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Cshel86
Check out DiBella's interview (9/28/11) about Ortiz as well, lol. Gotta love DiBella! OSDT will be in the mix for this rematch.



Thoughts?
checkleft
Now this is what I'm talking about... I still don't think berto is ready but who knows how ortiz will fight after the ko. If how odlh and hatton fought after they fought may is any preview to how victor will perform this may be a good thing for berto. I feel a ko in this one
caneman
QUOTE (checkleft @ Nov 4 2011, 10:33 PM) *
Now this is what I'm talking about... I still don't think berto is better but who knows how ortiz will fight after the ko. If how odlh and hatton fought after they fought may is any preview to how victor will perform this may be a good thing for berto. I feel a ko in this one

Huh? How DLH fought after May? lol He beat Forbes badly and got smoked by Pacman. Are you saying the fight with May trashes DLH? laugh.gif A SD win that was fairly close? I hope not but I won't be surprised I guess! laugh.gif

I'll take Ortiz again in another good fight!
checkleft
QUOTE (caneman @ Nov 4 2011, 11:51 PM) *
Huh? How DLH fought after May? lol He beat Forbes badly and got smoked by Pacman. Are you saying the fight with May trashes DLH? laugh.gif A SD win that was fairly close? I hope not but I won't be surprised I guess! laugh.gif

I'll take Ortiz again in another good fight!

At the risk of resembling Allen iversons practice speech, we talking about Forbes? Seriously..
I got victor too though.
Cshel86
I have to give this one to Ortiz again, though I wouldn't be mad if Berto walked away with the victory. Victor just gave Berto all he had in the first half, but I noticed how he (Ortiz) stopped punching after the 5th round. Hell, the fight was about 2 or 3 more connected punches away from being stopped, and thats AFTER Ortiz gave Berto everything he had in the first half in which he was controlling.

Though Victor dropped Berto at the end of the 6th, dude's leg were still shot from those punches he took up until the 6th round. So, this shit could still go either way, but I lean slightly towards Ortiz still. Im wondering if this is gonna be on B.A.D. or a PPV...wouldn't mind paying for it though.
caneman
QUOTE (checkleft @ Nov 4 2011, 10:58 PM) *
At the risk of resembling Allen iversons practice speech, we talking about Forbes? Seriously..
I got victor too though.



So you are saying FMJ trashed or ruined DLH?
checkleft
I wouldn't go as far as that for Oscar. I would just say he emptied whatever he had left in the tank
Ortiz is young though, and fun to watch. So hopefully he's back in form, shit maybe even make him better.
caneman
QUOTE (checkleft @ Nov 4 2011, 11:10 PM) *
I wouldn't go as far as that for Oscar. I would just say he emptied whatever he had left in the tank
Ortiz is young though, and fun to watch. So hopefully he's back in form, shit maybe even make him better.



Well I am pretty sure Ortiz won't be hugging and kissing his opponent anytime soon. rolleyes_anim.gif

I disagree on DLH but he was @ the age where that could happen...you just kinda make it sound like that was a dominate, one sided fight. I think DLH just thought he was gonna get this easy payday vs Pacman and it didn't think weight would matter. In fact I believe fishnets could still have some good fights in him. I would like to see him shake things up @ 154 for a minute and I am no DLH fan by any means!
checkleft
Haha yea I hope used up all his hugs and kisses in the mayweather fight.
Cshel86
QUOTE (checkleft @ Nov 5 2011, 12:51 AM) *
Haha yea I hope used up all his hugs and kisses in the mayweather fight.

Hahaha!!! That shit was foul! Kiss a dude after you headbutt, smh. He had to know that some foul shit was about to follow, lol. Low and behold, Floyd came back with that combo and had Victor's ankles in the air! Im still wondering how the hell he let Berto almost take the fight away from him after he dominated the first half of it and almost had him outta there dntknw.gif
caneman
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 4 2011, 11:56 PM) *
Hahaha!!! That shit was foul! Kiss a dude after you headbutt, smh. He had to know that some foul shit was about to follow, lol. Low and behold, Floyd came back with that combo and had Victor's ankles in the air! Im still wondering how the hell he let Berto almost take the fight away from him after he dominated the first half of it and almost had him outta there dntknw.gif



lmao, he had foul shit coming before that in the form and elbows and forearms laugh.gif No excuse for flying headbutts I think it's fair to call it though!
kidbazooka1
I see Ortiz takeing another strap away from Berto but maybe this time by stoppage. Berto was strarting to look like sh*t right before they stopped his last fight.
gbh32001
Ortiz will look amazing again by TKO'ing Berto and the next thing we know, he'll fighting JMM or the Congressman. All orchestrated by GBP-TR.
bnoles4life
Personally, I'm really interested in seeing this fight, for a couple of reasons:

1. It was an EXTREMELY good fight and I'm curious as to how the rematch will play out.

2. ALL eyes will be on Victor once again. Initially, there was a lil' bit of sympathy (mainly the anti-Floyd crowd) for what happened. Nearly two months later, that sympathy has waned and been replaced, largely, by scrutiny. Though no one is talking about the fight any longer, but I've heard less and less about "sucker punch" and more about "mental weakness", "inexperience" and (dare I say) "quitting" (oooh, there's that word again).

IMO, Victor is in the limelight once again to PROVE he's not a quitter. It's one thing to have that moniker, but to shed it, only to be branded yet again? Now, I'm not saying this is the general consensus, much less, if it's fair, but I, for one, am interested as to how he'll handle this again. I mean, the first fight w/ Berto, Vic was "hungry", now this second, in which state of mind will he be? Moreover, what if Berto is the "hungry" one this time?

This is can be an interesting fight......put it on B.A.D., but STILL use the 24/7 format. This way, the people who ate up Victor's past will tune in, while actually promoting Berto and giving fans insight to his struggles (Haiti disaster).
Cheesey1
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 4 2011, 11:20 PM) *
Check out DiBella's interview (9/28/11) about Ortiz as well, lol. Gotta love DiBella! OSDT will be in the mix for this rematch.



Thoughts?

I hope that this is really a done deal. If the next fight is as good as the last one, then I couldn't ask for anything more.
Sunni6Killer
What happened to the Randall Bailey fight?
HazConvictedFelonMane
With no PED accusations what so ever, I think that Berto will come out on top. Nobody knows if Ortiz had cheated his way to the victory. Nobody knows what exactly Manny and Freddie told him. When Larry Merchant asked Ortiz what was the advice they gave him, he stutter stepped on his answer. I know the OSDT showed us a different Victor Ortiz. He got hit by a shot that he rose from against Berto. A shot that was shorter and looked to be more powerful than what Floyd's looked like. I'm only speculating though. I think the PED testing will have no impact on the outcome of the fight and I think Berto wins by KO. He kicked his game up in round 6. The way Berto fought in round 6, is the way he's always been. Quick and powerful. Ortiz gets his ass handed to him this time around. Berto retains championship and goes on to face either Bailey or Jones. I'd personally like to see him kick Jones' ass and shut his mouth already.
Cshel86
QUOTE (caneman @ Nov 5 2011, 01:12 AM) *
lmao, he had foul shit coming before that in the form and elbows and forearms laugh.gif No excuse for flying headbutts I think it's fair to call it though!


Hell, Ortiz could've used that as an excuse (Floyd's elbows and forearms) instead of that BS story that he pulled out of his ass in the post-fight interview laugh.gif "Hey, he was using his elbows and forearms to foul me, so I got tired of it and fouled him back, ya know? I mean, I dont mind, ya know? Its okay though." - Victor Ortiz voice laugh.gif Him using this excuse would've at least put some of the heat on Floyd (which isn't hard to do), but instead, he made it seem as if he was getting his ass kicked and got frustrated.

QUOTE (bnoles4life @ Nov 5 2011, 11:20 AM) *
2. ALL eyes will be on Victor once again. Initially, there was a lil' bit of sympathy (mainly the anti-Floyd crowd) for what happened. Nearly two months later, that sympathy has waned and been replaced, largely, by scrutiny. Though no one is talking about the fight any longer, but I've heard less and less about "sucker punch" and more about "mental weakness", "inexperience" and (dare I say) "quitting" (oooh, there's that word again).

IMO, Victor is in the limelight once again to PROVE he's not a quitter. It's one thing to have that moniker, but to shed it, only to be branded yet again? Now, I'm not saying this is the general consensus, much less, if it's fair, but I, for one, am interested as to how he'll handle this again. I mean, the first fight w/ Berto, Vic was "hungry", now this second, in which state of mind will he be? Moreover, what if Berto is the "hungry" one this time?

Ortiz has a long career ahead of him and a bunch of "shaking off the quitter role" to do. He has SEVERAL fights ahead of him, so he cant afford to fold anymore. I mean damn, I would prefer to just get KO'd cold rather than quitting. Quitting leaves too much to the imagination of viewers, and none of those thoughts are good ones. If he would've hung on for those last few seconds of the Maidana fight or steered cleared, then Im pretty sure that fight would've been stopped on that bad cut over his eye.

So in this rematch, Im pretty sure Ortiz may end up taking it away again...if and only if he stays focused and continues to fight after the first half. If he does anything otherwise (like he did in the first fight), then Berto may just take it away like he almost did the first time.
bnoles4life
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 5 2011, 12:16 PM) *
Ortiz has a long career ahead of him and a bunch of "shaking off the quitter role" to do. He has SEVERAL fights ahead of him, so he cant afford to fold anymore. I mean damn, I would prefer to just get KO'd cold rather than quitting. Quitting leaves too much to the imagination of viewers, and none of those thoughts are good ones. If he would've hung on for those last few seconds of the Maidana fight or steered cleared, then Im pretty sure that fight would've been stopped on that bad cut over his eye.

So in this rematch, Im pretty sure Ortiz may end up taking it away again...if and only if he stays focused and continues to fight after the first half. If he does anything otherwise (like he did in the first fight), then Berto may just take it away like he almost did the first time.


Cshel...THAT reason exactly makes me think he may feel the pressure. I mean, if you believe the articles on FH about GBP needing $$$$, how much more $$$$ do they risk investing in him? They know he CANNOT lose THIS fight. To lose to Berto, after beating him PRIOR to losing the May fight, will be looked upon as regression.

This fight differs from the last, as this is a MUST win for BOTH, but for different reasons.

Berto looks to "right" a "wrong" (as he may perceive it). He's looking to avenge...he may be the hungrier of the two.

Ortiz is back to proving something himself..AGAIN. There's a great deal of pressure on him AND his camp after that debacle of a fight AND PRESS CONFERENCE.

I don't like Vic in this fight...something about it.

DISCLAIMER: This is predicated on the assumption that Berto can make it in the ring w/o gassing out.
checkleft
QUOTE (Sunni6Killer @ Nov 5 2011, 11:40 AM) *
What happened to the Randall Bailey fight?

Yea dude wth, or are they just simply looking past Bailey?
Cshel86
QUOTE (bnoles4life @ Nov 5 2011, 01:36 PM) *
Cshel...THAT reason exactly makes me think he may feel the pressure. I mean, if you believe the articles on FH about GBP needing $$$$, how much more $$$$ do they risk investing in him? They know he CANNOT lose THIS fight. To lose to Berto, after beating him PRIOR to losing the May fight, will be looked upon as regression.

This fight differs from the last, as this is a MUST win for BOTH, but for different reasons.

Berto looks to "right" a "wrong" (as he may perceive it). He's looking to avenge...he may be the hungrier of the two.

Ortiz is back to proving something himself..AGAIN. There's a great deal of pressure on him AND his camp after that debacle of a fight AND PRESS CONFERENCE.

I don't like Vic in this fight...something about it.

DISCLAIMER: This is predicated on the assumption that Berto can make it in the ring w/o gassing out.


You're right, just like Ortiz cant afford to fold again, GBP cant afford to get rid of a fighter that sells tickets...regardless of his performances. Top Rank didn't wanna deal with Ortiz anymore, so they let him go and GBP gave him a chance. I dont know where the hell Ortiz is gonna go if he screws this up. GBP has had money problems for the longest, and I wouldn't be surprised if Oscar happens to make a comeback for a few more fights to keep GBP's finances afloat.

Truthfully, Ortiz is always gonna have to prove himself from the Maidana fight until he takes his last breath. In this lifetime or the afterlife, whether he goes to heaven or hell, he will still have to prove himself laugh.gif I must admit, when he gets in the ring to prove himself, he performs great! Its just hard to watch him on the night where screws himself and comes up short, smh. Ortiz will always be a great fighter, even if refuses to believe that he's the only one responsible for his possible demise in this sport.

bnoles4life
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 5 2011, 12:59 PM) *

Truthfully, Ortiz is always gonna have to prove himself from the Maidana fight until he takes his last breath

Well, he will until he fights Maidana again

I must admit, when he gets in the ring to prove himself, he performs great![/b][/i]

I'm assuming you're talking about the Berto fight. So, we're gonna call the Peterson draw.....whaaaaat?

Ortiz will always be a great fighter[/b][/i]

Hmmm, here's where we may differ a lil'. I don't consider him a great fighter....a very good one, yes. Great? Uuuh, nope...not yet, at least. He has very good skills and enormous ability...however, he's 24/25, been a champ and we're still using the word "potential" w/ him. IMO, the word "great" (along w/ warrior) is thrown around far too often in sports and definitely, in boxing. When I think of great fighters, I usually don't have to question if he's going to "show up" tonight? If things get tough, how will this guy perform? IMO, greatness is multi-factorial. Meaning, it's not just physical ability, but intangibles as well. I think Vic has a heaping dose of the former, but has been short-changed somewhere along the line, in regard to the latter.
Cshel86
QUOTE (bnoles4life @ Nov 5 2011, 03:00 PM) *
Truthfully, Ortiz is always gonna have to prove himself from the Maidana fight until he takes his last breath

Well, he will until he fights Maidana again

I must admit, when he gets in the ring to prove himself, he performs great![/b][/i]

I'm assuming you're talking about the Berto fight. So, we're gonna call the Peterson draw.....whaaaaat?

Ortiz will always be a great fighter[/b][/i]

Hmmm, here's where we may differ a lil'. I don't consider him a great fighter....a very good one, yes. Great? Uuuh, nope...not yet, at least. He has very good skills and enormous ability...however, he's 24/25, been a champ and we're still using the word "potential" w/ him. IMO, the word "great" (along w/ warrior) is thrown around far too often in sports and definitely, in boxing. When I think of great fighters, I usually don't have to question if he's going to "show up" tonight? If things get tough, how will this guy perform? IMO, greatness is multi-factorial. Meaning, it's not just physical ability, but intangibles as well. I think Vic has a heaping dose of the former, but has been short-changed somewhere along the line, in regard to the latter.

I guess I can ride with your opinion of him being a good fighter, but not a great fighter. Maybe I said he was a great fighter because I wouldn't mind watching him fight, win or lose. He doesn't fail to disappoint when he gets in there to prove himself and put on a good show...but yet, he doesn't fail to disappoint when he gets in there, comes up short, and finds a way quit either...it goes both ways in my opinion.
bnoles4life
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 5 2011, 02:18 PM) *
I guess I can ride with your opinion of him being a good fighter, but not a great fighter. Maybe I said he was a great fighter because I wouldn't mind watching him fight, win or lose. He doesn't fail to disappoint when he gets in there to prove himself and put on a good show...but yet, he doesn't fail to disappoint when he gets in there, comes up short, and finds a way quit either...it goes both ways in my opinion.



LOL. Very well framed. LOL. I agree, I'll always watch him fight. He's very entertaining, but I don't get that "great" feel from him. Again, I think this Berto fight is going to be interesting.
Cshel86
This fight is a great way to start off the new year, unlike Bradley/Alexander stinkin' it up and for 2011 and leaving us in doubt of how the rest of the calender year will look for the sport. We've had a few "WTF" fight moments, but the end of the year shoud close out great. I slightly lean towards Victor in this one, but its still a toss-up. If anything, its gonna have to top the first fight.
sduck
If Ortiz shows up, he will beat Berto again. Berto is tailor-made for a fighter like Ortiz.
checkleft
Yea idk if he will ever be great, but he's a top fighter.. he floored everyone except may, so he's fun to watch, and his losses haven't been to any pushovers. Fighting maidana as a prospect = not a good idea lol
kingknockout
berto has much more to prove in my opinion...he lost to victor who went on and got beat by mayweather.....mayweather also chose the winner of the two...and he's one of two of the biggest names in boxing right about now, I know berto was pissed he missed a shot at probably his biggest pay day ever, BUT the fame that went with it. He might not ever get that opportunity to face floyd mayweather again.

the only thing I hate about this fight is, berto isn't patient enough now in his career to straight up "box" like a lamont peterson, berto is all about going in there, looking impressive in front of the crowd, and trying to KO somebody, he's all about the knockout or embarrassing the hell out of his opponents, not saying that nothing is wrong with that, but sometimes you just need to win...worry about looking like a KO artist your next fight, just box the way you were told and win the fight. If you try to impress the people out there, and wind up gassing yourself out, and landing into deep waters trying to hold on for dear life, it's YOUR fault.

You try to give the boxing fans what they want far as ring performance and you can wind up on that canvas. Don't fight for the people, fight for you.

He simply can't take the same approach as he did against victor in this fight....that's why I can't really pick him to win. The last thing berto is trying to do is go 12 rounds.
BoxingEinstein
QUOTE (kingknockout @ Nov 6 2011, 01:44 AM) *
berto has much more to prove in my opinion...he lost to victor who went on and got beat by mayweather.....mayweather also chose the winner of the two...and he's one of two of the biggest names in boxing right about now, I know berto was pissed he missed a shot at probably his biggest pay day ever, BUT the fame that went with it. He might not ever get that opportunity to face floyd mayweather again.

the only thing I hate about this fight is, berto isn't patient enough now in his career to straight up "box" like a lamont peterson, berto is all about going in there, looking impressive in front of the crowd, and trying to KO somebody, he's all about the knockout or embarrassing the hell out of his opponents, not saying that nothing is wrong with that, but sometimes you just need to win...worry about looking like a KO artist your next fight, just box the way you were told and win the fight. If you try to impress the people out there, and wind up gassing yourself out, and landing into deep waters trying to hold on for dear life, it's YOUR fault.

You try to give the boxing fans what they want far as ring performance and you can wind up on that canvas. Don't fight for the people, fight for you.

He simply can't take the same approach as he did against victor in this fight....that's why I can't really pick him to win. The last thing berto is trying to do is go 12 rounds.


One of the best post i've seen on this site in awhile. THIS is why Mayweather is undefeated. He fights only to WIN, not for people who only cares for entertainment in 1 night and thats it. Well, now Mayweather seems to now bring the aggressiveness we haven't seen since his 130 days back out, i wonder if it will cost him in future fights? We will see, i call his style now moreso "Controlled aggression". good post king.
Cshel86
QUOTE (kingknockout @ Nov 6 2011, 01:44 AM) *
berto has much more to prove in my opinion...he lost to victor who went on and got beat by mayweather.....mayweather also chose the winner of the two...and he's one of two of the biggest names in boxing right about now, I know berto was pissed he missed a shot at probably his biggest pay day ever, BUT the fame that went with it. He might not ever get that opportunity to face floyd mayweather again.

the only thing I hate about this fight is, berto isn't patient enough now in his career to straight up "box" like a lamont peterson, berto is all about going in there, looking impressive in front of the crowd, and trying to KO somebody, he's all about the knockout or embarrassing the hell out of his opponents, not saying that nothing is wrong with that, but sometimes you just need to win...worry about looking like a KO artist your next fight, just box the way you were told and win the fight. If you try to impress the people out there, and wind up gassing yourself out, and landing into deep waters trying to hold on for dear life, it's YOUR fault.

You try to give the boxing fans what they want far as ring performance and you can wind up on that canvas. Don't fight for the people, fight for you.

He simply can't take the same approach as he did against victor in this fight....that's why I can't really pick him to win. The last thing berto is trying to do is go 12 rounds.



Good shit KingKO! I believe I posted something along these lines back when the Mayweather/Ortiz fight was announced, since Berto was crying about PEDs and a rematch. You really nailed it on the head though...cant argue with any part of this post. Floyd shitted on Berto's chance at a rematch, but saved his ass at the same time because it was too soon and the results of the rematch would've been the same laugh.gif
kingknockout
thanks einstein and cshel

lol at the pernell whitaker gif
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