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daprofessor
floyd/cotto or pac/cotto? i think cotto is the next big money maker for either guy.
mgrover
don't really care, hes losing both
Cshel86
Cotto seems to be holding the remote to this out-of-control roller coaster. As soon as Cotto makes up his mind, then half of the bullshit will settle (in regards to these negotiations). We can all exhale and drink a few beers (whichever comes first), and get ready for part two.
daprofessor
i think cotto/mayweather is the better fight. cotto/pac kills the chances of pac/mayweather happening imo...but either way...we get cotto/mayweather which should have happened years ago.
p4pcrown
Cotto/Mayweather would be a better fight in my opinion...however i do think Cotto's chances of beating pac would be better the second time around.
Seek
Cotto is the reason why I became a 'hardcore' boxing fan. I was a big JCC and DLH fan as a kid. That comes natural being raised in a mexican family. But my dad was a chicano so he didn't care too much for the mexican vs puerto rican feud. He was a big fan of Cotto and so I was too.

And as for Mayweather, I used to pray he'd get knocked out lol. But as I studied boxing, I realized he was the real deal. It's a beautiful thing now to see Floyd in the ring. I cheer him on for the win now. So it's a tough question to ask who i'd rather see Pacquiao Cotto or Mayweather Cotto? I saw Pacquiao Cotto live at the mgm. First big fight I ever witnessed and it was a great fight for the first 5 rounds or so. When a fight is that one-sided I have to say no to the rematch. Bring on Mayweather Cotto! Not sure how the hell i'm supposed to root for and against my #1 and #2 guys....
BoxingStill#1
QUOTE (Seek @ Jan 26 2012, 04:12 PM) *
Cotto is the reason why I became a 'hardcore' boxing fan. I was a big JCC and DLH fan as a kid. That comes natural being raised in a mexican family. But my dad was a chicano so he didn't care too much for the mexican vs puerto rican feud. He was a big fan of Cotto and so I was too.

And as for Mayweather, I used to pray he'd get knocked out lol. But as I studied boxing, I realized he was the real deal. It's a beautiful thing now to see Floyd in the ring. I cheer him on for the win now. So it's a tough question to ask who i'd rather see Pacquiao Cotto or Mayweather Cotto? I saw Pacquiao Cotto live at the mgm. First big fight I ever witnessed and it was a great fight for the first 5 rounds or so. When a fight is that one-sided I have to say no to the rematch. Bring on Mayweather Cotto! Not sure how the hell i'm supposed to root for and against my #1 and #2 guys....


I agree whole heartedly with every with you as Cotto vs, May and who to root for....

Its about as confusing to me as you being mexican but a fan of a PR fighter?? Lls.

Id much rather see that fight though
mitukczuk
Cotto / Mayweather for me. Love both guys. My heart wants Floyd to win wide, my mind wants a competitive fight with no BS decision, with Floyd being victorious and with Cotto cashing himself out and giving his fans a reminder of why they (we) love him.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Seek @ Jan 26 2012, 04:12 PM) *
Cotto is the reason why I became a 'hardcore' boxing fan. I was a big JCC and DLH fan as a kid. That comes natural being raised in a mexican family. But my dad was a chicano so he didn't care too much for the mexican vs puerto rican feud. He was a big fan of Cotto and so I was too.

And as for Mayweather, I used to pray he'd get knocked out lol. But as I studied boxing, I realized he was the real deal. It's a beautiful thing now to see Floyd in the ring. I cheer him on for the win now. So it's a tough question to ask who i'd rather see Pacquiao Cotto or Mayweather Cotto? I saw Pacquiao Cotto live at the mgm. First big fight I ever witnessed and it was a great fight for the first 5 rounds or so. When a fight is that one-sided I have to say no to the rematch. Bring on Mayweather Cotto! Not sure how the hell i'm supposed to root for and against my #1 and #2 guys....


i'm in the same position....i'm a big fan of both cotto and mayweather. i'm also a fan of pac...but i don't think the rematch will be so easy for him. cotto didn't have a real coach last time to correct his very obvious mistakes and they (pac/roach) game planned accordingly. as for the cotto/mayweather fight...there are things cotto can do that floyd has not seen in a while. floyd should win this one...but i'd like to see cotto push him. i think he's capable of doing that. as for who i will be rooting for....both. cotto/floyd is good for boxing.
BigFightFan
Mayweather vs Cotto is my pick. We have seen PAC vs Cotto once already
Cshel86
QUOTE (Seek @ Jan 26 2012, 04:12 PM) *
Cotto is the reason why I became a 'hardcore' boxing fan.

What was the first Cotto fight that you saw?
Seek
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Jan 26 2012, 09:19 PM) *
What was the first Cotto fight that you saw?


I think its was the Ricardo Torres fight. First fight i followed was vs Judah. That was a big fight, lots of media for that one
Thickback
Mayweather/Cotto. Been wanting to see this fight for years. Now that Cotto isn't a Top Rank slave any more, I'd like to see him fighting some non TR fighters.
Thickback
QUOTE (Seek @ Jan 27 2012, 12:27 AM) *
I think its was the Ricardo Torres fight. First fight i followed was vs Judah. That was a big fight, lots of media for that one


Cotto/Torres was a good fight. Actually lost respect for Cotto in that one. Torres took the fight on very short notice and hurt Cotto a few times. Once Torres gassed out, Cotto get him out of there, but if Torres was in shape would've been a different ending imo. I gained more repect for him lately for basically fighting everyone in their prime or before they were damaged goods. Mosely, Judah, Margirito, Clottey, Pacquiao, N'Dou, Corley, Quintana, Gomez....good list. Adding Mayweather to that would be tremendous.
Seek
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Jan 26 2012, 08:10 PM) *
i'm in the same position....i'm a big fan of both cotto and mayweather. i'm also a fan of pac...but i don't think the rematch will be so easy for him. cotto didn't have a real coach last time to correct his very obvious mistakes and they (pac/roach) game planned accordingly. as for the cotto/mayweather fight...there are things cotto can do that floyd has not seen in a while. floyd should win this one...but i'd like to see cotto push him. i think he's capable of doing that. as for who i will be rooting for....both. cotto/floyd is good for boxing.


I think we have a much better version of Cotto now then we did when he fought Pacquiao. Back then he virtually had no trainer, had to shed an extra two pounds and was coming off his loss to Margarito and a near loss to Clottey. His camp came into the fight thinking they could bully Pac and that Cotto was stronger.

Now Cotto is coming off of 3 tko wins. Is going to be comfortable making weight and has a real trainer with real experience. I think Cotto will have his moments vs Mayweather. He has power and pop in his punches at 154 and 10oz gloves. Mayweather might stop him late but the extra weight and gloves don't help him. I honestly think Pacquiao would be in some trouble if he takes this fight at 150.

It's good to see Cotto calling the shots right now. I'd still prefer to see it at the 154. No point in a catchweight.
Thegreatequalizer
i want to see mayweather-martinez at 154 and pac-marquez IV. and cotto-ortiz?
Franchize
QUOTE (BigFightFan @ Jan 26 2012, 08:06 PM) *
Mayweather vs Cotto is my pick. We have seen PAC vs Cotto once already


Exactly and theres no reason to think part 2 will be any different.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Franchize @ Jan 27 2012, 01:38 PM) *
Exactly and theres no reason to think part 2 will be any different.


sure there is...cotto made adjustments in the first fight. they may have come a little too late...but that stoppage was really b.s. because pac had not really landed much and was just following cotto around the ring. i said back then...cotto exposed a serious flaw in pac. he doesn't know how to cut off a ring. also...u can't dismiss the fact that cotto didn't have a real trainer in that fight. the game plan, his training camp...the advice in the corner during that fight...it was all wrong. having quality experience in camp and the corner will make a huge difference. i say cotto beats pac this time around.
Franchize
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Jan 27 2012, 02:20 PM) *
sure there is...cotto made adjustments in the first fight. they may have come a little too late...but that stoppage was really b.s. because pac had not really landed much and was just following cotto around the ring. i said back then...cotto exposed a serious flaw in pac. he doesn't know how to cut off a ring. also...u can't dismiss the fact that cotto didn't have a real trainer in that fight. the game plan, his training camp...the advice in the corner during that fight...it was all wrong. having quality experience in camp and the corner will make a huge difference. i say cotto beats pac this time around.


He doesn't know how to cut off the ring because he's not used to a bigger fighter running from him. Let me preface my comments by saying I'm not a fan of either necessarily. I think Cotto's small sample set of success in the Pacquiao fight came when he was on his bicycle and moving around the ring; just like he did vs Magarito. However, I don't think he can sustain it for 12 rounds. I also think he's still damaged goods from the 1st fight with Magarito. He's been the superior boxer in a lot of his fights. Problem is, he can't take a punch all that well anymore and his defense isn't Mayweather good to stop him from getting hit. I don't think he exposed anything in Manny that wasn't already obvious to anyone who knows anything about boxing. Manny is a great fighter but just a pretty good boxer. That was exposed well before that fight and obviously after. I think we clearly saw the fight differently.
Cshel86
QUOTE (Thegreatequalizer @ Jan 27 2012, 12:30 PM) *
cotto-ortiz?

I was waiting on this one! Thanks!
daprofessor
QUOTE (Franchize @ Jan 27 2012, 03:59 PM) *
He doesn't know how to cut off the ring because he's not used to a bigger fighter running from him. Let me preface my comments by saying I'm not a fan of either necessarily. I think Cotto's small sample set of success in the Pacquiao fight came when he was on his bicycle and moving around the ring; just like he did vs Magarito. However, I don't think he can sustain it for 12 rounds. I also think he's still damaged goods from the 1st fight with Magarito. He's been the superior boxer in a lot of his fights. Problem is, he can't take a punch all that well anymore and his defense isn't Mayweather good to stop him from getting hit. I don't think he exposed anything in Manny that wasn't already obvious to anyone who knows anything about boxing. Manny is a great fighter but just a pretty good boxer. That was exposed well before that fight and obviously after. I think we clearly saw the fight differently.


yeah. let's just chalk it up to we saw the fight differently.

laugh.gif

manny is a great fighter when his opponents are at a disadvantage ie. weight drained or recently coming off of career ending beatdowns...etc..the last fighter i recall giving pac effective lateral movement before cotto was morales in his win. cotto was severely diminished after the knockdown and was able to last several rounds before the fight was stopped. he wasn't in any real trouble when they stopped it. cotto may be slightly diminished...but he still has enough left to get the job done. if mosley was able to survive 12 with pac, and he's is zero parts counterpuncher, i think cotto can be more successful with that strategy since he can counterpunch. from what i've seen from each in their last few fights...i give cotto a strong chance at beating pac. if u'd like to make a sig bet...or some type of wager...let me know.
xxxxxx
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Jan 27 2012, 02:20 PM) *
sure there is...cotto made adjustments in the first fight. they may have come a little too late...but that stoppage was really b.s. because pac had not really landed much and was just following cotto around the ring. i said back then...cotto exposed a serious flaw in pac. he doesn't know how to cut off a ring. also...u can't dismiss the fact that cotto didn't have a real trainer in that fight. the game plan, his training camp...the advice in the corner during that fight...it was all wrong. having quality experience in camp and the corner will make a huge difference. i say cotto beats pac this time around.


I agree with a lot of this post. I'm not sure if Cotto wins the rematch, but it would be much closer than the first one. At 154 it would be a tossup for me. At 147 I think Pacman gets the nod on activity.
Cshel86
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Jan 27 2012, 05:15 PM) *
manny is a great fighter when his opponents are at a disadvantage ie. weight drained or recently coming off of career ending beatdowns...etc..the last fighter i recall giving pac effective lateral movement before cotto was morales in his win.

I agree, and Morales did have Pacquiao in no man's land in the first fight because he was in a "boxing" situation, which is somewhat of a nightmare for him.

QUOTE (daprofessor @ Jan 27 2012, 05:15 PM) *
cotto was severely diminished after the knockdown and was able to last several rounds before the fight was stopped. he wasn't in any real trouble when they stopped it. cotto may be slightly diminished...but he still has enough left to get the job done.

from what i've seen from each in their last few fights...i give cotto a strong chance at beating pac.

Cotto just made a mistake by trying to exchange with Pac early instead of moving. Cotto has decent handspeed, but Pacquiao's hands were just too damn fast. Problem is (and this is just my opinion), when Cotto throws combinations, his stance is square, he stays there too long because he plants his feet and commits to every punch (which is good against a slower opponent).

It backfired in that fight because we all know that Pac doesn't plant his feet with all of his punches (in combinations), and only commits to the last few punches (depends on how long you stand there and get hit). That "in-and-out" foot movement that he does usually makes a guy commit to throwing a punch, but as soon as they're ready to punch, he's already headed back at you full speed with some hard ass punches...works almost every time.

Cotto just needs to get in and get out, and circle Pacquaio...works every time. I think Miguel played too much into the crowd (in regards to him being able to bully Pac), and of course, it backfired. I see him doing better than people expect, but I dont see a W coming out of it...more like a not-so-devastating loss.

QUOTE (daprofessor @ Jan 27 2012, 05:15 PM) *
if u'd like to make a sig bet...or some type of wager...let me know.

Make it happen cool.gif

Seek
I dont think Cotto can get the victory at 147. But at 150 he is going to have an edge over Pacquiao. The rematch will be a completely different fight. Big risk for Manny if he agrees to 150. But after coming off a poor performance vs Marquez, i doubt they take a chance. Theyll probably just offer more money...

Also i dont think they want none of Bradley. Theyre too worried about the headbutts. Not a confident sounding team right now...if no Cotto i bet they take Peterson. He will bring in the same money as Bradley and is less risk. Then Marquez and Bradley will fight for a shot at Pacquiao later this year.

Props to Manny if he fights Bradley next or Cotto at 150. Those are the dangerous fights. Marquez is dangerous too but he dont want none of that right now and neither do the fans. And u gotta admit Cotto is more dangerous than Peterson.
The Original MrFactor
Much rather see Mayweather/Cotto just to clear all that up.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Jan 27 2012, 06:52 PM) *
I agree, and Morales did have Pacquiao in no man's land in the first fight because he was in a "boxing" situation, which is somewhat of a nightmare for him.


Cotto just made a mistake by trying to exchange with Pac early instead of moving. Cotto has decent handspeed, but Pacquiao's hands were just too damn fast. Problem is (and this is just my opinion), when Cotto throws combinations, his stance is square, he stays there too long because he plants his feet and commits to every punch (which is good against a slower opponent).

It backfired in that fight because we all know that Pac doesn't plant his feet with all of his punches (in combinations), and only commits to the last few punches (depends on how long you stand there and get hit). That "in-and-out" foot movement that he does usually makes a guy commit to throwing a punch, but as soon as they're ready to punch, he's already headed back at you full speed with some hard ass punches...works almost every time.

Cotto just needs to get in and get out, and circle Pacquaio...works every time. I think Miguel played too much into the crowd (in regards to him being able to bully Pac), and of course, it backfired. I see him doing better than people expect, but I dont see a W coming out of it...more like a not-so-devastating loss.


Make it happen cool.gif


very good post. i agree with everything except the outcome. let's do it. smile.gif
daprofessor
QUOTE (Seek @ Jan 28 2012, 03:30 PM) *
I dont think Cotto can get the victory at 147. But at 150 he is going to have an edge over Pacquiao. The rematch will be a completely different fight. Big risk for Manny if he agrees to 150. But after coming off a poor performance vs Marquez, i doubt they take a chance. Theyll probably just offer more money...

Also i dont think they want none of Bradley. Theyre too worried about the headbutts. Not a confident sounding team right now...if no Cotto i bet they take Peterson. He will bring in the same money as Bradley and is less risk. Then Marquez and Bradley will fight for a shot at Pacquiao later this year.

Props to Manny if he fights Bradley next or Cotto at 150. Those are the dangerous fights. Marquez is dangerous too but he dont want none of that right now and neither do the fans. And u gotta admit Cotto is more dangerous than Peterson.


totally agree. pac is running out of options. cotto is more dangerous than peterson...but peterson won't be a walk in the park.
daprofessor
QUOTE (The Original MrFactor @ Jan 29 2012, 02:37 AM) *
Much rather see Mayweather/Cotto just to clear all that up.


if cotto fights pac...he wins...therefore he gets mayweather afterwards. if he fights mayweather...he loses and the pac bout is out of the picture. i'd rather see mayweather/cotto...
Cshel86
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Jan 30 2012, 02:18 PM) *
if cotto fights pac...he wins...therefore he gets mayweather afterwards. if he fights mayweather...he loses and the pac bout is out of the picture. i'd rather see mayweather/cotto...

I disagree about Cotto being out of the picture for a Pac fight, if he loses to Mayweather. It's not like Pac isn't used to fighting guys who are coming off of losses laugh.gif Seriously, they will put a spin on that fight so quick by stating that Cotto lost to a top fighter.

Im sure that will be a hard pill for Arum to swallow by stating that, but if he's smart, he will use to sell the fight...it's not like they haven't used Floyd's name and old opponents to reach this point, why reinvent the wheel?

As far as a Mayweather/Cotto fight in May (if it happens), Cotto would just have "come off of one of his biggest career wins", so this is where Floyd strikes while the iron is hot. A TKO stoppage in a revenge match with Margarito...a guy that derailed Cotto's career?! Yep...sounds like a big fight waiting to happen.
Franchize
To say ANYBODY is out of consideration, except Mayweather, when it comes to Manny Pacquiao is to be oblivious to the last 5 years of boxing. Bob Arum has proved,no matter how bad you've looked, if your name sells, you can fight Manny. Cotto didn't look good at all against Clottey (I actually had Clottey wining that fight). Magarito got killed by Shane. Shane got killed by Floyd. Bob Arum reminds me of the GM of my poor NY Knicks, he'll pay anybody with a name, regardless of how bad they've looked lately (ex Mike Bibby). So no, losing to Mayweather does NOT exclude Cotto from anything with Top Rank.
Cshel86
QUOTE (Franchize @ Jan 31 2012, 10:55 AM) *
To say ANYBODY is out of consideration, except Mayweather, when it comes to Manny Pacquiao is to be oblivious to the last 5 years of boxing. Bob Arum has proved,no matter how bad you've looked, if your name sells, you can fight Manny. Cotto didn't look good at all against Clottey (I actually had Clottey wining that fight). Magarito got killed by Shane. Shane got killed by Floyd. Bob Arum reminds me of the GM of my poor NY Knicks, he'll pay anybody with a name, regardless of how bad they've looked lately (ex Mike Bibby). So no, losing to Mayweather does NOT exclude Cotto from anything with Top Rank.

+1

You said it better than I could say it.
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