"I don't think Pacquiao walks through Mayweather. I don't think that at all. I think Mayweather is good at counter fighting, something that Marquez is good at and something that Pacquiao has struggled with in the past and he may struggle at it again. If he beats Mayweather, I give him all of the props in the world. I would expect for Mayweather to win that fight and maybe easier than people think. I may be one of the few that think that or will say it out loud, but I will definitely bet money...I think I have an opinion in this game and it's a pretty sound opinion and the only way to prove me wrong is to make the Mayweather fight and if he walks through Mayweather, I will come back on and say I was wrong. But if he doesn't, I want to see those same people that email you and leave negative comments about me admit that they were wrong," stated renowned MMA and boxing trainer Ron Frazier as he shared his thoughts on Manny Pacquiao's recent win over Miguel Cotto and the possibility of him facing Floyd Mayweather Jr. in the future. Check it out!
PC: What did you think about the Pacquiao-Cotto fight? Did you expect that outcome?
RF: I felt that the Pacquiao and Cotto fight was a great fight and I am a huge Pacquiao fan and my girl Rebecca and my baby girl Samara watched the fight with me and we were all rooting for Pacquiao and I thought he was going to do what he did. I felt Cotto was a little shop-worn after the Margarito fight and I predicted a 9th round TKO. Now, having said all of that and as great as Pacquiao is, the hype around him after the fight is kind of ridiculous to me. I see people saying he is one of the greatest 15 fighters of all time and I'm just like, how did we go from...if you look at his last few opponents, he fought Juan Marquez and got hurt several times in that fight and won a closer decision than what the judges had it. He beat Oscar De La Hoya, who was obviously overtrained at 145 and hadn't been a good fighter in about 4 years. He starches Ricky Hatton, who had already been knocked out and wasn't the same fighter after he fought Mayweather. Then he beats Miguel Cotto, who was beaten by Margarito and whether he cheated or not, that fight took whatever fight Cotto had in him out. He didn't look particularly good against Joshua Clottey. So we go from beating 3 shop worn guys to being a top 15 fighter of all time and I just don't see it. If he beats Mayweather, does that make him one of the top fighters of his era? Certainly! Does that put him on top of the pound-for-pound list? Certainly! But top 15? Come on!
PC: It's funny to me that we constantly see people saying Mayweather doesn't challenge himself, but personally, I think beating De La Hoya at 154 is more challenging, if not more impressive, than beating him at 147. Do you think people are just in awe of the names that Manny is beating with conviction and not putting the timeframe he's beating them in into perspective?
RF: Absolutely! And then I look back at the 7-division champion thing. 7-division champion? Okay, let's look at some of these titles. His last 2 titles are the IBO and the WBO, which are titles that people didn't even consider before. People didn't even have them on their list. If that's the case and the IBO counts, then the IBC should count and Hector Camacho is a 6-division champion. If Roy Jones wins his cruiserweight fight for the IBA cruiserweight championship, then that makes him a 5-division champion; are they going to give those guys that same love or are they only going to pick and choose? When they like you is when the WBO and the IBO counts or does it count when you fight the best in your division? Like I said, Pacquiao is a great fighter, but when you say he's in the pound-for-pound top 15 list, let's break it down. At 126, does he beat Salvador Sanchez, who is considered one of the greatest featherweights ever? Is he favored to win that fight? No, he is not! Let's say he does win that fight. Let's go to 130. Does he beat Julio Cesar Chavez or Alexis Arguello at 130? Probably not. Let's go to 135. Does he beat Pernell Whitaker or Roberto Duran at 135? Probably not. Could he have beaten Oscar De La Hoya or Aaron Pryor at 140? The answer to that is no. Does he come close to beating Sugar Ray Leonard, Tommy Hearns or Wilfred Benitez at 147? The answer to that is no. those guys would blow him out, so if he can't beat those guys when you match him up weight class for weight class, then you can't consider him a top 15 fighter.
PC: And that's taking nothing away from Pacquiao. I think your perspective is directed more towards the fans and media. If you watch all of ESPN's shows, from Around the Horn to Pardon the Interruption, boxing hasn't gotten this much publicity in years, which is a good thing, but I think other fighters have deserved that same amount of credit as well.
RF: Absolutely and like you said, Pacquiao is a great fighter. I love watching him fight, I love his spirituality, I love his speed and his power, but people forget that 18 months ago, he was in a life and death struggle with Juan Manuel Marquez. He had 2 fights with him that arguably both of them could have gone to Marquez. Nobody mentions those. He beats these last 3 guys and...if he would have beaten Shane Mosley, Floyd Mayweather and say an Andre Berto and he blows those 3 guys out like that, like he has done his last 3, then I would probably make him top 15, but until he does that...and it's not about him, it's more to the media because the fans are buying into the media hype. It's these old guard media guys who pick and choose who they like because they hated Roy. They hated Roy because he didn't play by their rules, so they loved it when Roy lost so they can dog him. Somebody on TV the other day said, "Manny Pacquiao is the fastest fighter I have ever seen as far as hand speed and foot speed and he puts it all together. Roy was fast, but not like Manny Pacquiao." I'm like, "Did you watch the film? Did you watch the guy fight? Are you kidding me?" You aint gotta like the guy, but respect his game. That is ridiculous. I look at Pacquiao's body of work and it's good, but it doesn't overwhelm you. he's been knocked out twice, and I know people say that was a long time ago, but you can't discount the fact that Floyd Mayweather hasn't lost and says he's going to get walked through [by Pacquiao], but you won't discount the fact that this guy has tasted defeat 3 times in his career and he has been knocked out twice?
PC: I watched Michael Wilbon say Pacquiao will knock Mayweather out and all will be well in boxing, like Floyd is some scrub. We haven't seen Floyd lose many rounds, let alone dominated the way some of these sports writers think he will be. Who would you favor if the fight does happen and why?
RF: Yeah, that's crazy and when the betting odds first came in, I knew Floyd would be the underdog and that's the best dog you can get. He's undefeated and this is a guy who the only times he's ever been officially knocked down in a fight was when he broke his hand and his hand touched the canvas. Other than that, he hasn't been knocked down in a fight. People haven't seen him wobbled all over the place and I just don't understand why they don't think this guy doesn't have a great chin. He has great defense and he is great at adapting in the ring, which is something we don't see from a lot of fighters today is being able to adapt and adjust in the ring. I think he beats Pacquiao. He's a bigger guy and remember he's fought at 154. They forget about that. He's just as fast and, like I said before, what are they going to say, "He struggled with Zab Judah for 4 rounds until he figured him out." Like Zab Judah is a scrub. He has just as much talent as anybody in boxing. Zab mentally is not the most focused guy in the world and that's why he has problems in the ring, but as far as skill sets go, he is just as talented as anybody who has ever laced them up. A lot of arguments are moot and I don't think Pacquiao walks through Mayweather. I don't think that at all. I think Mayweather is good at counter fighting, something that Marquez is good at and something that Pacquiao has struggled with in the past and he may struggle at it again. If he beats Mayweather, I give him all of the props in the world. I would expect for Mayweather to win that fight and maybe easier than people think. I may be one of the few that think that or will say it out loud, but I will definitely bet money.
PC: How does your pound-for-pound 1 and 2 look right now Ron?
RF: To be the man, you gotta beat the man. I have heard that time and time again, so when Floyd came out of retirement, to me, he was the pound-for-pound best and he showed it where Marquez didn't even win a round and Marquez is a great fighter. He didn't even win a round off of this guy. To me, Floyd Mayweather is #1 and Manny Pacquiao is you can say 1A or 1B. He's right there, but I would put Mayweather at the top of my list.
PC: They also recently announced a fight between Mosley and Berto for January. Who do you like in that fight and why?
RF: When you are dealing with an older guy, you always think maybe he can get old over night and we saw that when Mr. Johnson fought Chad Dawson not too long ago. But Shane Mosley is one of those guys who doesn't have bad habits and he takes care of himself real well. He's one of those freaks of nature who loves being in the game. I think at this point, Andre Berto has to bank on Shane Mosley getting old over night. He's still young in his career and he is still making some mistakes and Mosley is the kind of veteran that he probably shouldn't face at this time making those same mistakes.
PC: Well, you will be the most hated man in the Philippines when this goes to print. Just giving you a little heads up because they don't want anything negative said about their man (laughing).
RF: You know what? The messed up thing about that is my sister-in-law is Filipino and I have nothing but love for the Philippines. I'm not talking negative about their guy. I love Manny Pacquiao and it's not coming from the heart. I'm just not going to be like, "Oh, he is a great fighter," and let whatever they say go. I think I have an opinion in this game and it's a pretty sound opinion and the only way to prove me wrong is to make the Mayweather fight and if he walks through Mayweather, I will come back on and say I was wrong. But if he doesn't, I want to see those same people that email you and leave negative comments about me admit that they were wrong.
PC: Thanks for your time Ron. It's always a pleasure to speak with you. I think you are one of the better analysts in breaking things down in the game. Is there anything you want to say in closing?
RF: I just want to give a shout out to Rebecca and Samara; they keep me going.
[ Follow Percy Crawford on Twitter @MrLouis1ana ]