"Dude, there is only one way to find out who would win fights and that's have them fight because anything can happen in a fight. We can sit down and be the numbers guys and break down stats and when you look at the stats, Randy Couture has more tools. He can leg kick properly, he can takedown, wrestle, submit and all of this other stuff. He even has dirty boxing, which he is really the pioneer of, dirty boxing. James Toney, you can look at him and think he is a fat dude, but his fucking hands are lightning fast. He will knock you out with either hand and he rolls with punches very well and it's hard to knock out and hurt him. And he has now dabbled in mixed martial arts and anything can happen when two bad ass dudes step in and face each other...James Toney picked a fight and now he's got one," stated UFC President Dana White as he talked about this weekend's intriguing clash between James Toney and Randy Couture at UFC 118. Check out what else he had to say about the fight, the rest of the card and much more, including his thoughts on Mayweather vs. Pacquiao!
PC: It's an honor to speak to you Dana. How is it going?
DW: Likewise. Thank you. Good, man. Everything is good. I'm just getting ready. I leave in a couple of hours here to head to Boston.
PC: Sounds good. It's crazy because when I received a call from James Toney asking if I could get him in touch with you, I don't know if I took him too seriously the first time. He followed you to a couple of events. At what point did you take him seriously?
DW: At like the third event he showed up at, and then he started threatening to show up at my house (laughing).
PC: You have stated before that Evander Holyfield and Roy Jones approached you about fighting in the UFC. What was it about James Toney that persuaded you to let him step foot inside of the Octagon?
DW: There were guys out there that were talking, but there was never really a guy to step up and say, "I want to fight!" You know what's funny? We had talked about this a few years ago and we had always thought James Toney would be a guy like that. I never expected him to start chasing me around or whatever, but we just used to talk. I'm a boxing fan too. That's where I came from and if it wasn't for boxing, I wouldn't even be here today. James Toney is crazy; and not just crazy like, "Oh God, this guy is nuts," but fucking bad ass crazy. He's like a tough dude that would throw down and fight with anybody.
PC: Yeah, James truly believes he is the baddest man on the planet. That's not an act.
DW: Yeah!
PC: Dan Goosen put out a press release stating that years ago, James wanted to set up a fight against Tito Ortiz. Is there any validity to that?
DW: Yeah, that's true. That is true. Back in the day, when we first got this thing started, James Toney was like, "I would fuck all of those punks up," and everything else. And we were saying, "That's interesting. Maybe we should put on a fight with Toney vs. somebody." And you can think whatever you want about Toney, but that was back when Toney was making big paydays.
PC: I remember seeing the sit down you had with James and you showed some concern then about his weight. I think that was one of the first questions you asked, "What is he weighing?" Now that you see he's taking it serious and that the weight is falling off, how much does that solidify this fight for you?
DW: The thing about Toney and him getting in great shape shows me that he's really taking this serious. And here's the thing, all of the badmouth about Toney going into fights overweight and all of that stuff, think about it man, the guy is 42 years old and he's been boxing his whole life. It starts getting to a point where you're like, "I've fought all of the best in the world. I am one of the best in the world, what do I really need to learn or do?" You start to lose motivation. What this showed me is that it's a new challenge for James Toney and apparently, he's up for the challenge.
PC: Randy went through his struggle at light heavyweight and then he challenged himself by moving up to heavyweight and he captured the title., so you can kind of see them going down the same path and, like you said, you typically get that from older fighters where they need a challenge or a change up from the norm.
DW: Absolutely. And for the record, when me and Toney was going back and forth and all of this stuff was going on, Randy Couture called me up and said, "If this stuff really happens, I want this fight." He asked for James Toney.
PC: Was your phone ringing off of the hook with requests to fight Toney when the news got out that you guys had signed him?
DW: No. Randy was the only one that made that call. And let me tell you what, and you might be one of those guys, or you might know guys like this, but I'm not this guy that sits around and talks about, "Oh, Muhammad Ali would have beat Mike Tyson and Sugar Ray Robinson would have beat this guy." Dude, there is only one way to find out who would win fights and that's have them fight because anything can happen in a fight. We can sit down and be the numbers guys and break down stats and when you look at the stats, Randy Couture has more tools. He can leg kick properly, he can takedown, wrestle, submit and all of this other stuff. He even has dirty boxing, which he is really the pioneer of, dirty boxing. James Toney, you can look at him and think he is a fat dude, but his fucking hands are lightning fast. He will knock you out with either hand and he rolls with punches very well and it's hard to knock out and hurt him. And he has now dabbled in mixed martial arts and anything can happen when two bad ass dudes step in and face each other.
PC: I'm not a fan of the mythical matchups either my man.
DW: It's just ridiculous. Anything can happen when two guys get in there. And there are so many different variables. A guy could be feeling shitty that day or he didn't fucking sleep the night before. I mean, anything can happen.
PC: Not to mention, this is Randy's first fight at heavyweight in a couple of fights.
DW: You're right.
PC: For Randy to be competing at this level at the age of 47 is insane. Is this a one-time deal for Randy at heavyweight? Will he go back to 205 after this?
DW: Yeah, I think so. And yeah, he's 47 years old and that's another thing. Toney even has the age advantage in this fight. James Toney is 42.
PC: This has to be a special card for you. Not only are you inviting the first boxer into the sport as the president of the company, but it's also in your hometown. What does this card mean to you?
DW: Yeah, I've been very excited, obviously to get it sanctioned in another state, and to be in Boston...to go to Boston and hold a big event there; plus Boston is a big boxing town, so people are going to be pumped about this Toney fight there too.
PC: This is a great card. I don't think I have been on the fence more than I have been with Kenny Florian and Gray Maynard's fight. What are you expecting from this card with some of the matchups?
DW: That's the thing. When I made this card, because this fight could go 30 seconds either way, Couture could take him down and pound him out or Toney could knock him out quickly, anything can happen, so we built a great card around this. The first fight on the pay-per-view is Marcus Davis against Nate Diaz. And then we have Gray Maynard and Kenny Florian, Palhares vs. Nate Marquardt, Toney and Couture and BJ Penn and Frankie Edgar. On top of that, we got 6 undercard fights.
PC: That is a sick show for sure.
DW: It's going to be a good night!
PC: I follow you on Twitter and you seem to have a pretty good relationship with Zab Judah. He always shows up to the fights. What's your relationship like with Zab?
DW: Well, you got guys like Zab Judah and Mike Tyson and a million other guys. There are a million other boxers that come to the fights. Holyfield was at the last event. You don't have to...I don't know how this whole boxing vs. MMA rivalry got started or how it got going, but when I talk about boxing and say negative things, I only talk about the stuff that goes on in the sport right now; the problems with boxing. But I love the sport of boxing and there are a lot of boxers out there that loves the sport of MMA.
PC: Do you think a James Toney win could persuade some of these other guys to want to get into the UFC?
DW: No doubt about it. I think it could.
PC: Once, you prepared for a fight against Tito Ortiz that of course didn't come off. James Toney has been saying he wants you in the cage after he's done with Randy. Are we going to see you train to get in there with Toney anytime soon (laughing)?
DW: Oh, hell no, dude. Me and Tito had some serious bad blood that was real and everything else and I got in shape for that fight to do it. One of the things I realized when I was training for Tito for that fight is how fucking old I am (laughing). I tell you what man, these guys that are still doing it at 47 and 42 and all this stuff, it's really amazing. And let's face the facts, I was never good enough when I was fucking 22. I'm glad that fight didn't happen and the last thing I want to do is fight fucking James Toney.
PC: You could have easily milked a few more fights out of Kimbo and made money off of him, but I gotta give much respect to you for not seeing him grow as a fighter, or at least not making the improvements you wanted to see, and you released him. Although Toney could sell the hell out of a fight, you really want to be impressed by him to keep him around, right?
DW: Yes, just like any other fighter. What the UFC is, and I think the reason why people have grown to love the sport and got behind the brand, is because when the UFC rolls into town and you lay down your money to buy a ticket or to buy a pay-per-view, you know you're going to get a great night of fights, from top to bottom, with all of the best fighters in the world. When a guy like Kimbo Slice leaves...and I hear he's going the boxing route now. He could have kept fighting in mixed martial arts and training and tried to work his way back into the UFC. We want the best of the best and this thing with James Toney is, James Toney picked a fight and now he's got one.
PC: I want to cover the entire card with you. I don't think it's a given for BJ to recapture his title. No disrespect to BJ, but Edgar moves a lot and he could do it for 25 minutes.
DW: The interesting thing about this fight too, as we talk about boxing fans becoming fans of mixed martial arts, I think they will like the BJ Penn/Edgar fight too! These guys are good standing with their hands, both really good boxers, and on top of that, Frankie Edgar is a really good wrestler and BJ Penn has great submissions. Frankie Edgar wants to prove the first time wasn't a fluke and BJ Penn wants to prove it was, so I think that's going to be a great fight too on a great card. Even Marcus Davis and Nate Diaz; Marcus Davis is a former boxer who turned to MMA and Nate Diaz fucking loves to stand up and trade and has great submissions.
PC: Yeah I was going to ask you if you had already written the check for the "Fight of the Night" bonus for Diaz/Davis.
DW: (Laughing) Exactly! You are probably right.
PC: You have one hectic and crazy schedule. What's a good night of sleep for you?
DW: Four hours is good for me, man. I need four hours of sleep and I'm ready to roll. I'm not a big fan of sleeping.
PC: You can't get much done sleeping for sure.
DW: No. Plus my wife is so fucking great, I don't want to miss one second of it!
PC: (Laughing)
DW: (Laughing)
PC: Are you hoping to get more cards in Boston after this one?
DW: Absolutely! We will keep going back to Boston. Boston is a big fight town from way back when, man, and I'm excited to bring big fights back to Boston. The thing is, for me, Boston has been one of these cities that's always embraced me as their own and always rooted for me, man, so I'm always excited to go back there.
PC: I spoke with Kevin Kelly and his wife Dee, as well as Jeff Mayweather, and from what I hear, your boxing class that you had was amazing and you were a very hard worker. I even heard that people had to pull numbers, like at the DMV, and they still may not have gotten into your class. Did you bring that same drive over to MMA and that's why you are so successful?
DW: I think so. I've always been involved with the sport. Listen, when I walked out of that hotel that day and decided that the fight game was where I was going to be, it didn't matter to me if I was dumping spit buckets or sweeping up the ring. I didn't give a shit, man. I love being in the fight business. I love it and whether it was teaching people how to box or doing this shit now, as long as I'm involved in the fight game, I'm happy.
PC: I want to get your thoughts on the Pacquiao/Mayweather situation. If you had a fighter that wanted more testing and the other fighter was reluctant to do so, for whatever reason, how would Dana White handle that situation?
DW: First of all, the sport of boxing and the sport of mixed martial arts are the two sports that are regulated by the government. The government actually regulates the fights. They come in and do the drug testing and oversee everything. No way, shape or form should another fucking fighter ever be pointing out and saying, "I want more drug testing," or this or that. It actually bums me out a little bit that Pacquiao agreed to do that, you know what I mean? It's like, "Shut the fuck up and fight!" Do you want to fucking fight this guy or not? He's going to be drug tested, he agreed to take the fucking drug test, you're going to be paid a gazillion fucking dollars, so are you one of the best in the world or are you not? Period! End of story!
PC: If we ever get that fight, how do you see it playing out? I remember you telling me you bet big on Floyd against De La Hoya. Do you take him against Pacquiao?
DW: I won big money on Floyd for the Oscar fight. I think this is a different fight and I think that's why this is a hard fight to make. Stylistically, Floyd doesn't like this fight. First of all, Floyd just got clipped by Mosley, which is the first time I've ever seen him hurt. The difference between Mosley and Pacquiao is Pacquiao throws his most dangerous punches while he's getting hit. Floyd is used to fighting these guys where he can counter punch and he's so fast that when they try to hit him, he hits them. He moves around and does his thing. Pacquiao is so fucking dangerous because he's so fast, he hits hard too and he throws his best punches while he's getting hit. I think it's a very dangerous fight for Floyd Mayweather and I think Floyd knows that and I don't think Floyd is too crazy about this fight. You know what I do think? I think it is a fucking great fight for the fans. It's a fight that should be entertaining and exciting and it would be about fucking time because boxing needs one of those types of fights.
Here is the other thing. You got all of these fights...for instance, like De La Hoya/Mayweather. Dude, when they were promoting De La Hoya/Mayweather, I said, "This better be the greatest boxing match in the history of boxing," because of the way they were pumping that thing up. The fight sucked. You can never be for sure, but I think Pacquiao/Mayweather would be a good fight. The undercard they had for De La Hoya/Mayweather drove me crazy. They were like, "This is the fight that's going to save boxing and bring boxing back!" I was like, "Dude, this better be the best fight ever." And the thing that's fucking shitty again is De La Hoya is a fucking promoter and he's got Mosley, Hopkins and he had that kid that was really slick then that nobody wanted to fight...I forget his name, but they had him under contract. He used to beat the shit out of everybody, but it was never pretty. I forget his name, but they had him under contract. He could have built a fucking card full of mega-stars, but he didn't do it because he wanted all of the money for himself. That's what fucking killed boxing too! Everybody is so greedy. Nobody cares about securing the future for the sport; everybody just wants to take from boxing and stuff it in their pockets.
PC: It was a pleasure and an honor to speak to you. I appreciate your time and good luck with the card in Boston, UFC 118.
DW: I appreciate it. Thanks so much for being open-minded and being a hardcore boxing guy and giving us the time of day brother.
[ Follow Percy Crawford on Twitter @MrLouis1ana ]