilliant. Mosley's last hurrah was and will always be legendary. That night he looked liked a possessed man. I still believe that all that extra raw energy Mosley had and those neck breaking bombs he threw were all because Nazim told Mosley Margarito was going to try to retire him with casts, basically cheat him. Mosley was throwing those bombs in the 11th round like he was trying to kill him. If only Mosley would've fought Floyd like that he probably would have dropped Floyd a couple times and if he'd fought Pacman like that it would've been a war.

Prime Mosley stops Pacman within 8 rounds

Prime Mosley stops Margarito within 9 rounds

Prime Mosley stops Floyd within 11 rounds or gets a SD win.
BigDDatHomey
I thought when Cotto boxed he did well. But he would only do it for about 30 seconds before Marg got to him and pounded em. If Cotto boxes, he wins. Cotta was much quicker, lighter on his. The question is can he do it all night and will those ghosts come back to haunt him. I definitely wouldn't have gotten rid of Emmanuel Stewart though.

The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (cshel86 @ Oct 5 2011, 02:59 PM) *
I totally freakin' agree! Though Cotto is the fan favorite, that wont keep Margarito off his ass. In the first fight, Margarito was the underdog to unqualified observers, but in this fight, he's the bad guy, so he really doesn't have anything to lose this time around. I expect to see two or even three times the pressure on Dec. 3rd. Yeah Cotto isn't in love with fighting 3 minutes a round, only when he's in control. If his defense can hold up for 3 minutes a round, EVERY round, then he will be okay...it will just be a technical fight, where I see Cotto playing it safe.


In fact to elucidate a bit further, go back and have a look at his fights as far as the 3 minutes applies. Cotto loves fights were he can get to the outside for 15-20 seconds and just bounce up and down and reset. And most of his opponents let him do it. Since his 'comeback' fight after Pacman both Foreman and even Mayorga gave him spots in each and every round where he could do just that.

Margarito will give him no such space. I'll be pulling hard for Cotto in this one but Margarito is (and always will be) poison for him.

Gravy is gonna take this one hard I can tell laugh.gif
gravytrain
i wont be taking anything hard. taking Kylie's sig will be easy.
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (gravytrain @ Oct 5 2011, 04:01 PM) *
i wont be taking anything hard. taking Kylie's sig will be easy.


Methinks this is an intentional (yet totally appropriate) misspell.
STEVENSKI
Anyone see the scene in American Me where the Mafia don's son gets a good time from the boys? Cotto is that son & Margarito is Puppet. That boy gonna get his shit pushed in real good this time around & I am looking forward to it. I always liked when Cotto gets hit he gives that confused look like I can't believe he actually hit me. Expect that look a lot en route to a savage beating from Margarito.
Cshel86
QUOTE (The Ollie Reed Fan Club @ Oct 4 2011, 10:50 PM) *
In fact to elucidate a bit further, go back and have a look at his fights as far as the 3 minutes applies. Cotto loves fights were he can get to the outside for 15-20 seconds and just bounce up and down and reset. And most of his opponents let him do it. Since his 'comeback' fight after Pacman both Foreman and even Mayorga gave him spots in each and every round where he could do just that.

Margarito will give him no such space. I'll be pulling hard for Cotto in this one but Margarito is (and always will be) poison for him.

Gravy is gonna take this one hard I can tell laugh.gif

Man Im almost hesitant to see this one. The first couple of rounds will be pure hype, due to the fans yelling and feeling that they're getting their justice, but as soon as Margarito gets settled and Cotto realizes that he's really in a fight (which hasn't been in since the Pacquiao fight), then he will revert back to what he knows after everything fails. First, when his offense doesn't make the cut, then he realizes AGAIN, that he can't contain Margarito...that good ol' mental lapse will kick in at that point.

Maybe he will survive better this time instead of taking a knee and getting beat to submission afterwards. Arum has done Cotto no justice by putting him in there with guys that will rarely give him a hard time (Mayorga) or none at all (Foreman), and still make money off of him while robbing him of some good preparation for a big fight. Now he's back in their with the guy that successfully derailed his career from jump. When I saw him in the Foreman fight, I was more concerned than impressed...though Foreman didn't give him shit at all. Cotto appeared to be frail and hesitiant, but dialed in towards the end.
gravytrain
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Oct 4 2011, 11:11 PM) *
Anyone see the scene in American Me where the Mafia don's son gets a good time from the boys? Cotto is that son & Margarito is Puppet. That boy gonna get his shit pushed in real good this time around & I am looking forward to it. I always liked when Cotto gets hit he gives that confused look like I can't believe he actually hit me. Expect that look a lot en route to a savage beating from Margarito.


i think you've the fight confused with your average weekend.
Lil-lightsout
QUOTE (BoxingEinstein @ Oct 4 2011, 10:05 PM) *
The joy I had was utterly brilliant. Mosley's last hurrah was and will always be legendary. That night he looked liked a possessed man. I still believe that all that extra raw energy Mosley had and those neck breaking bombs he threw were all because Nazim told Mosley Margarito was going to try to retire him with casts, basically cheat him. Mosley was throwing those bombs in the 11th round like he was trying to kill him. If only Mosley would've fought Floyd like that he probably would have dropped Floyd a couple times and if he'd fought Pacman like that it would've been a war.

Prime Mosley stops Pacman within 8 rounds

Prime Mosley stops Margarito within 9 rounds

Prime Mosley stops Floyd within 11 rounds or gets a SD win.


This pains me to say it but I agree with this completely.
Cheesey1
QUOTE (STEVENSKI @ Oct 4 2011, 05:57 PM) *
There is no evidence that Margarito cheated in that fight. I simply cannot support a fighter who shapes their eyebrows. I should also add it is not so much I want to see Margarito win I just enjoy seeing Cotto lose.


Ha!! that was funny. Although I'm not supporting margacheato, I agree with you about the awful eyebrows.
BoxingStill#1
QUOTE (EAlbian @ Oct 4 2011, 06:07 PM) *
we don't know that the wraps were actually loaded, thats why this fight is happening. I hate Margs way more than Cotto, i just think style wise Margarito is all wrong for him


Cotto losses this fight..

Though I fail to find the interview someone ask Cotto "what is the difference between the last fight and this one?"

Cotto replies "the man in my corner"

Well.... now what the hell is the difference?

Cshel86
All the signs add up...the Home Dept Hurricane wins it. It will be a slow and hard-to-watch beating for Cotto down the stretch...maybe worse than the first fight if he gets caught good enough and mentally folds. Im sure we will get our money's worth though! Anybody wanna sig bet?
Mean Mister Mustard
Wraps or no wraps, Margarito still has a granite chin. Cotto better smack him to the body and testicles or else the Tornado is going to annihilate him.
The Ollie Reed Fan Club
QUOTE (thehype @ Oct 5 2011, 10:20 AM) *
Cocaine is a helluva drug.



Has his career gone to Bolivian? laugh.gif

Man when are you gonna reactivate TeamfightHype? laugh.gif
kingknockout
cotto's a natural brawler, he can't fight that great going backwards....if he could fight as good as he could going forwards going backwards he possibly could have won the first match against marg, but even still marg wasn't stopping...cotto got tired.
STEVENSKI
QUOTE (gravytrain @ Oct 5 2011, 02:17 PM) *
i think you've the fight confused with your average weekend.


Nah men don't fuck me. You may be confused with Cotto & Malignaggi as I reckon they had more action in the hotel room than they did in their fight.

QUOTE (Fitz @ Oct 5 2011, 07:09 PM) *
Good one....now we are going to have to hear how unappreciative we all were, again, lol.


We are Fitz. We just got no respect.
STEVENSKI
That is some nice action Fitz. I wish I could spread a couple bets on the following but it is coming up four years since I have had a bet.


Margarito $2.62

Margarito KO/TKO - $5.20

Antonio Margarito Round 7-9 12.25
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