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BrutUalBK
http://msn.foxsports.com/cycling/story/lan...e-france-011713

Not too long ago I remember being ridiculed and laughed off a certain boxing forum for suggesting that Blood Doping through Blood Transfusion was possible but listen to the interview in the link posted and then provide your feedback.

I'm a firm believer that testing not only for boxing but for all sports should be mandated and sanctioned by all sports organizations to ensure that we are all playing on an even field and if they're not going to make it mandatory then simply allow everyone to dope, disregard the testing and may the stronger doper win.

Your thoughts??
Southeastpaw
I like and appreciate your thoughts on the matter Brut. I am all for a clean sport, but given what I have read and heard, it seems unlikely, no matter what steps are taken. I am not going to point fingers, but I would not be at all surprised if just about all top boxers are cycling on and off certain PEDs and/or taking masked PEDs.

I watched a video of an interview with Victor Conte and Joe Rogan that really opened my eyes. As you all probably know, Victor and Angel Heredia worked with Olympians and helped them pass Olympic drug testing with the use of unidentifiable PEDs. Victor went on to call the current testing in boxing and IQ test. You know when the test is, so cycle off. Of course, random testing would detour this behavior, but would not stop it... IMO.
Cheesey1
QUOTE (BrutUalBK @ Jan 18 2013, 09:37 AM) *
http://msn.foxsports.com/cycling/story/lan...e-france-011713

Not too long ago I remember being ridiculed and laughed off a certain boxing forum for suggesting that Blood Doping through Blood Transfusion was possible but listen to the interview in the link posted and then provide your feedback.

I'm a firm believer that testing not only for boxing but for all sports should be mandated and sanctioned by all sports organizations to ensure that we are all playing on an even field and if they're not going to make it mandatory then simply allow everyone to dope, disregard the testing and may the stronger doper win.

Your thoughts??

Agreed completely.

It shouldn't be lost on anyone that the agency that's been criticised (U.S.A.D.A) by people who are supposedly in the know, is the same agency that busted Armstrong. Before Armstrong's confession, many even went so far as to say that the U.S.A.D.A's findings of guilt were ridiculous.
BrutUalBK
QUOTE (Southeastpaw @ Jan 18 2013, 08:47 AM) *
I like and appreciate your thoughts on the matter Brut. I am all for a clean sport, but given what I have read and heard, it seems unlikely, no matter what steps are taken. I am not going to point fingers, but I would not be at all surprised if just about all top boxers are cycling on and off certain PEDs and/or taking masked PEDs.

I watched a video of an interview with Victor Conte and Joe Rogan that really opened my eyes. As you all probably know, Victor and Angel Heredia worked with Olympians and helped them pass Olympic drug testing with the use of unidentifiable PEDs. Victor went on to call the current testing in boxing and IQ test. You know when the test is, so cycle off. Of course, random testing would detour this behavior, but would not stop it... IMO.



Yeah SP, I'm aware of Conte and the craziness with the cycling on and off of testing and how if Boxers (or any other sportsmen/sportswoman) if they know how they'd come off and then go back on the minute testing was over but random as you stated would detour it although we know nearly nothing is 100%.

About the only other testing I think that can detect when levels are not normal would be to pull hair follicle samples and DNA test them throughout the year. I got banned from a certain site because I spoke about how these athletes were able to perform blood transfusions, they clowned me so badly on that site that no matter what level of science I brought before them they simply summed it up to me being some kind of conspiracy idiot because I used the reference in relation to Pacquiao possibly doping or using PEDS at a time when he (Manny) was like some sort of demi-god.

Now, we have Lance Armstrong admitting to using the Blood Transfusion method to cycle on/cycle off (no Pun intended) during his training. Amazing how vindication can come.
BrutUalBK
QUOTE (Cheesey1 @ Jan 18 2013, 09:15 AM) *
Agreed completely.

It shouldn't be lost on anyone that the agency that's been criticised (U.S.A.D.A) by people who are supposedly in the know, is the same agency that busted Armstrong. Before Armstrong's confession, many even went so far as to say that the U.S.A.D.A's findings of guilt were ridiculous.



I've read so many disses towards W.A.D.A. and U.S.A.D.A but it was 99% from those who were Pac fans because they were using any source/resource to defend the claims being leveled against him about PED usage, now the cat is out the bag so to say that if the world's most reknown Cyclist was using and now has admitted to it after being caught that surely Manny Pacquiao or any other athelete figure should not be above suspicion.
Franchize
My stance is that I'm disgusted. Not by the people cheating, but by the people that say "Well people are going to do it anywa. What difference does it make?" There are going to be certain kids who turn out to be failures in life. It doesn't mean that you stop parenting. Cancer hasn't gone away, but we still spend millions of dollars on research. Same with AIDS.Shit, we haven't even found a fool proof solution to the common cold yet (not even Big Momma). What people don't realize is, this is beyond winning and losing. Especially in contact sports, the ramifications of steroids can be catastrophic. Bodies are unnaturally doing things they shouldn't be doing. Boxing, of all sports, should be the most strict. Even when you win you lose in boxing. I've nver known a fighter to fight his entire career and not get hit. Maybe steroids never goes away. That doesn't mean you stop doing your due diligence to ensure you've exhausted every effort to make your sport a clean one. I'm no genius or psychiatrist, but I'm willing to bet a cheater would be far less apt to use if he knows the ramifications of getting caught, as well as the methods in which to catch him, are extremely high.
BrutUalBK
QUOTE (Franchize @ Jan 18 2013, 10:27 AM) *
My stance is that I'm disgusted. Not by the people cheating, but by the people that say "Well people are going to do it anywa. What difference does it make?" There are going to be certain kids who turn out to be failures in life. It doesn't mean that you stop parenting. Cancer hasn't gone away, but we still spend millions of dollars on research. Same with AIDS.Shit, we haven't even found a fool proof solution to the common cold yet (not even Big Momma). What people don't realize is, this is beyond winning and losing. Especially in contact sports, the ramifications of steroids can be catastrophic. Bodies are unnaturally doing things they shouldn't be doing. Boxing, of all sports, should be the most strict. Even when you win you lose in boxing. I've nver known a fighter to fight his entire career and not get hit. Maybe steroids never goes away. That doesn't mean you stop doing your due diligence to ensure you've exhausted every effort to make your sport a clean one. I'm no genius or psychiatrist, but I'm willing to bet a cheater would be far less apt to use if he knows the ramifications of getting caught, as well as the methods in which to catch him, are extremely high.



I agree with you which is why I'm all for Mandatory/Random Testing throughout the life cycle of any athlete as long as he/she is active in sports-especially those that are considered contact sports (boxing, MMA, Football, etc.).
Southeastpaw
QUOTE (Franchize @ Jan 18 2013, 11:27 AM) *
My stance is that I'm disgusted. Not by the people cheating, but by the people that say "Well people are going to do it anywa. What difference does it make?" There are going to be certain kids who turn out to be failures in life. It doesn't mean that you stop parenting. Cancer hasn't gone away, but we still spend millions of dollars on research. Same with AIDS.Shit, we haven't even found a fool proof solution to the common cold yet (not even Big Momma). What people don't realize is, this is beyond winning and losing. Especially in contact sports, the ramifications of steroids can be catastrophic. Bodies are unnaturally doing things they shouldn't be doing. Boxing, of all sports, should be the most strict. Even when you win you lose in boxing. I've nver known a fighter to fight his entire career and not get hit. Maybe steroids never goes away. That doesn't mean you stop doing your due diligence to ensure you've exhausted every effort to make your sport a clean one. I'm no genius or psychiatrist, but I'm willing to bet a cheater would be far less apt to use if he knows the ramifications of getting caught, as well as the methods in which to catch him, are extremely high.



I understand your view. I'm not saying stop the testing. But I that doesn't mean that I should be surprised when someone turns up positive. Victor is right about testing in boxing. For a contact sport to have scheduled testing is ridiculous. It definitely turns into an IQ test instead of a drug test. Like I said, I am all for a clean sport. But I am not naive about what is going on. And stricter testing does need to happen. But let's not be surprised at the amount of fights that get scratched for a while after a tighter leash has been administered due to drug use.
Cheesey1
QUOTE (BrutUalBK @ Jan 18 2013, 11:24 AM) *
I've read so many disses towards W.A.D.A. and U.S.A.D.A but it was 99% from those who were Pac fans because they were using any source/resource to defend the claims being leveled against him about PED usage, now the cat is out the bag so to say that if the world's most reknown Cyclist was using and now has admitted to it after being caught that surely Manny Pacquiao or any other athelete figure should not be above suspicion.

Yup. Every pro. boxer (amateurs too would be nice) should be randomly tested for P.E.Ds (and coke too). If the sport becomes more structured then paying for it will be sorted out too e.g. a central fund can be set up to cover those costs.
Cheesey1
QUOTE (Franchize @ Jan 18 2013, 11:27 AM) *
My stance is that I'm disgusted. Not by the people cheating, but by the people that say "Well people are going to do it anywa. What difference does it make?" There are going to be certain kids who turn out to be failures in life. It doesn't mean that you stop parenting. Cancer hasn't gone away, but we still spend millions of dollars on research. Same with AIDS.Shit, we haven't even found a fool proof solution to the common cold yet (not even Big Momma). What people don't realize is, this is beyond winning and losing. Especially in contact sports, the ramifications of steroids can be catastrophic. Bodies are unnaturally doing things they shouldn't be doing. Boxing, of all sports, should be the most strict. Even when you win you lose in boxing. I've nver known a fighter to fight his entire career and not get hit. Maybe steroids never goes away. That doesn't mean you stop doing your due diligence to ensure you've exhausted every effort to make your sport a clean one. I'm no genius or psychiatrist, but I'm willing to bet a cheater would be far less apt to use if he knows the ramifications of getting caught, as well as the methods in which to catch him, are extremely high.

Definitely.
mrchitown
QUOTE (Cheesey1 @ Jan 18 2013, 12:41 PM) *
Yup. Every pro. boxer (amateurs too would be nice) should be randomly tested for P.E.Ds (and coke too). If the sport becomes more structured then paying for it will be sorted out too e.g. a central fund can be set up to cover those costs.


You'd be surprised at the amount of stuff that goes on in the amateurs...this issue included
BrutUalBK
For all those who lobbied against Floyd for making testing an issue let me simply say "YOU WERE WRONG!!!"
The Original MrFactor
No shocks about this whole thing coming to light. What it says to me is that the ones who get caught are either stupid or dont have the money to do both the PED and the masking agents. I imagine that there is a price for fame and glory.
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE (BrutUalBK @ Jan 19 2013, 03:06 PM) *
For all those who lobbied against Floyd for making testing an issue let me simply say "YOU WERE WRONG!!!"



I always agreed with Mayweather's stance, but in light of some recent articles about him, I'm not even sure he's clean. He's a cat who can afford the good shit with masking and all. Maybe thats why he retires so often...
mrchitown
QUOTE (The Original MrFactor @ Jan 20 2013, 06:12 AM) *
I always agreed with Mayweather's stance, but in light of some recent articles about him, I'm not even sure he's clean. He's a cat who can afford the good shit with masking and all. Maybe thats why he retires so often...


What articles are you referring to? I hope not Mr. Montoya
mikE11
QUOTE (Franchize @ Jan 18 2013, 10:27 AM) *
My stance is that I'm disgusted. Not by the people cheating, but by the people that say "Well people are going to do it anywa. What difference does it make?" There are going to be certain kids who turn out to be failures in life. It doesn't mean that you stop parenting. Cancer hasn't gone away, but we still spend millions of dollars on research. Same with AIDS.Shit, we haven't even found a fool proof solution to the common cold yet (not even Big Momma). What people don't realize is, this is beyond winning and losing. Especially in contact sports, the ramifications of steroids can be catastrophic. Bodies are unnaturally doing things they shouldn't be doing. Boxing, of all sports, should be the most strict. Even when you win you lose in boxing. I've nver known a fighter to fight his entire career and not get hit. Maybe steroids never goes away. That doesn't mean you stop doing your due diligence to ensure you've exhausted every effort to make your sport a clean one. I'm no genius or psychiatrist, but I'm willing to bet a cheater would be far less apt to use if he knows the ramifications of getting caught, as well as the methods in which to catch him, are extremely high.


Well said.
Cheesey1
QUOTE (mrchitown @ Jan 19 2013, 12:52 AM) *
You'd be surprised at the amount of stuff that goes on in the amateurs...this issue included

I can believe it.
Slowly but surely the sport will get its shit together. Just like the Olympics was forced to come to the conclusion that there's more long term money without doping, so will boxing.
mrchitown
QUOTE (Cheesey1 @ Jan 21 2013, 07:58 PM) *
I can believe it.
Slowly but surely the sport will get its shit together. Just like the Olympics was forced to come to the conclusion that there's more long term money without doping, so will boxing.


I've heard of amateurs getting paid, I've heard of many infractions that get swept under the rug because these officials and tournament organizers think a fighter is going pro so they give them free reign to do as the please. And I've definitely heard of fighters taking illegal substances and nothing happening. No suspension, no nothing.

I think Boxing will undergo a change or shakeup or what ever people would like to call it when a number of boxers start testing positive for PED's frequently. MLB went thru it, Track has gone thru it,etc. all sports go thru a sink or swim period. Boxing desperately needs to get this matter under control

mgrover
Or some sort of wake up call would be nice, I'd bet if a fighter died in the ring and his opponent tested positive, that'd do it.
Cshel86
QUOTE (mgrover @ Jan 22 2013, 12:20 PM) *
Or some sort of wake up call would be nice, I'd bet if a fighter died in the ring and his opponent tested positive, that'd do it.

Sad that it has to come to those measures, but that's just how laid back the sport of boxing is. When some terrible shit happens, people in position of power, don this "union-like" attitude, but refuse to start any unions for fighters.

That shit reminds me of the Billy Collins Jr. story. Of course Resto was caught immediately after the fight, but the fact that his glove and handwraps weren't checked properly (or at all for that matter), Collins suffered permanent injuries, and ultimately killed himself.
Cshel86
As for the doping situation...they are just going to let it happen over and over again...until someone dies on the receiving end up a doped-up beatdown. Maybe it takes the right fighter to get knocked the fuck out, in order for them to take it seriously.

Sad thing is, Manny's been under scrutiny for years about PEDs, but fuckin' Americans and their hero complex wouldn't push them to think twice about this dude "possibly" being on something...they just needed a hero at the time. Now that he's ran his course with brutalizing guys and ended up kissing the canvas, NOW they want to take drastic measures.

At this point, I could care less about whose doping in the sport...we usually dont find out until they do extra testing anyway (which isn't mandatory). The two blood and urine tests for championship fights, were being used when Jesus was a baby, and I dont see anything good coming out of it, any time soon.
BrutUalBK
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Jan 22 2013, 12:13 PM) *
As for the doping situation...they are just going to let it happen over and over again...until someone dies on the receiving end up a doped-up beatdown. Maybe it takes the right fighter to get knocked the fuck out, in order for them to take it seriously.

Sad thing is, Manny's been under scrutiny for years about PEDs, but fuckin' Americans and their hero complex wouldn't push them to think twice about this dude "possibly" being on something...they just needed a hero at the time. Now that he's ran his course with brutalizing guys and ended up kissing the canvas, NOW they want to take drastic measures.

At this point, I could care less about whose doping in the sport...we usually dont find out until they do extra testing anyway (which isn't mandatory). The two blood and urine tests for championship fights, were being used when Jesus was a baby, and I dont see anything good coming out of it, any time soon.


Now it's Mariusz Wach who has got caught doping for the Klitschko fight, who's next??

I agree with you regarding the highlighted area, all of sudden because Marquez (who has put many other fighters to sleep) KO's their hero it has to be some grand conspiracy regarding doping simply because they felt their boy (Manny) was invincible.
Cshel86
QUOTE (BrutUalBK @ Jan 23 2013, 10:38 PM) *
Now it's Mariusz Wach who has got caught doping for the Klitschko fight, who's next??

I agree with you regarding the highlighted area, all of sudden because Marquez (who has put many other fighters to sleep) KO's their hero it has to be some grand conspiracy regarding doping simply because they felt their boy (Manny) was invincible.

I just read about Wach testing positive this past weekend, wow...Im not surprised though. Whatever he was using, obviously didnt work. Lol

As for the media, the world, Pac fans, etc., their hero complex caused them to miss almost every questionable or BS move my Manny and his team/promoter. When you become a megastar, I guess you can do whatever you please. dntknw.gif
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