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MaxPayne
So much good stuff on the front page article on Ben's latest discussion with Ariza.

I can't fucking believe that Arum and Koncz are trying to pin the latest performance on Ariza. If that's the case, that they're secretly trying to get Ariza removed, then this is the bullshit right here. Ariza may not be everyone's type of guy, but let's all be honest:

He knows his shit and keeps it 100 at all times, which a guy like Manny who is constantly surrounded by Yes Men clearly needs.

He's the guy who has has helped Manny grow into a full-fledged welterweight.

He's generally well respected in the industry and has the credentials and experience to be anyone's S&C coach.

Does all of this simply come back to the fact that Ariza bitch slapped Koncz the fuck out because that motherless piece of shit wanted to work Manny's corner, and he's trying to pull the strings behind the scenes through that other turd Arum to get some shakeups to happen ?

Why is Koncz even a part of Team Pacquiao ? What fucking purpose does he serve ?

Fuck Arum. Fuck Koncz. I hope they both die slow.
bnoles4life
QUOTE (MaxPayne @ Nov 18 2011, 04:06 PM) *
Fuck Arum. Fuck Koncz. I hope they both die slow.


Yeah, I agree, but FUCK ARIZA too, w/ all of that "I thought Marquez was a real Mexican...he played it safe." What, b/c he didn't fight Manny in the manner in which would've been better for your team? B/c he made adjustments and LEARNED from the first two fights? As if Mexicans are incapable of NOT allowing their pride to dictate their demise? There's a fundamental difference b/t Manny and JMM, not the least of which, is their camp's mentality.

While Manny was awarded a win in the last fight, he either REFUSED or cannot make adjustments. Nacho & JMM were dialed into this fight and the one thing they left at home was probably their biggest assest: fear. They do not fear Manny nor anything he brought to the table.

So, I don't buy this "he keeps it 100" bullshit. He, like damn near everyone who is interviewed, has an agenda.
MaxPayne
QUOTE (bnoles4life @ Nov 18 2011, 03:37 PM) *
Yeah, I agree, but FUCK ARIZA too, w/ all of that "I thought Marquez was a real Mexican...he played it safe." What, b/c he didn't fight Manny in the manner in which would've been better for your team? B/c he made adjustments and LEARNED from the first two fights? As if Mexicans are incapable of NOT allowing their pride to dictate their demise? There's a fundamental difference b/t Manny and JMM, not the least of which, is their camp's mentality.

While Manny was awarded a win in the last fight, he either REFUSED or cannot make adjustments. Nacho & JMM were dialed into this fight and the one thing they left at home was probably their biggest assest: fear. They do not fear Manny nor anything he brought to the table.

So, I don't buy this "he keeps it 100" bullshit. He, like damn near everyone who is interviewed, has an agenda.


I can agree with some of that, like I said, he makes incendiary comments, but at least he ain't some insidious fruity swag motherfucker like Koncz. Maybe I'm picking evils here, but I just hate a bitch made ass motherfucker. It's like, you got a problem, let's settle it face to face like a man. Fuck that hiding behind the man.
bnoles4life
QUOTE (MaxPayne @ Nov 18 2011, 04:45 PM) *
I can agree with some of that, like I said, he makes incendiary comments, but at least he ain't some insidious fruity swag motherfucker like Koncz. Maybe I'm picking evils here, but I just hate a bitch made ass motherfucker. It's like, you got a problem, let's settle it face to face like a man. Fuck that hiding behind the man.


Yeah, I agree....to a point. He may be a cool dude, but from his interviews, I don't care much for him (to which, I'm sure his response is like, "fuck you too, mf'r") LOL.

Like I said, I see through that bullshit.
checkHook
What I found the most interesting is the fact that Ariza went through damn near the entire interview saying Manny won and Marquez lost and Marquez should blame himself, then the Arum and Koncz part where there is an important slip up made by Ariza. He says Arum and Koncz have gone around in the media, having their reporters who are 'Manny Loyalist' blame Ariza for Manny's "loss".

If it was so clear that your guy won and didn't take the foot of the gas, why damage control?

Why look for someone (other than the boxer himself) to blame?

I thought Manny pulled it out the last two rounds and won. Not "loss(ed)"?

Their team knows whats up and they're getting in line. From them reeling Amir Khan in and telling him to change up his quotes from the fight, to insisting on Mayweather instead of a
fourth fight with Marquez. This train is going off the track, it's time to cash out BIG before the inevitable occurs. A fourth fight with Marquez will do nothing for PacMan because he is not going to knock him out and it will go to a decision. They gave him his third shot because that calculated that he was a few years older and there would be NO WAY he would be able to adapt to the higher weight class.

If Marquez would have gotten that win on a decision, Top Rank would have (through "anonymous sources" of course) said that Marquez was on drugs and that the immediated rematch had to occur because they believed the Marquez gained an illegal advantage. All the talk about 'yellow water' and 'stepping on foots' are coming from the Pacmaniacs, while Top Rank are blaming Ariza for his role. If Marquez won, like I said earlier, Top Rank would be the ones supplying the unnecessarily-necessary BS to take the lime light off of PacMan and his trouble with agile, counter-punching, boxers.
BigFightFan
Arum and koncz is going to try their best to put the nail in his coffin after they read this interview. If they can get vision quest fired I'm sure Ariza will be gone in a week lol. Also he is down talking Marquez for using a strategy against PAC that works.

Did anyone notice him use the word my fighter during the interview? He indeed wants to be in the spot light just like most.
mrwigi
Not a mexican, but he did surprise me with the comment he made about marquez being a real mexican. Did kinda make me lose a little respect for him. Marquez is a warrior. I dont care what anyone says.
MaxPayne
QUOTE (mrwigi @ Nov 18 2011, 03:55 PM) *
Not a mexican, but he did surprise me with the comment he made about marquez being a real mexican. Did kinda make me lose a little respect for him. Marquez is a warrior. I dont care what anyone says.


I agree, some of his comments were definitely off base. I just think that Ariza is one of the people who generally keeps it real, out of all the fucking turds in that camp.

By the way, that Jack Johnson documentary was incredible. To me, he's the greatest boxer of all time.
Cshel86
Nobody's above the "he woudn't do that" margin...they are all capable looking out for themselves. Either they are doing these circus stunts for attention and to keep Manny relevant to save his "nice guy" image, or all of these guys are this stupid everyday. Both answers are acceptable...

Ariza does keep it real, and he does push the Pacquiao agenda a bit, but Im sure thats what he's supposed to do anyway. Out of all the members, I usually take his word over everyone else's. Roach seems to be comfortable expressing his doubts about Manny's lifestyle, training (at times), and seems to make his opponents have an advantage...which Im sure is all promotion anyway.

Who knows? dntknw.gif

un01
just a few weeks ago everyone was on the same page with each other, but now after the marquez fiasco, everyone is at odds and pointing fingers at each other... team pacquiao is collapsing before our very eyes, and to blame it on the conditioning coach is laughable.

no one was looking to give ariza the ax when manny was beating the shit out of cotto and margarito... i think manny is starting to slow down, and roach and everyone in top rank knows it... i think roach telling the media that him and manny want floyd next is only confirming this. its shocking that they would say this after the marquez fight, but this proves that manny doesnt have that much left in the tank and is getting ready to hang it up and call it a career. bob arum of course is not trying to hear any of that, and is trying to keep manny at a pace to where he can fight rios and bradley.
thehype
Just an FYI, Ariza wasn't saying that Manny lost...he was saying that reporters were telling him "Arum and Koncz are trying to put the blame on you for Manny's loss". In other words, he was repeating what reporters were telling him...not saying that he actually lost. I've gotten a few emails about that, so I just wanted to clear that up. He's basically saying they're trying to pin the blame on him regarding Manny's performance. The truth of the matter is that there's only ONE man to blame for Manny's performance and that's Juan Manuel Marquez.

And just for the record, Alex is a GREAT guy to talk to and interview. In my opinion, he generally does keep it real and 100. I don't necessarily agree 100% with everything he says, but for the most part, I understand where he's coming from when he states his opinion. That interview...well both of the interviews since the other one is up now too...was just about 20 minutes of an hour long convo. He's a pretty upfront type of guy...no sugarcoating. I prefer guys to be like that as opposed to those who put on a front. For the most part though, just about everyone myself or Percy talks to is pretty cool about keeping it real with us.
Allmenjoi8
QUOTE (bnoles4life @ Nov 18 2011, 04:37 PM) *
Yeah, I agree, but FUCK ARIZA too, w/ all of that "I thought Marquez was a real Mexican...he played it safe." What, b/c he didn't fight Manny in the manner in which would've been better for your team? B/c he made adjustments and LEARNED from the first two fights? As if Mexicans are incapable of NOT allowing their pride to dictate their demise? There's a fundamental difference b/t Manny and JMM, not the least of which, is their camp's mentality.

While Manny was awarded a win in the last fight, he either REFUSED or cannot make adjustments. Nacho & JMM were dialed into this fight and the one thing they left at home was probably their biggest assest: fear. They do not fear Manny nor anything he brought to the table.

So, I don't buy this "he keeps it 100" bullshit. He, like damn near everyone who is interviewed, has an agenda.


+1

QUOTE (un01 @ Nov 18 2011, 05:27 PM) *
just a few weeks ago everyone was on the same page with each other, but now after the marquez fiasco, everyone is at odds and pointing fingers at each other... team pacquiao is collapsing before our very eyes, and to blame it on the conditioning coach is laughable.

no one was looking to give ariza the ax when manny was beating the shit out of cotto and margarito... i think manny is starting to slow down, and roach and everyone in top rank knows it... i think roach telling the media that him and manny want floyd next is only confirming this. its shocking that they would say this after the marquez fight, but this proves that manny doesnt have that much left in the tank and is getting ready to hang it up and call it a career. bob arum of course is not trying to hear any of that, and is trying to keep manny at a pace to where he can fight rios and bradley.


The only problem with that is Arum has gone to the well one too many times. The public will not go for it and if he can't sell the fight then what good is it?

QUOTE (thehype @ Nov 18 2011, 06:38 PM) *
Just an FYI, Ariza wasn't saying that Manny lost...he was saying that reporters were telling him "Arum and Koncz are trying to put the blame on you for Manny's loss". In other words, he was repeating what reporters were telling him...not saying that he actually lost. I've gotten a few emails about that, so I just wanted to clear that up. He's basically saying they're trying to pin the blame on him regarding Manny's performance. The truth of the matter is that there's only ONE man to blame for Manny's performance and that's Juan Manuel Marquez.

And just for the record, Alex is a GREAT guy to talk to and interview. In my opinion, he generally does keep it real and 100. I don't necessarily agree 100% with everything he says, but for the most part, I understand where he's coming from when he states his opinion. That interview...well both of the interviews since the other one is up now too...was just about 20 minutes of an hour long convo. He's a pretty upfront type of guy...no sugarcoating. I prefer guys to be like that as opposed to those who put on a front. For the most part though, just about everyone myself or Percy talks to is pretty cool about keeping it real with us.


Hype, do you think that he will be getting the axe soon?
thehype
QUOTE (Allmenjoi8 @ Nov 18 2011, 05:49 PM) *
Hype, do you think that he will be getting the axe soon?


Nope. From my understanding, for the past few fights, Manny has been calling the shots more, doing what he wants to do, which is different than before when Alex was calling the shots. Coincidentally, for the past few fights, Manny has been cramping. He and Ariza talked about it and Manny said for the next fight, they're going back to doing it Ariza's way.
Cshel86
QUOTE (checkHook @ Nov 18 2011, 03:54 PM) *
If Marquez would have gotten that win on a decision, Top Rank would have (through "anonymous sources" of course) said that Marquez was on drugs and that the immediated rematch had to occur because they believed the Marquez gained an illegal advantage. All the talk about 'yellow water' and 'stepping on foots' are coming from the Pacmaniacs, while Top Rank are blaming Ariza for his role. If Marquez won, like I said earlier, Top Rank would be the ones supplying the unnecessarily-necessary BS to take the lime light off of PacMan and his trouble with agile, counter-punching, boxers.


The silly part is, whether Manny won or lost, it still would've been a rematch laugh.gif Mayweather handled Marquez 2 years ago (he was supposed to), but now that JMM is two years older and Pacquiao has gone "so much further" in his career, since the second fight, they figured this would be a piece of cake. That ugly performance on his behalf, made him look "less than" compared to Floyd's performance.

The whole idea is to "one up" Mayweather, and it backfired this time. They relied too much on the weight difference, opponents since the 2nd fight, JMM's age, and the fact Manny has "dismantled" bigger guys since then...but those guys were simply fighters with names, who were in a rough patch...and Manny's team had the leverage to bring them down even further before they inked anything.

QUOTE (BigFightFan @ Nov 18 2011, 03:54 PM) *
Did anyone notice him use the word my fighter during the interview? He indeed wants to be in the spot light just like most.


Pacquiao is his fighter, in some shape, form, or fashion. Hell, he has a bigger hand in helping Manny get to this point anyhow.
Seek
QUOTE (thehype @ Nov 18 2011, 05:38 PM) *
Just an FYI, Ariza wasn't saying that Manny lost...he was saying that reporters were telling him "Arum and Koncz are trying to put the blame on you for Manny's loss". In other words, he was repeating what reporters were telling him...not saying that he actually lost. I've gotten a few emails about that, so I just wanted to clear that up. He's basically saying they're trying to pin the blame on him regarding Manny's performance. The truth of the matter is that there's only ONE man to blame for Manny's performance and that's Juan Manuel Marquez.
And just for the record, Alex is a GREAT guy to talk to and interview. In my opinion, he generally does keep it real and 100. I don't necessarily agree 100% with everything he says, but for the most part, I understand where he's coming from when he states his opinion. That interview...well both of the interviews since the other one is up now too...was just about 20 minutes of an hour long convo. He's a pretty upfront type of guy...no sugarcoating. I prefer guys to be like that as opposed to those who put on a front. For the most part though, just about everyone myself or Percy talks to is pretty cool about keeping it real with us.


THANK YOU! Ariza just playin damage control by telling Pacquiao they gotta go back to the old ways. Go back to your old ways and you are still going to come up short vs Marquez.

Ariza couldn't stop talking about himself in this interview. It was pretty annoying. They all sound full of shit to me. I don't care how many times Pacquiao, Roach or Ariza say they want to fight Mayweather. Blame Arum all you want, still doesn't mean a thing. Sooner or later you are going to have to fight him or remain the guys who ducked Floyd over a drug test and opted to fight a 39 yr old Marquez for the 4th time over the #1 p4p fighter in the world
iKeNjiro
Ah man they told on themselves throughout this process.

Now we have to wait an see if Manny mans up an says fuck
a 4th fight with JMM, I want Floyd.

That's the news I'm waiting on...

good interview though
Cshel86
QUOTE (Seek @ Nov 18 2011, 06:52 PM) *
remain the guy who ducked Floyd over a drug test


Ha! Now THAT'S funny! The blame will forever be on Floyd, regardless of how the situation. Floyd is the villian and Im sure he always will be, so anytime these mindless nitwit Pactards run out of debating material, they always have the option to point the finger at FMJ.

I find it super funny how so many blind fans choose to speak up for a guy who cant even speak up for himself. Ironic aint it? laugh.gif


QUOTE (iKeNjiro @ Nov 18 2011, 07:15 PM) *
Now we have to wait an see if Manny mans up an says fuck
a 4th fight with JMM, I want Floyd.


Hahaha!!! Wait for it...

At the end of the day, Arum has the last say so...
BoxingFan86
QUOTE (checkHook @ Nov 18 2011, 03:54 PM) *
What I found the most interesting is the fact that Ariza went through damn near the entire interview saying Manny won and Marquez lost and Marquez should blame himself, then the Arum and Koncz part where there is an important slip up made by Ariza. He says Arum and Koncz have gone around in the media, having their reporters who are 'Manny Loyalist' blame Ariza for Manny's "loss".

If it was so clear that your guy won and didn't take the foot of the gas, why damage control?

Why look for someone (other than the boxer himself) to blame?

I thought Manny pulled it out the last two rounds and won. Not "loss(ed)"?

Their team knows whats up and they're getting in line. From them reeling Amir Khan in and telling him to change up his quotes from the fight, to insisting on Mayweather instead of a
fourth fight with Marquez. This train is going off the track, it's time to cash out BIG before the inevitable occurs. A fourth fight with Marquez will do nothing for PacMan because he is not going to knock him out and it will go to a decision. They gave him his third shot because that calculated that he was a few years older and there would be NO WAY he would be able to adapt to the higher weight class.

If Marquez would have gotten that win on a decision, Top Rank would have (through "anonymous sources" of course) said that Marquez was on drugs and that the immediated rematch had to occur because they believed the Marquez gained an illegal advantage. All the talk about 'yellow water' and 'stepping on foots' are coming from the Pacmaniacs, while Top Rank are blaming Ariza for his role. If Marquez won, like I said earlier, Top Rank would be the ones supplying the unnecessarily-necessary BS to take the lime light off of PacMan and his trouble with agile, counter-punching, boxers.

You've just bodied this entire thread. Nothin' else needs to be said.
Allmenjoi8
If Khan and JCC looks great (For Julio to look great means that the other guy is dead)... then what does that say about Ariza? Is it truly Pac has hit a road block or Khan and Julio are peaking? I think Ariza wants to be the main guy. F. Roach seems to be losing control of things. Everyone is talking in circles and the main one that should be talking isn't saying anything. If Pac does not fight Mayweather next year then I feel alot of people will start to stun him. He has no choice at this point. Fight May and then JMM. May 5th undercard should be The winner of Berto/Ortiz fights Maidana (sorry for the spelling)... Morales vs. JMM and the main even Pac vs. Mayweather.
BoxingFan86
QUOTE (Allmenjoi8 @ Nov 18 2011, 07:52 PM) *
If Khan and JCC looks great (For Julio to look great means that the other guy is dead)... then what does that say about Ariza? Is it truly Pac has hit a road block or Khan and Julio are peaking? I think Ariza wants to be the main guy. F. Roach seems to be losing control of things. Everyone is talking in circles and the main one that should be talking isn't saying anything. If Pac does not fight Mayweather next year then I feel alot of people will start to stun him. He has no choice at this point. Fight May and then JMM. May 5th undercard should be The winner of Berto/Ortiz fights Maidana (sorry for the spelling)... Morales vs. JMM and the main even Pac vs. Mayweather.

That undercard would be beast. I like watchin' Maidana fight, but I'd also be content to see the winner of Berto/Ortiz II fight Alvarez.
Cshel86
QUOTE (Allmenjoi8 @ Nov 18 2011, 07:52 PM) *
Everyone is talking in circles and the main one that should be talking isn't saying anything. If Pac does not fight Mayweather next year then I feel alot of people will start to stun him. He has no choice at this point. Fight May and then JMM. May 5th undercard should be The winner of Berto/Ortiz fights Maidana (sorry for the spelling)... Morales vs. JMM and the main even Pac vs. Mayweather.


You are right, it would be great to hear from Manny...even if he's already been told what to say! laugh.gif Even if he doesn't fight FMJ next, he will still be looked at as God, I dont think it will hurt him just yet. As far as that dream card for May 5th...good idea, but each and every last one of those fights you mentioned could be sold separately and make some decent money.

Now, if they sold this card for about $85-100 laugh.gif then it would make some nasty money! The question is, what causal fans would buy it, because the majority of sales come from them, honestly. I would pay that much for the card, but half the time, these buyers dont know all of the people on the card anyhow. As far Ariza, he does seem to keep it a bit "realer" than the other guys, even if you pick the lesser of the evils, Ariza would still be the pick.
Cheesey1
QUOTE (Allmenjoi8 @ Nov 18 2011, 07:52 PM) *
If Khan and JCC looks great (For Julio to look great means that the other guy is dead)... then what does that say about Ariza? Is it truly Pac has hit a road block or Khan and Julio are peaking? I think Ariza wants to be the main guy. F. Roach seems to be losing control of things. Everyone is talking in circles and the main one that should be talking isn't saying anything. If Pac does not fight Mayweather next year then I feel alot of people will start to stun him. He has no choice at this point. Fight May and then JMM. May 5th undercard should be The winner of Berto/Ortiz fights Maidana (sorry for the spelling)... Morales vs. JMM and the main even Pac vs. Mayweather.

Wow, now that's one serious card! Although, as CShel said, to pay all of those boxers, it'd have to be an expensive ppv. I'd pay for it, but I'm not a casual fan.
Allmenjoi8
QUOTE (Cheesey1 @ Nov 19 2011, 11:35 AM) *
Wow, now that's one serious card! Although, as CShel said, to pay all of those boxers, it'd have to be an expensive ppv. I'd pay for it, but I'm not a casual fan.


Because May and Pac would be the headliner they would pay for it. Not only would they pay for it they would pay up to 100 bucks for it. That card can be made. If Arum put aside his Bernie Madoff personality and greed it can happen. Not only that but Ortiz/Berto could fight Bradley. That is a top rank fighter. SO he gets his Pay from Manny, Bradley, and Morales and JMM. The only one he isn't being pimped out is May and Ortiz but more May than Ortiz. This undercard can happen. Or replace Bradley for Khan. either or you have a great undercard.
mrchitown
Ariza seems like a pretty good guy. I don't know about him keepin it real, but he definitely isn't afraid to lay it all out there when it comes to Koncz and Arum. I didn't agree with his statements about JMM not being a true Mexican warrior but he's supposed to look out for his fighter and that's what I like most about him. He's one of the few around Manny, who has his best interest in mind. And he definitely gives interviews that are full of quotables
mrwigi
QUOTE (MaxPayne @ Nov 18 2011, 04:59 PM) *
I agree, some of his comments were definitely off base. I just think that Ariza is one of the people who generally keeps it real, out of all the fucking turds in that camp.

By the way, that Jack Johnson documentary was incredible. To me, he's the greatest boxer of all time.



I agree. He was the original Paul Williams. No one wanted to fight him cuz he was black. That was bull.. No one wanted to fight him cuz they didnt want to get there arse whooped...Haha
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