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The Original MrFactor
QUOTE (Marcus @ Jan 27 2013, 08:54 PM) *
The margarito point is completely invalid because Margarito was with top Rank. Floyd JUST LEFT top rank to fight de la hoya in 07. The beef between himself and arum was fresh. A Mayweather margarito fight in 08 was less likely then a mayweather pacquiao fight in 2013. That has nothing to do with ducking and everything to do with business. And mayweather beat the man that massacred a cheating Margarito so whats your point?...
The Paul Williams argument is understandable. The Marquez argument is understandable and still Marquez was number 2 P4P and HE called FLOYD out. When ward fought dawson DAWSON called ward out. Ward didnt go up to 175 to fight. And Paul Williams vs Mayweather wouldnt gross nearly as much as mayweather marquez. Marquez is oe of the rop 3 mexican fighters of all time. Who is williams now? Where will he stand in history?...stop it. If you call someone out you fight at their weight class. Yes marquez was 135 but since you like to bring history up.. history shows marquez called floyd out. But to say mayweather "ducked" Maragarito like he didnt JUST leave top tank with bad blood boiling between himself and arum. No ones defending no one. Thats just a dumb argument.



I can agree with that to some degree. I believe, money talks and the fights could have been made if negotiations took place. Perhaps thae bad blood supercedes the pay day. There was and still is some issue between Arum and Mayweather. I think that has contributed to us not getting the fights we want. Williams was a great fighter whose career was cut short due to a horrific injury. I'm not gonna hold that against his body of work. Had he been able to continue his career, we'd possibly see a different set of circumstances today. He was scheduled to fight Alvarez before the injury.
MaxPayne
Why do people act like Floyd wouldn't have handled Margarito with ease ?

I mean, motherfuckers talk like his legacy is incomplete for not beating the dog shit out of a cheat.
Plah
QUOTE (MaxPayne @ Jan 28 2013, 07:07 AM) *
Why do people act like Floyd wouldn't have handled Margarito with ease ?

I mean, motherfuckers talk like his legacy is incomplete for not beating the dog shit out of a cheat.

This... and wasn't Baldomir the unified champ at '47 at that time?
checkleft
QUOTE (Plah @ Jan 28 2013, 09:54 AM) *
This... and wasn't Baldomir the unified champ at '47 at that time?

Yes he was. He had an awesome year that year, think he won like 3-4 fights against top ranked fighters. Not sure but I think he was even fighter of the year
Marcus
QUOTE (The Original MrFactor @ Jan 28 2013, 02:07 AM) *
I can agree with that to some degree. I believe, money talks and the fights could have been made if negotiations took place. Perhaps thae bad blood supercedes the pay day. There was and still is some issue between Arum and Mayweather. I think that has contributed to us not getting the fights we want. Williams was a great fighter whose career was cut short due to a horrific injury. I'm not gonna hold that against his body of work. Had he been able to continue his career, we'd possibly see a different set of circumstances today. He was scheduled to fight Alvarez before the injury.


Very true. Who knows what the future would've had in store for him had he never got into that terrible career ending accident. However legacy wise, I don't think Williams would've compared to Marquez. And thats one factor that makes Mayweather's decision to pick Marquez (The 3rd greatest Mexican fighter of all time, the No. 2 P4Per in '09, and arguably today's #3 P4Per) a solid one. I know if I was Floyd at the time I'd pick a 135 Marquez over a 147 Williams ANYDAY. Looks way better on a resume. And imagine if Marquez goes back down to 135. He'll beat everyone down there.. even Broner. Mayweather's win over Marquez would seem even greater.

As for Danny Garcia we can all officially agree that he wont be fighting Floyd since Garcia-Judah has been postponed to 4/27/2013

So now we have Guerrero and Bradley(unlikely). I dont see anyone else he could possibly fight. Someone mentioned Brook as a possibility but im not to solid on that. We'll see, but the suspense is killing me i must admit lol
mgrover
till Mayweather beats a legitimate 154lb champion there's no way he can simply beat Trout. I have my doubts about the Canelo fight too, but I think Mayweather outboxes him but who knows, he's shown he can be hurt.
Jovi
People are crazy to even want to throw Margarito in an argument to tarnish Mayweather's accolades. Mayweather would've destroyed Margarito!! if SHANE MOSELY (#3 welterweight at the time) can go in there and put him out and Pacquiao (#2) could beat on him enough and break his orbital bone, what do you think the #1 welterweight would do? Margarito was way too slow he could have been getting circled and countered all night. Cotto's endurance and his defense are not as good as Mayweather's including the possible plaster glove factor, Mayweather would've made margarito his bitch. If margarito applies constant pressure then he will constantly get outclassed.

Williams would have been more difficult but just because he is faster than Margarito. He still gets hit WAYYYYY too much and doesn't utilize his height and reach like he should. Williams would go down like Corrales (RIP).

We already know Mayweather just picks his big money fights, I dont think he feels he has to prove much. When you get a paycheck for a fight and its 20,000,000$. then maybe you just want more paychecks like that.

For his next fight i really think it wont be the obvious pick, which would be Guerrero. I have a feeling he is gonna surprise me and pick Amir Khan. Still a big money fight because of the UK fanbase, Khan is only has his speed lol, and he has Virgil hunter...If not Khan then Guerrero, i think Bob Arum doesn't want Mayweather to cashout if he picks bradley. Mayweather can then say "I beat both guys who beat Poochiao" and it would still be a big money fight. Guerrero i guess is a solid backup
daprofessor
QUOTE (MaxPayne @ Jan 28 2013, 08:07 AM) *
Why do people act like Floyd wouldn't have handled Margarito with ease ?

I mean, motherfuckers talk like his legacy is incomplete for not beating the dog shit out of a cheat.


i love mayweather and cannot stand margarito...but even i can admit that would have been a very difficult fight for floyd because of the size difference and margarito's ability to take a punch. floyd would have had to work really hard to get that win. i don't believe a margarito win would have been out of the question. as for his legacy being incomplete....he cast shadow over himself with his leonard-esque retirements and careful opponent selection. i ain't mad at him for it...it is what it is...when u get to that level, u deserve to pick and choose. but ask yourself, when was the last time floyd truly tested himself? when was the last time he fought a guy that no one thought he could beat? when was the last time he faced an undefeated fighter that actually had a chance to beat him? floyd and pac both are guilty of careful matchmaking above 140lbs.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Plah @ Jan 28 2013, 09:54 AM) *
This... and wasn't Baldomir the unified champ at '47 at that time?


key word...unified...not undisputed.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Marcus @ Jan 28 2013, 02:34 PM) *
Very true. Who knows what the future would've had in store for him had he never got into that terrible career ending accident. However legacy wise, I don't think Williams would've compared to Marquez. And thats one factor that makes Mayweather's decision to pick Marquez (The 3rd greatest Mexican fighter of all time, the No. 2 P4Per in '09, and arguably today's #3 P4Per) a solid one. I know if I was Floyd at the time I'd pick a 135 Marquez over a 147 Williams ANYDAY. Looks way better on a resume. And imagine if Marquez goes back down to 135. He'll beat everyone down there.. even Broner. Mayweather's win over Marquez would seem even greater.

As for Danny Garcia we can all officially agree that he wont be fighting Floyd since Garcia-Judah has been postponed to 4/27/2013

So now we have Guerrero and Bradley(unlikely). I dont see anyone else he could possibly fight. Someone mentioned Brook as a possibility but im not to solid on that. We'll see, but the suspense is killing me i must admit lol


looking good on a resume means nothing imo. maybe to the casual fan...but at that time, williams was a threat and not too many wanted to face him. not many gave marquez a chance against floyd. that fight went exactly as it should have. a win against williams would have been much more impressive imo.
daprofessor
QUOTE (mgrover @ Jan 28 2013, 03:33 PM) *
till Mayweather beats a legitimate 154lb champion there's no way he can simply beat Trout. I have my doubts about the Canelo fight too, but I think Mayweather outboxes him but who knows, he's shown he can be hurt.


trout dominated cotto. floyd split rounds with miguel. i don't think trout or canelo will be easy for floyd.
Marcus
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Jan 28 2013, 03:15 PM) *
trout dominated cotto. floyd split rounds with miguel. i don't think trout or canelo will be easy for floyd.


Trout definitely didn't dominate. He clearly won. However to say Trout dominated that would mean trout thoroughly outclassed Miguel. He didn't dominate. He was up 2 rounds (115-113). Cotto put up a great fight. That was a nail bitting fight. An ENTERTAINING high energy fight. I'd go out on a limb and say that fight was even more exciting and competitve than Mayweather-Cotto. They both split rounds with Cotto. Trout's win was just more impressive because he was an underdog, and he beat cotto at the Garden. Just because it's expected of Floyd to always win and he abnormally ended up winning under tough circumstances doesn't make Trouts win more definitive because he was the underdog. It does however bring a Mayweather-Trout fight into question which as a Floyd fan i wouldnt want to see but as a boxing fan I'd vouch for. It could go either way.In the ring Trout had just as much trouble as Floyd did. Trout was younger, and used his legs. Trout-Cotto took pace throughout the entire ring. Mayweather -Cotto was fought in a corner on the inside. That style Floyd used imo was way more difficult than fighting an athletic fight such as Trout did. Trout's stamina and ability to move throughout the ring was Cotto's Kryptonite. Trout i was a young strong big JMW fighting a Cotto that just came off a heartbreaking loss. Floyd was a welterweight fighting at JMW that beat Cotto coming of a 3 KO win streak including Margarito. And they both arguably had equally competitive fights.

I dont even know what to say about Canelo. He hasn't faced anybody notable. And as a 154 world champion holding a belt there was NO HONOR in him defending a title against Lopez. He should've taken that disrespectfully. Josesito Lopez is no Roberto Duran. Canelo Mayweather right now shouldn't even be a discussion. Lets see how he does against Trout first. At least Guerrero fought a #1 contender at welterweight.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Marcus @ Jan 28 2013, 04:42 PM) *
Trout definitely didn't dominate. He clearly won. However to say Trout dominated that would mean trout thoroughly outclassed Miguel. He didn't dominate. He was up 2 rounds (115-113). Cotto put up a great fight. That was a nail bitting fight. An ENTERTAINING high energy fight. I'd go out on a limb and say that fight was even more exciting and competitve than Mayweather-Cotto. They both split rounds with Cotto. Trout's win was just more impressive because he was an underdog, and he beat cotto at the Garden. Just because it's expected of Floyd to always win and he abnormally ended up winning under tough circumstances doesn't make Trouts win more definitive because he was the underdog. It does however bring a Mayweather-Trout fight into question which as a Floyd fan i wouldnt want to see but as a boxing fan I'd vouch for. It could go either way.In the ring Trout had just as much trouble as Floyd did. Trout was younger, and used his legs. Trout-Cotto took pace throughout the entire ring. Mayweather -Cotto was fought in a corner on the inside. That style Floyd used imo was way more difficult than fighting an athletic fight such as Trout did. Trout's stamina and ability to move throughout the ring was Cotto's Kryptonite. Trout i was a young strong big JMW fighting a Cotto that just came off a heartbreaking loss. Floyd was a welterweight fighting at JMW that beat Cotto coming of a 3 KO win streak including Margarito. And they both arguably had equally competitive fights.

I dont even know what to say about Canelo. He hasn't faced anybody notable. And as a 154 world champion holding a belt there was NO HONOR in him defending a title against Lopez. He should've taken that disrespectfully. Josesito Lopez is no Roberto Duran. Canelo Mayweather right now shouldn't even be a discussion. Lets see how he does against Trout first. At least Guerrero fought a #1 contender at welterweight.


i had cotto/trout 9-3 in favor of trout. i had mayweather/cotto 7-5 in favor of floyd. cotto busted mayweather up...and for a guy who very rarely loses rounds...that fight was more competitive than any mayweather fight i ever saw. as for trout...cotto landed his best punches on trout and he just ate them and kept going. at the end of that fight...cotto was busted up. i get ur point about the bouts they just came off of...and u have a legitimate argument there. trout and canelo both bring something floyd hasn't seen in a while....youth, size and skill. cotto brought skill to the table. ortiz brought youth and size. trout and canelo bring all 3...i'll even add one to canelo and that's punching power. even though canelo's resume is suspect, one thing is for certain...he hasn't lost yet. neither has trout. i'd like to see floyd show us how to beat each guy. both are obstacles standing in the way of his retirement. it would be a huge statement if he fought those two prior to retirement. i seriously doubt he faces trout though because floyd sr won't allow him to face a southpaw...especially one with as much skill as trout.
Marcus
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Jan 28 2013, 04:36 PM) *
i had cotto/trout 9-3 in favor of trout. i had mayweather/cotto 7-5 in favor of floyd. cotto busted mayweather up...and for a guy who very rarely loses rounds...that fight was more competitive than any mayweather fight i ever saw. as for trout...cotto landed his best punches on trout and he just ate them and kept going. at the end of that fight...cotto was busted up. i get ur point about the bouts they just came off of...and u have a legitimate argument there. trout and canelo both bring something floyd hasn't seen in a while....youth, size and skill. cotto brought skill to the table. ortiz brought youth and size. trout and canelo bring all 3...i'll even add one to canelo and that's punching power. even though canelo's resume is suspect, one thing is for certain...he hasn't lost yet. neither has trout. i'd like to see floyd show us how to beat each guy. both are obstacles standing in the way of his retirement. it would be a huge statement if he fought those two prior to retirement. i seriously doubt he faces trout though because floyd sr won't allow him to face a southpaw...especially one with as much skill as trout.


I like that 9-3 scorecard. Floyd got busted but again he fought in a corner on the inside all night. Trout fought a young mans fight. Very true, trout did eat Cotto's punches better than Floyd did. But you do make valid points. Trout is a big threat for certain.

While Canelo has power, i give Trout the bigger chance to beat Floyd beacause i think he's far more skillful. He's more athletic than Canelo and i think he's faster. While Cotto isn't the fastest power puncher in the game i realized trout was able t time his punches effectively. Two things Canelo and Trout do lack a defense. Cotto was catching Trout flush and Canelo even got caught a few times by Lopez.

I think experience and defense would play a big part in Canelo losing to Floyd. He's powerful but that right hand will tag him all night as he tries to hook to Mayweather's body. If mayweather wins thats the only way i can see it happening.

As for Mayweather Trout I have no clue how that fight will go. If Trout is to beat Canelo, Mayweather will probably try to let him face Ishe Smith first.

If Canelo is to lose to Trout on May 4 (Which is very likely) I'd love to see Canelo-Cotto. I would still love to see that fight.
Dolimite
QUOTE (Marcus @ Jan 28 2013, 03:14 PM) *
I like that 9-3 scorecard. Floyd got busted but again he fought in a corner on the inside all night. Trout fought a young mans fight. Very true, trout did eat Cotto's punches better than Floyd did. But you do make valid points. Trout is a big threat for certain.

While Canelo has power, i give Trout the bigger chance to beat Floyd beacause i think he's far more skillful. He's more athletic than Canelo and i think he's faster. While Cotto isn't the fastest power puncher in the game i realized trout was able t time his punches effectively. Two things Canelo and Trout do lack a defense. Cotto was catching Trout flush and Canelo even got caught a few times by Lopez.

I think experience and defense would play a big part in Canelo losing to Floyd. He's powerful but that right hand will tag him all night as he tries to hook to Mayweather's body. If mayweather wins thats the only way i can see it happening.

As for Mayweather Trout I have no clue how that fight will go. If Trout is to beat Canelo, Mayweather will probably try to let him face Ishe Smith first.

If Canelo is to lose to Trout on May 4 (Which is very likely) I'd love to see Canelo-Cotto. I would still love to see that fight.


Floyd is a not a true 154 fighter. SO he is fighting bigger guys. Trout would give Floyd fits because he stays composed, Red Head has yet to face a true fighter, Shane was shot and the rest of his competition is rather laughable but let's see. I am down for Floyd to fight whoever on May 4th and then those two guys and then hang them up.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Marcus @ Jan 28 2013, 06:14 PM) *
I like that 9-3 scorecard. Floyd got busted but again he fought in a corner on the inside all night. Trout fought a young mans fight. Very true, trout did eat Cotto's punches better than Floyd did. But you do make valid points. Trout is a big threat for certain.

While Canelo has power, i give Trout the bigger chance to beat Floyd beacause i think he's far more skillful. He's more athletic than Canelo and i think he's faster. While Cotto isn't the fastest power puncher in the game i realized trout was able t time his punches effectively. Two things Canelo and Trout do lack a defense. Cotto was catching Trout flush and Canelo even got caught a few times by Lopez.

I think experience and defense would play a big part in Canelo losing to Floyd. He's powerful but that right hand will tag him all night as he tries to hook to Mayweather's body. If mayweather wins thats the only way i can see it happening.

As for Mayweather Trout I have no clue how that fight will go. If Trout is to beat Canelo, Mayweather will probably try to let him face Ishe Smith first.

If Canelo is to lose to Trout on May 4 (Which is very likely) I'd love to see Canelo-Cotto. I would still love to see that fight.


i seriously doubt canelo/trout or mayweather/trout ever get made. it's disappointing because i'd love to see each fight unfold.
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE (MaxPayne @ Jan 28 2013, 07:07 AM) *
Why do people act like Floyd wouldn't have handled Margarito with ease ?

I mean, motherfuckers talk like his legacy is incomplete for not beating the dog shit out of a cheat.



Ummm because he wouldnt have beaten him easily... I give credit where credit is due. Fighting is a science. Floyd has masterd the science part. If you look over Floyd's resume, he hasnt fought too many cats that have a reach advantage over him. Thats part of the science of hittingh and not being hit. DLH was perhaps the most recent and prior to that I cant even tell you. DLH was probably his toughest fight. We all know, win lose or draw, he fought DLH for the money. Margarito and Williams have a reach advantage over Mayweather as well as a height advantage. So in each of those fights despite the speed deficit that Margarito has, Mayweather was going to take return fire from either of those guys. The science of hit and not be hit would make it a bit more difficult to overcome Margarito's reach advantage over Mayweather. Margarito's ruggedness made him too much of a threat. Mayweather would land counters and straights, but like Cotto, he would get caught on his way out.

For those that keep bringing up how Mosley beat Margarito, well I raise you a Jermain Taylor beat Hopkins twice. Kelly Pavlik beat Taylor twice. Hopkins beat Pavlik. Mosley fought the fight of his life against a shook Margarito. Mosley didnt fight again for almost 18months later which ultimately turned out to be Mayweather. Personally, I think in that 18months Mosley got old and never really recovered from that inactivity seeing that he has yet to win a fight since then.
daprofessor
QUOTE (The Original MrFactor @ Jan 28 2013, 08:27 PM) *
Ummm because he wouldnt have beaten him easily... I give credit where credit is due. Fighting is a science. Floyd has masterd the science part. If you look over Floyd's resume, he hasnt fought too many cats that have a reach advantage over him. Thats part of the science of hittingh and not being hit. DLH was perhaps the most recent and prior to that I cant even tell you. DLH was probably his toughest fight. We all know, win lose or draw, he fought DLH for the money. Margarito and Williams have a reach advantage over Mayweather as well as a height advantage. So in each of those fights despite the speed deficit that Margarito has, Mayweather was going to take return fire from either of those guys. The science of hit and not be hit would make it a bit more difficult to overcome Margarito's reach advantage over Mayweather. Margarito's ruggedness made him too much of a threat. Mayweather would land counters and straights, but like Cotto, he would get caught on his way out.

For those that keep bringing up how Mosley beat Margarito, well I raise you a Jermain Taylor beat Hopkins twice. Kelly Pavlik beat Taylor twice. Hopkins beat Pavlik. Mosley fought the fight of his life against a shook Margarito. Mosley didnt fight again for almost 18months later which ultimately turned out to be Mayweather. Personally, I think in that 18months Mosley got old and never really recovered from that inactivity seeing that he has yet to win a fight since then.


2 things to consider....

margarito was coming off of the fight of his life with cotto where he did take some very big punches and had to walk through fire to get that win against cotto. i thought that bout severely diminished him for mosley. he also had a partially torn retina and a bad back going into the fight with mosley. add the wrap controversy...and u have just the right mix for a poor showing. mosley also had the benefit of watching cotto give a partial blue print of how to beat margarito. not that he was unbeatable before that because williams beat him too, but it was a partial blue print for a guy of mosley's stature. mosley capitalized on all the things cotto forgot to do in that fight.

fast forward to the mosley/mayweather fight and u have to realize that mosley was in camp to face berto. that fight fell through just a short while before the fight was scheduled to take place because of the earth quake in haiti. mosley took a short break and started another camp to face floyd which also included random testing. say what u want about random testing...but for a guy of mosley's age to do 2 camps back to back...and have to give blood randomly leading up to the fight with floyd...he was diminished. i think it was more over activity than inactivity.
MaxPayne
Anyone who thinks Margarito, with his plodding footwork, lack of any notable defense and slow handspeed would have been an issue for Floyd already loses credibility.

The concept that a guy can just keep walking someone down only works if the other guy gets tired in the later rounds (think Chavez vs. Taylor).

Floyd has never, ever shown any signs of gassing. He's beaten Margarito type fighters before, and done it handily.

When people say a prime Pacquiao had a shot of hurting/knocking Floyd out with a power shot, I give that more credit than this idea that a slow, robotic fighter like Margacheato has any kind of chance.

The Original MrFactor
QUOTE (MaxPayne @ Jan 29 2013, 07:40 AM) *
Anyone who thinks Margarito, with his plodding footwork, lack of any notable defense and slow handspeed would have been an issue for Floyd already loses credibility.

The concept that a guy can just keep walking someone down only works if the other guy gets tired in the later rounds (think Chavez vs. Taylor).

Floyd has never, ever shown any signs of gassing. He's beaten Margarito type fighters before, and done it handily.

When people say a prime Pacquiao had a shot of hurting/knocking Floyd out with a power shot, I give that more credit than this idea that a slow, robotic fighter like Margacheato has any kind of chance.



Please, name names because I dont think he's fought anyone at WW thats 5' 10" with 73 inch reach. Agreed Margarito would have taken some shots, but Mayweathers power isnt on par with a Mosley or a Cotto. He would have had much more to sneer and smile about in a Mayweather fight. Baldomir comes to mind with his 67 inch reach. Mayweather was somewhat spent at the end of that fight. Baldomir went 12 and lost handily, BUT he was not physically as imposing or strong as Margarito. He didnt have any of Margarito's advantages in height, reach and AGE. If you say Margarito would not have been a very difficult fight, to use Floyd's words, you dont know shit about boxing. Fighting is a science about measurements and Floyd knows that well. He matches up with his opponents based on this shrewd observation. If you havent caught on yet in the last 10 years or more, then you arent in on the joke and have no interest in defending him. Please find me guy not named DLH who had a reach ADVANTAGE over Mayweather in the last 10 years. You lose credibility because you wont find one...
Plah
QUOTE (The Original MrFactor @ Jan 29 2013, 09:29 AM) *
Please, name names because I dont think he's fought anyone at WW thats 5' 10" with 73 inch reach. Agreed Margarito would have taken some shots, but Mayweathers power isnt on par with a Mosley or a Cotto. He would have had much more to sneer and smile about in a Mayweather fight. Baldomir comes to mind with his 67 inch reach. Mayweather was somewhat spent at the end of that fight. Baldomir went 12 and lost handily, BUT he was not physically as imposing or strong as Margarito. He didnt have any of Margarito's advantages in height, reach and AGE. If you say Margarito would not have been a very difficult fight, to use Floyd's words, you dont know shit about boxing. Fighting is a science about measurements and Floyd knows that well. He matches up with his opponents based on this shrewd observation. If you havent caught on yet in the last 10 years or more, then you arent in on the joke and have no interest in defending him. Please find me guy not named DLH who had a reach ADVANTAGE over Mayweather in the last 10 years. You lose credibility because you wont find one...

Lay down the pipe. Only thing Margarito would have had going for him if that fight had taken place is his chin. That reach advantage (which is minimal btw) means shit when you're slow as shit. He would have lost like Baldomir or even worst, like Corrales.
checkleft
QUOTE (The Original MrFactor @ Jan 29 2013, 09:29 AM) *
Please, name names because I dont think he's fought anyone at WW thats 5' 10" with 73 inch reach. Agreed Margarito would have taken some shots, but Mayweathers power isnt on par with a Mosley or a Cotto. He would have had much more to sneer and smile about in a Mayweather fight. Baldomir comes to mind with his 67 inch reach. Mayweather was somewhat spent at the end of that fight. Baldomir went 12 and lost handily, BUT he was not physically as imposing or strong as Margarito. He didnt have any of Margarito's advantages in height, reach and AGE. If you say Margarito would not have been a very difficult fight, to use Floyd's words, you dont know shit about boxing. Fighting is a science about measurements and Floyd knows that well. He matches up with his opponents based on this shrewd observation. If you havent caught on yet in the last 10 years or more, then you arent in on the joke and have no interest in defending him. Please find me guy not named DLH who had a reach ADVANTAGE over Mayweather in the last 10 years. You lose credibility because you wont find one...

Mayweather not having power doesn't matter, its his speed reflexes and quickness that intimidates. Everybody knows the shots you don't see or expect are the ones that put your lights out. Mosley dismantled margs but he couldn't drop dlh even though mosley was on peds younger faster and stronger back then. Yet when mayweather fought dlh he nearly dropped dlh a few times with short quick counters off his back foot even though he doesn't punch as hard.

Either way this argument is pointless because theirs no telling what would have happened if the fight happened
mgrover
while its so much more effort landing any sort of counter or a decent counter with a shorter reach, i know that the hard way, theres nothing wrong with Floyd fighting people with shorter reach than him, Judah was the same, so was Mitchell. According to boxrec anyways.
Cshel86
QUOTE (Marcus @ Jan 24 2013, 03:59 PM) *
Corrales was 5'10 1/2 but his reach was 70" thats crazy. You're right, no ones ever had Floyds reach. No wonder why that straight right is so effective...

I totally agree. But that fight isn't worth it. High risk, low reward. He gains nothing from facing Trout unless trout faces Canelo prior. I'd love to see it and see how Floyd adjusts but I dont think that fight will do much for his legacy. Floyd will have to neutralize Trouts reach and with his current style idk if he can do that. Floyd will have to wait for trout to counter him. He will have to go back to the style he used against Marquez. Trout reminded me of Ward a little against Cotto.

Bradley, Canelo, and Martinez are the fights he should take in that order. With Bradley he can unify 147, become Ring Champion, and claim I beat the guy that "beat" pacquiao. Bradley also has an impressive Resume on paper even though on TV they are boring. Hopefully they're no headbutts... Canelo would do great with Floyd in PPV and he could also unify 154 to become ring champ. The risk of losing to Canelo is lower than the risk of losing to Trout. And if Floyd moves up to 160 to fight Serg?! SMH win or lose... all hail Mayweather because he came from 130. It would also be interesting because Serg said he wants 3 more fights then he'll retire, Floyd said the same. So as long as they remain undefeated top level competitors, if these two could have their going away parties in the ring in 2014 that would be one for the books...

I believe he gains a bit more from beating Trout, then Cotto would've gotten for Trout. Had Cotto handled his business with Trout (which was a tall order), then we could omit the Mayweather talk. BUT, since Trout beat Cotto (a fighter with a name) and put the world on notice, then a Trout victory for Floyd (or any other fighter), would be worth a nod.

Trout has a way of making a fight boring, and the only way Floyd beats him easily, would be to circle and box (which was his boring style), so the fight would be a flop, unless Floyd takes a risk and exchange. I just dont see Floyd beating Sergio at 160, but Im sure that people would be delighted for Sergio to drop down to 54, regardless of the health risk. That sounds bad on my part, but the boxing world works in odd ways. Lol

QUOTE (duwdu @ Jan 26 2013, 03:27 AM) *
I like this idea, Cshel, of a Mayweather-Brook fight, should Brook come through those hurdles unscathed. Also, I'm a fan of "Special K" Brook's fighting style. However, the likelihood of a fight between him and Mayweather just/merely being agreed within one month after September and the fight itself for December, is, to say the least, almost nil. Such a fight could happen in 2014, tho'.

Even if in May Canelo loses a chance to fight Mayweather in September, the Mayweather train will likely not start waiting around till August or later, to identify another opponent for September 14th. So I still think the chance that Mayweather fights a second time this year - in September - is pretty high, barring other catastrophes, of course.

Pitching these two sentences together is really unfair of you, Cshel, and really shows your level of distaste for the guy. [I only hope that level does not degenerate to that you had/still have for Allmenjoi8? lol.] Seriously, in view of his incarceration during 2012, whether foreseen (20/20?) or unforeseen, it did not in anyway constitute that Mayweather had lied by him proclaiming much earlier in that year that he was going to fight twice during that year. After all, the way you yourself wrote it, he qualified the proclamation when he said "that he was gonna try to fight twice in 2012."

Relax on Mayweather, man; let him enjoy the emerging twilight of his career.

P34c3

I can see a Mayweather/Brook fight being made just a month after September...trust me, the one and only reliable source from the very website, sat on the Mayweather/Cotto news for 2 months before it was announced. Mark my words on that. Lol

I cant truly say if Floyd is sure to fight in September, he could just hold out til December, who knows? Whose to say that something big wont happen in the WW division? We're only on month #2 of 2013 (well almost), so we never know what could happen. Again, we never know what Floyd wants to do, so I can't hold on to that September date just yet.

There's no distaste towards Floyd, if anything, it's too much taste for Floyd around here. Sometimes, guys forget that boxing is a business, and ANYTHING can happen. Whose to say that Floyd wont fight JMM in May? Who knew that JMM would've put Manny to sleep last month, and derailed the idea of a Rios fight in April? All I'm saying is, Manny and Floyd are the biggest names in the sport, and things do revolve around them...when those things go right.

In the meantime, we must pay attention to every other fighter's schedule, and see what can be made of it. You cant blame me for holding Floyd's word against him. You're right, he did say that he was going to "try" to fight twice in 2012, but the dude was only in jail for 60 days. I've seen guys like Tyson, do YEARS, and got right back out and was talking boxing.

Those years that Tyson did, could've been a financial hit (maybe), but Floyd doing 2 little months in isolation, is nothing. An average citizen's life would be totally derailed (money, job, etc) after 2 months behind bars, but a guy of Floyd's financial caliber, should've been just fine.

It's funny how his fans hold on to every single word that comes out of his mouth, but when he doesn't follow through, guys start making excuses for him. What if he doesn't fight in September? Then what?
Cshel86
QUOTE (The Original MrFactor @ Jan 27 2013, 08:16 PM) *
Just curious... Why are people so quick to defend a guy who hasnt delivered the goods we would like. Do you defend the mailman when he doesnt bring you all of your mail. "You know, well it was raining and the ground was muddy. He just delivered a few of my letters. He couldnt deliver all of them, especially my paycheck." Same thing with Mayweather. Let me ask, did you want to see him fight Marquez or Margarito? Marquez or Williams? As a fight fan, I wanted Williams or Margarito. When both were coming off big wins, he retired. He came back conveniently when the air was clear. He came back to fight the best 135 pounder in the world at the time. Thats undeniable history. thats exactly what happened.

laugh.gif

I love the delivery analogy. I never thought the Margarito fight would happen anyway. Margarito's a piece of shit and he was TR, and in all honesty, that fight would NOT have been a walk in the park for Floyd. NOW, I would loved to have seen him fight Williams, I think that would've kept a lot of critics silent...of course he would've had to take that fight before Paul lost to Quintana.

Again, in my opinion, he could've bypassed the Margarito fight for all I care (because of contractual issues), but that Williams fight should've happened.

QUOTE (Dolimite @ Jan 27 2013, 08:47 PM) *
So you are defining his career based on two fights that you wanted to see. I would not want to see Mayweather fight a slow ass Margarito who has no defense. A typical brawler, boring, counter shots all night. Margarito is a fucking cheater and he beat a Cotto with loaded gloves. Do you honestly think Margarito with Mayweather's defense had a shot? Bert Sugar and he may not know a damn thing about boxing, stated that his fight with Marquez would give Mayweather fits, and it was Marquez who called out Mayweather. He fought the number 2 guy what more would you want? Paul Williams is just tall with an incredible tolerance for punishment. That fight would of ended with a body shot. Again Mayweather said that he was going to retire after the Hatton fight I don't think he was afraid of either Paul or Margarito and let's be honest, both guys were not household names, so even if he did stay in the game do you honestly think he would of fought them? I don't understand how you say he doesn't fight hard competition based on two fighters! Come on.

Again Mayweather will not be fighting either, Trout, Alvarez or Martinez since Trout and Alvarez are suppose to be fighting each other and Sergio already has a fight coming up. Speaking of the red head what the hell has he done to warrant a fight with Mayweather? He hasn't fought a legit 154 fighter and yet you are barking at mayweather for his "dodging?" Really? And Trout, he did beat Cotto and now you think he deserves a fight with Mayweather. Mayweather had to go through three or four fighters just to get to Oscar and Trout beats Cotto and all of the sudden he is proven? Okay...

By the way Mayweather isn't close to being 154 he is a welter weight. So if he ask Trout or Alvarez to come down to welter weight would you call him a coward?

Man c'mon D, you usually make some good points, but you cant defend Floyd's every move. He has inconsistencies in his career/word/etc, just as every fighter does. Marquez was the #2 guy...at 135. I cant give Floyd much credit for that fight, and it actually hurts me to go back and watch it. I like how he put the spin on it and basically said that he beat the guy that beat Pacquiao.

A classic example of people holding on to Floyd's every word...before he came back and got ready to fight Marquez, people either didn't care who really won the first to Pac/JMM fights, or they were cool with the controversy. As soon as Floyd cracked his mouth open about JMM actually beating Manny twice, people immediately came out the wood work and agreed. Suddenly, guys became scoring experts and boxing gurus. Again, before Floyd said that, we hardly heard a peep about the results of the first 2 fights.

Floyd actually said that he was going to retire after the DLH fight, but then the Hatton fight was made. Let's be honest, we can't even use the whole "(insert potential opponent's name) wasn't a household name", because Floyd wasn't even that damn famous after the DLH and Hatton fights. Dude retired and people weren't really checking for him like that...well, casual fans weren't.

It was ALL about Pacquiao, after the Oscar fight. THEN Floyd came back, and people were begging for the Pacquiao fight, which made Floyd a bigger name. So a Williams fight wasn't such a bad idea in 2008, but again, Floyd retired after the Hatton fight. Even if Floyd stayed in the game, he would've been FORCED to take a challenging fight. He couldn't go on that Berto trail of facing no-hopers for big paydays, that idea died after he did those numbers with DLH.

I believe that Trout deserves a Mayweather fight, why not? I agree that Trout hasn't done much as far as opponents are concerned, but compared to Canelo's flimsy resume full of over the hill, blown up WWs and small WWs, Trout has done a country mile more, by beating Cotto. Canelo just has a name and good team, period.

It's funny how guys say that Floyd would "easily" beat Trout, Canelo, K-9, whoever...but yet, when they're cornered, they're quick to say that Floyd isn't a true 154 lber. Which one is it? Again, some of you guys run yourself into the dirt (Tasmanian style) when it comes to making excuses for Floyd.
mgrover
he isn't a 154lb but realistically whats the welterweight division got to offer him lol, the jr welterweights don't bring anything new or special and anyone in the lower classes that can maybe challenge him is Broner but hes way too far out in weight, and his head is way to far up Mayweathers ass. So he should either retire or fight somebody that seems worthy. Mayweather's biggest problem is that he wants to be held next to the All time greats, and he has the skills, but not the resume to match.
Dolimite
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Jan 29 2013, 02:50 PM) *
laugh.gif

I love the delivery analogy. I never thought the Margarito fight would happen anyway. Margarito's a piece of shit and he was TR, and in all honesty, that fight would NOT have been a walk in the park for Floyd. NOW, I would loved to have seen him fight Williams, I think that would've kept a lot of critics silent...of course he would've had to take that fight before Paul lost to Quintana.

Again, in my opinion, he could've bypassed the Margarito fight for all I care (because of contractual issues), but that Williams fight should've happened.


Man c'mon D, you usually make some good points, but you cant defend Floyd's every move. He has inconsistencies in his career/word/etc, just as every fighter does. Marquez was the #2 guy...at 135. I cant give Floyd much credit for that fight, and it actually hurts me to go back and watch it. I like how he put the spin on it and basically said that he beat the guy that beat Pacquiao.

A classic example of people holding on to Floyd's every word...before he came back and got ready to fight Marquez, people either didn't care who really won the first to Pac/JMM fights, or they were cool with the controversy. As soon as Floyd cracked his mouth open about JMM actually beating Manny twice, people immediately came out the wood work and agreed. Suddenly, guys became scoring experts and boxing gurus. Again, before Floyd said that, we hardly heard a peep about the results of the first 2 fights.

Floyd actually said that he was going to retire after the DLH fight, but then the Hatton fight was made. Let's be honest, we can't even use the whole "(insert potential opponent's name) wasn't a household name", because Floyd wasn't even that damn famous after the DLH and Hatton fights. Dude retired and people weren't really checking for him like that...well, casual fans weren't.

It was ALL about Pacquiao, after the Oscar fight. THEN Floyd came back, and people were begging for the Pacquiao fight, which made Floyd a bigger name. So a Williams fight wasn't such a bad idea in 2008, but again, Floyd retired after the Hatton fight. Even if Floyd stayed in the game, he would've been FORCED to take a challenging fight. He couldn't go on that Berto trail of facing no-hopers for big paydays, that idea died after he did those numbers with DLH.

I believe that Trout deserves a Mayweather fight, why not? I agree that Trout hasn't done much as far as opponents are concerned, but compared to Canelo's flimsy resume full of over the hill, blown up WWs and small WWs, Trout has done a country mile more, by beating Cotto. Canelo just has a name and good team, period.

It's funny how guys say that Floyd would "easily" beat Trout, Canelo, K-9, whoever...but yet, when they're cornered, they're quick to say that Floyd isn't a true 154 lber. Which one is it? Again, some of you guys run yourself into the dirt (Tasmanian style) when it comes to making excuses for Floyd.


Welcome back! Your lady must of had you tied down (lol), I ain't mad at that! I feel your point and I am not protecting Floyd by any means. All I am saying is when people say he should of fought Margarito and Paul Williams I don't understand why. Margs was a no name and Paul Williams was getting his name out there. As boxing fans if Floyd would have taken these two fights would we really be overjoyed or saying, why the hell is he fighting these two men? Plus Paul Williams is 154 plus fighter, Floyd can barely make 151 let alone 154. You are saying why should Floyd fight an overhyped Alvarez and not a Trout who has proven himself against a viable contender in Cotto? I agree Saul should actually fight people his own weight and size, but he is popular and sometimes popularity let's you get away with bloody murder (Ray Lewis?). I think Trout would be a hard match up but would Trout bring in the money that Mayweather wants? Now if Red Head fights Trout and loses (fingers crossed) then yes Mayweather should indeed fight Trout. K-9 is a boring fighter and I hope Smith nails him but I would say this in regards to Floyd, if he is holding that 154 belt then he should fight 154 fighters with 0 excuses. But if he holds a 147 belt then he should fight his mandatory even though I do not want to see the shit. Fair is fair. If the guy earned it then he deserves a shot.
MaxPayne
You have to look at matchups.

The only hope that a Chavez style, "stalk till they drop" type fighter has against a technician is if the latter gets tired. We've established that Mayweather has never had fitness issues. I don't see any other result than a pretty easy unanimous decision.

The Paul Williams fight is fascinating. However, I think what would have worked against Williams is that he never truly learned to use his height and reach. Watch tapes of his fights. He ends up on the inside A LOT more than you would think. I think Floyd would have made him pay for not having a solid jab. On the inside, it was no match. A lot of people think you can just keep winging punches, but when you start missing, it takes a lot out of you. You also start thinking more and punching less. Watch film and you'll see. Floyd would likely have won a decision.

MaxPayne
2 guys in this era who I would have absolutely loved to have seen in the ring against Floyd ?

Vernon Forest and Winky Wright.

Both had excellent jabs, were accurate punchers from all distances and excellent defenses.

THOSE would have clearly been difficult fights for Floyd.
Cshel86
QUOTE (Dolimite @ Jan 29 2013, 06:08 PM) *
Welcome back! Your lady must of had you tied down (lol), I ain't mad at that! I feel your point and I am not protecting Floyd by any means. All I am saying is when people say he should of fought Margarito and Paul Williams I don't understand why. Margs was a no name and Paul Williams was getting his name out there. As boxing fans if Floyd would have taken these two fights would we really be overjoyed or saying, why the hell is he fighting these two men? Plus Paul Williams is 154 plus fighter, Floyd can barely make 151 let alone 154. You are saying why should Floyd fight an overhyped Alvarez and not a Trout who has proven himself against a viable contender in Cotto? I agree Saul should actually fight people his own weight and size, but he is popular and sometimes popularity let's you get away with bloody murder (Ray Lewis?). I think Trout would be a hard match up but would Trout bring in the money that Mayweather wants? Now if Red Head fights Trout and loses (fingers crossed) then yes Mayweather should indeed fight Trout. K-9 is a boring fighter and I hope Smith nails him but I would say this in regards to Floyd, if he is holding that 154 belt then he should fight 154 fighters with 0 excuses. But if he holds a 147 belt then he should fight his mandatory even though I do not want to see the shit. Fair is fair. If the guy earned it then he deserves a shot.

Lol, I was VERY busy.

As for him fighting Williams or Margarito...why not fight them? I can totally understand the Margarito and post-Top Rank contract with Floyd, understood. I seriously think that Paul Williams should've happened in 2008 when he was still a WW. I agree that Williams wasn't a big name fighter, but to an extent, Floyd wasn't either. If anything, he was still new to it.

If you think about it, not everyone that fought Oscar, became a superstar/cash cow after they beat him. For instance, Shane beat Oscar twice, and ended up taking $300k paydays on PPV against guys like Winky Wright. Again, not everybody becomes a superstar/cash cow, just because they fought one.

Floyd wasn't a De La Hoya-type star, who could fight just about anybody, and do some decent numbers, so a Williams fight in 2008, wouldn't have been so much of a stretch for him. If anything, that fight would've challenged him, and kept doubt out of most fans' mind. Instead, he retired, JUST to came back and fight the LW champion of the world.

And yes, popularity can help you get away with whatever you want in the sport. I'm not sure if Trout brings in the money that Floyd wants, but if we're talking about who deserves the fight more, we can pick Trout any day out of the week. At least he and Floyd have common opponent that had something left in the tank (Cotto). I cant even speak Mosley being a common opponent, because he was just there for a payday.

Plah
QUOTE (MaxPayne @ Jan 30 2013, 08:47 AM) *
2 guys in this era who I would have absolutely loved to have seen in the ring against Floyd ?

Vernon Forest and Winky Wright.

Both had excellent jabs, were accurate punchers from all distances and excellent defenses.

THOSE would have clearly been difficult fights for Floyd.

This.
Dolimite
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Jan 30 2013, 06:43 AM) *
Lol, I was VERY busy.

As for him fighting Williams or Margarito...why not fight them? I can totally understand the Margarito and post-Top Rank contract with Floyd, understood. I seriously think that Paul Williams should've happened in 2008 when he was still a WW. I agree that Williams wasn't a big name fighter, but to an extent, Floyd wasn't either. If anything, he was still new to it.

If you think about it, not everyone that fought Oscar, became a superstar/cash cow after they beat him. For instance, Shane beat Oscar twice, and ended up taking $300k paydays on PPV against guys like Winky Wright. Again, not everybody becomes a superstar/cash cow, just because they fought one.

Floyd wasn't a De La Hoya-type star, who could fight just about anybody, and do some decent numbers, so a Williams fight in 2008, wouldn't have been so much of a stretch for him. If anything, that fight would've challenged him, and kept doubt out of most fans' mind. Instead, he retired, JUST to came back and fight the LW champion of the world.

And yes, popularity can help you get away with whatever you want in the sport. I'm not sure if Trout brings in the money that Floyd wants, but if we're talking about who deserves the fight more, we can pick Trout any day out of the week. At least he and Floyd have common opponent that had something left in the tank (Cotto). I cant even speak Mosley being a common opponent, because he was just there for a payday.


NICE!
Shane has0 personality. And let's face it the 24/7 series sold that fight. Mayweather cracked me up when he was like "you said I stole your shit, okay, what are you going to do about it" Gangsta! You can't have two good guys fighting each other, makes for boring theater or drama as Larry Merchant would like to call it.

My only defense with Floyd not fighting Paul Williams was that he said that he was going to retire after the Hatton fight and he did. Now if he came back and foght Paul Williams after JMM called him we would of said he ducked JMM. So either way the guy loses. It either way the fight didn't happen and what is done is done. I would say his fight with Winky Wright or Vernon Forest (RIP) would have been damn interesting as someone stated before. Two smart fighters, not a ton a speed but smart nevertheless.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Dolimite @ Jan 29 2013, 06:08 PM) *
Welcome back! Your lady must of had you tied down (lol), I ain't mad at that! I feel your point and I am not protecting Floyd by any means. All I am saying is when people say he should of fought Margarito and Paul Williams I don't understand why. Margs was a no name and Paul Williams was getting his name out there. As boxing fans if Floyd would have taken these two fights would we really be overjoyed or saying, why the hell is he fighting these two men? Plus Paul Williams is 154 plus fighter, Floyd can barely make 151 let alone 154. You are saying why should Floyd fight an overhyped Alvarez and not a Trout who has proven himself against a viable contender in Cotto? I agree Saul should actually fight people his own weight and size, but he is popular and sometimes popularity let's you get away with bloody murder (Ray Lewis?). I think Trout would be a hard match up but would Trout bring in the money that Mayweather wants? Now if Red Head fights Trout and loses (fingers crossed) then yes Mayweather should indeed fight Trout. K-9 is a boring fighter and I hope Smith nails him but I would say this in regards to Floyd, if he is holding that 154 belt then he should fight 154 fighters with 0 excuses. But if he holds a 147 belt then he should fight his mandatory even though I do not want to see the shit. Fair is fair. If the guy earned it then he deserves a shot.


margarito had and defended his title more than the other belt holders at that time. no one wanted to fight him. williams was the one that was more than willing and he beat him convincingly. floyd never mentioned his name. cotto mentioned williams name and said he was more deserving of a shot at his belt than margarito...but we all know bob wouldn't allow that. williams had to take margarito to court to get his shot. that would have been the perfect time for floyd to fight williams. instead he sat back and let all these guys fight each other. we all know what happened after that. on the weight issue... williams was as low as 143 when he fought as a welter. he was 145 when he fought margarito. weight shouldn't have been an issue.
daprofessor
QUOTE (MaxPayne @ Jan 30 2013, 08:34 AM) *
You have to look at matchups.

The only hope that a Chavez style, "stalk till they drop" type fighter has against a technician is if the latter gets tired. We've established that Mayweather has never had fitness issues. I don't see any other result than a pretty easy unanimous decision.

The Paul Williams fight is fascinating. However, I think what would have worked against Williams is that he never truly learned to use his height and reach. Watch tapes of his fights. He ends up on the inside A LOT more than you would think. I think Floyd would have made him pay for not having a solid jab. On the inside, it was no match. A lot of people think you can just keep winging punches, but when you start missing, it takes a lot out of you. You also start thinking more and punching less. Watch film and you'll see. Floyd would likely have won a decision.


he knew how to fight on the back foot...he just got away from that often because he loved to mix it up. i think williams height, reach and volume would have given floyd problems.
Dolimite
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Feb 1 2013, 12:52 PM) *
margarito had and defended his title more than the other belt holders at that time. no one wanted to fight him. williams was the one that was more than willing and he beat him convincingly. floyd never mentioned his name. cotto mentioned williams name and said he was more deserving of a shot at his belt than margarito...but we all know bob wouldn't allow that. williams had to take margarito to court to get his shot. that would have been the perfect time for floyd to fight williams. instead he sat back and let all these guys fight each other. we all know what happened after that. on the weight issue... williams was as low as 143 when he fought as a welter. he was 145 when he fought margarito. weight shouldn't have been an issue.


Margarito to the casual fan and non fan unknown. Boxing fans knew he was I actually didn't know Margs until I saw him fight Cotto and I was like damn, damn! Paul Williams I am not going to lie, I watched him fight Sergio and I think that might had been the second time I saw him fight. He robbed a guy in his comeback fight and then the accident. I will go back and look at both fighters and look at their careers. Again Margs is a slow welter weight and Paul takes so much punishment. I will do my homework on both fighters tonight. Thanks for the insight Professor.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Dolimite @ Feb 1 2013, 06:38 PM) *
Margarito to the casual fan and non fan unknown. Boxing fans knew he was I actually didn't know Margs until I saw him fight Cotto and I was like damn, damn! Paul Williams I am not going to lie, I watched him fight Sergio and I think that might had been the second time I saw him fight. He robbed a guy in his comeback fight and then the accident. I will go back and look at both fighters and look at their careers. Again Margs is a slow welter weight and Paul takes so much punishment. I will do my homework on both fighters tonight. Thanks for the insight Professor.


there's a lot of history to catch up on. margarito was beating the dog shit out of a lot of ppl and had been a sparring partner for dlh. dlh didn't want any parts of margarito. i forget the guys name...but he ripped his ear off with a punch in a fight. he was a beast. williams fights with martinez was the beginning of the end. i thought he won the first fight with martinez. martinez even admitted he thought he lost...there was just one judge that had a score that was waaaay off....but they got the right winner. martinez left no doubt in the rematch. prior to martinez....williams was on a tirade himself and pretty much ran out of opponents willing to face him which is why he ended up fighting martinez again. margarito, williams and martinez were all avoided by plenty of fighters...they all blazed trails...martinez blazed the most significant trail of the 3.
checkleft
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Feb 1 2013, 03:54 PM) *
he knew how to fight on the back foot...he just got away from that often because he loved to mix it up. i think williams height, reach and volume would have given floyd problems.

Williams height would be a problem for anyone if he used it! He can be outboxed for gods sake quintana outboxed him for 12. But he never used his reach and height how he should have, that boy was too philly and I don't even think hes from philly lol. Eventually that's what got him caught cold against serg
bnoles4life
QUOTE (checkleft @ Feb 2 2013, 01:47 AM) *
Williams height would be a problem for anyone if he used it! He can be outboxed for gods sake quintana outboxed him for 12. But he never used his reach and height how he should have, that boy was too philly and I don't even think hes from philly lol. Eventually that's what got him caught cold against serg


Nope...Aiken, S.C.
checkleft
QUOTE (bnoles4life @ Feb 2 2013, 10:57 PM) *
Nope...Aiken, S.C.

As I thought lol. The guy just loved to exchange and be exciting, he was never taught to be lengthy and box from the outside.
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE (checkleft @ Feb 2 2013, 01:47 AM) *
Williams height would be a problem for anyone if he used it! He can be outboxed for gods sake quintana outboxed him for 12. But he never used his reach and height how he should have, that boy was too philly and I don't even think hes from philly lol. Eventually that's what got him caught cold against serg



He used his reach and height in the Margarito fight. That was the only time I saw Williams do that. He boxed and won an easy decision. If he fought everybody that way, the guy would have been unbeatable.
daprofessor
QUOTE (checkleft @ Feb 2 2013, 01:47 AM) *
Williams height would be a problem for anyone if he used it! He can be outboxed for gods sake quintana outboxed him for 12. But he never used his reach and height how he should have, that boy was too philly and I don't even think hes from philly lol. Eventually that's what got him caught cold against serg


he could do it..he did it against margarito. he did it at the half way point when he fought martinez the first time. he also did it against quintana in the rematch and kolle. he just didn't stay with it when he needed too. his eagerness to mix it up was also his undoing.
checkleft
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Feb 3 2013, 06:32 PM) *
he could do it..he did it against margarito. he did it at the half way point when he fought martinez the first time. he also did it against quintana in the rematch and kolle. he just didn't stay with it when he needed too. his eagerness to mix it up was also his undoing.

Yea he could always be sucked into a brawl.
mrchitown
Just saw Mayweaher's twitter and he announced that Alexander is the front runner to fight him and it would be a unification fight. I hope he's pranking the fans, or maybe his twitter got hacked lol.... Either way that's a shit fight
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE (mrchitown @ Feb 6 2013, 12:51 AM) *
Just saw Mayweaher's twitter and he announced that Alexander is the front runner to fight him and it would be a unification fight. I hope he's pranking the fans, or maybe his twitter got hacked lol.... Either way that's a shit fight



Yup, i just read it on another fight website. Not really interested in that fight either. Devon's a smallish guy who couldnt get past Bradley. Mayweather has his reach advantage, so I'm guessing this fight will be made. Here's to him, he found another easy way out...
Musashi100
im hearing rumor guerrero turn down 2mill to fight mayweather. he was asking for 4million. if true than who the fuck he think he is. i don't even think ortiz made that much
pimpfighterROQ
Mayweather fighting Alexander? what the fuck? Devon is boring as fuuck!! More boring than Bradley or Malinaggi fights. I know Mayweather hasn't fought for almost a year now but talk about a soft touch.
duwdu
QUOTE (Musashi100 @ Feb 6 2013, 02:20 AM) *
im hearing rumor guerrero turn down 2mill to fight mayweather. he was asking for 4million. if true than who the fuck he think he is. i don't even think ortiz made that much


You probably heard right, because Guerrero's body language had been to talk it all up and risk it all (read: negotiate a larger than life, unrealistic-at-this-stage-of-his-career payday.) And there was seriously time consuming negotiations regarding that, during which time - and up till now - Guerrero suddenly went eerily quite...must have been told to so do, to not upset the negotiations. We should hear from Guerrero pretty soon.

By the way, now that one thinks about it, the Mayweather-Guerrero negotiations must have already broken down by the time Mayweather tweeted that the news of him fighting Guerrero was just a rumor, and that he (Mayweather) didn't at that point know who he would fight on May 4th - meaning they were already in negotiations with other fighters for that date. Unfortunately, people don't always believe - some even have the tendency to sneer at - the signal Mayweather gives. But that's part of the fight game, of course.

And now, who else has a belt that at WW Mayweather can fight? I wouldn't expect Mayweather to fight at 154 straight out of jail. Even if he was there for only one day, the mental shock was enough to negatively affect someone whose life especially outside the ring has been around the Big Boy Mansion and clubbing like forever. Call it an excuse, it is what it is.

Therefore, if it is the Alexander fight for May 4th, I won't be surprised.

P34c3
mrchitown
QUOTE (The Original MrFactor @ Feb 6 2013, 12:13 AM) *
Yup, i just read it on another fight website. Not really interested in that fight either. Devon's a smallish guy who couldnt get past Bradley. Mayweather has his reach advantage, so I'm guessing this fight will be made. Here's to him, he found another easy way out...


Im Almost certain Canelo will take an even softer touch now if Floyd was to fight Devon. I can only assume that he'd take such a fight as a soft touch and then get ready for Canelo.... I still think as a PPV, this is a hard sell
Franchize
I read the same on Mayweather's facebook page. Doesn't add up tho. Isnt Alexander fighting Brook? They said he'd be redy in 8 weeks. No way he can fight then turn around and fight Floyd.
mrchitown
QUOTE (Franchize @ Feb 6 2013, 02:47 AM) *
I read the same on Mayweather's facebook page. Doesn't add up tho. Isnt Alexander fighting Brook? They said he'd be redy in 8 weeks. No way he can fight then turn around and fight Floyd.


Which is probably why Brook and his promoter think the injury was BS. Brooks' promoter, Eddie Hearn is saying that they won't take any step aside money to allow them to unify the belts. I hope that is true and that if they try to proceed with the match that Devon gets stripped of the title
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