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daprofessor
it seems morales didn't catch as much heat as both berto and peterson. is this my imagination? i haven't read too many articles crucifying him the way they did peterson and berto.

also...i've never really believed p.e.d's help that much in boxing and this fight proves me right again.

so far...of the bouts we know where fighters have tested positive...none of them have ever looked super human imo.

garcia/morales....morales got ktfo'd

vargas/dlh...vargas tested positive and got ko'd.

mosley/dlh 2...mosley didn't test positive but did admit to using after the fact...many thought he lost this fight.

toney/ruiz...toney beat ruiz...but it wasn't one of his best performances.

toney/batchelder...really wasn't impressive in this one.

jones/hall...both fighters tested positive...i think hall was stopped...but it wasn't devastating.

tarver/kayode....fight was a draw...nothing spectacular.

salido/guerrero...i didn't see this fight...but he tested positive.

peterson/khan...peterson later admitted to using TRT...but many thought he lost that fight and benefited from the home town refs' point deductions.

did i miss any?
checkleft
Who tested positive between salido and guerrero??

I think its one of those things in boxing that is happening a lot without being caught. I like that more and more people are getting caught so that maybe more fighters will be willing to implement these stricter tests.
Cshel86
Now that I see this list, my eyes are opened wide! How in the hell can you take PEDs and look bad in your fight? Im trying to remember when Shane started all of that jiggly twitching shit during fights, but my best guess is after he got off that shit.
mgrover
Proves that all the athletic ability in the world can never be a substitute for boxing skill
Cheesey1
All P.E.Ds are bad and are forms of cheating, but not all P.E.Ds are as dangerous (IMO). Things like EPO, testosterone, blood doping etc are much worse than diuretics because of the direct effect they have on a person's strength and stamina.
HazConvictedFelonMane
QUOTE (checkleft @ Oct 22 2012, 07:52 PM) *
Who tested positive between salido and guerrero??

I think its one of those things in boxing that is happening a lot without being caught. I like that more and more people are getting caught so that maybe more fighters will be willing to implement these stricter tests.


Salido.
daprofessor
salido tested positive for anabolic steroids. he beat guerrero.

anyone care to address why morales got a pass?
BigDDatHomey
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Oct 22 2012, 06:51 PM) *
it seems morales didn't catch as much heat as both berto and peterson. is this my imagination? i haven't read too many articles crucifying him the way they did peterson and berto.

also...i've never really believed p.e.d's help that much in boxing and this fight proves me right again.


You're not taking many factors into account. What about all the Ws each fighter had? They could've been taking it all along. You also don't know what kind of athlete they were prior vs. when they were caught. Any anabolic or growth hormone has a proven result. It is very clear that if you take it, it will enhance your ability. Just because you weren't that good of a boxer, you take PEDs and you're still not that good doesn't mean that it didn't enhance your abilities. It is very possible that if athletes were not using PEDs, they wouldn't survive at the elite level at all Hence the pressure to take it even though you might get caught. I also can't imagine that none of these fighters ever scored a performance enhancing knockdown or an enhanced blow that caused a cut.

Are we also saying that if FMJ decided to take PEDs now and used it for his next two fights that he wouldn't simply just walk through anyone you put in front of him? FMJ on PEDs would've ended Cotto in 3-4 rds.

If a fighter gets caught once you have to assume he was always taking it and every W is suspect.
Franchize
QUOTE (BigDDatHomey @ Oct 23 2012, 07:36 AM) *
You're not taking many factors into account. What about all the Ws each fighter had? They could've been taking it all along. You also don't know what kind of athlete they were prior vs. when they were caught. Any anabolic or growth hormone has a proven result. It is very clear that if you take it, it will enhance your ability. Just because you weren't that good of a boxer, you take PEDs and you're still not that good doesn't mean that it didn't enhance your abilities. It is very possible that if athletes were not using PEDs, they wouldn't survive at the elite level at all Hence the pressure to take it even though you might get caught. I also can't imagine that none of these fighters ever scored a performance enhancing knockdown or an enhanced blow that caused a cut.

Are we also saying that if FMJ decided to take PEDs now and used it for his next two fights that he wouldn't simply just walk through anyone you put in front of him? FMJ on PEDs would've ended Cotto in 3-4 rds.

If a fighter gets caught once you have to assume he was always taking it and every W is suspect.


This, not to mention the ramifications even when they lose. Sometimes people forget, even when you win, you lose in boxing. End of the day, if you fight and entire 12 rounds, at some point, you're going to get hit. PEDs are a big problem in boxing.

If that doesnt convince you, take into account that guys like Tommy Morrison wouldnt have even had a career if it weren't for PEDs. I won't even go into speculating on who else I think was on steroids.
checkleft
QUOTE (Franchize @ Oct 23 2012, 10:09 AM) *
This, not to mention the ramifications even when they lose. Sometimes people forget, even when you win, you lose in boxing. End of the day, if you fight and entire 12 rounds, at some point, you're going to get hit. PEDs are a big problem in boxing.

If that doesnt convince you, take into account that guys like Tommy Morrison wouldnt have even had a career if it weren't for PEDs. I won't even go into speculating on who else I think was on steroids.

That's no fun
leonthegee
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Oct 23 2012, 12:28 AM) *
salido tested positive for anabolic steroids. he beat guerrero.

anyone care to address why morales got a pass?


Morales gets a pass because he already has one foot out the door already. Plus hes not a threat to Manny Pacquiao now. Where as fighters like Peterson and Berto are. Not to mention they are black. For years people would argue Pacquiao never fought an African American fighter. He only fights fighters who come straight forward to make him look good. So since Floyd was such an advacate for ODST and is the best African American fighter guys like Peterson and Berto get hated on as a kind of collateral damage. Because Pactards think that all blacks support black fighters. So hating on Berto and Peterson is, in a sick profound way, another way of hating on Floyd. Or at least hating on FLOMOS while at the same time gives them an argument, them meaning Pactards, of why Pacquiao never faced Berto or Peterson.
Cshel86
Just reading this list, gave me this weird moment of realization...

"If you're gonna cheat, don't be cheap". - Cshel Delagatto (an excerpt from the PED Chronicles)
daprofessor
QUOTE (BigDDatHomey @ Oct 23 2012, 07:36 AM) *
You're not taking many factors into account. What about all the Ws each fighter had? They could've been taking it all along. You also don't know what kind of athlete they were prior vs. when they were caught. Any anabolic or growth hormone has a proven result. It is very clear that if you take it, it will enhance your ability. Just because you weren't that good of a boxer, you take PEDs and you're still not that good doesn't mean that it didn't enhance your abilities. It is very possible that if athletes were not using PEDs, they wouldn't survive at the elite level at all Hence the pressure to take it even though you might get caught. I also can't imagine that none of these fighters ever scored a performance enhancing knockdown or an enhanced blow that caused a cut.

Are we also saying that if FMJ decided to take PEDs now and used it for his next two fights that he wouldn't simply just walk through anyone you put in front of him? FMJ on PEDs would've ended Cotto in 3-4 rds.

If a fighter gets caught once you have to assume he was always taking it and every W is suspect.


very valid points. i agree.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Oct 23 2012, 02:33 PM) *
Just reading this list, gave me this weird moment of realization...

"If you're gonna cheat, don't be cheap". - Cshel Delagatto (an excerpt from the PED Chronicles)


laugh.gif


daprofessor
QUOTE (leonthegee @ Oct 23 2012, 02:09 PM) *
Morales gets a pass because he already has one foot out the door already. Plus hes not a threat to Manny Pacquiao now. Where as fighters like Peterson and Berto are. Not to mention they are black. For years people would argue Pacquiao never fought an African American fighter. He only fights fighters who come straight forward to make him look good. So since Floyd was such an advacate for ODST and is the best African American fighter guys like Peterson and Berto get hated on as a kind of collateral damage. Because Pactards think that all blacks support black fighters. So hating on Berto and Peterson is, in a sick profound way, another way of hating on Floyd. Or at least hating on FLOMOS while at the same time gives them an argument, them meaning Pactards, of why Pacquiao never faced Berto or Peterson.


that's deep.
BigDDatHomey
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Oct 22 2012, 09:03 PM) *
Now that I see this list, my eyes are opened wide! How in the hell can you take PEDs and look bad in your fight? Im trying to remember when Shane started all of that jiggly twitching shit during fights, but my best guess is after he got off that shit.


Haha....that's funny. I was wondering the same thing. A topic was posted about Shane's chin and the first thing I noticed was how calm he was. I asked when he started all that twitchin and stuff. I like the way you put it the best.....haha...that's funny.
mgrover
QUOTE (leonthegee @ Oct 23 2012, 07:09 PM) *
Plus hes not a threat to Manny Pacquiao now. Where as fighters like Peterson and Berto are. Not to mention they are black. For years people would argue Pacquiao never fought an African American fighter. He only fights fighters who come straight forward to make him look good. So since Floyd was such an advacate for ODST and is the best African American fighter guys like Peterson and Berto get hated on as a kind of collateral damage. Because Pactards think that all blacks support black fighters. So hating on Berto and Peterson is, in a sick profound way, another way of hating on Floyd. Or at least hating on FLOMOS while at the same time gives them an argument, them meaning Pactards, of why Pacquiao never faced Berto or Peterson.


this is a joke?

tbh there are some valid points, i just don't think the whole african american fighter has anything to do with it. the fighting the come forward fighters is pretty true. i think we can all agree the day when flomos and pactards are out of the sport the better off we'll be.

QUOTE (BigDDatHomey @ Oct 23 2012, 12:36 PM) *
FMJ on PEDs would've ended Cotto in 3-4 rds.


cause this obviously is

either way am pissed, maybe its because am paying much more attention to the bullshit that comes with boxing, but the corruption sees no end, everytime we think we've stemmed something somebody like morales fucks it up. and it just gets swept under the rug, i mean DAFUQ. Morales deserved to be put out like that, that should teach him to try and cheat. Garcias left hook was the hand of God teaching Morales a lesson, and I don't even believe in the big guy...
BigDDatHomey
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Oct 22 2012, 06:51 PM) *
it seems morales didn't catch as much heat as both berto and peterson. is this my imagination? i haven't read too many articles crucifying him the way they did peterson and berto.


I think Morales gets a pass because he's old, warn, and irrelevant at this point in his career. Maybe they should allow you take diuretics after a certain time and age in the sport. Diurectics really aren't really going to give you an advantage over your opponent in this situation, especially if you're taking them in a 3 - 4 month training camp. Maybe you'll go a few extra rounds. Morales would have had to be on test/anadrol stack to stay in that fight. Nothing was going to save him at this point in his career. I would think in some cases, it's probably worse for you.

I just heard that Holyfield might unretire. He should get a 10cc handicap or something....haha....

Maybe boxing should do what they do with bodybuilding. Have an all natural league. Let the not-so-natural fight the all natural in the end and see who wins.

Probably end up with the same drama....Pac vs. Mayweather...haha
leonthegee
[quote name='mgrover' date='Oct 23 2012, 11:54 AM' post='568469']
this is a joke?

tbh there are some valid points, i just don't think the whole african american fighter has anything to do with it. the fighting the come forward fighters is pretty true. i think we can all agree the day when flomos and pactards are out of the sport the better off we'll be.

Welcome back Stevenski. Man have I missed you.
mgrover
QUOTE (leonthegee @ Oct 23 2012, 08:22 PM) *
QUOTE (mgrover @ Oct 23 2012, 11:54 AM) *

this is a joke?

tbh there are some valid points, i just don't think the whole african american fighter has anything to do with it. the fighting the come forward fighters is pretty true. i think we can all agree the day when flomos and pactards are out of the sport the better off we'll be.

Welcome back Stevenski. Man have I missed you.


sorry to let you down but that aint me wink.gif
daprofessor
QUOTE (BigDDatHomey @ Oct 23 2012, 03:06 PM) *
I think Morales gets a pass because he's old, warn, and irrelevant at this point in his career. Maybe they should allow you take diuretics after a certain time and age in the sport. Diurectics really aren't really going to give you an advantage over your opponent in this situation, especially if you're taking them in a 3 - 4 month training camp. Maybe you'll go a few extra rounds. Morales would have had to be on test/anadrol stack to stay in that fight. Nothing was going to save him at this point in his career. I would think in some cases, it's probably worse for you.

I just heard that Holyfield might unretire. He should get a 10cc handicap or something....haha....

Maybe boxing should do what they do with bodybuilding. Have an all natural league. Let the not-so-natural fight the all natural in the end and see who wins.

Probably end up with the same drama....Pac vs. Mayweather...haha


diuretics do more harm to the fighter taking them than anyone.

laugh.gif @ the 10cc handicap.
flazi
i thought salido was caught with recreation drugs? there is a huge difference between p.e.d.s and something used to cut weight. if you cut too much weight, you will not be effective in the fight. especially clenbuterol. that shit will not enhance your perfomance, it will damage you. i took it for a while to lose weight and i was so jittery and felt so bad @ the lowest dose that i stopped after 2 weeks. you are your strongest the more water and salt and potassium you have in body so when you go losing it all and you don't rehydrate correctly, you will not have nothing come fight night.

Also depending on the steriod, it could have a negative effect come fight night. The only steroid imo that would help a boxer is test. i went from running a mile struggling to running 5 miles all on a 6 week cycle of 400mg a week. i am not a runner but with the test i had so much more red blood cells that it was a breeze to run. this is why its the drug of choice for cyclist, mma'ers and most others.
bnoles4life
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Oct 23 2012, 04:33 PM) *
diuretics do more harm to the fighter taking them than anyone.

laugh.gif @ the 10cc handicap.


To this point, the truest post in this thread. Furthermore, Floyd on PEDs isn't a guarantee he would've walked through Cotto in 3-4 rounds. IMO, the most important factor in gauging what type of advantage one has w/ PEDs, is WHICH PED one is taking. Like people, all PEDs aren't created equal.
daprofessor
QUOTE (bnoles4life @ Oct 23 2012, 07:13 PM) *
To this point, the truest post in this thread. Furthermore, Floyd on PEDs isn't a guarantee he would've walked through Cotto in 3-4 rounds. IMO, the most important factor in gauging what type of advantage one has w/ PEDs, is WHICH PED one is taking. Like people, all PEDs aren't created equal.


agreed... flazi makes that point in the post before yours.
bnoles4life
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Oct 23 2012, 10:04 PM) *
agreed... flazi makes that point in the post before yours.


Actually, he referenced steroids (or did I read that wrong?) and I outlined PEDs, as they're not automatically synonymous nor interchangeable.
Franchize
I think people think something automatically negative when they hear the word steroid. I have a skin condition that I used to take a steroid for. I don't think it meant I could knock a pussy out because I rubbed some cream on my skin lol. If anything it helped me get mroe pussy. That was a nice little marketing ploy in the bedroom for me when I was single. "Ma, I'm not tryna be rude but I have a non contagious skin condition. Can you rub this cream on my back?" Next thing you know.... head meet headboard! lol
daprofessor
QUOTE (bnoles4life @ Oct 23 2012, 09:43 PM) *
Actually, he referenced steroids (or did I read that wrong?) and I outlined PEDs, as they're not automatically synonymous nor interchangeable.


QUOTE
flazi: The only steroid imo that would help a boxer is test. i went from running a mile struggling to running 5 miles all on a 6 week cycle of 400mg a week. i am not a runner but with the test i had so much more red blood cells that it was a breeze to run. this is why its the drug of choice for cyclist, mma'ers and most others.


i'm guessing that is an abbreviation for testosterone...or TRT.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Franchize @ Oct 24 2012, 12:25 PM) *
I think people think something automatically negative when they hear the word steroid. I have a skin condition that I used to take a steroid for. I don't think it meant I could knock a pussy out because I rubbed some cream on my skin lol. If anything it helped me get mroe pussy. That was a nice little marketing ploy in the bedroom for me when I was single. "Ma, I'm not tryna be rude but I have a non contagious skin condition. Can you rub this cream on my back?" Next thing you know.... head meet headboard! lol


laugh.gif
flazi
yes test means testosterone in all its esters, enanthate, propionate, cypionate etc. your stamina will improve regardless. even on a clinical low dose. that being said there are guys who do need TRT. if your body isn't producing enough and there is something wrong with your hpta axis then you need it, boxer or mma or regular joe. with low test you would not want to get out of bed in the morning.

LOL @ head meet headboard.
Cshel86
QUOTE (Franchize @ Oct 24 2012, 01:25 PM) *
I think people think something automatically negative when they hear the word steroid. I have a skin condition that I used to take a steroid for. I don't think it meant I could knock a pussy out because I rubbed some cream on my skin lol. If anything it helped me get mroe pussy. That was a nice little marketing ploy in the bedroom for me when I was single. "Ma, I'm not tryna be rude but I have a non contagious skin condition. Can you rub this cream on my back?" Next thing you know.... head meet headboard! lol

Yet, another classic Franchize post. laugh.gif
Franchize
QUOTE
LOL @ head meet headboard.




"Yeeaaaaaahhhh Boy"
bnoles4life
QUOTE (Franchize @ Oct 25 2012, 09:19 AM) *


"Yeeaaaaaahhhh Boy"


"Marcus, you don't get pussy whipped....WHIP THAT PUSSY!!!"
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