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leonthegee
(Admin note: Thanks for poll! The multiple answer option was selected which would have enabled uses to vote both YES and NO. Which wouldn't make sense for this excellent question. Intent I am sure was to select one response, that Guerrero has done enough OR needs to beat a top five welterweight. The poll answering has been changed to allow only one response.)

For almost all poll questions, where you want only one response to show, don't check the Multiple-Choice check box.)



Personally I don't want to see this matchup. However I think if you add Guerreros story plus Floyd's mouth it equals a million PPVs. I think Guerrero could be marketable. As I said before he has a great story, plus he's Mexican American, he speaks perfect English, and is a handsome dude, no homo. You could stick him on ESPN with Skip and Steven A., ala Manny and JMM, and make his story national. I think Floyd would have to play the angry black man but it could work. Your thoughts?
mgrover
easily marketable, Robo could go on about how you respect your woman, and Floyd can tell him to shut the fuck up cause he don't know shit about shit etc etc etc, but the thing is Mayweather will only fight if hes sure he can make that type of money, and give him a low low percentage. Guerrero has fought nobody, but it seems in boxing that doesn't matter nowadays.
leonthegee
QUOTE (mgrover @ Nov 25 2012, 04:40 PM) *
easily marketable, Robo could go on about how you respect your woman, and Floyd can tell him to shut the fuck up cause he don't know shit about shit etc etc etc, but the thing is Mayweather will only fight if hes sure he can make that type of money, and give him a low low percentage. Guerrero has fought nobody, but it seems in boxing that doesn't matter nowadays.


Floyd can give Guerrero a flat rate, ala Vic Ortiz. I'm not going to get into the whole who have you beaten thing. But I will say that Guerreros done a lot more than Canelo, although Canelo might be the tougher challenge.
p4pcrown
First Guerrero calls out Mayweather then Broner then Mayweather again. He should fight an Alexander or Bradley before trying to jump up and fight Mayweather. If the Ghost thinks a win over a no name and a laid off Berto are enough to physically challenge Mayweather then he's going to be in for a rude awakening. I see it as an easy fight for Mayweather...Guerrero has no strengths against Mayweather, not even a punchers chance because he doesn't hit hard enough.
BigFightFan
QUOTE (p4pcrown @ Nov 25 2012, 07:00 PM) *
First Guerrero calls out Mayweather then Broner then Mayweather again. He should fight an Alexander or Bradley before trying to jump up and fight Mayweather. If the Ghost thinks a win over a no name and a laid off Berto are enough to physically challenge Mayweather then he's going to be in for a rude awakening. I see it as an easy fight for Mayweather...Guerrero has no strengths against Mayweather, not even a punchers chance because he doesn't hit hard enough.

I'm the ghost is going to fight Mayweather the same way he fought Berto. Try to get him out of his element with all the holding and hiting. I would not want to see that fight, but its possible and may happen.
Genius
Guerrero should fight Paulie next, collect that trinket.
Jack 1000
Not yet,

Robert needs one more fight with a top Welterweight before Floyd Mayweather. Tim Bradley would be good. However, unless Floyd has aged a lot, I still think he wins by preventing Guerrero from getting inside. The Mayweather camp will get someone like Jay Nady who won't let "The Ghost" pressure Floyd. And Nady won't let Guerrero get away with holding and hitting.

Floyd busts up Guerrero and stops him on cuts. Robert could make it "interesting early" but he would have to get and stay in the pocket to do that and a Nevada ref won't let him do that for extended periods of time. A middle of the ring, pot-shotting Mayweather busts up "The Ghost" on cuts.

If the fight is competitive, it's because of Floyd's age and inactivity in terms of, have Floyd's legs given out, and the fact that he is getting old.

Jack
BoxingStill#1
A couple names come to mind before Floyed looks his way..

Bradley,.. Pauly...
checkleft
QUOTE (Jack 1000 @ Nov 25 2012, 11:56 PM) *
Not yet,

Robert needs one more fight with a top Welterweight before Floyd Mayweather. Tim Bradley would be good. However, unless Floyd has aged a lot, I still think he wins by preventing Guerrero from getting inside. The Mayweather camp will get someone like Jay Nady who won't let "The Ghost" pressure Floyd. And Nady won't let Guerrero get away with holding and hitting.

Floyd busts up Guerrero and stops him on cuts. Robert could make it "interesting early" but he would have to get and stay in the pocket to do that and a Nevada ref won't let him do that for extended periods of time. A middle of the ring, pot-shotting Mayweather busts up "The Ghost" on cuts.

If the fight is competitive, it's because of Floyd's age and inactivity in terms of, have Floyd's legs given out, and the fact that he is getting old.

Jack

Idk about the thing with refs. I mean they let cotto fight on the inside, but maybe the name (popularity) would make a difference in your points favor. I don't think guerrero could beat him either way. Good story, easily marketed, but I still don't think he deserves a shot. He fought a berto who has looked like shit 3 out of his last four fights got caught on roids and was out for about a year because of an injury as well..

A fight with Alexander, Bradley, brook, or maidana would be good.. I see a lot of work he can put in before actually deserving a shot
Cshel86
All of the fights that Robert seemed to avoid/bypass at 140, are now catching up to him at 147 (Paulie, Maidana, Alexander, Bradley, Ortiz)...he should be happy with these bouts and pump his brakes.

I'm tired of hearing about his backstory and he still doesn't sell tickets, people seem to forget that. 24/7 isn't the end all, be all, and it isn't going to skyrocket every fighter's career. Hell, Pacquiao's boring as hell on 24/7, but he's known for putting on great fights, and that's why people watch him.

All of this jumping from A-Z in boxing, has got to stop soon. Guys think that they can have one good fight, and BOOM, they're entitled to a HUGE fight. What ever happened to cleaning out the division and being recognized as THE champ?

Robert's a decent fighter, but he still seems to be begging instead of taking on all comers. Khan has begged for a Floyd fight, but in the meantime, he's taken on all comers, even if it was a risk...I can never take that away from him.

One thing that sucks for Guerrero, is that he's still failed to produce any type of identity for himself in the sport of boxing. Golden Boy makes it seem as if they're trying to push for a Floyd fight, but they haven't put in half as much work for Robert as they did for Ortiz.

If Robert wants to make a statement, then he at least needs to fight Ortiz on the next Mayweather card...at least fight a guy that Floyd has already faced. I can't knock him for wanting a big payday, but don't get an invisible title (WBC "interim title), fight an unknown Aydin, batter and not put away a blind and inactive Berto, and suddenly get tunnel vision when it comes to everyone else in the division.

A Guerrero fight does nothing more for Floyd's career, other than make him seem that much more afraid of the competition at hand. I can't picture Floyd saying, "We chose Guerrero because he called us out. If he want it, he can get it". It looked bad when he "accepted Marquez's challenge" (who was a small guy), and it wouldn't look any better if he did the same for an unknown Guerrrero.
leonthegee
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 26 2012, 05:49 AM) *
All of the fights that Robert seemed to avoid/bypass at 140, are now catching up to him at 147 (Paulie, Maidana, Alexander, Bradley, Ortiz)...he should be happy with these bouts and pump his brakes.

I'm tired of hearing about his backstory and he still doesn't sell tickets, people seem to forget that. 24/7 isn't the end all, be all, and it isn't going to skyrocket every fighter's career. Hell, Pacquiao's boring as hell on 24/7, but he's known for putting on great fights, and that's why people watch him.

All of this jumping from A-Z in boxing, has got to stop soon. Guys think that they can have one good fight, and BOOM, they're entitled to a HUGE fight. What ever happened to cleaning out the division and being recognized as THE champ?

Robert's a decent fighter, but he still seems to be begging instead of taking on all comers. Khan has begged for a Floyd fight, but in the meantime, he's taken on all comers, even if it was a risk...I can never take that away from him.

One thing that sucks for Guerrero, is that he's still failed to produce any type of identity for himself in the sport of boxing. Golden Boy makes it seem as if they're trying to push for a Floyd fight, but they haven't put in half as much work for Robert as they did for Ortiz.

If Robert wants to make a statement, then he at least needs to fight Ortiz on the next Mayweather card...at least fight a guy that Floyd has already faced. I can't knock him for wanting a big payday, but don't get an invisible title (WBC "interim title), fight an unknown Aydin, batter and not put away a blind and inactive Berto, and suddenly get tunnel vision when it comes to everyone else in the division.

A Guerrero fight does nothing more for Floyd's career, other than make him seem that much more afraid of the competition at hand. I can't picture Floyd saying, "We chose Guerrero because he called us out. If he want it, he can get it". It looked bad when he "accepted Marquez's challenge" (who was a small guy), and it wouldn't look any better if he did the same for an unknown Guerrrero.



Agree with everything you said, but I'll just play devils advocate here, can't one argue that Guerreros done more to deserve a shot than Canelo? Who is rumored to be on a short list for Mayweather.
Plah
Not yet. He has to beat at least 2 of the following: Maidana, Devon, Paulie, Bradley (fight's not gonna happen), Ortiz, Lopez. Division is stacked, clean it!!
daprofessor
give guerrero his shot. i don't hear too many other ppl calling floyd out the way guerrero has been. i think he puts up a better fight than floyds last 6 opponents.
Plah
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 26 2012, 01:31 PM) *
give guerrero his shot. i don't hear too many other ppl calling floyd out the way guerrero has been. i think he puts up a better fight than floyds last 6 opponents.

A better fight than Cotto? Hell no.
Cshel86
QUOTE (leonthegee @ Nov 26 2012, 07:58 AM) *
Agree with everything you said, but I'll just play devils advocate here, can't one argue that Guerreros done more to deserve a shot than Canelo? Who is rumored to be on a short list for Mayweather.

We all know that a "name" ( tv views, gate sales, etc) trumps a resume any day of the week. The only thing that gets an unknown fighter a shot at the big name, is a promoter's agenda (Arum making the Pac/Bradley fight). If Ortiz only got $2.5M against Floyd, then I can only imagine the peanuts that Guerrero would get. He just made $1M against Berto (and beat him), so Im sure he'll be somewhere worth the amount that Berto got ($1.6M).

Mayweather is hardly a draw himself, so making a Guerrero fight would be a stretch (in my opinion). Floyd needs guys like Marquez, Mosley, Cotto, and Ortiz to crack $1M buys, so I cant see where Robert fits in the equation. Im not trying to make Floyd seem like this untouchable guy, but when it comes to money and promotion, he needs an opponent who will keep carry/stablize the sales, while he runs his mouth to promote the fight.

Now, if Oscar was still actively fighting (and was in great condition), then he could the likes of Guerrero, or hell, anybody for that matter. Oscar is a mexican-american, gold medalist, who had a crazy fan base...so he could fight a kangaroo on a rainy Sunday morning, and people would still buy it. That's not the case with Floyd...though people pay to see him lose, he still has to fight a marketable opponent.

I think Canelo and Guerrero are even, when it comes to opposition. Canelo fights known guys who are over the hill, while Guerrero has fought little known opposition. The only difference is, one of these two are promoted waaaay better than the other.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Plah @ Nov 26 2012, 01:54 PM) *
A better fight than Cotto? Hell no.


floyd dominated cotto. some ppl only gave cotto 2 rounds. laugh.gif

guerrero is taller...and a little rangier/faster than cotto. add the southpaw stance....there's a strong chance he does better than cotto.
checkleft
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 26 2012, 01:59 PM) *
floyd dominated cotto. some ppl only gave cotto 2 rounds. laugh.gif

guerrero is taller...and a little rangier/faster than cotto. add the southpaw stance....there's a strong chance he does better than cotto.

I think guerrero is too sloppy and doesn't have the boxing skill of cotto..

Cotto has had very calculated attacks with his very impressive trainers help
Marcus
Mayweather-Guerrero:


-Interesting 24/7 as aforementioned they talk shit about each other. Guerrero's the christian family man/woman respecting guy. Mayweather fresh out, money team, addressing 50 cent soap opera, Ray J playing his piano again, riding rolls royces with Rick Ross.

-Guerrero could be marketable but he needs 1 more fight on the card of perhaps Garcia-Judah in february to strengthen his fan base against Floyd. Alexander, Maidana(Ghost would out box him), Mallinagi(Won't happen. Malinaggi-Cano 2), Bradley (FUCK no-Top Prank), Josesito Lopez (Wouldn't get credit. Josesito a 140er just got MASSACRED by a 154er), Ortiz(GREAT FIGHT. Ortiz always will bring it). I see him Generating 1.2 Million for Floyd.

- Guerrero NEEDs to fight his next fight in february because Mayweather will only fight in May/September. It takes 6 months to build a PPV fight. He was able to do 4 months w/Cotto because Cotto's the 3rd biggest draw in the sport after Pac. Not the same with Guerrero however as it wasn't with Ortiz.

-Definitely possible being that Schafer said he spoken to Floyd and they have something in the works. Mayweather NEEDs a tuneup with his layoff at his age. For Floyd to gun straight for Canelo would be unwise. He needs to get back into fighting shape mentally and physically and Roger said that Floyd hasn't even been in the gym training since coming home.

-Another easy $40M for floyd. 1.2 M PPV's. I'd be included in the 1.2 M.

-If Mayweather fights Ghost Canelo will DEF happen in September 2013 because Cotto will be available post his december fight for a unification bout (Trout will give him solid work though). Cotto-Canelo/Mayweather Guerrero may be on the same card if Floyd decides to fight Ghost. Ironic that Mayweather would be the main event if it were to happen this way being that Canelo-Cotto is the better/bigger fight.

-Floyd will get so much backlash for fighting Guerro.

- Guerrero has fought better opposition than Canelo, that doesnt mean he is deserving of a Mayweather bout. Canelo is a bigger draw still.

-If the fight happens Ghost will not fight on the inside like he did against Berto. Official wont allow it. Mayweather wont allow it. Pot-Shot all day. Straight right hand down the pipe.

-Dont compare the Ghost's inside fight game to WarCotto's. Cotto has way more boxing skills, better footwork, better angles, better defense, better jab, and he's more pwerful.

-IF the fight does happen, with Guerrero's chin, i don't see him getting knocked out, BUT if he allows himself to take shots from Floyd the same way he did against Berto.... then i hope it was worth the money....

-If Floyd fight's Ghost in Feb, then Canelo in Sep 2013. He will hang the gloves for good after getting that WBC 154 title.
BoxingFan86
As someone mentioned earlier, Floyd wouldn't allow Guerrero to fight him the same way he fought Berto. If he tried, the fight would probably look a lot like Mayweather-N'dou or Broner-DeMarco.
Franchize
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 26 2012, 12:31 PM) *
give guerrero his shot. i don't hear too many other ppl calling floyd out the way guerrero has been. i think he puts up a better fight than floyds last 6 opponents.

Huh? Everyone calls Floyd out lol Including even Keith Thurman.
Franchize
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 26 2012, 12:31 PM) *
give guerrero his shot. i don't hear too many other ppl calling floyd out the way guerrero has been. i think he puts up a better fight than floyds last 6 opponents.

Huh? Everyone calls Floyd out lol Including even Keith Thurman.

N I think Floyd would relish Guerrero fighting him like he did Berto. Essentially, Guerrero would be trying to out-Cotto Miguel Cotto. Considering Guerrero got hit with moe flush shots by Bert than Cotto did by Floyd, I think he outta try something different.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Franchize @ Nov 26 2012, 07:33 PM) *
Huh? Everyone calls Floyd out lol Including even Keith Thurman.

N I think Floyd would relish Guerrero fighting him like he did Berto. Essentially, Guerrero would be trying to out-Cotto Miguel Cotto. Considering Guerrero got hit with moe flush shots by Bert than Cotto did by Floyd, I think he outta try something different.


and he pretty much ignores them when they do. something tells me he's going to hear guerrero's call out. laugh.gif

guerrero isn't as crafty or skilled as miguel...but he's a bit quicker on the trigger and may land an embarrassing shot or two on floyd. i get the feeling guerrero won't be looking to survive against mayweather...he'll go balls to the wall. he definitely has more skill and ability than ortiz. fresher and younger than shane. between mayweathers inactivity...and his difficulty with southpaws...i can see guerrero having his moments.
Cshel86
QUOTE (Marcus @ Nov 26 2012, 04:40 PM) *
Mayweather-Guerrero:


-Interesting 24/7 as aforementioned they talk shit about each other. Guerrero's the christian family man/woman respecting guy. Mayweather fresh out, money team, addressing 50 cent soap opera, Ray J playing his piano again, riding rolls royces with Rick Ross.

-Guerrero could be marketable but he needs 1 more fight on the card of perhaps Garcia-Judah in february to strengthen his fan base against Floyd. Alexander, Maidana(Ghost would out box him), Mallinagi(Won't happen. Malinaggi-Cano 2), Bradley (FUCK no-Top Prank), Josesito Lopez (Wouldn't get credit. Josesito a 140er just got MASSACRED by a 154er), Ortiz(GREAT FIGHT. Ortiz always will bring it). I see him Generating 1.2 Million for Floyd.

- Guerrero NEEDs to fight his next fight in february because Mayweather will only fight in May/September. It takes 6 months to build a PPV fight. He was able to do 4 months w/Cotto because Cotto's the 3rd biggest draw in the sport after Pac. Not the same with Guerrero however as it wasn't with Ortiz.

-Definitely possible being that Schafer said he spoken to Floyd and they have something in the works. Mayweather NEEDs a tuneup with his layoff at his age. For Floyd to gun straight for Canelo would be unwise. He needs to get back into fighting shape mentally and physically and Roger said that Floyd hasn't even been in the gym training since coming home.

-Another easy $40M for floyd. 1.2 M PPV's. I'd be included in the 1.2 M.

-If Mayweather fights Ghost Canelo will DEF happen in September 2013 because Cotto will be available post his december fight for a unification bout (Trout will give him solid work though). Cotto-Canelo/Mayweather Guerrero may be on the same card if Floyd decides to fight Ghost. Ironic that Mayweather would be the main event if it were to happen this way being that Canelo-Cotto is the better/bigger fight.

-Floyd will get so much backlash for fighting Guerro.

- Guerrero has fought better opposition than Canelo, that doesnt mean he is deserving of a Mayweather bout. Canelo is a bigger draw still.

-If the fight happens Ghost will not fight on the inside like he did against Berto. Official wont allow it. Mayweather wont allow it. Pot-Shot all day. Straight right hand down the pipe.

-Dont compare the Ghost's inside fight game to WarCotto's. Cotto has way more boxing skills, better footwork, better angles, better defense, better jab, and he's more pwerful.

-IF the fight does happen, with Guerrero's chin, i don't see him getting knocked out, BUT if he allows himself to take shots from Floyd the same way he did against Berto.... then i hope it was worth the money....

-If Floyd fight's Ghost in Feb, then Canelo in Sep 2013. He will hang the gloves for good after getting that WBC 154 title.

$40M for Floyd and 1.2M buys for Mayweather/Guerrero? Really? It's hard to crack 1M PPVs...hell, it's hard to crack 700k if you're not careful.

Cotto/Canelo and Mayweather/Guerrero will NOT be on the same card...they'd make more money with those cards being separate. If Floyd/Guerrero is the main event, then we'd probably see Canelo vs Molina, Bundrage, or Angulo...and me thinks that GBP will do that Canelo/Angulo on a B.A.D. card.

Mayweather's had a pattern of fighting in May and Sept, but he can pretty much fight on any month of the year. He fights on these Mexican holidays, but his opponent isn't always Mexican, so that should tell you something.

Me thinks that if Kell Brook comes to the U.S. on Jan. 19th, embarrasses and beats Alexander, and has another fight in the UK (dragging Paulie over there and beating him or fighting Khan) before the summer, then we could see a potential opponent for Floyd by the end of the year. There's no telling who Floyd will fight in May...hell, he may just take a Brook fight in May...who knows.
Marcus
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 26 2012, 09:25 PM) *
$40M for Floyd and 1.2M buys for Mayweather/Guerrero? Really? It's hard to crack 1M PPVs...hell, it's hard to crack 700k if you're not careful.

Cotto/Canelo and Mayweather/Guerrero will NOT be on the same card...they'd make more money with those cards being separate. If Floyd/Guerrero is the main event, then we'd probably see Canelo vs Molina, Bundrage, or Angulo...and me thinks that GBP will do that Canelo/Angulo on a B.A.D. card.

Mayweather's had a pattern of fighting in May and Sept, but he can pretty much fight on any month of the year. He fights on these Mexican holidays, but his opponent isn't always Mexican, so that should tell you something.

Me thinks that if Kell Brook comes to the U.S. on Jan. 19th, embarrasses and beats Alexander, and has another fight in the UK (dragging Paulie over there and beating him or fighting Khan) before the summer, then we could see a potential opponent for Floyd by the end of the year. There's no telling who Floyd will fight in May...hell, he may just take a Brook fight in May...who knows.

I mean he did 1.4 Million with Ortiz. Only a hundred thousand short of what he did with Cotto. Who would've thought that ortiz wouldve broken a record with floyd at one point? If Guerrero gets a solid WW as his next opponent like Alexander theres no telling how much it will sky rocket his drawing potential.

His opponent isn't always mexican... but he always fights on mexican holidays?... LOL thats something in of it self. Perhaps the mexican holidays are the ones in which he Draws the most PPV money. The most recent fight that wasn't on a mexican holiday was the Hatton fight. And that has not generated more PPV buys then all the fights after it that have been on mexican holidays regardless of the opponent.

I dont see Kell Brook putting a clinic on Alexander. Would probably be a snoozer.
I DOUBT HIGHLY that Mayweather even knows who Kell Brook is. If he is to fight he's gunning for the Money, hence the name. Guerrero has the potential to generate that for Floyd if he's matched right and promoted right in his next fight.
p4pcrown
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 26 2012, 01:59 PM) *
floyd dominated cotto. some ppl only gave cotto 2 rounds. laugh.gif

guerrero is taller...and a little rangier/faster than cotto. add the southpaw stance....there's a strong chance he does better than cotto.


Mayweather dominated Cotto with a messed up hand, a cold, and fighting at welterweight...odds are if the fight does happen, it may be an easier win than the Cotto fight.
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE (Marcus @ Nov 26 2012, 04:40 PM) *
Mayweather-Guerrero:



-Guerrero could be marketable but he needs 1 more fight on the card of perhaps Garcia-Judah in february to strengthen his fan base against Floyd. Alexander, Maidana(Ghost would out box him), Mallinagi(Won't happen. Malinaggi-Cano 2), Bradley (FUCK no-Top Prank), Josesito Lopez (Wouldn't get credit. Josesito a 140er just got MASSACRED by a 154er), Ortiz(GREAT FIGHT. Ortiz always will bring it). I see him Generating 1.2 Million for Floyd.



Actually, I think Lopez/Guerrero is a great matchup. These two guys go get it with reckless abandon at times. I'd love to see that one. I think it can go either way. Two smallish WW's that will go toe to toe. Could be very entertaining. It doesnt go 12. i'm a fan of both of these guys. I wouldnt mind seeing Mayweather/Guerrero, but that fight isnt gonna happen realistically. Mayweather is on the shelf until a "beatable" guy emerges that generates $$. If Guerrero was to beat Bradley, then i think mayweather would consider fighting him. Bradley/Guerrero is another one that I'd like to see. I think the Ghost decisions Bradley. I'm a huge Bradley fan too, but I think his lack of power and reach is a huge detriment at this weight class. Nobody fears his power, so they can go all in. Alexander may actually win a rematch with Bradley at WW.
Cshel86
QUOTE (Marcus @ Nov 26 2012, 11:11 PM) *
I mean he did 1.4 Million with Ortiz. Only a hundred thousand short of what he did with Cotto. Who would've thought that ortiz wouldve broken a record with floyd at one point? If Guerrero gets a solid WW as his next opponent like Alexander theres no telling how much it will sky rocket his drawing potential.

His opponent isn't always mexican... but he always fights on mexican holidays?... LOL thats something in of it self. Perhaps the mexican holidays are the ones in which he Draws the most PPV money. The most recent fight that wasn't on a mexican holiday was the Hatton fight. And that has not generated more PPV buys then all the fights after it that have been on mexican holidays regardless of the opponent.

I dont see Kell Brook putting a clinic on Alexander. Would probably be a snoozer.
I DOUBT HIGHLY that Mayweather even knows who Kell Brook is. If he is to fight he's gunning for the Money, hence the name. Guerrero has the potential to generate that for Floyd if he's matched right and promoted right in his next fight.

Nope...he did 1.25M with Ortiz, so no records were broken there. If anything, the Ortiz fight did 100-200k more than the Marquez fight, which I believe was right at 1M or 1.1M buys. Even if Guerrero fights and beats another top WW, then fights Floyd, those number will probably be stable..somewhere around 1M...maybe.

Yeah the Hatton fight was "strike while the iron is hot" fight...let's not forget that Floyd had JUST fought Oscar months before that. The Mexican holiday picked up from there. Again, at this point of his career, he can fight any month of the year and do decent numbers...couldn't have said that before the Oscar fight.

Mayweather knows who Kell Brook is, he knows who all of these fighters are...regardless of what he wants people to believe. If you're a guy that sits back and waits to strike while the iron is hot, then I'm sure he's been hearing Brook's name.

All of that "Who is that guy, I don't even know who he is", is a stunt, Floyd knows who these guys are. I stopped believing everything Floyd says, years ago. And yes, I believe Brook has a strong chance to upset Alexander, who has yet to add a new wrinkle to his game...he's just comfortable at his current weight.

Quick question, how good was Ricky Hatton's resume before he fought Floyd? Not really much to brag about...but he DID have a HUGE fan base, which equals ticket sales and views. If Brook comes over here and embarrasses Alexander (who Floyd possibly has his eye on), then whose to say that he wont fight Brook???

Guerrero slowed down his own train with that injury before the Maidana fight, so he has to play catch-up. Beating Berto puts his name out there a bit, but that cow has been milked by Ortiz already, because he was the first to beat him. Guerrero's potential to generate money is very slim...he can hardly sell tickets in his own town, and that's a bad way to start negotiations. WE know who Guerrero is, but has he made a huge statement with casual fans???

QUOTE (p4pcrown @ Nov 27 2012, 12:00 AM) *
Mayweather dominated Cotto with a messed up hand, a cold, and fighting at welterweight...odds are if the fight does happen, it may be an easier win than the Cotto fight.

Mayweather had a great fight with Cotto, but Cotto won more than 2 rounds in that fight. That was NOT an easy fight for Floyd, sorry, but you guys put waaay too much mustard on Floyd's fights, and tend to believe everything that he says. He was knocked down a peg or two in that fight, believe it or not. When was Floyd a WW in that fight? Im just curious.
Franchize
In my opinion, when you are a top tier fighter, you should never fight guys that leave you in a lose/lose situation. People keep comparing Ortiz and Guerrero because they both beat Berto. Ortiz was marketable not because he beat Berto but HOW he beat Berto. That fight bordered on being a classic. Plus, people believed Ortiz power would give Mayweatehr real problems. I don't think Mayweather stands to gain anything from fighting Guerrero. If he wins, he'll get a modest pay day by his standards and he would have beat a guy that no casual fan believes had a chance anyway. If he loses, he lost to a guy who isn't even a big name. Then the "is he old and rusty" talks start coming out as do the "he never would have beta Manny" talks. Furthermore, a Guerrero fight right now kills a bargaining advantage in the neverending Pac/May negotiations. He would probably hault his streak of topping Manny in PPV buys and a loss would kill his record advantage. Guerrero has to do something worth talking about. I don't really even think there was a buzz after the Berto fight and it's less than a week old. If anything, just people wanna see it again.
daprofessor
QUOTE (p4pcrown @ Nov 27 2012, 01:00 AM) *
Mayweather dominated Cotto with a messed up hand, a cold, and fighting at welterweight...odds are if the fight does happen, it may be an easier win than the Cotto fight.


that was actually sarcasm on my side. i thought cotto won 4-5 rounds and i actually think cotto will do better in a rematch. guerrero brings different problems to the table than cotto or ortiz.
Jovi
Ahh i didn't think it would be true but now Mayweather does have interest in this fight. dry.gif

I can easily see it happening. Robert Guerrero is in contact with schaefer (however you spell it) and golden boy. Mayweather (as most boxers) fight under the same promotions, unless the names are a draw themselves. So the deal contract deal is already done, Guerrero gets another big win under his belt then he is more of a commodity with the promotion. Mayweathers come back fight, against "up and coming lion" (dont be surprised to hear that on the 24/7) could become marketable.

Because this is one of Mayweather's many "Comeback" fights, i see robert guerrero being more of a tuneup for Mayweather than a real threat. lol easy paycheck.

daprofessor
QUOTE (Jovi @ Nov 27 2012, 09:05 PM) *
Ahh i didn't think it would be true but now Mayweather does have interest in this fight. dry.gif

I can easily see it happening. Robert Guerrero is in contact with schaefer (however you spell it) and golden boy. Mayweather (as most boxers) fight under the same promotions, unless the names are a draw themselves. So the deal contract deal is already done, Guerrero gets another big win under his belt then he is more of a commodity with the promotion. Mayweathers come back fight, against "up and coming lion" (dont be surprised to hear that on the 24/7) could become marketable.

Because this is one of Mayweather's many "Comeback" fights, i see robert guerrero being more of a tuneup for Mayweather than a real threat. lol easy paycheck.



the thing i like about this fight is that guerrero is a bit faster than cotto and ortiz and he has some zing on his shots. he also mixes up his punches well. while he does have defensive holes...his offense will give him a shot at winning. don't expect him to fight floyd the way he did berto or aydin. while i don't think his skill is on the same level as cotto's...i do believe he has enough in his arsenal to make it interesting and possibly score an upset. he'll go balls to the wall and isn't scared to mix it up or get in the trenches and get rough. look for a fight where mayweather will definitely get bloodied up and have to dig deep to win much the same way he had to do against cotto. i wouldn't be shocked if guerrero drops floyd at some point. this fight is more difficult than a pacquiao fight. i know i'm going to catch heat for this post... laugh.gif i just call it how i see it.
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 27 2012, 08:53 PM) *
the thing i like about this fight is that guerrero is a bit faster than cotto and ortiz and he has some zing on his shots. he also mixes up his punches well. while he does have defensive holes...his offense will give him a shot at winning. don't expect him to fight floyd the way he did berto or aydin. while i don't think his skill is on the same level as cotto's...i do believe he has enough in his arsenal to make it interesting and possibly score an upset. he'll go balls to the wall and isn't scared to mix it up or get in the trenches and get rough. look for a fight where mayweather will definitely get bloodied up and have to dig deep to win much the same way he had to do against cotto. i wouldn't be shocked if guerrero drops floyd at some point. this fight is more difficult than a pacquiao fight. i know i'm going to catch heat for this post... laugh.gif i just call it how i see it.



I can agree with you to some degree. i think the layoffs and age, at some point have to start taking their toll on Mayweather. I think Cotto is one fight away from being sent out to pasture... Especially at 154, he's a midget at that weight. Cotto gave Floyd his toughest fight in years. the way trout beats Cotto will make people realize how close to done Cotto is.
sduck
Not saying he should get it, but yes I do think he deserves a shot. In his first two fights at Welterweight, he's already defeated decent competition and has earned the Interim WBC Welterweight title. I've pastly stated that Guerrero wasn't shit, I was exaggerating, I don't think he'll be at the top, but I think with his tools he has the potential to give any fighter a tough fight. Anyone that thinks FMJ will walk through him is just spewing nonsense.

I also think Guerrero can put some decent revenue. He's a "nobody" but he definitely has the charisma, more than people like Ortiz and Bradley.
sduck
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 26 2012, 07:51 PM) *
and he pretty much ignores them when they do. something tells me he's going to hear guerrero's call out. laugh.gif

guerrero isn't as crafty or skilled as miguel...but he's a bit quicker on the trigger and may land an embarrassing shot or two on floyd. i get the feeling guerrero won't be looking to survive against mayweather...he'll go balls to the wall. he definitely has more skill and ability than ortiz. fresher and younger than shane. between mayweathers inactivity...and his difficulty with southpaws...i can see guerrero having his moments.

I hate it that people keep saying this. What difficulty? Give details. His way of fighting southpaws is like no other fighter. It just takes longer, but in technical aspects it's solid.
Plah
People say that (southpaw thing)because Judah made him very uncomfortable in the early rounds of their fight. I think Arum was spewing that shit for a while too, "explaining" why Floyd was scared of pac.
Cshel86
QUOTE (sduck @ Nov 28 2012, 12:16 PM) *
I also think Guerrero can put some decent revenue.

How many tickets has his fights sold?
daprofessor
QUOTE (The Original MrFactor @ Nov 28 2012, 01:29 AM) *
I can agree with you to some degree. i think the layoffs and age, at some point have to start taking their toll on Mayweather. I think Cotto is one fight away from being sent out to pasture... Especially at 154, he's a midget at that weight. Cotto gave Floyd his toughest fight in years. the way trout beats Cotto will make people realize how close to done Cotto is.


i think cotto gave floyd the toughest fight in his career period. trout brings nothing to the table that cotto hasn't seen or dealt with. he hasn't really taken any beatings since the pac fight...i think he should beat trout.
daprofessor
QUOTE (sduck @ Nov 28 2012, 01:23 PM) *
I hate it that people keep saying this. What difficulty? Give details. His way of fighting southpaws is like no other fighter. It just takes longer, but in technical aspects it's solid.


difficulty is probably too strong a word...but southpaws definitely make him uncomfortable and have landed good shots on him. *see demarcus corley, zab judah and ortiz before the headbutt.* guerrero will definitely slide a few shots in on floyd and he will bang that fragile rib cage.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Plah @ Nov 28 2012, 01:35 PM) *
People say that (southpaw thing)because Judah made him very uncomfortable in the early rounds of their fight. I think Arum was spewing that shit for a while too, "explaining" why Floyd was scared of pac.


it wasn't just zab. it was the spadafora sparring...his pops making the same admission and stating that floyd should avoid southpaws at all costs...corley...and even ortiz.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 28 2012, 02:11 PM) *
How many tickets has his fights sold?


he packed the house in san jose and out in ontario. if the fight is in vegas...he has plenty of fans that will make the trip from the bay and socal. i actually think robert has more fans than ortiz who is a transplant while guerrero is a local boy.
Cshel86
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 28 2012, 01:24 PM) *
he packed the house in san jose and out in ontario. if the fight is in vegas...he has plenty of fans that will make the trip from the bay and socal. i actually think robert has more fans than ortiz who is a transplant while guerrero is a local boy.

I have to see about those ticket sells, because I find that hard to believe. I doubt if anybody outside of the Bay Area really knows who Robert is. I TOTALLY disagree about Guerrero having more fans than Victor Ortiz, sorry, but that dog aint huntin' over here.

You cant possibly think that more people know Robert, than any of Floyd's recent opponents. You can walk out on the street right now and ask people who's the guy that Mayweather two-pieced or sucker punched last September, and I'm sure they 'd know.

It's not that don't feel Robert is all that worthy of a Mayweather fight, but let's face it, Floyd isn't one of those beloved fighters that does HUGE gates, regardless of who he fights...Oscar still holds that record.

Put it this way, if Manny (the world's most beloved fighter) only cracked 700K buys against Clottey (1st fight in the Cowboys stadium, HIGHLY promoted), or Bradley (when Pacquiao truly settled as a household name), then Floyd needs to be extra careful about his opponent selection. Robert may be a nose dive in sales with Floyd...hell, I'm surprised that many people bought the Marquez fight, but that was a "comeback" fight.

You got me turned on to Bradley, but I think this Guerrero transition will be a tough road. laugh.gif

daprofessor
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 28 2012, 02:42 PM) *
I have to see about those ticket sells, because I find that hard to believe. I doubt if anybody outside of the Bay Area really knows who Robert is. I TOTALLY disagree about Guerrero having more fans than Victor Ortiz, sorry, but that dog aint huntin' over here.

You cant possibly think that more people know Robert, than any of Floyd's recent opponents. You can walk out on the street right now and ask people who's the guy that Mayweather two-pieced or sucker punched last September, and I'm sure they 'd know.

It's not that don't feel Robert is all that worthy of a Mayweather fight, but let's face it, Floyd isn't one of those beloved fighters that does HUGE gates, regardless of who he fights...Oscar still holds that record.

Put it this way, if Manny (the world's most beloved fighter) only cracked 700K buys against Clottey (1st fight in the Cowboys stadium, HIGHLY promoted), or Bradley (when Pacquiao truly settled as a household name), then Floyd needs to be extra careful about his opponent selection. Robert may be a nose dive in sales with Floyd...hell, I'm surprised that many people bought the Marquez fight, but that was a "comeback" fight.

You got me turned on to Bradley, but I think this Guerrero transition will be a tough road. laugh.gif


it's not that far off! laugh.gif u'll see the light soon. after the aydin and berto fights...i think guerrero is bigger here in cali than ortiz was before he fought floyd. a lot of ppl were turned off to ortiz because he's weird and just said a bunch of dumb shit. guerrero, with his story and good guy image has been lurking for quite sometime...and i think he's now coming into his full potential. he's riding a serious wave and it's just a matter of time. if the fight with floyd materializes soon....look for it to be bigger than floyd/ortiz and definitely way more competitive.
sduck
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 28 2012, 01:17 PM) *
i think cotto gave floyd the toughest fight in his career period. trout brings nothing to the table that cotto hasn't seen or dealt with. he hasn't really taken any beatings since the pac fight...i think he should beat trout.

You don't even have to imply its your opinion, since Floyd stated it himself. smile.gif
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 28 2012, 01:20 PM) *
difficulty is probably too strong a word...but southpaws definitely make him uncomfortable and have landed good shots on him. *see demarcus corley, zab judah and ortiz before the headbutt.* guerrero will definitely slide a few shots in on floyd and he will bang that fragile rib cage.

For most fighters it's real easy to jump to conclusions on them (like after watching one fight or two), but when it comes to Floyd, it takes a lot of research to jump to conclusions on him, dude is way too complex of a fighter. People find it evident, but I don't think there's enough evidence to completely say he struggles against southpaws. He's practically dominated every single one he's fought, actually knocking out some of them, while only falling short to knocking out the others (A funny "fun fact" is that the second opponent of Floyd's career, though only evident of 4 rounds, was also a southpaw, who being a total bum, did better than all the rest). Some of the southpaws did land some good shots, Corley landing the most effective shot anyone ever has, arguably between Shane Mosley. Corley is also not even the best southpaw Floyd has fought, not even close. There's too many variables involved to conclude on this "myth" of Floyd vs southpaws. Of course Guerrero is going to get at least one good shot in, just like most of Floyd's other opponents.
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 28 2012, 01:22 PM) *
it wasn't just zab. it was the spadafora sparring...his pops making the same admission and stating that floyd should avoid southpaws at all costs...corley...and even ortiz.

Floyd Sr. really thinks so? Roger thinks it's bullshit, and I don't know what Jeff thinks.
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Nov 28 2012, 01:24 PM) *
he packed the house in san jose and out in ontario. if the fight is in vegas...he has plenty of fans that will make the trip from the bay and socal. i actually think robert has more fans than ortiz who is a transplant while guerrero is a local boy.

Guerrero definitely has charisma. He should be able to sell better than Ortiz. I also think there was more hype about Berto/Guerrero than Berto/Ortiz.
sduck
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 28 2012, 01:42 PM) *
I have to see about those ticket sells, because I find that hard to believe. I doubt if anybody outside of the Bay Area really knows who Robert is. I TOTALLY disagree about Guerrero having more fans than Victor Ortiz, sorry, but that dog aint huntin' over here.

You cant possibly think that more people know Robert, than any of Floyd's recent opponents. You can walk out on the street right now and ask people who's the guy that Mayweather two-pieced or sucker punched last September, and I'm sure they 'd know.

It's not that don't feel Robert is all that worthy of a Mayweather fight, but let's face it, Floyd isn't one of those beloved fighters that does HUGE gates, regardless of who he fights...Oscar still holds that record.

Put it this way, if Manny (the world's most beloved fighter) only cracked 700K buys against Clottey (1st fight in the Cowboys stadium, HIGHLY promoted), or Bradley (when Pacquiao truly settled as a household name), then Floyd needs to be extra careful about his opponent selection. Robert may be a nose dive in sales with Floyd...hell, I'm surprised that many people bought the Marquez fight, but that was a "comeback" fight.

You got me turned on to Bradley, but I think this Guerrero transition will be a tough road. laugh.gif

Well of course not now lol, you got to compare Guerrero to when Ortiz wasn't in the spotlight from being Floyd's opponent. To me it seems like Guerrero has more fans. Mayweather was able to make more PPV buys and revenue with Ortiz than he was with Hatton and Marquez. The Marquez fight did so poorly that not even the stadium was completely sold. Ortiz's persona was virtually boring, while Guerrero is a type of guy that talks shit, isn't a prick, with a "lets get it on, I wanna fight anyone" attitude. He also has a style of fighting that pleases most people. The dude is made to sell revenue.
Cshel86
QUOTE (sduck @ Nov 28 2012, 02:20 PM) *
Well of course not now lol, you got to compare Guerrero to when Ortiz wasn't in the spotlight from being Floyd's opponent. To me it seems like Guerrero has more fans. Mayweather was able to make more PPV buys and revenue with Ortiz than he was with Hatton and Marquez. The Marquez fight did so poorly that not even the stadium was completely sold. Ortiz's persona was virtually boring, while Guerrero is a type of guy that talks shit, isn't a prick, with a "lets get it on, I wanna fight anyone" attitude. He also has a style of fighting that pleases most people. The dude is made to sell revenue.

Sorry, but Guerrero and revenue should never be in the same sentence again...until further notice, of course. I guess people are forgetting how an up and coming Ortiz sold all of those tickets at the Staples center against an unknown Maidana. How do we all know Maidana so well nowadays? Yep, you got it...because of the Ortiz fight.

Ortiz was being built up as the next Oscar De La Hoya...when was Robert ever a factor around that time? Ortiz is remembered more for his quit job against Maidana, than people will ever know Guerrero for. Hell, Marquez is actually the bigger star of them all, and he and Floyd weasled their way to 1M+ buys. I said that to say that people need to start harping on the whole, "Guerrero's Mexican American", and so on.

Again, Marquez is the bigger star between Ortiz and Guerrero, and he and Floyd sold right at 1.1M buys. That says a lot. Mind you, this was BEFORE the whole Floyd vs Pac situation got out of hand. That actually started closer to the Pac/Cotto fight, and went into full overdrive after Pac stopped Cotto.

Ortiz was still being built up by GBP (despite the Maidana loss), and had was almost on his way to being dumped off. Then came the Berto fight, which he won in an impressive fashion, he was the FIRST to defeat Berto, and became champion. He looked to be a formidable opponent for anybody in the WW division.

When Floyd chose Ortiz, it seemed like a HUGE challenge for a guy coming off of a long layoff. So again, Floyd got us with the whole "comeback fight" mess, and on top of that, let's be real, Mayweather/Ortiz sold more than Mayweather/Marquez because at that point, the whole world was sucked into the "Mayweather is going to fight Pacquiao next" nonsense.

That's the ONLY reason Mayweather/Ortiz sold more than Mayweather/Pacquiao...the ONLY reason. Pacquiao/Mayweather was hardly as big of an issue, when Floyd fought JMM, than it was when he fought Ortiz. So, with that in mind, Guerrero has some heavy lifting to do, because seriously, nobody knows who this dude is. I believe Broner/DeMarco just had over 1M views...not sure about ticket sales, but TV dates usually win over the casual fans.

Robert not being able to stop a blind Berto, is NOT impressive. If it was Pac/Diaz-type beating, then he'd impress casual fans, but all of that smothering is a turnoff. Im a hardcore fan, and even I almost wanted to change the channel. Lol

And yes, Guerrero is a prick, and he knows it. Nobody's gonna be an asshole like he was during Berto's portion of the interview, then decide to jump in again and thank his Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. Lol. Sorry, but Guerrero has some heavy lifting to do. The only way I see this happening, is if Floyd decides to fight twice this year, and its been a WHILE since he did that.
sduck
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 28 2012, 02:47 PM) *
Sorry, but Guerrero and revenue should never be in the same sentence again...until further notice, of course. I guess people are forgetting how an up and coming Ortiz sold all of those tickets at the Staples center against an unknown Maidana. How do we all know Maidana so well nowadays? Yep, you got it...because of the Ortiz fight.

That would be a decent example but Ortiz was shunned upon by the result of the Maidana fight. His image in boxing was forever tarnished, regardless of the redemption from his victory over Berto.

QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 28 2012, 02:47 PM) *
Ortiz was being built up as the next Oscar De La Hoya...when was Robert ever a factor around that time? Ortiz is remembered more for his quit job against Maidana, than people will ever know Guerrero for. Hell, Marquez is actually the bigger star of them all, and he and Floyd weasled their way to 1M+ buys. I said that to say that people need to start harping on the whole, "Guerrero's Mexican American", and so on.

Well he's a factor now, so... Nah, no way, you just hatin lol. I'm sure more people try to forget that than remember it lol

QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 28 2012, 02:47 PM) *
Again, Marquez is the bigger star between Ortiz and Guerrero, and he and Floyd sold right at 1.1M buys. That says a lot. Mind you, this was BEFORE the whole Floyd vs Pac situation got out of hand. That actually started closer to the Pac/Cotto fight, and went into full overdrive after Pac stopped Cotto.

I see what you're saying...but it's also in theory... Pac was already making headlines on a potential fight with Mayweather before he fought Cotto, because of his sensational performances against DLH and Hatton. Those two fights were actually mainly why people got so hype of the Mayweather-Pacquiao showdown. Cotto was one of Pac's best selling fights, while Marquez was one of Floyd's worst, speaking in post-DLH terms. And Floyd was already still established as the PPV king at that time.

QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 28 2012, 02:47 PM) *
Ortiz was still being built up by GBP (despite the Maidana loss), and had was almost on his way to being dumped off. Then came the Berto fight, which he won in an impressive fashion, he was the FIRST to defeat Berto, and became champion. He looked to be a formidable opponent for anybody in the WW division.

Ortiz's image was also still tarnished because of the Maidana fight. Though still being a considerable opponent, most people still doubted him vs Floyd.

QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 28 2012, 02:47 PM) *
When Floyd chose Ortiz, it seemed like a HUGE challenge for a guy coming off of a long layoff. So again, Floyd got us with the whole "comeback fight" mess, and on top of that, let's be real, Mayweather/Ortiz sold more than Mayweather/Marquez because at that point, the whole world was sucked into the "Mayweather is going to fight Pacquiao next" nonsense.

Youth, champion, and Floyd's layoff had the only things going for the fight. Ortiz's persona sucked. No way, that reason has to be completely false. The Mayweather-Pacquiao fight lost a lot of luster by then. Mayweather's image was also very tarnished from the result of the fight failing to happen. The Ortiz/Mayweather fight even generating close to that much revenue is a mystery short of marketing.

QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 28 2012, 02:47 PM) *
That's the ONLY reason Mayweather/Ortiz sold more than Mayweather/Pacquiao...the ONLY reason. Pacquiao/Mayweather was hardly as big of an issue, when Floyd fought JMM, than it was when he fought Ortiz. So, with that in mind, Guerrero has some heavy lifting to do, because seriously, nobody knows who this dude is. I believe Broner/DeMarco just had over 1M views...not sure about ticket sales, but TV dates usually win over the casual fans.

Uhh, anybody that follows boxing knows who Guerrero is at this point. If you're mainly implying the casual fans, especially the extreme ones, nobody knew Ortiz either.

QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 28 2012, 02:47 PM) *
Robert not being able to stop a blind Berto, is NOT impressive. If it was Pac/Diaz-type beating, then he'd impress casual fans, but all of that smothering is a turnoff. Im a hardcore fan, and even I almost wanted to change the channel. Lol

Technically, anyone beating Berto (a b-level fighter) isn't impressive. I've read a lot of different opinions, so I have no idea.

QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 28 2012, 02:47 PM) *
And yes, Guerrero is a prick, and he knows it. Nobody's gonna be an asshole like he was during Berto's portion of the interview, then decide to jump in again and thank his Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. Lol. Sorry, but Guerrero has some heavy lifting to do. The only way I see this happening, is if Floyd decides to fight twice this year, and its been a WHILE since he did that.
For people that are not really into confidence or trash-talk, then yeah he probably is a prick. But he's not the kind of prick like Floyd. You can also consider that many people would actually enjoy confident trash-talk against a well disliked/hated person like Floyd.

Oh god, that took so long to finish, I think I need more coffee or somethin, wow.
Cshel86
You made some decent points, but seriously, people dont even know who Robert Guerrero is...even AFTER the Berto fight. People once again realized who Ortiz was after beating Berto, which is past tense for people knowing him before hand.

It doesn't matter if his image was tarnished after the Maidana loss...point is, he actually had an image to be tarnished to begin with. Guerrero and "image" don't even belong in the same sentence...dude truly IS a ghost. That's not hating, that's just the truth.

The weird thing is, people across the net are probably looking at pictures of Berto's eyes swollen shut, and it's sad because Berto may actually be THAT much more known for looking like a Star Wars creature, than Guerrero would be for beating him. When I seriously say that the fight lacked entertainment value...it did.

Berto walked away with more than an ass kicking after the Ortiz fight...he left with more respect and an enhanced fan base. It's not like Ortiz went in there and fleeced him over the course of 12 rounds. Hell, Ortiz was about 2-3 punches away from being stopped in that fight. So that proved that Berto wasn't just a trash hype job.

Robert, even without being knocked down, did a poor man's job of what Ortiz did. I'm still not understanding how a guy who was obviously bigger and faster, not able to put away a guy who couldn't see anything. I'm still stuck there. Berto was still able to duck & slip shots, and land some of his own. So that raised more questions about Guerrero, than it actually answered.

Oh yeah, I don't see how Floyd was considered the PPV after the Oscar fight, when he went on to sale on about 900k buys against Hatton. Dont get me wrong, those are good numbers, but a PPV King status should exceed 1M buys, ESPECIALLY after you just sold 2.4M with Oscar. So him cracking 1M buys against JMM, was wit Marquez's help...who is more popular than Ortiz and Guerrero.

Trust me, most of those buys in the Ortiz fight had a lot to do with people hoping that the Pacquiao fight was next. Floyd DID say, "And yes Pacquiao, you're next" during the press conference. NOW, to us who know what's going on, that's a big crock of shit on Floyd's part, but to the casual fans (who actually buy more of these PPVs than us hardcore fans), that was a sure as shit reason to buy it and see how he performed after a 14-month layoff against a strong Mexican American who had JUST beat an undefeated Berto and became champ.

I'll go back to my point of casual fans being the bulk of these PPV cards. Really, us as hardcore fans, what in the hell do we need to be bothered with all of the pressers, commercials, open workouts, etc. while a fight is being built up? We already know what's going on, that shit is done for PUBLICITY, to increase the buy rate.

As soon as a PPV is announced, I already know who most (or all) of the fighters are on the card, and I have general idea of how the fight will go. Casual fans don't know this, hence why we have to see one highlight reel after another, along with other promotional material. With that in mind, if people don't know who Robert Guerrero is, or they happen to be uninterested in the fight, then the remainder of the casual buyers will buy it because they either want to see Floyd just because, see him lose, or they wanna see if he's still able to pull it off.

Sadly, Guerrero has done the worst possible thing, he hasn't made an identity for himself, and he's trying too hard to find a fight that will get him noticed. All fighters should do the latter, but he was supposed to go out there and put Berto on a stretcher last Saturday. He needs to do what Martinez did...take on all comers, fleece 'em, and call out the big names while doing so. Robert can't just piss way up and down in weight classes, and hope for something big to happen. Floyd already called out a smaller MARKETABLE fighter to jump up 2 weight classes and fight him...and his name wasn't Robert Guerrero.
daprofessor
QUOTE (sduck @ Nov 28 2012, 03:11 PM) *
You don't even have to imply its your opinion, since Floyd stated it himself. smile.gif

For most fighters it's real easy to jump to conclusions on them (like after watching one fight or two), but when it comes to Floyd, it takes a lot of research to jump to conclusions on him, dude is way too complex of a fighter. People find it evident, but I don't think there's enough evidence to completely say he struggles against southpaws. He's practically dominated every single one he's fought, actually knocking out some of them, while only falling short to knocking out the others (A funny "fun fact" is that the second opponent of Floyd's career, though only evident of 4 rounds, was also a southpaw, who being a total bum, did better than all the rest). Some of the southpaws did land some good shots, Corley landing the most effective shot anyone ever has, arguably between Shane Mosley. Corley is also not even the best southpaw Floyd has fought, not even close. There's too many variables involved to conclude on this "myth" of Floyd vs southpaws. Of course Guerrero is going to get at least one good shot in, just like most of Floyd's other opponents.

Floyd Sr. really thinks so? Roger thinks it's bullshit, and I don't know what Jeff thinks.

Guerrero definitely has charisma. He should be able to sell better than Ortiz. I also think there was more hype about Berto/Guerrero than Berto/Ortiz.


i agree...but when u take into consideration the amount of orthodox fighters who gave him no problems...compared to the very few southpaw fighters who gave him some problems...it's the closest thing u can call a pattern. laugh.gif i wouldn't call it a myth. i think guerrero will get in a lot more than just one good shot. look for this fight to be announced right around the same time as the pac/jmm4 fight.

yes...floyd sr has stated that in the past. roger is going to go along with whatever floyd wants. floyd sr is the best boxing mind of the 3 brothers.

i agree on guerrero's charisma.
daprofessor
QUOTE (sduck @ Nov 28 2012, 03:20 PM) *
Well of course not now lol, you got to compare Guerrero to when Ortiz wasn't in the spotlight from being Floyd's opponent. To me it seems like Guerrero has more fans. Mayweather was able to make more PPV buys and revenue with Ortiz than he was with Hatton and Marquez. The Marquez fight did so poorly that not even the stadium was completely sold. Ortiz's persona was virtually boring, while Guerrero is a type of guy that talks shit, isn't a prick, with a "lets get it on, I wanna fight anyone" attitude. He also has a style of fighting that pleases most people. The dude is made to sell revenue.


totally agree with this...
daprofessor
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Nov 28 2012, 03:47 PM) *
Sorry, but Guerrero and revenue should never be in the same sentence again...until further notice, of course. I guess people are forgetting how an up and coming Ortiz sold all of those tickets at the Staples center against an unknown Maidana. How do we all know Maidana so well nowadays? Yep, you got it...because of the Ortiz fight.

Ortiz was being built up as the next Oscar De La Hoya...when was Robert ever a factor around that time? Ortiz is remembered more for his quit job against Maidana, than people will ever know Guerrero for. Hell, Marquez is actually the bigger star of them all, and he and Floyd weasled their way to 1M+ buys. I said that to say that people need to start harping on the whole, "Guerrero's Mexican American", and so on.

Again, Marquez is the bigger star between Ortiz and Guerrero, and he and Floyd sold right at 1.1M buys. That says a lot. Mind you, this was BEFORE the whole Floyd vs Pac situation got out of hand. That actually started closer to the Pac/Cotto fight, and went into full overdrive after Pac stopped Cotto.

Ortiz was still being built up by GBP (despite the Maidana loss), and had was almost on his way to being dumped off. Then came the Berto fight, which he won in an impressive fashion, he was the FIRST to defeat Berto, and became champion. He looked to be a formidable opponent for anybody in the WW division.

When Floyd chose Ortiz, it seemed like a HUGE challenge for a guy coming off of a long layoff. So again, Floyd got us with the whole "comeback fight" mess, and on top of that, let's be real, Mayweather/Ortiz sold more than Mayweather/Marquez because at that point, the whole world was sucked into the "Mayweather is going to fight Pacquiao next" nonsense.

That's the ONLY reason Mayweather/Ortiz sold more than Mayweather/Pacquiao...the ONLY reason. Pacquiao/Mayweather was hardly as big of an issue, when Floyd fought JMM, than it was when he fought Ortiz. So, with that in mind, Guerrero has some heavy lifting to do, because seriously, nobody knows who this dude is. I believe Broner/DeMarco just had over 1M views...not sure about ticket sales, but TV dates usually win over the casual fans.

Robert not being able to stop a blind Berto, is NOT impressive. If it was Pac/Diaz-type beating, then he'd impress casual fans, but all of that smothering is a turnoff. Im a hardcore fan, and even I almost wanted to change the channel. Lol

And yes, Guerrero is a prick, and he knows it. Nobody's gonna be an asshole like he was during Berto's portion of the interview, then decide to jump in again and thank his Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. Lol. Sorry, but Guerrero has some heavy lifting to do. The only way I see this happening, is if Floyd decides to fight twice this year, and its been a WHILE since he did that.


laugh.gif i get ur hate for guerrero...but i have to stop u on this one...ortiz/maidana only became the headliner because the original main event fell out. ortiz losing that fight lost him a bunch of fans as well because everyone heard his..."i don't deserve to get beat like this..." statement and it was disgraceful in the fans eyes.
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