How about a massive load of gooey, salty truth from the depths of my bulbous, bulging sack to kick off the Christmas Season? Well, this is the Thursday after Thanksgiving-- and just like every other Thursday here at FightHype-- I aim to oblige. So, put on your splash guard and brace yourself. This week, we have comments/questions regarding Spence-Garcia, The Tyson-Jones fallout, Joyce-Dubois, and boxing's next-generation stars.
Saving Your 50 Bucks, Spence-Garcia
Hey Paul,
I was thinking about forking over 50 bucks to see Mike and Roy, but 3 things stopped me.
1- I liked Nate Robinson when he played for the Chicago Bulls a few years back and showed a lot of gumption. However he didn't take his boxing preparation seriously, getting in at least 100 hours of sparring with professionals he needed to lose less dramatically. The late Roger Mayweather would've said Nate Robinson don't know $h1t about boxing. Nate Robinson don't know "shit" about boxing!
2- I saw video footage of Roy Jones doing roadwork and his legs were so shot his running was like walking. He could hardly run, so I figured he wouldn't be able to get away from Tyson and get clobbered. He sure fooled me, all that clinching and holding saved his life and Mike complied. This wasn't the 80's and early 90's Mike, so Roy was safe. Roy on his own behalf didn't do much and all this talk about Mike contending with the young heavyweights at almost 60 is hyperbole! Mike, don't do it!
3- Errol Spence and Danny Garcia fight this coming Saturday, Dec. 5, 2020 and all I got to do is find $25 to go with the $50 I saved not buying the Mike vs. Roy "exhibition" and maybe I see a real fight between two guys who can do roadwork and will most likely leave the clinching to the old-timers. But there could be a Nate Robinson like KO which will be just as shocking!
But I may end up holding on to my money 'cause I'm not sold on Errol Spence being what he was pre-
Mikey Garcia or pre-car wreck. To me, Spence and his trainer are kind of dismissive on DSG. Nobody would've faulted them for taking a soft touch opponent to see where Spence is at. With few exceptions, every event has consequences: Ali's 3-year exile from boxing, Ray Leonard's detached retina, Roy Jones dropping back down to light heavyweight after winning the heavyweight crown, same with Oscar DLH to fight Pacquiao and Chad Dawson to fight Andre Ward and Cleveland Williams getting shot.
-- Robert Jackson
Hey Robert.
I hear you on Nate Robinson...and on Roy Jones. To be honest, though, I don't think anyone involved in the main event exhibition was really ever intent on actually "fighting." Tyson clearly pulled his punches and fell into clinches in such a way that it seemed obvious it was part of the plan. Jones' apparent lack of real preparation proves, at least for me, that he knew what this was going to be all along, too. I'm not criticizing either, though, because this was clearly designed to be an exhibition and they delivered everything that could be expected from such an exhibition. Tyson-Jones turned out to be everything it was made to be. Tyson wasn't being held back by Jones' clinching, the ref wasn't at fault for allowing the clinching. There was just never going to be a "real" fight on any real level. Honestly (and ironically), the only one at the top of the show who took their fight seriously was Jake Paul.
As for Errol Spence and his readiness this Saturday-- I agree, we won't know until we know. Reports of him suffering spinal injuries and other career-threatening injuries were clearly overplayed. But he did sustain some severe facial lacerations and jaw/tooth injuries. We also don't really know if there's been some concussion-related issues. These big life events DO have their consequences and Garcia is good enough, dangerous enough, to take advantage of any diminished performance abilities.
Joyce-Dubois, Spence-Garcia
Hi Paul
So, we discussed that Joyce was tooooo slooooow last week, but it seems it was still enough to defeat Dubois right? After watching the fight, I am not high on either yet. Joyce called out Usyk and if that fight happens, I see Usyk outboxing him quite handily.
You got experience with boxers, what is your take on Dubois about this? I am asking you because us people are good at criticizing fighters but we don't know what happens with each fighter once they have an injury. I remember watching Vazquez vs. Marquez 1 and Israel "quit" on this fight only to avenge his defeat in style during the rematch.
Speaking of him, I Met Vazquez four years ago, decided to text him via FB and he kindly responded that his gym was open for me to meet him. I Felt like a boxing reporter because I talked to him about his career and I recall him being so excited that someone was as deep on his career as myself. This is an example of a fighter being too brave for his own good. I have seen recent pictures and videos of him and he does not look healthy.
Moving on...This Saturday, I expect a 60-70% version of Errol Spence. I am not convinced that accident did not take anything from him, and this should be enough for Garcia to get the nod. I was never high on Garcia. I believe he has been avoiding too many risky matches and got lucky on many fights:
1- He was getting outboxed by a past his prime, out-of-weight Erik Morales during their first fight
2- Mauricio Herrera got robbed against him
3-Khan and Matthysse were never elite level fighters
4-Peterson outboxed him
5-Shawn Porter outfought him
Hope you had a good Thanksgiving, best regards.
-- Miguel
Hey Miguel.
As someone who's been critical of Danny Garcia in the past, I think you're being a bit too hard on him. I think Garcia's skills are undeniable and for as long as he's physically fit, focused on boxing, and near-prime, he's a top five-percenter in terms of being among the very best in the division. He does have his weaknesses, though, and that's where some uneven performances pop up when the matchup is not ideal for him. As I wrote elsewhere a little while back: "A cool, collected counter-puncher by nature, Garcia can sometimes be too calm and collected, allowing opposition to steal rounds (or moments in rounds) while he looks for openings and analyzes opportunities." And, because he's so well-schooled and dedicated to his particular strengths, that makes it hard for him to change course when he needs to. That's been my biggest gripe with him. He's a terrific talent who will keep drawing on what he knows best, even when it's not working. The losses to Thurman and Porter were perfect examples of that. Both fights were definitely winnable, but Garcia simply didn't make the proper adjustments.
I talked about Spence in the response above. We'll see what's what this Saturday. I will say, though, that if Spence comes into this fight at 60%-70%, he'll get knocked out.
As for Joe Joyce and Daniel Dubois-- My take on Joyce has not changed all that much. I think he's lacking in some key areas, including hand speed. Usyk would beat him in a deathly-dreary 12-round snoozer. And Dubois? It's a shame things ended the way they did because I thought he was winning that fight solidly. An eye injury is a terrifying experience and to call him a "quitter" or to try and disparage his bravery as a fighter is really unfair. When you get cracked in the eye and you hear a crunch, feel that crunch, lose most (or all) of your vision, something primal kicks in. It's not fair at all to expect a fighter to risk permanent disability for one fight, one performance-- especially a 23-year-old with potentially many years ahead of him.
The Next Generation
Paul,
I hope that you’re doing well! There's a new generation of young boxers on the rise! In my opinion, the best of the young fighters in my ranked order are:
Shakur Stevenson – Fundamentally sound and measures distance extremely well and is the most cerebral fighter of the group.
Devin Haney – Explosive and has been groomed to be great.
Gervonta Davis – Explosive power but has size limitation and appears to have a tendency to make poor decisions outside of the ring.
Teofimo Lopez – Has the best win of the group, disciplined, confident power puncher. However, appears over-confident and boxing skills are good but not great.
Jaron Ennis – Elite physical skills and size but needs a step-up in competition fight.
Vergil Ortiz – Solid and will be a tough out for any Top 5 - 15 147lb. fighter in the world.
Ryan Garcia – Elite hand speed, excellent height and good power.
There are fighters that I could’ve included from David Benavidez (love this dude), Jamie Munguia, Jeison Rosario and Mario Barrios. However for this discussion, I’d like your opinion on how you’d rank the fighters that I’ve listed. Thanks in advance and I appreciate the work that you do for boxing!
-- Meredith Miller
Hey Meredith.
I can't dispute your analysis too much. I think Gervonta is the most special talent of the bunch with, maybe, Garcia coming in second. Garcia, however, needs more seasoning before we see what's truly what with him. But you can't learn that hand speed he has or the reflexes.
I like Stevenson and Haney and respect their skills/abilities, but my concern with them is that they still carry over that amateur mindset of "scoring" rather than "hurting." Stevenson, in his last couple fights, seems to be pushing through that. Haney, though, was tough to watch against an overmatched Gamboa who he had the ability to blast away. Fighters who don't realize that they're in the hurt business as pros tend to be marginalized as weak draws and avoided and/or eventually taken apart by lesser-skilled fighters who bring crazy war to them.
Ennis is a real talent, but as you mentioned, he needs some next-level tests to become a real player.
Lopez is a real treat to watch and a fighter who, because of his style and charisma, will make a lot of money in this game. He's still developing skill-wise, but you can't be too critical of him, given who he just beat. He'd be wise, however, to keep from going too far up in weight, too soon. Without his size and power advantage at the lower weights, he would struggle right now.
And, as for Ortiz, I think he's an even better fighter right now than Lopez, he just lacks the charisma. He'll be a blue-collar fight fan favorite for years and I think, right now at 22, he can beat most everyone in the Top 15-- maybe all but the very elite. It will be interesting, however, to see how he works against a true mover and stylist in the ring. Fighters like Ortiz sometimes struggle with smart, speedy opponents who can use angles.
Got a question (or hate mail) for Magno’s Bulging Mail Sack? The best of the best gets included in the weekly mailbag segment right here at FightHype. Send your stuff here: paulmagno@theboxingtribune.com.