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Full Version: If this Robert Guerrero stuff is true...
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MaxPayne
...then I'm going to be pretty pissed. At this point in time, I'm thinking about Floyd's legacy and fighting Robert Guerrero right now, who's a great boxer with an intriguing story, but ZERO following outside of Cali does nothing for his legacy. This is tantamount to him fighting Erik Morales.

I'm also not enchanted with a Canelo fight, but at least Canelo has a massive following and would be a large welterweight or 150 pounder. People could get behind that fight and really make it an event. Canelo doesn't have any better chance than Guerrero does, but it's still a fight that would be better received by the general public.

I should qualify all of this by saying that I personally think that Floyd's true boxing legacy is set from his exploits in the lower weight ranks. However, it's not enough for hardcore boxing fans to respect his true abilities. A personal measure of satisfaction would come from these mindless drones having no other choice but to acknowledge him as one of the greatest fighters of all time.

Cshel86
Im a Guerrero fan to a certain extent, but Im just not down with the idea of him landing a big fight, when he's done less than poodle shit to prove that he deserves it. I still want to see him do some damage in the 140 lb division, and there are more than enough big fights at that weight. Im sure all of these guys want to fight for big money, thats the point, but damn.

Honestly, I dont even believe this fight will materialize. With FMJ, you never know who he's gonna pick as an opponent, but all of these mofos crying about Guerrero can hang with him, he has an amazing back story, blah, bah, blah...so what! Its sad how boxing fans can promote their favorite fighter, but the fighter himself has tumbleweed bouncing in their head when its time to build themselves up.
leonthegee
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Jan 10 2012, 07:00 AM) *
Im a Guerrero fan to a certain extent, but Im just not down with the idea of him landing a big fight, when he's done less than poodle shit to prove that he deserves it. I still want to see him do some damage in the 140 lb division, and there are more than enough big fights at that weight. Im sure all of these guys want to fight for big money, thats the point, but damn.

Honestly, I dont even believe this fight will materialize. With FMJ, you never know who he's gonna pick as an opponent, but all of these mofos crying about Guerrero can hang with him, he has an amazing back story, blah, bah, blah...so what! Its sad how boxing fans can promote their favorite fighter, but the fighter himself has tumbleweed bouncing in their head when its time to build themselves up.


I dont want to see Floyd fight Guerrero either but to play devils advocate whats wrong with this fight from a boxing perspective? It wouldnt be the first time a lightweight has moved up to welterweight. In fact Sugar Ray Leonard, some say the best welterweight ever, lost to a lightweight moving up two weight classes to challange him. So I say again whats wrong with this fight?
Cshel86
QUOTE (leonthegee @ Jan 10 2012, 10:10 AM) *
I dont want to see Floyd fight Guerrero either but to play devils advocate whats wrong with this fight from a boxing perspective? It wouldnt be the first time a lightweight has moved up to welterweight. In fact Sugar Ray Leonard, so say the best welterweight ever, lost to a lightweight moving up two weight classes to challange him. So I say again whats wrong with this fight?

I guess Im just tired of these undeserving fighters whoring for the Mayweather/Pacquiao "sweepstakes" . Now granted, its always been fighters calling out the big names since I can last remember, thats just part of the sport. With that said, its just been terrible over the last 2-3 years...fighters and promoters are almost at that the begging point.

Im also through with the "oh, he's afraid, he's scared of me, he's afraid to lose that zero" blah, blah, blah. I haven't seen many guys prove themselves in the ring, still not sold on most of these fighters. Being the fact that most of these big fights take place mostly because of drawing power/promotion, some of these guys take it waaaay too easy in the ring, and avoid dangerous fights...just to be safe and land a big fight.
leonthegee
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Jan 10 2012, 07:26 AM) *
I guess Im just tired of these undeserving fighters whoring for the Mayweather/Pacquiao "sweepstakes" . Now granted, its always been fighters calling out the big names since I can last remember, thats just part of the sport. With that said, its just been terrible over the last 2-3 years...fighters and promoters are almost at that the begging point.

Im also through with the "oh, he's afraid, he's scared of me, he's afraid to lose that zero" blah, blah, blah. I haven't seen many guys prove themselves in the ring, still not sold on most of these fighters. Being the fact that most of these big fights take place mostly because of drawing power/promotion, some of these guys take it waaaay too easy in the ring, and avoid dangerous fights...just to be safe and land a big fight.


I agree with you there. If I had my way Id like it to be Maidana because of the clash of styles. It would be entertaining, ala Hatton v Mayweather, and we all know Maidana would come to fight. Im not sure I feel the same about Guerrero. Guerrero is more of a technical fighter, from what I can remember, and I could see him letting Floyd turn it into a chess match. Which doesnt always make for an entertaining fight.

And the same thing goes for Cotto. I cant see Cotto coming forward really trying to put the pressure on Floyd, although I am intrigued by the matchup. Especially with the weight cut back to 147. So bring on Maidana and then go do your lil 90 day bid. Who do you think should move to the front of the list?
Cheesey1
If it is Guerrero, whatever, not my first choice but whatever. I don't think that he'll be the opponent though. We'll find out soon enough.
PlayaPartner
What is wrong with a champion taking an easy fight every once and a while. Throughout boxing history champions have been able to take an easy fight every once and a while and not be vilified. Sometimes these quote un quote easier fights have turned out to be very exciting. As a boxing fan I do not have to see the champion fight the hardest fight of his career every time he steps in the ring. At some point it is good for boxing to let the younger less experienced fighters get a shot at the top. I did not have a problem with Manny fighting a few easy made for him bouts and I would not have a problem with Floyd fighting some one that may not be on his level. When Ali fought Foreman he was a big under dog and people thought he would get pummeled like Joe Frazier. But look what happened. When Tyson fought Douglas no one gave him a chance but he got his butt kicked. Just recently Peterson was not given a chance against Khan but he rose to the occasion and won the fight. Guerrero may not be on the level of a Maywether but for one day he may just rise to the occasion and become a shooting star.

thumbsup_anim.gif thumbsup_anim.gif In Boxing every fighter has a puncher chance thumbsup_anim.gif thumbsup_anim.gif

This may be the problem with boxing every fight has to be a big money fight with these champions and it has to gross more, achieve higher PPV views and be viewed as the champions biggest, toughest test. I think that boxing has to start giving back. By this I mean giving the fans fights that they do not have to spend an arm and a leg to see. Also, when a bad PPV happens, give the public a Showtime or HBO fight to make up for it.
Cshel86
QUOTE (leonthegee @ Jan 10 2012, 10:44 AM) *
I agree with you there. If I had my way Id like it to be Maidana because of the clash of styles. It would be entertaining, ala Hatton v Mayweather, and we all know Maidana would come to fight. Im not sure I feel the same about Guerrero. Guerrero is more of a technical fighter, from what I can remember, and I could see him letting Floyd turn it into a chess match. Which doesnt always make for an entertaining fight.

And the same thing goes for Cotto. I cant see Cotto coming forward really trying to put the pressure on Floyd, although I am intrigued by the matchup. Especially with the weight cut back to 147. So bring on Maidana and then go do your lil 90 day bid. Who do you think should move to the front of the list?

Now, I would like to see Guerrero/Maidana on the undercard of the May 5th event, but for Guerrero to jump to a big fight after doing nothing, is a bit annoying. A FMJ/Maidana fight would be pretty good...not sure how the promotion would go for that one.

As far as anybody moving to the front of the list...Im wondering what the hell happened to that May-Per-View idea? Im sure it got pitched to GBP, but nobody's heard anything.
Cshel86
You made some great points PlayaPartner, hands down. There's one little thing though...you didn't point out the fact that Mr. Mayweather only fights once a frickin' leap year. Now, if Floyd fought 2-3 times a year, then I would have no problem with a possible Guerrero fight.

Of course, as he stated, they cant afford to pay him to fight 2-3 times a year. We all know that Floyd aint gonna fight on an HBO B.A.D. card...those days are loooong gone. I agree that those guys in the past got a crack at the top guy and it ended in either an upset or an amazing.
Franchize
nea.gif I think this will be detrimental to Mayweather's career. It's a lose-lose situation. No casual fans outside of Cali know Guerrero. The light is finally starting to shine on Arum's BS. The consensus that "Mayweather is ducking" is slowly starting to die and the truth is gradually coming to the surface. Fighting a no name like Guerrero does nothing but tilt the scales back to Arum. It's almost as bad as if Mayweather really was fighting Morales on May 5th like Arum accused him of. Nobody really cares if Mayweather beats Guerrero.
cuzzo707
I am actually planning to attend this May 5th fight, and even though I'm from the Bay Area 707 I say no to Guerrero. I would actually rethink going to vegas that weekend if that is true. We need to see way more from Guerrero before he gets a fight of that magnitude. If tickets area gonna be sky high ANYWAY, I would rather pay for a fight against someone with a large following. I can't even imagine tryna sit ringside for $1,600 a pop or even a $300 ticket for a fight with Guerrero.
Cshel86
QUOTE (cuzzo707 @ Jan 10 2012, 11:27 AM) *
We need to see way more from Guerrero before he gets a fight of that magnitude.

Waaaay more! Again, I would have no problem with a Guerrero fight, if Floyd fought more than once a year, but that isn't the case here. He could do his 3 months and be out in Sept., in preparation for a December bout (if he pleases)...and I STILL wouldn't want to see him in there with Robert. Maybe next year for Guerrero...
daprofessor
initially...i wasn't interested in this fight. but the more i think about it, i welcome it. guerrero can crack and he's a decent fighter who has flown under the radar for the most part due to his situation with his wife and her illness...and lack of a big time promoter. he's a deserving guy who's won titles in more than one weight class. i was interested in seeing him fight pac back in the day. that fight was always impossible...but this fight against floyd isn't. i'll take it.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Jan 10 2012, 01:40 PM) *
Waaaay more! Again, I would have no problem with a Guerrero fight, if Floyd fought more than once a year, but that isn't the case here. He could do his 3 months and be out in Sept., in preparation for a December bout (if he pleases)...and I STILL wouldn't want to see him in there with Robert. Maybe next year for Guerrero...


this would be his second fight in less than a year. it qualifies to me. i think the bigger fights come after his jail time.
Cshel86
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Jan 10 2012, 01:55 PM) *
this would be his second fight in less than a year. it qualifies to me. i think the bigger fights come after his jail time.

I guess I'll roll with you on that statement. Sept. '09 (JMM) and May '10 (Mosley)...almost 8 months apart. Though its still once a year, I guess that would qualify as a Mayweather calender year laugh.gif
thehype
laugh.gif
BoxingFan86
QUOTE (thehype @ Jan 10 2012, 02:23 PM) *
laugh.gif

What's so funny? Is Guerrero not a serious candidate?
Seek
If no Pacquiao then Guerrero is the only choice. First of all Canelo will want more money. That may be speculation but its hard to deny. Second theres no reward in giving Canelo or Martinez such a weight advantage. 10oz pillow gloves Floyd complained about vs DLH. Guerrero may be a light weight but he is the same size as Floyd height and walk around weight. Canelo and martinez are 170+ lbs Thats asking too much now. Even though i think Floyd can put on a boxing clinic vs those too its risk vs reward im talking here. Look what happen to DLH. Clearly outboxed him yet only won a SD. Thats boxing for you.

Cotto and Bradley aint fighting Floyd without Bob.

Khan and Peterson are tied up.

Everyone else is scheduled for a fight.

Sorry to say nut if it aint Pacquiao. Best option is Guerrero. He can rally the fans and bring in the money. Thats some perfect timing if you ask me. Way to go Guerrero
Franchize
QUOTE (thehype @ Jan 10 2012, 02:23 PM) *
laugh.gif


Please tell me here I can get that shirt. It is amazing thumbsup_anim.gif
BoxingEinstein

Canelo is fighting Floyd you fools....smfh....it's not Guerrero. Floyd should fight Maidana after he cracks Alexander.
Cshel86
QUOTE (Seek @ Jan 10 2012, 03:20 PM) *
If no Pacquiao then Guerrero is the only choice. First of all Canelo will want more money. That may be speculation but its hard to deny. Second theres no reward in giving Canelo or Martinez such a weight advantage. 10oz pillow gloves Floyd complained about vs DLH. Guerrero may be a light weight but he is the same size as Floyd height and walk around weight. Canelo and martinez are 170+ lbs Thats asking too much now. Even though i think Floyd can put on a boxing clinic vs those too its risk vs reward im talking here. Look what happen to DLH. Clearly outboxed him yet only won a SD. Thats boxing for you.

Cotto and Bradley aint fighting Floyd without Bob.

Khan and Peterson are tied up.

Everyone else is scheduled for a fight.

Sorry to say nut if it aint Pacquiao. Best option is Guerrero. He can rally the fans and bring in the money. Thats some perfect timing if you ask me. Way to go Guerrero

I forgot that you were pro-Guerrero, Seek! I dont believe Canelo will want more money than he will already be getting...I dont think Oscar would allow him to push the envelope like that and make Floyd reconsider...especially if he is granted the opportunity to fight Floyd in the first place. I say that because, its obvious that GBP is having a few money issues and Floyd is sure to bring them money.

As far as I know, Cotto is a free agent, so Bob shouldn't be a problem. As far as the weight difference in these fights (Martinez, Alvarez), I dont see a really big deal, because Sergio rehydrates to 165 at MW (so he shouldn't be that much bigger at 54...who knows), and Canelo may be around 170, but he's not a quick and slick fighter. Personally, I dont see either of those two bringing that much money in Floyd...well, if you want to talk about him moving up to 154...but who knows.
un01
this fight makes no sense at all and does nothing for floyd's legacy. even casual fans know floyd would dominate this dude, and the only way a mayweather fight sells is if the opponent has a legitimate chance of winning... floyds not flashy and isnt liked by the fans, so they wouldnt pay to see him completely dominate an opponent.

a fight with canelo makes more sense, cause you can give him the age and size advantage and "kinda" pitch his undefeated record. plus it does alot for floyd's legacy, since canelo is gonna be a star and is gonna walk around with a mayweather loss for the rest of his career, while floyds retired
Seek
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Jan 10 2012, 06:55 PM) *
I forgot that you were pro-Guerrero, Seek! I dont believe Canelo will want more money than he will already be getting...I dont think Oscar would allow him to push the envelope like that and make Floyd reconsider...especially if he is granted the opportunity to fight Floyd in the first place. I say that because, its obvious that GBP is having a few money issues and Floyd is sure to bring them money.

As far as I know, Cotto is a free agent, so Bob shouldn't be a problem. As far as the weight difference in these fights (Martinez, Alvarez), I dont see a really big deal, because Sergio rehydrates to 165 at MW (so he shouldn't be that much bigger at 54...who knows), and Canelo may be around 170, but he's not a quick and slick fighter. Personally, I dont see either of those two bringing that much money in Floyd...well, if you want to talk about him moving up to 154...but who knows.


Im not pro Guerrero. Im just breaking it down on why it will be Guerrero and not the others. Ive never believed Floyd would fight junior middle weights. Khan is out, i know Cotto is loyal and i believe what he says in being loyal to Arum. I believe the fight will be a success because Guerrero does bring a lot to the table. He makes a great point for why he should get the fight. Even though i think others are more deserving. The others are tied up or not realistic opponents at this time imho. I have no doubt in my mind the latinos and general public will support Guerrero. Ill be surprised if im wrong. If not pacquiao then definitely has to be Guerrero.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Jan 10 2012, 06:55 PM) *
I forgot that you were pro-Guerrero, Seek! I dont believe Canelo will want more money than he will already be getting...I dont think Oscar would allow him to push the envelope like that and make Floyd reconsider...especially if he is granted the opportunity to fight Floyd in the first place. I say that because, its obvious that GBP is having a few money issues and Floyd is sure to bring them money.

As far as I know, Cotto is a free agent, so Bob shouldn't be a problem. As far as the weight difference in these fights (Martinez, Alvarez), I dont see a really big deal, because Sergio rehydrates to 165 at MW (so he shouldn't be that much bigger at 54...who knows), and Canelo may be around 170, but he's not a quick and slick fighter. Personally, I dont see either of those two bringing that much money in Floyd...well, if you want to talk about him moving up to 154...but who knows.


i don't think cotto will declare/exercise his free agency until pac picks his next opponent.
Cshel86
QUOTE (Seek @ Jan 10 2012, 08:24 PM) *
Im not pro Guerrero. Im just breaking it down on why it will be Guerrero and not the others. Ive never believed Floyd would fight junior middle weights. Khan is out, i know Cotto is loyal and i believe what he says in being loyal to Arum. I believe the fight will be a success because Guerrero does bring a lot to the table. He makes a great point for why he should get the fight. Even though i think others are more deserving. The others are tied up or not realistic opponents at this time imho. I have no doubt in my mind the latinos and general public will support Guerrero. Ill be surprised if im wrong. If not pacquiao then definitely has to be Guerrero.

I almost forgot why I find myself hard pressed to debate with you sometimes Seek laugh.gif You do great points, and you do a better job of covering your ass on others...so no complaints from this side. I still dont believe Guerrero's case is strong enough...at this moment of course, maybe later though.
Cshel86
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Jan 10 2012, 08:32 PM) *
i don't think cotto will declare/exercise his free agency until pac picks his next opponent.

Why do you say that? Im sure he doesn't want any part of Pacquiao again. If he does, then he would've signed back with TR and asked already...of course that would've easily gave Arum another reason to avoid the Mayweather fight. If he signs with Golden Boy and asks for a Pac fight, then that would simply be counterproductive because Arum nearly hates working with GBP.

I still pose this question...if Cotto really wants to stay with Arum, then why would he even allow himself to go into free agency? There's no need to be a free agent if you want to still be with TR, and being a free agent means that your options are open. Why leave yourself wide open for options, if you already know where you want to be?
mrchitown
I'm hoping it's not Guerrero, he's a decent fighter and he has a great backstory like everybody has previously stated but he has done NOTHING to earn a fight with Floyd. It's a fight that he has a chance in but in my opinion, only a puncher's chance though. Only Floyd knows who he'll fight and he'll announce it in due time, he may throw a curve ball, who knows. Hopefully it isn't Guerrero though
Seek
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Jan 10 2012, 08:39 PM) *
Why do you say that? Im sure he doesn't want any part of Pacquiao again. If he does, then he would've signed back with TR and asked already...of course that would've easily gave Arum another reason to avoid the Mayweather fight. If he signs with Golden Boy and asks for a Pac fight, then that would simply be counterproductive because Arum nearly hates working with GBP.

I still pose this question...if Cotto really wants to stay with Arum, then why would he even allow himself to go into free agency? There's no need to be a free agent if you want to still be with TR, and being a free agent means that your options are open. Why leave yourself wide open for options, if you already know where you want to be?


Cotto stated he will always be promoted by Bob. But now without a written agreement. After this Bob said that wa good enough for him and that Cotto reminded him of Marvin Hagler due to their loyalty and also stating he never had a written contract with Hagler. I just think Cotto wants to be able to retire when he wants. Not have to fight a certain amount of fights or for a certain amount of years. Thats a nice luxury to have
Cshel86
QUOTE (Seek @ Jan 10 2012, 11:39 PM) *
After this Bob said that wa good enough for him and that Cotto reminded him of Marvin Hagler due to their loyalty and also stating he never had a written contract with Hagler.

C'mon Seek, anytime you start a sentence with "Bob said", you have to be prepared to be scrutinized laugh.gif This is the same guy that said Floyd was next best thing since Ali (or something of that nature), and as soon as he left...didn't Bob's tune change?
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