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Full Version: Pac vs Marquez IIII (Preview and Poll)
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sduck
Freddie Roach is probably the most overrated trainer, ever. Dude speaks nothing but nonsense. Speaking on that, Marquez thinks it's "possible" to knock out Pacquiao. Man I don't care what any bullshit about proof/evidence someone wants to say, but this version of Pacquiao is just too roided up. It's obvious Pacquiao has took some sort of PEDs in his career. Dude was made with a glass chin from the start, now (being much older) he takes any kinds of shots and barely even stumbles. If he's really legit on that improvement on his chin, then that is fuckin incredible
Cshel86
QUOTE (checkleft @ Nov 27 2012, 09:07 PM) *
Talk about the pot calling the tea kettle black! Haha

http://www.boxingscene.com/roach-if-marque...-his-ass--59816

It's nice to see Roach go from strength to strength nowadays...
daprofessor
QUOTE (sduck @ Nov 28 2012, 02:38 PM) *
Freddie Roach is probably the most overrated trainer, ever. Dude speaks nothing but nonsense. Speaking on that, Marquez thinks it's "possible" to knock out Pacquiao. Man I don't care what any bullshit about proof/evidence someone wants to say, but this version of Pacquiao is just too roided up. It's obvious Pacquiao has took some sort of PEDs in his career. Dude was made with a glass chin from the start, now (being much older) he takes any kinds of shots and barely even stumbles. If he's really legit on that improvement on his chin, then that is fuckin incredible


i think it's a combination of being hydrated, careful matchmaking, weight drain game and pac actually being pretty good.
sduck
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 28 2012, 02:12 PM) *
i think it's a combination of being hydrated, careful matchmaking, weight drain game and pac actually being pretty good.

Besides all the cherry picked fights, doesn't mean they can't throw a punch. You can go back and look at footage of Pac's two KO defeats. Probably the most feather-fisted KOs I've ever seen. Making that much improvement on a glass chin that bad is astonishing.
mgrover
QUOTE (sduck @ Nov 28 2012, 07:54 PM) *
Besides all the cherry picked fights, doesn't mean they can't throw a punch. You can go back and look at footage of Pac's two KO defeats. Probably the most feather-fisted KOs I've ever seen. Making that much improvement on a glass chin that bad is astonishing.


didnt know your abs were a muscle in your chin...
daprofessor
QUOTE (mgrover @ Nov 28 2012, 06:47 PM) *
didnt know your abs were a muscle in your chin...


u beat me to it! laugh.gif
mgrover
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 29 2012, 12:52 AM) *
u beat me to it! laugh.gif


I hate to say this but it takes Rogers quote of people don't know shit about boxing to a whole new level. sduck either didnt watch the KOs or he really has a serious flaw his knowledge of the human body
sduck
u right im a dumbass, and no its just bad/mistake of memory

anyway fuck this fight, top rank, bob arum, fuck it. im prolly gonna end up watchin it anyway ffs
mgrover
why wouldnt people watch it, its boxing lol. i wouldnt mind if these fought another two times tbh, as long as the right decision is given.
checkleft
QUOTE (mgrover @ Nov 29 2012, 11:56 AM) *
why wouldnt people watch it, its boxing lol. i wouldnt mind if these fought another two times tbh, as long as the right decision is given.

I know for a fact I won't watch it cause ill be working, but if I could I Damn sure wouldnt pay a cent for it.
daprofessor
i'll watch because i am a die hard. i will also be praying to the boxing gods for a definitive end to this fight that leaves no doubt or controversy one way or the other.
mgrover
so realistically a KO, not a TKO, a clear KO
sduck
I just like to watch a scrap regardless. Pac-Marquez always make a good fight. The only issue I have is prolly the same as most people, Top Rank/Bob Arum's nonsense.
daprofessor
QUOTE (mgrover @ Nov 29 2012, 04:25 PM) *
so realistically a KO, not a TKO, a clear KO


that would be great! i think jmm has the better chance of making that happen this time.
Cshel86
Funny how Arum completely shitted on the idea of random drug testing for this fight. That goes to show you that HE doesn't want OSDT for the megafight, regardless of what he said that they agreed to.

On top of that, he JUST went on record and TOTALLY shitted on the idea of working with GBP to make a Donaire/Mares and Rios/Matthysse fight...so again, that goes to show you that he doesn't want to make the fight.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 29 2012, 10:53 PM) *
Funny how Arum completely shitted on the idea of random drug testing for this fight. That goes to show you that HE doesn't want OSDT for the megafight, regardless of what he said that they agreed to.

On top of that, he JUST went on record and TOTALLY shitted on the idea of working with GBP to make a Donaire/Mares and Rios/Matthysse fight...so again, that goes to show you that he doesn't want to make the fight.


i'm not one to wish death on anyone...but daaaaaaaaamn!!!!
mgrover
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 30 2012, 01:43 AM) *
that would be great! i think jmm has the better chance of making that happen this time.


thing is both of these have been stunned in the past by each other, but neither has been able to put the other away
checkleft
QUOTE (mgrover @ Nov 30 2012, 01:41 PM) *
thing is both of these have been stunned in the past by each other, but neither has been able to put the other away

Both are very resilient
daprofessor
QUOTE (checkleft @ Nov 30 2012, 04:07 PM) *
Both are very resilient


absolutely!!!
Cshel86
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 30 2012, 01:15 PM) *
i'm not one to wish death on anyone...but daaaaaaaaamn!!!!

Now I don't feel so bad for thinking the same thing. Lol

QUOTE (mgrover @ Nov 30 2012, 01:41 PM) *
thing is both of these have been stunned in the past by each other, but neither has been able to put the other away

I agree. That MG logic will never steer anybody wrong! cool.gif
checkleft
The irony just keeps building, hernandez (marquez nutritionist) is going to sue Freddy roach for defamation lol. And it looks like roach won't be able to back out of this one as his comments were on USA today I believe, this is not good for roach.
Cshel86
QUOTE (checkleft @ Dec 1 2012, 01:07 AM) *
The irony just keeps building, hernandez (marquez nutritionist) is going to sue Freddy roach for defamation lol. And it looks like roach won't be able to back out of this one as his comments were on USA today I believe, this is not good for roach.

Angel Heredia better keep his trap shut before that whole 8 weeks of training goes out the window. He better be careful and not mess up Marquez's payday...we ARE talking about Bob Arum here.

I'm glad that he's considering this, but this should've been news that we heard after the final bell of the fight. Looks like Marquez will get jobbed again, if it goes to the cards.
checkleft
I think he specifically said he was going after roach.
bnoles4life
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Dec 1 2012, 08:19 PM) *
Angel Heredia better keep his trap shut before that whole 8 weeks of training goes out the window. He better be careful and not mess up Marquez's payday...we ARE talking about Bob Arum here.

I'm glad that he's considering this, but this should've been news that we heard after the final bell of the fight. Looks like Marquez will get jobbed again, if it goes to the cards.



If you believe what FH puts out, it doesn't sound like Arum is too high on Freddie, as he reportedly tried to get him pink-slipped.
Cshel86
QUOTE (bnoles4life @ Dec 2 2012, 07:30 PM) *
If you believe what FH puts out, it doesn't sound like Arum is too high on Freddie, as he reportedly tried to get him pink-slipped.

I thought he was trying to get Ariza out there by banning him from the TR gym and so on. I always thought Freddie was Bob's little ass fairy. Maybe I was wrong...
checkleft
I didn't know bob wanted Freddy gone either... But arum probably wants not part of this, Freddie roach said this stuff for a big name like USA today or something like that. He fucked up if this dude follows up
BoxingThrone
I think that this fight will be better than III. This one is set up to be more brutal. One thing about boxers is that as they get older, their reflexes slow down, and thusly, they get hit a lot more.

So, with the speed turned down on both fighters, who does it hurt the most? I say that Pac is gonna suffer more. I thought that Bradley really highlighted the loss of speed Pac has suffered (granted, Bradley makes most fighters look slow). Marquez has trouble with speed ... but with a slowed Pac, this is the best chance for JMM. Pac hasn't displayed much punching-power in a while either.

What's ironic is I think that JMM could win this fight "IF" he fights the same fight he fought in III. If he tries something different, he's giving up his advantage IMO.

I expect a late round stoppage in favor of JMM. I predict that Roach stops the fight in the corner after the 10th round to save a bloody Pac. If I was in Vegas, I'd be all over the "under 10 1/2 rounds" wager ...
daprofessor
QUOTE (BoxingThrone @ Dec 3 2012, 03:07 PM) *
I think that this fight will be better than III. This one is set up to be more brutal. One thing about boxers is that as they get older, their reflexes slow down, and thusly, they get hit a lot more.

So, with the speed turned down on both fighters, who does it hurt the most? I say that Pac is gonna suffer more. I thought that Bradley really highlighted the loss of speed Pac has suffered (granted, Bradley makes most fighters look slow). Marquez has trouble with speed ... but with a slowed Pac, this is the best chance for JMM. Pac hasn't displayed much punching-power in a while either.

What's ironic is I think that JMM could win this fight "IF" he fights the same fight he fought in III. If he tries something different, he's giving up his advantage IMO.

I expect a late round stoppage in favor of JMM. I predict that Roach stops the fight in the corner after the 10th round to save a bloody Pac. If I was in Vegas, I'd be all over the "under 10 1/2 rounds" wager ...


thank you for putting my thoughts into words and welcome to the board! very good assessment. i can't disagree with anything stated.
wolterb
I imagine IV will be more like III than I or II. Yeah they're getting older and slowing down but any drastic changes already took place. One year between III and IV as opposed to the 4 year intervals between first three. Marquez has strength and conditioning 'supposedly' finally kicking in but I don't really give a shit. i think those developments can take you only so far especially this late in a career. could be wrong though.

all of the fights have been competitive, its just the first two were great and the third was...just competitive, imho.
wolterb
and oh, idk who wins but I'm rooting for Marquez and I hope he knocks Pacquiao out so there is no question. but i'm a dreamer and a marquez fan, lol. i dont think marquez has a knockout punch for pacquiao.
daprofessor
manny 147...jmm 143



pac has to flex...while marquez looks ripped in a relaxed stance.
mgrover
supposedly pac hasnt really been doing much strength and conditioning for this fight, just focusing on the boxing. Pacs lost a step maybe whether it be age, him growning into a full fledged welterweight or all of the above, but i doubt he gets stopped, i doubt one can stop the other, ill admit i misplaced my faith in pac thinking he'd ko marquez in the third fight, but no matter how many times i go back and watch those fights i cant see either knocking the other out, everytime they stun each other they both come back fighting. Pac says hes going for the ko which is a good thing since if hes very aggressive he could outland marquez in rounds and take a decision, but i cant see it, hes not the sake cagey animal as hefore, hes grown bored and fat of boxing, and is so predictable, comes in, left right combo, straight back out.
Gambit808
How is it Marquez looks bigger but comes in lighter than Pacquiao? Can someone save me the trouble of google and explain how weight works that way?
checkleft
QUOTE (Gambit808 @ Dec 7 2012, 08:40 PM) *
How is it Marquez looks bigger but comes in lighter than Pacquiao? Can someone save me the trouble of google and explain how weight works that way?

Less body fat maybe took a dump before the fight or drained as much water weight he could which would explain why hes so ripped. But he looks extremely strong tho, this might get interesting if age has not caught up to him. I feel a knockdown happening this fight

Oh and manny looked a little thick around the waist
mgrover
Ripped isnt always heavier in body building terms, not sure how itd translate in boxing
checkleft
QUOTE (mgrover @ Dec 8 2012, 03:13 AM) *
Ripped isnt always heavier in body building terms, not sure how itd translate in boxing

The way I have always defined ripped is as if someone was big enough to rip a shirt. But marquez also seems shredded to which where I come from means he has a lot of muscle definition, so that would explain the lower weight since he shows little body fat. But also pac has been at this weight much longer then marquez so even with marquez recent visual body gains he still hasn't had the time to physically build himself up to welterweight.
MaxPayne
Marquez is absolutely on that bullshit.

The only difference is, nowadays, there are so many "precursor" type of performance enhancing drugs that we'll never know for sure. It's almost like, you have to be really, really stupid to get caught.

But yeah, a 39 year old guy who suddenly gets ripped ?

Ha ha ha ha ha.
CrazyBuffalO
Obviously Marquez looking more likely to win this one. Every indicationpoints to such a feeling. Why do a FOURTH fight only to have Manny win again? Obviously this 4th fight is made to right the wrongs of the past 3 fights -- whcih is Marquez not winning any of them.

I'm rooting for Marquez to win this fight too.
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