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daprofessor
but dude could not avoid a jab to save his life. he looked very average and i wish all the p4p talk would stop already. when he doesn't have a size advantage, he looks very normal.
daprofessor
btw....rigondeaux destroys him.
Cheesey1
I missed the whole card and have yet to watch it on YouTube, but I like Donaire and think that he's very good. I do like your suggestion of him vs. Rigondeaux.
I'd pick Rigondeaux as well. They're both with Big Pimpin' so that's a match that could definitely be made, but I doubt that Big Pimpin' will let it happen.
mgrover
hes one of the better fighters out there, at least he has some technical skills unlike some, and if he disicplines himself to stop messing around with that lunge and what not, he'd do a lot better.
Cshel86
Did I ever mention that I was going to start listening to Professor??? laugh.gif Im serious man...I've done myself no justice by doing the opposite. And Cheesey, whats up with this "big pimpin' stuff"??? I like it! laugh.gif

Donaire looked like he ate some scallops...by accident laugh.gif Surely that bruising and swelling didn't happen on it's own, but some folks are willing to look past it still say that Donaire can' be beat. His frustration was evident, and Vasquez had a few moments of greatness or solidity, if you would.

I noticed the counter left hook that he hit Donaire with in the corner after Nonito had him hurt and couldn't finish him. Had Vasquez had more pop,then somebody would've been stunned. I agree that he's a top fighter, but yes, the P4P talk can stop at the moment.

Until he finds a division to commit to, there's truly no need to label him P4P, but of course, that's just my opinion.
Cheesey1
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Feb 6 2012, 11:10 PM) *
Did I ever mention that I was going to start listening to Professor??? laugh.gif Im serious man...I've done myself no justice by doing the opposite. And Cheesey, whats up with this "big pimpin' stuff"??? I like it! laugh.gif

Donaire looked like he ate some scallops...by accident laugh.gif Surely that bruising and swelling didn't happen on it's own, but some folks are willing to look past it still say that Donaire can' be beat. His frustration was evident, and Vasquez had a few moments of greatness or solidity, if you would.

I noticed the counter left hook that he hit Donaire with in the corner after Nonito had him hurt and couldn't finish him. Had Vasquez had more pop,then somebody would've been stunned. I agree that he's a top fighter, but yes, the P4P talk can stop at the moment.

Until he finds a division to commit to, there's truly no need to label him P4P, but of course, that's just my opinion.

Re. Big Pimpin', thanks. What can I say but game recognise game (ha). The Bobfather for real.
mitukczuk
I dont know about Donaire being P4P. I think he gets hit way too much but truth is, he possesses some good boxing fundamentals and he is...well...fluid when hes boxing. I would not judge him based on his last performance when he hurt his hand though. He was frustrated and Vasquez is a solid fighter who gave him some trouble but he handled it well imo. He is not in TOP 10 P4P, but in TOP 20 ? (which is kind of irrelevant) I'd say yes. But as was mentioned somewhere above, he needs to spend longer time in one of these division and really get someone who will test him.
karmine20
I have just one question.. IF he hadnt won and used the excuse he broke his hand, then he would be viewed in a different light. Andre ward hurt his hand vs froch and didnt put on one of his best performances, but at the end of the day you go out there and get the win no matter what. You have to understand he was fighting with a busted hand and still got the victory. and most would say he won 8 rounds to 4 witha busted hand. C'mon man give credit where its due. he has great head movement and i believe he can avoid the jab if he wanted to he just likes to mix it up. Donaire imo is a fighter who looks to put on a good show and he prefers to mix it up.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Feb 7 2012, 12:10 AM) *
Did I ever mention that I was going to start listening to Professor??? laugh.gif Im serious man...I've done myself no justice by doing the opposite. And Cheesey, whats up with this "big pimpin' stuff"??? I like it! laugh.gif

Donaire looked like he ate some scallops...by accident laugh.gif Surely that bruising and swelling didn't happen on it's own, but some folks are willing to look past it still say that Donaire can' be beat. His frustration was evident, and Vasquez had a few moments of greatness or solidity, if you would.

I noticed the counter left hook that he hit Donaire with in the corner after Nonito had him hurt and couldn't finish him. Had Vasquez had more pop,then somebody would've been stunned. I agree that he's a top fighter, but yes, the P4P talk can stop at the moment.

Until he finds a division to commit to, there's truly no need to label him P4P, but of course, that's just my opinion.


50% of the time...i get it right, 100% of the time! laugh.gif

daprofessor
QUOTE (mitukczuk @ Feb 7 2012, 01:00 PM) *
I dont know about Donaire being P4P. I think he gets hit way too much but truth is, he possesses some good boxing fundamentals and he is...well...fluid when hes boxing. I would not judge him based on his last performance when he hurt his hand though. He was frustrated and Vasquez is a solid fighter who gave him some trouble but he handled it well imo. He is not in TOP 10 P4P, but in TOP 20 ? (which is kind of irrelevant) I'd say yes. But as was mentioned somewhere above, he needs to spend longer time in one of these division and really get someone who will test him.


let's not forget, he looked like crap against the guy from argentina who was much smaller than him in the previous fight.
daprofessor
QUOTE (karmine20 @ Feb 7 2012, 01:59 PM) *
I have just one question.. IF he hadnt won and used the excuse he broke his hand, then he would be viewed in a different light. Andre ward hurt his hand vs froch and didnt put on one of his best performances, but at the end of the day you go out there and get the win no matter what. You have to understand he was fighting with a busted hand and still got the victory. and most would say he won 8 rounds to 4 witha busted hand. C'mon man give credit where its due. he has great head movement and i believe he can avoid the jab if he wanted to he just likes to mix it up. Donaire imo is a fighter who looks to put on a good show and he prefers to mix it up.


welcome, my filipino brother! smile.gif

ur right...he does deserve credit for winning with a broken hand but i don't believe he was taking those jabs because he wanted to mix it up. also...his head movement isn't consistent. he's looked very ordinary in his last two fights. i'll give him a pass for the broken hand....but i'd like to see him step up in competition. he's had his two "stay-busy" fights. maybe one more to work out whatever it is he's dealing with....then he needs to step up.
mitukczuk
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Feb 7 2012, 02:28 PM) *
let's not forget, he looked like crap against the guy from argentina who was much smaller than him in the previous fight.


But looked spectacular vs Montiel. TBH, I don't know what to think about Donaire biggrin.gif
daprofessor
QUOTE (mitukczuk @ Feb 7 2012, 02:39 PM) *
But looked spectacular vs Montiel. TBH, I don't know what to think about Donaire biggrin.gif


very spectacular!!! that's going to be hard to top.
Cshel86
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Feb 7 2012, 01:27 PM) *
50% of the time...i get it right, 100% of the time! laugh.gif

laugh.gif
checkleft
QUOTE (karmine20 @ Feb 7 2012, 01:59 PM) *
I have just one question.. IF he hadnt won and used the excuse he broke his hand, then he would be viewed in a different light. Andre ward hurt his hand vs froch and didnt put on one of his best performances, but at the end of the day you go out there and get the win no matter what. You have to understand he was fighting with a busted hand and still got the victory. and most would say he won 8 rounds to 4 witha busted hand. C'mon man give credit where its due. he has great head movement and i believe he can avoid the jab if he wanted to he just likes to mix it up. Donaire imo is a fighter who looks to put on a good show and he prefers to mix it up.


What? Ward schooled froch, what fight were you watching.

mitukczuk
QUOTE (checkleft @ Feb 7 2012, 11:42 PM) *
What? Ward schooled froch, what fight were you watching.


He not only schooled him, he outhustled him, which was maybe the biggest surprise in the fight.
Cshel86
QUOTE (mitukczuk @ Feb 8 2012, 10:31 AM) *
He not only schooled him, he outhustled him, which was maybe the biggest surprise in the fight.

Nuff said!
BrutalBodyShots
I think everyone is being a bit tough on Donaire. I didn't know much about Vazquez prior to the fight, but anyone that fights essentially an even fight with Arce is no slouch. The hand injury looked to be pretty bad; not sure I've ever seen gauze soaked through like that after a fighter took his glove off after a bout.

Anyway I won't be quick to say Donaire isn't P4P material; his wins over Montiel and Darchinyan (and the WAY he won) were impressive as hell. Yes he's had a few lack luster fights recently, but we do know what he is capable of against top opposition. Let's see what happens with him in his next fight or two.

mgrover
i think people are just picking out anything they can find bad about this performance, he beat the guy soundly, the one judge that gave it to vasquez was obviously in the wrong, what was the score card 117-110 for donaire? isnt that a damn fine scorecard?yes his face was swollen but i guess he wanted to give the fans some entertainment, like when morales came out in the 12 against pacman all southpaw and crazy, did people enjoy the fight? am sure they enjoyed it more than the main event.
daprofessor
QUOTE (mgrover @ Feb 8 2012, 08:45 PM) *
i think people are just picking out anything they can find bad about this performance, he beat the guy soundly, the one judge that gave it to vasquez was obviously in the wrong, what was the score card 117-110 for donaire? isnt that a damn fine scorecard?yes his face was swollen but i guess he wanted to give the fans some entertainment, like when morales came out in the 12 against pacman all southpaw and crazy, did people enjoy the fight? am sure they enjoyed it more than the main event.


i think when the fans/media are talking about the guy being top 5 p4p best in boxing....it's being generous. he's one of my favorite fighters...but let's not get ahead of ourselves here. the guy is very beatable. he did what he was supposed to against vasquez who is limited in experience and skill. the talk of him facing gamboa needs to stop. there are plenty of guys i believe will beat him. rigondeaux, moreno, mares...just to name a few. i'd like to see how he'd do against king kong agbeko. i think he's on par with mares and agbeko...but ridondeaux and moreno are the elite guys in their division. they both beat him imo. fighting arce is a step backwards.
mgrover
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Feb 9 2012, 02:00 AM) *
i think when the fans/media are talking about the guy being top 5 p4p best in boxing....it's being generous. he's one of my favorite fighters...but let's not get ahead of ourselves here. the guy is very beatable. he did what he was supposed to against vasquez who is limited in experience and skill. the talk of him facing gamboa needs to stop. there are plenty of guys i believe will beat him. rigondeaux, moreno, mares...just to name a few. i'd like to see how he'd do against king kong agbeko. i think he's on par with mares and agbeko...but ridondeaux and moreno are the elite guys in their division. they both beat him imo. fighting arce is a step backwards.


i mainly like the guy cause hes one of the few with solid fundementals (aside from maybe his foot work in the last fight) i hope he fights the top tier guys and beats them, but he won't win if hes fighting like he is now, he came out all overly aggressive in the fight rather than his controlled self, maybe the trash talk got to him?
daprofessor
QUOTE (mgrover @ Feb 9 2012, 09:18 AM) *
i mainly like the guy cause hes one of the few with solid fundementals (aside from maybe his foot work in the last fight) i hope he fights the top tier guys and beats them, but he won't win if hes fighting like he is now, he came out all overly aggressive in the fight rather than his controlled self, maybe the trash talk got to him?


when he did that interview with merchant before the fight it was clear to me he was going to go for the ko. it became even more clear when he was in the ring loading up on one shot at a time. knock outs rarely come when u do that. he should have stuck to what he does. vasquez definitely got under his skin and he came out of his normal game plan. not the stuff p4p guys are made of imo.
Cshel86
I believe that trash talk got Donaire out of character a bit, he's usually a bit more patient, even if hes going for the KO. He was trying to knock Wilfredo out the while time, and to no avail, the shit didn't happen.

If trash talk gets him worked up like that, then another guy with KO power and decent defense, along with a big ass mouth, will probably have Donaire up shit creek. That hand looked terrible though...wonder how long it will take to heal up.
BrutalBodyShots
Can someone give me a brief schooling on Rigondeaux? I saw several people in this thread say that they'd take him over Donaire and I know nothing about the guy... I looked him up and see he has 9 pro fights? Did he have some kind of crazy amateur career or something?
Cshel86
QUOTE (BrutalBodyShots @ Feb 10 2012, 09:50 PM) *
Can someone give me a brief schooling on Rigondeaux? I saw several people in this thread say that they'd take him over Donaire and I know nothing about the guy... I looked him up and see he has 9 pro fights? Did he have some kind of crazy amateur career or something?

He's Cuban and he's had over 400 amateur fights I believe. I guess that's
BrutalBodyShots
Just watched 2 of his fights on youtube... against Ramos and Casey. Based on those 2 performances I wouldn't take him over Donaire. Maybe there are other fights I should watch? He seems like a very good body puncher, but come on... 9 fights? I don't see Donaire laying down for this guy. I've seen Donaire take quite a few shots in this fights and keep coming... but what do we know about Rigondeaux's resiliency to punches? Of course I'm basing this assessment off of about 7 rounds of action, but I really don't see him dealing with Nonito's speed all too well.

Cshel86
QUOTE (BrutalBodyShots @ Feb 10 2012, 10:11 PM) *
Just watched 2 of his fights on youtube... against Ramos and Casey. Based on those 2 performances I wouldn't take him over Donaire. Maybe there are other fights I should watch? He seems like a very good body puncher, but come on... 9 fights? I don't see Donaire laying down for this guy. I've seen Donaire take quite a few shots in this fights and keep coming... but what do we know about Rigondeaux's resiliency to punches? Of course I'm basing this assessment off of about 7 rounds of action, but I really don't see him dealing with Nonito's speed all too well.

I agree. He has decent power and so forth, but I think people are pushing him because he's 31 and he "appears" to have the tools to beat Donaire, or at least give him consistent issues.
BrutalBodyShots
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Feb 10 2012, 10:19 PM) *
I agree. He has decent power and so forth, but I think people are pushing him because he's 31 and he "appears" to have the tools to beat Donaire, or at least give him consistent issues.


I didn't realize he didn't start his pro career until he was 29; I get why they'd be rushing him as that's an extremely late start in the sport.

I wonder why he didn't cut the amount of amateur fights he had in half and hit the pros years ago during more of his "prime" age wise anyway? If he did indeed have the goods by now he could have been making some real sweet money.

daprofessor
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Feb 9 2012, 11:44 PM) *
I believe that trash talk got Donaire out of character a bit, he's usually a bit more patient, even if hes going for the KO. He was trying to knock Wilfredo out the while time, and to no avail, the shit didn't happen.

If trash talk gets him worked up like that, then another guy with KO power and decent defense, along with a big ass mouth, will probably have Donaire up shit creek. That hand looked terrible though...wonder how long it will take to heal up.


there were no fractures. he had a ruptured vein or some shit.
daprofessor
QUOTE (BrutalBodyShots @ Feb 10 2012, 10:50 PM) *
Can someone give me a brief schooling on Rigondeaux? I saw several people in this thread say that they'd take him over Donaire and I know nothing about the guy... I looked him up and see he has 9 pro fights? Did he have some kind of crazy amateur career or something?


i watched rigondeaux work out of the wildcard when he was with roach. the dude is as solid as they come and freddie himself said that he is the most skilled fighter he ever worked with and that he had learned from him more than rigondeaux learned from roach. that says a lot when u consider who he has trained over the years. i've watched him spar guys and give up size. his defense is way above average and so is his punching power. one of my guys sparred with him and said his punches felt like bricks...and that was with big gloves and headgear on.

i won't name any names...but i'll tell u that he knocked out a very well known prospect with a single shot and the guy was wearing a bitch bar headgear and outweighed him by 20lbs. imo, he's the head of the class in that division. they've wanted to challenge for a title back when he had 4 and 5 fights. that is unheard of.
daprofessor
QUOTE (BrutalBodyShots @ Feb 11 2012, 10:47 AM) *
I didn't realize he didn't start his pro career until he was 29; I get why they'd be rushing him as that's an extremely late start in the sport.

I wonder why he didn't cut the amount of amateur fights he had in half and hit the pros years ago during more of his "prime" age wise anyway? If he did indeed have the goods by now he could have been making some real sweet money.


he tried to defect from cuba in 04 and failed. they took him off the national team and he was unable to compete. he defected a few years later...thus the late start in the pros.
Cshel86
Didn't he get caught up in some legal shit and did a little time?
daprofessor
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Feb 12 2012, 06:37 PM) *
Didn't he get caught up in some legal shit and did a little time?


i think ur thinking of gamboa with the domestic violence thing..
Cshel86
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Feb 13 2012, 02:27 PM) *
i think ur thinking of gamboa with the domestic violence thing..

Nah I meant Rigondeaux, I need to watch the Ramos fight again. I remember them saying that he was arrested for something, but I didn't know what it was. I just figured that somebody knew the reason why.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Feb 13 2012, 04:01 PM) *
Nah I meant Rigondeaux, I need to watch the Ramos fight again. I remember them saying that he was arrested for something, but I didn't know what it was. I just figured that somebody knew the reason why.


maybe...i didn't hear the commentary for that one.
Th3rd
I definitely want to see Donaire and Rigo vs the likes of Arce, Nishioka and Mares. But eventually Donaire and Rigo have to fight. The only one I think who can prevent that fight from happening is Abner Mares, whom I feel can upset both Donaire and Rigo. He has a tremendous heart and chin, being able to box and brawl when necessary and execute his game-plan. I believe Arce and Nishioka will come up short. In my opinion the big 3 is Donaire, Rigo and Mares. Any variation of those three fighting will be 50/50 type bouts.
checkleft
Moreno is pretty Sharp. He's gonna knock a top dog just watch, the guy is slick.
daprofessor
QUOTE (checkleft @ Feb 14 2012, 03:21 PM) *
Moreno is pretty Sharp. He's gonna knock a top dog just watch, the guy is slick.


i agree. he's the dark horse in all of this. i've only seen him fight once but from what i saw...he has the goods to be a tough fight for any of these guys.
Cshel86
Moreno? It sounds familiar, but Im not sure I've seen him fight...maybe by accident.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Feb 14 2012, 09:13 PM) *
Moreno? It sounds familiar, but Im not sure I've seen him fight...maybe by accident.


anslemo moreno...he fought on the undercard of mares/agbeko 2. he beat darchinyan pretty convincingly.
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