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checkleft
QUOTE (Plah @ Apr 21 2013, 01:03 AM) *
And that's why I thank the lord you are not a prize fight judge. (Not that the judges were any good tonight smh)

Hahaha
kidbazooka1
Canelo impressed me with his head movement very smooth. Trout is the real deal aswell but canelo showed he's ready for the big league.
Jack 1000
QUOTE (checkleft @ Apr 20 2013, 10:46 PM) *
They already robbed him. It's over guys, open scoring and Texas can suck a Dick


I stopped scoring when I heard they were using Open Scoring for this! Texas needs to get out of the Association of Boxing Commissions, because they are violating ABC rules with Open Scoring, Open scoring killed the interest in this fight for me. This is a perfect example of why it sucks. I thought a draw to a two point win for either guy was fair.

Jack
Jack 1000
Read that someone had it really wide for Alvarez who is a good boxing guy. I didn't see it that way at all!

Jack
mgrover
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Apr 21 2013, 06:20 AM) *
Did anybody score this fight as a 7-5 affair? If you did, then you cant be mad that it went in Canelo's favor. NOW, those crazy score cards are one thing, but the fact that the fight was that close, gives it the right to allow fuckery to happen. No way Trout should've let it get that close, being that the given circumstances were in place.


7-5 sounds about that. Just the fuckery of the world.
scdrking2
QUOTE (mgrover @ Apr 21 2013, 04:29 AM) *
7-5 sounds about that. Just the fuckery of the world.


The fight was close enough that after 8, Trout should have been able to sweep him to victory. But those fucked up scores change the complexion of the fight. Both camps know the only way one can lose is with knockout. I was bored after I heard those scores. Trout should have known that going in and been more aggressive, but that doesnt make it right.
mgrover
QUOTE (scdrking2 @ Apr 21 2013, 12:26 PM) *
The fight was close enough that after 8, Trout should have been able to sweep him to victory. But those fucked up scores change the complexion of the fight. Both camps know the only way one can lose is with knockout. I was bored after I heard those scores. Trout should have known that going in and been more aggressive, but that doesnt make it right.


Meh if anything Canelo ran in the 12th but whatever, what's done is done
Cheesey1
As alredy mentioned, dountful that Trout gets the rematch. I'd love for that to happen, but I don't see Alvarez taking that risk again. Trout just has to beat whomever he faces next and keep focusing on his career.

mgrover
Am hoping its either Vanes or Lara
The Original MrFactor
QUOTE (Plah @ Apr 21 2013, 02:03 AM) *
And that's why I thank the lord you are not a prize fight judge. (Not that the judges were any good tonight smh)



Ummm... He might actually be one LOL!
Dolimite
I told yawl a robbery. Canelo was wild at times and he did land some big shots but in spurts. Just look at how the fight went. Even with the knock down in the 7th round he controlled the rest of the round. This is the BS i hate about boxing. Austin had to know there was no way he could win. I had this fight 8-4 Trout. Canelo got outworked and to be honest trout looked like the better fighter and boxer.

Showtime had their pom poms out for Saul and I just do not understand how scoring can be this off. I am glad I did not see this live or else my TV would be broken. It was amazing how Saul could not believe he could not finish off Trout, he was even surprised that with his punches were not really hurting him. That is what happens when you fight a fighter in your weigh class. I hate fucking boxing right now.

I am tired of Oscar, I really am. He needs to shut the fuck up.
Cshel86
R1 - Trout 10-9
R2 - Canelo 19-19
R3 - Trout 29-28 (close)
R4 - Trout 39-37 (close)
R5 - Canelo 48-47 (close)
R6 - Trout 58-56 (very close)
R7 - Canelo 66-66 (Yes I scored it a 10-8 round. Trout was fighting back on shaky legs, but didn't do much to gain Canelo's respect or slow him down)
R8 - Trout 76-75
R9 - Canelo 85-85 (Trout was busier, but again, failed to land a meaningful eye-popping shot)
R10- Trout 95-94
R11- Canelo 104-104
R12- Trout 114-113 (Canelo didn't press the action at all, well, maybe in some spots during the last 20 seconds).

So, on my card, Trout edged it by 1 point, in a close 114-113 decision. Had I given Trout a 10-9 round for the 7th round in which he was knocked down, then we'd be talking 115-113.

What in world did I tell you guys about close fights that end in a 115-113 affair? There's a 110% chance that somebody will get edged, and both camps will be pissed. Not only that, but 115-113 affairs are close fights with close rounds that could go in favor of either guy. When you're faced with those "up in the air" rounds where either guy could've pulled it off, scoring then becomes a lot more subjective than it already is, and it looks as if both sides could be right.

When guys like Trout are bad at mounting an offense, and knows for a fact that they don't have enough power to keep a guy honest, then the pressure is all on them. Trout doesn't seem like he sits down on a lot of his punches, which is a reason that he couldn't get Canelo's respect.

It seems like everything that Trout threw, were shoeshine-like punches, and most of them either grazed Canelo or he slipped them. When a guy cranks the Ali Shuffle and showboats with his hands down, he either knows that he's winning the fight, or he knows that you cant hit and/or hurt him.

Those open scoring cards after the 8th were horrible, 80-71, 78-73, and 76-75 in favor of Canelo. The only one that I agreed with was the 76-75, but my card read the same in favor of Trout. That appeared to be the only judge that was actually watching the damn fight. But that 118-109 card? WTF?

I was hard on Trout last night, because he knew what he was up against. Those soft combination punches and high volumes of punches with nothing landing, screamed, "Ay look judges, I'm the aggressor simply because I'm throwing punches". Problem? Trout trying to convince the judges with anything other than HARD punches, knockdowns, or a knockout.

Everything that wasn't "Trout-like" should've been done by Trout last night. He had 38,000 fans out there (more in favor of Canelo), some disingenuous judges, and the fans/boxing business dreaming of a Mayweather/Canelo fight. Even if Trout had won, he would've had to rematch Canelo IMMEDIATELY (according to the contract), so whatever he did last to win, would've had to been repeated in an immediate rematch. Smh
emd01
Damn people really hate this kid here huh? My hats off to Canelo. I thought he fought a good fight and showed what a young fighter should show...improvements. We have to remember the guy is only 22 and isnt in his prime yet. I remember not long ago people were saying "Oh but he hasnt fought any real 154 lbers." and now that he has he still catches heat for it lol.

I had it 7-5 for Canelo. The judging was ridiculous but at least they got it right and judging by Trouts reaction after the final bell he wouldnt argue against it. The kid beat an undefeated fighter and floored him for the first time in his career and I dont remember seeing Trout hit him with an eye widening shot all night. Give the kid a break....its not his fault his promoter is a sissy and is slowly moving him along. The kid is a fighter...cool as a popsicle in that ring and thats his best quality.
Dolimite
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Apr 21 2013, 10:20 AM) *
R1 - Trout 10-9
R2 - Canelo 19-19
R3 - Trout 29-28 (close)
R4 - Trout 39-37 (close)
R5 - Canelo 48-47 (close)
R6 - Trout 58-56 (very close)
R7 - Canelo 66-66 (Yes I scored it a 10-8 round. Trout was fighting back on shaky legs, but didn't do much to gain Canelo's respect or slow him down)
R8 - Trout 76-75
R9 - Canelo 85-85 (Trout was busier, but again, failed to land a meaningful eye-popping shot)
R10- Trout 95-94
R11- Canelo 104-104
R12- Trout 114-113 (Canelo didn't press the action at all, well, maybe in some spots during the last 20 seconds).

So, on my card, Trout edged it by 1 point, in a close 114-113 decision. Had I given Trout a 10-9 round for the 7th round in which he was knocked down, then we'd be talking 115-113.

What in world did I tell you guys about close fights that end in a 115-113 affair? There's a 110% chance that somebody will get edged, and both camps will be pissed. Not only that, but 115-113 affairs are close fights with close rounds that could go in favor of either guy. When you're faced with those "up in the air" rounds where either guy could've pulled it off, scoring then becomes a lot more subjective than it already is, and it looks as if both sides could be right.

When guys like Trout are bad at mounting an offense, and knows for a fact that they don't have enough power to keep a guy honest, then the pressure is all on them. Trout doesn't seem like he sits down on a lot of his punches, which is a reason that he couldn't get Canelo's respect.

It seems like everything that Trout threw, were shoeshine-like punches, and most of them either grazed Canelo or he slipped them. When a guy cranks the Ali Shuffle and showboats with his hands down, he either knows that he's winning the fight, or he knows that you cant hit and/or hurt him.

Those open scoring cards after the 8th were horrible, 80-71, 78-73, and 76-75 in favor of Canelo. The only one that I agreed with was the 76-75, but my card read the same in favor of Trout. That appeared to be the only judge that was actually watching the damn fight. But that 118-109 card? WTF?

I was hard on Trout last night, because he knew what he was up against. Those soft combination punches and high volumes of punches with nothing landing, screamed, "Ay look judges, I'm the aggressor simply because I'm throwing punches". Problem? Trout trying to convince the judges with anything other than HARD punches, knockdowns, or a knockout.

Everything that wasn't "Trout-like" should've been done by Trout last night. He had 38,000 fans out there (more in favor of Canelo), some disingenuous judges, and the fans/boxing business dreaming of a Mayweather/Canelo fight. Even if Trout had won, he would've had to rematch Canelo IMMEDIATELY (according to the contract), so whatever he did last to win, would've had to been repeated in an immediate rematch. Smh


I do not believe just because you throw a few power shots in a round you should be awarded the round. Trout outworked and boxed Alvarez and yes Saul dodged a lot of punches but so did Trout. A lot of Saul's shots landed on Trout's chest and glazed his cheek. Showtime really did push the Saul machine I thought they were HBO, even Paulie was on that band wagon. Trout sounded defeated and I am wondering did he take the gas off on purpose maybe he was paid off hell I do not know. I am upset because judges reward one big shot and they feel that will win rounds when the guy who cuts off the ring sets traps and breaks your guard loses. Someone really has to explain to me how they scored this fight. Saul looked good last night but not enough to win. Win Trout let his hands go great things happened. I'm disgusted right now. Rather they gave the fight to Saul is one thing but to say he did not win a round is ridiculous.
Dolimite
QUOTE (emd01 @ Apr 21 2013, 11:53 AM) *
Damn people really hate this kid here huh? My hats off to Canelo. I thought he fought a good fight and showed what a young fighter should show...improvements. We have to remember the guy is only 22 and isnt in his prime yet. I remember not long ago people were saying "Oh but he hasnt fought any real 154 lbers." and now that he has he still catches heat for it lol.

I had it 7-5 for Canelo. The judging was ridiculous but at least they got it right and judging by Trouts reaction after the final bell he wouldnt argue against it. The kid beat an undefeated fighter and floored him for the first time in his career and I dont remember seeing Trout hit him with an eye widening shot all night. Give the kid a break....its not his fault his promoter is a sissy and is slowly moving him along. The kid is a fighter...cool as a popsicle in that ring and thats his best quality.

And your assessment is exactly what is wrong with boxing as a whole. I do not hate Alvarez what I do hate is the fact that he won a lopsided decision and this is his first fight fighting a 154 fighter and now everyone wants to suck his big toe. People love the razzle dazzle of boxing, yes he popped him a few times but come on, Trout came back in the 7th and actually walked him down and took over the round it was a 10-9 round. He has improved but his record is bullshit.
Amandla
This is the thing. What's really happenning is Trout is going into the lion's den and he has to face the music and step up his game. He has to win rounds convincingly and not closely. He should be dominating round after round...its an uphill battle for him and of course thats unjust. Just comparting cards:

I got
1st 10-9 Trout
2nd 19-19 Canelo
3rd 29-29 Even
4th 39-38 Canelo
5th 48-48 Trout
6th 58-57 Trout (No Doubt!)
7th 67-66 Canelo (For the knockdown)
8th 76-76 Trout (no Doubt!)
9th 86-85 Canelo
10th 95-95 Trout (No Doubt!)
11th 105-105 Even
12th 115-114 Trout (No Doubt!)


A lot of the early rounds were very close and theres the judgs you always gotta put on a convicing display for the judges and this was nothing like the Austin Trout we saw in Madison Square Garden beating Cotto.

And then there was the fact we never got to see a WAR break out...there were POINTS when it looked like thatwas going to happen but then Trout would check himself and go back to his gameplan and his gameplan was obviously not to get hit cos he would get his lights knocked out.

Once his chin was tested that was it...he wasn't going to throw this away by going ot war...some people admire that as smart.

I don't
emd01
So a lot of the rounds were close but you think its impossible that someone could give the close rounds to Canelo and not Trout? Theres a million things wrong with boxing and it was an opinion not an assessment. We all know judges give BS scores in every big fight, for the most part, I was just saying at least someone didnt get cheated and thats my opinion. I'm not going to not give the kid props because people have something personal against the way he's being promoted. The kid is a good, solid fighter! If i'm sucking his big toe for saying that then so be it lol.
mgrover
I think Trout won but so be it, am I biased for having money on Trout probably. I need to rewatch it so I can make up my mind. For some reason more and more I think am starting to prefer the British commentary, at times the showtime commentary seems to have the pom poms out for Canelo
Amandla
QUOTE (emd01 @ Apr 21 2013, 02:08 PM) *
So a lot of the rounds were close but you think its impossible that someone could give the close rounds to Canelo and not Trout? Theres a million things wrong with boxing and it was an opinion not an assessment. We all know judges give BS scores in every big fight, for the most part, I was just saying at least someone didnt get cheated and thats my opinion. I'm not going to not give the kid props because people have something personal against the way he's being promoted. The kid is a good, solid fighter! If i'm sucking his big toe for saying that then so be it lol.


I totally agree Canelo has the skills and the style of a warrior, a massive number of pro-fights under his belt and he is only 22 years ld.

He certainly gets my respect but it was a close fight. There should be talk of a rematch....but there won't be because he's THE GoldenBoy promotional project. He is De La Hoya's little baby as far as a lot of people see him and thats why theres so much hatefor Canelo.

Thats the sad part about the modern game. You get a great warrior and fighter and some machine comes along and shapes and manages him into a personan and a commodoty.

I'm sure Canelo wants more fights against tougher opposition.
BoxingStill#1
QUOTE (mgrover @ Apr 21 2013, 02:10 PM) *
I think Trout won but so be it, am I biased for having money on Trout probably. I need to rewatch it so I can make up my mind. For some reason more and more I think am starting to prefer the British commentary, at times the showtime commentary seems to have the pom poms out for Canelo


at times i was wondering if someone in the nose bleeds could see the fight better than they did, shit was making me sick
mrchitown
I had it a 1pt victory for Austin. We're all in agreement that it was a close fight. Me personally, I can't give someone a round when they are landing few and far between punches like Canelo was. The KD was telling because after that, Trout controlled the round. And going forward , Canelo is going to have to work on that stamina. He still is yet to be in a fight where he fights 3mins of the round.

The scorecards were shit, though I had Trout winning by a point, I wouldn't have been upset if Canelo won by a point but those wide scores were simply garbage. Now I see why Trout's team was pissed. The story wen under the radar but Trout's team says they were promised different judges and they were upset about the appointed judges. They came out with this about a day or two before the fight
Jack 1000
QUOTE (scdrking2 @ Apr 21 2013, 06:26 AM) *
The fight was close enough that after 8, Trout should have been able to sweep him to victory. But those fucked up scores change the complexion of the fight. Both camps know the only way one can lose is with knockout. I was bored after I heard those scores. Trout should have known that going in and been more aggressive, but that doesnt make it right.


I'll just say that the use of the WBC open scoring system is killing me as a fan. I wasn't thrilled when it was experimented with after Holyfield-Lewis I, tried to give it a chance when the WBC opted for it at their 2006 convention, and can no longer accept the system. The fight was really good, until Al Bernstein gave the 8th round scores.Then, my interest was lost, in what had been a great fight up to the announcement of the scores, because I knew Trout could no longer win.

Texas needs to remove itself from the Association of Boxing Commissions if they want to continue with the Open Scoring in WBC sanctioned fights, because Open Scoring is a violation of Unified Rules. It doesn't help improve the quality of the judging in any way.

Jack
Cshel86
QUOTE (Dolimite @ Apr 21 2013, 02:54 PM) *
I do not believe just because you throw a few power shots in a round you should be awarded the round. Trout outworked and boxed Alvarez and yes Saul dodged a lot of punches but so did Trout. A lot of Saul's shots landed on Trout's chest and glazed his cheek. Showtime really did push the Saul machine I thought they were HBO, even Paulie was on that band wagon. Trout sounded defeated and I am wondering did he take the gas off on purpose maybe he was paid off hell I do not know. I am upset because judges reward one big shot and they feel that will win rounds when the guy who cuts off the ring sets traps and breaks your guard loses. Someone really has to explain to me how they scored this fight. Saul looked good last night but not enough to win. Win Trout let his hands go great things happened. I'm disgusted right now. Rather they gave the fight to Saul is one thing but to say he did not win a round is ridiculous.

How can you not award a guy who lands a few hard shots? Man I tell, I will keep this post in my memory bank for May 4th. I can't wait to see everybody and their babymama's, cousin's, grandma's, sister's, cousin, give Floyd rounds for landing a few of those short right hands, while Guerrero calls himself boxing by fumbling all over Floyd and missing.

It looked like Trout had baby oil on his gloves all night long...a lot of those shots were either slipped, grazed Canelo, or had no affect on him. Trout didn't land a lot of flush shots, but Canelo did. I cant even say that Canelo landed "a lot" of shots, but the ones that he did land, convinced me that he had control of the fight.

It's hard to tell, because it seemed like Canelo was gassing, but then it seemed like he was playing possum. Either way we slice, I'm sure that didn't expect Canelo to reach in his tool belt the way he did. Everything that we expected Trout to do, he either didn't do it, or he did it but none of it oozed of confidence.

As somebody mentioned, Trout didn't have that killer instinct, and it only played into his detriment in the end. Again, I had him edging the fight by 1 point, but he knew in his heart that he shouldn't have let that fight get as close as it did. Had Trout's hand been raised last night, I wont lie, I wouldn't have felt that he deserved it. It's almost like he packed it, but did just enough to say that he wasn't in there just to survive.

All of this talk about Trout boxing and letting his hands go, just didn't impress me. Is Canelo this "elite" fighter after last night? Nope. Is he well on his way to being a superstar and good fighter? Yep, he's on his way with a full tank of gas. Last night was just a start, and Trout didn't do all that much to derail the train.
Dolimite
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Apr 21 2013, 01:35 PM) *
How can you not award a guy who lands a few hard shots? Man I tell, I will keep this post in my memory bank for May 4th. I can't wait to see everybody and their babymama's, cousin's, grandma's, sister's, cousin, give Floyd rounds for landing a few of those short right hands, while Guerrero calls himself boxing by fumbling all over Floyd and missing.

It looked like Trout had baby oil on his gloves all night long...a lot of those shots were either slipped, grazed Canelo, or had no affect on him. Trout didn't land a lot of flush shots, but Canelo did. I cant even say that Canelo landed "a lot" of shots, but the ones that he did land, convinced me that he had control of the fight.

It's hard to tell, because it seemed like Canelo was gassing, but then it seemed like he was playing possum. Either way we slice, I'm sure that didn't expect Canelo to reach in his tool belt the way he did. Everything that we expected Trout to do, he either didn't do it, or he did it but none of it oozed of confidence.

As somebody mentioned, Trout didn't have that killer instinct, and it only played into his detriment in the end. Again, I had him edging the fight by 1 point, but he knew in his heart that he shouldn't have let that fight get as close as it did. Had Trout's hand been raised last night, I wont lie, I wouldn't have felt that he deserved it. It's almost like he packed it, but did just enough to say that he wasn't in there just to survive.

All of this talk about Trout boxing and letting his hands go, just didn't impress me. Is Canelo this "elite" fighter after last night? Nope. Is he well on his way to being a superstar and good fighter? Yep, he's on his way with a full tank of gas. Last night was just a start, and Trout didn't do all that much to derail the train.

If Guerrero performs like Trout did and May fights like Saul, then yes Guerrero should win the fight. Oscar De La Hoya landed shots on May but May was more accurate and the busy fighter that night.

Trout was the busy fighter, yes Saul improved and looked great in some spurts but come on Cshels it was close and again I give it 7-5 or 8-4 to Trout but its whatever.
Jack 1000
Mixed views on who won the fight, but most don't like "Open Scoring."

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1612023...a-of-good-fight

Jack
Jack 1000
Interesting break down of the fight and a writer's poll: Wide range of scores:

http://www.badlefthook.com/canelo-alvarez-...vs-austin-trout

Jack
Cshel86
QUOTE (Dolimite @ Apr 21 2013, 04:51 PM) *
If Guerrero performs like Trout did and May fights like Saul, then yes Guerrero should win the fight. Oscar De La Hoya landed shots on May but May was more accurate and the busy fighter that night.

Trout was the busy fighter, yes Saul improved and looked great in some spurts but come on Cshels it was close and again I give it 7-5 or 8-4 to Trout but its whatever.

Lol, I should make this very post part of my sig...just so I can hold you to it. *still considering it*

If Trout was as busy as you say he was, then that would've made Canelo just as busy (which he wasn't). If Trout was so busy, then why was the fight so freakin' close??? This frustration isn't 110% directed towards you, but more towards Trout.

As much of an asshole as you guys think I am for repeating this, I have to do it...if a fight comes down to a 7-5 affair, then it's sure to end in controversy. To me, 7 rounds to 5, is too damn close to 6-6 (a draw), so some judges will "give" a certain fighter that ONE round, just to avoid a draw.

As strange as it sounds, a robbery is always better than a draw. We're all sitting here discussing the decision last night, but think of how sour we'd be if that fight was scored a draw. We'd want ONE of the fighters to win, but the fact neither of them would've actually won (if a draw occurred), then that would've been a HUGE waste of out time.

Well, now that I think about it, I still have that "draw" feeling, because I had Trout edging it by a pre-teen's pubic hair, but Canelo won, and there's no chance of a rematch because the oh-so shitty contracts have been signed. Those contracts were whack...they just about as whack as biscuit-chin Khan going into D.C. to fight Peterson WITHOUT a rematch clause, then begging like a bitch after the "questionable" decision was announced.

Trout's not a draw (translation: bring in money) like Khan, so he can eternally bitch and moan (if he so chooses to) for a rematch, but his voice wont be heard. Sad, but true. If anything, Trout will get Canelo after he gets Cotto (which is coming this fall), then Mayweather. He can be 2-0 or 1-1 in those fights, THEN he'll come back and decide to fight Trout...if he so pleases. Trout put himself in a bad spot, just as Cotto did when he decided to fight Trout.

PS: I wonder if Cotto will get the bigger split when he and Canelo fight. Common sense says "yes"...its not like he Mosley begging for a payday, but in the boxing world, Cotto will end up getting the smaller cut. If GBP gets real bitchy, then it may be a 51/49 split like it was in the Pac/Hatton fight...or it was some weird number like that. Lol

The Original MrFactor
I'm still a fan of Austin Trout. I thought he did enough to win the fight somewhere between 8- and 7-5 roundsI think we all learned that he graduated from the Tim Bradley school of power punching. He was very feather fisted last nite.
Dolimite
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Apr 21 2013, 08:35 PM) *
Lol, I should make this very post part of my sig...just so I can hold you to it. *still considering it*

If Trout was as busy as you say he was, then that would've made Canelo just as busy (which he wasn't). If Trout was so busy, then why was the fight so freakin' close??? This frustration isn't 110% directed towards you, but more towards Trout.

As much of an asshole as you guys think I am for repeating this, I have to do it...if a fight comes down to a 7-5 affair, then it's sure to end in controversy. To me, 7 rounds to 5, is too damn close to 6-6 (a draw), so some judges will "give" a certain fighter that ONE round, just to avoid a draw.

As strange as it sounds, a robbery is always better than a draw. We're all sitting here discussing the decision last night, but think of how sour we'd be if that fight was scored a draw. We'd want ONE of the fighters to win, but the fact neither of them would've actually won (if a draw occurred), then that would've been a HUGE waste of out time.

Well, now that I think about it, I still have that "draw" feeling, because I had Trout edging it by a pre-teen's pubic hair, but Canelo won, and there's no chance of a rematch because the oh-so shitty contracts have been signed. Those contracts were whack...they just about as whack as biscuit-chin Khan going into D.C. to fight Peterson WITHOUT a rematch clause, then begging like a bitch after the "questionable" decision was announced.

Trout's not a draw (translation: bring in money) like Khan, so he can eternally bitch and moan (if he so chooses to) for a rematch, but his voice wont be heard. Sad, but true. If anything, Trout will get Canelo after he gets Cotto (which is coming this fall), then Mayweather. He can be 2-0 or 1-1 in those fights, THEN he'll come back and decide to fight Trout...if he so pleases. Trout put himself in a bad spot, just as Cotto did when he decided to fight Trout.

PS: I wonder if Cotto will get the bigger split when he and Canelo fight. Common sense says "yes"...its not like he Mosley begging for a payday, but in the boxing world, Cotto will end up getting the smaller cut. If GBP gets real bitchy, then it may be a 51/49 split like it was in the Pac/Hatton fight...or it was some weird number like that. Lol

I go back to the fight overall. Trout fought full rounds and I stand by my statement. If Guerrero fought like Trout then yes he should win and if Mayweather fights like Saul then he should lose. I would of accepted a draw but like you said Trout should blame himself. I guess the stage was too big but in my opinion and the opinion of many others Trout won.
daprofessor
QUOTE (Jack 1000 @ Apr 21 2013, 03:48 PM) *
I'll just say that the use of the WBC open scoring system is killing me as a fan. I wasn't thrilled when it was experimented with after Holyfield-Lewis I, tried to give it a chance when the WBC opted for it at their 2006 convention, and can no longer accept the system. The fight was really good, until Al Bernstein gave the 8th round scores.Then, my interest was lost, in what had been a great fight up to the announcement of the scores, because I knew Trout could no longer win.

Texas needs to remove itself from the Association of Boxing Commissions if they want to continue with the Open Scoring in WBC sanctioned fights, because Open Scoring is a violation of Unified Rules. It doesn't help improve the quality of the judging in any way.

Jack



totally agree.

cristidoulu or whatever that judges name is...needs to be relieved of his duties as a judge. what the hell was he watching???
Cshel86
QUOTE (Dolimite @ Apr 22 2013, 12:21 PM) *
I go back to the fight overall. Trout fought full rounds and I stand by my statement. If Guerrero fought like Trout then yes he should win and if Mayweather fights like Saul then he should lose. I would of accepted a draw but like you said Trout should blame himself. I guess the stage was too big but in my opinion and the opinion of many others Trout won.

I have to be honest here...Im not sure if those rounds were truly hard to score, or if they just hard to give to Trout.
VJones
I thought Austin pulled out the victory by being the busier fighter (I detest watching fighters take off most of a round and then trying to steal it in the last 30 seconds. It annoys me, and I usually penalize a fighter on my scorecard...but I was not at all impressed by Austin's performance. His confidence, which was at an all-time high leading up to the fight, seemed to crash by the time he got to the ring. He didn't have that same look he had for Cotto. Now, I know there were some distractions...the renege on "objective" judges...flying conditions...and a hispanic team member/friend being beat up by Canelo fans earlier in the day, for being a part of Team Trout. So there may have been some mental challenges to overcome...but all of that is part of the fight game. Mental warfare is equal in importance (and sometimes more so) to the physical fight.

I think Trout himself summed it up well: "I tried my best, but didn't do my best." Texas + GBP + Money (the green, and Mayweather) meant he couldn't leave any doubt. It's not fair...but unfortunately it's the current state of affairs in boxing.

As for Canelo, he showed some new leaves in there, but no new branches. He's developing well. But I personally find it hard to stomach any "athlete" in any sport that gasses easily. He's gotta get that together before his name and the word "elite" can be considered in the same sentence.

For my thoughts on 'Nelo's performance and what I'd like to see in his future, I point to the great JMM's outlook on Canelo's win (via boxingscene):

"A win over Trout [does] not confirm that [Canelo] is the best, because there are higher quality opponents out there. This [is] an important step for Canelo and [a win over Trout gives him] access to bigger fights. He has to face the right opponents and prove that he is a great fighter - opponents like Sergio 'Maravilla' Martinez, Vanes Martirosyan, Erislandy Lara. He has to fight against those kind of opponents to prove that he's among the best in the world. That's where it should be confirmed [that he's great] and where [he will] gain greater credibility."

I concur.

As for the push for Mayweather, I have to SMH a little. Rehydrating to Super-middleweight? He should be trying to clean out his division and then move up to 160 and further make his mark. Trying to fight welterweights and jr. welters when you're that big is just pathetic. (Regardless of that welter being pound-for-pound #1). But if he wants it so bad, I'd like to see Floyd give to him. He's not ready for Mayweather yet.

Put him back in the pot. Add seasoning.
mgrover
I think Floyd does what Martinez did to Jr, depending if he still has those legs.
daprofessor
QUOTE (mgrover @ Apr 22 2013, 05:40 PM) *
I think Floyd does what Martinez did to Jr, depending if he still has those legs.


i think floyd is waaay too small for jcc jr. not a good fight for him. canelo is easier.
daprofessor
QUOTE (VJones @ Apr 22 2013, 05:22 PM) *
I thought Austin pulled out the victory by being the busier fighter (I detest watching fighters take off most of a round and then trying to steal it in the last 30 seconds. It annoys me, and I usually penalize a fighter on my scorecard...but I was not at all impressed by Austin's performance. His confidence, which was at an all-time high leading up to the fight, seemed to crash by the time he got to the ring. He didn't have that same look he had for Cotto. Now, I know there were some distractions...the renege on "objective" judges...flying conditions...and a hispanic team member/friend being beat up by Canelo fans earlier in the day, for being a part of Team Trout. So there may have been some mental challenges to overcome...but all of that is part of the fight game. Mental warfare is equal in importance (and sometimes more so) to the physical fight.

I think Trout himself summed it up well: "I tried my best, but didn't do my best." Texas + GBP + Money (the green, and Mayweather) meant he couldn't leave any doubt. It's not fair...but unfortunately it's the current state of affairs in boxing.

As for Canelo, he showed some new leaves in there, but no new branches. He's developing well. But I personally find it hard to stomach any "athlete" in any sport that gasses easily. He's gotta get that together before his name and the word "elite" can be considered in the same sentence.

For my thoughts on 'Nelo's performance and what I'd like to see in his future, I point to the great JMM's outlook on Canelo's win (via boxingscene):

"A win over Trout [does] not confirm that [Canelo] is the best, because there are higher quality opponents out there. This [is] an important step for Canelo and [a win over Trout gives him] access to bigger fights. He has to face the right opponents and prove that he is a great fighter - opponents like Sergio 'Maravilla' Martinez, Vanes Martirosyan, Erislandy Lara. He has to fight against those kind of opponents to prove that he's among the best in the world. That's where it should be confirmed [that he's great] and where [he will] gain greater credibility."

I concur.

As for the push for Mayweather, I have to SMH a little. Rehydrating to Super-middleweight? He should be trying to clean out his division and then move up to 160 and further make his mark. Trying to fight welterweights and jr. welters when you're that big is just pathetic. (Regardless of that welter being pound-for-pound #1). But if he wants it so bad, I'd like to see Floyd give to him. He's not ready for Mayweather yet.

Put him back in the pot. Add seasoning.


pretty much sums it up. the only ppl really celebrating that victory are the ones that have no clue. i've talked to quite a few fight fans since and everyone is pretty much in agreement...it wasn't impressive on either side. a draw would have been in order...and those two judges need to be taken out back and shot in the back of their heads with a small caliber pistol. laugh.gif
happygocampy
QUOTE (The Original MrFactor @ Apr 20 2013, 11:04 PM) *
Wow, you didnt give Trout round 6?!?!?! Canelo got hit with a body punch and did next to nothing?!?! If there was ever a convincing Trout round it was 6. I can see people having it close. I thought the Showtime folks were heavy on the Alvarez tip. Trout would land a right or a left and they'd mention it, but if Canelo landed one punch in the exchange their volume would go up.


I hope Paulie remembers his fight scores when he fights Mayweather Jr jr this summer because all the reasons he gave for Trout not winning will be the same ones he will have for not winning.


Alright so I've watched the fight 2 more times and watched the 6th once extra ontop of that. I can't even call the 6th close, it was a great round for Canelo, he dominated the 1st 2 minutes landing several good solid hard shots with Trout landing 1 or 2 good jabs and a body shot, then of course Trout lands a few more good solid body shots, at which point your thinking "maybe Trout will steal this round!" only to have that thought crushed by a beautiful crisp solid uppercut from Canelo before round ends. Rnd 6 was clearly Canelo's imho.

However, rnd 10, I'm willing to throw that one to Trout, i originally gave it to Canelo due to the 1 monstrous uppercut he landed that looked like it lifted Trout off the Canvas for a split second, such a nice punch it was but that was pretty much all Canelo did except 1 other right a little later that wasn't as good. Trout out landed him with decent solid crisp shots that round, especially to the body.

115-112, Canelo.

I know you guys hate my score already and now you just might hate me personally for what I'm about to say, but Calslappy vs Hopkins faintly came to mind here, Trout got knocked down just like slappy, and had a less but similar slap approach to this fight. If only Hopkins had been 22 like Canelo, he could have dodged more slaps.
mgrover
QUOTE (daprofessor @ Apr 23 2013, 12:30 AM) *
i think floyd is waaay too small for jcc jr. not a good fight for him. canelo is easier.


No that a what I mean Floyd vs Canelo would look a little like martinez vs jr
daprofessor
QUOTE (mgrover @ Apr 23 2013, 04:25 AM) *
No that a what I mean Floyd vs Canelo would look a little like martinez vs jr


got it. i agree.
Dolimite
QUOTE (Cshel86 @ Apr 22 2013, 11:50 AM) *
I have to be honest here...Im not sure if those rounds were truly hard to score, or if they just hard to give to Trout.

That is just it. Trout was fighting a very technical fight, nothing flashy and the crowd was not with him at all. The moment Saul did the slightest thing you swore Elvis was in the building. he fought in a very uneven atmosphere and the judges were influenced by the crowd. Saul fought half the rounds and gassed out and still won the late rounds. I think if Trout was more aggressive or appeared to be more aggressive he would of had the fight in the bag. I think the moment got to him. Which is off because he was in a hostile environment when he fought Cotto. Maybe he should go back and read his own articles. Cause the man that wrote those was not the man who should up in the ring. I still had him winning either 7-5 or 8-4.
Jack 1000
One of the best commentaries against Open Scoring that I have heard. This was so much a problem in this fight.

http://fightnetwork.com/news/38070:fn-vide...ng-robbed-fans/

Jack
The Original MrFactor
I think many who hate open scoring and the way it was presented in this fight may have really hated it because of the horrific scores read in the 8th round. If that score had a dead even fight, I dont think there would be as much backlash. I think that score was shown after the 8th round that showed Trout trailing badly that pissed everybody off. Stevie Wonder's scorecard had it close after 8.

I think open scoring can be done with success. I think it should be done after each round. I know the crowd may then sway the judges at ringside, just a bit after the scores are read. I also think that maybe there should be 5 Judges. 3 at ringside and 2 in a secluded room with a few monitors watching the fight with no replays or commentary just to balance that out just a bit. The ringside judges, particularly for this fight may get swayed way too much by the crowd. The secluded judges will see the fight in a more objective way. As it is now, we know judges are only human and dont have the benefit of replay, as we do. So they may see a scoring shot that didnt really score. That was also very evident in Pacquiao/Bradley.
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